 Welcome back. So a thing that has never happened on the nest is that I have two dads present dads and dads who are doing what they are supposed to do and one of them told me Hey, why are they acting like when we do what we're supposed to do? We need to be awarded You need to be thanked though Because you're setting a very good example, especially in our community and our you know, this is our particular generation and Again Thank you. Thank you. It's a conversation that I was having. Yes, and I was being asked whether we have a father with crisis And I was staying away from mentioning that we have a father with crisis and my reason was yes I think it's not that we are we have so many absent father is just that we are not celebrating Present fathers enough and today is our turn. Wow I cannot wait to hear more about that. Yes, and it's not your first time on our show today But for those who have not seen you before, could you please introduce yourself and tell us a bit of what you do? Yeah, thank you Maureen. My name is Jeff Dindy. I'm a father of two boys two lovely boys And my life revolves around fatherhood. We have Men's and fatherhood website where we write articles from experts Advising and telling men, you know, this is this is how to be present father So I'm the founder and we've been doing amazing job with Hillary as well I think he mentioned where we just have conversations that that that men have been fearing to have Yes, you know and discussing those topics I'm also I'm also a man's coach that is and I'm currently creating a fatherhood course Which will be available soon Well done. Hey, you didn't tell me all that last time Not really finalized on the details of the especially the fatherhood course. Yes, so it is up and it's coming Brilliant and we're going to be here at your disposal and I even personally because I feel you are right Indeed, there's a fatherhood crisis Yes, or as you say present fathers are not being celebrated enough But I feel like who's going to celebrate them, you know today today Exactly and I feel like the same way women have conversations and you know women There's a lot of things we are doing we have women in business We have to amaze we have even Mother's Day is more vibrant around the world And I mean both girls and boys celebrate their mothers, but think about it every father's day is a quiet down day Think about it. And here I am in your presence You too wonderful dads talking about a program of fatherhood I think that is something that Really needs a reward we'll find one you're right you're right because actually that is what inspired me to start To start a fatherhood because yes when I wanted I when I was beginning my my YouTube channel Yes, and I was thinking what topic should I bring? You know, I was researching You don't see that the likes of you. Yes, there are so many women On YouTube, but men were very few they don't show up the second thing the men that were there They were all comedians and it seemed like comedy was really silly Yes, so I was like what area do I really want to venture? Yes, what mark do I really want to leave? Yes And that's what encouraged me to actually start the YouTube channel around father. Yes, actually when I was telling people present I like what what is that? Yeah, we literally walk. Yeah, but They said let's see where it gets. Yes, then I started and then they saw me continue Right, and they're like this guy is actually serious about this thing right now. They're like you are a voice And you're going to be a huge voice and as long as we exist. We're going to amplify that Amazing. Thank you. Thank you and carry who's Anna once again for joining us on the list It's a very special day for us by the way. We've never had You know, we've had one dad. I met I met Hillary and we've been friends ever since Yes, and it was because of our passion that we shared around father and when I Met me on Facebook and we talked and we have actually found that we had mutual friends And when we met and talked and I shared my vision around father. He was like, I'm so totally sold out You must work together and see that every person hears about this. Yes Yes, it's it's even funny the first time we met just remember when It was called brother. Yes, building by that building by that. Yes a client of our kids in Around 2010 you're still not even a father. So we met through it was it was I was supposed to be guiding him on Something in terms of I'm passionate about fitness fitness. So supposed to be guiding him on that. Yes. So years years years later Is when I saw what he was doing with present father and I had been so passionate about father So I had moved to the u.s. For a while. Yes. So I saw what he was doing. I was like, hey, dude, you're doing something good I think I'll be coming back and maybe we'll be doing a few things Because they discovered for the time I was away. Yes, my family was still here. Oh, yes and It created kind of a void between now, let's say, especially me and my son just not being around, you know and Um When I was around because most of the time I used to work at the intercom. I used to be the manager at the gym So I used to have a lot of free time. So we used to spend a lot of time together I would go out swimming and just spend a lot of time around with him. Yes So when I left it really affected him So at first when we used to have conversations we'd call and you know, but after a while It's never the same again. So after some time I would call and Every time I would ask him, how was your day? He'll just go he'll just give me straight answers and he will not tell me how his day was And then slowly just he just became a quiet kid For this I was away for six months Then I just decided I can't I want to stay here, but no this won't work for me I know I'm making money more money here. There are more opportunities here But for me now I think fatherhood is about being there for this kid because you know, there's that time there's that period for kids, you know That emotional balance most of the time is between you see between the age