 Hello, welcome to Kwok Tok. I'm Crystal, Tuesday 11 o'clock. You know, Thanksgiving seems like a long time ago, doesn't it? But we're still in the festive mood and we're talking about traditions. We're celebrating things that mean a lot to us, whether it's family or friends or traditions. Now I'm talking traditions because I wanna talk about the concept of how things change sometimes with traditions. Sometimes people dare to break the norm. Sometimes people dare to just change things after being a set for so many years. You know, changing a side dish on your Thanksgiving meal is not going to kill the meal. When we come down to our lives, what happens when you do change? It shakes up things, come on, Trump's here. Things are gonna change, oh my God, are they? So what do we do when we face change and why do we actively or proactively decide to change things that have been set for so long? Today we're gonna talk about this through this artistic path of our wonderful guest today, Pam Tong, who is the artistic director of Valley Hawaii. Welcome, Pam. Thank you, Crystal. Nice to meet you. Lovely to hear you see you here. And I wish I could have seen you on the days when you were dancing at the Atlantic Valley. Atlanta Valley was a wonderful experience that I had for 10 years of my life. My daughter also danced in many of the productions in Nutcracker, of course. We moved into the Fox Theater every December and we did at least 35 performances of Nutcracker throughout the month. And that's Atlanta Valley, the Fox Theater in the middle of downtown Atlanta. So you mentioned Nutcracker, guys. This is what we're gonna end up going back to is the Nutcracker here at Valley Hawaii that's coming up. But the Nutcracker you did then, was it traditional? Was it the classic? Very traditional. My director was Robert Barnett and he was one of the original members of the New York City Valley with Mr. George Balanchine. And so we were allowed to do Mr. Balanchine's version of the Nutcracker. So I did that for 10 years and it was most wonderful experience. We always had beautiful costumes and sets and an orchestra and it was a time in Atlanta when businesses wanted to have a quality of life for their employees. And so we were just always given the best of the best as far as costumes and sets. You mentioned that your daughter danced with you. Yes, tell me about that. Yes, she did. That was one, that was my daughter and I. That's great. And the magazine did an article on Nutcrackers and they happened to choose us and that's a picture. And that's you in the back? My daughter and my back, yes. Why couldn't they show your face? You should have had a little old closet. Well, they were doing it on and they called, the Balanchine version calls Clara Mary. And so that was what they were focusing on is the different nutcrackers around the country. And so that's how they happened to do a number of pages on us. What was really funny is that they had a picture of the two of us cooking, which was not my biggest project. Portech? Hey, you can't be good at everything. Yes, pointe shoes were baked in the oven so that it hardened. So that's what's for dinner, mom. So we had a wonderful time in Atlanta at the ballet, very wonderful memories. When you say it was traditional, you were doing the same thing every year. You look forward to that, but at the same time, did it become tiresome? Never. Never, sit there before you even finish the sentence. No, it was the Balanchine choreography I think was so beautiful, it was never tiring. And there was always something new to bring to it, within the confines of the choreography. So you can, you can bring meanness in something old. And freshness, and doing so many performances, you had to find that, but that was wonderful because you had the ability to play with your performance. So it wasn't like, it's difficult here because we only have four performances. So there's a lot by the time we load into the theater and then every performance, you have to make sure that you're doing whatever is being done. And so there's a lot riding on it. I know nerves are high. Sure. How do you feel about the concept? Let's go back to your personal life and how traditional of an upbringing did you have? And your values on that? My mother took me to ballet when I was age three. Her best friend was a ballet teacher. And so I trained at a very young age, as much as you can do when you're three years old. But I continued on until it was difficult to continue the lessons and it wasn't affordable. So I had to stop taking ballet classes in my training and I went into something that, I mean, that was a change and having to make the best of it. I became a cheerleader for the rest of the year. That's a little opposite of how we are. So I had to give up that dream of dancing in a company because it was not affordable and the situation didn't lend itself. Okay, so giving up a dream, what does that mean? Because that sounds quite heart-shattering for a lot of people who believe in dreams. I think that I've always decided to make the best out of what