 Welcome back to the breakfast on PLOS TV Africa. By this time next week, which is next Friday, October 1st, 2021, Promenade Nigerians will be coming together to basically flag a mega-patty, which is going to be like a third force in the country. The Promenade Nigerians we're talking about include former Ainidh Shaman at Tahir Ujjaga and political economist Pat Utomi. Let's now invite our guest to talk more about this. She is the former special advisor Iqpoonabu in Kottaria. Good morning. Thank you for joining us. Good morning. All right. Let's talk about this planned political party. Is this what we need and is the timing right? If it's about what we need, I mean, when political engines are arrived up, especially at this time, this period of the year, of the political year, we have spent such, I call them, bigger days than this is it used, politicians and the political parties. People who want to form political parties for different reasons. One, they might want to form the political party in the Libyan. They can view out the stone of hope from a mountain of despair as Nigerians are right now. So, secondly, they believe that they don't have the chances in other political parties like the APC and the PDP, so the best thing is to come up with the political party with which they are going to launch their ambitions. We've had this talk of salvation. I mean, it awakens representatives of the military area. When one major government plots a coup, which in most cases, the coup is egocentric, they plot a coup and the excuse they give is that the previous military administration that I just announced that wanted to plunge the mission into anarchy, both political and financial, and so they are the redeemers. We also saw a situation with the APC where a pope organized that it was the redemption party and today we are all witnesses to the fact that it's worse than the PDP that it took over power. So for so many of the political arguments, I mean, people form this political party, but the fact is you asked a question, is it right? If you say it's right, it is in sync with our constitutional positions, freedom of association, and it's the discretion of those who are going to form the party and when they do things, if they believe that this is the right time, well, so be it for them. But my worry actually is, will they be able, will the new political party be able to rest in power for the agency? That is the next question, because when you talk of trying to house a power, a political party in power, you must have the go beyond credibility to financial strength. Do they have the financial strength, that financial muscle, especially when you consider the fact that Nigerians, the impoverished Nigerians are hungry, and in the past coming elections, gastric considerations, Nigerians will rethink of those that will give them money, those that will address their immediate welfare, because you see, Nigerians no longer believe in our politicians. They are tired of the high blood pressure of the desert veterans. South history is no longer a thing of interest to Nigerians anymore, because most times you come and make all the flower statements, wrap supplies, take leaves and that, and at the end of the day, you don't dream to cushion your promises. You imagine your promises once you're in office. So Nigerians believe that what I get now is my own. Forget about these politicians. There is lack of trust. And so with these diggers that you told me they'll go, be able to convince Nigerians to vote for them, because you're not just talking of the elites, you're not just talking about the educated class, the class that can't be sent. They are not just talking about, they form jobs in microscopic fields. The majority of Nigerians that will go and count their votes will count. We are there ready to listen to those flower statements and promises. That is the best question. So if you ask me, well, is it time for them to form the political party? Everybody has the right to form the political party when it's on streets, but when it's on streets, especially if it's in concern of an agreement with the provisions of our constitution, they have the right to form the political party. But will that political party be the redemption vehicle? That is the question. Will it be allowed to even see the light of, not the light, will it be allowed to even form a government? That is another question. So it's not like you mentioned, it's not the first time that we're hearing of something like this. In 2019, the beautiful 2019 elections, there was, of course, the third force. There were the obvious equestilities and, you know, philaduure toys and, you know, whatever that movement that they tried to start up then, which obviously fell apart, you know, just before the elections. But I want you to, you know, share with me why you think, or if you think that this might also be a waste of time and why this might be entirely impossible to pull off if they truly are trying to kick the APC and the PDP out of power in 2023, what are the reasons why this might just be wishful thinking? I will not dismiss it completely as wishful thinking because if we look at the CPC, CPC and the ACN were able to out the PDP until the various parties melded into one to combat the APC. Yeah, you cannot completely rule that out. You might have some disgruntled party members, like in the PDP, in the APC, especially when they considered the inclusion in these two political parties. In the case of the PDP and the explosion in these two political parties, some might see this thought force as a shocker and avenue to vent their political whatever they have, the thoughts of political activity. But I