 So, thank you. Is the mic on or is it? All right. So thank you, Roland, for the very kind introduction. I don't think I come back here enough. I graduated in 99. I spent 10 years before coming back, and there was a little bit of change, and I came back on Sunday, so nobody was in the office, you know, and everything was locked. But at that time, I was at least with my family, and now I'm here another eight years later. It's been too long, but at least I spent a full day here, and everything's changed, but nothing's changed. It looks and feels the same, but there's so much different construction and activity going on, but it had the same vibe, the same energy. As I saw it when I left, I started this morning at 8.30, and I saw this whole list of meetings, and I said, oh, you know, I'm going to come dead by this time at 4.30. I'll be tired. But, you know, beating some of the old people that we, you know, Roland and Tony and many other people that we met with, and going from meeting to meeting and, you know, having lunch, for whatever reason, instead of, you know, draining me of energy, I think that and a good cup of coffee before this perked me up. So, you know, Stanford has forced me a lot of memories, one memory, and again, just to note here is, Stanford was the reason I got married, too. So, you know, I was working for around four years, and I said, you know, okay, if I'm going from a graduate degree, I think getting married before going would be a wise decision. And for whatever reason, I guess the brand got me the wife I had. I passed whatever screening, and I got the better end or the better side of the deal on that. So, again, so thanks, Stanford, for me getting married, and I guess my kids thank Stanford as well. So, I have four children. It's very pleasing to be here. Again, thank you, Roland, for the introduction. Very happy to be here. And what I'll do is I'd like to talk about Capsaric and who we are very briefly, and then I'm going to actually transition to talk about what's going on in the kingdom. There's a lot. There's a lot going on. A lot of activities going on there. Now, Capsaric stands for, again, that long title that Roland went out, and it took me about six months to memorize it before I got it down pat. But it's King Abdullah Petroleum Studies and Research Center. One thing I emphasize is the center is not just about petroleum. We're about energy. We're about all forms of energy. We're agnostic on any form of energy as long as it best benefits the society that we're working on. We're an international center. We're based in Riyadh. Majority of our work, a lot of activities, of course, are in the kingdom with all the and goings there. But we also have a lot of work in China, and we have a lot of work in India. And the reason why China and why India is obviously this is where a lot of the energy growth is. We're not a public institution in the sense we're not. We don't report to any government institution. We report to a board of trustees. The board is chaired by His Excellency, Khad El-Falih. And that's the effect of who I report to. So anything I have to do, I have to go through the board, budgets, whatever, I would have to go through them. We're also advised by International Advisory Council, a composite of different international figures. And anybody can pick up their phone and Google who they are. It's on our website. But the bottom line question is what do we do? I mean, if the question I ask ourselves is what are we doing? We have a mandate and we're very lucky to have this mandate. We ask ourselves, can we improve the welfare of societies? And we try to do that through the lens of energy, the lens of energy economics. So we look at energy, it's intersection with technology, it's intersection with policy. And obviously you have to look at energy and intersection with the environment as well. Questions we ask ourselves is can we make, let's say, energy more affordable to people? That's one question we ask ourselves very deliberately. The other question is can we generate more value from the existing energy we have? Purposely look at the issue of energy productivity and we look at energy productivity that allows you to ask different questions and perhaps when you would say energy efficiency. Because if I have limited resources I can say, okay, maybe energy should not be here. It's better for the economy if we allocate these resources somewhere else. The other thing, the third thing that we're very purposeful on is we look at energy policy. In many cases, policy objectives and policy outcomes are different and they don't look the same. So we try to understand collective decision making, understand how people make the decision to understand incentives such as we can develop policies that are more sustainable and more pragmatic. So a lot of the team are social scientists. So we have a composite of social scientists, we have a composite of engineers and economists. In total we have about 65 researchers full-time as well as visiting faculty. We come from about 20 nations. Demographics-wise we're about 30% of the total population is women that are based in the centers. Again, we have, we publish, we publish on our website, our own work. We also publish on our free journals and that's been going up as we started to mature. Going back to our history a little bit, I keep on saying when we were born, we were born when we started hiring people. Beginning of 2013 we're about 10 people. Today again we're at 125 with about 65 in research right now. So we're coming, we're maturing as an institution in terms of the number of people we have but our work is starting to mature which is going to align very well with the talk I'm going to be giving about what the heck's going on in the economy. One thing in the Kingdom economy especially, but one thing again I like to emphasize, I think quality work is essential. That's absolutely a prerequisite but that's not sufficient. Sufficiently is only gained when our work is consumed