 Cymru! Ar gywed yw gwis hynny, mae'n hyn o bryd Bryn Cawcro. Cynill awaitio! Mae'n ziwn i'n wneud am fy nôl ysgol am y ples. Rhaid i'n gobeithio i llwy, Bryn. Mae'n gobeithio i'n cymryd pan fydd grants gyda'r wych. Mae'n gwneud i'n gobeithio i'n gwybod mewn gfain. Rhaid i'n gwybod i'n gweithwyr i'ch gwasanaeth. Rhaid i'n gwneud i'ch gweithu Bryn sydd gwasanaeth gael. Felly mae'n meddwl o'n gwneud. ond weithio ond rai'r brifatau i'r bryd, nid oed rwy'n ddweud, ac ydynt ni'n gwybod? Rwy'n gwybod. Rwy'n gwybod. Rwy'n gwybod yn ymwneud, roedd yn ymddangos arall, rwy'n gwybod ymddangos Scottish ac rwy'n gwybod yr Yrwyr i'w ddweud. Rwy'n gwybod gofio am y byd yn bwyd, oed. Rwy'n gwybod gyda'r Gweithlened, ac rwy'n gwybod i'w unigol i'r oed. Ond byddwn i'r bwysig, gan y dyfodol yw'r onion, ac yn ymwneud? Ond yw'r dreffledd yn y hwnnw, ac yn gweithio'r bwysig, dwi'n gweithio'r dislexu, rwy'n gweithio'n gweithio'n gweithio'n gweithio'n gweithio. Felly, mae'r bobl yn gweithio'r pwysig, i dweud hynny. A fyddwn i gweithio'n gweithio, dwi'n gweithio'n gweithio. Dwi'n gweithio'n gweithio. Fi hyd yn gweithio'n gweithio. Do you know I was the kid when we do it, all we all do it? But when I was the kid there was no drugs about, there was no stabs, there was no other things about it. Everyone was into training, it was just that way the culture then but now it's just exponentially ridiculous with these knives. So do you think that was a trigger point for you, getting bullied if I become bigger? Then it will shoot people away? That's why I like animals like you see in my house, I've got big lions on the front, I got big strong things you know like if you someone like a lion or a silverback ac dwi'n gweithio i ddweud o gael yn hyfforddi'r ddwyllion. Felly, rydyn ni wedi'i wneud, ond, mae'n gweithio'r ddechrau. Rydyn ni'n ddweud eich wneud yn ddweud, ac rydyn ni wedi bod yn mynd i'r ddechrau, ac mae'n gweithio'r ddweud o'r ddechrau, o'r ddweud, o'r ddweud. Mae'r benysig wedi'u ddweud, a'r oeddol o'r cael y mynd i gael, a'r pethau o'r ddweud, I was training after a few years then I moved from there to red car. I started training when I was 18 probably and I trained for two years in a little gym down there called the chapel gym. It was called the chapel gym because it used to be a church so we were in there training and then I competed for the Mr England 121. I came fifth in the show but I didn't really know I never took a steroid or nothing the other lads would compete with taking steroids. Douglas, I did that, I did a few more shows that came fifth. Then I started getting into, I was working on the door. The first door worked and I was in red car, Leo's, I got there job and I was a little bit scared, I can't fight but I don't know, I don't know put people out and things like that, you know I would call Jeff Robinson, Frankie Athens looked after me, and then the named days because it was on the seathront, if I called the street, they went out in Scotland square, go, they call it in Scotland. Byddai wneud yn y negraith, felly fwyaf i chi'n gilydd. Wrth gyd, i chi'n gilydd. Rwy'n gilydd iawn. Mae'n dweithio'r iawn i'n weithio i ddechrau i'r olau, o'n TEF或r. Wrth gyddi'r cryfffyrwyr neud y Momod, a'r lliwyddo. Fe wnaeth chi eich gwirio, o'r ffaith nes i chi'n cael ei gennym nhw yn cael eu gorffod mewn? Felly i chi'n gilydd, can arrested. Fe wnaeth chi wedi'u gwirio. followed up I fight yeah, I'm the best fighting gives with the sleds head. Which is a little town not far from here. And he knocked him out I guess. I must be the best fighting gives of now. What are you doing boxing training at that point? I started training with a man called Frank Yathan. He was a pro boxer. He was a 60 odd. He was a bit like Mickey and Rocky type of thing and I had a say that he's house and we used to run up to San June and he had a dog called Max and Sam two Labradorz we used to go run with the dogs and I used to train and he threw felly rwyf i ben yn iawn. Mi eisiau ei chyfaledlau. Dwi'n mynd i'n gwybod fyrdd fath o colliol. Rwyf i mewn bidon i hyn sydd. Rwyfa'nProductdol iawn? Da yn он. Dwi gyd yn ein bwg. Rwyf i fynd i gyd yn ei Gwyllian Davies. Rwyf i ymweld 300 meddwl. Ym bwg ac yw Brith. Rwyf i gyfliadau sydd wedi'i gwneud ei fod o'r batfyn. Rwyf i'n gwneud iddyn nhw yma. Felly gallwn eisiau hyd. Rwyf wedi cael fagor ac mae chi fydd. Dyna gwaith? Rhywbeth. Gwyddoch chi yn ei gweithio. Efallai gymrydau o'r gyfnod gyda'r llan. Mae'r wych yn ei gweithio gyda'r maen nhw. Rydyn ni'n credu'n gweithio gyda'r chymbr. Mae'r wych yn ei gweithio gyda'r chymbr. Mae'r wych yn ei gweithio gyda ben. Mae'r wych yn 24, er ffordd. Mae'n gweithio gyda'r gwybod a'r ddweithio. Mae'r gweithio gyda'n gweithio. Mae'r ddweithio gyda'r 3-moed. Tony None, he had Stanley Baxter, he had Diana Dawes, he had Jimmy White and Tony Mee, all them type of people and he found me and said, I'm going to make you a star and he had me a film called The Giant, I'm going around, I'm going FIFA, I've formed type of thing and all that. I had a bloke, I can't throw the drugs, it's just been a fucking dickhead. Do you think when you were getting these opportunities, do you think you never had the confidence to grasp one because maybe you were getting bullied back in the day so it was easier to hide away from the drugs? No, I think it was, I was addicted that bad on the drugs and in 2006 my brother hanged himself, he was on heroin and we used to go mad at him and say, what are you taking that rubbish for? We didn't know he'd been raped as a child and that destroyed me, I was just like, I should have done this for him, I should have done that and he'd have blamed himself for everything he had so I got worse in 2006 and I was with my girlfriend for 17 years and she walked out on me, obviously with the drugs and she went, my dog I had for 30 and a half years, he died and I probably missed a dog this morning. I say that all the time, I've lost a lot of people back when I lost my dog, my boxer, it was the most heartbreaking thing. Are you sure we're not there to be late? Do you think there's dogs over humans anyway? Of course there is. Any animal, because if you've been done wrong in your life, if you've been maybe bullied mentally, physically, your dog's your companion, it's the only thing that puts a smile on your face, it doesn't speak back, it's just, they're amazing animals. I've always wanted to get another dog or two but I feel as if that's my lawy way. I've got one upstairs, he's that big. He's much as he's been in a cater but he sleeps on my bed every night at the bottom of the bed with me, marvellous, brilliant company. So when did you start, when you got the reputation of the tax man, how did that come about? Well what happened, I was fighting and I started fighting a little bit for money and things like that. How much? A couple of hundred quids in here and there and I bet you couldn't beat them and people would come down. You'd fight in one night club and then I'm going to fight, I'm going to get my brother and then these brothers would come and then another one would come. So your reputation, you're going up the ladder you say because you're beating more and more people. I beat everyone but in the north-east nearly and then I started working the doors for John Black who was a good boxing trader and there was a lad called Lee Duffy. He was in jail all the time and I was 26 but I was probably like 21 in the end because I was just into trading. I didn't know nothing about drugs, I wouldn't have been in trouble with the police and nothing. He was walking down the street and I was with a lad called Kevkill and he was with a lad called John Phil. It's Lee Duffy's phenomenal name, everyone knew him. John said he'd probably be good friends with you. So me, Gullible, goes up to talk to him and says he's on and as I'm going to talk to him I'm stood square on. If you're square on you get eight, you're going to fall in your ass. I've let that off since side on now