 Well, I think this is enough time to welcome people so let me welcome you welcome to the future trends forum I'm delighted to see so many of you here today This is our weekly meeting where we collaboratively and through conversation explore the future of higher education My name is Brian Alexander on the forums creator host and chief cat herder And I'll be your guide to the next hour of conversation. We've been focusing on Inclusivity throughout the forum's life, especially for the past two years We know a whole series of sessions, especially looking at race and racism now I'd like to welcome Rita Kumar and Brenda Raffae. They're both the University of Cincinnati They both have an English literature and English professor background Rita runs their faculty and Richmond Center Which I think is where they physically are today Brenda Professor FAA is a professor of English who is teaching a lot on composition and writing together They published a book on inclusive teaching and very recently Published a really handy article at inside a higher-red on small changes promoting inclusivity So let me just bring them up on stage so we can start talking Let's see how it works and hello professors Good to see you both good to see you both You can see from the chat that we're all pretty keenly concerned about weather. So you have to tell us how hot is it there in Cincinnati? Very human oh Oh, you're pressing the web all very hard, but you're you're safe and sound and air conditioning right now, right? Stay there as long as you can And in in the chat we have people who are talking about think temperatures in the 90s or the hundreds This is summer where we're getting hit hard by this But but it's a lot easier to bear and much more pleasant to bear with the help of wonderful scholars like yourselves We have a tradition on the forum. We like to ask people to introduce themselves not by talking about their past But by talking about their future and if you just say what are you going to be working on for the next year? What kind of projects? What kind of initiatives what kind of stuff and what kind of ideas are going to be top of mind for you for the next year? Sure So this you know in the past two years we have been really busy with our work on our book You know equity and inclusion and higher education strategies for teaching and this year has been busy essentially with you know Promotion related to the book However, as we look as I look forward in my role as the executive director of the faculty in Richmond Center I'm looking at More innovative program for our faculty here at University of Cincinnati And how we can meet our objectives of diversity equity and inclusion a career advancement interdisciplinary collaboration and personal and social well-being and I continue to work closely on several projects together That are going to be coming up in the latter half of the year which include a Keynote address Some workshops for our own faculty here on inclusive teaching and Some other work that we have been thinking about but just haven't had the time or the bad news to just address yet And I'm going to ask Brenda to add to this Yeah, and so as a faculty member. I'm also a member of our coalition for anti-racist action and I've been working on a Syllabus rubric to help faculty to decolonize the curriculum and create a more inclusive syllabus for their courses and that work is going to continue into the future and I'm also our learning teaching center director at the University of Cincinnati Blue Lash College Where we have a number of initiatives to bring in the social justice center for our college in some more programming around diversity equity inclusion Excellent excellent that sounds very much continuing your recent work and and really taking it forward Friends if you're new to the forum This is a place for you to ask your questions and to make your comments and to float your ideas I'm just going to start off with a couple of quick questions just to get the ball rolling But remember to use a bottom of the screen use that raised hand if you want to join us around the table or Click the Q&A box Wanted to ask for a question and by the way if if you haven't had chance yet to look at this work You should see two buttons on the bottom left of the screen One that is linked inside a piece and one that's linked to our author's book So you can take a look at either of those as we go I my first question to ask you is Over the past two years We had a huge cultural shift in the United States A very strong focus on racism and anti-racism and I'm curious looking at it past two years Which teaching practices in favor of inclusion have really been the most popular among the faculty that you work with And which have been the most effective So I don't know that I would say that there's any one practice that covers everybody across the board When we're doing this work around anti-racism What seems to be most effective is to be very specifically understand your context your student population your disciplinary content and to work with that information to Decolonize the syllabus and of course and then If I'm thinking about specific things that people have done within their courses is they have More broadly looked at equity and inclusion statements diversity and inclusion statements that they can add to their syllabus to denote to their Students their commitment to creating an inclusive space for their students So that's one that kind of goes across disciplines But then we work with individual faculty. It really is a case-by-case basis on how to address what needs to be addressed in their classes. Oh Interesting interesting. So that statement of care that statement of intent is is something which can be generic In the positive sense that everyone can use that but otherwise it's really a it sounds like you're doing a kind of Consulting basis with individual cases One thing that I would like to add I think that is core to to this work