 We are back in the crib and we have a very special guest in the building. We got brand man Sean in the building. He's a marketing maverick. I call him a, I think he's a genius, you know, and I don't say that, I don't say that lightly. I've been following brand man Sean on YouTube for quite some time now and I've, I even have value and kind of follow him and really, you know, seeing the tips that he's given artists these days. So Sean, talk to the people. Welcome to the crib. How's everything man? What's up? What's up man? Everything is great. I'm glad to be on man. Appreciate you having me on your platform, man. Of course, man. Of course, man. And you have been helping countless artists for years now. So I wanted to, you know, kind of get, you know, you on the show to kind of talk to, you know, talk to you about like your journey and like how you actually got to this point because you're in a, you're in a, you're in a really dope spot in your career right now because you just launched brand man, brand man network. Yeah. As far as on this end, like you're in a, definitely in a dope place. So I want to start from YouTube. So when did you start your YouTube channel? I'll start here. I had a music festival that had been running for about three years, annually bringing about a thousand people out and we had grown that, that took a lot of energy. We grew it from zero to 1000, that first 1000, pretty much with no money spent on marketing, but just understanding and hacking algorithms on Instagram and all that kind of good stuff at the time. But you know, that's what I do, right? I'm in some real world promotions as well. And in that time, I'd always been around artists and helping out artists brandy consulting things of that nature, but I had to put so much more energy into a lot of other things that I was working in, that it was just an area I was given value in without making it a priority in terms of my own personal business. But then in a lull, when we decided to not do the festival for a period of time and there were some artists that I was working with, hoping to build their brand, but you know, artists hit their creative walls at a certain point, right? Anybody who's, I've never considered myself a manager, but anybody who's been through a management experience, right? Or even a lot of artists would be familiar with a period where artists are going forward, going forward or trying to gather some things, but the actions never add up for whatever reason. And then on top of that, they want to reinvent themselves, right? So I was working the most, the closest I was working on a day to day or let's just say week to week more so with artists, they had even taken a break. And in that period, I had so many people continue to come to me for advice because people would hear about the things that I would be helping other people execute. So it was all very, very much so a word of mouth. And it got to the point where I was like, you know what, let me just do this on YouTube because I was in a period where I was taking a break from all that other stuff and I was doing so much for other people. I said, you know, okay, let me, what, what can I do? That'll be interesting on my, in my extra time. And then I came up with the idea to try doing YouTube. I did YouTube really just to answer people's questions, right? Like, so I don't have to answer them over, over again, break them down in detail. My very first video was like that Fetty video, right? It was like just breaking down conceptually. So then if I show, if people ask me a question, I can say, hey, man, check this video out. And it was very much that I wasn't super heavily thinking I want to be this YouTube guy or anything like that. It was just like, yo, man, I kind of want to help some folks out. People always tell me that artists need a platform to learn some stuff from. I don't know everything, but I just, but I know what I like to talk about and what I know. So let me share some of that stuff. And that's kind of where it came off. And once I started seeing the energy, right? And the way people were rallying around the things I even had, like this one girl that I had like a crush on, like way back in like middle school, high school, she was like my forever crush back in school. She, she, uh, like commented on that video was like, Oh my gosh, this was amazing. Like this is going to go viral. And I was like, even that was like a little inspiration. I was like, oh, shit. Okay. But that's, um, like just little random stuff at that time, man, because it wasn't supposed to be a business or anything like that. Man, that's, man, like to kind of hear like how that, that whole thing transpired and it really started from you doing tactics from the promotion of the festival. Would you say that because I tell artists this all the time and I tell people that actually want to work with artists this all the time. And I, and I tell them, there's no way you're going to learn how to be a manager. There's no way that you're going to be able to know how to market your music unless you have hands on experience doing it. Like, you know, um, like just perfect example, like someone that's wanting to be a manager. Like I say, Hey, like you're going to have to know every, you know, every aspect of the business and you're going to have to do it hands on before you, you get thrown into working with someone. So would you say that you're like one of the ways that it helped you kind of branch off and kind of learn the stuff that you, you've learned was because you were doing it hands on at first with the festival? Would you say that that's true? Yeah, man. I mean, because it wasn't even just the festival. Like I said, I've been advising artists in one way or another for a period of time, even before the festival came about. So I've always been in and around it and doing it, whether it was small projects, just helping some friends