 Good evening. Welcome to the LBJ Library. I'm Mark up to grow of the president CEO of the LBJ Foundation We're delighted to have you here tonight as we welcome Joe Califano and Bob Schieffer I want to give a special thanks to our generous Friends sponsors st. David's healthcare the moody foundation and Tito's Handmade vodka. I'd also like to extend my thanks to those of you who contributed to Amplify Austin campaign that I mentioned last week. I mentioned that we were trying to raise money to bring school buses of underserved school children to the LBJ library and our goal was to raise $5,000 Thanks to your generosity generosity rather we shot through that goal and raised $7,000 which means that $7,000 underserved school kids will come to the LBJ library So thank you very very much like we had a Field trip here today, and it is just wonderful to see those kids enjoying the experience here at the LBJ library So thanks again. I hope you'll come to upcoming friends programs in April we'll offer a preview of our brand-new temporary exhibit get in the game the fight for equality in American Sports and on March 30th We are thrilled to be hosting Jake Tapper of CNN with his new release a novel that he's written called the Hellfire Club So get ready for that next fall promises to be exciting as well. We're We have a program around the release of Doris Kern's Goodwin's new book on leadership and another commemorating the 50th anniversary of 60 minutes which will include some of the 60 minutes talent So if you're here as a guest tonight I encourage you to join the friends of the LBJ Presidential Library one bit of housekeeping and that is that Joe Calfano the author of tonight's book will be Signing books after the program as well So if you weren't able to get a signed copy before the program you'll be able to do so afterward With now with no further ado, I will welcome to the podium the chairman of the LBJ Foundation Larry temple who will introduce our guests Larry Well to quote that famous philosopher Yogi Berra Tonight is like days of you all over again in 2015 the headliner on this stage was Joe Califano and he was interviewed by Bob Schieffer They did a reverse and in 2016 the headliner on this stage was Bob Schieffer and he was Interviewed by Joe Califano now we're back to the start again and So I want to tell you about these two remarkable individuals I thought about referring to them as icons and Then I made the mistake of looking up the definition of an icon in the dictionary And it has a connotation of a saint and neither one of these guys are saints So I abandoned that definition And I thought well, maybe I would call them legends because in my mind they are But I looked that definition up And one of the definitions has to do with the same that doesn't work still one of the definitions of has a definition of being an inscription and Those of you that bought Joe's book you might have an inscription, but I didn't think either one of those definitions would fit either So I will say that the two men that will be on this stage tonight Are two remarkable individuals who in their own way in their own fields Have left an indelible impact on this country over the last 50 years And we're fortunate to have those two individuals here tonight. Let me tell you about each of them Joe Califano is a lawyer by profession and was a very good one when he practiced But in 1961 he heard the call of President Kennedy Who said it was time for a new generation to step up and take the reins of leadership and Joe came to Washington and Got to the Pentagon and became an assistant To the secretary defense later. He became general counsel of the army Sir very ably there until he came to the attention of Lyndon Johnson Lyndon Johnson was a guy that was not bashful about Conscripting people and he brought Joe to the White House in 1965 where he served as the chief domestic advisor to the president For the last four plus years of the president's term And if you come to this library and look at that litany of domestic legislation that was passed by President Johnson, you'll see the fingerprints and the intellect and the foresight and the insight of Joe Califano on all of that legislation After he left the White House He again went back to a practicing law for a while until Jimmy Carter got elected president and President Carter brought him back to Government to be the secretary of health education and welfare now some of you in this audience that are younger than I am may not know what Secretary of HEW was because that disappeared We now have a secretary of education and the secretary of health and human services And I think they divided that up because after Joe left they decided nobody could do both other than Joe Califano, so they divided into two departments And he served very ably there and then as I say went back to the practice of law until He decided that there was a problem with addiction and substance abuse in this country And he found it a very very significant important institution the Center for Addiction and Substance Abuse at University of Columbia Columbus Columbia I get it right in a minute and It has been a major institution in this country and he served as known to the founder, but the chairman for many many years He still is very active there all the time. He was there. He has been a writer of books He tells me that this book about which we'll hear tonight is his 14th. He says it's his last I don't think he's right about that. I think we'll see more But the one that I come into you is his book on Lyndon Johnson the Triumph and tragedy of Lyndon Johnson if you want to get a real factual Understanding of Lyndon Johnson. That's a good one to do. So I will tell you that I think that Joe is probably the most important non-elected Person that's been on the public scene in this country in the last 50 years now. He'll be in an interviewed tonight by Bob Schieffer It's a homecoming for Bob because Bob was born in Austin He got his start professionally with the Fort Worth Star telegram And then he got to Washington with CBS and has been For 50 years The premier journalist with the CBS a lot of you've seen him on television On the news, but he probably was most famous for being the moderator for face the nation For many many years on Sunday morning Bob has received every single award for journalism and broadcast journalism that his