 I'm going to get going then. My name is James Pepper, I'm the chair of the Vermont Cannabis Control Board today is March 29th, 2023, it's 3.01 p.m. And I'm calling this special meeting of the Cannabis Control Board to occur. So, sorry to everyone watching about the late notice of this meeting. Essentially, you know, when we move to a monthly meeting, we also set some parameters about application approvals that essentially anyone who wants to get on the list for approval at our monthly board meeting has to have all of their documentation and compliance site visits by the Monday in proceeding. And after our meeting on Monday, we were two applicants who had all their documentation complete reached out to us. And that triggered just an internal review and we noticed that because of a few internal technical issues that they did in fact have their licenses or their application materials in their site review complete and reviewed. This really was kind of an internal accounting problem on our end. And so we are here to correct that today. We are going to review two applications for approval and the board will vote on those. I wanted to make a quick announcement while we're having this meeting about packaging. This is an issue that's come up a few times now and I just wanted to be absolutely clear. There is a distinction, a legal distinction in the cannabis statutes between cannabis, the flower and cannabis products. And cannabis flower is the plant material and pre-rolls. Cannabis products are when you manipulate cannabis flower to make products like edibles, like tinctures, essentially anything but flower or pre-rolls. And this is really a critical legal distinction when it comes to packaging. We advocated for and had the legislature lower the standard for cannabis flower, cannabis itself and pre-rolls. So it does not need child resistant packaging. Child deterrence is a term of art but it's a lesser form of it's a non-child resistant certified child resistant packaging. It does require certain things. Those things are identified in our guidance documents but it does not require a child resistant cap. Our rules say that for cannabis products, a retail store, sorry, I am trying to be clear. So in order to, we've banned plastic, we've created a waiver process for people that cannot achieve child resistance for cannabis products only. We've issued temporary waivers and there's been some misunderstanding about that waiver process. We issued a temporary waiver for a child resistant humidiculid and that waiver is specific to cannabis products. That lid is not permissible for cannabis flower. And because of that, you know, anyone who's been using a humidiculid for cannabis flower or cannabis pre-rolls is going to get a communication from the board of a registration error and waiver that will allow you to use your existing supply of these humidiculids for your flower until the, and once those are used up, you won't be permitted to use those for flower anymore. And I hope that was clear. Yeah, let me try and put a bow on that because I know a lot of folks reach out to me about packaging all the time. Using the waiver process and really looking at what plastic was necessary for cannabis to be packaged in on-store shelves over the summer before our market launched, I think our internal team recognized that achieving child resistance because that is a federal standard without plastic was challenging. And so when that waiver was given at that time over the summer, what was put on our website said concentrates and other products, you know, we can always get better at communicating certain things are being more clear to us concentrates and other products. We've always drawn a distinction between flower and products and our rules and in our statutes as Pepper alluded to previously without a public or a product registration system at the time that we opened, you know, we saw flower starting to be packaged in commutaco lids. Now that we've moved through the product registration backlog and kind of see how many folks are using these we want folks to exhaust their inventory of those lids and those jars that they've that they've already purchased. However, we're moving forward, we need to get back to what the waiver actually means, which is for child resistant purposes for cannabis products. I've heard from a number of manufacturers that cannot find jars and lids, and they actually need these lids for child resistance. Flower doesn't. We're trying to flip this narrative that child resistance is not necessary for flower. When I see 60 to 70 percent of our flower being packaged with child resistant lids and I think our team feels the same way, we're not going to move that needle. We're not going to show other states that it's not necessary either. So we need to continuously improve. We're hoping that making this announcement now will exhaust your supplies by the time that waiver, you know, is up in September and we'll look to renew it for manufactured products if it if it makes sense then as well. But I don't want anybody to panic will allow you to exhaust what you've already purchased. There's going to be communications to specific folks that are registered with these products. We're going to want to see and know what your quantities are and