 to Finding Happiness in Hard Times. My name is Ken Birtness and I'm coming to you from Alayva out at the North Shore. And today we've got a very special program called Life's Adding and Subtracting. This is part of our sort of mini series that we call the Big Questions because part of Finding Happiness is knowing what's important in life. In fact, that was our big question six months ago when I had the pleasure of having these three ladies on with me and they tackle that big question. So they're also volunteering to tackle this question today about adding and subtracting to get as close to what is important. So without further ado, let me welcome Tamara Mone and Penny Smith and Jamie McEwitt. Welcome to the show again, ladies. Hello. Hi. You know, as a way of introduction, one of the things that I've noticed in life as I get older, but actually it starts right from the beginning and that is accumulation. We accumulate things. We accumulate lots of different things and stuff over our life. And first what happens is we fill up our closet with all these. Then we fill up our garage. Then we look around and our light is so full. If you're like me, you look at your calendar and can't find a single day that's a rest and relaxation day. There's no blanks in that calendar. And while doing a lot of things and tackling a lot of projects and living a full life is very rewarding, it keeps us going to the maximum. And all that's great up to a point. But then it becomes just too much and that positive becomes a negative and we start getting burnout and we start dragging. And that could happen to us even when we're young. As I remember back to my days when I was quite a bit younger than I am now and those were full days too. Somehow I had the energy to do that. I wish they had more, but now I have even less energy. So it's important to take a look at both those things. And I think we need to look at them from both sides. Both what we need to cut back on or maybe even eliminate and what we need to add to our life because there's still things to add. And our future is just as important as our past. So we're going to be tackling all this and since Tamara has volunteered to start, Tamara, I'm going to throw it over to you. Okay. Well, I was thinking about things that caused me stress that I'd really like to limit in my life. And really, I think the major thing is all our digital communication stuff, you know, the phone texting, emailing, all that stuff that, you know, that part of our daily activity kind of expects you to be on call 24 hours a day, which is unreasonable, I think. And so I think if I was going to eliminate one thing, I would love to go back to a landline. That's not going to happen. But finding ways to limit the time that I dedicate to answering phone calls, answering texts, answering emails, I think for me it really makes a big difference to kind of lump that into a certain part of the day and not make it every time the phone pings, you know. And that takes some self-discipline, but it really makes a big difference. The other thing that I sometimes get a little too involved in is some of the volunteer activities I do, which are really satisfying and give me a nice community to work in. But I find I have to be careful about not overextending myself and not committing to doing more than is really great for me. So those are those are my thoughts. Those are the kind of the top of my list. Terrific. Thank you. Penny, we're over to you. Oh, thanks. Actually, I have to go right along there with with camera because those are things, the technology and oh my gosh, I can save the world. Let me go do that. Those do distract from an awful lot of things that may be more important. And to me, I think one of the things that's one of the most terrifying words is might. I might wear that again. I might cook that again. I might read that again. And I've moved just enough over the years that I don't have a lot of attachment to things like that. I pretty cool at getting rid of those. But it's other things. I'm brought to mind a statement called the the virtue of the small. It comes from Winnie the Pooh, the dowel of piglet, meaning the virtue of the little. And I lived most of my life on a big stage. I mean, my career was big. I was, you know, doing lots of big stuff and big spotlights and high technology with the big stuff. And I think I've reached an age where bringing this down, you know, bringing it to a small, small stage with intimate audiences, good friends, just quiet times to be able to really put thought into what we do do. And technology is one of the things that distracts that I got rid of all my social media, except for my normal email and things like that years ago, because I couldn't get anything done that I wanted to get done because I was busy doing the half twos. And I guess if there's anything I could say, it would be think about just how important are those half twos versus the one twos? And you know, some of them, of course, they're important. But all of a sudden to go off on what Tamron said, you know, oh, I've got to go to this meeting and I've got to go to that meeting. And then you say, but why? Because I'm, all I'm doing is jumping from one thing to another without the time to enjoy where I am. I'm really more concerned about getting to the next thing than I am about backing up and enjoying where I am. So, you know, that, that's the kind of thing for me, the discipline I need right now is to eliminate a lot of this kind of adrenaline, you know, focused have to stuff and discipline it back and say, let's go back to the virtue of the small, you know, writing a story today, not publishing the great American novel, painting something quiet today, not going out for a huge exhibit. And maybe