 Rwyf i'n gwych, a'r next item of business is the member's business debate on motion 9621 in the name of Tom Arthur on the carer positive employer initiative. That debate will be concluded without any questions being put, and I would ask those members who wish to speak in the debate to press the request to speak buttons. I call on Tom Arthur to open the debate, around seven minutes please, Mr Arthur. As MSPs, we regularly have the privilege of meeting an extraordinary range of individuals, groups and organisations. Amongst the many who make up the rich fabric of our society, there are certain groups and individuals who, to me, and I imagine for all of us, are a humbling experience. Those who serve in our fire police and other emergency services are forces in the veterans community. Those who work in the front line of our health and social care services and our unpaid carers. Our carers make up 17 per cent of the adult population of Scotland and it is estimated that 4 per cent of those under 16 are unpaid carers. The diversity of Scotland's population is equally reflected in the diversity of our carers community. The student who balances school while caring for her mum, the elderly husband who meticulously and selflessly organises his wife's self-directed support, the single mother raising three children who each have additional support needs. Those are but a handful of the experiences that are shared by the 788,000 people in Scotland who are caring for a relative, friend or neighbour. Each one of those carers makes a profound impact upon the lives of those that they support. In doing so, carers make a massive contribution towards the delivery of care in Scotland. The value of the care that is provided by unpaid carers equates to £10.3 billion per year. To put that into context, that is an amount equivalent to almost 80 per cent of our NHS budget. That is being provided by barely 15 per cent of the population. To put it simply, society as we know it can only function because of the selfless dedication of unpaid carers. The care that they provide is irreplaceable. However, as well as providing care, many carers also make a significant contribution to Scotland's broader workforce across a range of professions. It is estimated that more than one third of carers combine care with work. With the 270,000 working carers comprising more than 10 per cent of the entire working population of Scotland, with the total number of carers in Scotland expected to reach £1 million within the next 20 years, it is clear that our working carers will become an increasingly important part of Scotland's overall workforce. That is why it is vital that our workplace environments are supportive and understanding of the needs of carers, not just for the carers of today and tomorrow but also for Scotland's wider economy. The carer positive initiative both recognises and assists employers who seek to provide a supportive and understanding environment for those employees who are carers. That support can take many forms, such as telephone access, health and wellbeing support, leave arrangements and flexible working. Small differences can have a huge impact. However, without the right type of support in the workplace, working carers are at risk of stress, burnout and even leaving employment altogether. That, of course, can have a significantly detrimental impact on both the carer and the people who they care for. However, it can also have a very negative impact on the employer who loses a skilled member of staff. However, with the right support, employers are able to retain carers. That can lead to reduced absence, lower levels of staff turnover and an overall reduction in recruitment costs. The good news is that all organisations, regardless of size or structure, can become carer positive. How does an organisation— Ruth McWire. Tom Arthur for taking an intervention. I wonder whether you agree with me that if employers do not provide flexible carer-friendly workplaces, they are missing out on a huge pool of talent. It is not just about supporting people, but about accessing the talent and skills of folk who have caring responsibilities. Tom Arthur. I absolutely agree with my colleague, and I will illustrate some of that later on in my remarks. As I was going to say, the question is how does an employer or an organisation become carer positive? It is actually very simple. It is just about fulfilling five fairly basic criteria. Those are one that there is a good understanding of the meaning of the term carer, and measures are in place that allow for the identification of carers, including support to self-identify for those who may not be aware that they are carers. Two, that they recognise carer policies or procedures. Three, that there is workplace support. Four, policies, procedures and support are effectively communicated to all staff. And five, that carers are supported to engage with other carers. Once an employer achieves carer positive status, organisations can then progress through three levels, moving from engaged to established and finally to exemplary. The ways in which the criteria are met and progression achieved will, of course, vary between organisations, reflecting their different sizes and structures. This flexibility allows employers and carers to work together in the design and implementation of policies and procedures within the workplace that work for them. The carer positive scheme is designed so that all organisations will be able to meet the criteria, and there are now over 90 carer positive employers across the length and breadth of Scotland, covering close to 300,000 employees. Carer positive employers can be found in a range of sectors, including financial services, energy, food and drink, charities and social enterprises, local authorities, health boards, colleges and universities, Scottish and UK Government agencies and even MSPs—not to mention the Scottish Parliament, of course, and the Scottish Government. That means that there is now a