 discussed our Region Zero program outline. Let's do a roll call. I will start. Joan Kefner. Aaron Robert, are you going to City Council? Martian Martin, City Council. Ken Walker, City Council. Hope he won't, uh, do you have the patient planning manager? Jim Ixdenk, Director of Engineering Services. Harold M. Ixdenk, City Manager. Susie Delano-Fairing, City Council. Chiquiri Apo, City Council. Hello, I'm Andy Williams, Planning Director. Johnny Marge, City Manager's Office. RT's Transportation Plan. Kevin McKeen, Office of Health and Employment. Eugene May, City Attorney. Becky Doyle, TAP. Taylor Wicklin, TAP. Oh, I didn't know you were on. I thought you were... I thought you were a pretty center. No. Yeah, I'm just here to enjoy. Great. Zachary, Public Safety. Jeff Satter, Police. Okay, great. So I'm going to turn this over to Jim Ixdenk. Good evening. Good evening. Director of Council members, staff, and guests. Tonight, we have some information we want to present on a Vision Zero interview. This information primarily is taken from, which is the Vision Zero Network, which is the main kind of information place for Vision Zero programs. So to put this kind of in context when we talk about Vision Zero, Vision Zero is a strategy to eliminate all traffic fatalities and severe injuries and also increase safety. Safety, healthy and equitable mobility for all. To kind of add that context when we talk about the City of Longhorn, we have had, we have averaged basically for the last five years, about 6.3 fatalities per year. Full allow in 2016 of two fatalities, to a high in 2019 of 12. And that could be spread out through the city and local city streets as well, as the city of Longhorn is. Next month, we will be presenting our 2017 to 2021 crash report, which will have a significant amount of data regarding the number of accidents in the city, as well as the new number for fatalities. So when you anticipate that the average fatality will go up, simply because of the five-year, the two-year number I mentioned earlier was in 2016, that will drop off last year in 2021 when there were seven fatalities. So, just some context. Vision Zero presents itself as an alternative to the status quo that treats traffic-related deaths as inevitable. We have a chart from Vision Zero Network that shows the traditional approach that has the traffic engineers historically following and designing stuff and kind of the philosophy they followed. Vision Zero knows the traffic deaths are preventable. The average human failing in the approach prevent fatal and severe crashes. It takes a systems approach, and they also are saving lives. It's not expensive. Okay, thanks. That's good. Okay, so the components of a Vision Zero commitment. I'm not going to read these, because we're going to go into each one of these in a little more detail as we move through. But there are nine major components that the program pushes out. A political commitment. Probably striking what goal officials make an official commitment to Vision Zero goal to achieve their own traffic fatalities and severe injuries among all road users. That is the start. And then, specifically at the end, within a set timeframe, other communities have said 2030, 2045 is a date. It just depends on the program for what they establish. Multidisciplinary leadership. I can't emphasize it enough that this has to be all leaders in the city have to take this on. This is not just going to be an engineering, traffic engineering effort. This has got to be an effort through a task force with representatives from the City Council, public safety, planning, public works, community services, school district. We didn't list TAB, but we asked them last night's meeting to indicate that they should be part of that as well on our transportation project. That's why. Really, once it's adopted, the next step would be an action plan. That would be created within one year of the initial commitment that implements clear strategies, the owners of the strategies, interim targets, timeline, and performance measures. Equity. City State Goals commit to both an equitable approach to Vision Zero by establishing inclusive and representative processes, as well as equitable outcomes by ensuring measurable benchmarks for safe transportation options for all road users in all parts of the city. Cooperation and collaboration commitment is made to encourage meaningful cooperation and collaboration among relevant government agencies and community stakeholders to establish a framework for multiple stakeholders to set shared goals and focus on coordination and accountability. That's the biggest thing with Vision Zero is you have to have an accountability piece. This is a systems-based approach. City leaders commit to and prioritize a systems-based approach to Vision Zero focusing on the built environment systems and policies that influence behavior as well as adopting messaging that emphasizes that these traffic losses aren't preventable. The hardest thing that we do in traffic engineering and one of the things I think public safety may do as well is changing behavior. People love to speak. They always build your way around it. But we've Vision Zero will help us get some guidelines for that. Data-driven city stakeholders commit to gather, analyze, utilize and share reliable data to understand traffic safety issues and prioritize resources based on evidence of the greatest needs in America. I pointed out earlier the crash report, we do collect a significant amount of data. We probably, you know, should for Vision Zero need to collect more, but also share that data with all users of the road. One of the things that are failings in my engineering team is that we collect the data. We post it maybe to the website, but we don't utilize that data, but it's not necessarily put out and shared in a city-wide message. Community engagement. Opportunities are created to invite meaningful community engagement such as select community representation as well as force broader community input through public meetings or workshops, online surveys and other feedback. Community engagement. It will fail without having the community involved as well as getting their input. Transparency. The city's process is transparent to city stakeholders and the community including regular updates on the progress of the action plan and performance measure. Some other strategies that are pulled from those components leadership, collaboration and accountability, prioritizing community engagement and equity. Setting a timeline to achieve zero traffic tests. Collecting, analyzing using the data. No way design when growing from that data that prioritizes safety. One of the biggest components is managing speeds. There's data that are good studies where the difference in surviving an accident is significant if