 Welcome to Jenkins governance meeting. It's the 26th of January, 2022. Great to have everybody here. Thank you. So topics I've got on the agenda news, Linux platform support support policy. I'm going to move easy CLA a little later than dropping support for IE 11 and highlights from the mailing list and community forum. Anything else that needs to go on to the agenda. Well, good for me. Okay. All right, so then by way of news, Uli Hoffner presented a Jenkins online meetup today on the Jenkins development environment setup that he uses to get his students started very rapidly and Jenkins plug in development. We had over 50 attendees, good responses, we did a great job presenting very well well spoken and clear what he was doing and the configuration he uses is publicly available. And the UX CIG had a good session last week where Jan Faricic presented his latest iteration of Jenkins UI improvements, the recording is available and link there. And it's looking very good. The LTS baseline includes many of those but he highlighted even more that he has pending. So 2.3333 32 will include many of his changes but even more are coming. And then thanks to Gavin, the JRuby and jifon based plugins have been dropped from the update center. And so, I didn't really, I wrote a blog post that the only bit of this I was involved in and everyone keeps claiming I got involved. I mean, that's, that's already that that should remind you that you can contribute to open source in many ways and in this case you contributed very nicely by sparing people. We should do what I think we're going to do. Yeah, but I mean everyone's taking me on PR is all in the face of my guy. Really, all I did was mention it. Yeah. I like. All right. Well, I mean separate at any moment. Okay, understood like thank you. Thank you for joining us. That's great. Topic I had opened on the mailing list was around Linux platform support policy and wanted to hear if there are any guiding points from the governing board like I thought your point was very, very reasonable that hey this is not really a governance topic per se. So it could just proceed through the technical discussions on the poll request. Any other guidance that others want to want to offer or like that you want to offer on that one. Well, no particular guidance, it would be great to have any kind of documentation because currently we don't. Linux is generally more tricky than other platforms, because, but again, it's not just Linux, there are many target architectures. This Linux distributions may be running from. And if you will document it, I would rather be specific. What, what architecture would be included, because we don't test on anything beyond the MD 64 the moment, while we have some arms setups, but the configuration matrix becomes much more complicated. Good, good point. Yeah, so, and actually we do, we do perform at least minimal testing of the installers on AMD 64 arm 64 and s 390 X. Thanks to some work from folks working at IBM. But you're right, it should be stated explicitly and it's not. So that's a good, good point. Something to improve eventually having any documentation is better than having no documentation. Well, to be honest, I would expect Jenkins to run on all distributions, more or less. So historically we had issues with some font packages which were not available on some platforms. I still remember and believe it was deep in or whatever. What else you had for generally use standard Java it shouldn't be big deal on MD 64. Right. Good point. Okay, thank you. And in general, I'm on board with this, you know, having something in place a good I'm just concerned about the word support, because we already get a lot of questions on the forums for supporting me we don't support. But I don't have a better, like it's a standard term it just scares me. So for windows support, it's quite explicit what support means. And we also have support MD, which is also quite explicit but supported doesn't mean that we provide any kind of silly or whatever. Yeah, so I think you can just copy one of these disclaimers and that's it. I said I'm not actually like overly concerned, but it's just one of those things is in my back of my head, my head going, it's going to, it's going to be a problem, it's going to be a problem, it's going to be a problem and I'm like, no, probably won't be. What if. Right. I think it's a valid, valid point we at a minimum it feels like we should have consistent phrasing across the pages where we use that particularly sensitive word. Right. The word support is sensitive and we should try to be consistent. We've got the word support on the browser page and we've got it on the windows page and it should be consistent across those two pages and this Linux page, but it makes makes sense. Great. Thank you. Okay, any other concerns or comments there. Okay. Sorry, go ahead Oleg. Okay, so next topic was, again, that the dangers were dropping support for Internet Explorer 11. So, Tim Jacob has proposed a poll request noting that Microsoft will stop supporting Internet Explorer 11 as of June 2022. And if they don't support security fixes for it. I don't feel any compelling reason for us to support it. His recommendation is let's get it into a weekly now that it's not supported. LTS baseline is already selected so that gives us until June before it would actually be visible in LTS that it's not supported any concerns there or governance topics that we need to be worried about. I think it's going to be more aggressive about it. Honestly, I mean, you know, snarkiness aside. I, no one who's going to who's using IE 11 is going to be upgrading to lasers and Jenkins. You know, just by the nature of people using old tech they don't upgrade to news tech. So I think we could literally drop it now and nobody wouldn't be able to make a