 So welcome and thank you for joining us again for China is not our enemy. And I'm very excited for this guest we have today. Because, you know, as we've been looking at the situation with the, you know, US pushing this war on China. We're not listening to the voices that are at the front lines of this war. And we've talked about how Asian Americans in the United States have been the first casualties. But today we get to look at surrounding what surrounding China and how they're already paying the price. And also just the anxiety that brings, you know, after the United States has experienced something like 911 to terrorize other people to wave war in front of their faces is bad behavior. And it's not good for those people who are in Asia that look at a pending war on China as something that will affect all of them. So I'm excited today to have say, oh, Saruta with us. She's one of the founding members and the director of the new diplomacy initiative, a Tokyo based thinking for issues around diplomacy. So I'm so happy because at code pink, we know how important diplomacy is. After she graduated from a city university. She joined an NGO which included helping out in a refugee camp in Tanzania. So she, after passing the bar exam in Japan in 2002, she specialized in international human rights law and received her masters from Columbia University Law School and practiced in New York in 2009. In 2012, she received her second master's degree in international relations from the American University in Washington DC. She was just telling me where she she got to know Colonel and right. One of our superstars that could pink. So now she's working on us Japan diplomacy, and happy that she's been able to join us today to talk about what are the issues. If you're looking at this war from the space of Japan. Okinawa those places around China. What, what do you see, and also the issue of two nuclear powers. This is, this is frightening for us around the world but what is it like when you're right next door. So first, CEO, thank you for being with us and why don't you start by telling our audience why you founded director, the new diplomacy initiative and what are your goals there. Thank you very much for this great opportunity. I'm very honored to be with you today, Judy. And thank you also, you know, for you a very good question about why I founded the organization called new diplomacy initiative. And also, I actually just, you know, came back from Washington DC, but why I would like to go to Washington DC very often, even after my graduation from my master program, you know, I went back to Japan, I moved back to Japan, but I go to Washington DC very often. And what I'm doing there is, I think, now the diplomacy is just occupied by the people who have a very, you know, strong power in the government, and also who don't have a chance to listen to voice from grassroots people in Japan. Maybe in the United States, as ever, but in my case, I'm really afraid of that, you know, so many diversity of voices exist in Japan, like the voice from Hiroshima, like the voice from Okinawa, like the voice from, you know, voices from Fukushima, but these voices are not hard, not blow to the United States at all from Japan. But, you know, we are the United States and Japan are the country of democracy, but, you know, our voices are not, you know, reflected at all into the real diplomatic policies, which US and Japan to governments are deciding every day, every day. So, I would like to bring these voices from Japan to the United States to, you know, it's maybe not very easy, it takes maybe long, long, long time, but try to at least, you know, or let them understand, let them means, you know, the decision makers of the United States are lawmakers or government officers to understand what we Japanese people really think. Even the voices of the Japanese government is saying this thing, but, you know, people in Japan have sometimes very often have different voices, which Japanese government even doesn't want to bring to the United States. That's why, you know, that is my, you know, that is, you know, because of my experience as a student of master, master courses in Washington DC. And then, you know, oh my gosh, in this city, nobody is trying to carry the voices from Bukinan people, from Fukushima people. So, you know, why not me, we should do that. Then I established the organization called New Jersey Initiative. Then, you know, when to go to Washington DC very often, sometimes only by myself, sometimes with a diamond members, sometimes even former prime minister, Hatoyama, I went there together with him, like arranging the meetings for him and the counterpart in the United States. And that's what I want to do. And that's what, you know, I want to do, try to bring more voices to change the better diplomatic policies in the United States and also, of course, in Japan. Well, that's impressive. Thank you so much. Yes, because as you said, the people don't always agree with the government. So what are the people thinking right now, as we're watching Japan cozy up to the United States and become, as we know, fodder in this war on China. We look at the patterns of the United States, and they promise a lot, don't