 Psychopaths, sort of our favorite subjects. Hopefully you like them too, because we're gonna talk about one today. And we're gonna break down his body language and the things he says and what his behavior tells us and shows us. And you're gonna have a better understanding of the way they think and the way they behave. Greg, tell us about the video we're gonna watch. I don't know how this guy thinks, but certainly his behavior is going to be interesting. Robert Andrew Brodella was an American serial killer who kidnapped, tortured and murdered at least six young men after having forced them to endure periods of up to six weeks of captivity. We'll leave the rest of the details there. He pleaded guilty and was sentenced to life imprisonment without parole for one first degree murder. And later in prison, he would plead guilty to another first and four charges of second degree murder. That of a heart attack, three years after this interview. This interview is with a local Kansas City show. And he was known as the Kansas City Butcher. Mr. Brodella, you're sitting here as a man who is gonna spend the rest of his life in prison. We'll confess to murder of six young men in this city crimes that horrified the city and much of the country. You've confessed to, in various degrees, felonious restraint, drugging people, sexually abusing them, torturing them, killing them, dismembering them. And until now you've refused all interviews. So in light of all those facts, I have to ask you, why are you here? What is it you have to say to us? What is it you want to say about yourself in this case? Well, I've had the media clamoring to get interviews with me. And after I made my last pleas, I wanted to get at least part of my side of it out. I've found it very hard to find any way to do that in Kansas City. The media has so biased my case. Portraying me as being non-human and their motivation is no separate from what the way I treated my victims. I treated them as something less than human. It's nothing more than a play toy or an odd play object. This is what the media has done to me. It's dehumanized me so that it can believe, along with the public, that things like human sacrifice, set Satanism, demonic practices are more believable than me being a neighbor next door, reach a point in his life where he could do monstrous acts. That's not the same thing as being a monster. Your prosecutors, and I do want to quote this, when you came to plead, called your crimes wantonly vile, horrible, or inhuman. When was this done? I believe in documents associated with the Sheldon charges to repeat that quote from the prosecution. These crimes were wantonly vile, horrible, or inhuman. Okay. I think if you'll check with just about any attorney, you'll find that that is the standard clause that she used when they went to build a case for capital one with the death penalty. All right, Mark, what do you got? All right, so this is fascinating. There's a little bit of self-soothing just on the edge of the paper there, right at the start. Little bit of adaption there, repetitious, but not a lot. And when this kind of ream of crimes, horrific crimes is told to him, really nothing happens. There's no reaction to it at all. Then we get these words, why are you here? What do you want to say about yourself? And then we get a little bit of adaption in the chair, just that little bit of movement. So, zero happening on any of these crimes, no reaction whatsoever. But when you talk about him and what have you come to say, now there's a little bit of movement, little bit of excitement. So we know what he's there for. He's there for himself. There's a complete reversal happens here. He becomes the victim. He's a victim of the media. And the media he's portraying now as psychopathic, sensationalist motivations. And he's got disdain for that. He turns up one side of his mouth. So he's put himself in the position of the victim. He's put the media in the position of the psychopath, sensationalist. He says, I'm just a next door neighbor who reached a point he could do monstrous acts. So he's not saying he's a monster. He's not a monster at all. He's just your next door neighbor that got into a situation, reached a point whereby he could do monstrous acts. Not a monster, but did monstrous acts. So he's saying he won't be defined by his actions. The media characterizes people by their actions. You know, character is action. He's saying, no, my character is gonna be whatever PR I'm now gonna try and get away with at the moment. Reality for him is exactly what he's gonna try and get away with. And so he's gonna challenge our absolute perceptions about him. If we're gonna be absolute and go, okay, so you're a monster, you're a psychopath, he's there to challenge that today. And so what I'd like to do in return for that because it's quite a postmodern attitude. I think he's gonna have with us this little early, his early days of postmodernism at this date here, but he's out of the gate right away. He's gonna challenge our perception. So from now on, I'm gonna look at these videos and give you a little bit of a clue who how you can untangle yourself from a postmodernist and postmodern rhetoric that's really gonna come out of this guy's mouth today. Should be fascinating. I'm gonna love this. Chase, what have you gotten