solid evidence base highlighting the advantages of carer positive and a wide range of examples of best practice and how to achieve accreditation and progress. I wish to place on record my thanks to members of the Greens, Labour and Liberal Democrats, as well as my own SNP colleagues, who have supported the motion today. I would also like to express my gratitude to Carers Scotland, in particular to Simon Hodgson, Sue McClintock and Fiona Collie, who are in the gallery, for their support ahead of this debate. I am pleased to advise members that I will be hosting a drop-in session with Simon, Sue and Fiona, between 2 and 4 this afternoon in committee around free, and I would encourage members to spare five minutes to take this opportunity to drop in and learn how they can promote the carer positive scheme to organisations in their own constituencies and regions, and, importantly, to learn how to become carer positive employers themselves. Three in five of us will become carers at some point in our lives. Carer positive is an initiative that is relevant to all of us. It benefits both working carers and employers, supporting and enabling working carers to gain and retain employment, and it contributes towards inclusive growth. It is a scheme that deserves the widest possible uptake, and I look forward to seeing more organisations and MSPs becoming carer positive employers. We now move to the open debate and speeches of around four minutes, please, and I call Jamie Halcro Johnston to be followed by Kezia Dugdale. Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer, and I congratulate Tom Arthur on bringing this debate to the chamber today. Carer positive is an initiative that I hope members from across the political spectrum can get behind. It has been incredibly welcome to see a greater focus on the needs and challenges that carers face from across all of the parties in recent years. The motion before us today highlights the economic value of carers and the work that they do. This cannot be stated enough when we consider the provision that is made for carers directly through the state, as well as through initiatives like that. To focus on my own region briefly, the last census found well over 40,000 people involved in administering unpaid care, a significant proportion providing over 50 hours a week of care a week. That is likely to be an underestimate of the actual true fact. In some ways, our region is typical, but it is not difficult to imagine the extra strain that sometimes distant essential surfaces can cause. It is equally easy to predict that care would be far more difficult for the public sector to deliver to people in community settings in areas such as the Highlands and Islands. I pray to the great many carers from across the Highlands and Islands and across Scotland. When we present figures, they can often mask the thousands upon thousands of individual situations that they represent, the range and diversity of people who are in employment and yet undertake often extensive caring responsibilities. Each is unique, but many of the stresses and the strains are shared and, unfortunately, commonplace. When employer support carers within their organisation, it provides a benefit not only to them and the carer but to the person receiving care and the wider society, too. I would echo Ruth Maguire's point about being able to access a great pool of talent within the caring community. Carering for carers is in all of our interests and is rightly a key aspiration for parties across this chamber. The law mandates a number of employment rights that can be enjoyed by carers, including significantly the right to request flexible working, the right to time off in an emergency and the provisions in the Equality Act 2010 to guard against discrimination. However, there remain a range of steps that employers can undertake voluntarily to make their organisations even more accessible, inclusive and welcoming to people with caring responsibilities. That is where carer positive comes in. Much of what is needed is raising awareness. Often, caring responsibilities can be hidden with people's home and work lives kept separate. However, there always remain circumstances where the two clash. That is why it is positive that businesses maintain policies and procedures that ensure where this occurs that support is in place. I note from some of the published material that most of the existing awarded organisations under the scheme are public sector or third sector bodies. That includes, I am pleased to say this Parliament itself, having received its recognised status back in February of last year. I would ask the minister today if it may be possible to outline what the Scottish Government can do to encourage the uptake of the initiative among private sector companies, the private sector companies with which the Government has regular dealings. It would also be interesting to know how many businesses are currently working with carer positive with a view to becoming awarded bodies at present. Once again, I welcome the initiative and the work undertaken by carer Scotland. I would encourage the Scottish Government to look at where it can build on the connections and what influence it has to embed career positive attitudes among employers across the length and breadth of Scotland. I call Kezia Dugdale to be followed by Graeme Dey. Thank you, Presiding Officer, and I congratulate Tom Arthur on securing this debate. I consider Tom a friend, so I always like to follow his work. I also participate in this debate this afternoon as a forthcoming new member of the Economy and Fair Work Committee, of which this is what we are fundamentally debating—the role of carers in the economy and their ability to access fair work. It is worth repeating some of the economic statistics. We know that carers contribute £10.8 billion to our economy. We know that one in seven workers in Scotland have some sort of caring responsibilities, yet, as we heard from Tom Arthur, currently