profession has to offer And he has been inducted into the broadcast Hall of Fame the Arts and Sciences Hall of Fame and he's gotten eight Emmys and The Library of Congress Said that they wanted to honor him and they did as a living legend. Well, they didn't look up the definition like I did But Bob also is the author of multiple books. He has four books about the Journalism profession and his role in it and his experience and I commend him to you. I said to him a little bit early I didn't realize how mischievous he was until I read his books and they're really creative stories and wonderful stories that he tells But he wrote those four books and he co-wrote a book on President Reagan called the Acting President I don't quite know what the connotation of that is But I've said that I think Bob Schieffer is Kind of a modern broad man because in addition to everything else he writes music most of it country and Western but he writes Music and he sings in his own band In Washington, so this is a multifaceted guy that we have here tonight So it is my great honor and my great pleasure To introduce those two individuals to you We'll first have Joe, California will come out here And he will have a few remarks and then we'll Bob will come to the stage and engage in a conversation With them so welcome Joe, California and later. Welcome Bob Schieffer Hey I'm so touched by Larry's Introduction you ever talked about me like that when we were both working for Lyndon Johnson But but I Tell a story that some of you may have heard it's not a story. It's true With all the wonderful things I did. I'm not perfect and one of my jobs in the White House was to Supervised speech writers on anything they wrote about domestic matters and it was the first thing I did every morning I'd come in Lyndon Johnson used to make a lot of speeches to the treasury to sell treasury bills to the pages To the truckers to whoever came in for small groups or what have you? These speeches were typed on yellow index cards about this big and great big speech type He rarely looked at them If before he delivered them and They'd be just handed to them and one night I called in Peter Benchley who was one of those speech writers and I fired him I told Peter. He didn't know how to write and I Think both Bob Schieffer and I would love to have the royalties just from Jaws But in case the next day I came in and The stack of cards was on my desk and the top card said They say you can't increase defense spending and Balance the budget while I say you can and I'm going to tell you how They say you can't rebuild the cities of America Without any tax increase well, I say you can I'm going to tell you how and they say you can't Reduce in unemployment to 3% with no danger of inflation Well, I say you can and I'm going to tell you how and then I turned over to the next card and it said okay Linda and you're on your own So if I hadn't read those cards, I wouldn't be here tonight. I know where I'd be but I I want to get down to conversation with Bob Schieffer, but I I did want to Just give you a snapshot of this book Of a couple of things in it which will help set some groundwork The one of the points is that the the three branches of government have lost their constitutional balance Presidents become incredibly powerful The last 50 years we haven't had a single declaration of war millions of Americans have been sent into combat and Many had been a hundred thousand been killed a million have been wounded We'll talk about the other things as we get along The Congress is crippled week The gerrymandering we can talk about that and we'll talk about the fundraising but and The courts the courts have become politicized to a greater extent than we realize at just that point In the last since 2010 We've had 50 Supreme Court decisions with the four Republicans voting together on one side and the four Democrats on the other and Anthony Kennedy flipping it Subject states They need money from Washington. We can we'll talk about that a little bit But I just know for example Today now if you're in a state where you have to balance the budget under the state Constitution You now have three choices You can go Raise taxes you can cut programs or you can go on bended knee to the White House and and ask for funds and There are no free lunches in life and there are no free crumbs in politics The root of political evil. We'll talk about this some more. I think money is the root of political evil just a snapshot of how and Where money was spent in four states? 71% of the presidential campaign ad spending was spent in those four states and American fault lines. I dare talk about the media. I'm sure Bob and I will he has a fantastic book Called overload on the media and and we'll talk about these other things in our conversation I just want to make this point. I want to understand the numbers the Democratic Party gets 90% of the black vote the African-American vote now The Republicans get 8% or less Hillary Clinton got only 88% So she couldn't possibly have won the national election, but look at us the convention is the last time the makeup of the two parties and the fact that the Republican National Convention less than 1% We're African-American only 5% Latino and Then just a snapshot to focus you on the education Most people don't look at between 1970 and 2013 the highest income quartile has Is great is grabbing? About 80% their their amount is doubled from 40 to 80 percent of the bachelor's degrees The lowest income quartile is up from six to eight percent and what can we do? We'll talk at length about that so I won't I won't bear on it But I we will talk about these things and now To find out a little more about a week can we get Bob up here, and maybe you'll ask me a question to I would just say that I Set some sort of historical First a couple of weeks ago. I was down in Miami Pumping my own book called overload, which is a study of the press and what's happened in the shift from Print into digital and the impact that's had on everything including our politics and I got up and I said I'm going to do something that no one pumping a book is ever done before I'm going to talk about somebody else's book a little bit, and it was Joe, California's book. This is one of the best Explanations of how we got to where we are and how the 2016 election Came about and and I think and I'd never quite thought of it