the situation was. And I think I talked to you a little bit earlier is that you have to make sure that what's around you doesn't control you. And as I told you so many times, I've had situations where things have changed and for good, for bad, and then you have to dust yourself off and make the most of it. And I try and teach that to the students that I have that you don't always get what you want. And what you have to do is, as I said, work harder or decide to do something different if you feel like that's not for you. But you can't pin your whole life on one thing and be disappointed. It doesn't lend itself. What was the biggest change you had to face in your life that not necessarily was for the better? I was married and, okay, that was a big change. I mean, I grew up in Chicago. I was in Arizona going to the School of the University of Arizona. I ended up marrying someone that was from Memphis, Tennessee, and we had a child. And after five years, I was presenting flowers to Rudolph Nureyev and Fontaine. And I was backstage looking at them. They were doing Swan Lake and I thought there's something that is missing in my life. So I started taking adult class, getting back into shape, and I started dancing with a company that was in Memphis, Tennessee. Okay. And then from there, dancing a lot didn't lend itself to a marriage. Which ballet was this? That was Potta Cotte, Carlotta Greasy. But that was in Atlanta, Atlanta Ballet. Right. So I went to Atlanta, I was dancing with a company and I went to Atlanta to be with a friend who was auditioning for the company. And Robert Barnett hired me. And so I was faced with, do I move? You know, with my daughter. Crossroads. That was a crossroad that I had to do. And the person that I happened to be with said, if you don't do that, you will never realize all that you're capable of doing. Wait, so your husband at the time allowed you to choose that path? No, I was actually separated at the time. Okay. And we were on the way to being divorced. So it was, and what he said was, that you'll never realize your potential until you try. Well, isn't that nice that he had the support for you? He understood that, that was missing in my life. So my daughter and I packed up and went to Atlanta, you know, with our sheepdog. How old was your daughter at the time? My daughter was seven. Okay. Did she know what the concept of change was gonna be for her for moving like that? I think she was so young and she did love to dance. So that was a part of, we lived in Buckhead, which the studio was right there. So we were able to be a part of that whole group. And it was a wonderful family that I had in Atlanta. Do you remember leaving the moment you left your home? It was very difficult to leave to your family and friends in Memphis, but it was a new adventure. Yeah. And I had my daughter and my sheepdog and so off we went. Yeah. Sometimes you have to throw yourself into something. When I moved to Hawaii, I had lived in Hong Kong for 25 years and people back home would be like, why, why is something wrong? People don't understand that you are actively pursuing something because change is good. Sometimes people want the comfort of being the same. Yes? Yeah. For certain. So what were the biggest challenge of change at the time? Finding a place that was secure and near the studio and knew the school that my daughter was going to be attending. So we had to do that. She loved horses as well. It's dancing. So in the area that we were in Atlanta, which was a suburb, I know it's changed now after the Olympics that it was all within 15 minutes. What year was this? Or years? 75. I was with Atlanta Ballet 75 to 85. So you didn't have any segregation issues or anything like that? No. When I first moved to Memphis, that was when Martin Luther King was assassinated. So I was there later than the times where it was black and white, colored and white, which was I never, even living in Chicago, I never felt like there was any prejudice. And so I'm fortunate to have grown up in a family that wasn't prejudice and was very understanding that we're all the same on the inside and doesn't make any difference. I don't mean to bring politics into this, but with Trump here, do you fear any type of... I don't. I don't fear that, no. I think that change for the country is going to be really good, I think. That's my opinion. Okay, okay, because change is good. It's gonna bring out things where we have to figure things out. It is good that maybe it wasn't going the right way. And so we'll see, and I have great expectations for these next four years. Yeah, good, okay. So we've got positive change on the table here. So moving forward, so you went from Atlantic City, Atlanta, the valley, and why did you move to Hawaii? What brought you that change? Well, my mother was going through a bout with cancer. And I went to be with her on our layoff. We always had a layoff after the season, was finished. And so my daughter went to be with her father, and so I went to be with my mother. She was in Arizona, and so I stayed there, and my