 Hi, this is Debbie Daschinger and welcome to Dare to Dream. Today's show will feature Shekinah Ma and Sananda Ji, twin rays, who help us to learn and live the secret teachings of liberation. This show has been nominated for Two People's Choice podcast awards for a Webby award and currently Dare to Dream is a finalist for the Coalition of Visionary Resources Award and I've been listed, we've been listed in the WELP Magazine as one of the top 20 best podcasts to listen to this year. I have to thank our sponsors, our faithful sponsors low these many years, Dr. Dean here and Access Consciousness for their tireless energy work out into the world. If you'd like to become a facilitator or take a class, you can do so anywhere in the world. Go to Dr. Dean here, H-E-E-R dot com and Access Consciousness dot com. I'm Debbie Daschinger and I teach folks just like you how to become visible through writing a highly engaging book. I coach you through privates or through groups. I also show you how to be interviewed on podcasts and radio and get massive results and the third leg of my Visibility Hub is taking your book to a guaranteed international bestselling status. I'm about to run a weekend book incubator. It's going to be an exclusive intensive and if you'd like to join for these two days and write your book, whether you're a beginner or in the midst of writing your book, please go check out more information. It's Debbie D dot net slash book incubator D-E-B-B-I-D dot net slash book incubator. We only have spots for 15 people. It's going to be very intimate, very intense and very fun. So I'm looking forward to helping authors produce their work. So the question is how to play gracefully through the nature of this world and into the true light of spirit. My guests are Twin Rays, Shekinah Ma and Sanandji, having reunited at the Great Pyramid of Egypt, they began their merging life paths and service work, both already having established their own world followings and as they met, they remembered that they were already married and had walked together in service before this life, recited their last incarnation set of vows within the king's chamber after only days of the rekindling, led by this divine love marriage, sharing beatific vision, ancient wisdom and gnosis of unchanging truth. Shekinah Ma and Sanandji have walked the path of the initiated mystic and now help their Twin Ray global community to action, selfless service to humanity and the earth. This is accomplished through powerful healing certifications, free satsangs, retreat immersions at their sanctuary or Twin Ray living artwork, protective jewelry technology, their line of supplements and through teaching, the transcendence of the worldliness that brings suffering and binding while revealing the ultimate truth. To learn more you can go to their website which is TwinRay.com and I welcome you both Twin Ray's to the Dare to Dream show. It's so great to have you here. Blessings dear Debbie, it's such a joy to be with you. Thank you so much for a beautiful introduction. We are so happy to be with you and all of you. Yes, your entire audience in the community. When I was reading your bio, I got this download or curiosity about when it talks about how you met and you had been married already and you immediately recognized each other and I'm going to just pitch this. Do you have an affiliation or a connection with Magdalen and Yeshua? What do you feel? That's what I got. That's your answer. We cannot by what one feels, you know, we teach about transcending the ideology of the identity and really understanding the Gnostic truth, really understanding what spirit is, understanding what that one truth is. But yes, there is such thing as incarnation and the soul does have many lives upon that journey as well. But we never like to say who or what we are. We are here to teach really about the transcendence of what everyone is at the fundamental nature of love. OK, respect. And when you saw each other for the first time, so I understand you've done massive work already, we're doing OK and what you were being out in the world. When you first saw each other, what was that like? What was that experience? It was absolutely profound. There's there's no words that could ever give justice to to our meeting. It was tears of absolute remembrance. And it was the instance. Yeah, instant acknowledgments. And it took us down a path that has brought us to this moment. And it just merged both of our realities in our life. It was like timelines of that which is ancient and timelines that which is now and timelines that are in the future coming together and merge into one really spectacular reality. And it was also like, you know, this feeling of just I've been waiting for you, you know, just this just that that deepening and that tears of just such joy and excitement, but sadness at the same time, but being away, but then not being away because we just because we're all also so so much the same being as well. That's what Pinray is what it means. It's it's we share one consciousness. We have two bodies. But as we came together, it was also an adjustment period. You know, it was a big adjustment period to adjust to that frequency and that that that potency. And, you know, we did certain certain rituals in Egypt. Our journey in Egypt was very much. We took a large group to the different temples and chambers and sacred sites and we did profound work. And and many of the different memories that we had walked barefoot on this land before and different incarnations were returning. So any time a memory returns, there's certain emotions that return with that memory as well. So it's pretty profound on many levels. And actually, it was profound for the entire group. Yeah, profound. When we did come together, many beloved started to also remember it was like the veils were coming off. And so it was there really aren't words for it. Yeah, it was very. And that was, you know, five years ago. And it's it's also seems like yesterday. And that's what it felt like as well at the same time when we met was like yesterday that we actually had momentarily. Transition into these incarnated bodies. And then we were brought back together and it's sort of like all the memories that would come back didn't just hit at once. They were like incremental. And then there was just this big veil that just pulled at one moment. And it was just we came back together to further what we still. Exactly. And you remembered. Lifetimes passed and forward from this planet or also other incarnations on other solar systems and planets. Absolutely others as well. We've only had a few nations here. This is awesome. Yeah. That makes sense. And you must have been like, this is so cool. We even look like each other. How does it get any better? It's pretty extraordinary, right? Yes. And so now functioning is twin rays. What is your mission? How do you assist global ascension through teaching, through sharing this ancient wisdom, which I can feel pours through you. And I understand that you marry this ancient wisdom with modern science. So how does your mission manifest and how would you articulate that? That's a beautiful question. There's a beautiful question. Every time cycle, every era, there's whatever civilization we're in, there's a different way to express different language, whether that's science and this modern era or if it's been more biblical in the past. There's a certain language that needs to be expressed to understand the one same truth. Really, it's it's very simple. It's it's it's not a learning process. It's an unlearning process. You know, you already are it's it's removing the obstacles that prevents one from being established in that that truth. And in that love, essentially. And then what happens is there's a lot of phenomenology that can occur, especially through the path of cultivation. And we have a different sort of category between what is sort of psychic, the psychic, parapsychology phenomenon and what is sort of spiritual, because our definition of spirituality is a transcendence of the world. It's the transcendence of anything temporal. It's the transcendence of that which binds you to the world. It is not that you do not live, exist, enjoy and and transmit beauty into the world and with the world. But it is that which binds you. Yeah, so you transcend the suffering. There's there's no longer that that suffering. You experience the true bliss of