 No, listen, let me finish my sentence, let me finish my sentence, let me finish my sentence. Finish, maybe you need to spend more time at local farming. Do you think your commodity, like, they are a commodity? Well... Ridiculous, mate, laughable. I'll end the conversation there, think about what I'm saying. Keep going guys, keep going. We're going to eat more. Watch this documentary, brother, on Prime. What do you think? Not... Terrible? What do you think of that? Got to eat, aren't there? Got to eat pigs. Got to eat, aren't there? You have to eat pigs? Yeah. Do you? Why's that? Is this meat? But do you have to eat pigs? So I'm just asking. Can you eat anything, though? Yeah, I mean, do you see what happens to the animals in order for you to eat them? Do you think that's okay? Oh, no, Bobby said it's... Don't do it like that, did I? They don't do it like that? No. So where does this come from? Some of them just... It's an interesting interview. Bless you, brother. Hey, good shit. Wait, hey, check this out. I'll take one of these guys. My documentary just released on Prime. Bless you, brother. So what are you saying? You think this is okay in order to eat animals even if we... But I haven't eaten animals for 10 years. Hey, brother. Mr. Carlson. Yeah, mate, how are you? All right, thanks. I'll fully support you. Thank you, brother. I've watched your Amazon documentary. Yeah. Even before that I... You know, the change things on the government. Yeah, yeah. I suggested traffic lights for how it's slaughtered, not just the welfare. It doesn't go anywhere. Nah. Well, I know. Are you a vegan or you're a... I'm not a vegan. I'm very, very picky on what to do with it. And it's, again, how it's grown and how it's slaughtered is important. Yeah. So I'm not a vegan, but I do eat a lot of clump paste. I would say not how more that they are slaughtered is a moral issue. Yes and no. Well, yeah, well, I mean, in a human case, in a human case, it's no, don't slaughter humans. In an animal case, it's as long as you do it in the right way, it's okay. I mean, there's a controversial, there's probably a case for both. Oh, yeah, yeah. You know, the path of use them easier and things like that. Oh, you know, yeah, yeah. I mean, unjustifiable killing to eat. Oh, unjustifiable, yeah. And I think this works. How are we justified to kill an animal? When, you know, me, obviously, I don't eat animals. I'm a vegan. No, absolutely. So we're living proof that this is unjustified. Yes, but I think you're doing the right thing by educating people, but... But the goal of my education is not to find the right way to do the wrong thing. The goal of my education is to show that the welfare movement is failing the animals. Like, what you're suggesting has failed for decades. No, no, I fully do not support the RSPCA and all that stuff. Yeah, but you know, they are the pinnacle of the welfare movement. So when you're saying... They're really not. I think if you knew more about the RSPCA, you'd be... Well, who would know? I mean, I probably, you do know quite a lot. Yeah, yeah, I do know a lot about RSPCA, RSPCA. But what I'm saying is what's better than RSPCA in terms of animal welfare? Oh, that's why I need to shake it up. I don't support them. Anything they say, I don't necessarily... When you buy the meat, you support the meat, which does support them and does support the cruelty to animals. You know what I'm saying? So when you purchase products, you're donating to them, essentially. No, I'm not. Where do your money goes to, who? The farmer. Usually at the farmer's market. And what happens to those animals? Oh, they're killed. And how are they raised? Oh, quite transparently, because the farmer lets you go and look at them. Does he? Yeah. Never heard of that? Maybe you need to spend more time at local farms. I don't know. So you only eat meat from a local farmer? I buy meat from local sources, which are more transparent. Yeah, but you've never been... Like, so, honestly, transparency is an interesting one. Can people have the illusion of transparency? Like, do you have the illusion of transparency? No. I think if farmers say you can come round and have a look and they have it open, like, you can see it, it's relatively transparent. They never let me through. They never let me into the abattoir. They ever let you into the abattoir? No, but... Wait, if you think the industry's transparent, then it's an IE. It's very naive. That's where the issue is. Not necessarily on the farms. It is on the point of slaughter. And do you think that everyone here in the world, do you think the solution is small farms to feed the entire world? How are you going to meet the demand with a small farm? I don't think industrialization of farming was ever a good idea. But how are you supposed to... How's everyone like yourself, like, you still eat meat? So you live by your values, obviously? You eat a lot of white meat, which is good. I think there's still eating meat and there's different... It's a spectrum. Yeah, I understand that. I understand that. And also, there's also