in the way that you put it in this book Joe, but your thesis obviously is that as the White House has become more powerful and it started I Guess mostly with with Roosevelt. I guess it was some attempt Every president since is tried while talking about the need for smaller government has found ways to extend the power and the role of the federal government and so as the executive branch has grown The Congress and especially in recent years because it has become so expensive to run for office anymore The Congress is basically a place to raise money And not always just for everyone's individual campaigns and you go into some detail and I really want to talk to you about that But we're in a situation now where it's no longer three Equal branches of government you have this super branch Which is the executive branch and then you have the Congress and you have at the courts I will just add one thing into how This came about and and what has happened in in the in the funding of all of this and that is We basically have no campaign laws. We basically have no campaign finance laws anymore I would offer is that at this example in 1975 after the resignation of Richard Nixon 32 people Went to prison or paid substantially heavy fines for violating campaign finance laws Every single thing they went to jail for is now legal We're no longer moving forward in controlling the cost of these campaigns We're actually moving backward and that so that's where I want to start Joe talk a little bit about Well, let's say for example when a young congressman comes to Washington It's just been elected to the house. Let's say What does he find out about what's expected of well? If he's a Democratic congressman He'll get a memo which says you're expected to give Four hours of call time every day you're in Washington and three hours when you're away from Washington Call time is the euphemism for raising money. It's illegal to raise money on federal property So there's a Republican club just across the street from the Capitol and a Democratic club And they can just they can go over there and make calls a small room Little bigger than a telephone booth, but basically on the phone raising money and Also, if you're in Congress, and there's a table of the 2013 Every Democrat in Congress, but it's not it's similar for Republicans. I'm not I was a more had more access to some weeks from the Democrats than the Republicans but there's a You want to be chair of a committee? great Houseways and means or defense committees. Those are big committees, and we'd like you to be chair We think you're the right person Incidentally the chair of of the Houseways and Means Committee Has to raise $500,000 in campaign contributions for the congressional campaigns. That's in addition to whatever he or she raises for himself And say for Republicans, it's $800,000 And and this is really and Bob said, you know, what is it close to run? We have the night put in the book in the 2016 election an incumbent senator on average raised $30,000 a week every week of his or her six-year term to pay for the campaign On average an incumbent House member had to raise $15,000 a week every week of their two-year term in terms of running for office now This is really corrupting the Congress and and and in a savage way, you know and when and when you know Well, they come in on Tuesday. They go home on Thursday afternoon Where do they go well They don't go home really on Thursday afternoon a lot of those Thursday afternoons they go to New York or Chicago or Atlanta or Dallas or Houston or Los Angeles or San Francisco to raise money Because that there's such a desperate need for it and I think what what that means is They don't have time to do their job We have to tell them, you know, we hired you to do a job and you're not doing your job How do how's that reflected? Well The for the president issues 20 times as many regulations as Congress passes laws 20 times so they let the president become the chief legislator The Senate they don't and war I and and this is a cowardly piece to this too If any of you followed really followed the Iran Contra deal as it went to the Senate the Senate pretzels itself to avoid any record vote for or against Obama's Iranian deal Why the impact of contributors and the impact on votes? They just didn't want to be caught with that particularly Democrats because they have a heavily Jewish constituency and and supporters And and and so what happens Congress does pass a law what happens they and and this is as Bob said It's no one president. It's no one Congress. It's no one court. It's been going this way. I Think I think Ronald Reagan was the first president that said I'm assigning this environmental law But I'm noting that we're not going to enforce these provisions ever since then every single president Republican or Democrat has signed many laws With a signing statement that said I'm I I'm not gonna enforce this provision Or this is beyond the power of the Congress and to put that in perspective Lyndon Johnson in those years Not because he was a saint or loved the Congress or bats with wouldn't dare done that That went when he went when he when he didn't like a provision in the law He vetoed it and then drove us crazy to get enough votes So nobody would override his veto or get the law amended and this is another thing that's happened And of course as Bob knows the the continuing in the last 20 years With one exception the Congress has not had appropriations acts for every Department so they're not they're not watching what the departments are doing The way they used to out through the through their committees. They passed one you manga's law that even reporters, you know 3,000 pages and And just how many CBS reporters does it take to find all the stuff that's in there? And usually it's unravels over about 10 days. You see a story about this or a story about that or Carried interest will save this this is Do you do you think? That because of this for the Congress This enormous burden that they get up every morning know they've got to raise this much money They if they want to be the chairman of a committee and as you point out in the book something that I hadn't realized we now have what 90 some odd committees and subcommittees in the house and Why is that? It's it's pretty obvious, but these are these are fundraising devices These are ways to raise money