fuss. The fact that they might see it blog post saying we're doing it. I think we should be clear on what support means just like it's been like 10 years since we updated that page to just be like, you know, we run, do we run automated tests, we don't run a cross cross browser automated tests I think we only ever do one at a time anyways. So just, you know, very clear and what audit it means to be so does any differences between core and plugins you know this is this is core supports it not necessarily a plugin support it. And long as the same as the other, you know the same Linux port long for clear with all those things, then I think yeah we can be fairly aggressive about it we can even start removing code, you know if you wanted to. Okay, thank you. Good insight. Yeah, I agree was given. We can be more aggressive. Technically, at the same time, there is no practical reason to be more aggressive, because we can declare that it's basically duplicated in a weekly effective immediately. Yes. Yeah, the only case if there is a security vulnerability related to Internet Explorer discovered until June, which is, let's say quite unlikely. So, I think that it's okay to just drop it and force it until the next LCS when we get it to the guidelines. Great. That makes sense. Now, is when I asked him to come about this when he's, he felt like it probably didn't even justify a blog post. I'm great with that as well. In most companies, but maybe put a tweet out, but that's it. Okay, no trap said okay we're not booster for five isn't going to be a 11 that's it they didn't make a big fuss about it. No blog because that's it. You know, again, people who are using IE 11 are not the ones going to be in the latest versions. Great. Okay, so no blog post that's really great. Excellent. Thank you. Okay. I would phrase it more as no blog. Yeah, no blog post needed if someone wants to write one. We're not going to drop them. Right, right. We won't forget it. Okay. I only asked for a great guy. Yes, yes, and that makes sense. It's a great guide is update your computer. That is correct. The upgrade guide is use a different browser. Well, I definitely know a company, which is still using internet expert 11 is the company standard. I won't mention names. There are quite a few that will have it installed, but almost all won't require mandated like I used to work with companies that mandated he had to use internet spur. You can now have like a portable install or a secondary install of Firefox so you can still use the old apps and IE 11. Wow. Yeah. But a lot of those ones that are not doing that are so mandating Windows 10 and Windows XP so again they're not ones are going to upgrade so I don't really care. Okay, good. All right. Anything else on Internet Explorer 11. Okay, next topic then was easy CLA Oleg excuse my putting this on the agenda without consulting you first is there anything you'd like to share on it. Well, we are happy to share. Not that I have much to share. So yesterday I had a meeting is the LFX team. We discussed the rollout approach for Jenkins, because they had a lot of concerns about whether we tried to roll out easy CLA for three southern repositories right away. And I repeated they said no in the ticket but they still wanted to have a meeting. And so current update that we have easy CLA installed and enabled for inflex CLA. So this is our previous repository where we used to use to push certificates. We haven't updated the guidelines yet on this repository and we need to update guidance on this repository. It's my action item. I will do it right after I complete for them recordings. Right, taking the date, but okay. And the, what else. We also discussed the name of it for Jenkins Infra. So I admitted the request for me. For the dot GitHub repository, which practically makes no sense. But, yeah, I just wanted the bot to be technically enabled on this repository or someone wants to enable it. Because for me it makes sense if it's enabled for some infrastructure repositories where we don't expect white contributions like, let's see. Let's listen for charts, etc. But it's totally up to the infrastructure team to decide. And the use model then LFX. I was assuming the use model was once I've submitted the CLA to infra CLA that that's done for our repositories but that's, that's not the case I think is what you're saying is that eventually, it may be that we have easy CLA enabled on each individual repository. So currently, CLA won't be enforced, unless you enable the CLA bot and range protection on a repository. You can enable it basically just by clicking a few buttons as a maintainer. But if you don't enable it, then the CLA won't be enforced. Basically, the previous behavior remains, but if there is a repository where we want to enable CLA, then you just enable it up up. You can do it as I mean, you don't need infracting for that. And then you have for CLA enforced. Okay, all right, so it's, it would be up to individual repository owners for instance, plug in this or plug in that that might say I really want a CLA enforced on my repository. Yeah, I think I think to be clear, it's the CLA not a CLA. Oh, right. One CLA for the entire org one for infra one for Jenkins. Yep. No, it's actually one. And if you send the CLA currently you send it basically is the continuous delivery foundation. So all projects under the umbrella including text on et cetera, you can also contribute the same CLA. Okay, so I'm going to repeat this because then my can write notes and I can make sure I got this easy CLA is currently a Linux or wide the CLA earth. EDF wide. And then we have it installed on the, or at least functionally enabled on both Jenkins and Jenkins infra organizations. And we have to enable it per repo as we as we desire it. Cool. Yep. That does thank you very much. Oh, and