 This is the House Education Committee in the Vermont House of Representatives. We have a couple of things to do today. First, I just wanted to give you an update on our discussion about district budgets, and then we will take up a bill to delay Act 173, which will be in the House tomorrow. So just as people know, the Senate has come forward with a plan to provide a default budget should a district be unable to pass a budget. Their default budgets would be to adopt last year's budget, the 2020 budget, and then they can continue to vote. We had worked on another option, we are continuing to work on that option, but at the moment our discussions, because we have an agreement that given the challenges of remote voting, we are looking to have agreement between the two bodies, between our two committees before we bring something to the floor, and that's primarily due to the complexity of trying to deal with a vote with 150 people voting remotely. So we are continuing those conversations. I don't have a plan forward yet, is what I would say. So are there any questions on that? Before we go on, I realize we have two members of the House Ways and Means Committee in the room and wanted to see if you had any questions or thoughts. I've got to get my link up here. I see George tell you have a question. Yes, thank you. I'm wondering, is there progress with the Senate, you know, the House plan makes so much more sense than the Senate plan. I'm just wondering where the holdups coming in terms of, you know, coming to some agreement. Yeah, at the moment, the Senate has not been interested in looking at, by the last conversation, was not interested in an alternative proposal. They, and I'm, please, Jim, step in if I'm misrepresenting this, but my understanding is what they like about their proposal is that they at least have a past budget, which is last year's budget, so that they like the fact that people have actually voted on something. So that's why they prefer their approach, the approach that we've been discussing in the House. Is that accurate, Jim? And am I reflecting? Am I reflecting there? I haven't had those conversations with Tim Ferriss. I'm not sure exactly what his rationale is. Okay. That was, that was my understanding. Ours was approach has been looking more at what we can do to stabilize these communities in a time where voting is far more complicated and our concern is it's putting them in a different class of moving forward, they're definitely functioning farther behind than the districts that actually had an opportunity to pass the budget. I realize that that doesn't really clarify anything. There's still some hope that we might be able to get some movement, but they're working on that. Sarita, Austin. I'm wondering if the Senate and our committee agree on the 4% inflator over the last year, that's really important to me because it sounded like it was really important to the people, the stakeholders who testified last week. When I observed the Senate committee, they had rejected that. I don't know if there's still flexibility on that, but they rejected that at the time. Thank you. Okay. Anybody else? So that's, that's where we are at this point. Thank you. So with that, we will move on to the next issue, which is the delay to Act 173, and where this stands right now is that past the Senate, it's been messaged over. It will be sent to our committee tomorrow. We will vote on it tomorrow. What I want to do is do kind of a straw poll today. I think we've kind of done one, but I want to just make sure that we're okay. And then we will vote on it tomorrow, and then Representative Coopily will be presenting it on the floor. So with that, Jim, could you update us where we are with, it's Act 173 that has a number, what's the number, 363? Yeah, sure. So it's the record, Jim, Dan, where there's console. I think that's all here. Hold on. Kate, could I interrupt for just a quick second? Yes, please. It's just a technological thing. I don't, I was just on the streaming site and I don't see that this is in fact streaming. It says it's, it says it's live on YouTube. Okay. Yeah, I don't see it, but it could be a technical issue on my side. Yeah. Because I'm having a lot of freeze ups here. All right, thank you. Yeah, I can't. I think it's not really working right. I mean, I can't. I can't see anybody. Okay. Well, I on my, my screen, I've got that we are live on YouTube. Right, but I'm on YouTube and it's not showing up. It's, I know it's delayed. Yes, you usually not this far delayed. Okay. I think we got some kind of malfunction going on. Now it is up. Let's see if it's looking. Yeah, it's fine. The audio is coming through fine. It looks like, but the video is having some trouble, which I think we're probably all experiencing. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. I'm, I'm doing fine here. I can see everybody and I can hear everybody. I'm not sure if the thing does say live on, on YouTube. So I do believe we're live. We are taking up. Is it S363? Is that what the number is, Jim? S. 3. 