because if you're the chairman of the house committee on goat ropers or something like that you're the one that's going to get the contributions from the goat ropers association and It is just turned the whole thing upside down. It seems to me But I guess the question I would ask you do you think this has changed the talent pool? Is this The question I was most asked during the campaign. How did it come down to these two? Do you Do you think we're getting a different group of people who are running for office now? Sure? I do I think it's great that and some other things have affected the talent pool I think if you look at the top And I say this to everybody here and wherever I go Think about this. We all say how did we get? woman that really didn't have a vision and and seemed a little entitled and a egomaniac as the top well think about this Hillary Clinton got the Democratic nomination With 8% of the registered Democrats Donald Trump Got the Republican nomination with 7% of the registered Republicans Nobody paid any attention Nobody was voting in presidential primaries all across this country And and and that you have that part but when you go to the Congress You're raising money It's also, you know the the internet which you've written well about I mean the internet and that whole world of Tweets and everything else. I mean it's a double-edged sword. You can write anything and If it goes viral or if really gets out there the poor person that it's written about the senator or the congressman or the candidate has races to try hard to catch up So he says why why do I want to get into that? What why don't you know why why why do I want to do that? Is it really important what happened in the back of a car when I was 16 years old? Relevant to you know my ability to be a senator at 50 and another thing has happened the money thing we have I have a I have a section on American fault lines in the book and one of the fault lines is the single issue The the the single issue candidates You're a billionaire and you've got all the money in the world. You can go to somebody and say You got to stick with me. I'm pro-life or I'm pro choice. I'm pro gun control or I'm anti-gun control I'm pro legalizing marijuana against it, but you stay with me on that and I'll give you millions You know, I'll get you through all these primaries and I'll take care of you and look, you know Sharon Adelson on the against the legalization of marijuana and George Soros for the legalization of marijuana any number of candidates these two guys gave millions to for that purpose and What happens that means? They have no give on that issue and the other thing just to round this out Is gerrymandering and I know that's relevant for Texas too. There's a case working its way up You know the gerrymandering you carve a district out so the Republican will always win or that the Democrat will always win There were a hundred safe districts. I Once I suggest to the Lyndon Johnson that president Johnson we have He was always complaining about a demeanor was to raise money and About how you know, we could go for public financing of Campaigns he said I'll never pass the house. I said why not? He always said well because you've never run for office. You don't understand but the real he also said There are a hundred safe seats in the house A hundred hundred hundred people win by ten percent or more of the vote They're never gonna go for this because this would guarantee them an opponent You know how many people in the last congressional election won by more than a hundred percent of the vote 400 more than ten percent 402 402 safe seats in the Congress Now you know that so it also puts the the battle is in the primary The Democratic primary pushes the candidate to the left the Republican primary pushes the candidate to the right Along the way, they make a few commitments that they say they will never give an inch on they come to Washington And what's happened? They've turned compromise into a four letter word And we get nothing done. So these are terrible problems and just the The idea of waking up every morning and knowing that the most important thing you have to do is Raise the money and it seems to me that we have made running for office so odious with that is them Worst part of it That our best and brightest people simply want no part of it anymore Very hard to get candidates and when you are a candidate. I mean The I'm sure there are enough people in this audience with experience here But you know when you say I I think I'll run for Congress and you go to the key Democrats in the in your district and they say Or I'll run for mayor or I'll run for the city council and their first. What's the first question? How are you gonna raise the money? Now, how can I make my town a little better place or my town council or my city or my district or my state? How am I gonna raise the money? Can he raise the money to do this? I mean, this is not the way candidates were picked in the money You know money has been in politics from the beginning. I understand that but Bob made another very important point those laws That were violated and if he went to jail for The Supreme Court has wiped them all off the books Supreme Court basically began In in the 80s with a case called Buckley v. Belial, but with most recently with Citizens United They've given money First Amendment rights. What does that do? It dilutes your vote It does dilute your vote. So one of the things we have to do Is get that case reversed and I think that can happen I believe that we now have enough evidence Because in the way in the last case the Citizens United case where justice Kennedy wrote the opinion He said we now have a world in which With modern technology we can find out everything Every all the money that was donated. Yeah, but he he didn't know about dark money Dark money is money you can give now in large amounts with no indication of who gave it and and And we now have we now we're now seeing enough of what money is doing And it really is crushing our public policy You know we have a tax tax breaks, okay and Closing loopholes But the carried interest of the thing for the hedge fund guys that lets them Treat their ordinary income like a capital gain, so it's taxed at about less than half the rate of anybody else untouched untouched I want to talk a little bit about The presidency and the executive branch