or some other folks that heard about me. And then the festival, though, like that, especially a project on that scale, it just, it just helped fine tune things. And I think it's better to be able to have certain experiences from different categories, because then you can codify them into whatever you're going into, right? If you decide to just settle on just marketing, you just settle on just management or whatever for a period of time. Like all of those experiences, especially in music, are transferable. Like festival, I got a sense of, you know, attitudes of artists were at, you know, from a whole different point. Like usually I'm just helping them and blah, blah, blah, blah. But now I get to see the other side where artists are looking at me as a lick and how they approach from that standpoint. But then also the lack of professionalism for so many artists and even bigger than that, which really helps my channel was just the perspective that artists take, right? But then I can see the things that they're lacking in or the expectations they have versus the reality of what it's like. You know what I mean? Exactly. So I was able to get fine tune on both sides, definitely understanding the professional side, definitely understanding the other side, because one side have those two and then I couple it with. So my brother, he was a Grammy nominated, right? Well, just a part of a collective that was they were Grammy nominated. Oh, that's what's up. One thing that I learned was when I was because I was technically not even in music at this time. I was like, I wouldn't take call myself in music. I was actually kind of trying to run away from it. But that's a whole another story of marketing as well. But that, yeah, like I said, that's another story. But when I heard he was nominated, right? And he was still living the life that he was living. I had to do some math, right? I was adding things up just the way I think I'm very logical. And I was like, this don't make sense, right? Exactly. Based on the perspective you have growing up, like you Grammy nominated. Oh, that's like life changing. You you rich, you know, whatever typical childish fantasies or things you might associate with a lot of those titles. And what I saw that, you know, like, you know, it was it was lucky and fortunate for me to have that perspective before I even went into it seriously. Because I was like, oh, man, like this stuff ain't real. You know what I mean? On top of a lot of my experiences working in just other projects and industries and things like that. So it was like, now these numbers don't make sense. I already understood heavily, like, like growth hacking with marketing, how to like completely measure what's true and what's not. What's the source of where the true impact is coming from. So all those things I was just like, yo, a lot of this stuff that people think it is like, this isn't this ain't right. You know, like, how can I help people understand that y'all are far off? Like, so the music business is in the entertainment industry. And the entertainment industry is all about, you know, the in front of the curtain and the behind the curtain. Yeah. And all people see is in front of the curtain, like that behind the curtain is a beast. And that's what gets people messed up. So true. So that's so I'm glad you actually broke that down because that means that you had like that was that spark that kind of told you like, hey, like it's something's not adding up or what's what's happening. So I'm glad you broke that down because I think a lot of people have a misconception. And I think people, especially obviously listeners, like listeners have no idea how like most listeners don't have no idea how the music business works. And then there's a lot of artists that come in and they don't know how the music business works. And they and you know what's crazy is and I know you experience this a lot. You might meet with an artist that has been in a game for almost a bit in a game, but like, you know, has been recording and releasing music for years, but they don't know how publishing works or they don't know how certain things work. So it's kind of crazy how misinformed both people on the outside and in are within the game. So I want to ask you, I want to ask you something. What's one of your biggest frustration with artists today? Oh, because I know you you actually talk with a lot of artists all the time. So it's like, I know that there's some common thread that frustrates you about how they think or what they do. What's one of those things that you would say that frustrates you the most about about artists coming up today? I would say entitlement and especially not knowing and being able to see their own entitlement is like to be even worse. Exactly. Man, that, you know, when I was when I was thinking about that question, I didn't even like, that's not one of the first things that I thought about. But man, you're right. That is crazy. So so tell me like, because I know on your I was looking at your YouTube channel and I saw that like you were very adamant about not managing artists. Like what's one of the things that would that that's that's kind of shying you away from managing artists? One, that's just a lot of responsibility straight up to take over somebody's life. That's that's what it essentially is. You're you're a parent or like, oh, you wouldn't, you know, well, no. Unfortunately, many managers end up becoming a parent. That's right. You're right. Right. And that comes from some of those other things and the entitlement with artists. As a matter of fact, I have a perspective on that. I'll get to that in a second. But so but like just having to really push people along, right? Some artists are being dragged over the finish line. This is supposed to be your dream for you. And now you need to push you every step of the way. You don't want to work. You just want to