only around 287,000 employees are actually working for companies that are covered by the carer positive scheme, so there is a tremendous amount more work in progress that we can make in this regard. I have to confess, Presiding Officer, that I have not heard about the scheme until I noticed Tom's debate today, so everything that I have learnt about it I have learnt in the past few days. The similarities are striking with the living wage accreditation scheme, especially when you look at the benefits to the economy. Much of the argument around the living wage was made around the fact that it would reduce absenteeism, reduce the turnover of staff within organisations and drive up productivity rates. Those are all arguments for the carer positive scheme. It is worth remembering that one of the best advocates for the living wage in the early days was a private company, just to pick up on the point that was made by Jamie Halcro Johnston. It was PricewaterhouseCoopers, one of the first major private sector employers to adopt the living wage because they believed that it was good business sense. There are many ways in which we can progress the case for expanding the carer positive scheme in that regard. In order to become a carer positive organisation, you need to be able to do five key things. You need to be able to identify carers within your organisation. You need to make sure that your HR policy reflects and mentions carers. You need to provide various workplace support. You need to increase your communication awareness and training around carers. You need to have various mechanisms of peer support in place. As we have heard from Tom Arthur, there are three different scales at which employers can operate, starting from being engaged, then to established and then exemplary employers with regard to the carer positive scheme. I had to have a look in Edinburgh, the area that I seek to represent, what organisations, what employers were currently carer positive approved. I was delighted to see that in that first stage in the engaged category there is Edinburgh City Council, there is indeed the Parliament itself and the University of Edinburgh. When you work your way up to who the established carer positive organisations are, NHS Lothian, Standard Life, who were also a great champion of the living wage in the early days and the Scottish Government, appear in that second category. Finally, in the exemplary category, there are not as many organisations as I think we would like to see, but there is the big energy company, Centrica, who have their headquarter functions here in Edinburgh. Having only just learned about the scheme, I will endeavour as a Lothians MSP to do everything that I can to promote the scheme and contact employers large and small across the Lothians region to see what I can do to encourage them to participate in the scheme. Equally, I am a living wage accredited employer as an MSP. I will now, after Tom's challenge, make sure that my office as an MSP is also carer positive and I will start those steps this week. Finally, it is worth recognising that, although we know carers make a tremendous contribution to the economy as employees, there are many carers who cannot work, who desperately want to work. I am mindful of a young man who came to my surgery back in October who is desperate to work but just cannot find an employer who is willing to cope or deal with the reality of his living circumstances. We will get that right when that young man is in the workplace and I will continue to do my bit to make sure that that happens. Thank you, Presiding Officer. I thank my colleague Tom Arthur for bringing that motion forward for debate. First, carer positive is a great initiative that we should be celebrating and promoting. Secondly, it affords me the chance at the conclusion of this debate to meet with Sue McClintock and Simon Hoskin from carer positive and collect my carer positive certificate, as my office has joined Tom's as being accredited as carer positive. I am delighted to be the second MSP to be accredited. I would be even more delighted if he had not beat me to be in first mind, given that I am competitive, if you understand. However, it is only right that Tom and I are backing up words with actions. It is right and proper that the Scottish Parliament is doing that as well. Members may recall that, in February last year, I hosted an event here at Hwyrood to showcase the initiative at which the Parliament was presented with its carer positive engaged level accreditation. The Parliament has demonstrated that it has in place a number of policies that support staff with caring responsibilities. Regular development conversations with staff, line managers, are encouraged to ask about wellbeing and any support that staff member needs. Support resources are available to staff, including train counsellors, who can provide expert emotional guidance. The human resources office also raises with external organisations such as Vocal, which supports carers in Edinburgh and the Lodians. I am pleased to learn that further steps have been planned for this year. A carer staff network, which will be open to all building users, is in the process of being set up here. That will provide a space for carers to share their experiences and assist the organisations in developing its understanding of the needs of staff with caring responsibilities. Once the network is set up, the Parliament will work towards the exemplary level of the award in 2018. I hope that members will join me in acknowledging the efforts of Anil MacKenna and Philippaard Booth, who, along with other members of the Parliament staff, are delivering that. More than that, I hope that they themselves will commit, as Kezia Dugdale has, to joining the initiative, because, as MSPs, we ought to be leading by example. Let me be honest here that, although I have always supported the initiative, I have previously voiced concerns about the challenges facing very small offices and businesses in