we got to throw in note here that we're not importing the old CLA right now. So for silly. I will send the request why it's required because the document itself changed. So you cannot just assume that the home ever sent previously. I would send a slave with the continuous delivery foundation. Yeah, and I think that the fair requirement I just want to make sure it's noted. Yeah. Okay, so, so by not importing the old CLA is that means that to be compliant, I would need to submit a new CLA as would others right when this becomes available is that correct. Your employer will need to submit a company silly. Got it. Okay, how it works. So if you submit contributions from your company email. So basically, at cloud base.com. So if cloud base science company a silly, then a silly what will accept any commits, which assigned with this domain. And if there is some magic behind. But if you have an individual CLA, which is also mapped to your hub account and then everything is fine. Great. Thank you. So there are some additional tricks for company silly. I haven't really investigated them because whatever. Yeah, I feel like info is a good place to test on this because they're less people. Yeah, I'll probably enable it for James father on the currency. It's not actually developed. I maintain it, but there are no external contributors coming to the project right now. So it's related to silent and I could play with it. Listen. Thank you. Thanks very much for doing that Oleg. Just getting to the line. So, yeah, another feds up so currently LFX insights is disabled for the Jenkins community. So if you want to enable it we need to submit a request to the next foundation. That's the one that does like security scanning of documents and stuff right. And now it's well basically LFX insights is a fork of COSS, which was adopted for the next foundation needs. But it's basically tracking, you have contributions social media, whatever is aggregator. It has some security metrics to but it's not the main goal. This is like metrics not actually like tweet deck or something that will let you post for this is Yes, just a little bit for analytics. It connects to Twitter analytics and post it from the same for LinkedIn, Facebook, whatever. Mark you want to say we have to say, if we want to enable it we have to send them a ticket. We said Oleg. Yes, we need to submit a ticket. Yeah, you did. I have some experience of handling that just bug me. Yeah. I'm happy to be able to enable it for captain. So I'm happy to continue and get for Jenkins for reasonable. The biggest problem right now that the captain is a sandbox project in the since year. So we do to get full services from the links foundation. Link to help enable it. Not he's not able to do it. Is that the way to say it. Yeah. Thank you for that. Thanks. Or maybe even mentor, but I think help work fine. Great. Okay. Anything else on that topic. Okay, last topic then highlights from the mailing list and community forum. Gavin, anything that you wanted to highlight here. Nothing comes to mind I haven't been paying attention so but nothing comes to mind. Okay. So just because there's been no LTS has been no major notes. The meeting minutes continue to be well received. So maybe one question about the contributor summit discussion. So it was started by Alice and Kara one week ago. So, yeah, the question is whether there is a consensus that we do it. I don't think there's a consensus yet but there's there's interest. And I think it's worth having the discussions to us to check the interest. I would like to do it. I think it would be a help, but it would need to be a hybrid local and remote, because if we just make it there in Austin, Texas, I don't think we're going to get the attendance we want. To be honest, I have so many reservations about hybrid events. So I would rather do separate offline event and online event than try to do a hybrid event. Okay, all right. It's my personal opinion. I guess somebody has success stories of doing great hybrid events. I don't. I've never run a hybrid event so I have no success story to tell. That's a good question. Yeah, so, yeah, in my case, I'm not sure whether I would be able to go to Austin. I will start my visa application process next week. It may succeed in time, may not, there might be coronavirus restrictions. So, generally, I want to go to CDCon, because they will go to the Foundation members summit, the governance board meetings, etc. So, generally, it makes sense for me to go there, but he visa is unclear. Yeah, yeah, speaking of another side of the world, is anyone going to keep on Valencia? What's in Valencia? I missed that. Oh, no. So, why am I asking? So, in Valencia, there is part Jenkins. And if we ever do a happy hour there, then I know even for us. Oh, how cool. There's a bar named Jenkins. Yeah, Jenkins. So, yeah. That's possessive. Okay, well, interesting. Okay. Yeah, so, yeah, I'm currently organizing kept in community today. It's probably a big work, but I'm making some progress today. And if there is a critical mass of contributors, if again, it happens, we could also have a kind of small meeting there for those who don't go to QCon, maybe together with Jenkins sex, maybe without Jenkins sex, but yeah. Good. Yeah. So, let's see. Okay. Yeah, so I'm assuming that the contributors summit discussions will continue in those public threads and, and we'll try to settle on, okay, do we have critical mass to go ahead and do a collate located and or should it just be virtual, etc. Yeah, forced and yeah, we can ask Ryan. Ryan doesn't work for cloud bees, but probably he would be willing to help us with organizational site. Ryan Campbell. Yes. Ah, cool. All right, any any other topics for today's session. All right, thanks everybody recording will be posted. Thank you for your time.