 All right, so then we've got the total tax. So we're finally down to the total tax and that's gonna be compared to or subtracted from the tax payments and refundable credits. So if we get down to the actual tax, then we're gonna compare that to what we paid in usually with the W-2 withholdings, but also we might have payments that we've made in if we have a sole proprietorship or something like that needing to make estimated payments. And then we have the refundable credits. Notice they had to be separate on the tax return so that the refundable credits can be those that will extend beyond taking you below zero resulting in a refund even if your tax liability because below zero whereas these credits will not. So that makes the second half or the second page of the 1040 confusing. And that finally gets us to the tax refund or the tax due, which of course is the bottom line most people hoping for a refund if they have paid more than the tax liability but you might end up with a tax due which could result in penalties and interest. Remember the whole rationale of getting a refund isn't for the joy of getting a refund and going out to dinner or something on April 15th or whatever, the benefit, the reason we do it is to avoid getting hit with a stick from the IRS of penalties and interest. Everything we do, all the planning that we make always in our mind is I want to be in compliance with the law but pay as little tax as possible. That's always the question in mind. How do I do that? I shoot for a refund because if I get a refund although I'm losing some time value of money because I could have got the money sooner and either spent it or invested it earning a return on it I'm willing to do that to avoid underpaying in which case I get hit with a stick of penalties and interest, that's the point.