speeds are 30 miles per hour or 35 versus a 45. In terms of some of the management of speeds some of the elements of the vision of your commitment would be looking for light cameras. Speed cameras. Traffic enforcement tools. Traffic enforcement in general. So what will it take? Free simple items. It's going to take resources. It's going to take some funding. And it's going to take time. We're not going to turn it around every year. It's going to take a number of years from that commitment. After we produce an action for results to really to get the budget to start taking it on. Next steps. Let me talk a little bit about next steps for everyone. In the midst of doing a lot of different things with planning and all these other things we're very excited about what's happening and what's coming up. The first piece of this is only the transportation already planned. This is the portion of the vision Walmart plan that talks specifically to transportation. So in the first quarter of next year we've got funding available and we'd like to start moving forward with the idea of updating that plan. It's been a number of years 2016 since it's been done. So it's tied for this to be forward. With that plan with whatever was going to happen with vision zero we were still going to bring vision zero part of this plan because it just makes sense and we wanted to bring it in front of you and ask for your direction on that as well. For the first quarter of the year we're going to start to put together some spoken elements of that to really talk about we'll talk about this a little later in the presentation about how we're kind of changing the narrative and one of the future transportation pieces that we've been talking about so we're swapping it up we're kind of changing the discussions of it. Number one issue is the safety. So vision zero fits really well into that and it can be part of the TAB process and it can be part of that implementation piece that we're talking about. So those are all things that can happen and what are going to happen in the next year regardless. So we feel like we're on a good track but we're certainly going to hear about some of this as well. And then the TAB recommendation we actually went to take the same presentation to the Transportation Advisory Board last night and they came back and said people would like to make sure or recommend a council that they and they weren't taking direct action tonight but they knew that you might want to hear what they have to say. So they did talk about what's to develop the plan needed to implement vision zero. Return to TAB and council with the full development plan eventually to begin in the budget for all management implementation pieces in vision zero. Basically beginning in 2024 is when that's going to really start moving based on the TMP that needs to happen in 2023 and we just assume that that element of vision zero is part of that with your direction of question. So we're going to resume it again but that's part of the TMP piece as well. They did say they want the TMP to enthusiastically endorse and now this is going to quote endorse vision zero as part of the planning efforts for that. I don't want to say closing thoughts but closing from us thoughts from your staff this part of it. The vision zero really started in Scandinavian countries and they have a commitment to many modes and moving people by very many and different modes educating the public really consistent traffic law enforcement throughout the country which is a national policy piece. So what we're saying is we're a western United States city. A lot of western United States cities and a lot of United States cities have to take one of the American cities I should say to try to take on vision zero without all those elements in place. So you can't just drop a vision zero planning down and the only thing that you do you can't just be going on and it needs to incorporate all these various elements of what Jim brought up before really the education piece enforcement piece being on board with the police department with our community services folks with our columns team with engineering and planning and it's going to it's going to take all of us to make this work well and so you can just do vision zero you can go through the steps and do this work in other cities that try to just let's just check that box of doing vision zero and doing a really good plan without all of the elements we don't think it's going to work it just proved it out it doesn't seem to work in less and one thing we didn't mention and I didn't mention was community it takes community buying so we need to get the education piece out there but we need feedback feedback is this working for folks so a lot of things going on as you can tell by just the way we kind of laid it out it's going to take a long time so we are asking in the next section we do talk about how patients use and the results because this is going to take a lot of effort the safety as Jim mentioned as well there's a speed factor piece of that but that's also there's a vulnerable population factor so how do we build better facilities for vulnerable populations such as people who walk people who bicycle, people who are waiting for transit and transit has to be a better service as well it can't live with what is currently out there for transit so we need to take that next step and the TMP will help us do that take that next step on other transit opportunities and there's a few folks who have been listening to some of the things we've been sharing and there's other possibilities for really robust transit in the long run it's going to take again time, resources and money so we're really just pushing for that all modes have to be safe comfortable and reliable to make this larger obviously driving is fairly safe very reliable and very very comfortable so we've got that one covered and it's really talking about being a pedestrian in this town walking in this town, if you feel safe if you have a reliable trip that you can count on the infrastructure being there for you and it's a fairly comfortable a fairly comfortable experience if you have a place same thing with bicycle same thing with trying to ride a bus do we give people comfortable places to wait for a city bus sometimes yes so those are all things that we need to look at and that really builds toward that transportation mobility plan that we want to move forward and the future of transportation I think that's just part of that as well and part of the scoping that we like to do for the transportation master plan is really flip the current ideology and paradigm where we really talk about what we call new traffic it's all about the discussion about normal and seriously traffic and 85 percent have speeds and those kind of things we've really done a great job