I have and I was wondering about this as I was coming down here how many pieces of Domestic legislation did Lyndon Johnson pass? Oh Hundreds I mean hundreds look we did create there's no you know I say everybody's got their fingerprints on some of this Sure, there were about 50 agencies in Washington There were 500 when we left domestic agencies. It was a dramatic change in the government But remember sure that put a lot of power in the executive branch And and and and and a lot of power when you issue regulations remember Regulation is really like a law. I mean there are regulations that when you violate them There are civil penalties. They can even be criminal penalties But Thought always was wasn't just that we were naive. We thought government would be good We had we felt all of that but There was a Congress that was going to look over you and make sure you were following it and you were obeying and doing it And and and and there was a judiciary You know what happens today with the judiciary? I'll just think If you want to knock off Obama's immigration program You go to the Eastern district of Texas. You have the federal district judge to issue a national injunction and ending the program You want to get rid of Trump's immigration program? You go to San Francisco. You had a federal district judge to issue an injunction ending Trump's program We didn't do things like that. I want to The amazing thing to me is you you were the guy in charge You were in charge of the domestic council when you passed these hundreds of bills I mean, you know, we think of various Presidencies and we say well, he did this or he did that but you've just got these Hundreds of things that Lyndon Johnson did you were in charge of that operation? How many people work for you? I had four people for Well, you know, this is really and how many people would you say there's a domestic council now or there was during a couple of hundred several hundred well, and you're leading into the right but let's go to the other the other That's the White House staff. You're really on to something one The National Security Council is now about 450 people It grew with every president as Bob said at the beginning every single president grew it and The big the big jumps came the biggest jump came with Obama and Of course McMaster's and Trump has kept that in place That's another reason why how can you get really good people to want to be assistant secretaries of state, you know, Hillary? Traveled a million miles and then John Kerry traveled a million miles Meanwhile Susan Rice and Ben Rhodes made national policy In the White House in the White House I mean the Secretary of State didn't know that that that the deputy national security advisor was negotiating with Cuba Negotiating with Cuba to end the embargo. I mean just think about that and then and then In the council the White House counsel's office. I think we had Larry temple Who replaced? Lee White I guess and before that we had Harry McPherson Lee White. That was it We didn't have well that started to grow of Course it exploded with Nixon with the Watergate then it grew some more With with Clinton and all of that but just think recently two recent examples George W. Bush the issue was Are the way we treating can we treat prisoners in Guantanamo this way or is it torture? Well the first reaction of the Justice Department was yeah But then the White House counsel went after the Justice Department and they changed Obama goes into Libyan and He asks Eric Holder his attorney general is This is a situation where I have to there are these hostilities. I have to report to Congress or pull out and Older holders said yes, they are so he went to his White House counsel His White House counsel said no, they're not he got the answer He wanted and that's the one he followed and lastly and you have to comment on this book the communications department Grew and grew and grew and grew There once was none Ronald Reagan created the communications department in addition to the press secretary But the the real explosion came Started to come with George W. But the real explosion came with Obama who realized how important the internet was and all this stuff and And hit about 400 people 400 people now we now have and It's clearly a thing. We now have White House dot go. We had you White House YouTube We have White House internet. We have White House interchangeable internet We have it 24 hours a day 365 days a year Bill plant one of your colleagues who I quoted in the book said it's like a state-run media. I Mean, what was the White House? Press office When you were back there before Well, I can't I came when Nixon was there and and you know really HR Haldeman for all All that we know What some of the things he did, but he's the one who basically created the the press office That we knew of I mean now this what's going on right now. It's totally divorced from anything But I mean he's the one that created the he was the guy to invented White House advance He you know he invented the photo op he invented the the You know the press conference and and and all of those things it became you know There were some of them were very good ideas But he that was that was the model and then Reagan and and Mike Deaver kind of elaborated on that They figured out that if you're going to talk about Housing starts you go out to a construction site and have the president speak with what he's talking about in the background Because they they brought the movie part of it, you know they The Reagan White House they were the first ones to my to switch the inaugural to the to the west side of the Capital so you can look down and see the great mall up into that time The the inaugural had been on the on the other side of the capital that faces Supreme Court And there was nothing but just a parking lot out there, but they they understood the power of pictures and how pictures built up but These things just kept getting the larger and larger, but that was it was not just in communications It was in all parts of the government and as you point out especially the State Department now the the Pentagon still operated, you know kind of on their own about under the direction of the president, but All the policy was coming directly out of the White House Well, the president should be the one in charge of the policy But somehow every presidency seems to find less