sister had saved pictures of Ronnie Tong, who is now my husband for 31 years, and he was playing polo in Oak Brook. And I was just graduating from high school, and so we dated for a year, and then we broke apart because his father was hurt in the polo accident in Capulani Park. And so things changed drastically for him. And so we were separated for 20 years. And I was single at the time in Atlanta. So I was going through all of the relationships that I had done incorrectly, or went wrong with this or that. Maybe the wrong was right. I mean, it helped you define what you want. So my sister had all these pictures because I think she had a crush on my now husband, Ronnie. So there were all these pictures of him playing polo in Oak Brook, which is right outside where I lived in Chicago. And so I was like, well, call him and see what he's doing, you know? And I was encouraging her to call. And so he was going through a divorce himself, and he was helping me to get through the illness of my mother. So we talked for months. And after all the nutcrackers I came out here, and it was New Year's, and I got off the plane, and after 20 years he had less hair and I had more wrinkles, but especially after all those performances. And it landed. So we had a long distance relationship back and forth for two years. And then I had to make the choice to leave Atlanta Ballet that I loved. I love the director, I love the repertory because we had so many wonderful ballets that I was able to dance. And I had to decide this change in my life. Big one. At that point in my life where I was working in the artistic section, I was ballet mistress for the director as well as jumping into the ballets that I knew. So I was on the side of my career that was going into the teaching and directing at that point in time. So you really were, it was a real torn decision. It was. But that's life. It was. You know, putting something very strong on your table and to choose. I'm making the decision to move to Hawaii. And it was quite a change because my husband had four children. And so I became a stepmother. This is like something out of a ballet. It was like Green Acres. You know, I came to Tong Ranch and everything was green because that was the color of his polo colors. Okay, okay. And it was actually a cattle ranch. Was it more than you bargained for? It was certainly an eye-opening experience. And I used to wear white in the city. And so that's why I always wore black because after being at the ranch with red dirt, I realized, okay. See, there's always a reason for everything. I love that. Pam, we're going to take a quick break and it's interesting to hear how a relationship kind of affects your decisions or maybe even the stability of you as a person, as a performer, as an artistic director. It all kind of combines together, doesn't it? Yes. So we'll come back and we'll continue talking to Pam about her life in the ballet world and why she decided to change the nutcracker this year. Aloha, everyone. I hope you've been watching and think that Hawaii. But I'm here to invite you to watch me on Viva Hawaii every Monday at 3 p.m. I'm waiting for you. Mahalo. Aloha, I am Reg Baker and I am the host of Business in Hawaii with Reg Baker. We broadcast live every Thursday from 2 to 2.30 in the ThinkTech studios in downtown Alululu. We highlight successful stories about businesses and individuals and learn their secrets to success. I hope you can join us on our next show on Thursday at 2 o'clock. Until then, aloha. Aloha, Kako. I'm Marcia Joyner, inviting you to navigate the journey with us. We are here every Wednesday morning at 11 a.m. and we really want you to be with us where we look at the options and choices of end of life care. Aloha. So, back with Pan Tong from Valley Hawaii here. It's talking about the concept of tradition and change. Now, when I say that it's because Nutcracker's always been a most loved tradition, Christmas tradition. And this year, Pan, on behalf of Valley Hawaii, decided to do a little tweak. That's the least we can say about that. Well, this is Valley Hawaii's 40th anniversary, 40th year. The company was originally started by former mayor Frank Fosse and it was done with the CEDA funds that were given for the salaries for the dancers. But the board of directors was formed because the city could not actually take money out to buy point shoes and costumes. So it was the training program, the CEDA funds that were set up. And so that's how Mayor Fosse felt like no city could be complete without dance. Good. Thank goodness. So before that, there was really not much of a Valley. Not that I know of, but he felt like that would be a necessary company to fund. So he, after a number of years, the company wasn't able to sustain the salaries for all of the dancers because it is a great cost. So they were disbanded, but the board of directors stayed on. And so that still the board of directors that I work with. Okay. So backtrack a little bit is that when you came to Hawaii for your love of your life. Yes. How did you come across Valley, Hawaii? Did