if you talk to someone. Anyway, his mate had a bottle of pills on his hand so I turned and looked at him and said he might have left Oak. People said he did it hurt. I said I've seen more stars than Patrick Mower. I said I went down and got that flash. Like a lightning flashed out of a thing or a welding flash. But I got out of it anyway. He tried to grab me but I was 24 stone. He was about 15 half stone and I just, the strength, I picked him up, smashed him into the wall, headbutted him, got him and beat his mate and hit him in the head with a bottle. I threw him out the way. We broke up. I came back and I went looking for him all over, chased him in different places. And then the end he phoned me up and he said look Brian, you're hanging around with loads of assholes. He said I apologise for that day what happened. He said can we team up and we'll go taxing. I said what's taxing? He said come with me. I said what if I get in your house, there's 20 of you waiting for me. So I went with this lad called Mark Millar. There was another lad called Neil Booth who was the leader of his friend. And we got together and probably, I'm not being began, probably the best two fighters in the country at the time. He was going to fight Lenny McLean and then Lenny McLean backed off on the fight. So we teamed up together so it was like this massive tag team type of thing. Nobody could beat Lee and nobody could beat me in the area. So Lee Doffy had the fearsome reputation but he became your best friend. He ended up being my friend. He was not taxing all the drug dealers. The first day I went out with him. I went to his mum's house in Southbank and he was sitting down, put his shoes on and he looked up at me and he went, I must be fucking crackers. Look at the size of him though cos I was 24 stone huge. And he shook me and he said I was an asshole. He shook me and anyway we went out and made £15,000 in a couple of hours. I thought fuck it. I was doing the doors. I was adding about $8. I was making about $300 a week. I thought fuck the doors. So that's where the old case looks started. But your friend Lee, he was brutally murdered. How long after he became friends? I was with him for nearly four months. Three and a four months. And I had a fight with a big lad. One thing I can't stand is bullies. Because of your past. And I seen four dormant beating a kid on the floor. I knocked two of them out. And the police coming arrested me anyway. They put me in a van but I was that strong. I kicked the van door, hinges off, jumped back out of the van. And they ended up getting me in the van, kicked another van door, hinges off. So I got a nix of that. Anyway I've seen this like a couple of days later. I've knocked him out now. Went on remand. And while I was on remand Lee was stabbed to death. But he'd also been shot twice before that. So somebody had, this is how pathetic this is. It's like you thrown petrol on me now. I got the petrol on me in a bucket. And you're trying to get a light. So I punched it to stop you from lighting it. And Lee got charged for breaking the lad's door. Joe, who tried to set him alive. He was actually self-defending. He was on remand for that job. But he was four attempts on his life. And suddenly he got stabbed off a lad called Davey Allinson. So when you were in prison at that time, how did that affect you? Well, it's funny enough because the lad who threw the petrol on him was next door to me. Padded up. He saw things went weird that happened. He'd shouted up. It was a Sunday morning. He said Sunday he was going on a visit. He shouted, Big Bride. He said, Lee Duffy's being stabbed to death. I thought, fucking hell. I tried to go up the funeral. But they wouldn't let me go. So then it was me on my own. So when I come out, I say, fuck him. What they used to say to me, we'd go up the doors. And I was at the key. He said, what do you mean you've got the key? I said, size 12 feet. This is the key to get the door in. I was at them there. I just kicked it off the hinges. I wouldn't go on to those kids. I wouldn't go off those like animals or kids or children or women. But it was like a load of three or four lads in the house. Five or six. I didn't care. I just kicked the door in running, taxed them, take the gear off them. But I always used to take the shoes off them so they could run away. That was one of my little tricks. And at them days, it was cannabis mainly because it was the early 90s. Cannabis ecstasy? Not really ecstasy until later on the ecstasy because the ecstasy didn't come up later on. But there was ecstasy. There wasn't a lot of money in it. So what happened is we'd go in the house and I remember Lee in one house because you have some funny laughs. He kept stepping over this carpet saying, where's your fucking drugs? And he was going, I've got no drugs laying in me. He'd given 5,000 acid tablets. So he was going, where's your drugs? He kept stepping over this carpet. Anyway, when he left, there was ten key of cannabis under the carpet. So you can't see the wood for the trees. So some things are funny. So see when you came out, did you feel as if there could have been a hat out in your life because you became friendly? Oh, there was tables that had killed me all over. I went for a fight. That red car with some lads. They didn't come out. Six of my dangle and shot at me. They all missed me. My mate behind me got shot at the way of 12 store. I was 24 store at the front charging them like at the battle of the eight English and the Scottish. You should know when they've done them fails out of them. So I'm charging guns and he's fucking crackers them. But I thought they would just do you have a death wish then? Where you were feeling this death? Yeah, I wasn't bothered. Still still not bothered. See, another time, I'll come up the blues. It was like a rave type club for like black lads and that. And I was in there. I wanted my friend Rangid. I had come with a shotgun stuck her on him. I jumped in the middle and the gun was on me, the shotgun. I went, shoot me. I'm gonna shoot me. Mother of me, I'm gonna die. Once I'm dead, I don't think about it. I said, but all these witnesses, they're all going to jail for life. Anyway, just turned and run. But when you think what could happen, obviously you could have been killed, you know what I mean? So then when you were taxing people, Brian, how did you pick the people that you were taxing? Was it the serious criminals who were making the most money? Or was it petty criminals? No, no, no. It was anybody. Anybody. Anybody that had money? I didn't give a fuck. How big they were. How many people he had. How many guns he had. I wasn't bothered. And most of the times I'd do it by myself. I'd have a girl in the car with me. I was just going to take the money off the gear off them. But sometimes you go in. I remember going in one house. It was eight or nine black labs. I ended up knocking six of them out in the house. And I took all the money, the gear off them and the drugs and everything. But then other times you've walked in and you've aligned seven of them up to search them all, come out with the fibre. So sometimes you got out. And then another time I went to a caravan. I knew the letter to caravan and I went in and I found £36,000 with the speed because you can smell. It's like cap is the smell. And we've had kilos of coke to have taken off them. And I'll tell you this because I've been nicked for several offences. Nobody else has been nicked for. We allegedly taxed a lad from Nigeria bringing heroin into the country of cocaine. One of the two. And we took her off him. Allegedly a gunpoint to Amrubri. And the police come and arrested me. There were 17 NMDs. There wasn't no helicopter there. It was just the aeroplane. And the company house. And they had the rate at the Zuzie troopers. And they stood behind the thing when they had the different guns that they've got now. And they said, come on, I'm police, I'm police, Scream and Shelton. But