 Good morning, Tracy. Why? How are you? I'm doing well. How are you doing? Doing okay. Wondering how many people will end up getting today. That's a good question. I was wondering whether we should have canceled this one too or not since people are seem to still be out this week. But we'll find out. Well, We've already not had two meetings. So I'd really rather not. So I'm going to pause recording. Right. Happy New Year, everyone. Welcome to our first meeting of 2022. This year is a good year for us all. As you all know, to be part of this meeting, you have to abide by the antitrust policy notice, which is being displayed on the screen as well as the code of conduct. So if you have any questions, please feel free to leave them in the comments section. Neither of these things are new to anybody on this call, as you've all been on this call before. So with that, we have the standard announcement, which is Dev Weekly newsletter that goes out. Tomorrow. So if there's anything that you would like to add to that, please feel free to edit the wiki page. Add a comment or. And we can get that information at it. We did get two quarterly reports in this time, one for Ursa and one for Basu. When I checked this morning, we were under half review for those for both of those. So if you haven't had an opportunity to look at those, please do so. I did not see any outstanding questions from either the projects or from anybody in the TSC. If there are any questions about those now would be the time to, to ask those. All right. Not seeing any hands. I don't think there's any questions. I will note that we do have some. Project reports that are overdue. If you happen to speak to anybody in those projects. Let them know that they're overdue. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. As well as Daniel will be reaching out and, and having a conversation or trying to get somebody to. Respond to, to comments about the fact that we need those project reports. All right. And we have three. Upcoming project reports. Two for next week. One for the following week that I have included there on the agenda. So the next thing that we have is related to. You know, I'm not sure if you've heard about this. But I think that we did reach out for us and talk to Casey. About the status of hyperledger borough. He did come back and recommend that we move that project to a dormant state. I also got back an email from Silas. Just a few days ago, a couple of days ago. I just wanted to let everybody know that we did get the recommendation. For moving bro to dormant from Casey. And I wanted to put that as a decision point for us to officially. Move that to dormant. So any questions or comments on that? So hi, Tracy. This is Alma. Just to clarify. So Silas is aware that Casey suggested we move that to dormant. Is not opposed to it. Right. That's correct. He responded to the email. That had Casey's original response in it. He didn't say like, no, no, no, don't move it. It was just a, hey, I'll provide some additional information. What we're going to do with maintenance going forward. When I return next week. All right. Sounds good. Thank you. Other questions or comments. Are you. I saw that you reached out to a couple of project teams fabric and sort of to be specific and asking them to. Know the status. I know what sort of people responded. But did you hear back from the other people? I did not hear back anything. I put the question out on the fabric EVM. Chat channel. Asking if this EVM chain code was still supported. But I have not heard anything back. Does anybody on the call know if we're still supporting the EVM chain code? I think the plan is to retire that one. I don't know if dormants the right state. For a repo or sub repo, but that's the idea with that one. Okay. In fact, I asked Chris Ferris was one of the. Initiators of that one and one of the few maintainers of that project remaining. So I asked him if he could archive that. Okay. Great. Any other questions, concerns, comments about this. Before we take it to an official vote. Angela. Yeah, Tracy. First of all, happy new year. And just for the records. I really liked the borrow. I'm sorry that they go to dormant, but I really liked that project. Yeah. Just for the record. Yeah. Definitely. Thanks, Angela. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. Just for the record. Yeah. Definitely. Thanks, Angelo. This is our. Our first real move into the Ethereum space. So. It's, it's sad to see that wanting to go to dormant, but maybe at some point in the future, somebody will pick it up or move forward with it. So Tracy, just one thing. First of all, happy new year to everyone. So. So when we put this project to dormant states, so I think we should not, I think hyperlegia should not do the marketing about like this project is now went to the permanent status because there are, there are many kind of marketing agency who can use this kind of news and can maybe spit the wrong about like hyperlegia. Now kind of dormant and kind of deactivating the particular projects. So what about the hyperlegia about hyperlegia is stuff about this project. They're going to market about it or they're going to just, it would be the internet to the hyperlegia only. Yeah. So I know, I know when we move quilt to dormant. What was it last year? You know, it was pretty much a silent sort of move. Right. Obviously not silent in the TSE. We did discuss it here, but that, that was the extent of it. Right. There was no sort of announcement saying, hey, hyperlegicals or hyperlegicals move to dormant state. There won't be any sort of thing like that either. Okay. Yeah. Any other questions or comments? Or does somebody want to officially make this a motion? So I'll be able to make a motion, but I wanted to follow up on what the camera just said. I mean, I think there's an easy defense to anybody who tries to twist that into, you know, some