and that's the mission and that's effectively what we have to do and that's the end game that we emphasize time and time again. The work, it's not output, it's impact. That's what we're after at the same time. At the same time if you overpush that and if you pressurize that the concern is you start looking at short term stuff and you start looking at incremental stuff and you start not taking risks. So that's something we have to balance. We have to take an intellectual risk. We have to push the boundaries on one thing. We have to fail smartly. If you don't fail and if everything works and I'm sorry we're not a research institution and we're just doing a little bit of consulting stuff and that's not what we're about. So we have to take intellectual risk but at the same time in the end if our work is not consumed it's not sufficient. As a result of that we try to develop relationships that are a little bit different. We try to engage with what we call key stakeholders and the key stakeholders allow us to work a bit deeper with them such that we understand what the questions that they're being asked at the same time. They would take the work that we have and they would consume it and they would again operationalize it and it could be again a lot of the work right now is in the Kingdom but we also work in the other geographies I was talking about. We work with academic institution. We work with industry. We work with government. We do just seminars. We have an open sharing platform. I mean we're a nonprofit institution so anything that we have will share openly. We don't ask for any compensation for it so any model that we have we again if you want it you can have it. If you want the source code you can have it. The data that we have if it's generated by us and you'd like it again you will share it openly. If you want the raw data again we will share it openly. One of our collaboration platforms is we have a lot of workshops and we call them energy workshop series. They could be around different themes and subjects. They could be around energy systems modeling. It could be around energy productivity. It could be around energy transitions and we publish this based on a non-attribution basis where they're cumulative and we call them a series because they're cumulative. The output of one workshop would be the input for the next workshop and then you can again build the body of knowledge and a community around that subject. Also we have a conference. We had our first real conference this year. Well actually end of last year with about 300 people, about 200 in the kingdom, about 100 from the outside, plenary session, opening sessions. But the main theme about these workshops is we want to enhance dialogue we had. So we had round table sessions about six hours on the first day around six different topics and the same thing on the second day. First day was on the kingdom, second day was international. So again this is I guess a bit more than five minute of it or pitch of what we do and who we are and how we actually work and we have questions I can also answer later. But let me get into the meat of this stuff. I'm going to be talking about the kingdom. The kingdom is going on through a lot of change. Some of you are maybe aware of the activities that are going on in the kingdom. The kingdom has commenced its I would say most substantial diversification reform program. Riyadh right now is an extremely busy place. I almost cancelled my visit here as a result of some of these activities. Now the kingdom has had decades of dependency on economic or on government spending for economic development and for economic growth. The kingdom's economic prosperity was dependent on oil prices today. Oil prices, oil basically is about 60, maybe 70% of the current economy. Higher prices equals more spending which equals more and higher economic development and the opposite of that obviously was true. We had significant down cycles and we had down cycle in the 80s. We had a down cycle in the 90s and each down cycle called for diversification. Each down cycle called for reforms and the responses in each of these down cycles were typically fiscals, there are cuts in spending, but what happened after each of these down cycles was the prices became healthy and the calls for reform, the calls for diversification became muted and immediately that happened in the 90s and 80s after the fiscal pressures were released. The kingdom is in the middle of one right now and you guys are probably very familiar with this and this is after more than a decade of significant growth where government revenues increased by five times in the past I think 10 years. Now the initial response to this cycle was the same, from a fiscal perspective there were cuts and again that's a rational response to what the kingdom faced. However what I see in this cycle it's a little bit different than what I at least what we read about in the previous cycles. I will not argue that I was old enough to see exactly what was going on, I was not part of the government then. It's different, but it's different where I strongly sense that the kingdom looks to be addressing this cycle more systemically and much more structurally. Though there is a belief that hydrocarbons will be part of the energy mix for decades to come, there is a recognition that hydrocarbon resources are not sufficient to support a growing population. The demographics of the kingdom is changing substantially. There are over 30 million people living in the kingdom right now. About 2022 are Saudi citizens. Half the Saudi population is below the age of 25. Diversification, creating opportunities and jobs is best done from a position of relative strength where the kingdom is right now and this is a way that drive is now coming from. Now this is the backdrop and a little bit of the story on this cycle's reform program and why there is motivation for change. Again, last year the government announced very ambitious and very public goals that