 So, we're going to start with a digital land acknowledgement. This is used with permission from Adrian Wong of spider web show in Kingston Canada, who originally wrote this statement for the festival of living digital art. Since our activities are shared digitally to the internet. Let's also take a moment to consider the legacy of colonization embedded within the technology structures and ways of thinking we use every day. We are using equipment and high speed internet, not available in many indigenous communities. Even the technologies that are central to much of the art we make leave significant carbon footprints contributing to changing climates that disproportionately affect the indigenous peoples worldwide. We invite you to join us in acknowledging all this, as well as our shared responsibility to make good of this time. And for each of us to consider our roles in reconciliation, decolonization, and allyship. Thank you so much for that Portia. Hi everyone. Welcome. I am going to introduce myself first and then pass it over to Portia. And my name is Kate Freer. I use she her pronouns. I am zooming in from Lenape Hoking, the stolen ancestral homelands of the Lenape peoples, also known in colonized terms as Sunset Park, Brooklyn. I am a multimedia artist, a filmmaker, a educator and organizer, and I am the co curator of the series design and the time of reckoning with Portia, and this is the last day of the series so congratulations everyone. I identify as a white woman, queer anti racist theater artist who is working towards structural change and for a hopefully anti oppressive anti racist culture in the theater. And I'm so thrilled to be here with you all today. And I'll pass it over to Portia. Mine's going to be shorter. Hi, I'm Portia McEver and she her hers I'm on the unseated lands of the Monsei Lenape and Wapinger currently known as Connecticut. I'm a lighting designer or researcher and a facilitator for social justice conversations. And I'm going to turn it back over to Kate to talk about the series. Kate you're on silent. Thanks Portia. This is like the wonderful thing about facilitating with your friend, knowing that they have your back. So, we've had a big week this week in the series. We started off with an essay by Portia and myself that was sort of giving a broader idea in which to view the whole series by. We're starting to have a design series a series focused specifically on the work of designers on and off stage, the intersection of artistry and advocacy so we wanted to provide a lens in which to experience that so we started our essay series with design with an equity lens, which is about integrating a theater ecosystem that can hold us all in our full humanity. And then we went to Masha siblings essay industry or community. What are we going back to where Masha interviewed a bunch of different theater artists including Lawrence who is on here tonight about their experience during the shutdown and ways of moving forward from from this pandemic to hopefully a shift in the theater ecosystem as well. From there we went on to an essay, three costume designers, or an interview, three costume designers meet for tea on the edge of a cliff by Lux Hock Dominique Fawn Hill and Dev Sivani, which was a very exciting opportunity for sort of a co conversation a little bit about you about why they do what they do how they show up. Definitely check it out. And then yesterday we had illuminating the careers of disabled lighting designers by Michael Meg and any wagon, which was the end of our interview series and that was a beautiful, again, conversation between the two of them about the intersection of their artistry and advocacy. So, here we are at the final day of the series for this TV event. Yeah, but I would also say that we did have this very exciting change that happened, as that was prompted by the series. I'm going to hand it over to Portia to talk a little bit more about that. So we want to take this moment to thank how around from now on when there are production photos in essays and blogs on the website that designer credits will be there as well as the stage manager. So we wanted to thank how around for making that change in policy. It's a big deal. One of the things that we were talking about in the series and in general is acknowledgement is huge in, you know, just knowing who is doing the work and it's a big deal for designers, there are not very many publications and make that extra effort so thank you so much to how around for turning around that policy so quickly it was really fabulous. So what's happening now this event that we're about to do so we decided that it would be a great idea to wrap up the series as sort of a departmental check in go back to the format of design meetings that we so fondly remember and some of us are so are still very much in and get a chance to check in with a representative from each department about their the present and dreaming forward so the format is going to be that of a production meeting will go department by department, and then we'll have a conversation all together but instead of reporting on the show will be reporting on the field of theater and how everybody is doing inside of that field right now and dreaming forward. And that's, and that's it. So I would love to invite our guests to turn on their cameras if they feel comfortable doing so. And we can start with a check in that sound good. Hi everyone. Yay. So, just in, you know, full transparency of what we're about to do we've asked everybody, you know, to take five to seven minutes to introduce themselves and answer, you know, a prompt about what has changed for your discipline and the community since the beginning of the pandemic, what conversations are happening and just how are you doing right now. And I will put the order that we're going to go in our chat so that not so that everybody knows, but we are going to start with ASA and then go to Lawrence, and then SB, and then Cheryl, and so and then so on and so forth. All right. Asa, would you like to take it away. Hi, my name is Asa bin Ali and key him pronouns. I'm coming from the land of the Lenape, and I am a costume designer. And, well, let's see what's changed for my community. I haven't been able to have fittings for a year. And it's just been sort of like the whole concept of like, we're all separated from each other and we have to stay separated from each other. So, you know, when talking a lot about what I've been doing, you know, for the past years of my career I kind of said, you know, like people like, you know, humans are like my canvas, you know, I need them to do what I do as a costume designer. So it's been, you know, interesting kind of not having that but then like, you know, thinking about, you know, how the next phase is going to be. And in terms of like conversations that are happening, I feel like a lot of the conversations are really that I've been having have been like really sort of like deep and like sort of esoteric in terms of like, what is it really being to just be an artist, not, you know, be sort of like in this like sort of seizure machine, which is like, kind of I think what we were all kind of used to just, you know, pile on all the shows as much as you can go go go go. And so, you know, there've been a lot of discussions about like how unhealthy that was. And, you know, who I think we, who we strive to be, how we strive to be, once we get to the other side of this. And I'm doing good. I can't believe it's already been a year, it's been a year since I did my last show in a theater a year this month so it's very crazy how fast it went by but then also how slow I did I can't really explain it. And I fell into like some sort of like time warp or something but I am figuring out ways to be creative at my kitchen table. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, and pass it on to Lawrence and Lawrence, feel free to pass it on after you are done. Okay, thank you. Hi, everyone, my name is Lawrence, my pronouns are he him his. I am a scenic designer and educator kind of part time lecturer at a couple of different institutions. And I am currently in Flatbush, Brooklyn, what is today references Flatbush, Brooklyn, which is also the months in Lenape lands. It's been an odd. It's been an odd time. I mean the, the world went on its great pause and all communication sort of just stopped from institutions I think I had like three or four upcoming shows that I was contracted for radio silence. You know, a couple of moments of like well we think it'll happen in six weeks or eight weeks or whatever it was and then just kind of like things stopped I think. One institution has emailed me maybe two times in the past year to be like, we're going to do it in October and I was like, good luck with that. And then we're going to you know and, and then ultimately like it's not going to happen in our 2021 season and you know so on and so forth. I think the pivot has been for set design trying to figure out how you start to think in terms of film or specifically in the world that we're in, think in terms of the box, right what is the what is the zoom box what is, what is that constraint, and how do we work within that industry and curate this and make in the, in the worlds of zoom theater actors and performers who are letting us into their very personal spaces of their homes feel comfortable doing that, and curating that in such a way that we can still tell the story that we're trying to tell on a zoom screen. I was in it beyond the world of zoom theater to I was in tech in November, which was a really lovely and wildly fraught experience to be worried about the pandemic, but was able to create a piece of theater that was filmed with a 10 person audience and we were able to have that live interaction, captured and then is streaming this month the stream ends on on Sunday. So that was a wildly positive experience and and that experience with, you know, it's woolly mammoth theater company was a was was actually with I am a of like, open and honest communication about where they were in terms of pandemic and COVID safety and how to make us as artists feel safe, and feel like humans with our worries and concerns and understanding and acknowledging there is no such thing as zero risk in the thing that we are asking us all to do. And how do we, as a collective agree on the policies and protections for each other to minimize as much risk as possible and I've never felt more considered as a human and as an artist than than that conversation and those multiple conversations and hours and hours of us sitting in the zoom space, kind of being open and honest about we don't have that information. We'll get that information for you or that this was our testing procedures we thought but that doesn't make you feel comfortable we can up the amount of tests like it was a very amazing and I just want to shout out that like woolly mammoth did a really great thing and they they undertook that in such a way that made us all feel I speak from the eye made me feel very comfortable going to that space and participating in that project. But yeah, it is the shift to, it's not the human eye that's realizing it it's the camera that's that's taking it in and how do we recreate the awe how do we recreate the moment that we all love in a theatrical sense and recreate that on film, or recreate that in this in this format has been a wild shift in a, in a really challenging conversation among collaborators but a really exciting one. Yeah, I think the conversations between other scenic designers and kind of kind of collectively in the world of like work has stopped has been. How do we want to be when we move forward, like when the world comes back when when the theater industry kind of comes back in full force. What have we learned in these 12 months or so away. How do we maintain that humanity and maintain the best parts of ourselves that we have discovered, investigated, uncovered, and keep those values and that humanity moving forward and not let us as ASA had had talked about get bogged down show after show after show after show, and that burnout and that kind of that's where the conversation has been in my circles, and that's been wildly exciting. Yeah, I'm going to hand it off to SP. Thank you. Hello, everybody. My name is sata SP proctor she her hers SP. I'm a sound and multimedia artists working, not only in theater but also immersive experiences. I am calling from the land of Manhattan of the landing of the landing people. What is happening in the sound design community is a deeper, what I believe is a deeper appreciation for the craft by the community at large. There's been an increase in the amount of radio plays that have been produced. In terms of zoom theater finding intricate ways to be able to find new ways to create more live in the moment elements with sound design. So, whether, you know, whether radio plays come in the format of being able to find ways to record all at once in like to be able to capture a particular moment, or being able to record snippets and put that together, or even working on more site specific elements where people are encouraged to go outdoors or to a specific location and have that be the visual and then have the sound be able to add an augment that experience. There's been, and there has been for sound design, a continuation of work, but being able to have more ways of experimenting. There's also been more into other virtual forms of theater, so not only zoom theater but also in virtual reality as well. And so there's just overall an increase in the different types of pallets that sound designers can play in. What's also happened is because of the increase in these types of works, some conversations that have come up are what makes a radio play versus an audio drama? What does it mean to capture something in a moment versus having something that is no reminiscent of film or television but in audio format? Also, what are the different roles that make up a team for radio play or audio drama? And as we work together in person in theater, we have our designers, associate designers, our audio engineers, and moving into this different format, we have an increasing need to be able to split these roles of dialogue and sound effects and fully in music and not have that be wrapped up into one role. We also have that battle of digital theater being recognized and respected in its own form, as well as the acknowledgement that a lot of theaters moving into this space are also having to deal with a newer form of colonization where you have a lot of independent artists or communities being able to create their own radio plays, have their own festivals, their own blogs, their own hashtags, their own way of being able to do things and theaters being, in this case, the larger corporations or the outside space that is coming in and being able to redefine what radio plays, what audio dramas are, and so having to deal with that, that dynamic of a relationship. Lastly, the conversation about 10 out of 12 is happening and being able to end that practice. Working in audio book, working in audio book recording, what I've found in my own experience with working with managers is that there is actually a limit on how many hours we are supposed to be recording with another artist to preserve our ears. So to be able to sit and listen to someone talking or sound effects for 10 hours in a row, especially when they're in this close proximity compared to a larger space is very unhealthy. And so, you know, finding ways to be able to have healthier, have healthier holistic ways of collaborating with each other. And I'm going to thank you all, I'm going to pass it to Shira. Hi, everyone. I'm Shirelle Gaetan. I'm coming to you from Ashland, Oregon, the land of the Mkwa, Tekelma, and Grand Ron people. I am a theatrical hair wig and makeup artist specializing in inclusive hair wig and makeup design. Besides everything being shut down, I guess from my specific industry and work, there are a lot of conversations going on in regards to I said that my three top things would be BIPOC hair wig and makeup design, as far as the exclusivity of natural hair, natural hair designs and or designs that duly represent our actors and actresses on stage while representing their characters. The value of the work and where we're placed in regards to the hierarchy how we are kind of set up in a way supported and or not supported and the value around that and how we're treated based on what the work is assumed to be. The third thing would be I feel like for all of the different departments here on the call as well as ours is the there's been a big push for there to be a lot more diversity and equity and inclusion. And there's a lot of talk about it and there's a lot of boxes in which people are trying to check off in a way in a response to the we see you white American theater letter, as well as the revolution that happened in 2020. And around those conversations that folks are now starting to want to recruit and or diversify their institutions and their departments, and the conversation I believe I have with my colleagues, and my own question with that is, and even we're trying to we're we're trying to do something that's already been been happening and or been done, but while we're doing that, are we