is Is self awareness a self assessment and you know, even as we we offer Strategies for to our faculty we do encourage them to begin with self-awareness a Process of reflection to look within themselves and to be able to uncover their own values and their biases as they begin this work and then to Really Think about what will guide their work in and what we we prompt them to think about is To be intentional in this work because we know This work needs that level of intentionality and commitment So I think again as Brenda said, this is goes across the board Irrespective of discipline with that's the place to start and where we It's it can be sometimes uncomfortable, but I think Necessary to be able to commit to to this work long-term Very good. Thank you. Thank you both. Those are very very solid answers I'm going to exhort all of you to put forth your own questions So again, just use the Q&A box if you'd like to type in a question that I can raise or Just click the raised hand button so you can join us virtually around the table We already have one quick question that came in from Lisa Durf our good friend and she asks What exactly does decolonize the syllabus me? All right, so a lot of our disciplines are Eurocentric they're based in traditional practices of European Western thinking and so to decolonize our curriculum and our syllabus is to really think beyond that other ways of knowing Perhaps bringing in indigenous ways of knowing into the course or into the curriculum Thinking through other ways of knowing and making those ways of knowing accessible to our students. It's Applicable to all disciplines, but it's easier to see in some disciplines than others and That's why as Rita said, you know really looking at yourself your values and then being able to make the familiar strange So that you can start to identify those areas where you've just always assumed that the way you do something is the correct way when there may be other ways of Thinking or being that might help your students So to give a very concrete example in English composition standard edited English is like The default everybody assumes that that is like the normal way to speak, but that really is representing a white middle-class way of talking or Communicating and so when we use that as the normative we are shutting down other ways of communicating with our students if Making them feel that their own ways of speaking and communicating are not as Accepted in the classroom. And so how do we build? Students communicative abilities to add additional ways of communicating rather than saying this is the right way you're speaking the wrong way Lisa I hope that's a good question. I appreciate your directness and I hope that's good answer for you If you'd like to add more, please you know fire up the Q&A box and we'd love to hear more Thank you for that very very detailed and very clear answer Rita, did you want to dive in on that? You know, I see that, you know, how does one To add how does one alter a syllabus, you know You know, there's several ways that that can be done in terms of You know the way the syllabus is written. It should be less prescriptive and more welcoming You know just a small example where you're mentioning You know about the course and it's just saying this is what you will study It could be done in ways where you invite your students to join you in the exploration of that discipline And as Brenda said, then we are reaching out to different people and their different communicative styles Or talking about, you know, the tone of our Syllabus the language of the syllabus and the way we actually design the syllabus, you know In to incorporate the visual aspects into the syllabus that will make it easier for some of our Students who may be challenged in that way to be able to to read the syllabus more effectively and Make it sound less like a contract but as an invitation for our students to participate with us in that process That's a great phrase less like a contract and more like an invitation Just there's a question coming in but I just want to press on one point here of Rita, what is when you mentioned Making it readable are you speaking about accessibility in terms of say visual disability? Yes, accessibility as well as also accessible in terms of the tone of the language and what you know Some terms that we as academics we just assume that our students know but You know, we want to we want to be transparent. What do we really mean? You know when we say certain things, you know our Providing rationale for certain aspects of our syllabus, you know These you will be, you know, for example, if you're talking about a policy or plagiarism is to just handling the policy of plagiarism Explaining why that is important in the academic world and then, you know Giving them a sense of that, you know, there are ways that you they will not necessarily be Not not necessarily writing in a penalizing style that you know if you don't do this You would be penalized the same. This is the way to understand it and you know, this is important And this is the reason for its importance. So there's there's small ways to make that an invitation rather than a contract Interesting. That's a that's a great way of putting it. Thank you. Thank you We had a previous guest who couldn't make it to this to this session Because of a schedule conflict, but he wanted to put the accessibility on the table as well Um, we have a another question came from robin pappas In the chat and robin asks how does one check oneself about appropriating other cultures while trying to decolonize content and disciplinary approaches How to walk that line Yeah, I think that goes back to what Rita was saying and working with your students And I see somebody has put in the chat that they work with their students to co-create syllabus Which is one thing that we would highly recommend I think if you're going to go to it Like I mentioned earlier indigenous ways of knowing