negative news about hyperlegia. We ought to be able to say, no, this is just, you know, we have this philosophy of having this kind of greenhouse where we have projects that are being, you know, brought in, we give them a chance and it's normal. You know, it's, it's good governance for us to also recognize when some projects are not going to last any longer. And we are retiring them. So I don't think we should, I mean, I'm not saying we should make a press release about a dealer, but I don't think we should be, you know, embarrassed about it or be shy about these things. We ought to be able to take a very firm stand on the fact that this is normal part of, you know, the project's life cycle. Yeah, I agree with that. Oh, I was going to raise my hand. Sorry. I agree with our nose comments and maybe it's a good opportunity in the new year to also bring forward the, the actual governance and what the status is and what is incubated versus active because I think, you know, everybody here on the phone knows, or I hope everybody here on the phone knows, but I think a lot of people as they come into hyper ledger, don't understand what that is. So maybe it would be worth our while to take, you know, use this as a reason to, you know, maybe do a blog post around the governance and why it's important and how we see this as, as, you know, good governance and healthy project, you know, project developments as well. And I think that would be a great blog post. Tracy, we can help you or somebody else wants to raise their hand to do it on the TSC to put forward and have as a reference material. Sounds good. So again, I'm happy to move for the motion to move viral to dormant state. Okay. Any second. Second. Thanks, Hart. So I don't think we need a roll call here. So right. If you just want to give us a, yay name sort of. In the matter before the technical steering committee. Who votes yay. Yay. Does anyone abstain for voting on the matter? Do we have any nays? Okay. The eyes have it. The eyes have it. All right. Thanks for I. Okay. So then the other matter before us really is talking through the. The issue that I raised in the TSC around projects who have not submitted their TSC quarterly project update. I think we have a lot of comments on this issue already. But I did want to bring it specifically to the TSC and to our meeting here so we can have a. A wider discussion. If anybody has any specific thoughts they'd like to bring up. Now would be the time to have that discussion. So I think before we get to the discussion. Right. If you wouldn't mind just opening up that issue. So that we can see it on the screen. As far as what it's been. Written up as. So I have done a few edits based on things that people have brought up. But specifically. The idea here is that if. Project misses their quarterly. Project update. We. First go through the process of having. The TSC vice chair reach out to those projects to remind them that their report is due. Dan has been reaching out specifically using these mechanisms that I've listed, which is. Reaching out directly to the last person who submitted the project quarterly update. If he doesn't get a response, he reaches out to both the project mailing list and the official chat channel. And then the idea here is that. If for some reason he's unable to reach someone in the project and an entire quarter goes by. Since we've seen a report from the project. Then the TSC would discuss and determine if there should be a vote on moving that project to a dormant state. So questions, comments. Any discussion that we'd like to have. Or so. I guess my first question would be is dormant state the only state that we're looking to move this project directly into our. Can we consider a, let's say. Intermediary state. That says, hey, this, nobody from this particular project is responding. But probably eventually. Community will oversee it and move it. So. I guess my first question would be is dormant state the only state that we're looking to move this project directly into. Or see it and move it to dormant state. But for now. We're just awaiting response. Yeah. So I specifically use the dormant state as that was a state we introduced last year. And it seemed like the, the right phrasing, if you will. I think we spoke quite a bit last year when we were thinking about what the right term was for this particular state. So. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know if dormant seemed to be. The right idea, but happy to see if anybody else has any. Different ideas or thoughts about whether we should add in your state. Since I still have my hand raised, sorry. I'll probably pitch in that pitch that in with additional idea. So we are considering the current problem that is. Projects not submitting the court of the reports. We have certain other cases where they'd say some of these projects were not responding. Let's say a new labs has been set up and we recommended that particular labs project to reach out to existing projects. And see if there is any collaboration and they being a new commerce into the community, they tried reaching out to these projects. However, they did not get a response from, from these existing projects that could be another case which I'm anticipating could occur. So maybe that calls us for a, for a case where we say, hey, this particular project maintainers are not responding to multiple requests, irrespective of whether it's the TSC reaching out to them or it's any other community members reaching out to them. So yeah, that's, that's all I want to back up that my initial thoughts with you. I know a couple of thoughts. I mean, on the labs itself, I don't think we should put the labs in the mix here because they're officially not under the governance of the TSC per se. And I think, you know, historically, those two labs two worlds have dealt with those issues, situations where we just say, okay, seems like