creating systems policies protocols are we creating an environment where people of color are not only brought in but also welcomed. They are cultivated, they are provided with love and support and or other developmental opportunities, so that they can get those positions they can thrive in those positions they can do well, and have longevity in those positions. So we're outside of just kind of wanting this, but we should have already had right we should have already had a representation of our actors and actresses. In regards to their own natural hair and or makeup that suits them or costumes that suits them or lighting that suits them. It's like this grand away thing like oh, we have to do something. And so, while we're trying to do it, I think my question would be, and the conversation should be around the value around those what that value means, as well as are we as a people as a industry as as organizations, willing and able to create those spaces and create healthy collaborative environments, and or is it just talk and checking the boxes. So that's kind of, you know, what we've been talking about discussing that's where my mind is with things and since the shutdown. Since, you know, I've gone through this series of being in a limb biotic state. Some days being very productive and want to be productive and want to do all the things and other days just binge watching Netflix and making sure I'm taking care of the essentials. Since 2020 has passed us by and now that we're moving into 2021 and eventually we'll start to open up I think my mind has, you know, opened up and I am prepared to be more productive and kind of move forward and see like, are these conversations just conversations, or are we really going to get down to business and do the work. So that's where I am personally and professionally need to pass this off. I'm so passionate y'all I'm going to pass this to Julio. Yeah, hi everybody. My name is Chris Julio I use he him his pronouns. I'm calling in from the unseated lands of the Sarah Kataba Cherokee and Lumbee which is currently known as Winston Salem North Carolina. I am a full time assistant professor, working and the director of the stage properties program at the University of North Carolina School of the Arts, and I currently also have a simultaneous focus and equity diversity and inclusion work at the institutional education level. Wow, that is so much amazingness to follow after sure all that was, I got all amped up and speaking from props and sort of the state of things. I got totally sidetracked by just listening to you I just got really amped up so I think specifically coming from an educational perspective, you know, the, that anniversary of a year ago has really been nonstop at least for me personally because I happened to be part of an institution that was handed the task of continuing a season and a hybrid model of education, which includes a full season of production. Right so as much as everyone has sort of taken a step back and use this time to sort of figure out next steps. Personally as an educator thrown into the situation where, you know, our responsibilities became more about safety and protection of our students you know I run a department of close to 40 undergrad and graduate students and it was a daunting task to be faced with a deadline of opening school again. The really interesting and fascinating thing that we saw in our props community was a return to sort of skills development, and also information sharing I know several big name props guys who joined tick tock and started sharing them out you know shout out to J Docworth and Eric Grimes, who have a huge massive following and really the props community turned to their craft, whether that was going back to school, or joining conferences and really sharing out on those focus of props industry, and, or you know pivoting into their own entrepreneurial endeavors which, you know, tons of people opened SC shops and really wanted to make things for change which I thought was a really huge and positive uptick. And of course at the institutional like education level, there was a serious question about pursuing things in a model that we were so used to, and prioritizing safety first obviously as a conversation, but then also from the educational you know this is the generation that's going to graduate and really hopefully act on all of these things that we're talking about these really hard conversations about what we can take with us in this time and what stories we're telling. So as far as pivoting into other genres, I think, specifically as an educator, we found moments of pause, and also started to have the conversations of how do we slow down this process, and build in time for our students these young artists to really work on their projects and still get something valuable out of it right, how do we let them respond to this pandemic, and working in such a disconnect when they're so used to being in a greater community. It gave us this fascinating and thankfully an amazing experimental time to craft newer endeavors. So a lot of my students and projects turned from either small filmed and live stream, no audience sort of events. We translated our skills into full film production. We tried the technological advancement of doing zoom productions. And we're workshopping things like outdoor installation with distance audience members we're working in props to tell stories through escape rooms. We've really sort of blown out the model that we have to do theater and embrace the fact that we can sort of disassemble these hierarchies and give our students a chance to speak from their own perspective and they have a lot to say right 2020 was hard. And that's sort of the beautiful thing about this experiment thankfully we had a great track record and our conservatory at least my school to design and production. We had zero student cases for an entire semester. And so I'm really thankful for that I feel personally very safe in that. And I know my students take it really seriously because they're wonderful and they have such amazing and creative energy. And, you know, it's a weird, you know, checking in with how we've approached things it's really made us recognize what's important in our story storytelling and what's intentional in our motives about why we're deciding to partner with co producing entities to like tell specific stories so we've really had the chance to separate from the projects that we don't find valuable or don't see educational purpose in which is really great. And, you know, personally it's really weird to be working when so much of the industry is silent and quiet and sort of taking that time. And like so many others I just hope that there's a chance to recreate a better and more equitable environment for everybody. Once we get back, you know, part of me doesn't really want to go back to what's normal part of me wants to full time embrace the change that we're currently making, and I feel really fortunate to work in a place that is teaching that to current students learning that system. It's a really beautiful and inspiring thing and simultaneously just the most terrifying and daunting task as an educator right because you don't want to mess up. So that's, that's sort of a weird summary of the year we're back into the spring semester and we're doing some really exciting devised work with college students and they're making great art. So that is the state of things from my end I will go ahead and pass it on to Stacy. Hi, everyone. My name is Stacy I use she her pronouns. And I am assuming in from the native land of the Susquehannock Piscataway and not not to cook people. Otherwise known as Baltimore, Maryland. I'm a lighting designer, although these days. It's kind of weird that's that whole idea of a lighting designer is kind of a strange thing in the world of sort of zoom theater and whatever else there may be so I've sort of been calling myself a seeing designer. So what, similarly to something that like Lawrence was talking about and I've worked on shows with Kate but like a lot of what's changed for being a lighting designer is like dealing with the frame of the zoom box and dealing with what people have in their spaces. It's been essentially the paintbrush has changed the paintbrush has changed and like you're going from holding it with your dominant hand to holding it with your dominant hand in a way because you just don't have the same level of control. So you would in a, in a space in a theater where you could kind of program everything so I've been spending a lot of time, kind of looking at light or looking at people's spaces through a webcam and whether or not that