this one? Today's video is sponsored by Aura. I'm excited for this because I've been using this app for over two years. If you didn't know how much private information is out there on the internet about you, when you first see it, it's pretty shocking and maybe a little disturbing. These people that collect all these private things about you are called data brokers, but there's a secret here. They have to take down your information if you ask them to, so they make it incredibly hard to do. So what we do is let Aura handle that for us and you can do the same. You can let Aura do all the work tracking down and removing all the stuff that you don't want online. And you can try Aura for two weeks for free using the link right at the top of the description down there. And Aura does a ton more than just getting your information off the internet. They protect you from threats that you and even your kids can't see coming. And it's super easy to set up. You don't have to go download a million different apps to get all the benefits that Aura has like parental controls, antivirus, VPN, software, password management. They even have identity theft insurance, everything. One of my friends was over here sitting in this office just a week ago and I typed his name in and within just a few minutes we found everything. Even his anonymous accounts were on the dark web and the passwords associated with those. He downloaded Aura that night. So you should look into this. Your private information should be private. You can go to aura.com slash TBP, just like the behavior panel, TBP, right now to start a free two week trial that I've also linked down in the description. Yeah, I definitely agree with you. And I think that's probably been influenced by some of the books he's been reading in prison there and Scott can talk about how accurate that some of those statements can be when you look at a person and listen to them. But when he's saying the media is clamoring to get interviews with me that the closed eye talking is brief, but it's there. And this typically indicates some superiority or some false humility. I think he genuinely feels contempt for the media. They're judging me based on past actions and that shouldn't happen, but I'm judging the media based on their actions and that's the judgment that you should believe is what he's saying. So his head suddenly tilting downward is always a bad sign if you're seeing this, it's one of the pre-violence indicators that we teach to police officers. And in this case, it's about the prediction of potential attack. He's covering his neck, he's covering the carotid arteries. That's when we look out of the top of our eyes during times like that. And I think Bridella's language reveals a focus on himself and how it perceives this treatment by other people, especially the media and his concern over being portrayed as non-human. I think suggests a very strong egocentric perspective where his own view is paramount to other people's perceptions. But his lack of remorse or acknowledgement of the victim's suffering and stuff points to some pretty psychopathic traits. Then he does rationalizing and minimizing. He attempts to rationalize all this because there's a disconnect between someone who can commit these acts and being a monster. If you listen close enough, you're gonna hear somebody's mental rationalization methodology leak out in their language any time that you have a conversation like this. But it's discussed with the media as clear on his face. And if I was that reporter, I would dig into that, not for any kind of like confession or anything, just to make it an interesting interview to get some more, I'd probably try to piss him off. That's what I'd try to do. Scott, well, what do you got? Yeah, and that'd be easy because he's ready to go the whole day. It's a predator man. That's a little animal sitting there. And he's already, you're right. He's always got that head down. The whole thing, we're seeing that predatory behavior happen already because this guy's pushing against his ego. It's classic, man. This is awesome. Now, I'm the guy that always says, you can't spot a psychopath because you have to, it takes up to six months to a year, sometimes to diagnose one properly through being an FMRI studies or whatever it's gonna be. But I would put everything I have on this guy being a psychopath. It didn't take, when Greg sent me this video and said, what do you think about this? I was like, yeah, we gotta do this guy. This is awesome. This is unbelievable. So I think we're seeing the perfect textbook case of a clinical psychopath. Now, to clear a couple of things up, all psychopaths are narcissists, but not all narcissists are psychopaths. So what we're seeing here is this through the roof ego happening as it is with the clinical narcissist and the psychopath. So this guy, so everything is as it should be. Just so you all know, they make fun of me when I say everything is as it should be, because I'm saying when something looks normal for that, for example, this guy for a psychopath, everything is as it should be. I've stopped saying that now. Y'all have shot me down on that. So I'm not gonna do it anymore. But anyway, so let's go over like a couple of little things that we're gonna see for sure and a psychopath or the behaviors that we