won't say that. So you don't dismiss it completely. You can dismiss it. And I don't think those that are forming the party together believe that they can do whatever, achieve whatever they want to achieve on their own steam. I don't think so. I think they are also dependent on agreeing political parties from APC and PDP and maybe other smaller political parties. I think that is what they are banking on because it will be banking on the CPC to think that you can just do an election based on your credibility. Nobody is interested in that. Even if people are interested in that, it's not going to be possible because you don't have a financial model. Credibility is good. But in Nigerian politics today, finance is free. You don't go and talk to somebody that is hungry that don't worry, when I get into office, ask your son to stay back. When I get into office, he's going to continue his education. I mean, you're just talking the very straight. Don't worry. Even if your wife dies in the hospital today and you cannot afford it, when I get into office, I'm going to ensure we are going to resuscitate our health sector. What are you talking about? The man is talking of now and not the future. And Nigerians no longer believe in politicians who are futuristic because politicians have disappointed a lot of Nigerians. So that confidence is no longer there. So that is what might be the brain. That might be the problem. Because if you talk of credibility, of course you have the credibility. But what of the clouds? And when you talk of the clouds, you're talking of money. In politics, that is money. Look, you might be highly respected in the society. Look at Ghani Fern, with all the respect, the reverence and so on, he didn't win. And he didn't win for three reasons. One, he didn't have the clouds. No, that is the truth. The commoner, then, number two, the system. But I believe with INEC, if you talk of the system, with the innovations going on in INEC right now, I strongly believe that the issue of the system might not play a major role, especially if the lieutenant transmission is being done. It might not really play a major role. But it is very easy for Nigerians to be widowed into whatever provided you have the money. And I believe that these persons don't have that money. Money for what exactly? Please clarify exactly what the money is for. Money, let me say, all that you work out is money to buy goods. Are you saying that elections cannot be one fair and square in the country and that they need to be influenced by any politics for any politician to win in Nigeria? Before, now, a free and fair election, after the 1993 election, free and fair elections is a fleeting illusion. I can tell you that. So after the 1999 to 2006, they've always watched, they've always read the elections. Up to the 1990 election. So if you talk of free and fair elections, it's an illusion to arise in this country. But we are hoping that given the innovations of INEC, that we might have, and that's why INEC is insisting, and that's why Nigerians are insisting on the lieutenant transmission of results. But those that win elections are vast to read because they know that one result is that they have to go to a room. Okay, Mr. Ingotaria. Mr. Ingotaria will come in detail, will come back in detail to the electronic transmission of results, but still about your stance regarding buying election votes and all of that. I have witnessed that in person, while covering elections in the country. But are you saying that it's unlikely for Nigerians to look at the political credibility and the relevance and the leverage of people like Jagat, like Donald Duke, like Patutomi and the rest, and say they want to put their money there, and by money there, like they want to put their money where their mouth is and vote for the people that this Rescue Nigeria Party is putting forward? Are you saying that's unlikely? Well, there's two Nigerians. Are you talking of the money bags? Why are you all talking of the heart for life when you say Nigerians, right? I think she's referring to the electorate. Nigerians who vote. I made reference to money bags, and I said, when you talk of money bags, you're talking about the microscopic view. And I said a lot of them will probably depart from the APC and the PDP to this party, to this other new party. A lot of them that feel I agree and believe that their ambitions by distortifying these other political parties no doubt about that. But when you talk of the masses, the masses don't believe in credibility. That's what I'm telling you right now. They don't believe in credibility. Because over the years, credibility has got nothing. Look at, for example, a lot of, a lot of, look, APC did not win the election because we are in that one country. So, in 2015, I'm not talking of 2020, in 2019, it was the credibility of the world. But when it got into office, a lot of people realized that even while it was a military dictator, it was, it had nothing to do with the credibility that regime had, had nothing to do with what it had to do with the yearbook. So, Nigerians are sick and tired of credit. They will tell you, give them the opportunity to go in there to eat, to get the surface cake. Once you've given that opportunity, they will forget that. But it doesn't seem, it doesn't seem that you think so lowly. Mr. Enkotaria, Mr. Enkotaria, just a minute, doesn't it seem that you think so lowly of Nigerians to say that they will not vote for people who have integrity, but will only vote for people who are willing to put money in their hands? I mean, there are lots of Nigerians who will argue otherwise and say, no, that's not really what they're about. I