of moving traffic it's time for this transportation mobility plan to flip that over and talk about the most vulnerable users on top and that's the safety of the most vulnerable users which is typically those pedestrians riders, bicyclists and then we get to the single-optima vehicle that's kind of that last place maybe in this new idea we'll certainly float that by that's just riding out the scope of getting things kind of moving down that path we'll need buy-in from everyone at this table we'll need buy-in from our transportation advisory board and then again back out to the community and the different folks are part of the city to make sure we're on the track but I think we do want to flip the narrative and that's kind of what we're thinking about so with that if you have any questions you would really like to hear from you at this point in any kind of direction if you want to answer your question and one thing that I didn't hear as much as I would have both is and maybe at the end of the planning that you will hear more of this but community is a big organization with a lot of different collections of people and stakeholders in it and I think the earlier the better that our communications organization would come out with essentially contracts not in the sense of I'm going to sue you if you don't do this or that but understanding that I as the school system I as a transit provider I as a property manager and committed to certain ways of doing my job that are supportive of the nature of Vision Zero because I can see lots of ad campaigns coming out of that you know I'm for the safety of our children I'm for the safety of our elders that would essentially get people on the idea and get the community behind the idea as early as possible and I'm a lot of good person to think about what those little actions might be you know I mean to LHA make sure there's never I mean so on the sidewalk that kind of stuff but the people who do those individual jobs should be pretty good at figuring out what those things are any other comments or questions Yeah, no questions Go ahead So the school district was one of the Indians listening on the first slide and we had any conversation in the school district I don't see anybody in the school district here is there a dialogue occurring in the school district but that would be part of the TFP process that's a major player we have opened that conversation We do have ongoing meetings with them but I don't think it's the only person to understand You mentioned success in skin and avian companies less so in the U.S. Are there any U.S. exemplars who would point to municipality X, Y, or Z as examples of systems approach and systems based on the kind of data they're collecting that are usually we would think of as exemplar in the practices associated with or required if you're going to seriously eliminate serious injuries or deaths and could that's been your motives The best example would come up with the city board They adopted the GZRI using it They have lower data, lower some of their fatalities They are actually their average is about 2,000 fatalities in the last five years On the other scale on the other side of that the city of Denver who actually adopted the GZRI their accidents and actually just in comparison their trouble information would be a pretty big success and they had some success in adopting the program that was actually Is that it? If I can share a list There's an efficient zero network has a national map of probably the 20 U.S. cities that have adopted it whether they see success or not I haven't really dealt with it I think part of what we've talked about is if you look at transportation systems they're going east coast to west coast and the impact of the car culture and what it looks like and some of those cities that are more densely populated have more robust transit including bus some version of rail a stronger walking culture and those things they tend to do better just because they already have things culturally in place that's sort of the culture that already exists and you can almost look as you're moving east to west the further you get to the west it's a different issue because it's a different culture within the community and I think that's the part of the community approach in terms of that car culture and the natural inclination to speed and those types of things because our communities weren't built in the way that those other communities and I think that's the timepiece that they're talking about is why is Boulder done well when you drive in Boulder it's more congested you're not able to move at the speeds that you've moved in a less congested street so that's lowering the speeds which is addressing all of those issues versus in other communities where the roads are wider and people tend to drive faster it's all of that it's just a reflection I appreciate the fact that Boulder is doing this if there's one lunch over and over and over again it's don't turn us into Boulder so it would be nice to have another exemplar to you other than Boulder I'm just saying I'm not saying we're good looking for Boulder if that's it it'll be a more difficult road here or road to Plow if we had this just two more questions what does accountability look like because you mentioned the problem what does this look like in this context who's accountable for what, how would we know and so what I think we laid that out in the action plan and laid the goals and then the accountability piece would be a 400-year basis success or failure and for failing, what changes do we make to get back on track there's also a recorded feature that TAB has asked that we report to that whole supporter and we would report to Council once every year to talk about where we're at and what we're going to do so what would be encouraging to me to hear embedded or derived from Vision Zero but is this set of standards or trip for whatever for violations or taxes but in my mind accountability starts with clarity on what's the standard of performance that you're aspiring how are you going to know where you've met that and what are you going to do when you don't you're going to do high-fives when you do the answer to the third question in my mind would be what's the kind of virtuous cycle you get into how are you going to learn and what are you going to do that how are you going to get out of it and what's the plans for improvement just saying apps and standards and they're out of their policy accountability look a lot of different ways it just seems to me that's in my mind what this ought to look like when we talk about standards we're going to be clearer accountability we're going to be clearer on standards in these areas boom, boom, boom, boom here's the optimal performance we're after and we're going to collect data on these cycles right