they pursue you to become there? I had worked with one of the dancers, Nicholas Bacana, who is one of the original company members of Honolulu City Ballet. And so that was something that I naturally went to visit the, they were in the Waio'i Tea Room in the gymnasium. Okay. And so I had worked with a number of choreographers, Sonia Areva and Torzukowski with the Atlanta Ballet. And so they were doing Cinderella. And so I came to be in the gymnasium with them. Were you still performing at the time? I was, I had given that up because when I moved to Hawaii, then I thought I'd retired. And I didn't intend. I love that. I thought I retired. I thought I was done with that, but no. Going to a new chapter of my life. And then so I started teaching 12 little dragonflies from Cinderella, a warm-up class before they did their rehearsal. And I was helping Sonia and Torz with the production that was going to be at Christmas instead of Nutcracker. So that was a deviation from what was usually done. And... Do you have, sorry, do you have a favorite ballet? I'm just curious. I do. And that was Serenade that I did with New York City Ballet. And, oh, those are pictures. Look at that. Do you remember, it was that, so this was Ballet Hawaii when you came over here to... This was, yes, and we were in so many different studios and not the studios that you know now of you and your daughter, Rick. It was, we... We moved many a time from Wiley Tea Room to the Chinese Cemetery. We were over on University Avenue. Then we went many different places. What do you mean? There's a cemetery, there was like a room for you to... There was a school there. And there were, actually it was a wonderful place because it was right... You should do Giselle there. Oh, I know, I know. There you go. At night, we have a midnight performance right outside. Yeah, it was kind of scary. It was right at the edge of the... But no, it was a wonderful place and you could see the waterfall and that was lovely. The thing about Ballet, though, I'm sorry to interject all the time, but there's a beauty, the stories behind... If people don't understand Ballet, if you can look into the stories underneath all that beautiful dance, there's a really a lot going on there. It's historical. And it's a universal language so you don't need to know anything about dance. As you sit in the audience and it's the excitement and it has to touch your soul. That's why when also I teach the children, they have to know how to project and connect with the audience. Otherwise, they're a robot. They could be, they could just be some sort of animation and not really there. And I think that's what is exciting about the privilege of working with a symphony. And they have the music coming from the pit that is so glorious. And it's a little bit different every time. So they have to listen instead of working with a CD. So that's an experience for them. There's nothing like that energy. Now all the years that you've done so many nutcrackers, do you have a favorite part you played? Because I know there's a picture, I believe, of you doing the Arabian. As Arabian. Was that? The Arabian was something that I did with the choreographer for the version that we've been doing for many years, Tom Pasek. His choreography we used prior to this last year. And that was the balancing set and version. How do you feel when you look at pictures like that of you in those days? What do you feel? What do I feel? The joy of having done that. I mean, I love that role. It was something that was exciting. Such a sensual role. Yeah, and the music is so incredibly beautiful. It's enticing. It's intoxicating. And the partnership and that that I had. So that was, that was wonderful. And I didn't have to wear pointe shoes for all those that month long series. We always, I always did the main mother and Snow and then Arabian. So I got to take off my pointe shoes. You have to be very nimble. And I think nimbleness is something that, is that you again? It's the same. That's the same thing. It's the same color. Okay, color. Right. Look at your muscles. Just like, wow, it's gorgeous. That was a while ago. But no. Is that a, it looks almost like a painting, like a rendition of it. But it is a photo. It is a photo and the sets, it's just the other one. It's gorgeous. Wasn't in color and those were sets that we had. But Pam, don't you think that the beauty of the nimbleness and the grace of a ballet dancer kind of translates to life? You know, it's the best metaphor of how you need to be kind of flexible in life when change comes. That's true. That's true. I mean, I was always more flexible than I was as far as strong. So I mean, the strength I had to develop as far as inner, inner self. Right, right, right. And you take that with you. I was more flexible. I hadn't thought about that. So I mean, my body type, I was, as I said, a more flexible and I had to really work harder on strength. But as a person, do you think you're flexible or do you actually are stronger? I think I'm a people pleaser. You know, a lot of the time, but then when