then maybe you go to that community to ask them to work with you So in alaska The work there by the authors have stopped talking They did just that they invited the members of that community into the space for faculty development education To better understand how they could decolonize their curriculum. So I would say work with the people in your local community to help you to Not appropriate the culture but to actively Integrate it into your curriculum Well, that that's a great question. Uh, by the way, thank you for that for that And uh, and again, uh, Brenda. Thank you for that, uh, really clear answer I can tell that you are practiced and you've been thinking about these very deeply for some time now At a great level, uh, we have a couple more questions that are coming in I want to flash these on the screen. This is one from Catherine Wilson at the University of Nebraska Lincoln Uh, and she says what approach has been successful for faculty groups to engage in this effort to recreate content I I go back to learning communities When people who are very interested in the topic get together like-minded people create a community of practice around that topic It's really effective because then you have that cadre of people who are willing to challenge you and question what you're doing But you also feel comfortable sharing what you're doing so that It moves you forward So we both been fortunate to have those opportunities in our work in the past And it's something that we're trying to continue as we move forward So within my department now in English, we have a community based around anti-racist curriculum development for composition courses That keeps us moving forward so that we don't stagnate and think oh I've got the inclusive course now But along with that anti-racist approach We are also very keen to understand how do we make our courses accessible? It that we have many students at our college who need accessibility resources support and so we want to make sure that our courses Are arranged for their needs without needing extra accommodations, but that they're already accessible to those students Well, thank you. I if I could ask um, Rita, just a quick question. Uh, this is so fast. I have so many questions, but I want to make sure I have so many questions, but I want to make sure I recommend one of our course in here The communities of practice form around their departments, uh, or across departmental lines I'm going to repeat that question because it was some experience and I did quite crash the first half of your question Sure. Um, when you're thinking about faculty communities of practice Is it better to form them up within departmental groups or do you prefer to have them across departmental barriers? Personally based on my own experience in faculty learning communities. I really enjoyed the interdisciplinary aspect of the learning communities I enjoyed the opportunity to converse with people um That were outside my department because it gave me a broader perspective of looking at things because Sometimes we get so caught up in our own discipline within our and within our own department And that we are not unable to open our eyes to new ways of thinking and I think when we have interdisciplinary faculty learning communities That is the advantage because you are prompted to Speak and discuss with people coming from other Disciplines and they bring their own perspective of looking at things and I think that is a really A great way to enrich our own, uh, you know teaching practices Excellent. Thank you. Thank you Um, I'm trying not to ask my questions anymore. I'm just so excited about this and so fascinated Thank you for that. Oh a really really solid answer. We have Another question here from Amara Cardozo who comes to us from clean university in new jersey And Amara asks, how do you manage students being late to class quote unquote late when time is a colonized concept? Would you still recommend deducting points or not? um So this is they do several ways to approach it I think is when we when we think about inclusivity. It does not mean necessarily that there are no rules to a class right and uh, you know, perhaps in in the case of this particular student who continues to be late you may want to take some time to Uh, pull the student aside and have a colonization with them to really understand what is the reason behind That student being late and without making assumptions or this person represents this culture They tend to come, you know, what I know about this culture. They tend to have a different sense of time May not necessarily be true Most of the time is not they're individuals that instances involved in a certain person's behavior And I think it it behoves us to first check in with the student What is going on before coming to making any assumptions or coming to a conclusion? Oh, that's a very very balanced answer to a very very direct and tricky question Amara if you'd like to follow up With more we'd love to hear from you And for everybody else again, this you can tell our guests are incredibly kind and answer We're with really admirable seriousness. If you have any more questions or comments I'm sure they'll keep coming up Please feel free to join us. We have a another question that came up earlier from uh, John Hollenbeck and uh, John asks this doesn't equal access to education Objectified learning and make it a thing that can be transferred and rationed As opposed to equal privileging of learning which democratizes all knowledge I'm gonna put that back up in the statement That's yeah, I'm sort of So we we both agree with the premise that just having access to education doesn't make things equal, but I haven't had this opportunity to think through how it objectifies learning Interesting idea. I'd like to hear more about it if this person Should be willing to talk a little bit more about it. Let me just let me just draft John and haul him up on stage Because I want to