it's just age and accretion to that point. But for me, that's how I look at elimination and eliminating the redundancies and the distractions. Perfect. Thank you very much, Penny. Okay, Jamie, you're up. Okay, I always feel awkward that I'm on a very show that I have to tell about something that I need to do myself. So I'm right with Tamara on the volunteerism, because I like that sense of feeling of community and that I've done something to help in the bigger picture of things, especially concerning Maui of recent times. And I think I even talked about another show that we did the power of like learning only this year, my 61st year learning to say no. But I have found a more powerful phrase, which is I can't. So I can't is very different from no, or I won't. I won't would be the stronger choice, like I'd like to be able to say no, I just won't do that, you know, but I don't have that self control to actually. So now I look at my schedule. And without having to recite that schedule to somebody, I can safely say I can't. And I just leave it at that I can't I can't fit it in I can't fit another thing in. So I know it may seem like I am not cutting things out because of course I'm the one who writes five minutes before the zoom. Is she going to be there? Yes. But I am getting much better at narrowing it down to three things for the day, three events or three must do's or social engagements or something that's work involved or volunteer involved, as opposed to the five things that I used to do. So just that recognition of I'm not the person that can do it all anymore. I used to feel like I was the person. I did the mothering. I did the Kapuna care. I did the regular work and the volunteer work. And like I say, being in that sandwich generation where you're caring for older people and younger people, but missing out on caring for yourself. And my whole job has to do with self care. That's what I preach all the time. So now I'm trying to practice what I preach a little bit more, just by eliminating some of those things that as Penny said, like, are they really necessary? Like, do I have to feel that good about having contributed to that particular cause when I just contributed to this other cause last night? So yeah, just eliminating two things on the calendar every day. Not terrific. Thank you, Jamie. Now, as ladies were talking, of course, it took me back to my years of not only doing therapy, but teaching upcoming therapists. And whenever I was teaching upcoming therapists who are working on their master's other PhD and that I always told them, I said, look, we're in this business because we want to help people. And these three ladies that are with me today are terrific helpers. They've helped a lot of people, done a lot of wonderful work to make things better for other people. But as I would tell my counselors, I would say, look, you have to be able to help yourself as well. Because if you don't, what's going to happen is you're going to burn out. And then you're not going to be able to help those people that you are helping. And you won't be able to help people, you know, to any degree, like you have been helping them. So it's a really self-defeating type of thing. You have to take care of yourself before you can help others. If you can do that, then you can be in the game a long time. And I know a few people who have been in counseling for many, many years, and they practice that. But I also know a lot of people who no longer are in counseling or other helping professions because they've just burnt out. They just couldn't do that as much as they wanted to. And so all those are very important takeaways on that. Okay, let's go to the real positive side. If we're going to eliminate some things, that's going to freeze some time up. And we're going to be able to do some things that we've either always wanted to do or used to do, but haven't been able to do for a while. And so let's talk about those things that's upcoming on the future that we are looking forward to. Tamara, we're back to you. Okay. So I like to think back to the things that I love to do as a kid, because I think for many people they still love to do the things that they love to do as a kid. And I've also thought of the idea that even though we're all grown up, we should really have recess every day. And I think that's that time to do the stuff that you like to do when you were a kid, whether it was running around or playing with your friends or just goofing off. And I know for me, those things are things that I still do, like drawing and painting. I always love making pictures. So that's a real source of comfort and rejuvenation for me. But there's, you know, some others are just being out in nature, just stepping outside and taking a break from whatever I'm doing. And the music is another one, you know, listening to something that I enjoy listening to just takes me out of my own, you know, busy headspace. I think it's important that we somehow remember to do those things. And I don't know if that means setting a timer, you know, and taking a break every hour or whatever it is. But it's going to be different for every person too. And you don't have to feel like you need to do what somebody else is doing to relax or get in touch with yourself again. Or, you know, maybe it's just sitting quiet for five minutes. It'll be individual. That's terrific. I really appreciate that, Tamara. And I love the word recess. I'm going to steal that and use that because I can use recess a lot. I'm like, you know, like Jamie, who's still doing three things in a day or she's cut back from five to three. I've cut back. I can barely do one. So I want lots of recesses in the day. So I'm going to use that. So thank you very much. Penny, we're back to