 And I'm sure you can go back to that after the session and have a closer look at what you're going to do today. So this last session is very much going back to the policy-level inspection of client issues. I have three headscarred speakers here with us today. I have the entries all to your new, your BIOS zone. And they are basically just to say it's a very much in the discussion section. So we will have a few questions that we've already prepared for our panelists and then very much we'll give you a few slides to ask some questions to you. So our first speaker today is my name is Malvi. This is the executive of E3G, which stands for Third Generation Developmentalism. It's a non-profit European organization dedicated to accelerating the transition to sustainable development. And in addition to its management role, E3G's work on European climate policy, the policy and foreign policy are very relevant to this session, and to the security implications of climate change and resource scarcity. MiG was created as the senior advisor in the UK Prime Minister strategy and leading work on national and international policy elements, including energy, climate change, countries at risk, instability, organized crime, and fisheries. Our next panelist is Professor Anna Davies. She's a professor of geography here at Trinity. And she also directs the environmental governance research group and is on the steering committee for Trinity Center for Future Studies. She chairs the Royal Arch Academy's Future Earth Ireland Expert Group and is a member of the Royal Arch Academy's Geographical Geosciences Committee and the Fanning and Environmental Research Group of the Royal Geographical Society. She's also secretary of the European Naval Table on Sustainable Consumption and Production and is a member of the National Climate Change Council and she's a member of the Exeter Group on the Citizens' Assembly on Climate Change. And just to say that Anna is speaking in her own personal capacity as an M.I. expert academic here in Trinity. And our final speaker, always from Poland, is Mr. Gregor Gryppichski. Yeah, I got you. He's the head of the Climate Policy Unit and the Department of Climate and Air Protection of the Polish Ministry of Environment. So this combination is very relevant to that. And he's been working on the UNF Tulsi Association since hot-firing in Warsaw and is currently part of the Polish hot-firing program and he's headed the Polish Climate Change delegation to Oberhoi. Among other appointments, he's an alternate member of the Bureau of Criminal Compliance Committee and advisor to the GCF board member and previously worked on international law and the international relations in the College of Europe. So we have incredible speakers here today here to offer all their expert advice. As I said before, this is very much climate, past, present, and future. So I want to figure it out for a minute and just ask you what has happened since the past? Thank you for inviting me to see this amazing event. The first one is that it reminds us how massive an achievement Paris was and whether you follow the environmental development and the policy moves in that it will fail to agree to have them re-reserved in the past. That's quite simply given. So if you can probably even do that, I'll mention again all the information from the world to agree to a binding framework of climate change. It's an amazing achievement, but again Paris made it a safe birth. It did make it safe for British people to make Paris on. But the mitigation still leaves us in the vagus zone of 10 new places where we're all run away from climate change and unfortunately, again, if you follow the science, you'll realize that all of those famous points seem to be closer than we thought they were even more in the United States to Paris. So we need to do more using Paris as a platform to make these happen. So that's really where we are. We need to use the Paris platform to make it more solid. We're really going on increasing ambition, using the Paris moment 75 years to raise ambition. And where are we on that? Well, firstly, I suppose we're getting a bit real. There's some good things that happen in the real economy. Everything we thought is cheaper than we thought was. 30 years cheaper than we thought was going to be running in Paris. That's good. Electric vehicles have come out of the real alternative. That wasn't even a thing before Paris. So everything we need to do is work cheaper and it seems to be easier to do from a technical point of view. But it's also got more real. We realize that we actually have to do a lot of technical options to talk about. Like looking at people's concealed behavior like actually untangling the networks of fossil industries. Again, for US politics, we see Exxon has come out in Washington with government tax 31 million, but actually in Washington State, despite the middle of our companies to stop any government taxing from all at all. So there's lots of hard politics which in our reality is we've got big and we need to work out how to make our changes in the pace we need to do. The second thing that's happened is we've lost political leadership. One company that's going to stop this is France with President Macron who has shown some real leadership even though for the rest of France still needs to sell a little bit more. But particularly with Angela Merkel, the UK being in a progressive bar and therefore not really the table, we've lost a real progressive core of our country. And at the same time, of course, we have Trump and Bolsonaro pushing back on climate action. So the bottom up is