nobody is alive here, not responding. And we just so kind of, and we're pretty, I mean, thanks to right, I have to say, we're pretty responsive at resurrecting those if somebody comes back and say, no, no, I should be, I mean, to keep working on this. So, so I don't think labs are concerning when it comes to the projects themselves. You know, I'm happy that we just had this resolution for borough. I think everybody would like to, would like this kind of outcome better where there is actually agreement and discussions that has happened where there's no, you know, it's not a contention, a conflicting situation where the TSC military says, well, when heard from them, so screw it, we just, you know, move them to dormant. And I hope this, we never have to do this really because this is really an unfortunate situation. I do like the original proposal because I think it doesn't force anything. It just says, hey, this is the mechanism we'll use. If it comes to this, and there's all these like different milestones where you're really trying to reach out. And it's really the worst case scenario where we say, well, we just can't get any answers. And then we will have to make a decision. And it doesn't say we'll automatically move the project to dormant. It just says the TSC will really have to have, you know, hard look at this and make a decision. So I think this is all we need. I wouldn't want to make, you know, no offense to Arun. I can see the logic in Arun's counter proposal to add another state. I think it just makes things more complicated than necessary for something that ought to be a very corner edge case. Hopefully something we'll never really face. Okay. Thanks, Arun. I just to clarify on the one point about labs, I agreed, labs shouldn't be part of this, but I think what Arun was trying to get to was the place where if we told, the lab stewards told the lab to reach out to an existing project and then that project didn't respond to that lab is I think what he was trying to get to, which I think is a valid sort of point. Yes. Okay. Thanks for the clarification. I missed that. Yeah, no worries. I originally, when Arun said labs, my brain went there too. And then I was like, oh, wait, okay. I get what you're trying to say, Arun. So I just want to make sure that you got that as well. Hart, your turn. So I think we should also try to address some of the core issues around this. So just poking around, right? It looks like say Caliper is pretty active, even though their quarterly report is like, you know, a month overdue or something, right? I mean, they had just looking that, you know, somebody was merged pull requests two days ago. So, you know, it's clear that, you know, people are people are still working. The project isn't dead. They're just not doing the quarterly reports. And I think for some of these smaller projects, you know, you get people that say like, you know, it's just not a priority for people. They don't really see the benefit of doing the quarterly report or doing much or doing it on time. And so they just tend to like do it halfway or just, just kind of ignore it, right? So I think, you know, obviously for bigger projects, this is much less of an issue. There's going to be somebody that can do this. So I'm wondering if there's a way we can sort of attack in the other direction rather than, you know, just saying like you must do your quarterly reports and attacking with, you know, sort of the big stick. We can either give some kind of carrots for quarterly reports or make quarterly reports easy to do. So, so I don't know how we can, you know, give carrots or incentivize people to do quarterly reports. But, you know, maybe some like attention from the TSC or maybe, you know, you can get stuff from your like accomplishments from the quarterly report featured on a blog or something. I'm not sure. I also think some of the stuff on the quarterly reports, it would be great if we could automate in the long run just to make things easier. Like there's no reason why we can't pull like the contributors or the, well, no reason in theory anyway, but we can't pull all the contribution statistics from LFX or something like that. So that might be a lot of work, but, you know, maybe in the long run we can think about doing that. So I guess what do people think about all of this? Thanks, Hart. Just I'll comment before anybody else raises their hand. I think that there's a reason that we introduced quarterly reports and maybe that reason isn't obvious to everybody involved in the projects as to why they're doing the quarterly reports. I also would comment on the fact that I actually take those quarterly reports. There's two things that happen with those quarterly reports. One is that I share them on a quarterly basis with the governing board. I'm sorry. I have a monthly basis with the governing board as to which ones were submitted. And I also pull out the interesting sorts of facts from them. And so I use those in the governing board reports every month to let them know kind of what the projects are up to and interesting things that they've been doing. And I have also used a lot of the information from those quarterly reports for like the member summit when I gave the member summit update on the projects. Those quarterly reports were great to figure out what was happening specifically in the projects. I use those internally within Accenture to share what's happening on different projects that might be of interest to people within Accenture. I use these more than I think people realize. And so I think if and when we do this blog post, Daniela on the governance, I think it's also maybe a place where we can highlight the usefulness of these project reports and why they bring value and why the projects would want to do those. And maybe that's just a discussion that we have to have broader with the projects. But for me, I wouldn't know what was going