use for the bureaucracy and I don't think that's All that good myself. No, I don't either and I would know I think the total White House staff Approaches 2,000 people today the White House staff Now just think about that and it was about topped off at about 50 people in the Eisenhower Kennedy and Johnson years and then it started to grow now I think that's right, and I think actually dedicated this book to public servants because I think they're critically important And I also think Other things play into what's happening in Washington. I mean there's no question that that the Education that the collapse of public education in this country, and it's not just a ghetto in the city It's rural America. I mean there really there are there there's a The Education Department reports that 40% of high school seniors Cannot do basic math or really grasp basic English now think about that in this country I mean they're setups For the madmen of television and for the kind of communications operation that that politicians now run I think you know there are things we can do about all these things. I don't Want you to go on that's that's one of the things I want to talk about What We know what's happened. I mean In my view the whole electoral process is sort of collapsed and this is as you have pointed out and made clear in this book This started long before Donald Trump entered the picture here I mean these chickens were flying around and in 2016 they they finally came home and roost But what do we? How do we fix that is it fixable? Yes, I think it is and I make Not one other point. They really have been to make Bob's point. Just think about the fact that Nixon said There would be you know he said among other things there would be no Joe Califano in the white in my white house There'll be no staff like that in my white house. Well. He had a staff about a hundred replacing the four And then and then we went president after president. We look at George Obama assaulted George Bush for Executive orders issuing executive orders. It's not that's not the way the country runs and then Trump came along and then Obama issued more executive orders than had been issued before then Trump came along and said It's a disaster. He's ruling by executive order and Trump issued more executive orders in his first year than any president in the history of the country. Is that right? Yes So it's not it is it has just kept bumping along Look, I think there are a lot. I'm one. You know, you're all out there. I can tell you We must look in the mirror. We must vote. We must vote in primaries We must really look at that We we hat and we also have to send clear messages, you know, I say, you know, it's the one thing We can fire these guys, you know, we can we can you know You can be that you can be the lowest level employee in a fast food place And if you're a voter, you know, you have One of the you have the element that's necessary. You can fire people. You can fire these guys. That's very important I think we do have to get the money. We have to get some we have to get restraints on the money I think that case has to be laid out. I think lawyers can make that case now. I Hope some of these Organizations are looking at that Because that's critical and look at the number of people good people That we all know that have left Congress saying all I'm doing is raising money That's my main job. My main job is to raise money We could tell them we want you to do your job We want you to do we have we have a hell of a lot of problems as as Progressive and we we want you guys to do your job. Is this is the lobby more powerful today than it's ever been because there are a Lot of people in these cottage industries that have grown up around our politics that are becoming millionaires and And that wasn't possible until the campaigns became so expensive And and I think we're seeing this cottage industry a devoting more time To the money-racing part of it or the money-making part of it Then they are on the issues themselves But I think one of the more remarkable things is Watching these kids down in Florida After this this shoot I don't know how far they're gonna get but I think they're having more of an impact than anything We've seen I think that should be an example For all of us. I hope they have some success. Let me just tell you off something just interject this to underline We sometimes these things we almost become normal since the Orlando shooting at the club in Orlando and that was what in mid 2016 655 people have been killed in mass shootings in schools in nightclubs in various other venues and 2760 at last count have been wounded or hurt And it raises the question to me. I understand about the second amendment and all of that, but it's the number What I'm looking for is what is the number that we will no longer find it acceptable? to allow that to continue and Is this the number it ought to be one? It should be one but 660 some odd people in in just a little over a year and this is not a new problem I let me just go back to the Johnson years for a minute Lyndon Johnson proposed a gun control we started in 65 I think and we it was You could buy a gun at any age then Proposed an eight 18 year old age to buy a gun There was something called Saturday night specials the $10 guns that were pouring in from outside the United States. These were These were pistols and you could sell guns across state lines He proposed setting an age No Saturday night specials stopped that and no sales across state lines. He also proposed a registration of every gun and Licensing of every gun owner If to suggest that today people would say that's insane. That was the that was the proposal We couldn't get it done in 65. We couldn't get it done in 66. Couldn't get it done in 67 King is assassinated We did get the fair housing bill offer then Bobby Kennedy is assassinated and the president says let's go get our gun let's go to our gun control bill and There was a senator and senator Joe Tides of Maryland who thought he had a better bill and The president said I want you and Larry O'Brien to get up there and tell him we've got 10 days If we don't get this bill out in 10 days the NRA is going to beat us Now it's not just the money. It's the numbers and the concept and we did we couldn't convince him what happened We got the first three things the age the Imports and no sales across state