doing well and we're seeing leadership from cities and businesses and investors really moving things forward but the political leadership we have running against Paris has faltered and it's not really there to drive our mission forward. And that's really a consequence and a cause of this broader environment. Actually the whole, not so much climate change cooperation but all international cooperation is on the thread. This is one of the reasons why leadership is so lacking. With the rise of trade tensions with great power politics with the idea that we don't need the rules to live on the same planet, we can all just, as Trump said at the UN General Assembly, you're all lovely nations and you're all going to work to do the best for your own nation and the subtext was we're the biggest nation and what we want matters most. You can't run a world of 8 to 10 billion people with a fragile ecosystem with that approach to working together or not working together, where might is right. And actually the whole issues around the trade war with China with the tensions we're seeing all around the world geopolitically are the biggest threat to the climate crisis in Paris. The midterms in the US tomorrow are really going to be available for whether we're going to see Trump as a four year phenomenon or as an eight year phenomenon and if countries see Trump lasting beyond this term they will change their views on a lot of issues and a lot of ways they work together and perhaps we will see a rise of the rogue fossil fuel producers like Saudi and Russia who have been hedging their bets for the last two years really coming together to push back against Paris agreement so that's why we need to push our leaders to be so strong because the geopolitical environment is much more turbulent than we ever expected coming out of Paris. So good things about it but we need to prepare to really push on delivery the next few years or we won't get nowhere near what the OCC is saying is what the plan should be for. I'm sure you have some questions about the Trump effect because of course some Paris happened we didn't really see that coming and I think if you follow on from this point and we know that the countries their national determined contributions of free Paris were not in line with saying under 2 degrees or 1.5 degrees and maybe you can talk a little bit about what I understand since 2015 and we're around with things like the citizens assembly and the national dialogue. Sure, thank you. Yes, I think we have to be very careful to talk about the different spheres of active and I think today has been really, really useful in highlighting just some of the great innovators and creativity that's out there in terms of actors who can contribute to making us a more sustainable climate in New York including climate action and I think what was clear from previous speakers was how these things all intersect it's not just about climate science but it's also about how we live and how we wish to be in the future. So very inspiring ideas in the creative marketplace I think that there is a lot at the grassroots. I think what is difficult is to identify and have an open view of that landscape and certainly some work that we've been trying to do and I know other research projects are trying to map the landscape of innovations and I think having to our hands a real overview of the kinds of activities that are going on would allow better coordination because a lot of the activities which are going on may seem in isolation to be small interventions but collectively and replicated appropriately according to context could really contribute significantly to our collective actors a collective effort. So I think one thing is there's a lot of grassroots stuff and we know that because there are people who are here the activities that have already been presented to you today we also have action obviously sector and the Citizens Assembly on climate action was very inspiring to be part of because of the support that came through the members of that climate assembly and I think for a long time it had been a default position we can't talk about climate change because people will just switch off they're not interested or they become so despairing that they don't take any action and I think the results of the climate assembly showed that there was actually an appetite amongst everyday folk not just those people who are particularly interested or specialised in a particular area to support action so I think that's been a really positive development which has to now be as you can see rolled out through the national dialogue and how we know much more about that than me but that's happening now we wouldn't have one of the regional dialogues or one's happening in November soon, soonish and truly and so these are about creating a conversation about climate action but what concerns me and what I don't have clarity on around the national dialogue is exactly where those conversations go I would like to see a greater pathway being developed where those conversations can bear fruit that we see a clear line of action in conversation to implementation so while that's positive in terms of public action I would like to see perhaps a little bit more and certainly in terms of policy action obviously personally disappointed with the budget recently around action on climate and we don't have a finance promise but there's not a clear line to implementation of that climate and what will emerge through that so greater clarity around that I think is desperately needed in order to not lose this grassroots swell of public interest and commitment