of two and six If you're not present between between the especially for a boy that emotional side will never will never grow And they become Kind of detached and you will never get it back So I I used to read a lot of I used to get information from books and all that. So when I read that I was like, you know, I have to go back No, are you coming back? But you don't know what you're going to do. Yes. You're like, I'll just find out So I sacrifice on the side And most people are like, especially my friends back in the states are like, dude You're there opportunities there man. I'll like now for me Fatherhood is bigger than those opportunities I'll find my way. And I did I came back. I did was one thing once you're a father once you're a parent And you decide I want to be a present father. Yes God also listens when it's going to open ways for you because you've decided to do something. Yes that he He wanted you to do that And you've decided you want to do that, right? And he must provide look at that. So I came back He started with Jeff. Yes, and I could see the passion in him and I told him do it. Let's just do something bigger That's how now the present fatherhood and everything was born. Right. We want to go far. Yes, but we'll We'll sit down. We'll find people who support us just like you said women start something And they're always supported men start something. It's so hard for even other people Especially when it comes to emotional issues They scatter Because men don't want to talk about things that become emotive because they feel that he is Will emasculate them kind of because they feel yes, like this you said it's it's kind of a weakness Like if I cook for my kids, you know That's a woman's But you see that comes mostly from Upbringing again because if you don't build that emotional awareness around your kids There's something that you don't build in them. So at the end of the day, they are not Emotionally strong. So they're so scared of what other people will say. They see me changing diapers if they see me Walking my kids maybe to maybe to the clinic. I used to take my kids to clinic Sometimes because my mom my wife was working. Yes. So after her maternity leave was so long So now during those days because I used to have a lot of free time I'll just take the kid to clinic. Look at that. I remember some even some of my colleagues go like, dude That's a cheek thing. Why are you doing that? I'm like, it's it's not even you know, it never used to even piss me off Because I was like, you know, this person There's some weakness. There's something in he doesn't even know sound event and you just go like Good for me. It's my kids. So, you know, and that's something that as fathers We're going to build By being there in our kids life once that is built up our kids will become present fathers because of who want this So absolutely kids learn from what they see Especially the experiences that they go through. Yes For us our dad used to cook for us Because most of the time our mom used to travel to shag So most of the time it was the one who was around and used to so for me It wasn't so hard Yeah, wow, that's brilliant, right? Um, yeah, because I see a lot of privilege in your case But also a choice and that's something I know Jeff did Because I've heard his story he's upbringing was so different No father You're thrown into fatherhood. You don't know where to start but you decided, you know what? I'm today going to be a father and I'm going to be a good one and a present one in that case So Jeff, could you walk us through your definition of fatherhood crisis, especially in Kenya? My oh, yeah I think my definition of fatherhood crisis is Is not that is is not that People don't know really how to father Because I think fatherhood is very much pretty much instinctive. It's instinctive You are born knowing what you're supposed to do You're born knowing how you are supposed to be a father, but now you are surrounding and your society is what now dictates how you behave and silence Silences that that that instinctive voice that you have, okay? So this this this entails friends that you surround yourself with which is very critical in forming the kind of father that you become You know, you know already what you're supposed to do. You know that there is nothing wrong with cleaning There's nothing wrong with helping my wife to To change diapers But because the friends that you have and the conversations that they have is all about Those are the things that now start silencing that voice and you start listening to it Now you come home and your wife tells you can you can honey? Can you help me change the diapers and That voice keeps on ringing because what you surround yourself with is what you become and then that is what now Leads to fatherhood crisis Not that people don't know what they're supposed to do But because of what they surround themselves with The content that they consume and then now it leads to people who just neglect father And then we hand up with our fatherhood crisis and now we need to start talking about it And get is something that's not supposed to be there in the first place So that is my definition around fatherhood crisis What about you hillary? What do you think is happening to especially this generation? And i'm talking of generation the generation of men below 14 years of age because i've experienced it and There's a real crisis. I'm telling you. I do not know whether it's the upgrade. You see, this is what I was saying It's not an excuse. You were brought up the way you were brought up, but you had a choice Zero guidance By he knew at a very young age. I remember he told me at age 12. I knew the kind of father I want to be What's going on? Um for me, I'd also say just like what Jeff has said it's what we consume, you know Social media has become a very big thing out there and um there are those things that people tend to I I don't know. I'm trying to find a word or no, there are those things that people think are cool And they've found a way of being pushed through social media and people