becoming carer-positive environments. Those concerns might be hesitated before taking this step. There are some circumstances in which a very much outward public serving setup I thought an MSP's office could find itself conflicted, but it readily became apparent that, through common sense, since co-operation and dialogue, it could almost almost find a way. Interestingly, of the now 90 carer-positive employers in Scotland, 28 are defined as small employers, i.e. those with fewer than 50 employees. There are admittedly a large number of the small employers' work within the carers or voluntary sector, but the list also includes public sector organisations such as the Scottish Roads, Works Commissioners and private companies such as Moan and Aqua, UK Ltd and Interweight Ltd. Being a small organisation does create challenges, but assuming that clintock carer-positive has not designed a one-size-fits-all scheme, being accommodating does not mean that you are unable to provide a proper level of service to your customers or constituents. At the heart of that, the key point is communication and flexibility, cutting both ways, the same of which can be said of the benefits. The results of a carer employee survey recently found that 92 per cent of participating organisations saw better staff retention, 88 per cent experienced lower-absence rates, 61 per cent witnessed improved recruitment and 69 per cent observed higher productivity. There is a hard cash illustration of the benefit to employers, the wider economy and the public purse 2. Centrica, one of the five employers who have received carer-positive's highest status and one of the founding members of carers for employers, estimates that the direct cost to an employer of losing a working carer is between 100 per cent and 150 per cent of their annual salary. Across the UK, that amounts to a cost of around £1.3 billion a year to the economy, and when lost tax revenue and additional benefit payments are taken into account, that rises to £5.3 billion annually. In other words, there is a solid financial as well as moral case for pursuing carer-positive policies. The last of the open debate contributions is from Jeremy Balfour. Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer, and I would also like to thank Tom Arthur for bringing forward this important debate. Unpaid carers are unsung heroes. As of June 2017, as we have already heard, there were an estimated 788,000 unpaid carers in Scotland. We make a massive contribution to reducing the burden on the NHS, the social care system and relying on friends, neighbours and relatives. In fact, Deputy Presiding Officer, if it wasn't for a carer today, I wouldn't be standing here because I need help getting addressed every morning unpaid done voluntary. In our role as MSPs, we have all met with carers who tell you that it can be a positive and rewarding experience to know that you are helping someone else. But they will also tell you that to help a husband, a wife, a partner, a child comes and can often be difficult and upsetting. It can lead to greater stress, worry, isolation, depression, anger and guilt. The blurring of boundaries is am I a carer or am I a father, am I a carer or am I a husband? Carering can also put a strain on financial pressure as well. Often you have to cut down on your work, juggle work, cut out things that you like doing, perhaps in regard to sport or other activities. Supporting carers to manage the sometimes difficult job of balancing work with caring responsibilities can deliver real benefits to employers, as well as helping individuals and their families. The carer positive employer aims to encourage employers to create a supportive working environment for carers in the workplace. I welcome the wide range of employers who were consulted before this came forward, a strong partnership between public and private, between voluntary, and I hope that it will have a lasting success across Scotland. Employers' supporting initiative recognise that, in addition to being good employment and by supporting their employees, it also gives them benefit as well. Often, if you lose a carer from a workforce, you damage not only that individual and that family but you damage that company or that organisation. An example of that is the Scottish Court Service, who recognises the need to retain staff who are skilled and experienced, providing help through their carers policy and acknowledges that achieving a good work-life balance makes sense for everybody. I hope that the Carers Scotland Act 2016, which will come into effect on 1 April, will again help people to be supported in what they do. Carer positive is a win-win-win. Again, like Kezia Dugdale, I have to confess that I did not know a lot about the scheme until Tom Arthur's motion came up. I hope that, later on this afternoon, I will visit the session that he is holding and to look as an employer to bring this forward in my workforce. I hope that other organisations will do the same and other MSPs will do the same. I welcome the award and hope that we can continue to develop similar initiatives that teach conices of population changes, provide practical solutions for support and recognise, most importantly, the contribution that was made by Carers. We have, in fact, another contribution in the open debate, Fulton O'Greggor. I apologise to the chamber, but I have not intended to speak by pressing my buttons, so I thank you for letting me in. I will also make a declaration that I am the parliamentary liaison officer to the health secretary. I want to thank Tom Arthur for bringing the debate to the chamber and also pay tribute to Fiona Colline and others in the gallery who I know have done fantastic work in this. As I said, I did not intend to speak, but when I heard the debate progressing, I decided that I would chip in. I was remembered of my own experience. I thought about carers in the context of not just being a carer once in their life, but maybe that carers would be in and out of