likely a copy of your receipt of the inventory that you've purchased and we'll track things through inventory tracking on our end that way. I have talked to Humidico representatives. They know we've made this decision and this distinction. We don't want to guide anybody down a path, including the packaging companies to be out of compliance. So again, please do not purchase any more of those. But if you have them already, we're willing to work with you as we kind of find the exit ramp on making sure that that flower is not packaged with those slits. I don't know if that was more concise or longer or helpful, but it's where we stand. Can you please kind of present the two applications that we missed here on Monday? Yep. We've just got two on the list today. And these applicants have demonstrated compliance with all required requirements for their license contained in board rule and in statute. And they are cloud nine cannabis applying for retail license and green mountain ganja guys applying for a tier two manufacturing license. And would you mind just briefly describing why they didn't make it on for Monday, what the kind of internal technical issue was? Yes, certainly. So the first applicant that did not make it on the list for Monday had submitted their application during a time that there was a problem with the portal. And that required board staff to go in and manually manipulate their application. And that manual manipulation resulted in like the elimination of an internal checklist that board staff uses to conduct all of the due diligence on the application and associated documents. So as a result, that application appeared to be incomplete and therefore it wasn't designated for final review. So that was entirely our internal error. And then the second applicant had sent a portion of their application, a document associated with their application to a staff member's personal email account rather than upload it directly to the appropriate inbox. And so as a result, that submission was temporarily lost. So we would like to remind everybody to please upload documents directly to the application portal. Or if you can't upload them directly for some reason, submit all of that information in any document associated with your application to the application inbox, which is ccd.application.vermont.gov. So again, technically an internal error. And that's why we wanted to make sure and get them approved during a special meeting. Great. OK. Well, why don't we make a motion and then have some discussion if we need to? I move the board except each of the recommendations as presented to us by staff in this meeting. Second. Any discussion about these two? Any questions for Bryn? No, thanks for catching the air. I know we don't typically do special meetings, but it's something that you know, working them into. So appreciate you bringing it to our attention. Great. All right. All in favor? Hi. Hi. Hi. OK. We're just going to shift to then to public comment if there is any. We'll do it the same way as in a normal meeting. If you join via the video link, please raise your virtual hands. And we'll call on you in the order that you raise your hand. And then we'll shift to anyone who's joined by a phone. Hello, thanks for taking the question or comment here. Just I know a lot of people have the same question, same concerns, but we're just checking in about product registration and looking for any comments or updates or reassurances that the CACB can give us about specifically older registrations from the old system that are waiting. We've specifically are getting to the point with retailers where they're struggling to know what to do with inventory for goods that seem to have all the checkboxes in place for the registration, but have yet to be approved. They don't appear in the portal. They were prior to portal. So we get emails that say incomplete. And as instructed, do the product registration email for all the documents and still waiting on those approvals. There's three we email about all the time and leave messages. Just hoping to push that through and we understand that a lot of people have the same concerns about the registration. We're just hoping that we can get some sort of a formal update or comment or addressing of the later ones from the older system that I've yet to show up in the new one. OK, thank you. One of them, yes. OK, we'll have someone reach out to you about that. We really appreciate it. We understand that other people are waiting on this. Also, we're not unique here. But thank you so much for understanding the urgency of this, given the time. We're also curious, is an infused pre-roll a pre-roll or a flower? Or I should say, you know, as a. Manufactured good flower. Yeah, that would be a product. That'd be a product. Thank you. And we're just waiting on a packaging waiver. I think you guys said you're going to be addressing those later in the call. We applied for a child-resistant pre-roll packaging waiver for. So that was over like a month ago. Thank you very much. We sincerely do understand and appreciate. Yeah, thank you. Hey, guys, just wanted to clarify about what you were talking about those lids. So if somebody has purchased those compostable lids and they can show evidence of their purchase and the date