 Hi, welcome to Issues and Answers, a production of the Government Information Service and the National Television Network. I am Miguel Fabrié, communications officer within the Department of Infrastructure, Ports and Transport. And with me today is Mr. Schanger, the Chief Electrical Engineer in the Department of Infrastructure, Ports and Transport. Mr. Scher, this welcome. And this is our second time meeting today, meeting on this program. The first time we spoke, we spoke about the street lights, the traffic lights on St. Lucia and some of the issues that we're facing, whether it be driver error and the whole operation of the traffic lights. But today we're here to discuss a different type of lighting and that is a street lighting project which is ongoing on St. Lucia. So once again, welcome Mr. Scher and welcome to Issues and Answers. Thank you very much, Miguel. It's a pleasure to be here. Before we get into the ongoing project, Shane, let's just speak to the process by which we apply for street lights in a particular area. Well, as you know, there are many places in St. Lucia where you find that there are street lights that are missing, where basically you find that there are the areas of darkness in St. Lucia. Now, when situations like that arise, usually they are brought to our attention by the general public, right? And there are multiple ways that they can do that. First of all, right? They can simply come into our offices. There is a form there that they can just fill out, right? Obviously that form must have certain information, for example, the area, a contact number if we have to reach the person, and very importantly, a pool number. Also, there's a second way that they can also do it. There is an email address, electricalcomplaints.govt.lc, right? That they can also send that same information that they would have placed on that form in our offices. They can just send us an email with all the necessary information. Now, in a situation where a street light is existing but isn't working, right? They can also go to kled.lc, and there is a map there. If on that map they can locate the street light, they can just click on it. And basically, by clicking on it, it's going to inform us that there is a fault on the street light, whether it is not working, it is flashing or whatever it is. We'll get our information, and then we can address whatever needs to be addressed. Let's just get that addressed once again so maybe we can have it on screen. It's complaints. Electrical.complaints.govt.lc. Now, you didn't mention kled. Let's just get to that web address again. kled.lc. The latter day is for situations where there is a light, right? But the light is faulty. Whether the light is there, it's not working or it's flashing or it's basically blinking, as people prefer to call it. In a situation like that, they can just go to kled.lc. If they can locate that light on the map, there is a map. If they can locate the light on the map, they just click on it, and by clicking on it, it's going to send us a fault report, and then we can address whatever issue that it has. And kled, obviously, is the company that's currently undergoing... Engaged, yeah. The company that is currently engaged in executing the street light retrofit project. Okay. Are there situations where a request for a street light may not be approved by the Ministry of Infrastructure? Yeah. This is... We have had situations where we have had to reject certain applications for street lighting. But this happens on very rare occasions, right? You find that on some occasions, right? If we receive an application for a street light, right? Especially a new street light. And we go to the area, right? And we find that there are street lights there already that exist in. And the primary purpose, right, of this application is to light up some bodies. Let's see some bodies backyard. Right? We mostly, on some occasions, we are going to reject such an application. Because as the name suggests, right? Street light is for the street. Right? And not necessarily to light up some bodies. For public infrastructure. For public road infrastructure. Public infrastructure, exactly. Okay. You said that... So you're saying that there are people who may request for their backyard. How do we get many of those requests for personal lighting? It is not a lot. But you might... You find it on some occasions. For example, I'll give you an... I'll elaborate on something there. There are places in St. Lucia, right? Where you go to, right? And you find that there is a track or a road, right? And obviously that light. And there's a pool right next to that track or road. There is a house next to that track. Now, obviously, logically, logic dictates that the light should be facing the track, should be right above the track, right? But for some strange reason, on some occasions, right? It is not on the track. It's facing the opposite direction, shining into some bodies yard. You understand? And on many occasions, the track itself is left in darkness. Now, situations like that, right? If it's a situation where somebody applies for street light what we try to do is to try to have that street light directed towards the street, right? So, therefore, the