were transparently shared. The kingdom announced the national transformation program with a vision for 2030 and that was announced back I think in the middle of end of the second quarter of 2016. The objective, very public, is to create a more open economy to diversify it, to be less dependent on its hydrocarbon resources and to be less dependent on the state. Basically to move the state or the economy towards one that is more based on merit and more based on market principles and this includes privatization of major state-owned enterprises and many of you have heard of the privatization of Saudi Ramco but there is also privatization of other sectors of the economy as well and they want to support the private sector much more. They want to encourage a lot more localization. They want to create an environment that's attractive for both local and international investors. Now, interestingly enough, the vision that was developed was developed over the course of a lot of months and a lot of late nights and I know that they were spending 8, 9, 10 up to midnight working with different institutions. In fact, there were over 20 government institutions and ministries and each one of them developed 8 goals on average that aligned with the major objectives that the vision called for and each goal, when this is interesting, each goal was very transparent and so they shared openly so if they're not doing well they'd say this is where we are and that was shared openly but they also shared exactly where they want to be by this time and this is again an opening and being more transparent government that you perhaps would not have seen a few years ago. Now, the 2030 goals, for example, would include an increase in the private sector's contribution to GDP from 40% right now to 65% by 2030. It also include or one of the objectives is to share the, or raising the share of not all GDP export, not all GDP export now is about 16% and they want to raise that to 50% by 2030 and that's significant given how large the oil or the hydrocarbon economy is within the kingdom. And there is changes and also an ownership regulation. Full ownership now is open for investors in almost all sectors and there's also a view to improve the demography of the labor market and this also publicly includes increasing the participation of women in the workplace. They want to increase the participation of women in the workplace by 40% to reach 30% by 2030. Again, that was a very public goal that the government stated. Now, other major goals include the kingdom seeking to position itself as a major regional, logistics hub, linking continents and countries in the region through enhanced logical services. The kingdom borders to, you know, it's a peninsula, so border season both sides. It also links different continents if you see its position between Africa, Asia as well as Europe. There are major infrastructure investments that are in progress and that others that are just to be started and again to improve the links within the kingdom. The ports have already been given to private contracts to operate and there's still enhancements to the ports of the kingdom. Reforms also include increasing the infrastructure investment in kingdom so there's massive mass transit investments that have been initiated in the kingdom and I don't know if anybody who's been to Riyadh right now, you cannot drive from one place to another place without having detours. So there's huge investments in the kingdom to improve again the efficiency of transportation within it. Rail will also significantly increase. The kingdom is also looking significantly towards mining which has though, it's ongoing major strides over the past, I'd say three or four years, substantial investment will be made in the near future. Another major goal is to create itself as an investment powerhouse and so they have the public investment fund and they see it and they seek the position itself as the world's largest sovereign wealth fund in the world by 2030 with more than a couple of trillion Riyadhs, maybe a few trillion dollars. And this is why they want to do that. They want to unlock strategic sectors requiring intensive capital inputs and I'm going to return to this and maybe talk about this later on in the talk. In terms of how this is actually being pushed, this is being pushed, many of these programs are being pushed through a council of ministers. This council is called the Council of Economic and Development Affairs. This is an important council that was recently formed. This is chaired by His Royal Highness, Mohammed bin Salman, who's pushing a lot of these certain forms. But interestingly, not only issues are presented there, but they're actually very carefully monitored and I've seen people being held accountable against this. The council is very active and I don't see that decisions are actually being delayed. They're actually moving very quickly relative to what I've seen in recent history. Government also has been restructured. For example, the ministry has been reshaped recently. You can look at, for example, the integrated ministry of energy industry and mineral resources. And this ministry on its own is probably 60% plus with the current kingdoms economy. They integrate power. They integrate industry. They integrate that with oil and gas. They integrate that with minerals. Underneath its umbrella includes renewables. Underneath its umbrella also includes its national labs. Now, just to give you again, this is the National Transformation Program. This is what's going on. I'm going to move back to, again, the heart of the discussion, which I want to bring up, which is around energy. Now, the background first on what's going on. Local energy consumption by 2030 is expected to double from what it is today. The kingdom has been providing energy prices, especially liquid fuel prices. It's above production costs, but still much lower than international market prices. And for example, if you want to use a barrel of oil