be in a studio and a lot of that but comes from them not understanding that it's so much more than their talent, right? So that's that's one perspective just from from that. But then literally just the responsibility of it, right? And me not feeling that personally, I'm not in a position where I can even do that, where I can count on you. Yeah, somebody I really, really, really, really no count on. Like I like believe in and understand that work ethic through and through, probably like a childhood friend more than anything for me to have something like that. Just because like not only in you are you putting all this trust on me to oversee your life? I'm really, especially if this is how I'm starting to come and like if I might come up, I'm putting everything on you too. Yeah, you're right. So that's just a tough relationship to me. So it would have to be so, so, so, so right. And I also believe what I could, there was a path that I started to take that was very management oriented and also like label exact opportunity oriented. But then I started to recognize the opportunity for what I'm doing right now, exactly, YouTube and that other side. And it makes so much more sense for who I am, how I think and being able to impact multiple people at scale and provide resources and connections and proper information as opposed to just holding on to one situation. Because also once I start down that path in a lot of ways, like certain offers or or jobs, like that just creates a certain conflict of interest, right? I can't be working with this place and then dropping all these videos a day talking about such and such things like, yo, like, bro, what you doing? So like that created space as well, honestly. But but yeah, like just back specific to the management is like that with the artist, like that whole trust relationship thing. And even that, outside of that, just I would love to have more of a sense of my own system. I always say maybe for one, if I had kids, like once I go through that, I might it might make it easier for me to like have an artist. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'd be more in that mentality. But then even bigger than that, like continuing to build right and be patient with my own path and career, where maybe one day I might run into a talent and then I'm like, yo, I really believe in this talent. You know, maybe fact check them a little bit, make sure they got a got the character and all those things in place. But then say, you know what, I'm in a place where I know such and such, I know such and such, I know such and such. I I have such and such amount of money. No, let me guide this situation, maybe at least up until this point. You know what I mean? Yeah, I got you, got you, got you. There's various ways to do that. And I could still not do that without being a manager. Right. It's like the professional world in general. There's all these set paths there's been and not only did it not match up with my personality once I started to get a feel for it, because I've been around some really dope dudes in terms of like managers. I'm like, oh, this is a manager. Like, when you see a dope one that lets you know, like, ah, am I going to am I going to be like this? Am I going to dedicate? That's not me, but I do this thing as much or even more than he would do. So like, and I'm all about finding my space. But yeah, like understanding that traditional path that was in the industry is not just for artists, it's for the professionals as well. They don't I don't think it's talked about enough on the professional side that it's just as open for the professionals to do whatever they want to do and pave new lanes as it is for the artist. You 100 percent right. Yeah, that's that's one thing. And and really just to bring it back full circle, because I know I mentioned I would touch on this earlier part of that whole entitlement that artists have. I truly believe is only a symptom of really the industry itself. The industry made it that way. It enabled artists to have a certain type of behavior and be entitled in and to like feel like you're supposed to serve me. When you're the entertainer, you're supposed to serve your audiences, right? It's not all about you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You feel like it's all about them, right? Because that's that same mentality right that kept them from wanting to seek other things like ownership in their own stuff, right? We we enable them, we sue them. So now they're in a space where they're good. Their whole world feels like it's about them until the money runs out and they realize the label controls everything. The label has all the access to the data, to the fans, the label. You know what I mean? Like has the ongoing world sees an income or the majority of it, right? They've been doing all the business while we've been having you out here thinking it's all about you. You're enabled in like that. That environment, I think, was very beneficial for the whole industry. Yeah, you know what? Speaking for you to actually say that, like that's kind of what's crazy is, is that because I'm in the business and I have a certain kind of viewpoint on things and it's dope to kind of hear that because I really never thought about that. Like I never thought about how you like, you know, and I agree with it. I think there's a lot of things that happen or, you know, the industry. It did allow, you know, as far as it to actually happen that way, this way. So I want to get I'm going to I'm going to get some more of your takes on this. We're going to go into into into the mix and tell me real quick, what was some some some music that you're listening to right now? Oh, I hate this question. I always forget about folks. Oh, just just tell me just tell me. Yeah, the last thing you listen to. I'll say the last artist that I heard recently that struck a chord with me was the artist by the