street light should be illuminating the street. And not the other direction, right? Where it's illuminating somebody's backyard. Now, speaking of illumination, we're going to move segue right into our ongoing project, which commenced in August of 2023. And that is the street light replacement project without having to say too much about it before you give your information where we are replacing the high pressure sodium lights with LED lights. Can you just brief us on the background of the project and where we are now? Well, to be honest, for our purposes here, we're simply going to refer to it as the street light retrofit project. Now, obviously, this is not all that's happening under this project. Obviously, as you know, we're also installing new lights and not just replacing them. Now, this project started in earnest. Although sometime in 2001, we had about 800 lights had already been installed in 2020. That's LED. LED lights had already been installed. Or the same kind, the same type. However, in earnest, that project started in late August. And to date, we have installed over 16,000 lights. Now, this is a process that is very fluid and it's ongoing. So to date, we have installed over 16,000 lights. Basically, we're replacing, along the highways in St. Lucia, we are replacing 250 high pressure sodium lamps with 75 watt KLED, should I say LED lights. So just to clarify, 250 watt. 250 watt. What? High pressure sodium. High pressure sodium lights. With 75 watt LED lights. And in the inner communities, the secondary roads, we are replacing 70 watt high pressure sodium lights with 21 watt LED lights. As a layman though, I would ask you what is the difference or maybe the savings in terms of usage between the 250 watt high pressure sodium and the 75 watt LED. Okay, I'm going to think about it in that way. What is the typical wattage of an iron at home? It's about, I'll say about 1.5 kilowatts, about 1,500 watts. Now, along the highways, with the high pressure sodium, with the high pressure sodium, 250 watt lights, right? We are looking at about six of these already, right? Only six of these lights will be quit to like an iron left for 12 hours per day, right? So therefore you get the pitch already. So replacing that with a 75 watt light, right? With a 75 watt LED light, which means that the savings is basically threefold. Additionally, with high pressure sodium lights, right? We have a situation where you can only basically get these lights to... As a matter of fact, that's the reason why they are called yellow lights, right? Because these lights basically are yellow. Now, this may not seem like a problem, but actually it is, because with these lights, right? It is more difficult in the night to tell the real color of an object that these lights are illuminating. However, with LED lights, right? And the temperature of the lights we are installing is about 5,000 feet, right? These are more daylight. Now, with these lights, right? They are better for security in that, right? Basically, if an orange object appears beneath lights like that, then you see the real color orange. However, with these high pressure sodium lights, right? Because of the fact that they are yellow, it is more difficult to make out the true color of an object. It is illuminated. Okay, so a blue item may appear green because of the mix of the yellow lights. Okay, now that said, moving from there, since we embarked on that project, in fact, before we even go into that, can you just tell us where we are in terms of how many lights we have on Island and how many lights we've replaced so far and the percentage as it relates to? Okay, so on Island, we have between 22,000 and 23,000 streetlights, right? Along the highways, we have about close to 4,000 lights. So therefore, initially, before the project even started, we had about roughly 3,500 of these 250-watt LED lights, right? And obviously, the remainder would be these 70-watt lights, right? Now, as I said earlier on, to date, we've replaced over 16,000 of them. We're talking there of about 2,500 with retrofitted so far, about 2,500 75-watt lights, which means that we've replaced the 250-watt high pressure sodium lights, and obviously, the remainder will be the 21-watt lights which we have replaced. Now, that is the first phase of the project. So basically, the first phase of the project is just a straight swap. So basically, replacing the 250-watt with the 75 and replacing the 70-watt with the 21. In the second phase of the project, that is when we are going to start installing new lights. Now, when do we expect to finish with this first phase of the project? That first phase of the project will come to an end. I'm almost certain that it's going to come to an end by the end of the month, by the end of January. End of January, 2024. Yes. Okay, now the second phase. The second phase is important because since we embarked on this project, we've got numerous complaints whether it be through talk shows, people coming into the ministry, which has been increasing over the past few months, coming into the ministry, particularly electrical departments, regarding the illumination and how much illumination they get from the new lights