to make certain we're meeting those standards and if we don't we're going to learn quick we're going to learn fast and we're going to get what we learned and we're going to be two references to public engagement and education what should be the role of elected officials in both what does that look like what's our role in the public engagement process in the public education in that sense no it's going to be critical what do we do what are we doing differently if it's same old same old yeah that might be that vision it's a real plan an action plan that needs to be very specific about what we need to see leaders to be conservative in the process and how they give themselves a message that we sort of can't really then it's going to be can't answer the question exactly but I just think that action plan is pretty good as far as how that brings out your role I think those are questions that come out in the TMP in the plan as we're building it we will outline all of those issues in the plan in terms of who has what role who does what we haven't started on that because we don't have direction from council to start on vision zero and so once we start on it those will all be components of the plan that we will outline and outline what we want you all to do when we did the compost there was components in there where council members were part of the advertising campaign and were putting out messages and so now we'll all start folding in with the plan as it's created right now we're here to talk about here's what vision zero is do you all want us to proceed in the TMP we will line all of those areas out okay it's a safe it's a safe to assume that for us to be successful for any municipality to be successful there's a different set of behaviors or responsibilities for elected officials or we just we just show up on Tuesdays we go through our agendas and hope for the best can I can I comment to that at this point I think what I've always wanted is that council as a group discusses what it is they want to do and what they are capable of doing and I think that might be after the TMP comes out for us as a council as a group to sit down and say how can we carry this message forward rather than having because we know what the TMP will be we'll know what the message is what would we feel comfortable doing and how can we do it because we're all different and I think those discussions from us together would be helpful I don't mean to be argumentative but I do think I think it should be a robust discussion but I if we're doing nothing differently or we're only doing what we're comfortable doing then that would explain why a lot of municipalities have not done very well in this because people fall into the same patterns of behavior without clarity and expectations or what's going to be different for them and I'm down with Vision Zero a lot not knowing what the expectation is but the expectation may be that we abandon one council meeting a month and do public forums on Vision Zero and invite the public it may be that we abandon meetings in the council or change the charter so we can go on the road and be all over town it may be a lot of things we host meetings in our wards or not knowing those things I'm up for all of them but not knowing those things and then being confronted later with well this is what it's going to mean if it's only something uncomfortable I'm going to take a step back and I think if I can either that gets on the typical council meeting if when we look at this they say resources it is adjusting our budget process to make sure that we can adequately fund what we want to do so we talked about red light cameras and speed cameras let me just make a point right there I saw resources, funding and time if I were to put resources funding and time as bullets under resources because those are two of the most valuable resources the other huge resource are the people in this room and how to utilize the people that's part of it and I think the answer is if you look at it from a traditional sense it's reshaping how we look at budgets and how we look at funding maybe the cameras are $5,000 a month per camera per camera $5,500 per camera so if you cover the entire intersection you get $4,000 so you're looking at $4,000 a month for one set of red light cameras in an intersection so you're looking at $480,000 a year and maybe on a five year contract so that's just for one intersection so $480,000 per intersection if you want to get all the lights and I think so to talk through this to go if we're going to embrace this and we're going to do that people will come to us and go everything that we've heard when this came up before big brother shouldn't be doing this and if we're going to embrace the concept of vision zero we've got to know how to do certain things and really withstand that storm this is part of that solution or speed cameras because we can't put officers of every intersection we can't have them in every neighborhood and so we need to be able to utilize these resources so that it can really be a force multiplier for us so that we can hit those goals at lower speed limit fewer fatalities so it's going to take that kind of piece and that's where we really need support do you remember when we redid I mean we got a lot of pushback about that when we redid how do you have it and things like that so it's if we're going to make them run at this when we get into those situations you know we need support or if we need to change design standards on streets where we go we don't need them as wide as we normally have and we need them more narrow which will cause no cars to back up and people talk about congestion we need to be delivered and constantly referring to vision zero and that's really where the electives come in is to be there in this and be champions at the end of the day you will lie in all of these components out but at a high level it's very specific into how we make funding decisions to as broad as how do you all become champions and when we're dealing with these issues be there I've seen cities that have done things like this and got a little too hot because somebody needed a curb cut for a business or somebody needed this they lost focus on it and I think those cities ended up moving away from what they were trying to achieve so can you just I just want to make sure I have a clear understanding that a plan will be created and we know that there are other departments within the city that we know public safety, we know communications we know these departments will be involved in this plan is that correct and so you said that from what I read what I remember is that this plan could take up to a year is that correct and so from us you just need us to say we are all for this plan for you to create this plan get it going and in the meantime you will inform