hear what he has to think Though John you knew this was going to happen. You knew I'd have to bring you on stage I didn't shower. I didn't shave this week. I required to stay low Take me as I am. Well, that's how that's all we can do Okay, um This goes to a concept that I had that went back to my graduate studies with michael apple and he was talking about um With holding education or not making things possible and I said well, doesn't that make you a behaviorist? Who thinks that knowledge is about transfer and he said it makes me a behaviorist only for the purposes of my theory and That's what he lost me, but um my point being This this isn't just a Eurocentric syllabus or class issues. We've been discussing in the chat It's it's it's the institutional norm It is our concept of learning that we go to a a smart person until recently a smart white person with a beard and We extract their knowledge from them and we are judged on that extraction by our ability to Say it back with fidelity and You know, this doesn't fly in most disciplines in practice And so I guess that's what I what I'm saying is Yeah, Lisa. You don't have a beard look where it got you Um So I mean what it gets to me is when we're talking like this It seems like behind all the theorizing and all the good intentions We are we are placing knowledge is something that we can ration. We can control We can pan up keep away from some people and allow other people into Isn't that what we're doing right now? Yeah, exactly what i'm saying It's what we're doing it because that's how the this is my last my last college was in new mexico and espanol. I was 85 Espanol And what was there were two ways to approach that school and some tried to make everybody white to put it bluntly And some tried some disciplines were free to become culturally aware of where they were They depended on how much flexibility they were willing to take and how much they could But through the whole thing you saw this whole notion was we have a thing called a unit that has a thing called Knowledge behind it that has a thing we call grades That are all constructions of a culture that none of us can go back to So that's that's my that's where I get lost in these discussions is that you know A syllabus is very much an artifact of of the old white man with the beard Yes, and and to me it's more interesting is how do how do we How do we let everybody Manifest their own intelligence in ways that are real to them culturally cognitively Life-wise everything else That's a great question And it really calls it. I really like that rethinking what higher education looks like Given the pandemic and all the changes that we've had this seems like a good opportunity to think through what we could change about the system we're in Which includes thinking about does the syllabus serve the purpose that it used to or When it was first envisioned right over the years the syllabus has become A 20 page document, you know in as a way to protect yourself against everything, right? And so this is the time really to rethink about so How else can we communicate with our students about what how we want to learn together? Is it a syllabus or is it going to be something else that It should should we be really thinking about Beyond the syllabus in terms of some other thing that that will That will serve the purpose of communication, but it doesn't have to be the traditional syllabus So it you know, these are questions that are coming up because of the kind of climate we are living in and what you pointed out john the The treating treatment of education as a commercial product, right? You know this thing as you mentioned it. So, you know, um, even though we do talk about decolonizing the curricula or the syllabus I do Do agree with you that maybe time to rethink What is the syllabus and what function does it serve and how can it be? um How can it be better reflective of our current needs and the climate that we are living in right? Well, let's not kid ourselves the syllabus is a legal document Maybe But not really because as tom pointed out earlier students don't read the syllabus It doesn't have the caveat that it had back in the olden days and A syllabus in my my understanding exists to convince some other school that the class you taught was close to a class that they taught because Your syllabus looks like their syllabus And that seems to be its most important function But beyond that then what students are looking at at a syllabus is where's the schedule? What do I have to do to get through this turkey of a class? So I get my three credits and can move on So Though we think that the syllabus doesn't play that big a role because of you know our experience with that Students do check it out and sometimes they've been not even joining the class if they they don't feel welcome Based on what they read in the syllabus. So it's you know, but we continue to call it a syllabus or whatever document We want to call it, but it has to be something that That gives the student a sense of belonging a sense that they are in they have a place at the table And that this is an invitation to learn now We may end up calling it by some other term, you know at some point I do not know But you know currently that's that's what we call it and so it It suggests that you know that We need to do something about this document. How can we make it more? Useful as you said, you know other than just saying this is what you have to do Right, but we don't have to have this document And that's where we get into this institutional dance where? Grains and classes and semesters and everything else are like this These things that came down to us from some god who said this is how education can only take place It's not that's just not true I think learning The institution of education Places learning as a solution to the professor's problems And what engages people and what what includes people is when learning is the answer to their problems