lines. We couldn't get the other two the president made a blistering signing statement speech about it and When Obama member new town, which is the town next to the one we live in in Connecticut And Obama said he would then propose gun control I I did an op-ed with just telling that story about Johnson and saying now do it now But he set up a commission chaired by the vice president Which took three months to report and by that time couldn't really get anything now Nobody even thinks of proposing registering guns and My god, I guess we've got 300 million out there now And There were no assault rifles in those old days today But I think the kids What's great about these kids is They're saying we're gonna do something Well, everybody in this room want to say we're gonna do something Everybody in this room. How many people have written to their congressman say enough. This is enough If you take Bob's numbers, that's these a number of people killed in mass shootings. We've got to stop it. I Have to confess I haven't written to my congressman, but I will when I go home tomorrow If I can get into New York tomorrow But but I mean that's absolutely right, but we can you know, we need these things we need to be shaken out of our Comfort zones a little bit and say this is a mess But we can do something about it. I have the reason I wrote this book is I believe deeply that if the American people understand the problem and As as Bob said the problem isn't Donald Trump He may be the latest version of what we're dealing with but That's not if if Trump Left tomorrow and You know decided he'd resign and go back and build hotels or whatever But if he left tomorrow, it wouldn't change any of these things I've mentioned So his successor Republican for the moment or in the next time in the next election Democrat We must deal with these problems and we must deal with them you know, I was heartened when I looked at the reports they on local television The largest turnout of primary voters in an off-year election in the history of the state. Yeah a million Democrats Unfortunately a million and a half Republicans but But inside this is a totally non-partisan book, but I think this is no I Want to make that clear. I Should I mean it is this is this is an equal opportunity The point of the book is it hasn't made any difference one president after another has Enhanced the power one president after another Who has complained about his predecessors gone and done the same thing? Congress after Congress has gotten more and more expensive. They demanded more and more money To run and more and more money if you want to serve on committees The problems we have in education You know look the education and talk about redistributing money wealth That's like a capital offense But governments, you know Medicare was redistributing wealth Social Security is redistributing wealth. We don't put enough Resources into education. Let me ask you this you talked in the book about what was your phrase breakout Moments or yeah, big big moments. Yeah game changers game changers Tell us about what you mean what what would be a couple of those and what do you think the next game changer might Well, there were three big game changers for the national government. The first was the income tax in 1916 or whatever remember the federal government didn't have any money They had excised taxes so it couldn't offer programs or what have you? that was the first game changer and then they started out of that came the the first college program For land-grant colleges for example, and then the new deal was the next game changer Of all the all the alphabet agencies and all the laws And and the welfare law was not was not a great society was a new deal or the original welfare law and Then the and then the next game changer and the biggest was the great society it changed the role of the federal government Just dramatically changed it now. There are a lot of reasons for that. It wasn't just Social programs and what we traditionally think it was a great society We all have to remember The country was changing dramatically We you know we the corner the corner grocer the local bank the local pharmacist We're giving way to the national food supermarkets To the to the pharmaceutical store national pharmaceutical change to the national banks and a whole host of consumer laws came And in those years that put the federal government in the business of trying to level the field a little bit so that when you went to borrow money you had reasonable chance and not being Taken to the cleaners so to speak and all of that so But we've lost the ability And a large part of this is the Congress, you know, I say the press become more pay hasn't become monumentally more problem But the Congress has ceded the power 98% of the international agreements we made since World War two Haven't considered executive agreements and not treaties 98% nothing like that before so What is your take now on on where we are? I think where we are I think I think I Think the chaos so to speak in Washington and the issues of that's not too strong No, okay. Well chaos not just chaos and an executive branch with many posts not filled And incidentally how could that possibly happen the only way that can happen is That you've got a couple of thousand people on the White House staff You don't need all these assistant secretaries. They're not doing they're not doing the jobs. They were doing before I think that I think we do have to the partisanship is bitter and petty and Ludicrous, I mean, let me give you one. I mean to me the most incredible example is congressman Nunez the chair of the House Intelligence Committee and Adam Schiff the ranking member don't talk to each other They just don't talk to us. So Nunez writes a memo Sends it to the president. He sends the FBI the FBI clears it and then they put it out and Then Schiff writes his memo He sends it to the president of the FBI and they put it out They're literally putting a wall up between the two stairs. Don't talk to each other now think about it if you're Putin or the Russians and you want to screw up our system and you say this is the Intelligence committee of the United States House of Representatives the most representative body and these guys don't even talk to each other boy It's a setup for us. That's what they've got to think And we we have to you know, what do we