us as you are progressing with the plan the idea is that we were asking for direction tonight on the vision zero element of the transportation mobility plan we want to do the transportation mobility plan regardless you think a big part of that plan is the vision zero so we're asking for the public for your direction on what we should formally adopt a vision zero stance for the city of Alabama because we will need to come back to you if you say yes we need to come back to you we've talked about this earlier of resolution basically states that were playing for a vision zero city and here's the steps we're going to take I think it's a good idea and I actually feel that vision zero when it's communicated to the public will be the backing for some of the changes we want to make in the city we'll explain why we're doing this because there are too many too many changes that are made in all the areas but essentially in transportation where people don't understand why we're doing that so if we make vision zero of everything we're doing in transportation I think it would be easier to sell like ways changing streets crosswalks lack of them everything if we just always push the vision zero I think it should definitely be part of the transportation but I also think that we need to be clear as to what vision zero is in our community that's key we don't want to confuse everyone what's the difference and so I just think we need to make sure we have a clear description as to what that is before we go out vision zero of everything I agree with you Councillor because some of the push backs are going to be shouldn't we always try not to have gaps in the plan so I think that's a good point alright thank you so first of all my question wasn't brought up here and I know that it's been spoken out a little bit before is possible funding that's related to vision zero either from state or federal levels you know anything about that funding channel well there is through Dr. Cox are you going to interrupt you there is through Dr. Cod grants because they have a huge vision zero from the state to adopt and they are looking for grants from the state and federal level but we don't know exactly what those amounts are what we missed out was in September there was a headline for vision zero planning efforts of the action plan and so that was up to a million dollars for that level of effort we could move into the next project funding which was up to 30 million dollars for a publication about vision zero planning and that was again this year so I don't know what it's going to look like for next year but that gives you kind of a scalability I think of how much you need to do the action plan and certainly if the action plan is something that comes out of transportation mobility plan you would choose those dollars or even if it was part of something that you wanted immediately we'd go after those dollars to the next possible chance so there's the possibility there of recouping some of the expenditures you know as far as the implementation of automated enforcement for instance, you know, like cannabis and bicycles and things through that application if you have the action plan there's two components to this on the funding one component is grants to do work the other component is in transportation dollars and grants that aren't specific to this we are seeing I think the state said they want to see vision zero program so is that correct so it's two funding sources correct Phil? The state has a funding source for sure but in terms of just normal grants they want to see cities move into this for other transportation grants is that correct so it's starting to become a requirement for other dollars as well okay and so then also in kind of the revenue concept that we had to go in the segue a little bit is considering cameras and things is there kind of projected revenue per intersection you know traffic counts that goes through that intersection as far as citation revenue is concerned yeah so let me correct that but I apologize I gave you the wrong numbers it's about twenty two thousand dollars it's about two hundred sixty four thousand per intersection about one point three million dollars if you wish to do it in five years so you can limit the number what we look at early on what we've seen just in some conversations with followers in other areas you'll tend to see a higher number in the beginning because you're getting used to it and then you can see that number so when you're talking about revenue it's very limited because the state puts a marker of seventy five dollars per violation so you can't go over that number so it's typically different when it walks your observe it pulls you over and writes your ticket there's a different time amount but the state has set a standard regular seventy five dollars for violating that because if we look at the civil penalty versus the municipal criminal and so you have to figure out basically to cover your costs to buy twenty two thousand twenty nine dollars to try to figure out either way the point I was getting at is there's obviously some sort of revenue streams be it grant funding be it citation revenue that will offset some of these costs right and the one I'm most concerned with really is the enrichment of our intracity public transportation system compared to what we have now as I think that is a very pivotal and key portion of Vision Zero community and so that's the one that I think would take a lot longer to implement than say adding cameras and that kind of stuff lowering speed limits depending on how the whole plan goes and so just wondering you said that there's broad work being done all day and I now have this conversation looking forward basically your answer to me was it's going to take a lot of different partners and stakeholders to make that a reality how close are we to getting towards having that conversation for making that a reality great question we are working right now with somebody from the private sector that has a very interesting role that we would like to pursue further so we chat a little bit about the events a lot to make you part of that discussion so there's some interesting things that are out there we've got this cost dollars which is cost numbers for what that would cost to provide and this would be part of the TMP is that 15 minute trip across town people who don't have access to cars or anybody that's where we're starting so there's some things out there that we're looking at they're not simplified by any means at this point but I think it provides we actually see some light at the end of the tunnel like the tunnel that's our TV that we feel like we can there's a little light out there that maybe there's something beyond our TV that we can jump on and maybe transport up in Fort Collins and running the flex bus