you can tell because they've all got Irish accent because they're all like SES or they're all like army type of thing. Anyway, I came all got arrested for Amrubri of a drug deal and bringing drugs from Nigeria into England, going to Salomon and taxed by me and another couple of people. So I was charged with it. I was taken in. And they had them and picked me up the line up. But we went to court when the judge said, this can't go to court. He said, he's bringing drugs into the country as a drug dealer. And they've took the rough and it was the worst. It's not going to barely make the judge kicked it out. So it's a ridiculous charge. So obviously, anybody that's involved in a life of crime, there's always, I believe anybody can be got, anybody's capable on their own day. So if you're taxing people, was it a set wage or were you just taking their gear and money, just not giving a fuck? Just taking everything, the fucking, like an ornament, like the picture that's up, like that picture that's up. You know, setting things like that. And if those scumbags are taken, I've gone to houses where I've taken drugs off paper and I found out the good lads and they're only selling a bit of blown, but when they're selling heroin and crap and they're selling the kids and things like that, they just want taking care. What happened the time you get set up, you went to a house and there was 12 people waiting for you? What happened is I'd tack somebody in one of the raves and like you say, I've had quite a few people. I've had a few track to shoot me when I've gone away. You know, I go to this house, Almsby Bank, Tommy Harrison's friend of mine, he says, can you come and see me? But little did I know they had handguns and shotguns to their heads and they spoke to all of them in the house. So I go to the house, knocked on the door, I'd come and I thought, I said, you Brian, I said, I said, I'll be in mate, I'll come in, I've got it in the idea, I've got my legs hanging off of you, I've got the scars on me, I've got my shetties all over me, stabbed in the back, stabbed in the front, but I was fighting for my life. So people said, we are scared, fucking course I was scared. I was going to the door trying to kill me. And I got told that from a man called Phil Berryman, they wanted to kill me and he had a boat and they were going to put me on a boat and put me out to sea and dump me in the sea. So they all come together in another story, but the people who attacked me when they were all big, big lads, big, big hitters, like little fucking idiots to big time gangsters, I threw them all over, there was a couple of big heavyweight boxers there, I dropped a few of them, anywhere I fell on the floor and they started hitting me with my shetties and chopped me up but they battered me with baseball bats. Have you ever seen a film casino and the beat to me? Yeah, that exact scene is that. Never brought one more on my body because I was that big. It was like, it cushioned it, but I thought I was going to lose my leg. The doctor, she was only 27, I fell in love with her, she was beautiful, she was American and she said, we might have to empty take your leg from her. I thought, you might as well just put me under. I said, so she saved my leg, but yeah, that was the scariest situation. She jumped close as I come to death because I lost three pints of blood in that 176 stitches but I thought, fuck yous. When they would do me, I was on the floor, I said, you better fucking hide because I'm coming for every fucking one he is and I'll still tell him now to this day, and five of them were in that house, I've died, I've been killed and the other ones have been set about and been done in, so I would be revenge type of things. So see that in your life, was your kind of, that was, you can see where the other flip of the coin that you do that to people, so when it happens to you, do you feel anger or do you just accept it to go, well that's what I do. That parcel of what happens, at the end of the day, the place coming, they weren't made to make statements, I wouldn't make a statement, I said, all we need is a blood sample, nobody will know, I said, I'll fucking know, and you'll know, I said, I don't do my statements. So they were saying, we'll give you 100 grand because these were big time gangsters, you know, really big, and they were up for the tip they'd made, obviously, because they hit me on the head of my hammers and put guns to my head, and I said, listen, if you want, what happened is that, I don't know what, you got remanded, and a couple ended up being friends with the people, because it was a bit like you, saying to me, Brian, I've been jumped by 20 lads, what it was, it had a fight with me and I beat him and I broke his jaw in six places and he said I'd jumped them below the lads and what happened, and I literally went down to a nightclub which was a wedding with those, he said machine guns and handguns and all sorts of 80 people, got bowl cutters up at the back door, come in and had the fight with this professional everywhere boxer, beat him and he told all the bullshit, saying I'd jumped him below the lads so they've done tit for tat, so I didn't really was bothered about them, so I went to see the lads, because when they come out in the house, Tommy Harrison's, they were seen by undercut, sorry, off duty policemen and they took the registration and then when they got caught on the A-99 they got remanded, so they were on remand for the tip they'd made on me, but I went to court and said, we're not with them on me, I said they're my mate, I'll come your bloods in this, how can you put over to my bloods? Anyway, they said, we can make you give a sample, I said, well, I'll tell you all the bloods in there, I was at his house, I was boxing with him, we were doing a bit of sparing, he pushed me nose, I told the bloods in his shape, so my statement got them off, so they come down to kill me and then I'm going to court and get them off and that was through fear, it's just the respect I've got. How did the McTires underworld come about, because that's what kind of gave you the reputation and everybody kind of got to know you by then? Well, what happened? I did a book fire Julian Davies who interviewed about 300 fighters I was telling you about and he went across the mall and he had me on the pads with Richie Horsey, the legendary fighter from Hartlepool and he said I've interviewed 300 north fighters but there's only one Brian Cockrell, he said every 100 years I saw someone like him coming around, he's got hand speed, he's got power, he's got solid chin, he's got ability, he's got an abundance of intelligence, he said most people were big and everybody like oo oo oo, like by caveman type, you know, thick and dosy, you know. How was the documentary then when you did that? I had to watch what I was saying, obviously it was. How can you say you were done for murder? Well, I was done for murder but got offered it. So it's like saying, well, I killed Tommy Jenkins and I buried him in the back yard and then they go and find the body so I'm going to get caught obviously but if you've been charged for something and you go up and the evidence has dropped and they haven't gone off evidence against you, obviously you can talk about it or it was alleged on the street or it was still on the street, it's totally different. Did he give you a run-through or anything? Or was he just want information? Was he not caring what you were saying? Even if you incriminated yourself or you have to be careful? No, I just, it was alleged, it was alleged, it looked like the police would say, you know, just, I'm really, really clued up in the law but yeah, it was just it was still on the street, I'd done this and done that. It's like the time when I took place, took place with Chase, he used to chase me every day for fuck all, for no reason whatsoever but they couldn't catch me because I was full group in Rolly Driver, I was top, top the edge. How many things were you charged with, Mulder? I got charged, I've been questioned about 13 times for murder. 