3. S3 43. And this is the bill that we've been talking about in our committee related to delaying implementation of ACLA and 73. It has passed the Senate. It has passed the Senate. It has passed the Senate. So if it's going to make to us. We will, it will be in our committee. The center of committee tomorrow. My intention is for us to vote on it. And send it back and representative Cougar. He will. Present it on the floor. So Jim. Demaray. Can you present the bill? Yeah. So we need to open the bill up to people to see it. We have been through this bill numerous times and the last time we went through it, you heard testimony from John Carroll, Chair of the State Board of Education. He wanted some changes made to some of the rulemaking timing. So that's how it included in this bill. And also to give the advisory group one more year of life. It's now in this bill as well. So let's go to the sections that you haven't seen. We can go back and review more if you want, but we haven't seen, we can go to page five, section four. Yeah, just a little higher there, if you could. Right there, perfect, okay. So this is amending Act 173, which created the Census-based Funding Advisory Group. And what it does is it extends the life of the group. It was going to cease on June 30, 2022. Now it's June 30, 2023. And if you scroll down further, you'll see that the number of meetings they can have in any fiscal year has been increased from eight meetings to 12 meetings because I understand they've run out of meetings in the last year that would be compensated. So they now have 12 meetings for which they would receive compensation per year. Therefore the appropriation goes up from $5,376 to $9,018 per year. So that's what that section does. If we can scroll down, Avery to page seven, section nine, right by the page. Impassionation, okay, great. So a couple of things here. The State Board mentioned that they have the update towards rule series 2200, which is the series that deals with approved independent schools. And I'm sorry, let me go to B first. B first and then A, B first. He mentioned that the State Board of Education rule series 1320, 360, which are the ones that would implement the census grant are out for public comment. And that comment period would expire this summer and he wanted to extend that period until the end of the year, given the state of emergency. So B extends the comment period until the end of the year and adjust the other timelines accordingly under the Administrative Procedures Act. And then A, there was no date in Act 173 by which the State Board had to initiate rulemaking for approved independent schools. And remember that Act 173, in addition to changing funding from the reimbursement to census grant also a separate part of it, which required approved independent schools to enroll students on IEP if the Supervisory Union for that student recommends it. But there's no date by which the rulemaking had to be done. So if you would like to have rulemaking initiated on before June 30th, 2021, and that's what this one does. And then if you scroll up a little bit, a brief section eight, and we're going to have I order, scroll up a little bit higher, right here. In Act 173, there was a small piece of law that required the State Board adopt, review and update its rules for independent schools in order to speed the process for getting approval in various specific special education categories. So you might recall that to be a couple of years ago that one of the issues that independent schools have or have with complying with new part of it is it takes too much time. If they're forced to take on a student who is on IEP, there are 13 disability categories under law and they have to be approved for that category. And the approval process was taken too long. So this was designed to have the State Board somehow get that process sped up so that they can actually do that. That date was November 1, 2020. It's now been moved to June 30th, 2021, which corresponds to the date we just went through in section nine when the State Board asked to basically update its rules for current independent schools. So those are the changes to those dates. So aside from those changes to dates, which really deal with rules, rulemaking, and the additional year for the census-based group, sorry, the advisory group, aside from that, the bill is the same as you saw last time. So unless there are questions over on the bill, that's all I had to say, but I'm happy to go through more, I'd like to. So Larry Kupley on mute, Larry. I have to get used to that mute button. Does this have to go to appropriations before it goes anywhere? Well, it does have a higher appropriation to it. So I'm not sure how they would deal with it in this time period, give them what's going on. But usually- So it's come to our committee