services in the long run too there's a bunch of different partners that we share at the time I do believe that I read recently that RTD is starting to look at the concept of really just being a regional provider more so than having municipal services at least that's what I read from various directors in a regional meeting RTD is saying we finally got our costs under control which basically means we're not going to have the power to service anywhere else in the district we've got right where we need it and our revenue and expenditures now so we know we're not going to get more service in the long run we're at we don't even get the regional services that we used to get so there's a couple things going on there that we are excited about trying to change that discussion so at the end of the day I'd like to see vision zero included in the TNP process because I'm generally in for the vision zero so I just want to add to a conversation about the interest city I had a conversation with Deborah Johnson the CEO of RTD and asked her if we're interested in having our own local services fashion that we're working on and this is actually a conversation that has been happening in many cities in the RTD district to be able to take those buses and put them regional with the drivers and not using for local and what would be the possibility of the amount of dollars that RTD is putting into local a percentage of those coming back to the city for us to be able to run our own service and it is in the discussions it's being looked at as a partnership with RTD and probably the county as far as dollars but it's just a discussion at this point and I'm really excited about the fact that they're realizing they can't do it all and even if they wanted to they just can't so those conversations are moving along to the question earlier when you look at you can call this map up to the Vision Zero communities you can see how it's dominated on the east and west coast and then in Central US there's not a lot of cities that are doing that and I think that's part of it most of them in Central US are larger communities in the point of I think transit speaking so if you don't have a robust transit system it's kind of hard something to give you a sense of what may be this is purely theoretical what do we need to do so a purely theoretical situation we kind of got into during covid when we did the parkways so we called the parkways and we essentially took a lane down on Main Street and something that comes out of this may very well be a conversation of in order to increase pedestrian safety in this area we need to reduce the lanes from the street to this street to one lane in each direction I mean that's very much driven by vision zero to reduce severe accidents, pedestrian accidents that theoretically could be some of the hard decisions that come out of this and how we look at it and being committed to saying yeah we're moving on to vision zero and I just throw that out because we all know what we got into when we did that but if you talk about something doing in perpetuity and you're committed to vision zero and these issues are there that's some of the things that we're going to need from the elected officials some of these potentially paradigm shifts in how we look at transportation I have some remarks Susie you haven't said anything do you need to say things or okay so I didn't notice that you were going through this that a lot of the pieces parts of what this plan would look like or that underpin the plan are things that have already been discussed whether it is a new relationship with RQD a new provider the automation that you're dipping our toe in there with I think it would be a great thing to incorporate into the plan this inventory of we are already invested in this at this level and kind of a ramp to what we would need for goals I think that would be a nice way of approaching at least part of it but what I would really like to see and you said it might take as much of as a year to get this plan together but you also said Phil that there was one ramp deadline that said yeah you need to have a vision zero resolution in place and a second parent deadline for if you have a vision zero resolution in place what you thought become eligible for and if we could assume it's possible put those things in our plan for a plan as milestones so that we don't inadvertently miss something and then you can come back and say council we need you to find us some money so that we can get some more people to help us with this right at the beginning because if I learn one thing in the private sector it's really hard to add resources at the table of the project so let's get those milestones and then I see Shakita going oh yeah let's get those milestones in there early so that we have a really a really set date for when we're going to expect to see this plan and have time to pass a resolution because I'm for it through the got put down at the time when everybody was for traffic safety because we haven't just lost a permanent resident I don't think we've forgotten that yet but let's get it out there while people still have not forgotten it and yeah I don't have a present for us Sissy councilman no I don't have any questions no I appreciate the introduction to what this is I am supportive and I think I heard council member Waters is for putting it in the community here's my so Kevin may call I'll get one more comment yes and if I'm asked tomorrow what does this mean for me as a resident when will we have a robust trains assistant that's a prerequisite for this what does accountability look like who's accountable for what my answer to every one of those questions is I don't know those are kind of questions before we have these sessions I understand this is looking for guidance do we move forward but there's a lot I don't know that I would have to say in response to questions I'm supportive I'd rather not be in a position to say I'm supportive I'm certainly supportive of the concept of reducing traffic incidents death traffic and collisions accidents but you know there's just so much I don't know about any of it but conceptually I'm I think we're moving forward but I wish we had more questions that somebody should be asking we just threw down the gauntlet three weeks ago right no we talked about vision zero in february 2020 was the first time we talked about vision zero well yeah but then we said no what we did we said we were not ready to move forward so between then and now there's some of these questions we could have anticipated and I have a better idea of what the expectations are I hope there are some if it's same old same old and there's no reason to think anybody's going to be any safer no I think you go to the definition you know the definition is zero deaths zero serious injuries and so on