deliver anything and use countries and people on the way to their goal. And how is that being seen in Japan? I think the, you know, diplomatic channels are very, very narrow. I think everywhere in the world. So only voice from the United States to Japan is, you know, we have to be very tough on China, tough on China. So whenever, you know, the select committee on China in the House of Representatives, the United States decide something very strong or tough on China, that is the only voice from the United States. Then that really scares us a lot actually. Maybe the Japanese government hesitates to set up to the United States Congress or to the United States government because the United States and Japan are the allies each year. So it's not very easy for the Japanese government to make a complaint, to complain about something which the United States decides. But, you know, I said, you know, it scares us. It is because, you know, we have lots of people who live very close to, live in the area which is very close to Taiwan Strait, where, you know, there might be, you know, real or military clash, you know, happens very near future. So people are really afraid of, you know, seeing how the war is happening, or even, you know, people have to be involved in the war as victims of the war. So, you know, whenever we hear something, you know, new comes from the, especially the committee or the Congress, you know, which is very, you know, strong voice, you know, to be tough on China. We think, I understand it, you know, there are so many problems over China, you know, I think, you know, human rights situation should be improved in China, you know, diplomacy should be, you know, you know, at least, you know, gradually, gradually, gradually implemented in China. But, you know, that's not the right way to do, even if you do that, China will not change. That's not the, you know, way to try to, you know, improve the people's lives in China. Then, you know, only the things you're doing is to just escalate the tension between two countries. Please don't do that, you know, that's a feeling of us, the Japanese, you know, civil society. And so, do you have a map that you kind of show our listeners what, what that relationship is between. Great. So there we are. We can see Beijing and Shanghai to the side of them we see Taiwan. Right there. So that's right there and you can see where Japan is from there, and then also Okinawa. Can you talk to us about Okinawa, which is now part of Japan. And, you know, kind of the situation with Okinawa, which is a beautiful place with a beautiful history, and the Indigenous people that have lived there have suffered a lot through wars. And what is the situation for them right now? Thank you very much for the quick question. Actually, the, as you know, Okinawa has a lot of US bases. You see the orange map here in the left side of this, you know, screen that there is a long island called Okinawa. The blue shape is the Okinawa island. But there is a part, parts colored with red. That is the place where the US base is occupying actually, the Okinawa land. That is almost 15% of the Okinawa land. And, you know, if we have only US bases in Okinawa, then without any problems, that is okay. I think, you know, maybe I shouldn't say that, but that's okay. Okinawa people, for a long time, trying to get along with US military officers, military, you know, service men in Okinawa. But, you know, very often, you know, there are rape cases and murder cases occur in Okinawa, as well as a helicopter class, where aircraft sometimes, you know, drops, drops the window frame, you know, which is like seven kilograms, which is, which, you know, dropped into the playground of, you know, elementary school kind of instance, always happens. Then, you know, even if there is a very severe crime committed, you know, we cannot bring the case to the court because of the so far, the status of forces agreement. So we Japanese are not allowed, you know, on certain conditions cannot bring these, you know, cases to the court in Japan. So, you know, people in Okinawa very suffered from the very huge military presence in over the United States. Yes, you know, I can talk about Okinawa's issues, you know, for maybe like one day or two days, but you know, now we are talking about China and the United States. So in the context of, you know, context of competition between China and the United States, as you see in the map, this red, you know, islands are called Okinawa, you know, belong to the Okinaw prefecture, which is one of the 47 prefectures in Japan. Then, you know, these small dots, you can magnify it like this. You see the small islands here, you know, this is an island with people, you know, people live there. You can tell how close it is between Taiwan and these Okinawa islands. Even, you know, from the coast of the nearest island of Okinawa to Taiwan, you can see Taiwan from your, you know, from Okinawa. So, you know, fishermen sometimes cooperate with each other to fish, and, you know, long time ago, they cooperated with each other, you know, they did a very good amount of trade with each other and the cultural exchange a lot. So that's a relationship between Okinawan people and Taiwan