can actually, like whether a we can control the exposure brightness control those settings versus dealing with this person has X camera this person has wide camera but they need to look exactly the same. This person has 12 feet of space in their room this person has two feet of space from the wall. What, how can you get them to look similar or dissimilar. I've been a lot of fun. I've had I found myself having more interactions with with actors and I normally would have on a process which has been kind of exciting because I normally I'm sitting in the dark very far away from the stage but like now I'm in breakout rooms with actors having a good time, having that kitchen, getting foil paper to like use this kind of black wrap on a light. So it's been, it's been, it's been there's been a learning curve for sure but it's also been kind of fun getting to kind of create lighting worlds with stuff that like exists in a home without having any of the kind of like expensive tech gear. Yeah, like that's sort of what I've been doing and that's sort of what's changed. I recently got to tech a show, but it was, I checked it remotely I focused the show in person which was a trip having not focused a show and almost a year I literally everything shut down in the middle of a focus call for me so I was on stage and we had a meeting sort of closed so it was really weird to get back into a space and try to focus lights and then after you've made all those decisions to kind of go back and check the show from your looking at your computer screen, which was just hilarious because like the colors render completely differently and you try your best to do what you can. But there's there's only so much you can do but it was it was an interesting process trying to figure out what this new world we live in is. Another thing that I'm like really finding is kind of like similar to like what everyone is talking about like, do we go back to the same thing. And also, even in some of these remote processes, like, are we trying to create something new and make the technology new with something that we know already, or are we trying to embrace the oddities of the technology and create something entirely new that maybe it's we're gonna it's going to take a while to learn to relearn something or to try to learn something new but can we find something else in it it's just been, it's been kind of strange figuring out like, is that possible, or do we have the time to do I mean it feels like we have nothing but time on some days, you know, it's been a roller coaster of a ride every day of this pandemic. Yeah, I've just been finding, I've been finding myself sort of like kind of going crazy trying to think like one day I'm like we should just you know, embrace the fact that you know, zoom does this weird echo and feedbacks and stuff like that and then I'm like I just cannot deal with zoom I do not want it anymore I'm camera off so it's, it's just been it's been a roller coaster as I'm sure it's true for everyone. As for how I'm doing. It's kind of like how I'm doing is I'm is okay I'm doing pretty good actually. I was fortunate enough to get a SOHA rep residency this year which has been actually really exciting, because we've been having a lot of conversations like this and conversations about what are we coming back to and how things have been done. So it's been really cool for me as a as a lighting designer as just a designer in general to be able to have that conversation where I feel like sometimes you feel like you can, you can't have those conversations ever or no one cares about what your opinion is on stuff that you see on the ground. But having this residency and being able to start having those conversations about like how do we move forward, what things are important, what, like, what are things that affect everybody in the team have been really awesome. And so I'm kind of like, that's been another part of my journey that has been helping me sort of cope with the loss of theater and also the fact that like, I feel like every other day I see someone has posted something saying, I wish we were back or and I'm just like I don't want to go back to that is exactly what Chris and Cheryl was saying. So hopefully like through those conversations, you know something can be illuminated and it's not, it's not like you can have one conversation about something and it changes like it's got to be ongoing and I think that one of the exciting things about Soho Rep's project number one is that they started that conversation and I hope that that can continue forth and like more people kind of take that time and like, you know, say to themselves, okay cool how do we take what we've learned from the pandemic and just like the loss of work completely, and also the fact that like we can't do any work right now how do we take that and just also the treatment of people. And like create something better. I'm sorry that was slightly incoherent, but so I may have a little bit of zoom fatigue. I'm just going to say that. But thank you for listening. And I'm going to pass it on to Kate. Hey, I'm Kate Hevner, I use she and they pronouns and I'm zooming in from Lena Bay land. I'm a projection and scenic designer. And I'm thrilled to go last in this order because that means that I got to listen to all of y'all and take notes and now sort of respond and have this delightful little dialogue with what you guys are talking about. And it's interesting to several Stacy you did Lawrence you you you talked about what it's like to that that suddenly we came and start working in a box. And as a projection designer. It's funny to hear here you say that because as a projection designer is so so many. Most dare I dare I say all most of the tools that we use are built to be in rectangles. I feel like so much of my work is like forcefully breaking the rectangles apart and not acknowledging the rectangles. You know, we create all of our continent computers which are squares are screens or LED walls and projectors that you know they literally project things and we're in theaters like with tape like taping over things so no one can tell it's a rectangle. So, you know, in a way it we sort of like immediately got to like, oh, let's, let's, let's, let's take these tools that we've been sort of forcing and manipulating to into our theatrical live will, if you will, and, and then start to see what happens if we play with them in ways that they might have actually been intended to be used. And actually, you know, making, I actually haven't made a zoom. I haven't made a zoom piece, but I've made several, you know, full length YouTube videos. I got to do one piece that was two actors filmed on entirely green screen and I got to create backdrops for that green screen and and similarly in a way I also as a set designer in a green screen rolled with a camera you, you get to design the fourth wall so in a way I got to break that rectangle as opposed to being in that that proscenium rectangle. And I did do one piece that actually was live it's it's be teched for six weeks in person. And the audience drives through a parking garage in their cars. So it's still happening so again that was very non rectangular. So, so my relationship with the rectangle is is strong and goes in a lot of ways. And thinking sort of what we come back to in addition to. I think the question of the technology that we use. And what we come back to is in that regard is a great one and I also wonder about the theater that that we come back to. There's there. I speak very colloquially there there's an episode of Gilmore girls that I love. And I think that they're watching. I think it's an elementary school production of Pippin. And I think is sort of that the elementary, every time they turn around like the aisles are filled with like 70 elementary school kids like throwing streamers at them, like every 30 seconds screaming magic to do. And the characters all jump in and are like react with fear and, you know, we didn't, I don't know that we fully grasped this last April but we're coming on about a year where that action is not is not only startling or perhaps uncomfortable because you're not a fan of audience interaction in the aisles but is is we've learned is then is truly dangerous right. And and have have spent at least a year by the time we're able to safely do that again. And I think that we're learning that that is dangerous so so this dichotomy of sort of learning that the profession that we love of bringing people together in a space is dangerous and the learning process that will go through. I'm really interested in and if how once how around wants to pair me up with with a sociologist