name of Yellow Payne, Y-E-L-L-O Payne. And yes, he has a couple of songs worth checking out. OK, OK, OK, that's what's up. OK, it's good to know, because like obviously you're you're when you're on when you're on when you're on YouTube, you're you're very unbiased. So it's like, you know, you actually mention artists in a case study type of a scenario, but never on the music side. So I'm going to get some more of your music taste when we get back. You're tuned in to the crib on Dash Radio. We got a brand man, Sean, in the building. We'll be back with him after this mix. Let's go. And we are back in the crib. We're still talking with brand man, Sean. He's he's dropping knowledge. And I and I hope the artists that's tuned in. I hope they actually are really kind of soaking it in. And obviously anybody that's unfamiliar with your channel to go check out the interviews and all of the the content that you actually have on your on your YouTube channel, speaking of interviews, I want to ask you about the interviews, because you've had like a lot of dope interviews when the day you've been interviewed. You it's it's it's so many people that that that I've actually been able to kind of get so much information from and so many people that I've never heard of before, but, you know, that I was able to actually get knowledge from. So tell me some of your favorite just just a few of your favorite interviews and maybe some like something that they wanted the gems that they dropped. One of the interviews with T.J. Chapman, the B.O.B. manager. Also manager, Crabbeco. And one of the gems that I really enjoy in that interview was actually just him talking about diversity, B.O.B.'s diversity. And the reason I enjoy that so much is because, man, I hear every single artist always talking about they want to be diverse these days. I'm diverse. I want to be like this and that and and that's just what I like. Because now it's become a cool thing, right? Like, I listen to everything. I don't like, you know, everybody thinks that it's not true of like for like 99% of people, but everybody thinks and desires to do that. But I always try to take the picture of just from a business standpoint, a logical practical standpoint, it's hard to just come out to be diverse. And even if you do, it creates a lot of struggles. So T.J. having B.O.B. as an artist, one of the most truly diverse artists, not saying the other artist might be ability, but put on a large scale of success in multiple different like type sounds and categories. He walked through really how B.O.B. can win a lot of times when it comes to dropping a song, like one part of his audience will hate it. At least one part of his song, our audience will hate every single song. Like come at it hard because it's so they're so diverse, right? Because he has these songs where he built audiences around these different songs and makes it hard to maneuver in some ways where, you know, you have your favorite artist and they might have a song. Sometimes we're like, oh, they doing that other thing over there. I'm not feeling that or this song ain't for me. But literally B.O.B. is going back and forth between both sides of his fan base and he's a sellout. You know, like that extreme and really, I mean, there's more than just two sides to his fan base. So just really the fact that he was able to like for real, paint it out like use case wise, this is what how hard it is on that. And that that was interesting. And then Ryan Leslie, when I never, yeah, that was a big one. Yeah, yeah, that was dope. And I I love it when it comes down to it. I'll just I'll just say I'll love the fact that he talks about the power relationships, connections, the fact that he thought he was supposed to be, you know, the most talented musician there was in the world, you know what I mean? On some prints playing 27 instruments type stuff. And that was why he got so good. He thought that was the way to get in. But then he realized music wasn't wasn't a meritocracy, right? That's part of that escaping from the childhood fantasy of what it's like. You know what I mean? And realizing that, you know, there's talent. That's a portion of it, but it's the music business. So there's a capital portion of it. There's a connections portion of it. And then just handling the business from the execution team portion of it. They're really encompasses the whole thing. But so from realizing that and then realizing the value of relationships and he has a formula where he basically speaks on the the the potency of a relationship depends on two things, which is proximity and frequency, which is simply how close am I to you, right? Like physically, right? How often do we see you physically? And then how often do we come in contact, right? Like how closely and how often do we come in contact? Of course, because of technology, you can hack some of that through like, oh, we just we text often or we talk on the phone every day. We FaceTime some of that. But even if you think about how many relationships you gain just because you work together or you went to school together, you but they normally probably wouldn't have happened, right? True. And the fact that he's building technology around keeping that experience at scale. That's interesting. And I like and I love the fact that he kind of broke it down into a formula because it's so relevant. It's one of those things we sleep on and it just sounds good. It's like cliche, the power of relationships and things like that. The value of the people around your network is your network. All that stuff is cliche. However, cliche is repeated a lot because cliche is have some truth in it. And people tend to ignore the common sense truth because execution is the hardest part. So I love the fact that he broke that down into this concise formula. Most definitely. So I want to I want to talk to you about the brand man network now, like as