When they learn to solve their own problems when they learn to formulate their own problems So like in my ladder classes, I wanted everybody to be their own instructional designer You know within the loose framework of what this class is about what do you need to learn? And you know, I my whole career has gone through different phases of where Really well-intentioned inclusive things tried to go from the top down and they just don't work I mean, you remember eubonics in san francisco I was at state at the at the time when that took place And everybody was trying really hard, but it was just not a task that could be accomplished So, you know, I really I think is you know, we we say a lot of the forum or at least commonly do that We really need to look at the practice of higher education. I think there needs to be a different institution with a different A whole different thing and that's that's probably a whole different thing. So I should I should go and take a shower I was gonna complain that you had too much hair This is great, I mean We have questions that are following up on this, but John if you want to go, I'll I'll let you go. Well, I could say here if you want Well, I We have one question that came up, which I think all three of you would want to address molly says or molly asks in chat I was going to ask if there may be a need to shift to a term other than syllabus Is there a more inclusive term to express the outlawing of expectations for the course throughout the semester? learning plan huh In part in part state doesn't have semesters. They don't have They don't they have individually Negotiated agreements and here's what I'm here to do and if I do all this can will you give me a master's? Yeah, we promise we will okay. Let's get to work Okay, the learning plan lisa dirscher just the course guidelines Rita have you come across in your work at the center? Have you come across any? Nothing, I'm just thinking but I really like the idea of the learning plan because it It is suggestive of it focuses the attention on the student And you know, that's what we want. It should be student-centered and when we say learning plan They're here to learn and the the role of the Of the of the faculty member then becomes to help them facilitate this plan But it is they have input and it is suggestive of that it is It you know, we're going to think of learning plan. I'm thinking. Oh, yes You know rather than this instructor making the learning plan for the student the student would And would work with the faculty member to come up with their learning plan because they know how they learn And you know this what the job they then instructor is to help facilitate that process Which is a very different project than traditional schooling. Yes Or where the instructor's job is to explain what they want and the student's job is to is to give it back to them verbatim And I see that somebody said that plan is in the learning management systems. Yes, the learning management systems have taken over to a great extent for of Some of this conversation that we're talking about in terms of guidelines or Processes that are associated as Thomas said step one step two step three Yeah, but I would say that all that's doing is is mechanizing what was already there. I mean, that's there's a reason they called it blackboard And we don't handle any paper copies now Right. Everything is up online now Right but I My first online class was in 1992 It was on email And what we learned in that class was when you don't have the traditional props of a classroom Learner tend to become learners and follow things that are of their interest and they ended up co-creating Did my dissertation on it democratized education simply because There were none of the traditional stops. Well, you know blackboard came along and ruined online learning but You know in those it showed what a student centric democratically oriented Classrooms that look like and you see that you we saw that in new mexico When we asked students what were culturally appropriate ways for them to learn to overcome their problems to to get where they needed to go And you know, it's just it's just different than fixing the syllabus. I'm sorry to keep going back to that but it's Yeah, you know, I said it's different than us saying we need to make this less white To put it one way we do But but it shouldn't be us doing it If if I could at risk of being literally the white man with the beard if I could come back to an earlier point in the conversation Which may complement this focus on a syllabus Rita You were talking briefly. I'm sorry. Maybe it was Brenda About how the conversation we're having now is that kind of collaborative collective learning You know not an object that's being delivered while it's being constructed together And I'm curious in your work at Cincinnati, uh, how do you help faculty think about having that kind of pedagogy in their classrooms? Well, we go back to what our students interests and needs are so, um We have student listening sessions where the students will share what their concerns are in the classroom And we bring those back to our faculty to say how can we address these concerns? So that's been one thing that we found is helpful Um Then Rita and I were also engaged in our project where we very specifically asked students in our courses. What are your concerns? That we could address to make our classes more inclusive and we Very broadly asked what their concerns are. So we were asking about like life outside of school not Just in the classroom Because we're very aware that higher education if we're just talking about the syllabus We're missing the mark and that's not what we're trying to suggest if you fix your syllabus everything's going to be great We're suggesting the syllabus is one small step one very small my new part of the process This is a wicked problem as Rita wrote about recently It is very complex and interrelated and if we pull at