13 different murders? Yeah, but I've been charged with seven and I got charged for two attempted murders and two police officers. They said I tried to run them off the road and kill them. I said, so right, you're saying I've tried to kill you, so did my vehicle strike your vehicle? They went no. I said, so how could it be attempted murder? I said, did you get injured? Is there any marks on you? Is there any injuries? No. So I got kicked out. So I've represent myself half a dozen times and caught and won the cases. You know, it's just some of the things that just made up and some of the charges. I mean, I've got done for another attempted murder. I went to see a friend in Thornaby and he copies the DVD to me for the kids, you know, the tax man and the ones when I come for the world strongest man. And I went to see him and as I was in there there was a shooter on the corner from where I was. So as I come out these flats, there was a big block of flats, a couple of hundred people lived there, you have to push the buzzer, you're on camera, but there was a Stockton Board of Council meeting because the flats were getting done up, they were changing the kitchens in the format and stuff and things like that. So there was 50 people there who identified me so I was on camera. So I come up to my house, police car behind me, I said, yeah, what's she have done? Anyway, do you want me? She went no, no. So I come out the house, drove to the petrol station, got some petrol and I had a young lad who used to stay, used to call his dad. I've adopted, like not adopted, but I've took in 30, 40, 50 different kids over the years who've been run away from home and they've had nowhere to live, I've had to stay with social services and things like that, you know. And he was staying here and he was in trouble for a snowball fight. Anyway, the next minute we had this day, day, day, day, the next minute four. It's always the SES to come for me now. It's all the blacked out uniforms and it's on, if you look on the Ridker Road Thornaby, you'll see there was 33 armed response, 68 police involved in this and they pulled me on a road just around the corner. Armed response, armed response, and he was looking through the gun close to the dew. He kept looking through there and looking at me. I went, listen mate, you're in the wrong fucking game. I said, if you can't shoot me from that distance, you want to pack in, you want to get a different job. So anyway, I'm pleased at screaming at me and screaming. I went, will you stop shouting? I said, I'm not 20 mile away. I said, my mum shouts a lot worse than you and I've had more good ads up in my mind than you would ever give me mate. And she frightens me a lot more than you saw. Anyway, he didn't like it anyway. He was doing me heading and he had my hands up and my dog was really vicious Charlie. He was on the McIntyre. He was trying to bite and he hated the police. Yeah, he fucking hated the police. I said, why is that dog always barking at us? I said, he's fucking sick of getting pulled over by his. Anyway, what happened is, and he arrested us for it, for attempted murder. Somebody shot somebody. He got shot. So they took us and then what they're doing now they split you up. I said, there's four years. One of them got stopped in police station. One of them got in the middle. One went to a Harley pole and I went to Redcar. Now Charlie was only in the cells two hours. I said, the dirty bastard, the dogs blew us up. He's only been in two hours. He's got bail. He must have made a statement on the boxer. So anyway, we were in the cells 23 hours something. You can only do 24 hours and then after that for more time. So they said, well, we've got two witnesses. Witness one says, this was supposed to be my resemblance to me. Five foot seven to five eight. I said, fuck it. I must have lost some weight. Medium built a slim. Ginger hair to press frequently. How the fuck is that supposed to be me? And where's the mention of the dog and Miguel friend? I said, why would I take Miguel friend? I love them in life. My stepson and my dog on an arm robbery and shoot someone. Then go back two hours later and drive it home with the big red flags. It is Brian Cockrell. It just makes sense. So anyway, I said, I want a forensic, I want a forensic scientist in here now to do a powder residue test. You know what they are, don't you? For the shooting gun. So I've had seven of them. So they've done all the stuff. She said, wow, you're confident. I said, I haven't done it. Anyway, it gets sent off to whether be coming back four hours later. It's not him. So they took me in the police station and asked me where I went. Told them where I was and I was on camera. There was 50 witnesses and they had me on bail for nine months and then I got shot. They come in and said, I've got your bad news bank. I've had his died. He said you're getting charged with murder soon. But it was just bullshit lies again, though. So it never happened. But again, that's the inconvenience because all the shit that you have done, they just cut your door every day. They bug your house. Bug your car. They bug my car. We found the bug. We went to Leeds. My mate found it. He was ex-SES. He found it for us. I got nicked for another murder. I had called Dougie Manders who was killed and they called for murder squad. You've done this to him. You've done that. You killed the kid. They pulled me in for that murder. They pulled me in for a murder when I worked on the door with somebody 20 years ago to even know him. But from Luton, he'd been shot. They pulled me in for that. They've questioned me of different other murders. They pulled me in for the lad. A lad had been text because this is another problem I have for him, James. Because you've got that big name and that big persona. I'm going to get Brian Cockrell. I mean, I was working on the door once and there were four lads coming in. I knocked three of them out. Anyway, they went, I'm going to get my fucking brother. He's going to kill you. I said, oh, that's your brother. He went, Brian Cockrell. So they were threatening me with me. So you just can't stop that. So anyway, the police had come to arrest me over murders because of the people using my name. How were you dealing with that then? Were you still bang on the drugs? Yes, you'd go on it. And one night I'd just come off it and just got rid of the pipe and everything. I don't think fuck with that. But when they come, it's ridiculous. I remember when they come, they were all excited, they had all the riot shields bang on them. I got out the window and I went, I'm fucking Spartacus. And they went, he's fucking crazy. He doesn't give a fuck, you know what I mean? And they went, come on, come in the house. I've got something for you. And they just stood on the front. And I remember excited to get me for a kidnapping once. And I was supposed to kidnap someone to come to the house for me and it was in Roseworth. And when I was there, I used to have always had dogs. I had a big, massive rock wallet. He was huge. But it was like a council house with a little lally. You know, where you can get through. So I said, let Ben out in the back to my girlfriend anyway. Ben went all the back in the overroom on the front. So I went and he cut over the back fence. There were everywhere the cops were. I laid down on the side of the fence. Wait, were you as well? 23 and a half store. So I'm laid down on the side of the fucking fence. And they're going, I don't know where he is. I was right under his fucking feet. And they walked one foot. And he tripped over me. But you just get looked on you sometimes. You know, anyway. And we re-kidnapped the lad again and made him go to the police station. When I got, I went and myself in and he went to the police. He said, I didn't kidnap me. I was full of drugs. I've got my charges dropped. So do you