far as the. So I want to I want you to tell the listeners what the brand man network is and the benefits of joining the network. All right. So number one, brand man network is a platform that connects artists with the community and resources to help them develop their brand and build their fan base. Those are the two primary things that's the focus. We want to help you get your brand fine tuned. Like if you're a brand, we have one workshop in there where you don't have a brand is going to get you like nice, real nice. And you already have a pretty dope brand. I guarantee you, your brand will still be sharper coming out of the other internet workshop. And then the rest of it is also, once again, helping provide tools and resources to actually help them build a print of a fan base, right? For real, practically real fan base. And we do that in a few ways. All right, we have the workshops, as I talked about, right? And even just some hardcore like courses, because we want to help them be able to do this for themselves. The New Age, right? Has all these independence coming up and for an independent to be able to be successful, they're going to need a couple of things, which is pretty much the same thing. Even going through a label would need artists would need, which is connections, capital and proper information. Right. And of course, as an independent, you don't have access to the label, which can expedite your connections, right? Those the label, you borrow connections, you borrow capital, basically all those things that you need, you need to borrow information. So we're providing those things where like, Hey, man, like if you have a team, your team needs to sign up and everybody needs to be on the same page, have access to this information, because your marketing guy needs to know how to market music specifically on Facebook ads. And we have, okay, we got that. We got Facebook ad course. We're building out the YouTube one right now. But it's not just even those general courses. Like I said, there's specific workshops and I promise you, this is different than a course. This is different than watching YouTube videos. Like you can watch two years of my YouTube videos or just random information online and you probably wouldn't make as much progress as four months going through the workshop series. So it's guided versus I watch a YouTube video and I'm trying to take in this random information. I'm trying to figure out where this tip works in my own process. We help guide you through a more specific process and even help provide some systems. That's another thing. And then so, so you have that, the course slash workshop. You have some private videos that can't be online because sometimes, you know, people just can't talk about certain stuff on a YouTube level or then there's some other things that are just exclusive because it's easier to go deeper in that platform versus YouTube, where sometimes you honestly have to talk about some trivial things just to keep people's attention. And then one of the best things, most valuable things are weekly Q and A's with real people, right? Hopping on calls and you can talk to me currently. So like, you know a little bit about me, right? I've worked with artists in several, you know, yeah, I worked in artists in multiple genres and I got some like a tech background, helped build some companies to the point where they get millions raised in capital and things of that nature. I just just helped not, not be guys, but and then you have people like currently guy who goes by the name of Kory the savior that's his online Instagram, right? Kory the savior and Kory, digital marketer, Spotify playlist expert has clients, a festival co-founder, one of the founding members doing his thing heavily as well. These are people that do it. You have Russ B. He's no longer at Island Records, but he was at Island Records for a good minute, has been at Deaf Trent Jam. He's the GM of Rapsast and he's doing some account management or big social media for some pretty big artists right now. So these are like real people that you get to talk to and that's just currently and at the beginning of the network, we aren't even that deep in there. You're going to be a lot of other people. You have resources coming real soon, whether it's resources they're offering to the network that you'll have access to for free, all these things or whether it's them actually being someone you can talk to from a call, right? There's so, so, so much coming into the network. We're only like five, six weeks out. To be honest, and there's so many things I can't talk about completely just because you know, you got to get things on the dotted line, but there's a lot of value coming into the network. And this is the way I like to look at it. Just I talked about a lot of things. I want to summarize it. You have a video space exclusive videos. Trust me, they're not just regular. I'm on YouTube videos. They go deeper or they touch on things that you don't hear people touch on other places, including me on my YouTube channel, consultations, basically with the live Q&A where you hop on to talk to people like you can get in context. It's not like I'm typing in my YouTube comment hoping they answer my question and they don't even know how deep my situation goes. I'm talking about a play of music, pull up your Instagram profile. All right, what's going on? What did your manager say? What's like, and we go back and forth for real, for real video chat. So and then in the courses space alone has an extreme value because it's guided and it's touching on these Facebook courses and things like that, that people charge thousands for. But going all the way back to just the consultation piece alone, right? Right now I'm going for about three hundred fifty dollars just to be transparent. Exactly. Right. Um, and I was doing this discounting for a period for like a hundred dollars, right? And