the thread on one part Maybe we're tying the knot in a way. We didn't anticipate So being careful about how we start to undo this Problem is important. Um, you know, so We're all familiar with syllabus, but as people have noted, you know, that's not the only place and that's not the only thing We should be looking at Yeah, I mean just again in my northern new mexico college. We had to have a class to teach them what a syllabus was These were mostly a first first time in college generation. So they didn't know what it's all about sure Telling them what it was and then one and finally I remember one one Students says, oh, so this is where you tell us what to do Yeah, that's what a syllabus is. We're here to tell you what to do Yeah, it's easy to unravel but Difficult to wrap so you have to be very careful as you unravel things You also have to have a plan and how you're going to Fold them back and it's not always easy and not always known So some things are discovered in the process as Brenda pointed out richly when we when we did this project with our students I mean we we had focus groups. We had individual interviews. We did the survey to see what we find out You know, what what is there that you find out from our students How we can be more inclusive and to interesting we found out though the sample size is not that big is that a lot of students also indicated aspects outside schools So it was not all about, you know, what was happening with the classroom But there were many aspects that contributed You know to how they felt and that were outside our outside school and you know that we As faculty members in the classroom were not necessarily all this control. I mean not that we didn't control anything much, but John, let me thank you. Thank you. And let me give you a break. Thank you. Well, give the rest of the crowd a break Always good to see you I love the way that you're talking about These small chances or small changes and how they really start to unpick and unravel the entire whole We had a comment from Bill Heinrich who says I know learning outcomes are meant to clarify expectations Learning learning outcomes very often lock and functionally limit the range of learning that is possible in the course So that's that's a very focused one Friends we That was the example of a video question So if you'd like to join us you you don't have to have a beard to be on stage But just please click the raised hand You can tell that we're we're very kind and supportive if you want to be up here face to face with Rita and Brenda And if you would like to type in your question again, the q&a box is is there ready for you and for your Your comments and your thoughts We've had One topic that's come up before when we've addressed this is a kind of future oriented view Which is to say if if you have free reign to do this kind of work with inclusion and dei At your university, what does it look like in in 10 years? How is it different from 2022? So I think we would have student led Faculty development that helps us understand what students lives are like both in and out of the classroom To provide us with guidance in where we could be more supportive of their learning goals Wow I would see more Institutional wide support um at all levels For for for this work for this for the commitment, you know for this commitment because it takes everybody's commitment At their level to make this really successful So in 10 years, I would hope that we would get to that point that they would be established commitment to this to this work, right? but I'm going to bring up the Elf that we haven't talked about and that's we're in the state of Ohio Which is one of the states that has pending legislation around anti-racist curriculum And so, you know in 10 years from now, we may not even be allowed to talk about these issues so We're right now thinking pie in the sky doing everything we can to hold on to the ability to address diversity equity inclusion Recognizing that there are some who don't want us to have these conversations For the very reason I think that we were talking about with the changing in higher education Um, it was brought up in the chat like the demographics are changing If we're changing the way we can see whether some people feel threatened by that and so it's How do we tread carefully forward to allow people to recognize that by valuing each person's individuality We are not negating Other ways of thinking you know conservative ways of thinking need to be honored and valued as well but we Need to respect everybody And find ways forward where we can do that which is Very well This is a great. This is a great answer to my humongous question And you one part I I love that vernetta humball also agreed They were a student led professional development. That's a great idea explanation point I love the sound of that But what but what you said was was so important that uh on the one hand Rita you're describing the different projects that you can that you can Accomplish the different ways the institution could structure them But at the same time, uh, Brenda, you're describing the resistance outside of campus Um, although some perhaps uh on campus as well Um, I what kind of means of looking ahead? I mean that seems like a very good forecast I don't mean good as an happy but good as an as an accurate and plausible um How should the academy React to these so-called anti-crt laws that we're seeing in ohio and florida Should we just amp up our lobbying of state legislatures or what do you recommend? Well in ohio there are A history who's a higher education have lobbied against it That particular piece of legislation because it's too narrowly focused Um, so I know that there's a political Um movement effort, but I don't know how much That will have an effect. Yeah, I mean it's terminal. I think um, you know in the meantime We may not have control over the political aspects of this But we do have control over How we approach