associate with someone who's been diagnosed with it as a psychopath. When he says, I've had media clamoring. Well, that's the first thing out of his mouth, really. So that's his ego saying, man, I've got so much going on. These guys are into me for, you know, because I'm a great guy, I'm special, I'm different. And, you know, that's what's happened. I'm famous now. This is what I've done. It's made me famous. And then he turns it around and he makes himself the victim. He says, when he starts talking about how he used these people, well, we'll get to that in a few minutes, so he makes himself the victim that the media has turned him into the victim. And then we see the classic contempt facial expression. Now, there are more than one expressions that are asymmetric, but one of the only universal facial expression is contempt. And that's when you see that lip go up like that. This guy's happens so slow and so clean and so clear, even the cameraman zooms in on him as he's going, you can see that thing raise up and it's just like, you gotta be kidding me. So this is perfect. The camera guy maybe knew what it was, you know, maybe he didn't, but having seen it enough to say, wow, let me get some of this, that's a pretty big deal. That's a lot of contempt going on there and contempt is peppered throughout this whole interview, which I thought was fascinating because it's one of the only feelings that he feels of emotion is anger and contempt. So I think that's a classic example. If you want to show somebody what contempt looks like, use that as an example. And then when he says, this happens when he says their motivation, look right after when he says their motivation, it zooms in, there it is. I don't think you can find a better example of that anywhere. Then he goes on to describe how horrific these crimes are. Then as he's talking about that, he talks about how he saw him as toys and he saw him as play things and he saw those things that didn't mean anything because he was just playing with them. That's the way psychopaths see people. They look at them like bugs or a video game. They mean nothing to them. No more than you want a can or a pen or anything else. They don't see anything, any kind of attachment to that thing emotionally, to a human emotionally. And that's why I say that thing. But this is a psychopath describing the way psychopaths see the world and the way they see other people and their victims. I think this is awesome as far as getting into the mind to one of those and seeing how it thinks and seeing how it approaches the world. So Greg, what do you got? Yeah, when little kids color outside the lines, there's two reasons they could do that. One, well, three. One, they don't have the dexterity to do it. Two, they're being creative. Or three, they don't even understand the lines have any value. Ding, ding, ding. As we watch this guy, this guy has no idea that normal human beings have compassion for other human beings or that. Because the only thing that matters to your point, you've said it over and over and over and you showed contempt or showed all this is him. And if you don't believe that the very first part, watch him as he's waiting to get his turn and then he bolts in and his head does that wobble. We can say the wobble is uncertainty. I think it's contained emotion. And I think the only emotions this guy has like you said are negative ones, anger, frustration. I think that as you pay attention and we talk all the time about people not understanding or not connecting, this is the guy. When he says things, watch him with that jaw work and the intake breath, as he says something about his side. These are something we classically don't see in most men he does kind of a head whip around as he makes a point, all that contempt, that disgust, all those things rising every time he brings something up. When he gets down to this human sacrifice and sex Satanism piece, watch his taffy pulling with his eyes to look and see if you're paying attention as he moves his head and then closes his eyes and blocks. I think it's a control thing. I think if you were dealing with this guy, you're both dancing all over this one. I think if you poked him very hard, you'd get a really hard reaction. But I think he's probably a powerless person who doesn't kind of show a power until he runs up against somebody who pushes back. This guy's not going to be the guy. Guy may push his buttons a little and Chase, we all know that if you're in an interrogation room and you really want to get a guy to come apart and lose his composure, that's the only time you do it really because it's not how you get people into a position of trust, but it does work to have a person lose control. Once you lose control, then you can start pushing their buttons. There's actually a couple of other things. He's indignant at that monstrous act. See his chin rise and his purse lips and that narrow mouth. Look, this guy's turned in his human card to me. I think about, when I think about psychopaths, like this guy, you guys ever see the thing where these kind of guerrillas, the guerrilla fighters are sitting around and there's a chimp with an AK-47. You ever see that video? It's funny to tell, but oh, it's great. It's funny. You should show it. They hand this chimp, this AK, and they have no idea