I'm super into writing that article. I think it's going to be really interesting. I think that also speaks to how we integrate the technology and in our relationship. You know that we're used to screens on stage, but our relationship to the screen has so drastically shifted that I'm interested in what that's going to be. When we come back. And yeah, so some of the other work that I have been doing a good deal of the work that I've been doing over the past year has been in different groups and specifically working with us say a 29 hour union. I've been doing a lot of committee work. Working with the respectful workplace committee working with the diversity committee, starting to write codes of conduct and start start to figure out how we can sort of affect some of this change they think a lot of us have been talking about right now and lending sort of investigating what what it is that we are going to come back to and taking the time to investigate that and that as we come back I think it'll be we've spoken for about a year about the type of world that we want to come back to and as things start to reopen. And really, really staying true to that that culture that we've sort of dreamed about for the past year and finding ways to hold ourselves accountable to to the dreams that we've been having of what the industry could look like. Yeah. Thank you. I'll pass it I'll pass it back to Portia and Kate. I'm so glad this is being recorded so I can go back and listen to this. Thank you all so the funny faces. Thank you all so much. So we're going to transition to group conversation. And I think we can just start with this prompt and then we'll see where we go. What lessons can the rest of the field of theater learn from designers and production artists in general and your community specifically. I can feel free to just unsilence yourself and you know, respond. Wow. It's like a list there's like a long list. I'm going back to like what I was saying, because it was about like probably two, two years ago, where like, I kind of had this like breaking point where I was like, I am an artist. And I was just kind of like stamping out like all these shows and like, you know, started this conversation with my, you know, other friends and colleagues are just like, what, like, how do we, you know, reclaim like this, our creativity, like, we're just, you know, another, I don't know, like, I can't even, I reckon a lot to quote Pink Floyd. But I think that was like kind of the danger that I was saying because I like have seen like people in my community, like really just literally literally crash and burn and I was like, Why is that happening. So I think, I don't know if that's like, really a lesson but I think, I think that respect that we have artistic processes that you know, we can't just like make the dress from purple to yellow like it's you know what I mean like there's, there's so much nuance there's so much artistry to what we do. And I think I think this whole period has just been like all of us kind of like re learning that because we've had so much time like with ourselves. So yeah, I don't know if that answers that first question but that's just what I was feeling. That was great. Lawrence I see your, your. I mean, I think this, this kind of small group discussion I've been in in with many small groups of designers of like what is it that we want and that that kind of self critical lens and introspection that this element of the industry is undergoing and asking ourselves what are our flaws what are the things that we've done in the past that we don't want to do moving forward. Working with each other to hold each other accountable as we move forward in those ways, like that has been really exciting in this aspect of the industry right that I can have that conversation with any of the designers and artists in this room and say that like if I was to propose something. And any one of you were to say that feels like it goes against the very things we've been talking about that we hold each other accountable in those ways. And that feels really exciting. I don't say that other parts of the industry or other industries aren't doing that I have just found it very self evident in the ways in which I have been interacting with designers and with artists within this element of the industry and that's been exciting. I wish we were also self critical in that way sometimes. I also just sort of like what a so was saying like, it's like a regarding like sort of like crashing and burning and stuff like that I feel like there is like there's this like idea or the sense of like, we need to get to the final product like we need to have like this is we need it has to be perfect on the first try in the everything needs to be amazing and I think like sort of like a sense of play and exploration is kind of has been a little bit missing and like one of the cool things about this format of like being in the virtual space where we have no idea this like sort of uncharted territory is that we've had no choice but to explore. One thing that like, I feel are sometimes can be stifling is like probably is like the timelines of being like okay well we only have 12 hours to check this like 300 page musical with all this automation I mean that's an exaggeration you know it's kind of like that that pressure of like, well I get one shot at it and there's no, there's no moment to kind of take a step back and actually work together and create something and like be able to try something out have it fail completely and then kind of read readjust and like reconfigure. So like that's something that like for me has always been like a part of my practice because my background is not really in lighting but it's like as a painter like that's always been I've messed up canvases all the time and then had to kind of just so over them and try again. So like kind of the idea of being able to make mistakes or being able to try things fail I think like not always focusing on the end goal but also like what what things you can discover on the way towards that place. piggybacking on a lot of what was just said the thing that pops out to me about lessons that we've learned is at least in the conversations I've had is talking about the necessity of an audience and what that means. I think that the biggest thing I've encouraged young artists to sort of embrace is you don't need a fourth wall or any wall you don't need any walls. Right. Everything is a playground and and you don't need a traditional model of audience anywhere to make something that's meaningful and impactful. You know like let's bring happenings back like let's do stuff that's like hidden in a forest let's go experiment in the wild. And I think that you know giving artisans and and designers sort of the permission for themselves to actually pursue that has been a lesson like we that's a huge step in breaking that hierarchy and model of traditional theater. And I'm leaning all the way into it I'm diving right into it and letting my students really run wild with it. A lot of them are exploring sort of installation art of their own and they have a lot to say I think there's at least from my perspective and career history a sort of well I have to tell someone else's story. Why don't we get to dictate that why don't we get to write that ourselves. I think that's the biggest lesson of 2020 is like we got a lot to say so might as well just like owning it is a huge part of, I think the biggest lesson for me in this, this last year. I'll pay back off of a part of that as well. I think sort of are creative or creativity and ingenuity. Over this time I think, you know, like, I haven't we've sort of thrown away the lines of like, well I've done a couple zoom plays and like it we're still within a realm where a year ago that literally wasn't a thing. Right, like we invented many ways of storytelling that didn't exist a year ago like, and truly I think that that's remarkable and, and, you know, there wasn't the default there wasn't that like, sure we'll put up three walls like, sure it's a box style like none of those standards applied and in my experience I saw a lot of like, I don't know how to do it but I'm going to figure it out. You know or like, I don't know but I'm going to, I'm going to call someone who might, and then sort of lending that to just a real generosity. Among a lot of, at least speaking from myself but a lot of the community that I've seen both both for things like that of like, we're trying to do on a thing who knows how to do it and, and really willingly, willingly sharing that that information or pitching it and brainstorming and solving it not, not for financial gain