for whatever purposes in the kingdom, if you're allocated that, a barrel of oil in the kingdom for local use is $7, given to, let's say, $55. And that gives you a scale. So diesel, HFO, all of them were much cheaper than what you would be able to sell it internationally. Households, obviously, because of these low energy prices, electricity was not that expensive. Households consumed based on the low cost of energy. As early, I would say, as 2015, I think on about 15 to 20% of total monthly expenses was just from energy. The kingdom used low energy prices to encourage capital and investments to industries. And so that was good, I would say, in the 80s to 90s and in the 2000s. But as a result, we've not been using energy as effectively as we would have. So the value, as a result, maybe not as high as you would have expected or would have wanted. So the energy productivity of it was not that high. In fact, it was reasonably low. And what I mean by energy productivity is the GDP to the economy for every BTU of energy used was actually very poor. And if you look at the much of the world over the course of the past 30 years, you look at major economy such as China, Europe and US, India. Energy productivity have increased by 50 to 100% while per capita consumption was flat. Some of it's due to offshoring some of their energy intensive activities. But much of it is due to improved efficiency and consumption and more logical use of existing energy. Now if you go back and look at the Raven Gulf countries and in the middle of it, in the kingdom in the past 30 years, energy productivity has actually decreased by 50%. And energy consumption on a per capita basis has increased and actually I think it's doubled in the past 30 years. So you can see what kind of behaviors low energy prices has caused. Again, this is maybe directionally consistent with the kingdom's current phase of economic development. It's rapid economic growth and specialization in energy intensive industry, but I would strongly argue this is also as a result of system inefficiencies. And again, this is the backdrop of the top of energy and the backdrop of energy reform as I'll explain it in a sec. Now there are wide opportunities to improve how the kingdom is consuming and utilizing its energy. So one of the most significant programs the kingdom has announced and this was announced back in December or beginning of January as part of the National Transformation Program is, and this is something that we're, the CAPSARC is currently very deeply involved in right now, is to look at energy reform. So what they've been asking is, what they've been saying is they would like to significantly effectively do these energy reforms over the course of the next couple of years where the main principle of these forms is a movement towards international energy prices. So instead of selling a barrel of oil at seven or eight dollars, it's going to be linked to world energy prices. At the same time, they're going to be providing support mechanisms for industry for this transition. You can imagine that industry has configured itself at these low energy prices. You're going to have to help them come through the system and transition through this system, as well as providing some compensation for poor households because you know that there's going to be pain for a couple of years as the kingdom goes through this and so how do you alleviate some of the pain? There will be some direct compensation towards, to low income households. But again, all of this, if you think, if you see it, it's, it's, it's, it goes back to more market based principle economy. Again, and this is central to the energy reform that the kingdom is pushing. And again, I'm going to start discussing this and I'll be discussing a little bit more on industry and what's going to be happening in industry first. Now for industry, the drivers are to improve efficiency and competitiveness with these higher input prices. Now transition support for industry will likely include some financing or it could be interest fee financing and that's still being discussed and maybe some infrastructure investments as applicable. Industry support will be provided and will be prioritized based on the value that they bring on the kingdom, as well as their expected global competitiveness post reform. So one of the questions is if, if an industry may not be competitive in the future, it may not be there in the future, but they will be looking to support all industries in any case and help them transition through again, this current environment to an environment that's more again, principle based or market based. Now understanding each sector is important because a lot of these sectors have long value chains. So there are implications where some energy intensive industries have implications downstream. So understanding how they link together is important as you roll out these reforms as well. Instead, especially when you consider values such a diversity diversification sectors such as mining or pet cams or maybe even the steel. Now the change to industry is expected to start and it's going to roll out slowly. You can't do this suddenly. You don't want a hamstring industry, it makes no sense, but it's going to start maybe in 2018 and it will be rolled out over a couple of years. But one thing to look at, you have to understand that, you know, this reform is not just based on, you know, better use of energy or better more efficient consumption of energy. One thing, and this was a realization as we study each of these systems, low energy prices in each sector have distorted the sector, each sector was distorted a little bit differently. And what I mean by that is, I'll give you one sector, for example, one sector was making hyper profits. So what they did to that, they said, you know, we're capping you, you're no longer going to be selling that, you're fixing this price. And why did they do that is because energy was so cheap and they were making profits. And