 I interviewed Jill Abramson who was at the Times at the time and she, we talked about you leaving during a negotiation process and I wanted to hear from your side what prompted you to leave the New York Times. You had it, 538 was bought by them, they were there, you were doing very well, curious what prompted you to leave. I'm trying to figure out how high to dial like the candor meter but you know I had a wonderful experience at style pretty low right now. It sounds very muted, very diplomatic, yeah. The New York Times is a wonderful institution and I really enjoyed my time there and it was great for me. I didn't think they were ready to build kind of a business around 538. If you read The New York Times some editors said there, you know your last name is always Times right and part of what we do is actually we kind of critique the mainstream media's understanding of things and we're critical of the conventional wisdom in the Times. It's an amazing institution but it kind of perpetuates and reinforces a lot of conventional wisdom. So it wasn't just money that prompted you to leave? It was not just money, the ESPN or I should say the Walt Disney Corporation offered that opportunity with 538 whereas The New York Times I think would not have as much room for growth. It's so ironic to hear of like a major corporation giving you that freedom versus like an institution that's known for its journalism though, it's just interesting to hear. It is strange and you know the fact of the matter is that it is tough in online journalism to kind of make a living. I mean we had a million people read our site yesterday and kind of back in the day definitely people read the site, you'd have a staff of hundreds of people and it would be a newspaper and they would be advertising flowing in and you know now it's more difficult where people have not quite figured out how to sell ads quite as well online but you know it's still like very gratifying to be able to kind of speak in your own language on your own terms, hire really amazing colleagues who hopefully think sort of like you but not too much like you because then you do become susceptible to all types of confirmation biases and then publish something every day. It's very satisfying.