but for the gain of sort of all of us moving through this. I want to add, overall first and then first sound design that overall that, you know, working in these digital and virtual spaces that this kind of storytelling has been around for, for some time, but like Kate has said, this is the first time that like, we here in states in this moment are dealing with these technologies under the guise of the global pandemic. And so how do we, you know, for folks that have worked in digital spaces, how do you adapt when, you know, it's rather than being a choice of being, being online or being virtual that now it's like a given like a hard given. And for, for folks that are like coming into these spaces to be able to, to be able to play. And I think they're over time, people have let go of the desire to get it right, because there is no, there is no right answer in terms of like how to do this kind of form. And especially for zoom plays, you know, while they're, you know, there are grievances about it not being not being the same as being in person. There's still, I think for all disciplines, like a real interest in finding ways to innovate and to be able to have that have that have that sense of play and have that sense of exploration. Especially as we're like, you know, figuring out how to come back together. I think in terms of sound, there's been, you know, like I said, just a greater appreciation of the craft, but also understanding that even on the technical side that there is still, there's still art within the creation of sound. And there's also an art in crafting that system of how that sound gets put out. And I think, as we've continued that both the both the technical elements of sound design as well as the more more, I guess, creative side of it, really seeing that all of it is all of it is a creative endeavor. Yeah, so I mean, this is so wonderful to hear all of these thoughts and even when you all were giving your introduction so much of what I was hearing about the innovations. They also kind of sound like the collaborative process to me this like deep innovation that happens in every design team coming together to imagine a new world for every show. And this is just happening a really non perceptive way, right, or something that wasn't held as the only way to make theater as you know so much of the theater industrial complex had been pushing basically before the shutdown which has basically forced us all to do what I know Stacy has heard me talk about a few times which is this like creative misuse, take tools that were maybe intended for something else, and like figure out how to like pull them apart and put them into a new kind of space to create the story that you want to tell for the audience that you're hoping to reach in the way that you want to be doing it and not doing in a way that somebody has dictated to you that it has to be done. So inside of this creative process which is something that designers are really, really, you know, skilled at as being, you know, reinventing for every single new space, you know, how are each of you, what do you actually need to feel value to be able to go up as your full self to actually like realize these worlds both in the art and to realize the world of the theater field, as we are moving forward, what do you need to feel valued to be able to do that work good for Lawrence. Yeah, this one's gonna. This one's one that has been on my mind a lot as I have been interacting with theaters now as they attempt to create is time. I have found that every theater that tries to engage with me on a collaborative process is trying to immensely compress the amount of time we have to engage with text or to engage with the art and to engage with our collaborators, and is a reaction like we need to have time to react and self reflect and and churn and think about all of these things and then find the creative misuse to quote you Kate is how we want to move forward in that. And I think that every single time has happened multiple times now that like, you have two weeks to design a show and like that's not enough time like that was never a risk that doesn't respect me as an artist. Full stop. It doesn't respect anyone in this room as an artist full stop. That's been really hard. Beyond that is is the respecting of one fees like art, and we are all in this as a career and like we need to be supported financially in that. And the one that I'm going to call out that's been really hard for me because I've taken this financial hit is assistance and associates, like the people that institutions overall had been blindly or willfully ignoring as it as an existence already contractually. I need to pay or support my assistance and associates as I can in 2020, because I know I have a fiduciary responsibility to them, like they relied on me for a paycheck. And as I got money in what little money I got in I made sure that I could support the people who had been reliant on me for years. And I think that respect and acknowledgement in the collaborative process of the necessity of assistance and associates is is something that we all desperately need in the collaborative process to be able to bring our full selves forward. I don't even know why I'm trying to follow that Lawrence because you said it so so brilliantly so maybe I'm just saying hi and and signing back off. I think it's about culture I think it's about coming back to a culture that has respect for its artists and you know there's a huge, you know, we've read the news, you know, we understand that the theaters aren't, you know, coming back with exactly the same budgets that we don't like we get we get it but there's a huge difference between we've decided to cut your fee and you're going to have to make it work to guys, let's let's have some creative problem solving because this is what our show budget is now and what what type of art do we want to create that we can do with the resources that we have, you know like that and those aren't even perfect examples but they're there. Like, like we said, and we've proven through the past year where we're incredibly innovative we're incredibly creative creative we're incredibly adaptable. And I want to come back to a world where we take that and we celebrate that and we find the right way to create art in the moment versus coming back to a theater landscape that's so based in fear and scarcity. I also want to add that for first thing that recognizing that people have different abilities and disabilities. And that like that, you know that work can still be done if these things are accommodated. Earlier, I had mentioned prior to the streaming that I have a visual impairment and so you know it's helpful to have, you know, use of emojis or to be able to communicate because there are certain social things that may not translate across a 2D screen. And in terms of like working as a sound and projection designer is often something that I don't say out loud because it's like how can you work with projections and visuals when you know like, you don't have like perfect vision, but you know I've been able to continue to work for years and, you know, have my own personal accommodations or be able to add, you know, extra strings extra screens or large font or, you know, these things to be able to communicate but having to do those things silently and under the radar. And so, you know, being able to be more open and communicative about these things and be able to get that support to be able to continue to do the work is really crucial. I also think on a different scale that in order for digital theater for virtual theater to continue to be a sustainable thing and not just this one time thing that we're doing during a pandemic. I think that's very important for theaters to be able to build around, build community in these digital and virtual spaces. You know, there are certain rituals in, in a physical theater sense that we took for granted that people would come in during a pre show there might be, there might be program notes or they might be a dramaturgical board. You know, to look at the history of the theater, you may get to talk with people, you go find your seat. You know, there's you, you, you know, there's ushers that you, you know, like to be able to have that kind of conversation. Intermission, because I know that that was slowly an outgoing thing but nonetheless, like intermission being a thing. And then like that post show virtual of being able to, you know, have the curtain go up and to be able to grab your items and be able to go home or go to a post show conversation go to chat with friends be able to post and talk about like what, what your thoughts