I get backed up into a corner, you know, I will fight for what I know is right. And at the same time, you need to be stern with all these girls running around, girls and boys, you know, you have to kind of keep that. You see, I think that I need a balance and Septine Weber has brought that to. So tell us who Septine is. Septine Weber is a choreographer for our new Nutcracker. And that is this year's rehearsal. And he was rehearsing. In the summer, we didn't do a production, which we usually do a full length. What we did is we workshopped in our summer intensive, the choreography. And Septine just has the knack of pulling all those dancers together. He brings out the best in them. And see, I came, I did better as in a nurturing background with teachers. I felt like I gave more when I was in a nurturing atmosphere, but not all students need that. Sometimes they need that strict discipline and not, you know, not so nice drill sergeant. And so I like the balance. Is Septine a drill sergeant? He's wonderful. He's very kind, though, but in his choreography, of course, that he knows what he wants and he's going to get the most out of each and every one of the people that are in that cast. You know, sometimes when I come to pick a bread and I just look at little glimpses of the rehearsal, there is just a storm of energy that I feel even from outside the glass because he's putting something and the girls are just following and they're just like this flurry of snowflakes like in the Nutcracker. And he's not satisfied until they give their 100% and more. And that is the beauty of that. I can be then nurturing and then he can be the strict father type that will bring the most out. But you do need balance, don't you? You do, you need balance. And because a lot of that, and if you have a drill sergeant all the time, they lose their spirit. That's right. And you can't take that out because that's what comes forth in the performance that people connect with. I'm glad you said that, because the art of ballet on one hand is so disciplined, so focused, but if you don't have that little bit of passion or that spark that comes out of something that's individual. And didn't you say that about your daughter when she was... She went to Shanghai Ballet and it really just almost killed her spirit because they just wanted a drill. Everyone was the same. God forbid you have your own personality. But it's interesting culturally that everyone has different ways to deal with their core values. Right, and you build the technique that way. Yes. And so, but if you break their spirit, you know, it's funny, my husband always trained horses too. And he said, well, you can't put the bridal in too soon because you don't want to break their spirit. And you have to have that energy and that, that, I guess, has... I wish I had this for those of you, Pam. How do you keep the spirit in like a traditional piece like a nutcracker while changing it? Because you didn't even talk about the change. Let's talk a little bit about the change. The change is very exciting because when we were embarking upon our 40th year anniversary, I wanted to do something that was related to Hawaii, set in Hawaii. And so, 1858, Mary Dominus had given the first Christmas party with a huge tree. And she and her son, John Owen Dominus, were in the home. And so that was a natural. And when Subtein and I walked into it, the first Christmas of my life, the whole story of nutcracker unfolded because we found out Mary Dominus lost her as he kept in husband and she had to take in boarders. So therefore, Council General is going to appear, the father and Clara and Fritz and the grandfather. So they are the boarders that are in the Governor's Mansion, Washington Place. And the whole story unfolded. And so from the battle scene, if you stand outside or did at that period of time, you could see all the way to the ocean. So that's how the battle scene is, the pirates are coming out of the ship. And we have a wonderful dolls that are, it's all set in 1858. So there's a Pueo doll that is normally the soldier variation and a hibiscus bud open. Pam, because of the limited time, I'm gonna have people go and buy tickets and see nutcracker. But what would you like to say to people with what you have and what you want to bring to? I think that this nutcracker is going to be the most incredible nutcracker they have ever seen. And they will love the whimsy, the relationship to the Hawaiian islands, the beauty of a lush tropical garden and our snow scene is set up on top of the island, Hawaii Island of Mauna Kea and Mauna Loa in the background with a beautiful moon. So that's why our snow is set. And when does it start? It starts on the 16th, 730, 17th, 730, and also 2 p.m. That's our last performance. And again, folks, this is the first change, the revamped traditional nutcracker set in Hawaii, beautiful Hawaii. So please go and see it. Beautiful guest dancers. Yes. Oh, so thank you so much for your time. Very cute. Very interesting life. Thank you. Thank you. Good luck with the pretty program. Thank you.