this was fixed about four decades ago on one sector. So they said, okay, you know, that you're still doing good, but then they were still making huge profits. And what they did to the same sector, they said, okay, what we're going to do is your raw materials, we're going to triple the price. Why? Because they're making hyper profits. Again, that distortion was as a result of the extreme profits they were making for low energy prices. They also did not allow them to export, they did not allow them to import. There were a lot of regulations placed on these sectors. And all of this was as a result of the low energy prices and the distortions that it caused. So with the question or the point I'm trying to make here, when you actually go back to a bit more market-based pricing that tracks international pricing, you have to go back to each of these sectors. You have to understand what's happened to them. And you have to unwind each sector slowly to remove the distortions that were caused by these low energy prices. And that requires a lot of study, a lot of understanding on what has happened in each sector. And each sector from cement to pet camps to mining, whatever was treated differently. Again, still unwinding these sectors and going back and changing regulations is probably capping this issue. But a lot of it still goes back to efficiency and the reason is, you know, industry and utilities configure their facilities based on low import prices. Why would you invest in capital if my fuel is very cheap? You wouldn't. As a result, our efficiency of our power generation of our facilities were not very high. They were less efficient than international peers but they were economically rational based on low energy prices. But consuming again energy more efficiently is of the interest to the kingdom. And energy efficiency programs has started a few decades ago. We have the Saudi Energy Efficiency Center started about six, seven years ago who designed and implemented energy efficiency regulations. They spanned homes and they spanned industries. It was amazing that in a hot country such as the kingdom were made 80 and 90% of the homes didn't have insulation. Again, you say what the hell is going on when the temperature outside is north of 50 degrees Celsius. But the reason is, you know, energy was cheap. At the same time, they had the worst efficient air conditioning because again, why energy was cheap? So what they've done is they've implemented and they forced people to build, you know, they had building codes but nobody really followed it. But they enforced the regulation and implementation of building codes. They actually imposed energy efficiency rating on air conditioning. Again, it's a no brainer. It made no sense but that was reality. The other thing that they did is they implemented cafe standards. We were buying the same cars, the same models that you sell here in the kingdom but the engines were not of the same efficiency. Why? Because the dealers could make a little bit of a profit. Again, they were making rational decisions but then they implemented cafe standards. Again, and that will start showing as the fleet starts to roll over. Including other plan measures based on the Saudi Energy Efficiency Center's estimates, they showed as a result of these efficient measures, in terms of a BOE equivalent, can serve more than 500 or 600, maybe even north of 600,000 barrels of oil equivalent per day as a result of these energy standards. Again, the energy reform and market principles not only would be on the efficiency side but should also restructure the energy economy and restructure significantly the energy mix. Not only would Saudi Ramco be privatized but the power generation sector is going to be privatized. Higher prices and competition is expected to encourage a more efficient utility system. It's going to allow the king to have a more productive use of fuels internally or perhaps for exports. Alternative forms of energy are going to be, of course, much more economic. It's going to encourage its further penetration. The kingdom has announced about 9.5 gigawatts of renewables that should come in line by 2023. A great portion that I think is going to come by 2020. I personally expect more than that as a result of the changes of these energy prices. This is on the industry side who will also be impacted significantly. Think of the difference and the change of, again, prices is the households and cost of living is expected to increase substantially. This cost is more directly a reflection of the higher electricity and higher energy prices, which we've seen sometime probably the end of this year, but there's also going to be an indirect cost as a result of inflation. Households will be compensated directly. There will be direct bank transfers to poor households. The transfer will be based on the households' incomes. The transfer entitlement is bracketed into three and to five, I'm sorry, income brackets. The lower two brackets will receive full allowance covering the cost increases, which also includes inflation over time. The third and fourth quintiles, for example, will receive some sort of sliding scale, and the fifth quintile will receive no compensation whatsoever. Again, the amount of this transfer will grow as reforms roll out slowly, fully over the next couple of years. Now, the reform revenues that you will see will be invested because there's going to be a lot more. If you think about it, instead of selling directly to industries at, again, low prices, now you'll be getting international prices and the government will be getting higher revenues. And these revenues will be invested into infrastructure investments. There will be diversification programs. There is a small to medium-sized governance, or they call it an authority, that will help encourage the development of SMEs within the kingdom. There will be investment in healthcare. A lot of this money will come back to the public investment fund, which I brought up earlier, and