tomorrow. We vote on it. I can't see it going anywhere until it goes through appropriations if I'm not mistaken. Kate, any- I have sent that language to our contact in appropriations. I will follow up with them on that plan, whether it's going to need to go to them afterwards. They are aware that there's an appropriation in it. Okay, thank you. Stephen Austin. I'm just wondering about the public comment time. Is there a way remotely that the public, I mean, I'm sure there is. I'm just curious what it is, how the public will provide input remotely? Yeah, I'm not sure how that will work actually, but Boston, right now he's concerned because he can't really comment at this point, obviously. I think he's thinking that as your progresses, there'll be more chance for people to meet and make comments or not, but that's who knows, I guess, is the answer. Okay, the members of the board come from some pretty varied experience as well, representing groups that have an interest in this bill. This law. Mary Coopley, are you still there? Are you, your question got answered? Yeah, I'm fine. I should have put my hand down, I didn't. Yeah. Okay, so just looking at everybody then, just taking a straw poll, just raise your hand if you're comfortable with this bill as written. Raise your hand if you're comfortable with it. Is there anybody that is not comfortable with it? Okay. Okay, good. We will take a formal vote tomorrow on this. And so Kathleen, that will be you and have you got the arrangement on that? By tomorrow, I will have gotten the arrangement. Thank you. Do we have a scheduled time, Kate, that that will take place? I have to check that out with the clerk's office on how that will work. I'm not quite sure myself, but I will sort that out before tomorrow. So I see, we do have, so yes, Jim. What time is it to have some of the floor more? Is it nine o'clock? I think it's 1030, isn't it? Are we having a house meeting at 930? No. I've got 1030 tomorrow morning. Yes, 1030 and then again at one. So I'm assuming what we'll do is probably meet between shortly after the floor and take a formal vote and Avery and Kathleen will have it all figured out on how the voting works. And then I'll sort that whether it has to go to appropriations. Just it's a little confusing. The house calendar does say 9 a.m. but our Zoom invitation says 1030. So Kate, our committee vote will be after the first floor session. Yes, we have to have possession of the bill to actually vote on it. So we will get possession of it tomorrow and then we'll vote on it. Okay, I need to look through my emails. I'm sure I'm not the only one who's got a lot of unemployment emails right now. So I need to try to look through my emails and find, do I check in with Avery or Bill on committee voting procedures or both? You know, I got a nice response from Rebecca. So let me send that to you as well. Okay, if you could just resend, that would be great because a few things have gotten lost, not lost. Hard to find, let me put it that way. Yes, exactly, buried. Buried, thanks. Okay, thank you. So that at this point is our business for today. I am in conversation, Representative Conlon and James and I had a conversation with the president of the New England board of higher education, asking them to help us understand trends, future trends in higher education in post-secondary education. So we will have a joint committee meeting with commerce and economic development, looking at just getting a better idea about what's happening around the country, what's happening around New England, what are the trends in post-secondary education? So that's gonna take a little while to set up because they wanna pull together and organize some information for us. I understand that Georgia has some interesting things that they have done. I think there are a couple of other states that might be of interest. But to clarify, I know people have had some interest in this conversation. Our committee at this point will not be weighing in on the decisions related to what's happening at the Vermont State Colleges. Our committee will not be looking at their finances, will not be looking at their enrollment, will be not be looking and trying to come up with a plan for the colleges. I figured our role might just better be to get a sense of what the trends are in higher education. And that might be a more useful use of our time. And as far as the other bill, that still looking for an avenue for the budgets, delayed for the 19 districts. At this point, the Senate is firm on their position to, and I'm repeating this because I believe we weren't live before. They are prepared to offer their solution to us at this point are not interested in further testimony on the work that our committee has done. So anything else? Sarita, do you have something that you want to say? Can we send you questions to possibly ask that the group on post-secondary education? Can we submit questions