were on a show that there is some sort of release that happens after a show, and that in moving into these digital virtual spaces that we have cut out a lot of those traditions of like, coming in right when it starts dropping out right when it ends. And while those things are okay. Again, you know, I believe that theaters are going to continue to work in this way because there are communities that they can access that don't live in their immediate area. But what that also means is like building, you know, building resources in community around it. I know for myself personally. There are, there's different digital and virtual communities that I have because most of my friends do not live in my immediate vicinity. And we've, we've worked through having formatting digital sleepovers having bingo games being able to make polls on Twitter for a weekend having streaming parties, being able to have these things to be able to continue to communicate around a particular event that we enjoy or music that we enjoy or a venue that we enjoy. And there is that engagement between that institution or artists, and, you know, us as a community, and to be able to continue to have that kind of relationship and be able to, to have that to be able to carve out and make us make a not even carve out to just be able to cultivate a safe space in a digital sense for communities to really feel like they can, they can be welcome you know if I'm not living in London but like I can find a way to be able to check out with the Royal Shakespeare Company you know feeling like I have that connection, even though I'm not physically in that space because there is that there is that cultivated community that is a part of part of that digital and virtual process so I think that's something that's very important in terms of sustainability and also for artists to not feel alienated in this space that there are ways that we can be able to have proper connections. So I would say in regards to being valued or to feel valued in regards to to return to the work. And this is for myself as well as some of my colleagues I think it's a multi step process and I believe that all of my colleagues on the call mentioned quite a few of them. And the first thing of course is like Lawrence said being respected being respected for not only you know the experience that you bring the experiences that you have the education you bring the skill level you bring. But once you are respected in that regard and you're brought on a brought back to the work trusted. You have to be trusted to be able to create you have to be trusted to be able to kind of move freely in a way as long as you are you know producing and so that trust is really big not only with your work but also with the communications that you have being trusted to talk to about specific things in your area and or in your industry and inconsistent engagement. You want to be able to engage the artists you want to be engaged not only the designers but also the craft artisans who are responsible for maintaining that work compensation fair and equal and equitable compensation. While we know we are returning to a lot less than what we formerly had and I mean some people may not be returning to anything you know that's that's a that's a real thing that some folks won't be returning to their theaters and looking for other work. But you know prior to prioritization of our compensation. We're in making making sure that's equitable, you know within the ranks also and that's something that we often don't want to talk about I can talk about that for days, but but respected, being trusted being compensated. Once you're compensated once I get in there by being supported, you know, being talked to and supported in a way so some systems and processes are in place, the products and tools that you need in order to get the job done. Those are in place and also consistency. Oftentimes we go when we do shows and we'll do a show and you know they'll roll out the red carpet for you and then the next show is like. If you're called for the next show, right. So, because sometimes you're brought in, especially designers of color, oftentimes, and or designers who may identify in certain ways are here for this particular show or we brought you on for this special show. But then you are trained and educated and experienced in all these other shows, and you're not even considered to come and return to do the work and so you know consistency continuity full engagement support compensation and prioritizing those things with our designers with our artisans with everyone. And so in order for myself to feel valued as well as some of my colleagues and probably a few of y'all in this call, I think that it would take all of those things and probably even a lot more than I'm not mentioning. But as I'm listening to everyone talk I'm like, you know, because we, we definitely a group of people who are ready to get in there and ready to do the work but at the same time like also being human, we need a moment to be human. We need a moment to kind of take a step back and play, like we were talking about with our other question, being able to I mean the only reason why I want to call and able to be designers in this realm is because we like to play. So being able to go to that five year old self and having that time and ability to play and trusting that that list that I've just given you as well as the list that everyone else has here is in place so that we can do that and do it effectively and do it in a healthy manner. So that's, you know, as in regards to feeling valued is a heck of a lot but at the same time I mean I think that should be the new standard. I'm going to get and listen to y'all talk forever. And we had so many more prompts, but we're going to, we're going to go into closing. Right. So, one request you make of the field or an assignment action item. We'll go in reverse order from when we did the departmentals. And Kate will have that because I can't remember. That's me though. Okay. Other Kate. It is you. Yeah, it is me. The word return, right. In the past year we've had a pandemic and we've had a revolution, right. Like, do we. Are we interested in returning. And I think in so many ways so passionately yes and so many ways so passionately no right. And I think my request is for us to take the energy that we have to continue to interrogate and continue to consider to hold each other accountable and in in many ways to not return. And in many ways return really, really passionately. And I'll pass it but I'm not sure who else is next. Yeah, you know, I mean, like, there's so much conversation and like I've just been thinking now like the past however many minutes that we've been talking ever since Lawrence spoke his piece about everything I'm just kind of like I want to echo everything that he said about that because I think it's like super, super valid and super important. But I guess like one request from me, like, just in thinking about like, I don't know, it's like what we all need different things, we all deserve to get paid equitably. Yes, did I say that word correctly probably not I'm sorry. Um, but I have this, I fell into this conversation the other day, where we were talking about like designers and like the difference between the work that designers do, and how do you pay everyone equitably for the work that they do, considering the fact that like, Oh, let's say like, you know, like costume designers do have to kind of lug clothes around a lot of times in New York City, and there's no like, a lot of times there's no space for them, and to leave anything. I'm not going to speak out of turn about custom design but it's just like stuff that I've sort of seen and like, I mean I know when I'm in a space I have a master electrician but like, there's not always a worker supervisor so I'm, and I won't speak out of outside of my turn on that but just in thinking about like how do we approach designers how do we approach the work that they bring to the table. I guess it's very, I don't know it's very loaded and I think it like bear some like really deep sort of thought and careful looking through. I don't know sorry that's where my brain is at right now I don't. I'll pass it on to whoever is next. Chris. Yeah, so I guess to refresh the request is of the field of. Is it theater at large. Is that is that the question. Sure, it could be. If you wanted you could make it into the field of theater education, the field of education or the field of life. That'd be fine too. I think I think in general over the past couple months, I've been talking a lot about it and thinking about it and getting angry about it and sort of