go like yeah No, and that has led to a lot of people just doing whatever they see on social You know what is happening on social media and reality is totally different Especially not, you know, you know, we're in a third world country Abroad might that's what they show us. Yes And you'd leave the broad and you know and actually parenting especially for the good It's very normal to see a dad with a baby strapped on him Very proudly and the wife has gone to work and again I know it's the same situation with him you've been having rule exchange with your wife But then you're right. There's this aspect. Okay. I I don't know whether I'm still in the line But I'd like to call them like Social media dads. Yes, he will make sure the child is in a certain outfit just for the picture It's like a puppy. Yep Children are like puppies. They look good on camera But then in reality this person is not fathering this child They do nothing. Yeah So we're doing a lot to just try to find that validation But in reality, we're not doing what you're supposed to be doing and there's so many fathers out there And we're not supposed to be doing that We're supposed to be real because you know at the end of the day if you're not real out there We're still damaging these kids. You're still damaging regardless of whether it's a boy or a girl Um Society is broken. I started by saying that society is broken right now. It's both men and women But I'll tell you the biggest role is for the father to step up once the father steps up One thing I always realize in my house. It used to happen even in our house Um, I would see my daughter. My daughter is very cheeky. She do she does stuff and The mom would shout all the time What are you doing? But when I'm present the moment Taraji does something cheeky. I just give her a look That's it. That's the end of it. I don't even need to talk So that's that's where now the masculinity part comes in and it really helps our women Because anytime I'm around. Yes, she knows she's not going to shout your authority without a crown on your head Or a high seat. Yeah, but as a man as a man this authority this authority and kids know these things Because it's it's instinct. It's instinctive. Yes. It's macho. Yes. Once you just say you don't even need to shout The moment you just give them that look That's it. Yeah Just to add something father would is responsibility and Responsibility People have skewed definition of responsibility when it comes to father because They think that once I house these people once You know, I provide they have food and and and we have a nice car Then now I'm a man. Yes, and and and I'm now I'm now responsible You know, but true responsibility is something that is innate. It's something that you first of all have to own Okay And and and responsibility is in Is in the values that you have right that you want to dictate your family to have You know, uh, how you carry yourself around the house. How you love your woman. Yes Very important. You get how you love and not just love how you love her. Yeah, truthfully. Yes You know without you know, sometimes I've seen these things around my my cycle And uh people who are able financially and they're providing very well And they they are driving nice cars and they have this woman that Quote and quote they love but outside that they are very promising. I agree And they're like once I do the things that a man is supposed to do then nobody's supposed to ask me anything Including that woman. That is not responsibility. Yes, and I think on the same note You can uh sat because uh again fatherhood doesn't mean the perfect family setup. Yes Regardless of who they are. I think Besides love there should be respect. Yes Even if you're not with the mother of your children Because you need to show your children the kind of a man who are boy girl They need to see So it takes it takes a mature mind. Yes, which now still It treats but back to responsibility. Yes to be able to even respect your woman. Yes, whether you are with them Because again, it's not about you. Yeah But funny enough sometimes men feel that it is always about this You know It if it's not about you then it should be about the kids, you know and And there's another thing that I've seen and I've had go around and people mention a lot that you can be A good father, but a bad husband, which is wrong. Whoa, it's wrong. Okay. First of all, you need to be a good husband Okay, for you to be a good father Finally someone you know It's true. You need to be a good husband. Yes, because what is fatherhood? Part of being fatherhood is being a husband. It's true. It's from a it's from being a husband But we have a father Okay, so if you're not treating this woman right because how is this kid supposed to learn how to be a father and how to be a mom? Is how you treat that woman? How and by treating I mean how you love how you you help her out of the house That that is when the kid will be able to learn I I agree and and I could pick a lot of examples also from Hillary's story where he says Ah, my dad used to cook for us whenever my mom would go to shards And it didn't the dad didn't need to tell them. I love you guys so much I can't even tell you He was like my kids need to eat I know I'm my macho man and I can tell Um, if anything if your dad looks anything like you I think he's all alpha All alpha or if you look anything like your dad because you can tell also there's a matter of again Correct me if I'm wrong because I'm not a man, but I feel men who tend to behave Contrary to what they're supposed to do either towards their partners towards their children They have a very fragile ego. Yep. I've also met Men who have made it in life. They have everything now. We all wish to have their humble table career They've settled their homes. They have a wonderful retirement plan. They have all these but then Every day they go home. They have dad They're dad. We've seen even the most powerful man in the world Barack Obama You can tell his dad and I I have just done my own personal study and I realized that this man who