to you to possibly ask them? Sure. Okay, perfect. I'm gonna keep it at the pretty much 50,000 foot level. We're not going into the buildings right now at Vermont State Colleges. Will the Senate be at 50,000 feet, Senator? Excuse me? Will Senate education also stay away? I didn't understand that. Will the Senate Education Committee also be at 50,000 feet? Or are they gonna be diving in? Oh, on the Vermont State Colleges? I don't know. I haven't had a presentation about the Vermont State Colleges. Um, Kayla Belder. Yeah, thank you. I don't know if you can hear me while I'm not having great success this morning, but hopefully you can. So can you just reiterate, Kate, the Senate's recommendation on the budgets? Again, I think you said that a little earlier. We weren't on the record. If you could just give the quick summary of their recommendation, that would be helpful. Thank you. Yeah, the Senate's plan is that if you do not, and Jim, I should probably let you do it, but let me see if I've got it here. The Senate's plan is that if you do not have a budget by July, by June 30th, then they will have a default budget that agency of education will give them a default budget, which will be last year's budget. So that will be their budget. They'll be able to set tax rates on that budget. And then the communities can continue to vote. And if they pass another budget, that will supplant the budget that was set by the agency, which is last year's budget. That's what their position is. Thank you. And presumably they've heard testimony from the Vermont School Board's Association similar to what we heard. My understanding is they have received a letter from the State Board of Education, and which was supported by the Superintendents Association. I am not aware of any testimony that they have taken. I have not in any committee meetings I've seen, I've not seen any testimony, but that's my current understanding is that they do have a letter. Okay. They do have a memo. Kathleen James. Thanks, Kate. So considering the kind of constraints of how we're working now, what will be the path forward in trying to come to compromise between our idea of what might be the best path forward and the Senate's idea of what might be the best path forward? That looks like the options before us are, we accept the Senate's proposal. We hold out with them accepting our proposal or negotiating that position, or nothing happens at which point that would mean that they're left with the borrowing 87% until they get a vote. Sarita Austin. And Jim, if I, it helps me to kind of put it in English, but to have the lawyer right there to say, well, you know, it's not quite right, I think it was, please. You're perfect. Okay. I hope that's not in a President Trump sort of perfect, but I'm sorry, you were on YouTube, aren't we? Sarita Austin, you had a question? Yeah, I'm just wondering if it would be possible since Brad James and I believe Secretary French both support the 4% inflator if someone in the Senate could give a rationale as to why they wouldn't support that. You're more than welcome to reach out. You're more than welcome to reach out to your senators. Okay, thank you. I am not choosing to, I'm not choosing to reach out to the members of that committee because I want to be respectful of the chair. Any other questions or concerns? Kate, I don't have my hand up, but this is our topic of conversation Friday, is that correct? Excuse me. Is this our topic of conversation on Friday? I will let you know if we're gonna have, well, I will let you know if we're gonna meet on Friday. Okay, thank you. Okay, so at this point in time, we will meet Wednesday. We'll let you know when that's gonna happen, probably right after floor, that's okay with everybody. We will then have the bill and we will vote on that. And then on Wednesday, I will keep you posted as to whether we're going to meet on Thursday, I mean, on Friday. At this point, I don't have an agenda. Larry Coupoli. Yeah, is there, we have members from Ways and Means with us this morning. Do we have any comments from them or any recommendations or suggestions that would be different from the Senate bill? Don't be afraid to speak out. Hi, it's Robin. I don't feel like I'm in a position to say anything different. This is brand new news to me, so I'm just taking it in and I think your chair knows what the options are. I expect that our chair, if she doesn't already know what's happening, we'll know very shortly and we'll go from there. Thank you, Robin. Anybody else? Okay. Bill, did you wanna say something? Yeah. Can you tell me what the vote was from that Senate committee? I understand that it was unanimous, but it hasn't left the committee yet. Okay, thank you. There is, you can watch, you can, when everybody's looking for us to watch another YouTube Zoom meeting, but we're looking at our options. And with that, I guess we will adjourn. Everybody be ready to meet right after.