being. And that is synonymous with love. That's anonymous with peace, with happiness, with self, with God, whatever we wish to call that that truth, that is essentially what is. And so for us, you know, our our teachings, we can get very advanced and speak about different biochemical relations to what happens when the body goes through a metamorphosis process, because we speak about the next human race, the divine human that's on this quantum leap where humanity is on this ascension point. And then it can also be, you know, very, very simple as well. So. And the simplicity is just abiding and being absorbed into that that that profound nature of self. Or we like to refer to that as as Christ as well, that that that Christ principle, that cosmic Christ, that is the ever-pervading intelligence of the omniverse. Yeah, I want to riff on something you just said. Because when I hear you speak like that. I feel hope. I feel when you're talking about our ascension and stepping in to our divinity and releasing these binds. There's a quote from you that I'll read, which is, we know there is a world that exists beyond the limitations of the normal human mind and common human experience. We serve a world where people communicate through love and awareness and the prophecies of a golden age come to pass with more gentle transformation for the planet and heartfelt connections with all life are made. Imagine a world where compassion for all life is the calling and sacred activism is the result. I understand this. I think I intimately, my soul understands this. And I'm also concurrently unclear how at this time on the planet that this is possible. So, for example, this past weekend, I was sitting in a San Pedro ceremony. San Pedro is a plant medicine and it opens the heart. I'm sure you're aware. And I experienced in that space on the medicine with other people on the medicine what it was like to be with some folks I knew and a lot of strangers, just this incredible, amazing, easy way of being and transparency. It was I was immersed in it. It was beautiful. And coming out of the ceremony or any openhearted experience, how do we then transcend that? How do we continue to manifest a world where people communicate through love and awareness, where compassion for all love and sacred activism is the result? Not just for that pocket day experience, but that we can take that and be that, create that out in the world. Yeah. Well, what we always say is that the golden age starts first within you. That which you wish to experience must first be the reflection that you give out. This takes work. This takes the deep excavation process of all the conditioning of all of the belief systems of all of the seeding that has been within humanity since written and recorded history to remove its convolution and bring about its truth. And what we say is that right now, you know, thousands of years ago, truth as it was given and stated were for a very small percentage of people. Because back then, there was not enough of the collective that was waking up or that was awakened or that was on mission or purpose. Now, thousands of years later, we have libraries and libraries of information that are coming back, coming up through the temples and underneath the surface of the waters, being found all over the world, ancient ruins with all of this information written on cave walls and structures. And it all is hieroglyphic in its nature and such that it is coded information. Now, this coded information is not only on these cave walls and structures, but coded information is within your own DNA. It is signaled by the RNA and it is spread throughout the entire universe. And is this what you're referring to within the human, what they call the junk DNA, the 90 percent they've never known what is, but it's actually encoded with all this knowing. Looking at the extra 10 strands that are considered the junk DNA. Well, this is a this is a complete different process. But what we do know is that there's been a lot of modern science claims that aren't really backed in truth in the sense of what the human potential is capable of. There's certain aspects of the human biology that is dormant and not activated. The body itself goes through a metamorphosis and the DNA plays a role in that. And it is because it is a failsafe mechanism that can only activate when you are truly living in integrity, living in that pure state, what we call a satific life. Satific is just a Sanskrit word for pure purity. But but also there's more than that in the container of what's happening on this earth. Like a lot of a lot of the the energetic templates we see physical and we see separation because we see one object and we see another. But there's this entire intelligent field that is a is a bio energetic field that has all this information. And so a lot of this information is encoded within the field that then the DNA signals and switches on. And then sometimes you get a download or a remembrance or a memory or an emotion or a direct experience that sort of triggers that. And then you have an embodiment of that that knowledge of that wisdom. But bringing it into a deeper level, you mentioned something quite important with the plant medicine, the power plant medicine. And what does that do? That really dissolves all the veils that that really lets the veils drop for people to get out of the way of themselves, to get away out of this this human ego construct that's based on conditioning. And that's really what this world has been experiencing from the dawn of time is the conditioning of societal conditioning, religious conditioning, ancestral conditioning, family conditioning. All of that conditioning is about programs and beliefs. And that's what has to be excavated. That's what has to be really looked into. And when you do that, what happens is that you start releasing all the things that don't support you. So what happens is when you pull those programs out metaphorically, you can see clearly, you can feel clearly, you don't see the borders or the boundaries or the or the separation that is between, you know, a human and a plant or an animal or or anything. You see the oneness, you can feel it, but that's not enough. That experience is not enough. You have to embody it. You have to live it. And so that's where you must be courageous. You must be courageous to stand for truth, to stand for love. And right now there's a global awakening. Many people are waking up. They're waking up to this this truth in many different ways, whether it's through meditation, whether it's through cultivation, whether it's through certain power plants that are supporting this global awakening so people can actually see that. A lot of these perceptions are illusionary and they're just beliefs that need to be dissolved. Beloved, warring countries do not just exist within the countries alone. They are reflections of the people themselves that live within the countries and that live all over the world. A warring country is the reflection of every single human being that looks in the mirror and says, I can't love myself. It is it is a reflection of every single person that can't love their neighbor. A reflection of every single person that still hasn't resolved what they need to resolve with their family of origin, which means the family they were brought into. These are the tests. These are the the paths that one takes. You incarnate into a body. You incarnate into a family. You choose what you've incarnated into. You choose the country. You choose the way in which the mapping of the stars were at that moment that then connects to your own mapping of the stars within you. There are there is nothing that is not of your choice. And we help people in a standard four different ways of living, essentially. And this is your choice. This is how one can live and experience and perceive the world. Soul's choice is what I'm referring to, not a conscious human's choice. So the first level to this to make it really simple for everyone that's listening is that there's this perception of the life happens to me. You know, the world happens to me and that's the victim mentality. That's when someone's in a show state. You know, everything that happens, there's no responsibility. There's there's more of a a resistance. And really, that's the only cause to suffering is resisting to what is when you're in resistance, there's ignorance. You're ignoring love, you're