to taking climate action because I think we're at a moment where I can really be a leader in just an engagement on climate action but it's an opportunity that must not be wasted because if we collectively do not take that opportunity and particularly political or policy officers take that seriously it will be lost and it will be very difficult to regain that sense of momentum so we are at a cusp I think in Ireland around how we move forward in that regards so we have climate ambassadors I saw that outside the Mercated Marketplace a fantastic entity of a game building with the enthusiasm and the commitment of people to take the message out further the grassroots actions and not only those which are branded as climate actions something like the rediscovery centre for example in Ballyman which it reminds me when we talked about the cup earlier in the Mercated Marketplace these kinds of actions about reuse is like in all parts of the climate equation we must not lose sight of those other actions the climate kick also I notice one of the presenters mentioned the climate kick Ireland is a member of the climate kick Sustainable Nation provides input into this Trinity hosts the journey which is a summer school where participants get to travel around Europe for lots of different actions these are all really positive things the EPA is funding research on climate we have researchers here in the room who have research projects examining both the climate change policy and its even issue we have European funding projects which are looking at these innovative ideas energised for example which is run out of the National University of Ireland in Galway looking at community energy initiatives so it's a huge amount of activity but I want to be able to see the whole landscape a bit clearer and to establish the impacts of all these actions I think that's really important because despite these actions we know that emissions are going up in Ireland so we're moving away from our targets so finance is guaranteed through the key measures in the climate timelines are still unclear I think that's where we need to take the most action I would say it's funny how you pick up the National Library but I'm involved in that just in the Citizens Assembly because I think if that showed anything to other people in your room and let them consider climate action in the two weeks which was unprecedented that they come up with really strong measures and they did come up with 13 very strong recommendations that the government is correctly obliged to respond to but it's being discussed to you so it is the cusp of that Gregor you could follow on when we have Paris and we have our own domestic situation here now we have Poland coming up COP 24 it's very interesting to hear where you see the negotiations going and give us a little insight into that process before it kicks off in a second sure I think when we're talking about COP 24 and its possible outcome hopefully its success in Catamisa there are two dimensions that are not necessarily the same thing one is that the negotiators are wanting to achieve in Catamisa and the other is what the world is expecting in the process working as a negotiator I know the intricacies of the process the dynamics and the literables and for that the absolute mask for COP 24 is to finalize the Paris Climate Work Program which means getting the implementing rules for the Paris agreement for every party to know how to implement its procedures and the better idea is this year and so we absolutely must observe that not only for the credibility of the process but also because of the change in the national environment that we mentioned already probably that's the last moment where we can do it very easy and there is room as for the parties as far as I can see so far the main challenge is it is just the most important hundreds of pages of text the other thing that the negotiators are looking forward in COP 24 is the dialogue the successful conclusion of the dialogue that could prove that the parties are serious about considering global efforts to tackle climate change and there are 20 other items that we need to be finalized one of them is a fresh realization of the local communities and indigenous peoples platform so that's inside the process but the outside world is a sort of action and that's what matters and that's what negotiators are working on to pacify that action but on this point there are there is a limited process to deliver and that's something that we're trying to send to the general public to do a number of our expectation management because in Paris we decided to we decided to go on with the national approach which means that ambition is important that is so important and to the national to actually facilitate and encourage that and here again our experiments are key so that's common platform for every party to engage and to have the pressure internally from the society from the decision makers to take decisions on the mass immigration and in addition to that we're talking about action Poland is a different for instance it's also trying to do something to enable and we propose to maybe reframe a bit the discussion about how do we take action so that we think that comes more than the devising of policy dimensions of the development so we're talking about human dimension, the technology and in that we propose three considerations that are currently worked on by the presidency to take part in the parties to be prioritized in the government or amongst the leaders on just transition so that both for the government and the government the others in certain priorities