on with some of these projects if we didn't have these project reports. So I'll stop because hard, obviously something I said made you raise your hand again. So I'll let you go. Yeah, I was just saying, I think I agree with you. And I think that the key point that you said was that the projects aren't aware that this is happening, right? So from there and it's just particularly a small, the big focus here is small projects that are not connected to the TSC that don't have TSC representation. And these and to them, these quarterly reports are just kind of like a black hole, right? They see the input and they don't see a lot. A lot coming out of it. So I think, I think emphasizing what you said to the small projects would, you know, to these projects that are, you know, still active, but not necessarily on time on their quarterly reports would be fantastic. And I think this would be, you know, this would encourage people to be more on time on these. And to your other point, we, you know, you were there for this, but we actually introduced the quarterly reports because we used to have people do them live at the TSC meeting. And this just became too much of a burden on actually the TSC because all of the meetings were dominated by, by people giving their quarterly report talks. And it wasn't a problem that people didn't want to give them. Generally people wanted to like, they wanted to talk about their project in front of the TSC and, and they spent too much time. And that was the problem. And I, Arno, I'm sure remembers this as well. So maybe, maybe we can also give some of these projects a little bit of, we can say, Hey, your quarterly report is late. You know, if you're worried about, you know, impact or the TSC not seeing it, do you want to talk, do you want to give it verbally in front of the TSC? And obviously this isn't a sustainable thing that we can do for every project every time, but, but maybe it could help connect some of these projects back to the TSC. Thanks for listening. Sorry for the long talk. No problem. Thanks, Hart. Any other thoughts or comments? I've kind of heard two different things. And we like this and two or not sure this is the right thing. So, like this here are some other people and their thoughts on the issue at hand. Nathan. It's important to emphasize for the record. We're not trying to make these reports hard. If they're over burdensome or if there's data that's not applicable to your project or if there's something about doing quarterly report that's really, really difficult. You know, you could even use your quarterly report to tell us about that too. And you know, the ideas that we are trying to gather enough information, we can support your project. We want to be able to brag about the good things that you're doing, find you help, make connections with other partner companies and organizations who are working in other areas in Hyperledger so that they can understand why your project's interesting and hopefully get involved. So if someone's feeling like this is a bunch of busy work and it's not making any difference, let's have a conversation about how it can make a better difference and what different kind of data we might put in the report to make it better for you. That's always fair game. And the template is not fixed or static enough that I think that that's a problem. I haven't heard complaints around, you know, it's just too hard to find time. I think that other than there's just a lot of other things going on and people have a lot of competing priorities. So I think that this effort to follow up and formalizing some of the follow up around it will help us to avoid kind of that limbo of we haven't heard from a project and we're not sure what to do. It'll give us kind of some specific action steps as a TSE that we can take to keep everything straight and to do our due diligence around governance like Arno was telling us about before. Thank you. Hi, everybody. Happy New Year. I know that the learning materials working group every time I get a quarterly report, I update the resource library for each one of the projects. And when new people, new developers come in and they say, I don't know where to get started. I send them there and I say, look at the summary of what's been going on in each one of these projects. Look how many developers are coming in or going out and make your decision based on that information. And then they just figure out what projects they want to jump in on and that could be a carrot for these people who or for the groups that aren't seeing the value in that saying that's one of the first things the newcomers are looking at is how active is your project. That's a good point, Bobby. Heart. Other people can go first. Okay, Jim. Sorry for joining late. So, I apologize if this has already been brought up earlier. I felt like the quarterly report. Definitely gives TSC a view to how each project is doing. But I thought it's also a mechanism for the technical evaluation of how each project might need may or may not need help from TSC's point of view. I wonder if the burden can be shifted a little bit. If we can produce every report, not requiring the team to do that, but every report comes with default content since we have a lot of great project health status dashboards that I think each report just basically ended up including anyway, if we can say, well, every report will be generated on certain time. It can be the time that we currently require them to be produced. And they by default come with the information from the dashboard that shows I think a lot of information about the healthiness of the project already. And then every project owner is welcome to add more details, more color to just the numbers. But I think the number themselves tells a great story about how each project is doing. Don't want to add more work to anybody's plate. I don't know if there's a good way to have