as opposed to the high-pressure sodium. Can we speak to that issue? You're saying that the LEDs are not as bright as the high-pressure sodium. Well, to be honest with you, I wouldn't describe the LEDs as not being as bright. Here's the issue. You see, with high-pressure sodium lamps, right, what they tend to do is to project light outwards at a 360-degree angle. So therefore, with high-pressure sodium lights, when you have a high-pressure sodium light at a particular location, especially at the height at which they're installed, they project light all around. However, that is not the case with LED lights. With LED lights, the angle of illumination you're going to use is about 180 degrees, which means that these lights are more directional, right? Now, dark spots in the solution have always existed. However, with the fact that LED lights are more directional, these dark spots are now more pronounced, right? Now, in the second phase of the project, what we intend to do is to treat these dark spots. So in certain situations, you find that they are dark spots that are usually brought about either by a corner beam between two poles that are illuminated, or secondly, you find that on some occasions, the poles are distant. So therefore, you find a dark spot in between them. Now, we are going to address all the situations when they arise. So that would involve basically installing new poles where it is necessary, right? Or basically putting a light between two lights that exist presently. Okay, we're about to head into a break, but we will continue this discussion as it relates to the dark spots when we come back. You are watching issues and answers. Miguel February, the Department of Infrastructure and Transport Communications Officer, and with me is Mr. Shane Shear, the Chief Electrical Engineer at the DIBT. We'll be back in a minute. Hello ECS. Yo, ECS. This is your ocean. If I am to protect your future, we have to work together. It's the time to work together. If I am to protect your future, one science to be so pure. Hello ECS. Green actions. Welcome back to Issues and Answers with me, Miguel February, the Communications Officer within the Department of Infrastructure, Ports and Transport. And again with me is Mr. Shane Shear, the Chief Electrical Engineer. And we're just going to pick up from where we left off as it relates to addressing those dark spots following the replacement of those high pressure sodium lights with LEDs. And just to reiterate, how are we going to address those dark spots which currently exist following the installation of those lights? Yeah, so I was saying basically, these dark spots, they've always existed. However, it's a situation where they are more pronounced now that we've installed LED lights that are more directional. And we intend to address these dark spots by putting up additional LED lights where these spots arise. But I've also heard concerns where people are saying that, then why is it that we are removing a light, a high pressure sodium light which basically gives light at a 360 degree angle and replacing them with lower wattage LED lights when we do know that we're going to have to install more. I'd like to address this point by simply saying that we're comparing here a 70 watt light, a 70 watt high pressure sodium light to a 21 watt LED light. And we're also comparing a 250 watt high pressure sodium light to a 75 watt LED light. So even if we had to double the number of lights we have in St. Lucia, we would still find ourselves in a situation where... It's about 60% the usage of one light. So therefore we still find ourselves in a situation where the savings would be enormous both in terms of greenhouse gas emissions and obviously financially. Additionally, we have other issues with high pressure sodium lights also. These are lights that generally the world is trying to get rid of for the simple reason that they contain toxic harmful substances and especially we're talking there of mercury because we have to understand how these lights work. Basically these are discharge lamps, these are discharge lights and as the name suggests, right? These are... where basically you find sodium in a gas state mixed with, should I say, amalgamated with mercury. So therefore all these discharge lamps from the fluorescent you use at home to the high pressure sodium light you find under all these things contain toxic substances, unlike the LEDs that we're installing. Okay, in terms of the percentage, or maybe you could give a figure, an actual figure, how many more lights do we intend to install following this first phase of the project? We intend to install, after the initial phase of the project, as I said, we're going to begin the installation of... As a matter of fact, we have started inserting parts in certain areas. For example, along the highway between Denver and Vuford, we have already commenced the installation of new lighting along that area, also in the Grosilli area. And we intend to install an additional, let's say, 2,000 lights to address the situations in the dark spots. And we believe, based on the complaints that we have received, we believe that that is going to be sufficient to address all the dark spots that we