they'll be the main investment of the kingdom, and they'll manage the government's taking companies both locally and globally. One question, and maybe I'll end up in a few comments around this, is how society will take this change. People and households have already been talking about this. We've had a small reform last year, and electricity prices were increased by a few percent on lower household. Gas prices increased by 50 percent, but that was generally taken in stride. However, the changes now are much more significant, and the success of much of this is going to be dependent on how this is implemented and how this is communicated, and there's going to be a large PR campaign that's going to be starting over the next couple of months. It's going to be a long road for the kingdom. The reforms are obviously needed. This is just starting. Its success is going to be dependent on the long-term resolve of the government. It's going to be dependent on the transparency and the equity of the reforms and the adjustment that needs to be made as they go forward. Again, how well this is going to be implemented and how well this is going to be communicated. Keeping these factors in line will affect the likelihood that a resource-rich country, such as a kingdom, can use its resources as a foundation to diversify its economy, where many countries in similar circumstances perhaps were not as successful. But the timing for it, I would strongly suggest, is now. You want to change, you want to diversify when you're in a relative position of strength, not when you absolutely have to do it, perhaps when the cycle happens against in 2025 and 2027. It's much wiser to do it now, and I see a long-term commitment towards that. I'm very pleased to be working extremely long evenings and nights and weekends along these questions, and the reason is, and you heard that I have four kids, and I want them to have jobs in a couple years' time as this reform is going to. Again, the objective of these reforms, the objective of this is to make sure that the kingdom's economy is much stronger, much more competitive than it currently is now, to exit stronger than it entered in the next couple of years. With that, thank you, and I'll be pleased to answer as many questions as you guys have. So, as per usual, we'll begin with questions from the students, if there are any. So, thank you very much for being here and taking the time to travel out here. I also want to share that I recently got married, and I think Stanford also helped with that, so I agree with your story. I kind of want to ask you, there's a lot of technologies around machine learning, AR, VR, autonomous vehicles, things that are, let's say, used to be science fiction only a few years ago. Do you see any opportunities for these to go back home and study? I would argue that it's already coming back home to, if you want to call, you know, it's already going back home to the kingdom. So, there's a lot of, if you look at Calcium, what they're doing, a lot of that stuff is being adopted there. ARAF was doing, applying that, and you're probably aware of that in oil and gas. Autonomous vehicles I think is very interesting. I would love to have a autonomous vehicle because, you know, I'll let it drive and I can do work to take me from point A to point B. I live now in Rialvo, which is crowded as any major city is. If the technology is fixed, I see a huge potential of these technologies. I don't see why not, and as you're aware that the kingdoms also, and the people, the young people in the kingdom are actually well connected in terms of technology. I think the young population there are probably top five users in YouTube, Twitter, and consume technology very actively. So, I don't see any apprehensiveness in people using new forms of technology for whatever purposes. All right. What impact has or will the Trump administration play in the way Saudi Arabia sort of sets their force economically, because obviously big trade partners, oil-wise, and big investment connects on the level recently, and like U.S. oil production, how does that play out in global economics? I would argue at least the signals that you're hearing from the Trump administration is well aligned with the interests of the kingdom. So, they're a believer of a Venenju mix that calls for all of the above, which you hear at least from the Trump administration. So, there's alignment there, and then you also hear some political signals that are well aligned with the kingdom's interests as well. I know that there's, I mean, you have Rex Tillerson as Secretary of State, and he's well known within the kingdom, and the Secretary of Energy, I keep on forgetting his name. Rick Perry. Rick Perry, that's it, our friend Rick Perry, yes. So, he's well known, and he's well liked, at least with figures within the kingdom. So there's, I would say, alignment objectively, but also relationship-wise between two main figures within the government as it leads to at least the direction of the kingdom. The question went in the back. Thanks for the talk. You mentioned the policy targets of the kingdom about the renewables. Are there, about the renewables, the policy that they are following by 2023 you mentioned. So, is that because of the economical perspective of the renewables or because of the environmental aspects of electricity, carbon emission, or these sort of issues? Right. I think it's one of those win-win things. I think it's both. If you look at the current energy mix and the demand for the kingdom, there is no less than, it calls for no less than about 10 gigawatt, if not more, of renewables in the kingdom. So, the driver is economic, but also there's an environmental benefit. So, about the kingdom's INDC is about 130 million metric tons by 2030. That would play into it, but also efficiency targets will also play into it. So, efficiency investment will also play into the current commitment that the kingdom has. Now, given the new prices and the new energy