and third is the partnership for election committees so we know that we can gather as much support as possible for those iterations to complete that and make it successful so we've given an overview of some of the DSPTs that are bringing you a very much honest question so we're going to take three questions from the panelists and so without hearing I see you're in a long time to mention there I asked a question but I just want to put this question to the panel because I really worry sometimes when we talk about these issues unlike this conference which I was really delighted with it emphasised personal responsibility it emphasised urgency and it puts it up to us in some of the impractical ways in our individual lives because we saw from our stage just in chat we're really burning it because people are dead by their life choices at the moment so I just want to point to even showing the best thing each of us can do as individuals is to switch to a plan-based diet and when you look at the statistics you look at the analysis it's terrifying how compelling that is staying at three amongst two and I really don't take an irony because it doesn't have to be plan-based it doesn't have to start to change I'm sorry, I apologise but I'm sorry I just wanted to ask that we have to put this front in centre we have to confront this choice even if we can't do it we have to agree that the potential of plan-based diet is essential and we're really getting out of this especially with a lot of questions there and down here and you're just giving us this very basic yes, I'm sure I think no one cares I'm a charity engineer I can put together an alternative national mitigation plan that could be probably wider in the air but also on the back of the citizens' representative recommendation we have a dedicated body to look at to drive plan-based action as I put together and I'm hopeful that might entail but my question to the panel here and over here today is I do that and I've got very little kind of traction and we can see from it was it last week how little traction and how the feeling the Minister has done in the Senate there's limited political will for this kind of action what can we all do together to push this out because our local efforts our community efforts are admirable but we need something like Professor Lewis' proposal there that's the kind of things we need to push for massive change in carbon taxes, BRT deep sorry, I thought it was important to get the point out Thank you and thanks to the panel for fantastic input so my question is in relation to the upcoming COP so I've heard the expectation around finalising the rulebook etc for the Paris agreement but I also understand that there's a re-yearage of need for pre-2020 action and I wonder if anyone on the panel could reflect on what around thing we might be able to hope for from the upcoming COP to push that urgent action in pre-2020 Thank you, so if we'll get the panel to answer those questions then I think there's a lady and a gentleman there in the middle of the thing that those two hands are making that's the next question So if anyone has questions I'll ask the agriculture such as saying it's not the agreement it's not the agreement that was evident and so it's a very huge issue that we're starting to get into but I'm requiring obviously the last couple of changes is obviously everyone why? Because politics is entangled with lots of field interests and people don't feel the pressure from the other side so I was talking about what he sees as having industry and gassing into your time there's not a single industry impacted by climate change as come to see it so firstly let's mobilize some political constituencies those people are impacted by climate change which in Ireland is the same as because of an inter-agriculture why are they that? the people playing the bills the people playing the bills the industries that are going to be the lobby they will show up at the same time citizens have to really get on the piece and say why are you using the wrong island? why are you using the wrong building the wrong transport system the wrong power system if your money either is a consumer or it's a taxpayer you've got to get to the nitty gritty of why is the money going to one place and the other and let's be clear about this it's politics but it's also corruption everywhere in every country and you solve that by holding your representatives to account there's no other simple way but focus on the money why are they spending money in one way not another and that's where there's a real agenda about making sure your taxpayer's money is not being squandered infrastructure will be the wrong infrastructure you have to replace it for 10 years make it that issue as opposed to a long-term money on COP 24 I don't think there's going to be a huge amount of free 2020 agenda that's being politically massaged away actually most people in most of Europe are doing quite well for free 2020 the emissions have gone up a bit this year but what about debating in Europe beyond 2020 it looks really bad because people aren't putting the policies in heating area, housing and transport it's quite easy to turn off coal power stations and build windmills you kind of know how to do that the next stage is much harder to the politicians and practically it won't look okay in 2020 but that will be a false sense of optimism it won't have laid the foundations for the real deep change beyond us that's why the next two years we really have to put pressure on governments to make new commitments beyond 2020 and back them with cash because otherwise we'll