you. Well, I have to pick up again on what Tamara's saying. And I go back. I mean, as a kid, I wrote from the time I could write, told stories on the neighbors and everybody else and constantly in trouble for it. But and I still do that. That's my passion. But I have to agree that you just have to take the time to stop and do a few things. I've tried to program that in by a lot. I like to dance. I've danced and, you know, done those kinds of things. So I program those things in almost every day so that I do do them because if I don't, I don't feel as good. But time for me is what I would like more of but not years added on its time in the day. And that's something that we can control. And I remember as a young woman in the journalism business where the field I covered had things going on every day, every night. And I could be someplace every day, every night. And I realized that early. I had to be home three nights a week to be able to organize my mind to do what I did do well. And I still kind of feel the same way. And I'm having to learn to do it at this age, because it gets out of hand, you know, you have time you have. So you just wasted. And it isn't really wasted. But if you really want to, for me, if I really want to feel good about the things that I do do, I have to have the time to cogitate on them, to think about them and to sort of plan them. And I think for me, that's one of the biggest things is, is, is, you know, adding in is disciplined to push away some of the things that are getting in the way of what I love to do. That's, that's what I would say. Terrific. Well, thank you very much. Okay, Jamie, we're over to you. Okay, I just have to say, because we've been talking about recess, you said do do twice, huh? So I try to have a child's approach to things. And one of the things that I found recently is anything creative, anything creative that I used to do. And anything creative that I'm, I'm still pursuing doing. So when I do have that time that I've now set aside for myself, you know, recently, I've been in a theater production that was all about caregivers. And for me, actually, it was kind of like doing therapy. And realizing that I didn't even know there was such a thing as caregiver burnout, that there was a diagnosis called that. And hearing all of these true stories of people, what they've gone through. And I think, oh, I don't have it that bad. But that's also something that I used to think when I would think of what a challenge it was having my son, because I had him so late in life. And I would look at other people and think, oh, she's got triplets. And it's like, whatever causes you stress, that's enough. That's, it doesn't have to be in comparison to somebody else's stress of they've got way more on their plate or, or whatever. So my only takeaway now is that if I do something creative, and that can be something as easy as having tea, I'm not a coffee drinker, tea with a friend at a nice tea place, or it doesn't have to be something like I'm going to write the great American novel, or I'm going to perform in this stupendous epic production, just something that makes you feel good. And the creative side of things sort of come out of me by spending time with anybody that I really want to spend time with. So those people that I care about, and that are also positive, it's kind of tough when you're a caregiver, especially, of just being around the negativity of it all and having to be the person that brings the light into the room and is having the optimistic attitude and things. So I think it's really important to surround yourself by other people who have the same kind of vision of what they want to create in their life. So spending time with friends and being creative about it. That was great to me. And I appreciate all the input from you three ladies. Terrific words. Now we're going to go to a little more difficult side, which I mentioned earlier. I talked about the calendar with its full things jammed in there. Well, some people have gone through such a catastrophe, such a whirlwind, if you will, or in our case, a wildfire, that so much has been lost. And people are immersed in grieving, especially grieving lost things. So their calendars aren't full, like most of ours are, including the four of us plus the audience here. But their calendars are fairly empty and their possessions may be empty. And their support may be empty. So I've asked our three ladies to give some suggestions, maybe, or to reach out to these people, like our friends in Maui who've lost so much in the Maui wildfires. And tell them a little bit about what, if they're thinking about, okay, what do I do next? Or how do I replace this? Or what should I do instead? All these questions that come up with them. I've asked my panel here, my guest, to respond to that. So Tamara, can we go back to you on that first? Sure. So I'm not really sure that those, that people who lost stuff in the fire have an empty calendar. I think they're overwhelmed with the stuff that they have to get done. Or that's the case for many of them. And I think when I'm in a situation like that, what helps is realizing not that I have to take care of every single big issue all at once, but that I can do a little teeny tiny step today. And if I get that done, all the better gets me that much closer to where I want to be. I think it's really hard to not feel overwhelmed when there's so many fronts that need to be addressed. But if you can take it a little chunk at a time, you can have somebody near you who you love who can help you do it, that's even better. I know that a lot of community support has been really important for the people on Maui. And sometimes if you're hurting, it helps to help somebody else. That's kind of all I have