that they had them in the amount, but they have not yet submitted them for approval, we'll still be able to use those until we don't have them anymore. Is that correct? We're trying to draw a distinction and products that have already been registered. If you have done that, you know, they can still be used. If you have a manufacturing license, I know that there are manufacturers out there looking for these lids. And so, you know, it feels like, you know, there's an opportunity to speak with other licensees on who might need these lids. But well, so what I meant was, you know, like I purchased a bunch of these lids thinking that I was taking another step towards sustainability because they say that they're home compostable. And so, you know, I bought 5,000 jars and lids. I've yet to submit them because I was going to go through my current, you know, packaging before I use these. So if I can show you guys the purchase date that it was from, you know, three, four months ago when they were originally purchased, can I submit that and still use them until they're gone? That's not what we're intending to do here. I mean, man, you know, I thought I was in good will trying to become more sustainable by buying what I saw other people using and spend a lot of money to buy 5,000 of them and just wanted to kind of go through what I was currently doing. Also in an email, I would hope that you guys would be willing to work something out. Thank you. Thanks, Sam. Anyone else or a public comment? Please raise your virtual hand. And if you join by a phone and would like to comment, you can hit star six to unmute your line. Yes, thank you. Excuse me, I'm wondering about this cover thing in the fact that the cover for flower is, if it's used in the flower, by your description, it seems to be above and beyond. Excuse me, what? I'm wondering about this cover thing. I'm sorry, I got some feedback there. The cover is, Frank, if it's in the flower, by your description, it seems to be above and beyond. Yes, thank you. So it seems to me, again, that if we make a more, where do I want to use here? If I use that cover for flower, which by your description seems to be above and beyond what is necessary, so therefore we're doing a better thing, one, rhetorically, why wouldn't that be OK? And then two, I didn't hear anybody say specifically, and especially the commenter just before me, these inventories, why aren't we selling these inventories? If you're going to make a hard line on no, we're not going to use them for flower, can we sell them to the manufacturers who have been stated to be in dire need? And I'm glad to see that you guys saw an internal problem and had this special meeting to take that. Thank you. Yeah, and let me just see if I can try to be clear on this, because I recognize it is confusing. Plastic is not allowed in this industry. That's ruled 2.2.9. We recognize that certain products need required child-resistant packaging and that there really are no options for non-plastic child-resistance. If a kid eats a bunch of cannabis flower, they're not going to be rushed to the hospital, they're not going to have a psychoactive response. So we make waivers for cannabis products that allow for certain types of plastic. We don't make those same waivers when it's not necessary for a cannabis flower, because you don't need child-resistant packaging for flower. And so there's no need to put a child-resistant lid. It's not necessary on a flower jar. And yes, any person out there, you know, we registered some products for flower with this humidical lid, and we want to give people the benefit that they relied on that and went out and bought products. But for unregistered products for flower, you know, we don't have to extend that same courtesy because you weren't relying on a communication by the board. But what Kyle was suggesting is that there is a shortage of these humidical lids on the product manufacturing side. So any person who is packaging flower with a humidical lid that's registered, they can continue to use that until their supply has been exhausted or they could sell it to a product manufacturer, which I think are pretty desperate to get these things right now. So... That's my understanding in what I've heard. I have heard some folks want child-resistant lids because they think there's potential liability for their flower business, and that is categorically untrue. It is in law that you do not need that. We are one of two states in the country that does not require child-resistance for flower, us, and Oregon. But if all of our lids are child-resistant, now what incentives do other states have to try and move that needle as well? We're trying to push this industry to be regulated more normally, right? This is an area where we all need to work together to do that. And so yes, we're putting folks on notice now to exhaust current inventories with registered products. That's where we're drawing that line in the sand and we're gonna move forward from there. Nellie, did you say that there was someone with their hand raised? Thank you for having us. So I had submitted product registration a while ago. I got my product registration and now we are redoing our labels. I had spoke to Kerry and he told me to email them into... I believe her