all hit a wall and then the whole idea this is deliverable unravel quite quickly to be honest if we don't make the politicians think more long-term and not in the long-term we might continue this long-term and make sure we can get somewhere near the Paris government I think I would agree with a lot of that and I certainly think the problem in climate change is that it's a systematic issue it's a systems issue we focus on what we can do as individuals we won't react to those systematic infrastructures that we need to put in place so absolute collective action is key politicians do worry about what the voters will pay attention if there is significant collective action and grounds for our form of support as you rightly say there are other actors that are very influential in that system and it's not always visible for us as citizens to see how they have influence and to see what decisions and who's in those conversations so some transparency around decision making will be really important there as well as collective action and we can start those diets again it's a very complex issue because it depends where you are and who you are what kind of plans you're using and where you're using them we all know that it's very easy to dismiss a complete argument on the basis of a single issue and avocados are something that has really been brought to break because they've received a very trendy plant-based consumption but actually are usually making blanket statements but we need to consider just transitions in the Irish context form of all communities to ensure that simply by suggesting that we move towards the form of production of food production we pay attention to those people whose lives are very much reliant on the current system and this works not just the farmers but also those who work in current industries or fuel industries what are these people going to do we need to ensure that there are alternative pathways and alternative income streams to provide for these individuals and these communities and I think that that's really really important so we need something that's win-win for society, economy and the environment and there are no requests solutions out there that we need to consider but it may require shifts in cultural and social norms which have taken place in the past to do that as you rightly say with a long-term horizon with a good island and planet within that decision-making process thank you thank you I want to first address the 2020 issue so in Katowice there is a ministerial pre-2020 stop taking event which is an event from the previous company in Rome and it's going to be a high-level discussion focused on both education and finance in the pre-2020 perspective but if you look into that topic and what it actually can achieve you you might say that well how much we can achieve pre-2020 if it's at the 2018 and decision-making at a national level takes a lot of time in the future it takes more time and what can we still do pre-2020, two years to deliver but on the other hand I agree that there is actually a lot going on in the pre-2020 already in mitigation doha amendments did not enter into force yet but it's implemented by the European Union so historians will be actually nevertheless and finance to deliver half a million dollars per year is also underway despite US engagement plus I think that there is a very positive effect of Irish treatment and the NDC process in theory they apply post-2020 but we can already see that they do have a positive impact already now because countries did engage in a national planning and policy-making but some of that legislation is already in force so countries are in the path not only in Europe but across the world so I wouldn't be that desperate about that just in terms of positive attention from the DC countries working with junior engineering companies having tax incentives for sustainable programs and working more on fossil fuel companies than on sustainable production business Thank you My name is Cassie and I'm the master student of Trinity also and I have a question about the sustainable development and climate change and I have a look at the dashboard for Ireland and while Ireland is in the middle of the world and I have a question about the sustainable development and climate change and I have a look at the dashboard and while Ireland is in the right of the right for climate change I was kind of surprised to see that it's been more than 3 hours which means that it's considered to be likely to achieve the climate change with a little bit of high security and I was a little bit surprised to see that that we're not on track and not leaving our targets And I agree with you that the system is wonderful and I think some of the examples you've seen outside are fantastic and I thought it was in the actual government's action when I thought to get very far so this is my question about the needed challenges that we're seeing and I was seeing more and more recently and I'm wondering what's the colour of view of how important these are and will they push the very much I wouldn't dare to speak to the international situation in Ireland but it's an interesting question about the challenges how the case is that I think it's not playing the impact of those cases is not huge yet I think it affects several governments and some others are looking into that it is for the service based by the definition that's a preventive approach so in the EU we already see that there is a bit of pre-technetics because the cash government is pushing for more action because of that governments who are not in the same position are still a