count yourself lucky that you're still alive today, Brian? Yeah, I suppose I do. But I look at people. I believe they used to say to me, Brian, you ain't going to make 28, 27, the way you're going on. I said, because you just don't give a fuck mate. He said, I've been with some people in my lifetime. I thought the hardest people in the country. And he said, you just don't give a fuck. He said, I don't know why you get it from. You're not crackers. You just don't give a fuck. We spoke earlier. Obviously I've watched your documentary. He's read the book. Speaking to Jamie Boyle, who's writing your other books. So you're expecting to come here and you're just a big fucking lump. Not very well educated. I know you said you weren't at school, but we spoke about things in there that I was surprised with. Guys like Joe Dispenser, all about the mindset, the stuff that you've done with law, that you've found in your own cases. It's quite surprising, Brian. I'm not going to lie mate. You're on the ball, clearly. But again, even though we can educate ourselves on some things, when you're going to court and stuff, you've been lucky, not been lucky, but if you've found your own cases because you've got a way with the majority. Do you know what I mean? I've only met Joe for the end of his time. So you've got a way with them all then? Yeah, yeah. They've never been no evidence or witnesses. They had one case with 15 witnesses against me, but the trial of all the witnesses went missing. They all went away and all of this somewhere I'm going to clue with. They all went, so the case was kicked out, so things like that. But most of my stuff was fighting, you know, fighting, things like that. I remember I was on bail for five years. One day was I off for that charge. I would get another charge out. They had to stay in the house, no house arrest type of thing. Every night I'd been at six o'clock. They'd come four or five times a night. I'd sit outside all night long. That's how much they wanted me. Did you take steroids at any time? To reach 24 stone you must have took something. I took steroids, yeah, I took the steroids. But they're not the bail on end. I'm over 20 stone now, but nothing, you know what I mean. In your documentary, I watched you were eating like 12,000, 13,000 calories a day. How did you consume all that? You could consume a lot of it through just drinks, like your yogurt drinks and protein drinks and porridge. Yeah, but you were waking up at three in the morning, you were eating toasties and baguets, ice cream. That was only on there. That was only for like a holiday. I don't eat that crap all the time, obviously. I ate a lot of protein drinks with porridge in, because obviously it's the Scotch porridge of us. I remember one of the, you only remember this film, remember Wee Geordie? That was my favourite film and he was walking. He's dead a little and he got the pamphlets and he was getting bigger every month and the stairs was shaking. That was when the films got me in the way trade, you know. So I just wanted to be big and strong, you know, because I was always, I mean, that's when I was a kid. I was bullied as a kid. So I was a little weak, like a little weak, the runt of the later type of things. What's your best feat you've ever, bernocle feat you've ever had? You've had over a thousand. So what one stands out to you go? I would say about a thousand bernocle fights. I think I've had a thousand fights with the end clubs and pubs and things like that, probably for about 2,000 people out of it. 2,000 people out on the doors. You've got to remember this, James. I was working there for 40 years, you know what I mean? So working the doors for 30 odd years and I was working like 40 doors. So when you're working like in 40 different clubs, you're fighting every single night. Do you think because you loved fighting that much, that was like a licence to a feat? I think in the end, if you get away with it now, I think it's all changed. You can't even just shout at anyone now, you get charged. It's all licensed. Yeah, yeah. But what it was is people wanting to fight you. And that's what it was, because everyone was at the training and wanting to be fighting, the boxing and all that stuff. But you get beat, you win, you lose, you draw whatever you want. I mean, I've had fights. I had a fight with a lad called the Gypsy lad. He was six foot eight. A bit like Tyson Fury. You know when he was good, he was the type of fighting. But he was the top fighting. The company had 300 fights. They called him the dentist. He used to hit with a big right hand, not called the Tate House. When you used to go to the dentist, that was his nickname. So he tried this for me. The Gypsies are tough, tough bastards. It's had it with me one night, and Spennymore, and I broke his jaw in six places. And he'd come back with a shotgun. And I ran at the car, and he had the shot coming out, and I kicked the window and smashed the window and the fuck down. Why did they come back? Because he got beat? Because he got beat, yeah. He went the fucking police. I had to hide in a big massive fridge with all these hamburgers and stuff on top of me. So the police couldn't find me. That was Spennymore. He was the top hat. That was the worst place where it worked. It was full of like, backwood, if you know what I mean. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but they were all like, I'm fucking like the antithole. I'd be like 40, 50 national frontskins and they'd be throwing money at us. That wasn't so bad. Then I started throwing stones. I said, fuck this. So it comes out and I dropped four, five, six of them. Anyway, it's the only one. He hit the deck. And so I'm looking back, looking always, looking about, you know. As I'm looking, he gets hit and he falls on his ass and he goes, that didn't fucking hit. So he gets up and he went across the road and then he went to the car, hit him and broke both his legs. I shot it that fucking out though, didn't it? And later on, there's a policeman walking by. I said, I thought it was gonna nick me. He said, did you need about that? I looked up and knocked over. I said, oh yeah. I heard about that officer. He said, the funny thing is, the ironic thing is, it was his own kind. It was his brother-in-law coming to pick him up. So the things that just, things that happened are just mad. And then I remember one night we worked Henry Africa's and there were seven of us on the door, John Black and Cookie, Gary Russell, Bernie McDevitt. Tony Bookall. Anyway, there were about 50 of them waiting for his massive gang of them. And it was my birthday. I was 26-year-old. He said, what are we gonna do? I said, I tell you what we're gonna do. Charge! And I just fucking ran at them. And as we ran at them, they all dispersed. And we make on it in the end. He got 22 stitches in his face. Got a brick in his head. But it's chip charge. It was like that in the library. But I just didn't give a fuck. When did you, because I know you end up on the crack. What age did that happen? I was 26. I had the fight with Duffy. I went and looked for it to fight him again. I wanted to have this fight. I tried to fight. He didn't want to fight me in the end. And he just ended up being friends with me. So we went out and we did an attack. I called Craig Howard. We went with £700 off this lad called Nippa Harris. Nippa's something I can't be sick of him anyway. We were looking for him all day. And all of a sudden we walked past the phone box. He's in the fucking phone box. He goes straight in his pocket. £700. He goes a lot of money. He's a lot of money. So we go and get some gear, he said. I said, what do you mean gear? I didn't even know what coke was. I'd heard of it on the telly. I said, you offer a lot. I think you're fucking bullets. That's what I'm probably like. Anyway, so we go to the gate. And we've got this white powder stuff. He says, have a go of that. So I had to go. And that's hot. Fuck it. I thought, fuck