those be generated with that default content by default. And then every project owner can accept what's there by default or they can add more to it. Yeah. So I don't know, I'm going to jump in here before I call you because I'd like to respond to Jim's comment here. I think that there is information now that we didn't have when these project reports were originally created, right? And I think that information is useful. However, I would also say that a lot of the words that people use are useful as well, right? About the specific things that we can't see via numbers, right? These are the new features that were added in the last month or these are the things that are going well. These are the things that are going bad. And I don't think you can necessarily get that information from analytics. But at the same point, I do agree that there's probably stuff in that project report template that maybe doesn't have to be there anymore now that we do have the analytics tool. Yeah. If I can take a minute to respond to that, Tracy. I think we're kind of agreeing that we should utilize the dashboard more sort of as the baseline of evaluating if a project is very active, clearly pushing more code and having discussions. Even if they have nothing in the quarterly reports, I think we should feel happy, right? It shouldn't be a concern to anybody. It's only when it's silent over there, it's silent on the report content in terms of words. That's when we should get concerned. I just feel like if we did this, then it takes a lot of sort of confusion and complaints of too much work out of the equation. Thanks, Jim. Arno. Yeah, I, you know, on that very point first, I would say quickly that I agree with your view, Tracy, which is, I think, you know, we are leveraging the dashboard. We're asking people to put a link to the less quarter so that people have an easy approach to that. But I think the intent at least was to go beyond what's available, you know, that's been can be gathered automatically. And in a way that only a human being can really convey. But maybe Jim has a point where we, and it kind of, you know, goes, it's in line with what Nathan was touching on earlier, which is maybe at this point, we could, you know, better communicate what we expect from, from this, this form, this report, and maybe lighten up even the, the, the structure. And, you know, so that it, the effort to fill them out in the case where there is no issue becomes much lighter. But I also wanted to bounce initially to the back on, on this, topic where you were explaining very interesting, you know, use cases for all those reports, all the use you make out of them. And Bobby also highlighted how she uses that. And so I think maybe out of this, we should take, you know, what I'm thinking is we should make an effort to try to capture, you know, the, the, the use of those reports. And so that we can communicate that to the projects, because I agree with what I said earlier that I suspect most projects don't even understand how much, you know, how useful this is. And, and I don't think we do a very good job, necessarily explaining why we are having, why we are asking them to fill out those reports. And if they say, maybe they would be more, you know, inclined to making the little effort. We're asking them to fill out those reports. Yeah. Good point. Right. Your hand is virtually up. Yeah. My hand is virtually up. So I agree. I think that's a good way to go. I do want to point out that the. The data in insights is not static. And you can change history. So if we're going to generate one, I just asked the TSC. It should be a static thing that they're pointing to. Not like a URL within LFX. Because you can change history. And that's, that's all I got. So I agree. I think that's a good way to go. I do want to point out that the, that's a good way to go about changing history. And that's, that's all I got. Right. Can I, can I ask a follow up to the changing history? How do you change history? I will give you an example that will happen later today. I just transferred a repo in from BC go for Aries. So the contribution data for this quarter. And all quarters proceeding it. We'll have, we'll be recalculated once that repo is. We'll be able to see what the contributions are taking in. So they're going to change. And if we archive a repo. Those contributions will retroactively change as well. Okay. Yeah. Understood. Makes sense. Thanks. Heart. Thanks, Tracy. So I just wanted to essentially agree with what Arno said. Just a second ago. And I also want to point out that I think we have sort of two different problems with quarterly reports. There are projects that are seemingly inactive that are not submitting their quarterly reports on time. And obviously these projects we should consider for dormancy, but there are also projects that are seemingly active. That are lazy about. Submitting their quarterly reports. And probably discussion for dormancy is, is not really right for these projects, right? We could just look at them and say like, well, people are, are still working pretty hard on this. They're just not submitting their quarterly reports. Yes. Just thinking about that. In the, in the case of the projects that are. Not responding. Not providing a project report. I'm just trying to rephrase what I think I heard. There's two different. Reasons that they might not be doing that one. They truly might not be active. And two, they might be active, but they just don't see the need to fill out the project report. In the, the former case, we need to do something about that. In the latter case, we need to still get information from those active projects about interesting things that we might be able to share with a wider community. And we need to figure out a way to do that. Yeah. Did I, did I capture that correctly? What you were trying to say? Yes. Thank you. That was great. Okay. I just want to make sure I didn't miss something. No, no, no. Yeah. I just wanted to point out that these two problems have. Potentially two different solutions, which is what you summarized perfectly. So thank you. Okay. Thanks, Hart. Nathan. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. When that's the case, like maybe it's someone who is handling a lot of the administrative work has transitioned on to a different. Roller job. Or, you know, maybe they need help with. Nominating a new maintainer, for example, because if the core maintainer who was doing all the reports. Moves on it. Maybe the project is still. Perfectly active, but not all the roles and responsibilities as a former maintainer. You know, we're passed on or handed over to someone else. So I think it's worth calling that out. That the dormancy is not the only outcome here. We're really telling the TSC as a whole. We need to go look at this. We need to figure out what we can do better. Yep. Yep. Definitely makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely makes sense. David. Well, to build on that about responsibilities and making sure they're handed off. I mean, I've seen situations where new people come into a project. And they're just not aware of their responsibilities. I mean, I don't think we need to assume that. A maintainer necessarily knows that they need to do the report and just chooses not to. I suspect. There are new maintainers who don't even realize this is necessarily a thing. There's no real official maintainer onboarding, so to speak. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe there are as more we can do to notice when a new maintainer shows up and reach out and make sure that we have a conversation with them. Cause I've seen other situations where new people show up and they're not necessarily aware of. Existing community calls, for example, or other things that maybe we would hope that they were aware of. Yep. That's a good point to David. Is there something that we can be doing to document some of the things that might exist out there that people are not aware of? And in theory, if I knew if, and I don't know if insights could do this, but in theory, if it could, if we had a list of all the new maintainers who showed up in a given time period, you know, I could reach out to them and say, Hey, do you want to have an onboarding? But you know, I don't, you know, I don't think that's really been happening right now. I think that onboarding, if it exists, has been very informal. Yeah. Okay. I saw your hand go up and then back down anything. Oh, sure. I was just going to comment that it seems like the reminders were particularly erratic. Recently. I don't know what was up with that, but. I did go through and change. A bunch of the meetings when I was. Rescheduling stuff for this year to kind of spread out. We had a bunch of them that were happening all at once and we had some new projects. So I was reshuffling them. And I think it's possible that I. Didn't get all the invites exactly correctly set up with the, the proper reminders. So I will. Go back and look at the project calendars and make sure that those are set up correctly. Thank you for pointing that out. All right. Anything else. I've heard. A couple of things that I think are action items. That we need to take as a TC. I think one is that we probably need to review the project report template and determine what is still useful to have. What is not useful to have in there. As well as writing up. And some. Wiki page or some blog post that talks about why. A project reports are important. Right. How are they used beyond just the. A, you wrote it. We read it. That was the end of it. Right. So I think those are the two action items specifically for this. Particular issue. I think there's still value in it. For. The projects that are truly inactive. Right. That they're not writing a report because there's nobody there to write a report and there's nothing that's happening on those projects. However, as has been stated. Right. There are the cases where. We want to try and figure out how to make this. An easier process for. Projects that are active. And that this doesn't seem like a. A hassle, right? A struggle. A complex sort of thing to, for them to do on a quarterly basis. And I think, you know, the two action items will help in that regard. So anything else that we should talk about specifically for this issue. Is there anybody who wants to volunteer for, for maybe reviewing the project report template. Coming up with an alternative for suggestions for changes. As we go forward. I'm happy to write up the information on why the project reports are important. Tracy, I can help take a look at the template itself to see if we can include a section that has the. As the stats captured somehow. Okay. That'd be great too. And also if there's, if there's things in there that we think are no longer really. Valid. Right. To have. Somebody manually go and ask. You know, those are things we can take a look at. You know, updating the template as well. All right. Any. Any other comments, any questions? Anything that is not related to this that we should be talking about as this year starts. Everybody's got their fingers pressed that Tracy's going to say they can go now. Everybody's keeping very quiet in order to make that happen. Tracy, we're expecting a closing monologue. No, I can't do it. All right. So there's nothing else. Okay. Jim, you know, we'll hopefully have the opportunity in the next week for you to, to go through and take a look and make some suggestions and hopefully get you on the report next week. Or on the agenda next week. And then I will also start to write up the information. On why a project report is important. So we can take a look at that and see if there's other things we'd like to add to it. Thank you. That was a good closing monologue. Thank you. Thanks, Tracy. Bye. Thank you. Goodbye.