ignoring truth. As you ignore that, then the universe keeps tapping you. Wake up, wake up, wake up and lessons get harder. Lessons get more intense until you get to your breaking point. You get onto your hands and knees and say, I surrender. You know, this is where it comes to a crucial point where many souls are going through the dark night of the soul. And this is what's happening on the earth as a purification that's taking place, where people have to literally humble themselves. They have to become more selfless. It's not about the ego any longer. It's about the we, not the separate self. That's the first level. The second level is where sort of life happens for me. There's this, you know, there's these symbols, the synchronicities. You start noticing license plates, numbers. Yes, everything's speaking to you. Something's talking to you. It's the synchronicities, the serendipities. There's these beautiful symbols that come to you. And there's affirmation. There's confirmation while the universe is listening. Well, I'm not alone. That is this process. And there's more this active manner where you want to, you want to change. You want to be the change. You want to, you want to be active. You want to learn, you want to be a sponge. You want to absorb as much the information that you can that resonates with your heart and soul to expand your awareness. So that's the second stage of this where the spiritual journey really starts to starts to pick up. You really what? I'm not just this physical body. I am the soul on this spirit that has a physical body. Let's play with this. What can this do? What are the magic that I can manifest? That's where that all happens. And then there's another level to that where that takes on another level where you start integrating greater virtues, greater, there's greater integrity, there's greater purity, there's greater patience and presence. And at this level, this is where life happens through you. You're more of a conduit. You're more of a conduit for spirits. And and this is where you can see that where you're living in that alignment and life is such a beautiful unfoldment. There's a greater flow at this at this stage, so to speak. And then there's a fourth stage, which we won't even speak into. But because right now it's unless you really wish to. Are you serious? It's like you took me to the edge of this beautiful vista and you're turning around and walking back. Help me fly. What is the fourth level? Please, yes, I want to know. Yes. So the fourth level is life happens as me. There is no differentiation. You know, you see God's. This is God realization. You don't know anyone who's very. You see the divinity. This is not something that can be taught. This is an awakening that occurs and it's a maturation that unfolds. It's a maturing process where you see divinity in everything. You see divinity in the stars. You see divinity in the animals and the plants in every aspect. You see divinity even in the war that takes place. Everything you everything is divine. There's an unconditional oneness. There's an unconditional truth and all of it makes sense. You have the golden key that unlocks every single door. There is no more suffering. You never go backwards because you cannot entertain the notions that are a part of the delusion of the separate self. That is self realisation. That is enlightenment, self illumination. Here, there are no more questions. The mind is empty and still. Yes. Wow. That reminds me of a story I learned many, many years ago. And I I'll just suppose because I can't remember that I was at some kind of a workshop or experience. And somebody was a real story that they told that somebody was taught no matter what happens. Your response is fantastic. So this gentleman and his wife go on a trip and they go to a hotel and they're wind up there in the middle of the night. But their reservation was given away and the man says fantastic. And they escort them to another hotel in town. And it turns out they get an even better room and everything along. They have all these obstacles and beautiful things that happen. And no matter what shows up, this man says fantastic, that always stayed with me, that very detached way of blessing life, no matter what comes in one's path. And I know this is but an element of what you're describing. And I even have a sense as you say it, I don't live this. I would love to live what you're describing. But this sense of these eyes that one must have to go out into the world. This heart that one must have in this way of truly energetically being with every thing, every one, every situation. Yes. And you know, this is not something that is like another state to attain. Like it's not something it's always this is that one universal truth that is always there, that one expression of love, that awareness, that that one thing, essentially, that is always there. It's always in the background. And when you are present with that divine presence, then you are more conscious with every activity, every action. And you no longer you no longer reacting to life in this struggle. There's a response. And it's not something that's, you know, somewhere over there in a long far distance. That's only for those people. It's only for those type of people. It's not it's really it's really much more grounded than that. It's it's something available for everyone when and it's your true nature. Yeah, I think this is what you were describing in the very beginning when you said why people come to work with you and what you facilitate. And I think what I hear you saying is we are already that it's not a state to become or attain. We are that is just that we have all these trappings and beliefs and, etc., that have disconnected us and made separation seem like the reality rather than the illusion and the work you do helps to remove that so we can get back to our natural state. Yes, that is correct. Imagine for a moment the most beautiful necklace you've ever seen all of the jewels you've ever wanted to have in one necklace. Diamonds and rubies and, you know, anything you can think of, right? And each one is sparkly and beautiful and has an illuminated presence. But what holds all of those jewels together is that thread that that is what is unseen. That is what is holding it all together. And that is what is very rarely appreciated. One is more interested in the illusion, the the shimmeringness that can blind you. We are inviting to see what is behind it. And then when you see that it's all one. It's one necklace. It's all beautiful. It's all it's it's all has its has its different difference and uniqueness, but it's all one at the same time. And so, you know, at the same time, they're like we also said, there's a different aspect of the the parapsychology, the phenomenology of the psychic phenomenon that can occur as well. And when you start cultivating, this is where certain gifts can come online. And we don't necessarily attribute that to spirituality. We just attribute that to being able to tap into your divine potential and manifesting those divinities. And that's that's really what what we mean by that is that because sometimes people think, oh, it's all about the gifts. It's all about the diamonds, the rubies, all the sparkles. But it's but spirituality is a lot more sobering than that. Spirituality is this undying truth and unborn truth. And and it's always there. It is your makeup. And it's not about finding that. It's about just abiding inside that. And then from that space where your cup is overflowing, then you can play. Then you get to play. And all of this becomes a divine play. And then you have truth, you are no longer. Encumbered by your conditioning, your perceptions, your belief systems by others, perceptions of you. Those things hold no value anymore because there is truly a oneness and an internal peace that does not go away. When people work with you, when they come to your retreats and such. I already know the answer, but because I can feel you. But I want it, I want to know for the listeners, is it are you're energetically working with them as a group? Yes. And then. You're how does that operate? I mean, do you also work with individuals? Is the whole group as one entity being facilitated? How is this guidance unfolding? All of the above? Yeah, all of the above. It's it's one harmonic induction. When you come to our sacred lands, when you come to a sacred temple, when you