he's gonna do anything when he starts firing it. It's all set up. It's not real. But it looks really good because he's firing up people around. And this is a great example of why we always talk about what you feed is what you become. If you have no understanding of where the lines are and you have no understanding of compassion for another human being and you feed that side of it, it's gonna go there. And just because an ape has fingers and thumbs and looks like they would do the same thing we do, doesn't mean they think the same way. And that's what we're looking at here. This guy is fed the wrong side. And then he thinks it's okay to say, look, it's not my fault. Yeah, I did do some bad things. And yeah, but I'm not a monster. Well, the definition of a monster is somebody who does monstrous things. If you go look it up, we had this with another guy. I think it was Sheldon, one of these guys we talked about. When he gets to this prosecutors and they're inhuman claims, just watch the smugness and Chase, you talk about closed eye talking. He does that. We're talking about the criminal justice system. But then when he's asked, did you do it? Well, I can't disagree. He doesn't say no. He doesn't say yes. He's always going to avoid and always going to hedge. Look, this is gonna be a fun one only because this is one of the creepiest people we've ever covered in all of these videos, in my opinion. You guys may have one that can top him, but in my opinion, one of our tops. I think this is the best one we've seen so far of a psychopath. I think this is classic. I can't believe we haven't done this guy before. Yeah. Well, I just happened to stumble into him the other day and I don't even know why I didn't have him on my list. I just was clicking through and looking up serial killers and what's good for this week and here he shows up. Yeah, that's a good one. Oh man, that's a tie right there. You and Mark, Chase, that's good though. Mr. Bridella, you're sitting here as a man who's gonna spend the rest of his life in prison. We'll confess to murder of six young men in this city and crimes that horrified the city and much of the country. You've confessed to in various degrees, felonious restraint, drugging people, sexually abusing them, torturing them, killing them, dismembering them. And until now, you've refused all interviews. So in light of all those facts, I have to ask you, why are you here? What is it you have to say to us? What is it you want to say about yourself in this case? Well, I've had the media clamoring to get interviews with me. And after I made my last pleas, I wanted to get at least part of my side of it out. I've found it very hard to find any way to do that in Kansas City. The media has so biased my case. Portraying me as being non-human and their motivation is no separate from what the way I treated my victims. I treated them as something less than human. Nothing more than a play toy or a play object. This is what the media has done to me. It's dehumanized me so that it can believe, along with the public, that things like human sacrifice, set Satanism, demonic practices are more believable than me being a neighbor next door reach a point in his life where he could do monstrous acts. That's not the same thing as being a monster. Your prosecutors, and I do want to quote this, when you came to plead, called your crimes wantonly vile, horrible, or inhuman. When was this done? I believe in documents associated with the Sheldon charges. To repeat that quote from the prosecution, these crimes were wantonly vile, horrible, or inhuman. I think if you'll check with just about any attorney, you'll find that that is the standard clause that's used when they went to build a case for capital one with the death penalty. Another report was that you kept detailed torture logs and diaries. Did you? I kept sheets of paper where I had made some notations on. This is between the mattress and springs on my bed. This is one of those packages. It's containing enumerous photographs and what became to be known as meticulous methodical diaries. Those pieces of paper in there are these meticulous diaries. These are the pictures of the more than 200 photographs, some of them of young men, sexual partners. And these are in some ways, and these that we see here are the sheets of paper upon which you made notes. Right. This is a copy of one of those pages. That looks like a loose leaf paper. It does contain information about amounts of drugs and so on. So what is your complaint with the police calling these detailed diaries? By your evaluation, does this look methodical? It doesn't look methodical. Meticulous? It looks a little sloppy. They are not the bound in the Corinthian leather written on parchment diaries that the media apparently tries to describe them as. The sheets of paper, better notes. All right, Chase, what do you got? So he's using phrasing here to minimize the complexity of his logs and diaries calling them sheets of paper. You know who else writes on sheets of paper? Scientists, NASA, space engineers, rocket scientists, detailed meticulous logs, all written on sheets of paper. So I'm really wondering as a behavior guy, why is this a subject that he's sensitive about? That's fascinating to me that he's sensitive about this meticulousness of the logs. So there's