name is Lauren, the product registration email, and they would approve them. That was almost a month ago and I haven't heard back. I was specifically told I did not need to do new product registration just to do new labels. So I wanted to clarify on how I can get this done. Exact same product, exact same everything, just new label. Great. I know we've engaged in a little bit of a back and forth in Q&A here. Maybe that was appropriate in the packaging, the lid context, Michelle, we'll make sure somebody gets in touch with you, okay? Awesome, thank you guys. Anyone else for a public comment? Sorry, I had some issue with the old mute button right there. I've been trying to reach out to the central line for a few weeks just to kind of clarify some vague issues that have arisen via product registration for white label manufacturing. I spoke briefly with a board member the other day, but they seemed somewhat uncertain on a number of issues, though they were quite helpful on some other ones. Was just hoping someone could get back to me at some point. Thank you very much. I really appreciate it. Thank you. It's Bobby. Yeah, very briefly, Bobby. I know you make a lot of cool products. They're also very complicated for us to review. So hang tight, okay? Oh, no, I'm not even talking about my own lingering product registrations. I understand that. But there's just been vague issues with, if we do packaging services, so if we get a product made by another manufacturer on behalf of a cultivator and we package it for them who is supposed to register that, it's weird niche situations like that that I understand are also somewhat frustrating. So whenever anyone has the time for 10 minutes on the phone, appreciate it. We're working on it, that's all I gotta say. Thanks, Bobby. Thanks for the comment. Hi, apologies. Jason from Birdman Vermont. I missed the first 10 minutes. I thought it was about new hires, but I understand that the home compostable, just need to verify this. I know it's annoying, but the home compostable lids that fit my 53, 400 thread, so I know correctly. For flower products is no longer gonna be allowed. Is that accurate? If you have a product that's been registered using that lid, we're gonna make an allowance for you to exhaust your existing inventory. If it hasn't been registered and moving forward beyond your existing inventory, we will not allow the humidico lid for cannabis flower or for pre-rolls. Okay, so I mean, just do the nature of having your packaging in inventory in order for your harvest. So my registered product was five pounds, and that's all sold. I prepared myself for the next two rounds, which is 10 pounds of lids and jars that fit those lids. I know it's annoying, I see your frustration, but this is the only way we can get clarification. I'm another person that's invested in these lids, so now we're not allowed to use them. My labels fit my jars that specific jars only fit those lids. Now I can't use them, so I just need to know, and my option is to either sell to somebody else because I'm getting ready to register the product with the lids and the jars that I have prepped to pack them. So if it's not registered right now, I can't really use them. So that delays everything, and this is pretty, you know, this is a big deal. We stress that by narrowing in us to use specific lids that the market was gonna demand, and they're not gonna be able to produce them. So now we're in this situation, so I just needed to make sure that that's clear. So I need to sell these lids and start over again. Is that what you're saying? If your products are not registered, Jason, then that is what we're saying. Again, we approved this, we approved this waiver for products initially. It was clear on the website, we're making it more clear, and we're starting to figure out a path forward for everybody, okay? Yes, yeah, thank you very much. Anyone else for a public comment? Allie, just Frank, there's something going on with your microphone, Frank. We can hear you, but you're very faint. I just wanna say, I hope we can all work this out, and make it work. That's all, and there's too many rules, but I'll talk to you later. I'm not a computer guy. Thank you, bye. Okay, thanks Frank. Thank you. Since you mentioned Oregon as another trailblazer, I was curious if you have some good examples of jars for a flower with screwtop lids, cause the ones with the plastic seal are a little too big for eights and quarters, and they dry the flower out, and they're not ideal. So if we could have some like ideal storage jars for cannabis that are compliant, as well as pre-rolls that are manufactured, like some examples on the page of what are appropriate to order would be super helpful. I will, thank you. Any, anyone else for a public comment? Raise your virtual hand, and again, be joined by a phone, you can unmute by hitting star six. Hi, thank you. I'm wondering what the process for having a type of packaging, specifically a beverage packaging be considered by the CCB as a child resistant certain type of packaging that's currently not being used in the market, but I think could get qualified. I'm just wondering who would qualify it and how I could like submit a type of packaging for that sort of approval by the CCB. This may not be an