come into our field, it's about just unmasking, not through efforts, but just being receiving that transmission that brings you home to that love that's within you. Always has been and and you know that these we are simplifying all of the the teachings with intention because it is simple. Now, there is certain levels that you can play with when you can understand all of this is a divine expression. And you can play with that. Am I, you know, the magic? Why is the magic? Yeah, Maya is magic. And so we teach beloveds how to really connect the different levels and realms, but not because they're trying to become more spiritual by doing so, but they're actually playing with the realms that are available. And and as you do that, you can cultivate a profound. Yeah, a profound gifts. And these gifts once cultivated is is just like any muscle. Once you once you work on it, it becomes stronger and stronger. And your abilities become not because you want them. It's because how can I serve and use them for the greater good of all? And that is the main beloved, you spoke about something so important to me in the touch on it. And that is the main thing is that gifts are not given in order for one to have their own self interest. Gifts are given in order to be in selfless service. I want to ask you a question about that. So for you both, did you ever have the sense in the beginning like, you want me to what you want me to be a master, you want me to lead, you want me to teach, he'll, did you ever have a moment like? Or was it always just this, but of course, this is my calling. This makes sense. Was it always graceful and harmonious? Or did you have a few moments of, I'm not really sure why me or how to step into this? You know, great question, you know, for us, it was from the very beginning that we knew that we're here for a greater calling. And, you know, life doesn't give you all of it at once. It gives you step by step. The universe never gives you more than you can really handle. The universe doesn't give or take anything. All it does is show you you. Yeah. And and we've had to give everything to you. And we've had to give everything up, you know, our lives included. And it's there's always some emotion around it, but there's always a willingness. There's there's always a willingness and the emotion isn't of of resistance. The emotion is that beautiful surrender of what is now. Shekina has a bit of a different story because she's she's what's known as walking where the soul that inhabited the body beforehand, she had left. So the body died for six days and six nights. And Shekina, the presence and her spirit that she is in this physical embodiment came through and and I have a different sort of different story, but the same story where I sort of went through my own death initiation and resurrection and and so for us, we're not the same souls, you could say that first came into the vessels from the beginning. Absolutely. And we can share that, at least for this original inhabitant of the beautiful soul that came in through the both now and the body was a challenge. And she had been told from a very, very early age repeatedly that her future would this is what the body's future would end up as. And she didn't understand one word. That was like another language then or another calling. It must have been very confusing if most of your particles with another being were on a path and a knowingness and an identity. And all of a sudden that's gone and it's vacant. And then you came in with all new desires, awarenesses and soul path. That was what the death initiation was for, was to release all of the old comic streams, all of the older conditioning, and it would take seven years, which is a full comic cycle in order for from that time of the death to really until I was able to come in in in fullness. And so, of course, we knew this, we orchestrated it. So we were already aware. Yes. So it's sort of like, you know, the the one that's experiencing life, experience itself of life and the one that's witnessing all the experience that's playing out since this three sort of perspective at all at once. And that's sort of how we how we look back and see it all unfold. But yeah, we are writing a book about all of this. Yes, great detail. Yes, all of the stories and the entire coming together. Yeah. Yeah. And there's many, there's many stories of just really just giving everything up, giving it all up. And and from from every single level, like even you know, physically, I gave every single thing away. I gave all I had all the money in my bank accounts, which was quite a substantial amount. Just gave it all to homeless people. Just just to fully show that I that I'm in complete surrender. Took the clothes right off your body. You gave them off as long as I didn't get them done. Gave it gave my clothes to, you know, homeless people that needed it more than I, you know, just not not to prove something to myself, not to but just to actually surrender and give everything away. And that that's we're not saying you need to do that. We're not saying go out and do that. We're saying that this is this is the path that we took, which was, you know, the encodement of our journey. But that's where it all comes from. It's like, give it all because what do you really earn? What do you really have? Really, if everyone answers this question for themselves, what do you really possess? What are you taking? What are you taking with you? What are you actually attached to? Because everyone thinks they're attached to stuff. Oh, I'm attached to this or this. But really, at the end of the day, if you really think about it, what can you be attached to? It's it's a deep question. Like, what can you physically? What can you emotionally? What can you mentally actually be attached to? Nothing. If you were attached, you'd be attached always. You'd be attached throughout eternity. And so what what happens is when you relinquish the identity of attachment and you are discerning truth and what is what is eternal and what is temporal. And when you relinquish the expectations emotionally, then you free yourself from this binding. It's so that's a very simple process, but it's not easy. You know, it's just like when we say simple, we speak like you can see a beautiful pianist. They can play amazing, the instrument amazing. They're one. They're just they're just one with everything that they're doing. And that's years and years and years of mastery, but they make it look so simple and elegant. And so we always give this analogy as well as that. You know, there's a difference between listening to music. Everyone can listen to music and feel that. And some people are transported when they listen to that music. But not everyone can can play music. There's a deep and there's a deeper level of mastery. And not everyone can create music, you know, produce it and make it. That's a high level of mastery. So there's these levels of mastery in life. That's why we say it's simple, but it's not easy. Because sometimes the whole blueprint of someone's conditioning makes it seem like a mountain and you have to go through it. You can't bypass your own process, essentially. And why would you want to? Yeah, you have come in order to have this process. You've come in order to have the ups and the downs to experience and imperance all of the multiplicity of God. Why would you want to bypass it? When this is where the magic is, it's happening right now. Whether you feel it's good, whether you feel it's bad. It's all part of the oneness because this is belief system mainly in the West that all is one and everything is one. And that seems to mean that everyone is the same. And is completely equal. And thus everyone's soul attainment is equal. And that is not correct. However, what is the one? Is that which moves everything? Is that which allows experience to exist at all? But the multiplicity? Yes, ma'am. Just just emulating what you're saying is that it's just the consciousness, the consciousness is one, you know, the spirit is one. You look around the room right now, everyone takes a look and goes, OK, I have the lighting and maybe there's some PowerPoints and maybe there's some different appliances. They're all different in their expression, but they use one power. That's sort of a simple analogy to understand that there's one current. There's one consciousness, there's one spirit, but there's all different aspects that