no indication of remorse or empathy for any of the victims in his responses. His focus solely remains on how the details of his actions are perceived and documented instead of the impact of this stuff on these victims. And this whole time, there's a priority of his self-image over any accountability whatsoever. And he's focusing on the physical appearance of the logs. And he's saying something like they're not bound in the Corinthian leather or written on parchment and stuff instead of their content. So he's focusing on the appearance, not the content. And this is classic redirection. And as a quick tip here, interesting fact, he was born in January and people with brain deficiencies are more likely to be born in January. We're gonna talk more about this in a couple videos, but one of the reasons is a vitamin D deficiency. And one of the leading theories relates to the exposure of sunlight and the synthesis of vitamin D in our bodies. In the winter months, shorter daylight hours and a lot less sunlight, cloudy days and stuff can lead to vitamin D deficiency. And this stuff is crucial, vitamin D, for our brain development and any deficiency during the final stages of fetal development can impact the brain severely and mental development. And one more reason is seasonal infection rates. Winter births coincide with a lot higher rates of infectious diseases like flus and colds and other stuff. And if a pregnant woman gets sick, it leads to increased immune system activity which can affect the developing brain of this little fetus in there. And this maternal immune activation or MIA is what that's called, it's been studied a lot as a very likely cause of some serious disorders, even autism and schizophrenia. We'll do some more in a coming clip here. Greg, what do you got? Yeah, a couple of things. Whatever month this guy's born in, he's got some deficiencies for sure. But the thing to pay attention to is I don't think he's doing chaff and redirect. I think when we talk about chaff and redirect, it has intent, it has, I'm falling off the truck, I'm gonna go down this way and I'm gonna let you follow me and then pick up and run. I don't think the guy has any idea that what normal people expect. I think he's so far out of step with the rest of the world that this is an accidental chaff and redirect. He's parsing facts. Look, Julia Child kept meticulous notes about what she cooked that didn't make her a monster. It's not how you keep your notes, it's what you do with them. And the fact you're keeping records of torture and of how well a person was stood drugs and resisted and the mere fact that he's able to, I don't think he even is aware that he's shifting gears and moving on. He's just saying, look, I didn't keep meticulous records. Not I didn't kill them, not I didn't torture them, not I didn't cut them up. All that stuff he has no, no, no concepts. So he's just going down that way and this is trading guilt. I always say trading guilt. People do intentionally or unintentionally. Yeah, I kept horrible notes. I kept horrible notes. I did kill them, but I kept horrible notes. So that's trading guilt for him in this case, in my opinion. And I don't think he knows the difference. We're back to the kid who doesn't know where the lines are. Now, does that make him a monster? His actions make him a monster. So this I think is the only thing that he is doing is he's the smartest guy in the room. That's why I think he reminds me of this guy, Sheldon, we covered who burned his girlfriend up in the house. He thinks he's smart enough to say anything and walk away with it. When the interviewer finally does mention the contact and actually does say something challenging to him, you see that distaste in his mouth and a hard swallow as he tries to get away from it. As soon as the guy says, okay, yeah, they are loose leaf and they're not in a big deal. See his demeanor change. He goes too amused in his eye and even ridiculing in his characterization of this whole thing. And his posture changes for the first time. He's got a victor. I think this guy, and then finally at the end, he does that sarcastic voice tone about the whole situation. I don't think this guy has a clue what normal living, breathing humans do. Now how he got there, that's a different story. Scott, where'd he go? All right, Chase, going back to what you said about having, you know, colds and things like that. I think his mom must have had the damn amygdala flu because he doesn't have an amygdala. There's that, you couldn't, if you crack that head open, you couldn't find one in there for anything. I'd bet $1,000. fMRI's body, you're not gonna see us too late now, but he wouldn't have one in there. Now, quite often what psychopaths do is they'll keep a trophy of whoever they've killed. And it may be a finger, it may be part of their hair, it could be clothing, anything like that. I think that's what the notes were about because he wants to relive that buzz of what he did. So that's why I think he's taken such meticulous notes about that because he's obsessed with that. Number two, and number one, that's probably all he thought about was that. Because once they become obsessed with something like that, the world is about that for them because that's one of the only things that give them any feeling whatsoever is that