dealing with the emotions of all the things that we've talked about. I think the biggest word that comes up for me in moving forward and you know I like giving homework so this is a perfect prompt for me but is the idea of accountability and holding others accountable but also holding ourselves accountable right like, I had to do this work because it is the demands of my job right now, but I know a lot of people are starting those thoughts, and also getting tired and losing that momentum. And how can we keep moving that needle of momentum further so that they're actual actionable policies and protocols for people to feel safe and welcome in their environments and also policies that take care of everyone's different experiences of life right like we talked a lot about accessibility and and the need to sort of acknowledge the whole self of what we bring to the table in collaboration. But also our circumstances right like respect the baggage that everyone has and and understand that accountability and constructing that for ourselves doesn't, you know we have that gift of time don't waste it, you know make a plan because it doesn't take that long. Right there's so many simple changes we can make just for ourselves that you know that's a culture shift. So my thing is don't lose momentum like keep it going, and remind people that that it's okay that it's a longer journey than we expect right because it's only 2021 now. And I know working in policy and looking at systems that a five year plan is still okay. Right. So we all have acknowledged that it's not like it's not going to happen overnight, but give yourself that grace to at least make actual plans for yourself. Even if it's in tiny increments. I think that's my request. So, I believe the next person is sure. Thank you Chris. So Porsche I just want to make sure that I get this right. Are we mentioning our, we're saying our actionable items to the industry. Just one. Whatever you can say in 95 seconds. A little novel. No, my biggest thing and it's always been my theme, and it's not it's going to always be there is it also comes from one of the football players who actually like a lot and admire that he's about that action. And my biggest thing is, you know, with these requests, these demands, these things that are needed, all these conversations that were happy that are happening, and it continued to happen it's not like we haven't heard these things before it's just that now since 2020, and since the shutdown and the revolution, all the things, you know we're talking about them and so my big request to the industry theater as well as even other industries is to put some things into action. You know, because over time like talking constantly and having these conversations, they're great. I respect the conversation, but what I'd like to see is some action behind the conversation, and not three months, not six months not one year, consistent action behind the conversations and action that is from the people, and by the people that is signed off also by the people who are asking for that. So, so some, some action behind it inconsistent, and that with that action to make that a way of life and a way of doing business, not just something to placate, but consistent continuous action that would be my request. I am going to pass it off this time correctly. Let's see. I am passing this to SP. Hello. My request for the industry is to treat all the various forms of digital and virtual theater, whether past, present or future as legitimate art form and be able to give a creator some resources they need to be able to experiment. I would like to ask that theater is realized that digital theater grants access to those who would not normally have it. And I think the advent of digital theater and zoom theater creates an avenue of access that is wildly important and creates greater avenues for people to experiment but for also people to be exposed to the art, and to maintain that is wildly important. Maintain and continue to investigate people's humanity and treat people like humans. Right. The world we came from, we've all acknowledged treated us in humanly. And my biggest one for the industry and I will say it on every single one of these talks is that I am tired of seeing stories on stage about people of color only in pain. I want to see people of color experience joy and adventure and all of the highs and lows of life. I do not want to see any more stories on stage about only people of color and pain. That's not all we are. We are so much more than that. Let those stories be told. Let us tell those stories. And then I will give it off to ASA. Now I have to like follow everyone's amazing, amazing words. This kind of goes back to the last prompt, but I wrote down basically, you know, value my value, you know, my self value my self-worth. Because I realized, you know, in theater, I really had to, you know, fight, fight for that. Like I didn't have, you know, a lot of value for myself when I started out in my career. And I was like doing, you know, I had like crappy budgets. I was, you know, it was like just, you know, getting taken advantage of. And then, you know, over the years, it's like, I, you know, had like fought for space and especially in like contract negotiations, which then, you know, because it's like I didn't have an agent. You know, there's like a lot of stuff I didn't have. So it's like, okay, well, I have to do like do these, you know, little like battles like on my own. And like at this point in my career, kind of like sort of, you know, seeing how just, you know, contracts are negotiated or things that are offered or not offered or, you know, it's sort of been like a whole sort of time and navigating all of that. And I think that at the beginning of the pandemic, there was this moment where I kind of just had this this moment where I was like, I have no career. I have no value. I have, you know, the thing that I did now no longer exists, like where do I go from here. And then, you know, apart from being, you know, kind of awkwardly put into play readings or, you know, zoom theater here and there I it's sort of like, let me really kind of like see like sit with that and realize that there was this whole trajectory in how I valued myself and my creativity and my art and really what that brings to the table. Yeah. Thank you, Asa. And I guess portion I will add on a little bit to the end before we close this out. I, yeah, I have, I have so many asks for the field but I'm going to just try to keep it short. And you know, the way that we're using words right now I want. I think it's really important for us to figure out what accountability really means to you, like really means as artists as humans, how to be accountable to each other and to our audiences be accountable for the work that you put into the world, and the jobs that you say yes to, and the people that you recommend, figure out what anti racism means to you, figure out what you're willing to sacrifice for the liberation of all living things. So I want to give a little bit of ownership to the land that you are on and the original and current caretakers of that land, and ask these questions at the beginning of the process, and all throughout the process and after the process. This is all of our responsibility to do this work but we need to care for ourselves during the process and make sure everyone is being taken care of and that we're attending to those who are most impacted and targeted by the oppressive system that is the theater that is more complex. This is hard work. This is artwork. This is necessary work, and as the incomparable tie to foe often says art is a tool for social change, and we have the power to use this tool to create the world that we deserve. Over the pressure. I think it's going last perfect ending. I was just going to say, you know, we've talked a lot about boxes during this time, and I wish everybody we worked with everyone we knew realize that nobody fits perfectly into a box, and that we shouldn't have to cut off parts of ourselves to squeeze into a box to be in this industry. Right. So that that's what I would just that's my ask from the field that there is no box that any one of us should have to squeeze ourselves into. So thank you to how around. Thank you to all you wonderful people on this call. Thank you to our ASL interpreters. Thank you to our captioner. Thank you all so much for being here. I can't tell you how much I've appreciated this conversation and now I appreciate all of you. Thank you, Portia. Oh, thank you Kate. And thank you for everyone watching. Alright, thanks audience. This conversation continues. It's not the last one.