are part of that one. So there can be a confusion that can happen when someone thinks of oneness. Oh, no, I have to just, you know, everything's one. And there's that's that's not complete yet. That is not complete. There's a there's a deeper process that happens. And so you still you still have your unique expression, but you see truth and that that truth is the freeing agent that never leads you. It's my path right now to be moving into a sacred divine union. I I know this is so and I I know because when I'm called to something, I I become voracious on some level and I really feel as well. That's why you were called into my life right now. Obviously, you emulate this and you are this. So I find that really fascinating. I don't know if I'm a twin flame or a twin ray with Rob. And I'm not sure. I mean, we're certainly not what you are talking about coming from the same space. How does one know if they are involved or not with their twin flame or twin ray? All right. So that's a good question. And we have we've full support of you and this beautiful partnership that you're in now. Now, in order to be a twin ray, you actually have to us to have to help send it already. Which means that you have no longer any calm. You are free of karma, you are free of suffering, you are empty. You are fully liberated and free from the bindings of yeah, any aspects. So that that's that's what it it is. And that's first and foremost, so that can't be confused because you just there is there is no difference between that that's truth. It's like looking at rays of light, right? They're unmovable. There is no push pull. There is no taking. There is no real need for each other or for that connectivity. Rays don't move. And they're all part of the one, the one sun, essentially. OK, so if you saw shafts of light coming out of a cloud, you know, there's there they're very defined, but yet they're part of that one elimination of the body of light. Now, twin flames on the other hand, watch a flame. It moves, it dances with it with each other. And it has a very different feeling. Very different feeling and a very different purpose. Twin flames are here to be activists in the world. They are here for their, you know, for the purpose, for working together. And through that, they can send together if they are able to work through the first few stages of a twin flame relationship. Yeah, this is, you know, where you get to be each other. There's very highly charged mirrors. And everything come up and you have to you work at that through that together and then you ascend together. And then your your your purpose together is always worldly. There's always a world focus. You're here to assist the world in a greater way. And when you come together and you be powerful leaders of light, you are you are supporting each other in that. And there's a great love, there's a great remembrance. It's not the first lifetime that you've had. There's multiple lifetimes. And so, yes, it is a difficult journey with a twin flame. It's it's kind of, you know, we don't like to say difficult, really, because the truth is, is that it's what you make of it. And it's beautiful. It's everything that is a challenge is a great opportunity. You know, really, it's a great opportunity. And but there can be some intensity. It's intense. There's an intensity to that feeling. And then there can be greater peace and greater potency that can be honed when you come into that that joint union. And it's everything can become sacred. That's really what a relationship is about. It's about that sacred commitment, that sacred union and making that connection inside yourself and within a relationship container. Absolutely. Perfect. Yes. And listening to you, I feel really clear. We're not rays. We are flames and we have just come out of such a difficult almost year, so difficult. Most people would not have stayed incredibly triggering and activating for both of us. And yet we both chose each other and we are here coming out. And there's all this love and possibility. And we definitely have a mission because we do music together. We do very healing spiritual, if you will, uplifting music. We love performing and helping people shift that way. And in our pursuit of divine union, we're reading things that are we're attracted to like the Magdalen manuscript and the manuscript and the Sophia code and things that keep being presented. I also know we long in heading toward a sacred union like the reading is beautiful and showing us. I think it's actually a lot of remembrance going on. And for Rob and me, for the listeners who want to go way beyond reading to actualize a sacred divine relationship, are there steps? Are there ways of being so that our hearts and our lives align and how would we go about this? Yes, beautiful question. And there's many unfoldments and developments that take place and your fields start going through an emerging process. But it also creates that divine union creates the mystical thirds, which is the third part and component of what your relationship is together. And so you have the very first breath that you take is encoded to the entire alignment of the stars. And you breathe that breath of Prana into your body and your body is embedded and encoded with the with the karmic lessons that you left with in your last incarnations. Your last breath is your last breath in your last life that you take before you leave the vessel. Is your first breath in this life that you take? And thus everything goes right through the Prana too. And so everything's recorded inside you. You have this entire bio circuitry system and you have these different levels and layers of your light body, your field. When you are in a sacred relationship, there's certain resonant points that trigger these certain memories or these certain encodements to unlock and to work through together because you come through this whole host of your ancestral line and also your soul ancestry tree. And so when you come together, you're working together to the collective soul, which is known as the monads. Monad is just a term called meaning one, mono, meaning one. So it's the one group of souls, which is 144,000 souls within this monad that are a part of one cluster of experience. When you're a twin flame, you're working through that to embody and clear and support and harmonize and perfect really all the different karmic scripts and records. And so as you're working together, there's a unification that takes place, you know, your field starts to emerge. There's certain activations that take place in your body. There's a greater love that can happen. There's there's certain callings that you receive that you have to go somewhere. You have to do something and there's a place that's calling you. You have to remember and collect those those memories or those coatings there. There's it's very mission orientated. This is a very dynamic, powerful, important relationship to be a part of and it's a blessing. It's such a gift. It's such a gift to be bestowed such a thing. So many people are yearning to be in relationship and so many people think they're in that relationship, but they're not prepared to go to that extra extra mile to go in the excavations that it takes. And astrologically throughout one's birth chart and just for your listeners will share very quickly. The moment you are born, there is a snapshot of the sky that is taken. That's not the sky has characteristics and traits because the planets themselves have characteristics and traits, those characteristics and traits and lessons and karmic times of that snapshot is very much a mapping of your life of your entire soul's journey in the body. And if you learn how to read even deeper throughout time and space. Yeah, in astrology, traditional astrology, it's called a natal chart. We call it your navel and the connection of the ambilical chord to the cosmos. So any incarnation you take, you always take your records. And this is this is recorded in your karsic body, the fifth level of your field, the causal body instrument. Your role is to turn that into a causal, which you negate all the records that are negative. And then you live in the good karma of your actions in the what's known as dharma. So when you're in a full alignment with your dynamic purpose, your spiritual purpose, so when you are in a twin flame essentially. Yeah, when you're in a twin flame relationship, you are following cosmic