even if you want to go to that low, right? A hundred dollars is for an hour. And what you might have, this happened to one artist. We got on a consultation, potentially real dope guy. Love what he had going on. He was part of a brand session, too. And we went through all this information and got his plan right, but then probably like two, three days after the call, he had a big company reach out to him. And, you know, he wanted to know what was up and blah, blah, blah, but he didn't have the money for the consultation. Do you get up there? Like those, and because stuff can change so fast, it can change so fast. New opportunities for our newer artists. More important, it's just a one-off call. Because, you know, when you have so many things that you need to do, like, there's just too many factors and too much stuff that can change things. More important than just one one-off call, not to say that a one-off consultation has no value. It definitely can. But more valuable than that is ongoing guidance. So instead of a hundred dollars for one hour, right? You get five months of access to Bram and Network for that same price. And in that five months, you can talk to Sean weekly, you know, Bram and Sean weekly. You can talk to Rush B, Corey and like multiple times as artists in five weeks, I've probably been on seeing them in like 10, 12 calls already, like leveraging and I can't be mad at them, you know, using the resources and using as much as possible. And they're giving it to me every single thing and I can keep updating, oh man, since this last time we talked, this happened, right? I couldn't do that for, for like a cheaper price. Exactly. Like on a one-off basis. I couldn't talk to a lot of people on a one-off basis because it just wouldn't make sense or be worth my time. But this is about how do I create an environment where artists can get as much support and much access as possible, right? Without it not being a charity. You hear what I'm saying? Exactly. No, I totally get you. And this is, this is dope. So, so question, I just want to get just so because I know there's going to be a lot of artists that are going to, you know, ask about the actual payment structure. So is the payment structure for the Bram and Network a monthly? Can they pay by the year? Can they pay by 10 months? Like, how does that, the payment structure work? Right now, it's only available in monthly payment structure. Got it. Looking, you know, by the time some people get on and check it out, it might be a year and monthly. That's the whole, the goal is to add a yearly payment structure as well, just in case people want to do that. And of course, you know, usually the yearly payment structure it gives a little bit of discount off the monthly price as a whole. But right now it's just monthly as of this conversation. Got it. Got it. Got it. OK, so most definitely. So this is my thing. My anybody, any artists listening out there, like there is a lot of value what Sean is bringing. Like, and to be honest with you, I don't know anybody off the top of my head that is doing what Sean is doing. So you guys make sure you head over to brandmannetwork.com to to check this guy. Because I mean, what you're doing is so valuable because and that's kind of why I wanted to have you on the show, too, because I wanted to know because I get a lot of people in my DMs saying, you know, they want to get a shot. They want, you know, they want to have me hear the music. They want me to manage them. They want me to do whatever. But it's it's one of those things where it's just like, I don't really don't have the time, you know, to, you know, have a situation where I can work with everybody. I want to work with as many talented people as possible, but I don't have the opportunity to do so. So I think what you're doing is is is dope because you understood that, OK, you know what, these these one off consultations aren't really and you know what's crazy is you could have kept doing the exact same structure with the consultations. And I feel like and correct me if I'm wrong, but you actually switched it up because you want to help more people and you want to be more of a help instead of being a situation where it's just you are just taking people's money. You know, I'm not saying that you weren't yet that you that that's what you were doing before. But you want to help as many people as possible and spread it out. Am I right? Hey, man, you you got some kind of intuition, man. But you read that perfectly. Perfect because because I could tell and that means that because like, you know, there's a lot of people in this business. They're they're sleazy. They're they're like they just are about the money. And I could tell it's not about just the money with you. It's you're really you really care about the art of the music. You really care about just, you know, everything overall. So it like people got to understand that people like you in this industry is few and far between. Like there's there's not really a huge amount of there's not a lot of people in the business like you, you know, because like there's a lot of people that they they come in, they come out and, you know, they just really in it for that quick book because they see how much money is coming in the game. So with that being said, man, I hats off to you. I have I have another question for you before we go. What's one of the things that you think is going to happen in the industry three years from now? Or, you know, that's coming that hasn't come yet. But what's one of the things that that are that's in the industry that people should be looking out for right now? All right. So there are multiple facets of this. All right. So one I should be able to say this part pretty short and sweet is just the rise of the middle class artist or the livable wage artist. Right. All that we were in some sense. But I think it hasn't really calcified