and so forth and so I think that's part of the you know I was looking at some of the data that we have and you got to work off the data right to go what do we want to change and so what we know is that highway 119 in main street 17th in main 66 in main 119 in crack partway partway over in 119 over in nelson 119 in marten over basin and over you can see where our progress are and then you can see the fatalities with the barriers and when you're running off the data it's like so what do we want to change we want to change what's happening at these intersections and reducing and that's kind of the next dive into this is to go what are we changing here's what we're going to change here's what we're going to change about other things and every area is going to present itself and those are things before we bring a resolution to you all we will have that what do you think when we hook into a bigger plan the state's vision zero that we have more of a roadway into grant funding and other forms of resources in marten that the resources are needed for them to really get going as well like they need to hire up consultants they need to get all of the things they need to get started with as well so I think getting the transportation master plan knows the first step getting it in there yes and then we also last year we asked for a vision zero so those are the things you're going to see as well as these requests for people to help us the resources needed to help get it and to be clear on this I think part of it is so here's the first change if council says yes we're interested in this and we go into the TMP that's going to alter how we look at transportation because we're going to bring these concepts into the TMP in vision zero which will impact funding and how we look at budget issues so it's not a transportation management plan that we've had here for the last 30 years it's going to be fundamentally different and that's why I think for the public using vision zero as the reason for some of these changes is a better message to put out that everything we're doing is for safety so vision zero do you think Jim and Phil that if we had more pre-sessions a year on this topic alone to get started would that be helpful for you to have this discussion because sometimes what it's just brought to council it's more difficult to have this discussion yeah why don't you want to see it before we take it up to the council everybody here can tap thank you as well do you have your direction do you need anything more from us that's not it so here's where I'll say operationally based on where I see where council wants to go on this we're going to start moving operationally to get the resolution ready to start the work on the transportation master plan to get you all the information you need we will be looking at other things so if there are projects that aren't in play that we know may not be in alignment with vision zero it's highly likely we may slide some of those back until we understand this I don't want to pull the trigger on a project that we know is probably not going to be in alignment with where we're heading to be at vision zero so we're going to adjust a lot of things as we're moving in this and I'm going to be adjusting the staff work on some of these issues as well do you have an example or two if we were looking at a widening project we would go does this widening project really take us to what we're looking at at vision zero or is it something that's designed to look at flowing traffic through and not having congestion I mean that's a prime example of where we'd go what would this look like under the vision zero lens and should we look at it in a different way and if the answer to that is yes then we're going to hold it so it's going to make us rethink a lot of things that have been on our capital agreement plans for a while that may not be in alignment with vision zero and that may in turn free dollars up to then do some other things Zach how will this affect your department so Jim and I and the staff have already been working with Jeff so some of the things along the slide we're already working with so as far as staff Jim and I'll just take two seconds to cover you're really looking at the direction of the council whatever it might cost identifying the top intersections that we're having these issues at because these things are stationary they stay in the intersection that's where we're at so I'm understanding this is an expensive product it does have a link that the goal for it is not to carry this in revenue but to change it so I think I can remember some of my shared stories this would be maybe you or someone else that they were in a car approaching one of these cameras oh there's my son, yeah so they have them at Fort Collins yeah and so immediately he hit the brakes as the light was changing yellow instead of trying to beat it knowing that oh there's a light here so you could see a change in behavior most people are just definitely asking yeah in two months his behavior has changed in his driving they have those red light cameras to literally it was at night and you have to see if the flashes are going on constantly and so his behavior changed dramatically so again identifying those intersections where we have many issues the other part of that is that's always where we're at but using odd tools which is the famous of intersections to be able to get real-time information that we have crashes and determine those things other things that we've done such as the use of equipment to scan scenes where we can do in a fraction of the time it took us a few months to do hours and have intersections locked out causing problems for traffic and then the other piece again there's a sign that's on one of the screens that Jim Hista had actually purchased repainting the cloud software base but as folks been in the city council they're being complicit that people are speeding and racing down the streets this is a device that we put up in the neighborhood and we get real-time information in three hours so it goes into the cloud because of the speeds, the average speeds we break down the high speeds and the low speeds and it's the hour of the time of the days so we can use the resources that we have instead of sticking drugs out of your ruby go sit down here for four hours and see what you see we now even take data over a period of time share that with traffic but we're also able to send enforcement out there at that period of time when we identify the violators put the signs as portable so we're able to move those around the city as soon as those complaints come in that helps us use our resources smarter instead of just throwing band power at a problem that we don't really need or what's the frequency of these time and date and so a lot of the things Jim talked about we're