do and you should comment on this probably what do we do on the media? well Nunez goes on Fox and Schiff goes on MSNBC or CNN which moves closer and closer MSNBC. I mean, this is another terrible terrible problem We don't have everybody can have their own facts Now Pat Moynihan used to say you're entitled to your own opinion, but you're not entitled your own facts Well, I can watch Fox if I like that and I will never hear anything said that I don't agree with or like I can watch MSNBC or CNN and the same thing. I will never hear anything. I don't agree There is no Walter Cronkite. I Reserved the privilege of asking Bob Schieffer one question. What happened to Walter Cronkite? What happened? What happened? What is it cable news? I mean well, what's happened to what it's all of these professions Well, what what happened is that when Walter Cronkite became the dominant voice in American media He was only competing against two networks You know all this was pretty simple When when I came was growing up and came in every town had Three television stations some had four one had an you know, maybe an independent station and every town had a had a fairly decent newspaper and the facts That people got from those four sources and maybe to life magazine and the Saturday evening post From those sources they formed their opinions What the important thing to understand is They were all basing their opinions on the same sets of facts Now you have 700 channels on the television you have more Sites than that on the digital network on the web and so The people that as you say listen to this channel They get one set of facts the people that listen to the other get another set of facts and they form their opinions So we're no longer all forming our opinions on the same Common data and as you say It's as if we're all bringing our own facts to the argument and that is is the main reason in in my View that that we are one of the main reasons that the country is so Deeply divided. Yeah, it is the country Joe I would say is more deeply divided than any time since 1968 And I was there for the 1968 convention and saw what happened in Chicago and what had happened before that and after that and I Guess if there's one sliver of good news we did get through that and we'll get through this Let me say also, I would know I do think the cable news channels Alleged news channels really really treat their audience as customers Not as citizens, but they're validation channels. It's where we go to Confirm our preconceived point of view For many many and I think that's a big part of this problem now and you know In what I wrote my book about and I don't this is Joe's night I don't want to talk about my book, but you know the fact that we have lost so many local newspapers Is had an enormous impact on our politics. We've lost a hundred and twenty six newspapers In the last 12 years There are so few newspapers out in the country now that one reporter in five One reporter in five lives in Washington, New York or Los Angeles So in many parts of the country now, it's no longer a question of bias news. It's a question of no news They can't afford the cable anymore They can't afford the news apps that are on their phones most people 80% of us have phones now But those in the lower economic classes In in a large part of the minority community, they can't afford that the only news they get for the most part is what they now get on on Facebook or the social media and Here's a surprise the the news that you get on Facebook has not been vetted It was in your local newspaper or in Or the way Walter Cronkite used to do it I mean, I know Bob's gonna open to questions. I want to I I want to I do believe we can deal with it There are there lots of examples in this book. There were things up there. I think we have to deal with the money I think we have to get more demanding of of the people we vote for When they appear or when they when statements are made. I think we have to Well, we've got children and we've got to make sure we understand how important education is There are a whole host of things. They're all local and we've dealt with them before I just want to read one thing Because I really think it's important Everybody likes to read what they wrote. I know but bear with me for just a second and then I'll turn it over to Bob to for the question period but This is from the end of the book trust trust is critical Change is enormously difficult to master under any circumstances But brutally so when we have lost trust in our institutions our Presidents our legislators our courts our media our political opponents our fellow citizens of different ethnic racial and religious backgrounds Trust is possible in our complex society only with strong honest leadership of high competence and compassion that encourages citizens to shake hands not form fists Reliable consistent policies that are fairly applied must also be seen as fairly applied Political fairness like justice must not only be delivered, but perceived as having been delivered That is not possible in a mightily partisan and single-issue political culture In which the size of the bankroll Smothers at the soundness of the policy and the locked gates of gerrymandering Got the value of votes And the gerrymander issue is before the court now and in two or three cases We have lots to do a long hard journey ahead So did Christopher Columbus the founding fathers Abraham Lincoln Martin Luther King, Jr. And Susan B. Anthony They had successes and failures and so will we But each of us has to get involved This is no time to sit back And leave it to the other gal or guy or to fear failure It is a time for all of us to speak up and exhibit and demand of our leaders the courage to take some risks and persevere Until we repair our damaged democracy It would be a tragedy for our children If we let the damage persist increase fracture and Petrify our society We will make mistakes some colossal ones We will make take plenty of missteps and we will trip and fall along the way So what? Wouldn't we the people rather make mistakes than have our children and grandchildren say that we didn't even try Are we prepared to take a few questions no No, so we've worn it out We're over time That's my fault. I didn't I didn't know about that. Well, thank you all very much and let's give Joe another And this is a great book. Thank you. Thank you