don't, I don't intend to be mean or despise Nigerians. I don't intend to show good. But I'm only stating the obvious. And it is better to tell ourselves the truth, I'm not trying to embellish facts. I'm only stating the obvious. I can tell you now that if you have, that's why I said those that will vote for credibility are quite few. Don't forget I said that. I said they are quite few, but we're looking at majority. And even the peccinary state of Nigeria, look at actually a simple question. You have a man that has, I haven't been disappointed several times. Now somebody tells you by their vote for me. Once I get in there, I will ensure that your salary is increased. This is one promise that has been made by 20 other persons in the past and the salary will never increase. And somebody comes to you to tell you but that one is talking about salary increase. Won't you eat today? When were you dead hungry? We'll just collect the money and vote for that human being. But if we create an awareness in the same position the last time I said, I will ask Nigeria if we really need a change. I will ask Nigeria to collect this money and vote their conscience. But in the past it has not been the case. In the past they collect the money and they vote accordingly. But if they will collect this money and vote their conscience then we will not start having the change that we are talking about. Miss Angotara. It's awareness. It's creating awareness. That's all we need to do. Because the vote is going to be secret. Casting is going to be secret. Miss Angotara. Collect this money and vote your conscience. Some other aspect of all of this is looking at our leadership selection process. The whole process from the start to finish of putting people in power. I'm talking mostly of INEC and of course also looking at a lot of Nigerians also consider religion consider tribe. If you follow the conversations from the two major political parties that are talking about whether to put a northern candidate or a southern candidate for 2023 these are still very important details with Nigeria's elections in 2021 sadly. The new political party very likely I'm not sure if you would think that they may also want to be considering some of these things as they build towards the elections in 2023. But do you think that might be one of their stumbling blocks? The fact that we've not been able to develop the selection process to think beyond tribe and religion and regions and some of all of that? Well, first of all, we consider the role that we've described the issue of tribe and religion in our Nigerian politics of today. It will be too early. You see, they say when cheese fall on cheese, the top most is best removed. It's a gradual process. They won't move slowly, but by day they think it's called the sky. Because we already have that sentiment and it's quite it is institutionalized and it is in recognition of that fact that you have the federal character. Because Nigeria is in the middle of different nations, so to speak. It is so bad that even when our leaders are talking they talk in line with that. The Islam, the Muslim, the Christian the North, the South, the East the injustice you are talking about today are plant on these very issues. So you can't wish them away. You just can't wish them away. So you have to take into consideration or let's say you're not a senior political party. You have to take into consideration and if another that is why in the day before the APC comes up with this convention it waits for it to carry the wise for the PDP to come up with the convention. Now this is mega-party. I think that you will respond on the 1st of October. We will also policy. Because if you don't take into consideration this sentiment issue then you will make it a very big mistake. It's very big mistake. It has come for now and I believe in the next 10 years it will be the process. It will be the process. It's a gradual process. But you cannot completely wish it away. You have the what you call why do you have the electoral college? The electoral college is to take out the small assets that ordinarily would have been considered because of their population. That is why you also have the electoral college. So every democracy in every country has these nuances which you must take into consideration in the practice of the politics. So I don't think that is a problem. I don't think that is a problem. We almost got the work for me in the election of both Muslim and Nigerian voters because of the credibility of the Nigerian voters. So it's a gradual process. After that the situation got faster because of the bad leadership we had that has saturated religion and religion. So it's a gradual process. It's a gradual process. If we have somebody that is credible enough that the most Nigerians believe it it will eventually change because it cannot be so it cannot be so graphic because that's what we are putting. And we must take those two issues into consideration in our politics. Interesting. Mr Ikpunago Inkotaria from a special advisor to the River State Governor, we thank you very much for coming on the show today to talk about the Rescue Nigeria Party and how much of a formidable thought it would be in its 2023 elections to have a wonderful day. Thank you. Good morning. Good morning. All right. Next we are going to be speaking with Maxwell Adelaide who is director of public communications for Nenas who of course have continuously spoken about a rally at the United Nations to push for what's the word now? They basically say they want a referendum to be amended and all of that. He is going to be joining us after the short break here on the breakfast. Good morning.