have on Island. But obviously, we have the lighting storage, so as the need arises, we're going to address them as the complaints come along. Okay, so members of the public, obviously, once we've done with this second phase, if there are any areas where dark spots are located... We're going to address these. All they need to do is come to the Ministry, file a complaint... Or the same email address that I mentioned at the beginning, electrical.complaints.govt.lc. I think it's important to note that this second phase, it involves our staff and the KLE, our contractors, working at night just to have to observe those spots. So it's not just a process of we figure that they may not be sufficient. We actually go on site at night after hours. Here's what happens, right? We have our personnel on the ground. So therefore, what usually happens after lights have been retrofitted in a particular area, right? When the sun sets, these people, these hard-working individuals, what they do, they drive through the area and take note as to where all the dark spots are. So most of the dark spots that we are receiving... Most of the complaints concerning dark spots that we are receiving, we are already aware of them. And as I said, we are going to address them. Okay, before we get to the next point on that, actually we haven't spoken about the savings that we've been able to amass so far since we started this project in August. Can you speak to that? Okay, well, as I mentioned earlier on, right, we've installed so far about 16,000 lights. However, we have not... The last calculations we have, right, is for the period basically ending on December 31, 2023. And based on the last figures that I have, right, we are realizing a saving of $377,000 on a monthly basis. That's a little... That's well over a quarter million dollars a month. Absolutely. So we're looking at in two months, three months, three months we can save a million dollars. So basically we are looking there as we continue replacing these high-precious sodium lamps, right? And we're going to continue to gradually be seeing an increase in the savings. Wow. I'm trying to do the calculations in my head. If we look at $350,000 by two months, that's $700,000 already. Absolutely. So for four months it's $1.4 million? Absolutely. Wow. That's by four by three. Four, three, 12. So we have about $5,000,000 saved a year. But as I mentioned earlier on, it is not just financial, right? The savings are not just financial. Because as we know right now, we also have certain goals in St. Lucia, right? Sustainable development goals. Exactly. We sign on to. Exactly. We can involve the reduction of greenhouse gases and so on and so forth. Let me give you a typical example, right? Street lighting, right? For countries like St. Lucia, which cannot be considered metropolitan in any way, right? Far from. Street lighting accounts for about 10% of total energy consumption in St. Lucia. Now this does not seem like a lot. In metropolitan countries, right? It may not seem like a lot. But for a country like St. Lucia, that is quite a bit. When a government has to pay for this a lot, we could be using that money for other means, our security and all that matter. Exactly. Now another issue, and of course, part of this job is paying attention to the talk shows social media and all the criticisms that come our way as a department of infrastructure. And one of the suggestions or the questions is why have we not gone solar, gone LED instead of skipping it? Why have we not skipped the LED part, just gone solar, which it is believed would save us more in the long run over time? Any reason why we have not chosen the solar aspect, solar lighting as opposed to LEDs? You see, presently as it stands, right? Solar lighting is a very good idea. But it is more, it is something that you would look at or you would implement if you are looking at smaller scale projects. Because what we do have to understand is that with solar energy, street lights do not work during the day, right? So basically, when the sun is out, you do not need these street lights. You need these street lights during the night. So basically, you need these street lights when the sun is not up. So the question to ask yourself is you have to capture this solar energy during the day, right? And release them at night. So therefore, you have to store them in batteries. Batteries are not cheap. So basically, it speaks to the high initial investment involved, right? In the installation of solar lights. Because you are not just looking at the light there. The most important part of it is the storage component basically, which is the batteries. Batteries are not cheap. Secondly, right? Solar lights, they do have the disadvantage. It is not an uncommon thing in St. Lucia for the sun to not be fully out, right? For weeks at a time. Especially when you come in towards the end of the year, like September, October, where the days start getting shorter, right? And you might find that they are weeks sometimes for elongated periods of time. But it has always been for cloud. Now to get a battery fully charged, right? You require a situation where you need a certain amount of solar power to be hitting that solar