reform that's happened, I would suggest that that baseline could be easier reached, perhaps even earlier than later. But then that's part of the assessment that we're conducting right now. A question here. Following on this question, I couldn't quite hear exactly this question in your answer. It was difficult. The role of solar for the Saudi or for the kingdom, at some point you will run out of oil. And I assume that part of your southern local fund is recognizing that and trying to diversify into other areas. How much are you going to really begin to use that resource if you said it was up to the resources? That's a lot of fun and you have a lot of area where you can put in solar panels and thermal solar. So, if you look at in terms of research, if you look at major universities and major investments, there's a lot of investment in basic science on solar and cows. There's a lot of basic investments in science and a lot of IP actually, not only in the science of looking at different forms of solar PV, but also on the manufacturing side and that's being done through the Kingdom's National Labs, CAXT. Right now solar, as it is, it's slightly more expensive than, let's say, developing power through gas. Gas is slightly cheaper than solar is right now. But given that, when you look at the energy cycle within the kingdom and when you look at peak demand, there's a call for solar of, again, no less than 10 gigawatts. And I would argue that I think we can go easily north of that. What people don't recognize that, again, gas is a resource. So, you can, again, some of the modern that we're looking at, you can hypothesize that some of those gas resources could go to industry. Utility may be a little bit more expensive, but in terms of actual value to the economy and jobs, that may be a wiser choice. So, again, there's trade-offs and compromises. When you look at the overall energy system where solar in particular or just renewables in general, there's a lot of advantages of encouraging it within the kingdom's energy mix and energy economy. A question in the front, please. What's the argument for privatizing power for solar and wind power and how far do you expect it to go? It's part of the, again, it's part of the initiatives of, again, ensuring that there are best practices that are maintained, ensuring that the company remains as a company run professionally as it is now. The privatization has been announced and said by many officials in the kingdom. It's probably going to happen the second half of 2018. Again, I hear talk one, two, but I hear 5% is what I hear. It's probably going to be in more than one market and, again, that's something that's been announced in the kingdom and other places. But if I speak to people within company or outside the company, I don't see any signals other than it actually going on. So, it's the most of the conversation I hear is the different options of how to actually implement it, not if it's going to happen. So, the way I see it, it's going to happen and the way from the side of the officials, it's going to happen second half of 2018. Again, I can't confirm that. But, again, these are numbers I hear off the news as well. I don't have those numbers. They're keeping that to, yeah. The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, of course, is a really central player of international time and expression, whether it's international standard or ICC. As the Paris agreement goes through the next few years of becoming operational, how do you see the priorities for a few pledges, monitoring, verification, finance, different shoes, responsibility, all of those. So, I mean the kingdom's committed to that. The kingdom's been made to 130 million tons by 2030. I know from internal and speaking to the people that this is something that they're actually, that they're pushing forward. The questions and some of the modeling we do is what is the optimal ways to actually achieve those targets. So, they're committed to the indices that they've had back in Paris in 2021. So, I see no signals from my perspective and them not heading towards that. Let's take one more question, Charles. Hi, thank you for coming. I have a question about how this reform package is being perceived by mainstream society and elites. Is there a lot of credit given or is it a concern? So, that's an interesting question. Maybe I'll take a little bit of time and explain it. There's a lot of apprehension. There's a lot of apprehension because there's a lot of change. And if you didn't have any apprehension, I think that would be a little bit strange. I mean, but then when they speak about the vision and what needs to be done, you know, they know, everybody inherently knows. You talk about the elites, you talk about the poor people, they know that this has to be done. We cannot or the country cannot be dependent on a single resources that may flip by $20, go down by another $20, fluctuate 40% in one year and say, I'm going to live off that, not with a growing population. A lot of the questions that you hear is around, it's less about we know that we need to do it. A lot of the question is around how it's going to be done. No, this is a better way of doing it. The debates are on the different pathways, not necessarily on if it needs to be done. So those are the debates that you hear. You can go to Twitter, you read about a lot of that. You can go on a lot of Snapchat, whatever you want to call it. Again, a huge consumers of my wife reads a lot of that. She shows me stuff on that. I don't have time for that. But a lot of people talk about that. But it's mostly on the pathway on how and how you redistribute, I would say maybe the pain that the country will have to go through. There will be pain and that's a given, I think, because transitioning from where we are now to where we need to be is a must. It has to happen and I haven't heard many debates on saying that, no, we don't have to change. We don't need to diversify. Very good. Thank you very much.