in people's minds that being an artist doesn't necessarily mean being Rihanna or being some big star million there. We're now because of all these resources in the lower overhead and the access. We're now going to have a lot of artists that, I mean, they're making $30,000 a year, $50,000 a year as an artist. And from so many people, that's a failure. But, you know, my question is if would you rather be an artist making $50,000 a year or would you rather be doing some job that you hate for $50,000 a year or $60,000 a year? True. Right. So that's one thing that's going to change as people artists are really going to start to take on that mentality. And some of some of them are going to actually accept that mentality and even start thinking of it as a way of, OK, I'm doing this. I'm a livable wage artist. But then, of course, just like a regular professional career, you start to work your way up, though. Say, OK, I'm working this job. I got entry level. But by year 10, you know, I want to be the CEO or I want to be an exec. So a lot of artists will say, OK, I'm going to focus on this first level. I'm good with this regardless, but I still want to try to figure out how to move my way up. But that in some ways will create a sense of a bubble, at least mentally in the industry, just from an artist standpoint. Now, I don't know how much it'll affect the actual industry, actual industry. I don't that. Yeah, I don't I don't know, right? Particularly when you talk about the more formalized, labeling on that stuff, I think they'll be good. But from just the mentality of a lot of these people who are willing to be an artist, just to be an artist, or they think it's cool. You know what I mean? Like there'll be a bubble burst more personally, individually. So it won't hurt the industry. I don't believe as much, but it will hurt. You'll start to see a lot of individuals kind of like this other dude who, you know, where it comes out. Oh, you were getting money from this and you weren't an artist. You were supposedly allegedly scamming money and things like that, right? To push your career along. So it'll be a lot of people and even influencers in general, where it's like their life is not adding up with what they think it should be or other people think it should be in that part or be exposed. On the other hand, because of this more formalization and professional outlook that a lot of artists have, and as the industry starts to mature, there is going to be more formalized structures on the independent end serving them, not just from a distribution standpoint, but even things like brand that network artists will be more and comfortable with the idea of paying for their education outside of school, which is just a more, you know, that's like a whole different game that's being sold to artists, right? But when artists think about music, they say, oh, man, you know, I see these artists popping, they're blowing up and they're doing it off of a viral video, which obviously we know that a lot of these videos are viral by design, not by just luck, but artists will stop thinking and seeing that. They'll start to say, no, I'll invest in my education this way in the same way I would invest in the school. And that's part of the reason for brand that network, right? There'll be more of things similar in that direction. There already are some like that are similar or serving different audience in different pockets, right? But artists aren't really ready for it yet because I hear artists all the time saying, if I can get this information out here for free, like what's the point of doing this other thing? But you don't know that information is quality, you know what I mean? Or this infrastructure and its surface level is even if it's deep, you don't know how to apply it to yourself. Yeah, you need guidance. What's applicable to you? Like me reading about like all these books on how to be a CEO when I have a business is irrelevant. You know what I mean? Like all these things are operations, but I'm doing marketing and branding over here. And I'm not involved in that. It's irrelevant. It's just like, OK, now you know a lot of stuff, but you can't move or anything and apply it to yourself. So you more structures that help artists do that at scale, I think will come because it's something that's needed, especially when you talk about the education system, education, traditionally college, they don't serve artists. That's true. They don't serve artists at all. Like these music thing, a business courses and things like that. If anything, those are more designed for the music exact, right? Or I want to go work at a label and put my work aside than an artist side, especially a rapper side. No, there's no college. I guarantee you trying to figure out a build out the curriculum to better the lives and increase the chances of success for a rapper. You get 100 percent, 100 percent, 100 percent. Man, you're 100 percent right. Last thing, like it's crazy because like we could and I think I might have you have to have you come back on a show again just to kind of drop some more gems, especially once, you know, once the website gets a lot more steam and so forth. Question, what's one piece of advice that every artist needs to understand if they're really trying to be serious in this business? What's the one piece of advice you can give to somebody right now before they jump on brandmannetwork.com to actually sign up? What's one of the pieces of advice you got for them? Oh, I would say nobody owes you anything. No, that's a good one. I say that not to be like generous, like general or sound good. I say this because truly as an artist, I promise you it would apply to you in many situations where you reach out to somebody and you think that they should reply. It starts to feel a certain way and trust me, this happens to everybody in the industry period at some point and probably still