different qualities of meat. And there's a great difference between something you know where it's reared to go to... Most people don't know. They think they know where it's reared. But what I've done is gone and... This is a free-range farm, right? Now, if you look at their advertising, pristine. Pristine advertising. It depends on the scale, though, doesn't it? Well, how many people got here in England? What, 50 million? How many people in the UK? 60, 70 million? Yeah? How are you supposed to feed everyone meat without there being industrial farming? Oh, less meat. But to know meat. Yeah, less meat, yeah. And then, how do you... So you suggest that industrial is a good thing? No, I'm saying that industry is required. Industrial animal farming is required to feed this population. My solution is for everyone to be plant-based and not exploit animals because there's no way you can do it in a way that looks after the animal's welfare because their interests will never truly be respected because they're commodities. Animals are commodities, right? I don't care about that because some can be quite coupling. I know many people that keep sheep as pets. I know many people that keep cows as pets. And chickens as pets. They kill them? More often than not, no. But I know them that have. Well, then they're not commodities if they are onion animals. I've just said that they are, so... No, I said when animals are commodities, their interests will never be truly respected because they're products. So you can't... I can't have you as a commodity and also respect your interests. The government, you are also the same. You have a value on you as for the good food. We have fundamental human rights that protect us from enslavement. They're inalienable rights we have. Cruel and unusual punishment, enslavement. We can't be treated as property. We have a right to our life unless we forgo it through like doing something horrible, like trying to kill someone. But we have a right to life. You know, there's certain human rights we have that animals just don't have. They're commodities. They're property. They're like essentially slaves. Now, how can you respect a slave when they're a slave? I would also say there's human slavery going on as well. I never said that that's not wrong. This is legally sanctioned and you are almost justifying it. If the animals are treated the way that you feel comfortable with, but honestly, the happy animal doesn't want to be slaughtered. So you're not actually viewing this from the animal's perspective. Then there's sort of... Think about it. Things like eating the fallen stock, don't you? Eating the fallen stock. What does that mean? When they died. I know that's not a thing at the moment. That's a hypothetical. You're not violating the animals rights. I still think you're viewing them as a commodity, which is a slippery slope. Obviously, that's not where you get your meat from. You get your meat from animals that have been butchered slaughtered against their will in a slaughterhouse that you haven't even visited. So you have no idea what goes on in there. And you're talking about like the industry being transparent. They've got no interest in being transparent because they will lose customers. Now, that will let you in on an open farm day once they've cleaned everything up. Just like they do with the RSPCA. I think the farms I go to is any day you can wrap up. Unannounced? Yeah. Really? Giving the names of the farms? And if you go to Holton Farm, which is a dairy farm in Holton Low. Holton Farm? Holton. And they are just allowed... They literally have BBC on premises most of the time. Exactly. So it must be one of those... The ones that they use to propagate... Like manipulation and say that we are the industry standard. That's why they let people in there. There's the BBC. And we also say it's not a good thing. No. It's not a good thing because what they're doing is they're giving the impression that... Well, if everyone else reads that standard though. I'm telling you why it's a bad thing. If everyone thinks that's what farming is like, then they are living a lie. So the BBC and that will only go to farms that are open. They're open for a reason. This isn't the standard, right? No, no, no. Let me finish my sentence, right? Let me finish. I'm not missing the point. I've been doing this for 10 years, right? And I know exactly what they do. They get these little farms that they use to propagate lies to the people. So when people go in and they see, oh, RSPC, I should, that must be like that. One dairy farm they keep posting on BBC. I'm saying just use that one farm. How is everyone supposed to get all their milk from one farm? Everyone else isn't me. So you're only thinking about yourself? Isn't that the thing? You're only thinking about yourself, isn't that where it starts? My philosophy, right, is something we can all achieve. And it actually helps animals. And it solves the issue. It doesn't solve every world issue, but it solves the issue for the commodity status of animals, which leads to, like, if you're