it. I thought, fuck it. I said, fuck it. I said, fuck it. I said, fuck it. I said, fuck it. I said, fuck it. Fuck it. Now? My nose is a bit funny now. About four hours later I got it. I still don't fuck off the way that you know. You've never fucking chewed up. I thought I'm a four fucking hours. And we were laughing at it. But it was good at the time. But then we went to 84 Hampton Street. That's called Nicky Smith. This is in Stockton. And Craig got a test tube. And instead of putting it on the spoon, like you're doing on by-cabs and all that, or ammonia, you put a bit of this by-cab stuff in. He got a bit of a coat hang on. He was out in the heat of it. And it sticks to the metal. Took it off. And then I go like that. And then I went, fuck it. I thought it was like being me upspoken. You know what I mean? So off of my head on it. So anyway, if you started then, I thought he's going to fucking start. I was a bit paranoid then. I thought I'm a bit cabbaged here. And he went, Brian, show him how fast you are. Go on. Get on the pads. So he took me on the pads. And when you punch, you punch with light hands. You don't try to punch like you bench the fath over a pound. Because you've got to know. You've got to feel light. My best fight was 20, 20 stone, 10. When I was 22, 23, I was too heavy. I was out of breath. I couldn't move. I was good. So 2010 was probably perfect. It's like Mike Tyson when he was 15, 7. When he went into 15, 10, he wasn't as fast. So that extra few pounds does slow you down. So anyway, I was on the pads. And then he was treating me like that. Anyway, then we went out. So we were on the crack and we were on the pads. And then I thought he's going to throw a slight punch. I thought, fuck it. But if he does, he does. He didn't give me a big cuddle. He was off his head and he went, you know that there? He said there. He beat me. He said for six weeks I couldn't sleep properly. He said he had just batted. No one that said he was better than me said. There's not a man in this there. He can beat you. I'm not a man in this country. I don't think anyone can beat you mate. He said, you've got the word you come up with. You've got hideous strength. He said, when we went to the gym, he was benching 300 pound. I was benching 630. He was squatting 250. I was doing 800. So I was a respecter. He said, fucking hell. I've done this in all these gyms. I've done it in the prisons and everything. I've done 850 kilo leg pressing home house. It's on the wall. I've done 2000 pound leg pressing in other gyms. I've brought the weights, the benches and things in gyms. So I just had this like Samson, one of my other films, like that type of strength. I just had it. I was gifted. And when I was 22, I could bench 500 pound. And I was with no steroids or nothing. So it was just phenomenally strong. Because you went off the radar, Brian, what was that because the drugs were taking its toll? Yeah, yeah. What it was is, it's like pop stars. It's like, you get to see after it. Do you know like the Katie Price is not all them? They write the top of them, don't top films obviously, then they come down a little bit and it's not as good. And the people in the train of chase say, I don't document you with McIntyre. Did that shoot you about a, let's start them with a glorify kind of gang stuff? Yeah, yeah. Which is not good because I don't want that. It's not good, it's not good. I don't want kids to emulate me. I want kids to emulate me, train, I want kids to emulate me, look at after people. The thing in this world and other things that we've lost down is respect. I think the most important thing in life is, doesn't matter if you're black, you're green, you're white, you're pink, you're yellow, whatever religion you are, it doesn't matter what you are, it's what the person you are, it's how you come across, what your persona is. Because I know we're talking about a lot of your past, but we will touch on the future and the stuff that you're doing now, which people will be shocked with. I don't know how this came about, but it was a vote that you were the sixth most feared man in the world. What happened is Steve Richards, who was a prolific author, he didn't interview Peter Old Mafia, top lads all he said. I wasn't saying it was the sixth hardest man in the world, what he was trying to say was probably, five more people like you on the planet could have done what you've done and survived. Macintyne said the same, he said, how you've lived all these years, what you've done, the times of guns pointing at him, everything is just unbelievable, he said. We know it's true, but if somebody had written it in a book, they'd think it was made up, but we don't know, obviously it's in the papers and everything what's happened to you. How much money do you think you've spent? Millions and millions and millions. Millions. I'm not bullshitting you on this. I took 250 grand in one week. I thought I'm going to talk to you. I went to these three lads, they were blabbermouths, they said you won't do this, you won't do that, so I found out where they lived, what dogs they had, where they lived, all the stuff that I met, and I said I want 20 grand off you. 20 grand each, but really I want a 20 grand off them. He'd opened the door for me, and my IQ is 134, so I thought. Of course I want 20 grand each, you don't think I want 20 grand for the three years. So anyway they were two days later, so I charged them an extra 10 grand for being late for the money, and they met me and they gave me, 20 grand of a Scottish money, as you know, a Scottish money, 200 pound note, a little red one, so they gave me 20 grand. I went okay, that'll do me pal, because it was a Scottish 100 pound note. So it was a lot of people using you as well, because of your name, you had money. Of course, of course. All the hangar on, 60 people had it in the door. Well, fancy going out, what it is, I need to get the money for the insurance, and I'd give the kids in the streets and give them 10 quids, and all the stops, and go out where you've gone, would go nowhere, would go this way, there's 20 quid each, just something like that. I used to think I used to be a little kid, nice to be nice to be, but yeah, that people come and phone calls all the time, but when you went on the crack, I'd let people 5 grand, 10 grand, 20 grand, and then you'd say, can you do the favourance to, I am going to penny bri, when you're at rock bottom, you fucking friend that. The only friend I had was my sister, Catherine. Family's always going to be that. My brother Jamie, my mum, my dad, my brother Bobby, they're probably the only people that were around me, that was it. When was rock bottom for you? Well, when my girlfriend left me after 17.5 years, when I was making, when money goes out the window, love goes with it, she was alright when I was making 10s and 20 grand and coming home, I'll come home with 70 grand and throw it in the bed one night and things like that, dating abroad all over and buying the this and 300 pound handbags and all that type of stuff. She thinks she was one of the cadastrians, but when the money went out the window, she went after 17.5 years, she's gone, and then my dog died and my brother hanged him, it was just a nightmare, it was just that bad, you know, just not going to get 200 quid for an eighth, I'll get an eighth and I'll get a bottle of popper to do this and do that. Was that when the drugs were at the heaviest? I used to say, it was a funny analogy of what I said, I said I taxed 20,000 pound and I spent 19,500 pound on drugs wasted, 500 pound on messages. Do you think though, because you are your hot rock bottom, there's your reputation that slayed with it, were you still trying to tax people then or did you hear that? I was still taxing people, I didn't give a fuck, I was even more. Was that just before? Yes, exactly. That's another thing when you start selling drugs, you start selling them in big top range cars and all that stuff and it