law, you're following your dynamic path, you're living together, upholding that. And that is upholding it for the world. Now, but it's harder to do because you're still going through your soul's heroes journey. So it isn't quite as easy because there are conditionings that you're still moving through. There are belief systems. There are fears, a lot of fears come up for a twin flame relationship. At least they can, you know, but there's also supreme magic. There's a power that can come from those relationships as well. That love that can be felt and experienced. When you cultivate that, not from what can you do for me? But how can I serve you when you are give of yourself? How can I serve you, my love? And when you see the oneness of the heart of your beloved is the one beloved of the all loving one. There is a great depth to the love that is infinite and your capacity to express that, feel that, live as that. And so you're just being, you're being literally pulled apart and shedding all the layers. So then love stands alone together as one. And that's the path. So there's and there's so much magic. You can have this telepathic connection. You can have a telekinetic. All the high sense perceptions start activating as well when you're really cultivating together. You can you can start taking your abilities to a whole new level because there's two vessels that can work with that alchemy together. So there's a whole ascension process that happens. Or we call it the in sentient. It's the ascension that's happening internally. So there's a there's there's a profound magic that can happen when with your twin flame and also in preparation to actually attract your twin flame. I want to ask you along those lines. And this will also encompass individuals. My word, I pick a word every year and my word is now become an overused word. So I don't like that. I like unique, but I resonated with it. And the word was sovereign and sovereignty. I was very attracted to that for myself. And I noticed that there are people who say I'm a sovereign being. I have a right to do this. I have a right to be this. If you have a problem with this tough because I'm a sovereign being. And so it has these elements of selfishness to it. And their behavior can actually wound another without empathy or compassion. But standing underneath the umbrella of that word. So what is sovereignty being sovereign? What is that really? And how does one get there? What is the I want to say? Like the homeopathic essence of that and that truth. Let's break apart the word show. Yes. Yeah. You know, to rain, to sovereign, to rain over what? What are you raining over? It's a lot of self. And that's that's that's what sovereignty really means to rain supreme over the ego. Not this identification of I'm sovereign. The ego can never be sovereign. The individual cannot be sovereign in that respect. Now, we're talking solely spiritual. There's sovereignty. That means different things to different governmental bodies. But but we're talking about spiritual sovereignty. There's a difference between selfish sovereignty and selfless sovereignty. Selfish sovereignty is that there's a lot of entitlements pretty much is like I'm entitled to whatever I want and I can be or whoever I want. And it doesn't really matter who I upset or if upset because I'm a free being to do as I please. That is not freedom. You know, the universe won't won't be kind to that. The reflection that comes back on that is going to be pretty pretty intense to listen to to want to learn as a matter of fact, if you just for a moment, let's let's do a little exercise, just one moment. OK, imagine somebody who's standing there. There's there's an energy. There's a pushing in order for one to even speak words like that. And guess what happens when one pushes like that? There's always a push. So that is not free. That is a struggle. That is a struggle all within its own right, even standing up in that way. There is going to be opposition. Yeah, and that's important to understand, because at that level, that's perceiving the world and duality. Does that make sense? Light, first, dark. Very much. Yes. It's hugely. I love this this picture, you drew of if you're using words like that and impressing upon another or the world, this entitlement, this selfishness, then any energy going this way in order for it to have anything other than just pure air must have also energy coming back at. And then, yeah, that is not creating, I think, with the intention. Even, you know, unconsciously for the person of what sovereign really is. Yeah, and, you know, being in one's power and being in one's, you know, there's this there's this ideology of it's about me, you know, the world's for me. This is this is that very second, that second level, that self-ambitious like the world happens for me. What do I get from this world? And there might be elements of what can I give, but there's always something what do I get back in return from? It's not really truly selfless. The next level is that selfless sovereignty, where there's a truth. There's a truth to know what one really is beyond the individualization, you know, the individual in divides. That's what it says. It's in division. Basically, if you look at that word, it's someone that's in divide, they're in division with themselves and in division with others. And a lot of the sovereignty movements is like, OK, there's these negative forces, there's these positive forces, there's this light, there's this dark, and you have to free yourself from this. You have to be sovereign in your own energy and you have it's all nonsense to anyone who believes that. Yeah, that will never end for you. You will be fighting some external thing for the rest of your eternity. But when you go into this, you don't get this piece. The selfless sovereignty, you start taking responsibility. It's your ability to respond. And when you see that everything is a reflection, if it's virtuous, the angelic expression of your own heart and your divine nature, the divinity made manifest through that angelic human, or if it's not virtues, it's the vices, the things that bind you, which are then the demonic aspects, which are the divisions. Again, demon means divided mind, the divided man. So when you see that, it's the psychology of one's interpersonal relationship with the world. So how do you free yourself from this? How does one be truly selfless? In balance as well, it's not to not be out of balance with what they want to be of service. Well, there's certain virtues to really cultivate, which is humility for starters, being humble. It's understanding healthy boundaries, making sure there's healthy boundaries in life. But always every action is a dedication to the whole. So whatever you're doing is for the greater good. So is this action supporting the ascension of the world, of the soul, of my soul? There's a selfless attribute that these are not my words that I choose to speak on an individual. These are my words I speak in support and upliftment for the whole. So everything is a more of a noble endeavor. But the trick is this, how can you be sovereign if your causal body, which is exist before your minds? So whether you unconscious and a subconscious and a conscious mind pulls its data from that causal body instrument. If that's littered with all these different fears and imprints and and belief models and conditioning that's based on division, that's based on that individual ego construct, then how can you have free will? You can't when you start shooting into your heart and start really making choices from a unity perspective. That's when you start dissolving the the ambitious self and it's more of a purity. So you go from the shadow to the the more self-ambitious, the active, and then they you transform into the more pure. There's a pure intention and simple. It's it's do good and be good. It's pure intention, righteous action. What's righteous, the right use of your energy. That's as simple as it is. If you learn that one thing, you master the world, the world you win this game of this world, basically, which is pure intention with everything you do. There's a pure intention with every word, deeds, your words, your thoughts, your transmission and everything that you do is righteous. There's a right use of your energy. If the world did that alone, it would be a paradise. It would be heaven on earth. And so what our intention is to cultivate