having the people that you think are successful that are reaching out to people or or think or have some expectations of people and the actions or what's happening isn't aligned with that. And a lot of times that slows people down. What you have to do is sometimes to get to the point where you know I'm going to keep moving forward regardless and not not over index on what I think other people should do for me. Not only because, you know, you need to be self-reliant and all that stuff, but a lot of times people get in their feelings and I say this as in I feel it all the time, too. I get it where, you know, you send out an email, that simple scenario and you think somebody to reply, you feel like somebody is ignoring you or you feel like, oh, someone saw your DM, but there's so many honest cases. I know I do it to people where I might be like, I might open up a DM. Oh, man, that question is way deeper than I thought. I don't got a quick chance to answer that. And then, you know, now when I go back to my DMs, I got another 50 other DMs and I'm doing all the other stuff for my life and I don't remember, right? It's nothing personal. I just don't remember. I miss it. Or I'm trying to get back to you. And like, there's there's so many things that aren't personal to you. And but we personalize a lot of stuff because ego, that insecurity. So if you just remember that people don't owe you anything in the first place, it'll help, right? I'll say that I had one situation. I would say this last thing in relation to that. I had one relation where I was like, yo, this girl is super dope. She's doing her thing and she's not even like an artist, but she's in the industry. She does like interviews and things like that. I'm like, she'd be killing it. I mean, she'd be consistent for so long, too. And she hasn't even blown up to like a huge scale yet, but she's still doing it. And I just want to reach out to her and let her know how dope I thought she was. I go into my well to DM her and when I DM her, I see she messaged me like two, three months prior, asking if she could chop it up and like interview me. And I'm like, oh snap. Like I like I missed out on her DM, you know what I mean? And I hope she's not in her feelings or anything about that because I know how that goes. Exactly. Because I'm literally because I think she's dope. And I don't even know that she already tried to reach out to me. That is crazy. It happens all the time, though. Like way more either like it just happens all the time going both ways. So it's hard to that that ego thing is your most vulnerable thing when it comes to moving and dealing with so many people. Man, that's that's invaluable advice for folks, man. Like like I said, man, it's definitely a pleasure chopping it up with you. You know, I could I always get a sense of people that are coming at this business, you know, with with a genuine heart and not really coming in like, oh, how much money can I make? How much money can I make so I can kind of do the next thing? So my hats off to you, man. And like I said, I want to continue to support what you're doing. So please keep me in the loop with everything you got going. Whenever you're about to launch the next arm of your of your business. Let me know. I would love to have you come in to talk to the people because like I said, I have a lot of artists that actually listen to the show because they want to either get their music played or whatever the case may be. And I think this information is going to be super, super valuable for me. So thank you so much for actually coming on the show. Any anything that you want to tell tell the people. OK, well, first, one small thing, that thing you say about delivering with, you know, a genuine heart, I appreciate that. So I definitely try to approach things that way and not just being out for the bag. I can say I'm not about not like, you know, I am about getting my money. I believe everybody should be accountable and treated fairly. More important than just the genuine heart is the ability to, like, OK, say if I'm going to do this for you, I'm going to live on it for you. Exactly. Do it with integrity. I might be doing it just for the money, but if I do it, I'm going to do it right. That's more important. We need more of those people in life in general. When it comes to following me, brand man, B-R-A-N-D man. M-A-N. You can find me on my YouTube channel. I encourage you heavily to check out brandmannetwork.com. The goal is not just to get the information, but also see how you can apply the information to you, execute that information and actually change the level that you're at with that information. And that's an alignment with what we're trying to do and help artists with in brandmannetwork.com. So go check that out. And other than that, you'll find everything else that I'm connected to through those things. Man, like I said, thank you so much for stopping by the crib. You guys have been listening to the crib. If you are an artist and you found this information valuable, make sure you hit them up. Let them know, you know, if you get up in his DMs, don't be mad. If you don't respond quickly, but just make sure if you really want that one-to-one contact, make sure you sign up and join brandmannetwork. Like I can personally vouch for it because I, you know, somebody that's been in the business for as long as I have, I don't know everything, but I know when people know what they're talking about and Sean does. So make sure you guys check them out. Once again, thank you so much, Sean, for stopping by as far as on the crib and giving us a giving us a call. We really appreciate it. And you've been tuned in to the crib on dash radio. Let's go. Remember, check us out every Sunday. We're at a new time. We're on at Eastern time, nine p.m. And we're on Pacific time, six p.m. So make sure you check us out every Sunday. With that being said, let's go.