looks great and you've got the police bug in you and you're getting followed, people are trying to shoot you you can't, you're looking out at the winners, then when you're selling the drug I'll have a bit more and you end up being addicted to it so at the end you don't need selling it to supply yourself with it. So for the last 10 years Brian you were obviously that you're most vulnerable because the drugs have really taken your toll. Why did nobody try and take your life then? I had a fight with a lad 2011, I think it was, I went down because people last of me was your heroes George Best, Mamdali, Rocky Marciano, I said yeah they're fantastic, my heroes are the servicemen and women for giving their lives for this country over in Afghanistan and Iraq and places like that, fighting for our freedom and liberty that they're the real heroes, doctors and nurses policemen, even saving people's lives fighting things like that they're the real heroes, you know The policemen are probably watching as they're going you're lying bastards You can't call all the policemen because if you're a house on fire and you've got your kids in there they'll still go on their house and save your kids so they're not all bad there's a local bobby around here once and he came and said Brian there's 17 houses have been burgled I said leave it with me but in three hours I've got everything back from every house and I said go to this garage all the stuff will be there in the car there's everything like that can't tell you how it'll do me and then another old woman got robbed from her house all that stuff, I've got all that stuff back but you don't hear about the good things you do you hear about the people who get you to he's a bastard, he's shot him, he's killed him any man, is there anything he'll say he said, he said, he said, he said he just goes on forever but when they're going to talk and good about you you're alright but when they're going to talk and bad about you then you're in trouble it doesn't really matter because they're full of shit anyway so what was the catalyst then for you to change your life and open your eyes and go I'm not going to leave my legacy like this I'm not going to die this way when I was I started listening to a man called Joe Dispincer we just mean you were talking about him I couldn't believe that you you come up with these names because he's fantastic and he says that anyone can change your mind no matter how old you are and I was thinking because I'd listen to other people and they would just regurgitate the same stuff but his philosophy was phenomenal it just hit me and he says things like don't think about the past because if they're thinking about the past they're the bad memories that are making you bad so you've got to change the processes in your brain so most people get up every day as you do nobody says you just get up and brush your teeth and put the same cup and get the coffee going away and do the same thing so then the body becomes the mind so you've got to change that then you've got to change it around so that's the philosophy so I started realising that the concept of your thoughts or don't be thinking about bad thoughts thinking about good things and don't try to think about tomorrow or don't think about yesterday just concentrate on the now and nobody says don't plan for tomorrow but before you get out of bed have 20 minutes and think right what can I do today to be the best that I can be and what I can do to help people and to have been listening to following that for the last four months I've been doing it for a year but the last four months I've been helping people I've saved six people's lives in the last eight weeks or so and I've got about 200 people to the hospital and got them back in the gym and you go up anything I've done a great thing there you know and I've got in people's houses, pictures and photographs to be on the Facebook where I'm sitting with little babies and going on people's houses and saying oh you can do this if I can do you can do it I was the biggest crackhead in the world I said don't believe me I know about drugs and it's a bit of a joke once you can't hit any further you've got to come up or you can die so that's what you've done I'm going to shake your hand for that fair play to you big man no matter what you've went through people can change your prime example lying dying full of crack hating the world because the shit you've been through the shit you've been involved in that's going to play PTSD mental factor so it's easy to slip into what people do is they're making excuses oh he's done me and I'm going to have a bit of coke so you make yourself you make your brain think like that think well she's done my head in there I'm going to have a bit of gear, I'm going to have a drink so the only person who can do your head in is yourself because it's you who's thinking everything's in the thought process it's like he says you're a dispenser people think 80,000 thoughts 60,000, 80,000 thoughts a day but most of the thoughts they have 80% of the thoughts they had yesterday it's the same thing so if you're going to keep thinking about the same shit you're going to still stay in the same shit but if you're going through a process of bad thoughts for 10, 20, 30 years it ain't going to change tomorrow it's a long steady process and you've been working on it for the last year and probably now you're starting to feel the effects of it now you want to do your interviews you want to speak in schools you want to speak in schools you're very big on knife crime you want to bring it down you want to kind of put something back into the world but again, as long as you've got air in your lungs you've got something to give so you're clearly here fighting and it's showing that you've not quit you've put through a lot especially your brother and stuff, your misses it's easy just to go it's too much I've seen the biggest men become the weakest because of certain circumstances prison sentences they can't handle it but I've also seen people who've been the weakest become the strongest and that's the beauty of life that is an amazing thing so plans for yourself are moving on then now that your head's clear you're getting another book written by Jamie Boyle we're doing one on I always say healthy body, healthy mind so when you train he's another thing what any doctor will tell you you produce good endorphins you could set at home and levels go up and things like that it makes you feel better but the thing is you have to get your mind right first the most important thing, once you get that right the most important thing is your mind and your health I'd rather have my mind and health than a billion pounds because without your health you've got nothing so you can't help no one without your health so I'm trying to get people sitting about like couch potatoes I can't do it, of course you can do it just get up, quote the doctors get your heart checked out, get yourself your bloods tested and things and just start off small if you're too heavy to train do a little bit of swimming and things like that a little bit of walking I said one of the best things people pay is thousands of stair masses you've got your stairs in your house walk up a couple of steps next day do another few steps and in the end you get there you've got the crawl before you're going to work walk sorry so we're trying to do that and we're trying to do the anti knife campaign because there's another kid just been stabbed the other week I know Teeside is the best place in Britain for people being killed in the last few years there's been 19 life sentences giving out in the last 13 months so yeah for horrific crimes really really bad because you're what are going to speak in prisons and stuff now yeah well I'm doing one of the school on Thursday but kids naughty kids have been involved with knives and take drugs and stuff like that the teacher said oh I know Brian Cocker on the way you don't know