in our classrooms, you know, what can we do and it goes back to that whole idea Small changes, right? We we at our own level can still continue to do that even as you know, a lot of this happens around us and Whatever is in our control I know some of that chat has shown that some things are not in In our control sometimes you're handed things and we're just supposed to deliver them But there are certain things that are in our control and that's where we can exercise our autonomy of Of endeavoring to or committing to to these small changes. So Even if it sounds like a lot of glue there is still hope in in in terms of our own personal commitment to this work And our own intentionality regarding this work Thank you. Thank you. Um, I appreciate the sanity realism of your answers If if you could well, we're waiting for more questions to come in And friends were we're down to the last 10 minutes we're down to the wire So this is the time to put out any question that you're just hoping to ask Um, let let me ask one more. This is a kind of basic question What are some of the other like small steps that structures can do we talked about re-envisioning the syllabus? We've talked about really thinking time, but we've talked about thinking about pedagogy We talked about you really talked earlier about faculty becoming more aware of their own biases and their own values Where's some other small steps that faculty can take? I think somebody has mentioned in in in the chat they talked about assessment and how to Separate assessment from grades. I think that is a powerful way of Thinking about this because they're you know, our assessment needs to be inclusive we we tend to I mean so far having assessing Uh students on the basis of what have our Eurocentric ways established ways and how do we separate that and And how can assessment of somebody's learning to be separated? from grades because ultimately, you know as as again was pointed out in the in the chat that grades then, you know continued to be a source of ongoing Challenge for some of our students, especially if they're coming from underrepresented minorities if they come first generation students I think that is an area that that needs a lot of attention and Where we can actually make some difference Those are really good answers Thank you. Thank you The the chat box has been just a torrent people have been asking There's a chiming in an assessment and there's more and more questions questions about guns in the classroom in Ohio But I want to give bill hindrick A chance to ask one of his questions And bill put it from orbit. Let's just share this in getting started in the practice of decolonizing inclusion Does it help to use a theory to practice of inclusion i.e. a from power fair operationalizing the learning plan? Yeah, I think for me, I Used to sell in a ways anti racist writing assessment ecology book as my Background because it was specific to my discipline So I think it is helpful if you have that kind of framework if you're thinking through What you can do to be more inclusive in your courses um, and I would say probably almost every discipline has uh, specifically Work or body of knowledge that could help guide you in this work Making your course more inclusive Well, thank you for that. I just I just want to make sure is that um, uh asao annoying Yeah U. E. Thank you. I I just want a link in the chat so people can Uh and and people in the chat have thrown in a whole series of the recommendations carol swex mindset um Catherine james recommends jennifer eberhardt's book biased which has a chapter on on higher ed Bill hindrick also has a new assessment resource on equity What a good question bill. Thank you. Thank you I Loa's website night loa If you're interested in equity and assessment the work of natasha jen kawalski is also really good stuff Well, what's the name of that website? I'm sorry in i loa Thank you um if we uh I'm just more people are asking and and tom hams is just up on on the terror And uh engaging with maria and other people which is great um And this sounds like we have quite a few resources um Do you think We had a comment above about demographic change not for our students But for instructors and faculty this is maria Uh, she said I would assume for education to change in 20 years The educators demographics would need to change i.e. our current diverse students may need to become professors who drive change as well And i'm i'm i'm curious. Are you are you seeing more more of this being a driver? Are you seeing more people who are not white men? Uh, obviously i'm talking to two people who are not white men, but um, Out of at a statistical level. Are you seeing more of that change? And does that help empower the kind of transformation that you're working towards? That's true in the demographics for Professor the professor if i remember the latest aap numbers Women and faculty of color are still not as represented as the general population So yes, it would help if we had more representative faculty Of the population that I don't think we're there yet. Yeah, it definitely does because There's so much conversation about students not having a sense of belonging if they don't see people who look like them And they come into these institutions Uh, you know, it's going to impact retention but at the same time, you know as we get to to bump up our efforts to Make our faculty more representative of the of the students that they get in the classroom, but then again it goes back to Um, what are we doing to retain them? You know, how are we supporting them? Even if they are getting hired how are we how are we doing to? Maintain retention. Are we providing them the support that they need? I mean You find that a lot of underrepresented faculty Underrepresented faculty tend to be doing larger loads of of service and which goes unacknowledged Because they're providing services to Students who who are coming from underrepresented groups. So