saying, oh, only for myself, like some people are like, we'll just go hunting animals. Don't you think it'd be in a commodity? Not commodity is based on the capitalist system, which is where we live. Yeah, we're under a capitalist system. We're not technically slaves like animals are. Everything is a commodity. You're not a commodity like a pizza commodity. They're gassed. This is a commodity. Yeah, I've watched your video. I know. Do you think your commodity, like, they're a commodity? I think it's towards the government, especially the... Are you a commodity like a pig as a commodity? We personally know. Are you getting gassed in a gas chamber? I would say we could be in Manchester at the moment with the pollution. Ridiculous, mate. Laughable. Well, it's our own opinion. No, it's not. Animals are being slaughtered, gassed in torture. You have got rights. I can't attack you. We can't attack them. We can't take them and enslave them and put them in a gas chamber. We could literally do that to pigs. You're comparing your commodity status because of pollution to theirs, which is a laughable joke. So would it be fair for a vegan who's never eaten meat to be getting their toxic fumes from a city centre? It's not a rights violation to be involved in an environment, man. No, it's not a violation of our fundamental rights. They have no rights. I have a conversation there. Think about it. Do you have something to bring to the table, my friend? Did you want to watch this documentary? I don't know if you ever get a chance to... We're just trying to raise awareness, man. We're trying to make change for animals. We care about their suffering, what they're going through. I filmed all this footage for this documentary. We want people to stop donating their money. You wouldn't donate to an animal charity that tortures animals, but this is what people do when they go in and buy meat and dairy and eggs. People that have a choice, they have freedom of choice. Look, all these people that got cash to spend, they shouldn't be putting it into industries that abuse and kill innocent animals because they wouldn't do it for dogs, do you know what I'm saying? They feel the pain the same. Look at this animal here trying to escape. What do you think deserves to happen to him? I do, sir. Exactly, exactly. People that are disconnected from this will go and pay money for that to happen. So it's a level of disconnect, do you know what I'm saying? And people like that gentleman there trying to justify it with stupid s**t, stupid s**t, bro. This is very simple. It's not complicated, man. I've been vegan for 10 years, right? And some people don't have the education, they don't know what to look for. I get that, but I come out of prison, got sober, had no education, could barely string a s**t sentence together because I didn't know how to articulate myself properly and I could go vegan, right? I had access to the internet, I could f*****g never look quickly, you know? All these people here, privileged lives, education, money, they can't choose a vegan option for the animals, they have to come up with a bunch of s**t. Do you know why? Do you know why? Because they've never done it hard in their life so they look at their suffering and they can't put themselves in their position because they've always done it good. Do you know what I'm trying to say, bro? We're asking people to be empathic towards each other. If you see someone needs help, help them, you know? But we're just asking people not to hurt them. That's different. There's no need to do it f*****g at all. Imagine this, let me give you this scenario. I've got a dog sanctuary, I rescued all these dogs and we treat them amazingly. They sleep on the couch inside, they're loving it. Whatever they want they have, they're so happy to these dogs. And then I take them all to a gas chamber, kill them, chop them up for a barbecue and I say, well, I did it in this amazing way. What would everyone say? I think I was a psychopath, wouldn't I? You've just killed all these happy dogs. So why does everyone look for the happy way to kill these animals? Do you know what I'm saying? Makes no sense, bro. There's no logic. Why are you doing it for the pigs and not for the... and not for the... Good question. I do for all animals but this particular movie is focused on pigs and that's exactly what we're trying to do. See you now, you're thinking of cows and chickens and fish. The pigs are just a gateway. All animals that experience the world deserve to have rights protecting them. Like, you know, you can't murder them, kill them. Even if done quickly, you know what I'm saying? That's what we're asking for for all animals. And the first step for that is for people to eat a plant-based diet so at least you're not hurting them. Second step for that is to help us raise awareness. Do you know what I mean? We've not got a website. If you just type in... ...pignorant, it'll all come up. Everything, everything you need. I'll go through the library in a minute and put it up. Bless you, brother. Take care, my friend. See you, mate.