panel, right? Are we going to achieve this thing? Are we going to keep that battery charged to the level required there, right? To give us light every night when the sun is not fully out. I don't think so. You might find that you come across a situation where during what we referred to as the summer, the dry season, right? These lights are working perfectly. However, during the rainy season, when the sun is out a bit less, right? That there are certain nights where you would have lights, street lights in St. Lucia at all. Unless, of course, you choose to go for a hybrid process. A hybrid system that uses both electricity and solar. But I mentioned earlier on the initial costs, the initial investment involved in installing solar lights, right? Where you have the battery component, the other battery component which also exists is not a cheap investment. And the summer months are also the rainy months as well. And with climate change now, we really can't tell when we're going to get some and when we're going to get rain. Absolutely. More or less to end this discussion, we have another component with the street lighting project and that is the installation of new lights which we spoke of in regard in certain areas. And there are areas where we need to install low-tension lines. Can you tell us more about that? Okay. So you find that there are certain areas in St. Lucia where we've never had street lights. So basically, we've never had high-precious sodium lights. We've never had LED. I can mention a few of them. There's the Windward Road in Capestit. There's also a large section between Belvedere countries and Kachime. And you would know that that's your area so you wouldn't be traveling there often. So I'm aware that this area exists. And also, as we go around Ireland, during the implementation of super vision of that project, we also notice that the other small sections in St. Lucia where there are no street lights. And the reason why all these areas do not have street lights is because there's no low-tension. You see, electricity in St. Lucia is transmitted at 66,000 volts. Now, that's not very important for this purpose. They're distributed as 11 kV. Although you may see poles in that area and you may see these lines running. These lines travels in the island. Somewhat, they may be at... In these areas I'm talking about, the other Windward Road along the West Coast Road, you have the 11 kV line that travels the island, that area of St. Lucia. However, street lights operate at 240 volts. And that's what we refer to as low-tension. So 11 kV is high-tension. So 240 volts required by these lights do not exist presently. So for them to deal with that situation, we'll be in conversation with Lucia. And the intention is to have Lucia installed low-tension in all these areas so that we can have the electricity required to energize these lights. So as soon as that part of the project is done, street lights are going to be popping up in the Windward Road, as I mentioned, and also the Belvedere-Kachim area. And as I mentioned, there are all the areas in St. Lucia also that are like that. All of them are going to be addressed. We have just about two minutes to go, but just from a layman's perspective for clarification, the 11 kV lines which are the high-tension, what exactly are they used for to power? What do they power or can you just let us know? You see, I think the proper question is why do we have high-tension at all? Now, obviously, there's very little to do with street lighting. I still believe that it should be explained. You see, it is better to transmit electricity, right? Over large distances at higher voltage and lower currents. I believe that the further it goes, the less currents or the less voltage you have. So that's the reason of these high-tension lines. Now, obviously, because they cannot be utilized, most equipment, you find most equipment, three-phase equipment will be at 415. Single-phase equipment will be at 240. So basically you need electricity in your home at 240. So you're going to take that distribution line now at 11 kV and reduce it via transformer to 240 and then distribute it over short distances to residential buildings at 240. I think we've covered basically everything regarding the street lights for today, but I think there's more we have to discuss in the future. I'm talking about even wiring for homes, certain things that are people that residents will have to look to and things that you need to know. Shane, once again, it's wonderful having you here. I think it was very enlightening for me and I hope the public can get some of what I was able to pick at. I'm sure they did. You explained very, very skillfully. Once again, thank you for joining us here for Issues and Answers. I am Miguel Fabrié, communications officer within the Department of Infrastructure, Ports and Transport. And with me was Mr. Shane Zhe, the chief electrical engineer. This is our second discussion and I'm sure there will be many more to come. Like I said, we have other things to discuss as it relates to electricity on island and your houses and wiring and everything. But for now, we'll say goodbye and see you soon. Thanks for tuning in to Issues and Answers.