to offer. It's really hard to even imagine being in those shoes. But all of us have different kinds of disasters that we deal with. And you just have to, you have to do what you can do and not worry about what you can't do. Absolutely. Thank you very much. Penny, over to you. That's good advice for one, you know, taking it in bite-sized chunks. I think the other thing, and this is really, really hard. I mean, none of us, probably, or maybe some of you, I have never had the kind of tragedy that these people have lived through. I've had a lot of ups and downs that are important to me and might be terrifying to me, but nothing like what they've gone through. But kind of my mantra has always been, what's bleeding the worst? You know, what needs to get taken care of first? And it kind of goes back to the old, you know, what is it, Masluffy and hierarchy of needs. But if we need to feed ourselves, that's the thing we need to look at first. If we need a roof over our heads, we better figure that out first before we start trying to do a lot of other things. And, you know, it's preaching. And if I were in that situation, I don't know that I could get my head around it clear enough to be able to think about that. But that would be the first thing that I would say is you've got children sitting there, get them fed, get them housed or warm, whatever. And it requires everyone to have to stop and think about this a little bit. And sometimes that's hard to do, but I can't even imagine just how chaotic it is in the mind and the hearts of these people. Well, thank you very much, Jamie. Well, one of the things about the Maui Wildflowers that I've continually been amazed about is it's about Hawaii itself is like how resilient that community is, how it's been community. I mean, yes, the Red Cross is there, yes, FEMA was there. But, you know, even the things that we hear on the news, I know for a fact, having been on the ground, they're not true. There are people who are displaced and have no place to go. But there are also people that they can reach out to and share some of that burden with. And I think it's really interesting that we're in this season of gratitude right now. So I was reading something the other day about how grief and gratitude can exist in the same plane. Like, I know so many of those people in Maui are just thankful that they got out alive. But they're still grieving for those other things that they lost. And many of them are grieving for people that they lost. So having that, I, we're not super religious here, but every night when Kaimana goes to bed, this is my nine-year-old, I ask him, what are you thankful for today? And being a nine-year-old, it's usually the most recent thing that's just happened to him. But I make him review and go back and say, okay, what was something good that happened this morning? Did you help anybody this afternoon? So that, and it does something, it does something to your psyche by opening up first with that positive of like, I'm thankful that I do have a roof over my head today. And then, you know, all that grief can flush in there at the same time. And believe me, I know those people in Maui are processing it day in, day out. It's not over for them. That fire occurs for them day after day after day. But just knowing that there are people out there, probably people who are watching this television show because I'm sure the people in Maui who are on the ground suffering from the fires, they don't have any time to be on something like this watching right now. But those of us who do have the time, if you reach out to those people, and I know it was very beneficial, for instance, that a lot of the families just put up their own GoFundMe pages and people could just directly donate know that that's this is the family that this is going to, as opposed to it being caught up in red tape through all the community organizations who again are trying to help but just the bureaucracy of it all is not being that effective. So yeah, be thankful for whatever those little things are and allow yourself that time to grieve as much as you need to but know that there are lots of us out here supporting in any way we can. Like I'm sure I know that there are friends of mine on Maui right now who are just saying come here for Thanksgiving. I don't care who you are or what you need or whatever but we're going to make it work. Thank you, Jamie. And thank you to all three of you. I really appreciate that. I would just add to something to what Penny said about preaching. When you're a caregiver oftentimes whether inadvertently or however it comes across is preaching and like there are easy answers to difficult questions whether aren't and I think the best thing that all of us can do for people who have suffered whether small or large is for us to listen to be there and to listen and understand rather than to preach or give them easy answers but be there for them and I think that that's what we all try to do and I hope that that message comes across as well. We're running out of time and I can only say thank you very much to Tamara and Penny and Jamie for once again being with me and tackling some big questions and if we can answer these big questions or at least go in the right direction to these big questions it's going to make our life a lot easier and in the end run a lot happier for focusing on what is important and how to get there. So thank you all and thanks to think take away for supporting us all the people at think take away Jay and Michael and Carol and Haley of course and thank you at the audience for being with us today and you know sharing in these thoughts and listening to us much appreciated and hope to see you in two weeks and we'll have a show on the joy of Alaska. Aloha.