it's kind of a vicious cycle You know, if you want to maintain if you want to Push up those numbers of underrepresented faculty Uh underrepresented members, then you also have to have equivalent systems of support for them To to be able to retain them and even if when you retain them then and you know, when we continue to support them then they become you know members of our faculty and become a source of inspiration Of our changing body of students This is here. Well, that's that's a great and very sad answer In the in the chat a bit earlier, tom haim said if diverse students don't get through the system You'll never have those diverse educators since most of them need degrees from the current systems That is true. So it's you know, we have to if you want them to be represented in our faculty bodies We also have to make sure that they get the education to be then join academia. So, you know, it's It's a it's a Which is which Makes us should make us think about, you know, how do we make Students that are traditionally have not been a part of the education system Give them a sense of belonging make them feel that they belong here that they have they've seen right to this education And you know, then later on become representatives in in our faculty. So Uh, there's not more work to be done Are there any other ways you'd recommend For faculty to create that sense of belonging in their classes either their virtual classes or their face-to-face classes We talked before about the change in the syllabus. We talked a bit about assessment We talked about time we talked about conversations We talked about the work of of the two of you and and doing interviews with students To run to you know, try and check on their on their issues So anything else that uh that you would ask faculty to do in order to help these students under present students Persist and maintain in these classes so that down the road some of them can become faculty I think we always so in addition to talking with the students who are currently in our classroom If we could read the research that's in our field about what works To keep our students in our classes and try to employ some of those strategies. So For instance, I know that when I let my students choose their writing topics That's something that keeps them engaged in the class so that I'm better able to retain those students So I know that works. So what you know, and I know that from the literature in my field So reading What research is out there in your field about what works to help with retention is something that Everyone can do Well, thank you. Uh, I mean, it's it's I'm unsurprised as a fellow english professor to hear english professors recommend more reading That is that's what But this is very very practical You've given us a whole series of not just grand ways of thinking about education And inclusion but also very very many practical ways of proceeding It's it's been a real treat to host the two of you and you've been very very generous with your time in thinking What is the what is the best way for us to keep up with you two and your and your work? Um Anybody has questions for us, um, you know, we're happy to share our email With you and we're both on linkedin 2 feel free to contact us and we would love to continue the conversation Um in our book, we also have a section Which is unmanifold if you have resources or ideas you can actually add to them. It's it's What I call the living section of the book that you can add to Where there are resources available for faculty to you know to try in their own classrooms and also add resources or, uh, you know strategies that have both in their own classroom and I think by you know contributing to this Body and we're all helping each other and we're keeping the conversation going Well, thank you. Thank you. And again, I'll link to I'll link to the book that you two authored is there on the bottom left of the screen Thank you. Thank you both. Please keep up the terrific work. Keep going and we'd love to see you again down the road Thank you, Brian. And thank you everybody We joined us this in conversation. We learned a lot from you and your questions and and the very very active chat That I've been trying to follow as you could talk to you all Well, our pleasure our pleasure. Thank you. But don't go away friends Let me just point out where we're headed over the next few weeks if you'd like to keep talking about these issues Everything from the big picture of politics and institutional change down to individual classroom transformation We're on twitter very actively. So just use the hashtag FTTE or on twitter tweet at me brian alexander or at shindig events My blog is also a place for this kind of conversation. Just go to brian alexander.org If you'd like to look into our previous sessions on everything from teaching in general institutional change to teaching inclusivity and supporting Marginalized populations. Just take a look at our previous sessions tinyurl.com slash ftf archive If you'd like to discuss this in other topics and see where else we're headed as we think about the future of higher ed Go to forum.futureeducation.us and see some of the topics that have coming up everything from paradigm project public higher ed Free speech diversity in the climate crisis And if you'd like to share your work on these topics or other topics and you want me to celebrate them Before the entire audience just send me a note brian alexander gmail.com. I'd be glad to celebrate with you And with you is the key thing. I've been delighted to be thinking about this with all of you together Thank you for being so generous all of you with your opinions your experience your good questions All the information you shared. Please continue to enjoy a safe summer I hope you stay cool for in the northern hemisphere and have you stay warm if you are in the southern And above all take care of yourself and be safe. We'll see you online next time Bye. Bye