people. But now, you know, as Okinawa has a lot of US military bases there, if something happened in Taiwan, I mean the military crash in Taiwan, military contingency in Taiwan, from where the United States will say, if the United States decides to send troops to Taiwan to help Taiwan people, that is actually not from the United States, continental United States, mainland United States, but it is, it will be from maybe not, you know, not only from Okinawa, but from Okinawa as well as other areas in Japan. Also, we have, like you say, the corner of this, you know, PDA, another base, other bases are also located in Japan. But the things I want to say is, if the United States decides to support Taiwan people by sending troops from Japan to, from the United States to Taiwan, that is not from the United States. That is from Japan. It means we will be, you know, retaliated by China, you know, maybe immediately after the United States decides to send troops from Japan to Taiwan, or maybe a few days later, you know, we have to be, you know, damaged by the attack from China. So now we really believe that. I mean, let's just hope that this never happens. I just want to start there. And, you know, the Chinese government is not going to attack Taiwan, because it's China, and China will not attack itself. So, but what we see happening is the US being provocative in the China seas. And that's where you're talking about, is where all that provocation is happening. So it's probably going to happen on the seas, not on the island of Taiwan, because that would, it would mean the United States would have to attack Taiwan, because China is not going to attack Taiwan, Taiwan is China. So, so what we see is all this provocation, provocation happening on the water, we see lots of US military ships surrounding Taiwan. So, and, you know, the US is preparing for war, which is a very dangerous situation when you prepare for war. It usually means war is inevitable. But what I'm, what I'm seeing is that Okinawa is right there in those waters where all this provocation will be happening. You know, I know you could talk a lot about Okinawa, but, you know, for our listeners, it's a, it's a beautiful pristine, you know, coral reefs and an fantastic wildlife and this is a place that's been used for war, not by the choice of the people who live on Okinawa, but it's really been occupied by the US military. Could you explain what a prefecture is for Japan? You know, so the US military basically occupies Okinawa, but it's part of Japan. If you could kind of explain that, you know, contradiction for us, that would be good. Yes, I just wanted to show, you know, how beautiful Okinawa is, but I cannot find the best picture where maybe you can insert the picture later. Yes, Okinawa is a very beautiful place and I think that you, I mean, if any listeners are going to get married, why don't you choose Okinawa as your destination for your honeymoon? I think that's the best way to go, I guess. Yeah, but yes, Okinawa was a kingdom for a long time until like 200 years ago. Then Japan annexed Okinawa, so they lost their own kingdom, then they are now losing their language and they are losing their cultures. Then, you know, as I told you, yes, Okinawa has a lot of US presence as a basis in their land, but that is because we Japanese lost the war during the Second World War. Then Okinawa battle was very, you know, infamous battle. Then, you know, one fourth of people, including American soldiers and of course Okinawan people, you know, had to die, you know, because of the very severe battle there. Then, you know, the outcome from the war is occupation by the United States until 1972, you know, since 1945. Then that was in the United States, it was a part of Japan, but occupied by the United States. Then during that time, the United States created a lot of bases, military bases, you know, which Japanese didn't have any chance to say anything because the occupation was done by the United States. Then in addition to that, the photos in front of you is the new construction plan right now going on. So, you know, for us, you know, for Americans, maybe the war ended, the Pacific war ended right after, I think, the August, you know, 1945. But for the Okinawan people, still the war is continuing kind of, you know, not the war itself, but, you know, they have to oppose the decision made by the mainland Japan and the United States, which the Okinawan people doesn't have any chance to say anything about. Then, you know, this, you know, plan is for new marine base in Okinawa, of course, for the United States marines, but then they have been, you know, strongly working, you know, to oppose the new construction for already like about 20 years. But when, while they are very busy opposing the new construction, now, you know, United States started a very massive military exercises with the United States, with Japan and other sometimes even European countries in the Okinawa. See, to data China, deterrence, deterrence, deterrence. That's the key word for all military exercises and this, you know, the base in front of you and, you know, other bases in Okinawa and also new missiles try to introduce into Okinawa. These, you know, I would