him Mr and every kid in the school knows me so but when I'm not trying to be big headed here if you go as a policeman if you go as a probation officer or a school teacher they don't mean because they're authority but when you go as me I'm just Brian Cocker on the streets and what I've done I don't want people to emulate me taxing because an average dustbin man an average shopkeeper makes more money than any criminal because they'll probably make £400 a week you get caught burgled and you get five yeah you could have made a hundred grand working on the bins you could have made a hundred grand working for the council the day you're in prison and anyone in prison is easy and when I went to prison I was like that door was shut and I was like that nightmare you have to ship when they tell you to pee when you tell you to eat you can't do nothing it's horrible horrible How were you in prison when the size of you came through the cell door well what it was I'm the only person in people calling history to wear my own clothes because my legs were 37 inches each and they couldn't get nothing to fit me so I had to wear my own tracksuit bottom because every jail I went to you should have there such a cockerel I said no it fits me so they've never seen the film The Green Mile when he's massive they're trying to get me the dungaree they still didn't fit me they still didn't fit me I said fuck you I said so I got to wear my own tracksuits in jail but they sent me all over I was only in for a drive defence I mean dangerous driving a chase three year fucking ridiculous a judge said to me I'm astonished Mr cockerel that he haven't been in jail before I said well how can you be astonished where they've been in trouble before it's obvious he's obviously been taught the police officers are people I was told him what I am so see me did the documentary though as well sorry I keep going back to that did that bring a lot more heat on you though not really because they just told the truth it was just the police couldn't know nothing like I said the police they're really a lot of them are alright with me now because I saved a woman's life on Durham road your kid cut her up and went across the road smashed it into a wall and got out the car I thought it was a light but it was the other the smoke comes out of the airbag anyway I got out 66 years old I was a bestie that day she panicked, she collapsed, I brought a background my brother phoned the ambulance and I stopped the lorries let the traffic get past them but you never hear things like that another time me and my brother were driving along in the zoosie trooper and this man he was up and down the pub I said he's fucking pissed him ram him off the road because there was a school 600 kids coming out anyway I tried to get out and he pulled away again so in the end I opened the door and I went to punch him pulled his handbrake on but I realised the diabetic and what had happened with it had been automatic the car kept going when he put his foot down there's another thing that they should do if you're a diabetic you shouldn't have an automatic eye you should have a manual car because they don't conch out with but it was all over the fucking place so anyway I phoned the ambulance the police come to me and said you've probably saved the potential disaster there so how's the copers with you now one lives the claw it's enough to live there so is that going to be fantastic do you get any more grief or they know now people just use my name probably at my door once or twice a month he said you come around his house he's done that but the come one day they said murder squad I said oh fucking hell again I tell you what it's one murder I will admit 300 million pound reward so get my money and I'll admit it get me the paper else now what had happened some lad had text some lad they broke it in somebody's house and broke still £20,000 so these villains other lads big gangsters kidnapped this lad but how'd they kidnapped him they said it's Brian Cochrall here if you don't come to your house so he shit himself it's me but it wasn't me it was somebody use of my name so the last text that lad got was me and he was found dead in the red kit police would found him in a van dead but of course the perpetrators they all got 20 year 20 year age but that's how easy it is to get blame for something you haven't done so you want all that behind you to move on to the future and concentrate on getting the next book out doing your talks showing people that you can change showing people that have counselling there anything Brian someone you can speak to about the trauma just your dispenses I've quite a few psychologists on there I think it's just your own mind I think you can programme your own mind if you try hard enough you know anybody can a lot of meditations some people do but what you better do is get a set of headphones what you put on so you can't hear any of the noise because if a car goes by it breaks it breaks the meditations type of thing so for anybody watching Brian who's maybe in the struggle who's maybe got addiction issues or anger issues or who's thinking about becoming a gangster a bit of a boy any advice for them please don't do it because crime doesn't pay my leader feast a Peter Rose my brother the Harry Lancaster the big frames the Mac says the Mickey Soltars different people I know being stabbed to death or do life you know it's just not worth it but at the end of the day the most important thing is get yourself if you're feeling depressed go and see the doctor get yourself in a gym get yourself in a routine where you're looking after yourself and educate yourself because there's nothing better than education when you're educated nobody can take the piss out you but if you're not educated and honest living and I'm proud of you going to school so get yourself to college don't try and do what I've done because 95% of them going out where I'm probably one of the last of the old gangsters now they're all dead so how they've all done 20, 30 years in jail it's just not worth it crime does not pay, believe me in the end it doesn't pay Do you feel as if you need to shed your light then and try and help others to rectify a lot of shit that you've done the past as well but the thing is most of my stuff was what I did as young and daft when you're 20 and you go along with other people but what it is now when I was about there was no knife like there is now I said to people what do you carry a knife for you're not peeling potatoes are you you're going down that town with a knife now if you were to get into a fight and you're having a fight with someone and you hit them and bait it's over you've got a knife you could have pulled a knife and you killed people you killed yourself because you're going to jail for life and you've taken that person's life and you've destroyed two families I was in Brisbane I was telling you earlier on I said how long was the thought the concept of thought and you said I'm going to kill him he said two seconds how long was he here he said two seconds I said one, two, 20 years one, two, 20 years one, two, 30 years 70 years for six seconds six, seven seconds and they went wow they're screwing it over there when you think of it like that just ridiculous if you don't have that knife you're not going to use it are you as simple as that what's great to see you're cleaning sober and you're social media now on social media now what's your name on Twitter Jamie Biles got it I won the the resurrection of Brian Cockro on Facebook the resurrection of Brian Cockro check out for the new book and Jamie Boyle the author Jamie Boyle check out his Twitter page so it was Jamie kind of helped with this interview because this is your first big interview since for that a long time so listen Brian it's been an absolute pleasure good luck with the book and keep doing what you're doing keep trying to help others there's massive respect for that brother thank you very much