a community where beloveds live in that alignment. They're living to manifest their divinity in selfless selflessness, not to be someone, but be what you already are. You can't be anyone greater than you already are. You are that divine love already. You can't become someone greater than already that is it. Thank you. That was really clear. How would you express the inexpressible mystery of God? Silence through great bliss. Just just when you feel that bliss in your being and you're smiling for no reason and you're happy for no purpose and you give of yourself freely with no intention of returning. That is when the goodness of God is flowing through. That bliss is love made manifest. And so when you follow a life like that, whether it's your career, your vocation, when you live in that purpose and it brings up that, it may not be that all the time. There may be some technical pieces that you have to iron out. But when there's this this inspiration, this in spirit that brings forth that greater joy because it's a higher purpose, there's a higher meaning, there's a higher calling. That's when you get to glimpse at the mystery that's unfolding. And I know you've been to amazing sacred places around the world and there are sacred temple teachings, for instance, Egypt, as you mentioned, also the Himalayas and other ancient lineages. Is there one or two ancient temple teachings or sacred temple teachings that you can share with us? Yeah, you've got all the great questions today. There's this one place that we've been blessed to be, which is in a remote area in a jungle. And it was a temple that was built on top of three existing temples below. And so the lower temple, it hadn't been actually excavated because what happens in this particular country, if it is excavated, the government owns the land, so then they take it and then they basically put everything into the museums and it doesn't. It loses its sacredness. So it's been kept secret, basically. And every place, whether it's a ruin or whether it's active, it has a physical component, it has its energetic components. And this this place in particular, there was a library, a library of all different types of technologies and different formulations. And we could say that this was New Priory Atlantis, so very, very old, very, very ancient. And there was a particular series of books that was imprinted into one sort of master blueprint, one book. And inside that, there had different formulas for different cures, whether it be medicinal or whether it be mental or emotional or spiritual. And one of the the amazing, amazing secrets that was revealed during that visit and that time. This is a long story, very short. Was the power of breath. When you learn how to breathe in a specific way. When you understand the mechanism of breath as life. And when you transform the way you breathe, not so much from the content of how much oxygen that you're pulling in, but when your body actually unlocks these passages inside you and your body learns how to breathe internally and you can exactly breathe itself. What happens is that there's certain processes of the body that go through in an alchemy. This in an alchemy is life rejuvenating. So it's sort of like cultivating a golden elixir, a beautiful elixir. It's a panacea that heals all and it's also rejuvenating. It rejuvenates the body in the cells. When that goes through its process and you learn how to breathe through a certain way, you can actually instruct the body to self heal, self regenerate, self rejuvenate and become more vital in its life force. And so what we would share is that's one of the special sacred teachings of our lineages that we are here to share, teaching people how to really manifest their divinity, manifest the wisdom that this body can actually, this is the greatest technology that you can ever experience. This is right here and right now. And if you know how to activate it, if you know how to utilize it, the abilities that you can experience and experience is truly profound. And so just breath is a key that can access that. And when you direct with conscious awareness and direct that breath and have certain knowledge and wisdom of the alchemical processes, then your body can become this grand temple, essentially. And it becomes that proper living temple, that proper divine living temple as a divine human for your soul to be. Illuminated, illuminated through it and that comes from breath. So that's that's one sort of. Not a simple, simple teaching. It's it's we don't we can't give the practice, but we can give the inspiration of what what is possible. We can't give practice like this online. It must be harmonically inducted in the physical in the physical and passed on specifically through initiation. And imagine a breath that you could do that completely just silenced your mind, rejuvenated your body, you become younger, you become more happier, you become more healthy, you free all the bindings just by breathing. How amazing. So that's just one of the technologies that we could call it such that was was reinstated in a certain passage. Our I'll have some of that, please. I'll place my order. I find it, you know, I know it's true, because when I read about how the body is a self healing mechanism and, you know, all the wonderment that even went into creating this and how it functions, and I love that. And yet I find it very mystifying. You know, one has ever had a condition or an injury and it persists and it's chronic and the pain goes on and on. You know, and and especially if you're a spiritual being, it can be very mystifying to find your way out of that and how to tap into what is actually possible within this body already that you're describing. We can absolutely tell you with one hundred percent certainty because we are healers. We can immediately within moments remove almost anything. Now, what this means is that everybody is able to heal instantly. However long it takes one to process that or however long they believe it's going to take them might also have something to do with how fast energy can move. But energy can move like that. It can be so quickly moved, replaced, reconfigured, dissolved. Absolutely everything. And we can certainly say that our community not only with healing, but with other things that would seem impossible have seen, have witnessed. Yeah, and also the body is profoundly resilient. But after years and years of certain food, foods and conditioning and malnutrition and depletion of what it needs, it does sometimes need a good source of that nutrition so it can have the fundamental building blocks inside it as well. But what we say is that you need to make sure that you have good source of air quality, a good amount of sunlight, spend a good amount of time in nature and then also making sure you have biaceuticals, life giving whole food, super foods that are giving your body what it needs until maybe you don't need them any longer. You know, we've both experienced life where we haven't needed to eat. We haven't needed to eat and we've lived solely on light. So that's like a breatharian, is that correct? Yeah, but we don't give it a label because the only reason we don't call it anything specific is because there's this ideology that you know, if you do something, then basically you can become a breatharian over time. But for us, it wasn't like that. It's like we couldn't eat not because we didn't want to eat. It's because we couldn't eat. It's literally that you try to put food in your mouth. The enzymes just fill your mouth with this bliss that you can't swallow. You can't ingest food. You're so enraptured. But that's a different lifestyle. We do eat and we enjoy eating. We eat a little. But we do enjoy it when we do. But what we will say is that when you're a breatharian, it's not by it's not by something that you're trying to accomplish. It's something that happens so natural. It's not the path we don't feel that willfulness is the path. And so what we say is that when you serve the body, what it needs and treat it like the template is and give it a very fundamental building blocks for what it needs in order to rejuvenate, regenerate and do cultivation practices. Then that's where the healing can occur. There's really only two two causes of dis ease, which is acidosis and toxicity, you know, or that which is toxicity and inflammation that comes from that. So if you break that down, you look at it