that position. I thought that myself as a young 18-year-old, and through my early 20s, I helped as a family unit caring for my gran, who unfortunately passed away in the year 2000. However, I took that opportunity to pay tribute to her, because it was actually her anniversary on Tuesday. I was reminded of that as a family unit caring for her, and we all had our different roles to make, whether that was simply going over to make some breakfast or lunch or whatever else. However, I even thought that my brother and I were teenagers at the time, so my mum and dad were having more full roles. I was kind of reminded of that. Also, the case work that we deal with when people come in and out of the office disease has almost become common. I do not know how other MSPs feel for people to come in now with a carer, as it is for them to come in individually, whether that is a surgery or coming into my local office to meet with us. Inevitably, as you are chatting to focus, people recognise that, as well as dealing with the query, they might be able to talk about their own situations. What has struck me is the inconsistencies in how people are supported at their work. Some people say that they are really well supported here by my work, so that they know of my carer, my aunt or my sister or whoever. Other people say that we are not very supported at all. It has been a real struggle to get here today. I have only got half an hour, I have only got 20 minutes. I think that that is a really great initiative that can maybe help if it progresses to deal with some of those inconsistencies. As Tom Arthur pointed out, it is much about supporting the individual and the organisation, so I think that that is really good. I want to also mention, as Kezia Dugdale has done just a particular case, a person that had just came to my surgery recently. They are caring for—there are a couple who work in the same place and they are caring for their wee boy who has a lifelong condition. I was absolutely shocked to hear that they are really struggling to get a shift pattern that would work for them both. They are coming at a lot of difficulties with that. Even when they are needing time off, they are not getting paid leave or such. I have just various difficulties, and I will get the relevant information to the ministers to take that possibly forward. However, I will ask the minister and the Scottish Government if they will commit to pursuing all sorts of organisations, including ones such as the prison service, for example, who I did not see on the official list, to sign up to carers positive as much for them to get support about how they are treating their employees as well as being able to treat employees. I have significant caring responsibilities, and I will leave it at that. I thank you again for letting me in and for Tom Arthur for bringing this debate to the chamber. A very good initiative. Thank you very much. I now call Eileen Campbell to respond to the debate around seven minutes, please, minister. Thank you, Presiding Officer. As others have spoken about, this has been an important debate not only for recognising our unpaid carers but to help to raise awareness of carer positive to employers across Scotland, large and small. I, like others, also thank Tom Arthur for bringing this debate forward. I echo the words that he used to describe Scotland's carers and paying rightful tribute to the irreplaceable and selfless dedication of carers across Scotland. I also welcome carers Scotland to the Parliament and recognise the work that they do to promote this important scheme and initiative carers positive. While caring for a loved one can be a positive and fulfilling experience, there are stresses and challenges that many carers face every day. Jeremy Balfour and Fulton MacGregor spoke with real experience about how that can impact on people and families' lives. Likewise, from my own family experience, my mum relies heavily on the respect that she got from crossroads when she was caring for my grandad when we and my sister were both very young. Because of the value that we attach to the unstinting commitment carers have to the ones that they love, this Government is absolutely committed to enabling carers to continue to care if they wish to in better health but to also have a life alongside that caring role that they have. We have invested around £136 million from 2007 through to 2017 towards a number of programmes supporting adult carers and young carers with our partners in local authorities, health boards, the third sector and the national carer organisations. The views and experiences of carers have also been crucial in helping to inform our programmes and initiatives. Most recently they have helped to shape the new legislation that extends and enhances the rights of carers to support. I want to take a moment to speak about the carers act as there are important links, as speakers have already mentioned, to the intentions of the carer positive scheme that has been discussed today. We have brought forward the carers act, which takes effect in April this year, to ensure that all of our carers can be better supported and that they are able to realise their own personal outcomes. The new adult carer support plans and young carer statements will identify each carer's personal outcomes so that their eligible needs are supported. That may include their wishes to, for example, remain in work or undertake studies or training. Local authorities must also establish and maintain an information and advice service for carers. There are a number of areas that that must cover, including income maximisation for carers and information about carers rights. It is clear to me that the outcomes being achieved through carer positive can complement the provisions in the act. I encourage integration authorities to consider schemes such as carer positive when undertaking their duties under the new legislation. There are an estimated 788,000 carers in Scotland. 