tend to think that by treating um A woman or a weaker person than they are I think it's just An aspect of who they are and it all comes down to immaturity emotional. No, it's emotional Weakness exactly. It's emotional weakness by they never really realize its emotional weakness. Yes Because for them masculinity is more about How you sound? Yeah, but it's not about being you know, you can be very soft. Yes, but you still Yep, you can be very far many very soft at the same time. Yes. So most people who have an ego They don't realize that they they have what them They have an emotionally but in balance. Yeah, that didn't Maybe there was something that happened in between their childhood that contributes a lot to that So sometimes they can't even know that that is what is affecting them But anytime you'll find a man who has an ego. It's an emotional thing I agree and you they tend to have the same patterns from misquity They become dead beaters. Yes, they try to find validation of my brain Another thing another thing that also they really like a lot is Not being a counter. They don't want to be a counter between anyone Anyone and especially their spouse and in one area that in one particular area, which is finances They never really want to be accountable Especially on finances. No, what I do with my money is my business As long as food is in the house the house is okay The car the kids are going to school. Don't ask me anything. My business is my business So what I what they earn their investments. They never want to be accountable And especially their spouse exactly That is a true characteristics of somebody who is not responsible as a father Yeah, and I can tell you please Jeff. They're getting worse. There are men who actually don't even want to bother They want the women to take care of them and they want to be the liar in the house They wouldn't do even the simplest tasks. You know, there's a way A man can Like we say, it's a it's a balance to partners. There's a reason why it's a partnership A relationship a marriage an institute Two people who have to balance each other and I think also with this new generation. There's that aspect of extreme laziness And it's a pattern look around and I've seen it also even in developed countries like the u.s Somebody has a string of baby mama It's normal. Yeah, unfortunately I have to work like 10 jobs You know, because I have to feed all these kids He and Kenny's unfortunate, right? He and Kenny's unfortunate. They get away with a lot of it But we can see the gulf and I wish we can continue with this conversation But the show How's to end? Uh, what I would like to ask is um Uh, Jeff, maybe if you have final words for dads out there for Even a word of hope for moms who are raising their kids on their own What would you tell them? If you're a father out there Finding themself in the situation where they they are going to be fathers and they don't know what to do know that We are here People who have been there who are Who are ready to work with you in that journey and support you and help you understand that, you know what? Fatherhood is an amazing thing that you just need to accept and embrace And if you're a single mom out there raising a kid alone First of all accept that you cannot do what a father can do We start by accepting that part And then now going out there to probably be intentional in terms of seeking information Absolutely on how to be Yeah, or even getting a trusted father figure into the kid's legs. Yeah. Yeah, are hillary's the same question For me, I'll say uh being a father is spiritual Okay, it's a huge responsibility And uh once you give him responsibility, there'll be provision around it. Yeah, so it depends on how you look at it Fatherhood is not as difficult as it sounds because being a father is a big word It it it is fun. Yeah, what matters is How intentional are you about it? Anything in this life is about how intentional are you about it? If you're intentional about it, you'll always find ways and means And it will work for you. Yes. Yes For those single mothers out there. Yes, just like jeff said, yes, you cannot do it on your own Yes, there's that stage that your kids will need that Figure that father figure around so you have your Brothers your sisters your uncles There are those people who can always Feel in that shoe because sometimes it's unfortunate the fathers will not be there But the figures will be there. That's what we're talking about a father figure. Yes So about the biological just like you said It's about a figure that is ready to step up and make sure I'm taking responsibility for this life And you know this life totally depends on you if you decide they're going to lose it If you decide they're going to have life in abundance, it depends on you and the path that you put them through Wow, thank you so much for joining me. I want to have you guys again because this Conversation is so important and again with present fatherhood and the master classes that will be coming up Please whatever you need from us. We're ready To help and support you. I think it's a wonderful and worthy and a very necessary course And I'm sure this is just the beginning of it all. So please let us know Great. I cannot emphasize more than this wonderful gentlemen who happen to be dads of to each Have beyond this But one thing I've taken home with me is that for you to be a parent and I mean a father You have to be intentional and I wish there was a change of attitude whereby, you know, the way mothers just decide You know what I'm going to raise my kids If only there was the same effort With the dads, can you imagine what a world would be living in the law doesn't have to force you to be a father Circumstances don't need to force you to be a father. Just love that child And you will have left a wonderful mark in the world This has been the nest. I'm more than 82. Thank you very much Tomoka coffee Africa. Thank you my wonderful crew Thank you fashion clinic for dressing me and Do not miss the next show same time. Same place. Meanwhile. Have a good night