from a spiritual perspective, from an emotional perspective, from an mental perspective and a physiological perspective, an ancestral perspective, a biological perspective. When you put all those perspectives together and have a holistic view, then you can isolate what matrix is causing that symptom and you can't heal the body. You just give the body what it needs and it self heals. There's nothing that can heal the body. You just need to give it what it already needs and it will heal it on its own accord. Only thing that can heal anything or bring anything into wholeness is the return tool. And that means it is an it is an energy. It is a bandwidth that is able to be experienced in the human body as well. And sometimes there's lessons for people that they have to change their diet and may make different choices with their food combinations. They have to be conscious of what they're putting into the body to rebuild it. What you're listening to, what you are lending an ear to, what you are lending your sacred eyes to, everything is part of that which creates your reality and thus creates your life's experience. So everything is how precise can you be with your life? And if one was to wave their hand, if they'll wave their hand and be like, cure or all, what would that really learn someone? You know, what would that teach someone? You know, yes, that has that has happened. And we're not, you know, we're not saying that's not possible. We're just saying that some people have literally contracted within their soul to take something on for their ancestors. Sometimes they take it on for the world, the collective, and they take certain things on. Sometimes they take it on because of what they've done in the past and the fruit is coming to bear, you know. There's some people that we will not heal. Not because we don't wish to, but it's because it's not meant to be. It's their lesson for that. And that was like that thousands of years ago. Yeah, not everyone was healed every time. There were always people that that weren't ready. And we've done and we've also done the opposite, where there's where we know, we know. If we do heal this person, they may turn and something may happen. But through their their pleading and their prayers that has happened, we and we give them the benefits of their soul souls yearning. And then through that, they repeat certain activities or actions and turns. So, you know, sometimes these dis eases of the body, right? The physical dis ease, the discomfort. This is the body's language. The body can only speak through the physicalization of sensation. That's the only way it knows how to communicate because people of the world are not still enough to listen to what's actually going on. They can't see the event that took place that is creating it or the person. Or so this is how the body communicates. Now, what we have seen in and sometimes these dis eases happen in order to keep one from making mistakes in the past. And the soul has said, you know what? Actually, I'm going to hold this because it's reminding me of something and that something might keep them doing good or that something might keep them on a certain path that is in fact along the line of their eternal soul's mission and journey is in fact beneficial for them. So there are many, many factors to look at when we look at an entire blueprint, we call a gold print of their perfection to them to see where their blueprint is, where their gold print is, how that can match up, if it's time to match that up. And then we take it from there. Yeah, from the higher self perspective to the individual perspective. I think I would like to come live with you. Oh, and what a you're so lovable, you're so beautiful, what you emanate. And I'm just sitting here feeling a lot of gratitude. And like this is a really special experience. So a little shift here, Shaquena Ma and Sananda G. This is Dare to Dream. What are you next, Dare to Dream? What are your future dreams and goals? We dream for the world. We have no personified dreams. Our vision is this entire world to live as the Garden of Eden, the heaven on earth that it deserves to be. And what we are doing to make that a reality is creating the living structure, the temples, the housing, the gardens on our property and the land that we have at this moment. Everything you could possibly ever need to live the most beautiful life of true purity and goodness to each other. Everything that you can think of, we are creating and bringing forth. Yeah, so we create, we're doing it when our dream is now. We're living our dream because our dream is for the betterment of all. And what our choices are are just to serve and be selfless in our service and to give all and love all and the helpful. And through that, whether one is a part of this local community or whether a part of this global community, we do that to help each one remember their divinity, but then manifest. It's not it's not just enough to remember your divinity or remember that you're divine. You have to manifest that you have to live it, be the angelic human that you are truly and manifest that into life. And so we do that through our academy and we school of divinity. We have a transmission through our healing certifications. So everything that we dream is living right now. We're building more of it. And now it's time, you know, you shared earlier with us that, you know, we've been a bit a bit veiled and we have been and it's been very purposeful because we've been honing quite a lot, honing and honing. Now it's time, basically, the curtain is coming up and we're unveiling and uncloaking. And so now it's time to really connect with all the people while that I've been praying and praying for this kind of a life and for this kind of a reality. And so people can find you at twinrate.com. Is there anything you'd like to say here at the end to the listeners? Just thank you, you know, thank you for following your guidance to be a part of the show. Thank you for showing up for your session, showing up for yourself and we love you so much, you cannot imagine. And just keep following the inner voice of your heart. You take what supports you and make it real in your life. If there's anything that we have shared today, it's really to remember that you are already that divine love. Your role is not to become something better or greater than that. It's to live as that now and to bring that into everything, whether it's as simple as, you know, travelling to another destination, whether it's as simple as preparing your breakfast or your meals. Do it with love. And when you do that with love, to an offering, this life is an offering. Yeah, it is. This is that life is a temple. What is your offering? Yeah, what is your offering? So give your life as an offering and you'll be health with more grace than you can possibly imagine. Doesn't mean that grace doesn't transform to the pressure of life. Like a diamond. But it does mean that you'll be always lifted into a greater height, greater depth when you trust and you surrender to the divine. And you asked a question earlier, beloved, which was, how do you something like, how do you express the unexpressible mystery of God? And an ego, a person, an individual cannot know God, cannot truly express God, but one who has dissolved so much to the point where they are no longer that personification of of this world, then God is found, then love is truly able to be transmitted at all times. And so we say dissolve into that, which seems undesirable right now. Thank you so much. Thank you both. I end today's show with this quote from Shakina Ma and Sanandaji, the greatest attainment one can experience in this lifetime is the unification of the divine feminine and masculine within. And the highest honor one can have in any lifetime is to be in service through the alchemy of divine union. Subscribe to this number one transformation conversation. Dare to dream with Debbie Dashinger. Leave a comment and share. I read them all and I'm so grateful that you are on this journey. Next week on the show, I am featuring Jesse Colcy. He's a world's renowned numerologist and he specializes in residential and business numerology. Jesse provides valuable insight on the power of numbers and how they affect our lives. Thank you so much for joining us today. See you again next week on Dare to Dream. And remember, create all your dreams and your divine humanity into your reality.