bit more certainly so I'm not sure how effective this approach can be that will depend on how many governments will be challenged in this way as far as geoengineering this is not featured in the negotiations nor in the public discussions but I think for now we can also achieve true communication and truly sequestration by natural ecosystems the participants will be able to decrease themselves so I think that nature is the answer to that and so we will need to get to that those questions are a little outside of my comfort zone but in terms of geoengineering it covers a whole range of technologies and interventions so I think that a one size fits all response from them I know some of the arguments which are kind of alluded to in the previous response around the moral hazard of investing significant amounts particularly in research and development around some of the technologies around geoengineering but at the same time researchers are always like to explore the possible so experimental search for example is something that is all going and may well be extended to be cognisant of the first preference working within our natural systems and not allowing these situations to become sort of trickling into being essentially a moral hazard having to invest in these responses which in some way allow people to perpetuate unsustainable consumption practices again the legal challenges I think it's important that all routes of conversational work are explored and I think it does again show a critical mass of people coming together to push for change and so it's an incredibly important symbolic action I would know whether it will have legal implications I don't know if I'm sure we have some lawyers in the house that may be able to help more in terms of identifying how that process might take place I don't know if it was what the question was but I think if I just didn't know about the reality of the word reality but I think you could put the dashboard as you mentioned completely so but that's not something that you can do Ireland is going to work to be a part of what you mean by doing things easily said, you answered me I think it's quite an advisory panel for you that they would like to know this about that so if I could give you an answer I would really like to answer a few more questions but there will be a recession and this is a lovely catch why I'm sure I'll get to be one of those questions because I could give Nick the final word and we'll look it on to partner one of the video engineers I think is very worried that most of the models that are trying to keep us well we're low to 81.5 have a lot of capturing carbon from biomass and just capturing carbon from the industrial process in power stations we worked as an organization for 15 years on carbon capture storage and putting serious money into it and as a public the UK was spending a lot more on subsidizing more oil and gas exploration or techniques than we are on any of these techniques to sequester so it's one of the areas of entanglement they're very good at using it in PR like Exxon is at the moment they're spending more on the advertisements about their algae programs than they are on the actual research so I think it's really worrying and we need to be very cynical about that and again attack the money where it's going now rather than these mobile pieces the legal challenges the government challenges which I think are quite some countries have constitutions where that will work in Netherlands it works back to the US actually but it's very very difficult depending on how government is set up constitutionally relative to its judiciary but the real problems are being made in losses and where the commercial side is picking up is sewing companies and not doing due diligence and not actually looking at the risk to their businesses or their investment funds properly and the highlight of this for me was California and the suit Exxon because they invested in Exxon for not doing due diligence on this business model for climate risk climate transition risk Exxon has countersued California for not doing due diligence in its municipal bonds which Exxon invests in for climate impact risk which is like thank you Exxon for proving this to the economy that's where you see the latest suits bringing in Poland UK I think that's making board rooms really sit up because that's personal liability of directors actuaries, investment managers pension trustees they can go to jail that they knowingly have not done the best job for their shareholders or their pensioners that's going to make a real difference I'm not going to tell you talking to big mainstream law firms in the UK which is like most of them live this is a big topic because they're defending a lot of these cases against small individuals so I think that might be one of the the dark forces that moves the dial a bit faster than people think it's going to be with so we know what to do you're a Cheryl so I'm very sorry I don't have a lot of discussions to go on for a long time I'm sure it turns out that 8 o'clock tonight in Trinity I'm short of a year there's an art exhibit that's very relevant to this discussion and is Karen Harrell here Karen Harrell is an actor he's a world renowned scientist illustrator in France and he specializes in astronomy and astronautics and some of the cool-dome images in the arts in Ontario and very much there's one connection to his work and so if you're not even heard you all go to the exhibit 8 o'clock in the show here 2 o'clock in the International Development and Insurance Program such a good friend to have a seat after a really self-doubt