56 per cent of carers aged 16 or over are also in employment or self-employment. In the authority of my own constituency, that equates to around 18,300 carers who are also in work. I have heard from some carers who struggle to look after their own health and wellbeing and, as a consequence, their loved ones' wellbeing, too. The financial impact of reducing the hours that they work or giving work up altogether can be life-changing. Nationally, around 35,600 carers have reduced the number of hours that they work, and around 22,600 have left work altogether. With some of the unfairness of the social security system being delivered by the UK Government, their situation can quickly become more challenging. We believe that it is unfair that the support carers receive in the form of carers allowance is the lowest of all working-age benefits. That is why we are increasing carers allowance to the same level as job seekers allowance from summer this year. Of course, supporting carers to balance work and caring responsibility helps to improve family finances, but there are other positive impacts of the carer positive scheme. As caring responsibilities increase in intensity, carers are at risk of becoming isolated. It can be difficult to maintain or foster social networks and pursue hobbies or interests. Being at work and among colleagues can be invaluable to a carer's health and wellbeing. Carer positive is reducing socialisation and creating carer-friendly communities across the country. It is clear that, since its launch in June 2014, carer positive is making organisations reflect more about what can be done to better support employees who are also carers. Maurice Corry I thank the minister for taking the intervention. My capacity as a chairman of the cross-party group for armed forces and veterans community is a very apt subject that we are discussing today in debating. Can I ask the minister to consider the care support that the armed forces veterans organisations provide to veterans in Scotland? That can amount to some 200 cases per month for some of the larger veterans centres in Scotland. Will it be good if the minister could consider those organisations under the carer positive initiative? Aileen Campbell I think that there are always ways in which we want to enhance the offer through carer positive. If the member wants to write to me with some of the details of that, I am happy to look at that and share that with Carer Scotland and others, my officials, as well, about whether or not there are areas that we can make improvements. I am certainly encouraged that, so far, 90 employers have been recognised as being carer positive, covering around 295,000 employees in Scotland. However, as Tom Arthur and Kezia Dugdale rightly noted, there is clearly much more that we still need to do. The list of employers who are carer positive also includes the Scottish Parliament, Scottish Government, third sector, public and private sector organisations. As members may be aware, I recently wrote to all Scottish public bodies to encourage them to participate in the scheme. I also wrote to MSPs in November, so I apologise to the members who have come left field if they did not receive that, but I am certainly happy from my perspective to ensure that we can pass on any knowledge and information to any members who wish to sign up. Certainly, in response to Jamie Halcro Smith's points, my officials are also working across Government to engage and establish better links with the chambers of commerce, making sure that we up the number of private companies who are embracing carer positive. I also congratulate Tom Arthur as the trendsetter for this, alongside Graham Day, and my ministerial colleagues, Gene Freeman and Marie Todd, who have been recognised as being carer positive employers. As I have also done, I hope that members across the Parliament visit the carer positive website and apply to participate in this important scheme. Carer positive is not only, however, benefiting carers. As Graham Day described, those organisations who have taken steps to become carer positive recognise the business case for supporting staff to remain in post, retain their skill and experience, and that can reduce staff turnover and associated recruitment and training costs. Inclusive growth is a key element of this Government's economic strategy, and we will support and encourage employers to maximise the benefits that come with treating workers fairly. It is right, as Kezia Dugdale did, to set carers positive within the context of fair work practices. We are committed to driving up employment standards. That is why we launched the Scottish Business Pledge and appointed an independent fair work convention, which published its framework in 2016. Despite employment law being a reserve matter, the Procurement Reform Scotland Act 2014 enabled the Government to publish statutory guidance on addressing fair work practices in procurement in October 2015. That makes it clear that a positive approach to fair work practices can help to improve the quality of services, goods and works. Public bodies must now consider, before undertaking a procurement exercise, whether it is relevant and proportionate to include a question on fair work practices, including things such as the living wage, which can be evaluated as part of the competition, and carer positive is contributing to that positive approach. I thank Carer Scotland for its hard work and development of carer positive. I hope that employers across all sectors in Scotland take steps to become carer positive, and we will continue to work closely with Carer Scotland to explore how best to increase take-up of the scheme and how to support existing carer positive employers. I am grateful to all MSPs for their commitment to do what they can to promote that initiative. Finally, I thank Tom Arthur for bringing forward that motion and for his clear passion for making a difference in that important issue. That concludes the debate. The meeting is suspended until 2.30pm.