say, you know, huge new installment of the military facilities, you know, always with excuse to deter China. But, you know, deterrence means to secure somebody else, right? But is Okinawa people are secured by these military actions? Actually, not. You know, maybe American people will be, you know, secured by the military presence in Japan. But maybe Tokyo, I'm now in Tokyo, so my life will be maybe protected by that. But, you know, Okinawa people are really afraid. If you decide to introduce me. Wait, wait, wait, wait, we cannot, we cannot say these things. Okay. Not no one is made secure by weapons and war. That doesn't make anyone secure. It just makes sense. So the fact that we can have this conversation or listen to people try to convince us that somehow all these weapons and these bases are going to protect anyone. I mean, ask the Okinawans about what happened during the war. No one like Okinawa was protected by those bases. They were killed because those bases were there. If there's a, I mean, if there's a war, what would be attacked? But the US bases that are closest to China. I mean, it literally is like putting the war on their front lawn. The fact is, you know, there's no, it's a lie. When, when there's an US military base on your island, you're the one that will be attacked and they know that from World War Two. And so what we're, and what you just said is very powerful that the war ended in 1945, but the war has not ended on the people in Okinawa. We know earlier about the rapes and about the murders and having absolutely no access to justice for what's happening to them is criminal. And so here we are on the front lines of this war that the US is pushing. And what you're saying is the people of Okinawa are already paying the price. And I know they have fought that base for a very, very long time. But you were showing me that a poll was done about how people in Japan feel about the US war on China. And, you know, we see Japan as an ally of the US. But yes, here, here's a public opinion poll. If you could tell us a little bit about this poll. Yes, you know, as I told you that the Japanese people are really afraid of the Taiwan Strait, possible Taiwan Strait war, this number shows that, you know, 80% of people are really concerned about war, and not only about the war itself, but also we have to be involved in the war. That's a feeling. If something happened there, that is very close to us, then we are recognized as allies of the ally of the United States. It means, and then also the Japanese government, you know, even vice prime minister said, we are ready to fight against the fight in the war. I don't think they said that. He said that, like, you know, just 10 days ago. So, you know, government says that, but we are really concerned. We are not very happy about, you know, to be involved in the war, which is not the war of us, which is, you know, of course, the war shouldn't be, you know, of anybody, but definitely it's not the war of us. We will not start the war, but why do we have to get involved in the war? That's a feeling of us. That's the first public poll. Then, second one is kind of shocking, shocking not only to the Japanese government, but shocking to the American government as well, I think. This says, you know, 75 or almost 75% of Japanese people disagree to send Japanese self-defense force, I mean troops of Japan, send Japanese troops to Taiwan to, you know, help American forces. You know, the vice prime minister of Japan said, we are ready to send troops to Taiwan to help American people, American government, then American officers usually said, you know, if, you know, Japanese government will help us to fight against China, that would be very helpful. Like, you know, these are conversations between two governments. I mean, I think that's because the people of Japan can look at the people of Ukraine. You know, the US pushing the war on the Ukrainians, promising weapons, telling them they'll have their back, they're pushing NATO, they're pushing this war that ends up to be, you know, Russia bombing Ukraine, but who's dying? The Ukrainians are dying and they're on the front lines, you know, we've just heard that there's 200% casualty rate on this, in this war, and there's no US soldiers are dying. Let's just look at, you know, this is, you know, US generals have said this is a proxy war on Russia, and that they're not ending, they won't go to the diplomacy table until they've defeated Russia. But they are doing this war with Ukrainian soldiers. There's no, you know, very few American soldiers over there. There are mostly Ukrainian soldiers and Ukrainian civilians who are being put on the front lines and slaughtered. So of course, I would understand the Japanese people having watched what's happening in Ukraine, the very concerned about what could happen to them in the US war on China. I thank you so much for showing us these numbers. There are greater numbers than what we see, you know, in the United States. And like you said earlier, like why you started the new diplomacy initiative is that we're not listening to the voices that are on the front lines of this possible war. And thank you for raising this up because I think these are voices we