already working in partnership together to get those things in place and using technology on it so again there's a lot more to the plan I understand that we're able to develop the resources and share the resources in that data to address some of these issues and traffic needs to be addressed for the city and I think from what you all can do there's some low hanging fruit that I think we need to focus on pretty quick and it really is on the communication side so over the last six months six to nine months if you go on North Main Street at night I was up there and I started noticing it across the community the amount of people that are jaywalking and jaywalking and dark clothes yes it's something that is USA problem and I've come close a couple of times you just don't see it and you don't expect them there and I think that was one of the areas where we had a fatality or a serious injury adjacent to the Starbucks and Main Street so those are some of the things that we need to put on the list and move it up pretty quick because we don't need to wait on that because it's getting bad and what we're seeing so those are some of the things we'll bring as we're talking to you all especially on the other lead streets so have we ordered our little ill-way trinkets for the summer fairs because we could order reflective tape to keep it away we're actually going to be done with that truck it's safety fun that you the council approved a couple of years ago this year we're going to buy it we used to get those little winky lights from the lights we get some more reflective pieces that last forever so the things that have batteries that die are gone so could I go to your second slide as I'm thinking about what I just heard about red light cues and behavior modification or not we're with the language about changing about behavior change how does that play into the vision zero side of this as opposed to the traditional approach as far as red light cues and so on no, because the language is vision zero and the camera is about trying to do behavior modification I thought I heard Jim say this is not behavior modification this is a whole different approach I think it's a behavior modification it is a behavior modification I think the I mean what resonated with me is on the traditional approach is that's our name inevitable it's based on perfect human behavior whereas this is they are preventable and you integrate human failing in an approach and so when you look at the human failing that's where the behavior modification comes in to minimize the human failing so to that point Lake Britain is doing a very interesting paper if you have jaywalking there's a flashing light that can actually monitor the street because it's going to happen you can put a crosswalk less than we have jaywalking today crossing less than 50 feet from the jaywalking crossing but that's the piece where we're talking about anybody human failing in an approach because people aren't going to do those behaviors they only have to get ready for them so Lake Britain has a flashing beacon that kind of goes on if there's somebody in the street you kind of get ready for because it can actually monitor and sense people in the street so there's interesting things that happen to some of that I lost my mind three nights ago so we were going south on Bank Street and someone was walking across from where the gestures the location is across the street literally the crosswalks up here and because of all the traffic you couldn't see and that it is behavior modification and that critical part of this was a key example he was on it it was amazing to see the difference so so in Boulder they have adopted vision zero I've noticed when I'm riding around especially you know as a walker it's hard and I can empathize why people might jaywalk when the intersections are so far apart so it's just easier to jet across the street I don't know this by experience but I can empathize I do notice in Boulder they have a lot of crosswalks with the flashing lights and that's something I'm all for flashing light things would we be able to utilize those especially along the street in some of our areas where you know it's a greater distance between intersections we're actually looking at C dot right now to install the first flashing light on the east we have other ones around the city the first one on the state highway we're currently looking at installing our early next year 17th street the challenge right now is the product we use has about three to six more orders simply to get the materials our staff has worked on it we have installed them on the city they've been successful we will continue to use them the challenge on Main Street is that we're going to see that and I think that brings in the broader holistic design conversation because Joni and I were talking about there's one on right where the signal is it can be a bit of a fiasco there too because a lot of people are driving and then it hits and somebody knows so that's not the end I'll be on either because the broader design actually comes into play too we get into the culture too because we're good to other countries like Canada, Scandinavia people are just taught to stop once they see anybody on the side of the road because the expectation is that person has the right to go across and so we're all about the colors and we're going to get to that next draft because that's what's going to stop us but not anybody on the side of the street culture is big even on the signalized intersection here in front of the building I think we've had three people here two or three that work for them two police members yeah at least two and we had umpteen people almost hit and it's on a walk signal and other countries also don't have a right to a red signal so I mean that's a cultural thing I don't know what's ready for that right now but it's I remember when I first moved here a couple of days ago and our principal at the time you know you're in Longmont when you get to that light and yellow means go faster and red means three more cars go and that was just kind of that was the culture and it hasn't changed it's good to know you've been working on this we're just putting a name to it yeah so make some dummy red light cameras so that people wouldn't it's just flash yeah so based on this we're going to have them work on the resolution we're going to answer any of the questions that you all had as part of the backup for the resolution and we're going to include that in the transportation management plan we didn't want to go too deep based on we didn't know where the council was we'll start moving and we're going to reprioritize them I'm going to ask for a motion to adjourn if you're ready so we have our Hispanic our sister city's name so I'll move it second all right here it is what's the bar now