appropriate question, and maybe it's been answered long before, but I'm just curious, why can't some of these questions related to some of the growers, manufacturers related to the packaging using these plastic products? Why can't they be grandfathered in for another three months or so? And that the deadline would become effective, you have to get in your request for being grandfathered in by a certain date, and it won't be extended by another fixed date. And it sort of seems to me, it might solve the problem. It's not my problem, but I'm just curious about the obstacles to doing that. Thanks for the comment. It's not how we're gonna do it. We can see who has these products and her using them in our product registration system and will be in communication with the folks that we have registered with these products. Thank you. Thank you. Yes, thank you again. One comment that I had overlooked and I wanna change the focus to security. I'm not a computer tech sort of person either, as I've heard mentioned before, and I find a great deal of anxiety over the fact that somebody's application information went to a personal email. This information that we have to disclose as potential licensees and licensees in this industry is, as far as I'm concerned, very highly classified. We're talking social security numbers. We're talking resident identifications, et cetera, et cetera. So I want to strongly suggest, as I'm sure you probably are doing, some internal review on how such an egregious event could have happened. Thank you. Yeah, I would just say that the applicant sent it to one of our staff's personal emails. It wasn't the other way around. We can't control what people are sending to us. All of our systems meet all of the state security requirements and are tested for security threats. Pepper, can I just clarify by personal email? Are we talking about someone's like individual personal email or their work? Individual email. Okay. Yes, thank you. I'll just clarify, because it was me, and I know you guys don't want to disclose personal information. But what happened was that I sent some documents to an individual staff member at their CCB email address, not a personal email address, rather than the correct mailbox, CCB applications. It was my error and I appreciate that the staffer was able to catch it. And thank you, though, that error was mine, not the CCBs, want to make very clear. Anyone else, a little comment? I just have a question about inventory tracking on the retail side. It seems like there could be maybe some more options for, this is like a lost comment. There's some things we've had happen, like we've got a pre-roll tube that somebody was sold that ended up being empty, and that was like our oversight, but it was something that was counted in our inventory as having as like, and so there's just would be nice if there was like an other option in the lost tracking section so that we could maybe write a note about exactly what had happened, because it seems like the lost tracking is kind of more geared towards cultivators and manufacturers. So I just wanted to like, throw that note out there. Thanks for the comment. Thank you. Okay, go ahead. Yeah, this is related to a question that was just raised about how to send documentation digitally if it's not capable of being uploaded. Should it go to the application inbox? Is that the appropriate place to send it? What about, okay, but if I have an application that was what, dormant, and I'm trying to activate it and I can't upload some of the information in that section where one would normally do so. So is there an option to sending that canned information to another address? I'm happy to jump in here, Nellie, if that's helpful. Yep, if you can send us the submission number and let us know that you're trying to attach some information, we can look to see if that, we need to unfreeze that for you or make some sort of SharePoint folder for you. But if you just let us know which submission it is, we'll get back to you on good steps forward. And that should be sent to that request. CCB.applications at Vermont.gov. Thank you very much, I appreciate that. Which Jason, me? Hi, my apologies if this is a repeat question, but my question being is if I have created labels for my bulk flower and one gram pre-rolls, do I need to complete a separate product registration for a 0.5 gram pre-roll or can I just make the label? Okay, thank you. Anyone else, Nellie? I will close the public comment window. Thank you for all the comments. Thank you for the questions. They really do help direct the board, show us where the problems are. And we'll all get through this together. I know it's challenging. I know this is a highly regulated industry. And everyone's trying very hard to be compliant and we'll get through these issues. Yeah, we know the packaging thing, it's a high ask for everybody. I'm very thankful for everybody that's doing their best to comply here. We can really put a dent in the over-regulating part of things and move it away from child resistance if we all work together. So thank you. All right, Julie, is there anything you wanted to add? Okay, then I will adjourn this special meeting and we will see you all next month. Thank you for everything and we will see you all next month.