should be hearing. Also, I wanted to ask you, you know, this is two nuclear powers. This is the end where, you know, we live in a time where all we should be thinking about, especially after this horrible summer of so much devastation and heat and flooding. We all should be cooperating on climate change. Instead, we're still hearing the drumbeats of war that would be two nuclear powers. And, you know, you're from Japan, you have suffered the unthinkable. I would assume that that's one of the great fears that must be in the hearts of those from Japan around this confrontation. Yes. The logic of the governments is always like, you know, extended the talents of nuclear weapons. So in order to have, you know, peace in their words, peace, we have to have nuclear weapons, nuclear umbrellas to keep us safe. But, you know, we have experience of Hiroshima and Nagasaki in Japan, then once, you know, it was used, it is used, nobody can survive anymore. Not only nobody, but this globe will, you know, be devastated just at all. So, you know, threats to use nuclear, data means to use the threat of nuclear weapons, right? Otherwise, it cannot deter anybody. So we cannot rely on the power of nuclear weapons anymore. That's what we learned already. Almost 80 years ago, that is 80, almost 80 years ago, 78 years ago. So, so I'm very frustrated to see the outcome of the G7 Hiroshima summit. You know, this G7 countries prime minister and president wanted to use the name Hiroshima to show, you know, how they are cooperating each other. But, you know, with the name of Hiroshima, they said, you know, the talents by nuclear weapons is very important. It, you know, actually triggered the anger of Hiroshima survivors, atomic bomb survivors and Nagasaki survivors. So don't use nuclear weapons as an excuse, you know, for peace. You know, it's not going to make any peace at all. So we have to understand that, you know, from our experience. You know, it's not because of the American people's fault. You know, maybe some of them, but the Japanese government always say, we have to do that in order to make the better world. We have to have the nuclear umbrella, you know, for now. They always say, for now we need it. Now we have to have it. But when you can say that we don't need it, you know. Now is the time to do it. That's what I'm going to say. Thank you. Thank you. And I think with this film, Oppenheimer out right now, where it's finally being talked about that those two bombs were unnecessarily dropped by a brutal US president who was just trying to flex a muscle at Stalin and with the costing the lives, the innocent lives of those people who lived in Nagasaki and Hiroshima is criminal. But, you know, there's no one being held accountable. And instead we have to get rid of these horrible weapons that really are, you know, a dark shadow over all of our heads. And as you said, if they're used, it, it's a nuclear winter and we won't be surviving that. So, yes. I wonder if there's any other issues that you want to discuss with our audience from the viewpoint of Japan sitting very next to, you know, what the US is pushing. Thank you for asking. The United States is, you know, very important country after this super power in the world. So I go to the Washington DC, then try to meet with, you know, high rank officials or, you know, senators and congressman with not only by me, but by me, but we, you know, say like a former prime minister or, you know, minister or that members, but it's not very easy to work together with American people. You know, always they said we are very busy. And also, you know, we have, you know, in Japan is a very important country, but still there are so many things we have to work on. So the things I'm going to say is it's not very easy to work together with American people. But I understand the United I like United States very much. That's why I live in the United States. I have lots of, you know, great friends, you know, who try to change the world towards the better, better future. So I really respect that. But I think, you know, we have to work together internationally. Otherwise, we cannot change the world anymore. So international solidarity is very important. So, you know, it's not very easy to work together with somebody who don't speak very good English or who don't understand the culture, but we have to work together. Yeah, that's it. Please. And I think the people who watch this, you know, listen to this interview already understand it. So there is no meaning to tell that to you. But still, you know, international, you know, cooperation is the, you know, only things we can change the by which we can change the world. Please, you know, consider that even more than now. That's what I want to say. Well, that was beautiful. What a great sentiment to leave on because it is international solidarity that we need for the people and for the planet, that there's no greater contributor to climate change than war. And so let us be cooperating, especially in this moment in history. Thank you so much for all you do. And thanks for sharing your voice with us today. Yes to diplomacy. Yes to cooperation. And I just celebrate your work. Thank you so much. Thank you very, very much.