rush of doing those things. So I think he's kept those notes, and made them so tight so he can relive that over and over anytime he goes in there. Because when he brings them up, we're seeing a couple of things that would make us think he's nervous. It's just a couple of, like we see him scratch his neck and he gets a little bit stiff there as he moves toward. I think what we're seeing is excitement there. I don't think it's nervous since I think he's excited about that because he's talking about his favorite thing in the whole wide world. In other words, being a psychopath, the things he's done, he's talking about the things that give him a buzz, which are the most horrific things that we can't even, we can't talk about the things that he did on here in detail because they were so horrific. That's what a bad guy, that's what this monster did to these people. So he's reliving it with his notes. He has no shame or anything talking about that. No shame whatsoever. We don't see many expressions with this guy other than the anger and disgust and contempt. There's nothing else in there. There's a couple of things he should find humorous that we'll talk about in a few minutes, but he doesn't find that humorous, nothing in there at all. Quite often people confuse psychopathy with sociopathy. They think there are things called sociopaths and in real life, there are no sociopaths. That's just a behavior that's been tagged that. As psychopathy or psychopaths have been tagged that because in real life, there's no true psychopath. Look at the DM-5, it tagged it. No, it should have been. Yeah, you talk about it as something else. But you have the psychopath and sociopath. Sociopath was actually used to make the psychopath not sound so bad because the psychopath and sociopath, you're talking about nature versus nurture. Psychopath is the one, like I was talking about the amygdala, that's part of the limbic system that is either misinformed or missing or isn't working properly in the human brain, the limbic system that you feel empathy and that you feel sympathy in and gives you helps with feelings. It does many other things than that, but in a nutshell, for what we're talking about, that's what I'm focusing on that for. Now, when they're born that way, that's the psychopath. When they don't have any feelings or empathy for anything, the one that's nurtured that way, what people call the sociopath, that person has grown up in a violent home. For example, let's take ISIS as the example because the guy growing up in a family whose father is in ISIS, let's say, or he becomes one of them, is he's never had those feelings, those emotions nurtured by his mom or his dad. Quite often you have someone who's got an alcoholic parent who beats him all the time, is mean to him all the time. They end up being the sociopath and they're just really violent, violent people. Quite often they end up stabbing people for some reason and it ends up in bars or something like that from my understanding, from what I've seen the most of, it ends up with something violent like that where as a psychopath when they do it, quite often it's violent, extremely violent, but it's a little bit more of a plan to it. They, you know, it's a little bit more thought out most of the time, not all the time. So that's the nature versus nurture in a tiny little p-shell for you there. Now, when he's talking about the Corinthian leather, do you guys know the story about Corinthian leather? Mark, were you gonna tell it? No, no, not at all. Okay. Well, there's a guy named Ricardo Montalban and he was an actor and back in the 70s, like 1974, this car came out called the Cordoba, right? And when he went on TV, he was talking about the Cordoba and how wonderful it was and now it had, that the seats were made of fine Corinthian leather. Well, come to find out. Corinthian leather is just upholstery made by these guys in New Jersey. Coins are called the Rae Bowl or something that rebel upholstery company. But they just needed to sound fancy so they had him say it's Corinthian leather because his accent made it sound really expensive and really high end. So there is no such thing as Corinthian leather before this marketing company came up with that that these other people made in New Jersey. This is upholstery company. So anyway, psychopaths to wrap things up. They like to keep trophies and like the scouts keep in notes, that's what, that's his trophy except for the body parts he kept because they like to relive that and photos. They like to relive that so they can catch that buzz again from the horrible stuff they've done. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so the Corinths were never known for their leather. Their columns, yes, of course, but their leather, not particularly. I love it with one sip. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Chase, I live in the great white north. It gets very dark here in the winters and so on my desk, here is the vitamin D. So there it is, at hand, always on the desk or a beautiful shaker if you need it. Now, what postmodernism will tend to? So is he a psychopath or is he just a postmodernist? Let's find out. So postmodernists will like to disrupt categories or definitions in order to dismantle power and often seize power by the dismantlement of the power by disruption of categories. And so we see this disgust, disdain or contempt. Contempt is for an individual. Distain is for a group. It's signaled by the same side of the mouth going up. One is social and one is personal. We see this throughout around these sheets of paper with notes on what he's going to do here is semantically disrupt the category here. By my reckoning, notes on a sheet of paper with a time log with short intervals, that seems like a detailed log to me. I mean, to anybody, that probably is a detailed log. What he's saying is, no, I'm disrupting that category for you. It's not a diary. It's not that. And so therefore, my power in saying that's a detailed log has been taken away from me. Now, can he put anything in its place while he keeps checking the interviewer to see whether he's getting a reaction from this is the interviewer joining along with this? But ultimately, he's got us into a semantic argument, which is an argument over definition. You all have been in these kind of arguments with people. It's terribly annoying sometimes, unless you're the person doing the arguing and then you postmodern and then it can be incredibly fun, incredibly interesting to dismantle somebody's ideas or the way they see the world simply by messing around with the words that they've got. Now, here's what you do in those kind of situations. Here's what I would do in an interview with this person when he's dismantling and challenging the category of a diary in front of me and saying, it's not a diary. It's a pile of papers kept between a mattress and some springs. I'd say, but what was the spirit of keeping those notes? What was the spirit of keeping those notes? Now, the idea of the spirit of it is kind of general because I'm trying to get past the categorization and get into what were you trying to achieve? What were you really doing? Not what are we calling this? So somebody who wants to have a postmodern argument with you will get into a semantic argument if you can get past that and go, well, what is this really trying to achieve? And sometimes just saying, what's the spirit of that? We'll get them to say what their motivations are, what they're trying to achieve and stop them arguing around the periphery of it. So maybe a psychopath but maybe a brilliant postmodern argument there. Don't know. Let's see what else we've got. Maybe both. I know. Maybe both. Another report was that you kept detailed torture logs and diaries. Did you? I kept sheets of paper where I had made some notations on. This is between the mattress and springs on my bed. This is one of those packages containing enumerous photographs and what became to be known as meticulous methodical diaries. Those pieces of paper in there are these meticulous diaries. These are the pictures of the more than 200 photographs. Some of them of young men, sexual partners. And these are in some ways, and these that we see here are the sheets of paper upon which you made notes. Right. Let's see. This is a copy of one of those pages. It looks like a loose leaf paper. It does contain information about amounts of drugs and so on. So what is your complaint with the police calling these detailed diaries? By your evaluation, does this look methodical? It doesn't look methodical. Meticulous? It looks a little sloppy. They are not the bound in the Corinthian leather written on parchment diaries that the media apparently tries to describe them as. The sheets of paper, their notes. How did you feel when you learned that not long after your arrest, pardon me, the local radio stations, two of them at least, were running a Bob Bridella parody song and were asking people to come to parties wearing dog collars? Well, I think the newspaper article reported that even the families of the victims were upset by the song. I haven't ever had a chance to hear the song. I had also been told when I first came into jail that the Fox radio station had run a promo giving prizes to their listeners if they showed up at the station and a dog collar and a leash. The people here in the institution, the correctional officers, the case worker, even the psychiatrist, or I think surprised to find out that that upset me. And it did upset you. Very much so. All right, Greg, what do you got? So now he's got this whole thing going where he's got condemning withdrawal of his lips and narrowing of his eyes. And that's the same disdain. If you go watch the thing we did on Dr. Phil with Tarik, that's exactly what it looks like. No, all I see is liar, liar, liar. And then he backs away and his respiration increases and he does some kind of an adapter we can't see down in his arms. And we say an adapter is releasing nervous energy of some kind. Can't tell why or what, but what we do show is that he's starting to show some kind of feeling and some kind of real emotion about his feelings being hurt. Again, negative things we know from the studies that psychopaths pupils dilate for negative things and don't for positive things, for example. So it might be a good indicator. I'd love to see his pupils a little closer. And that lip compression in this case, we talk about that being withheld information. In many cases, it's the single piece of information is some emotional thing. And I think that's what we're seeing is him containing his emotion. And then I love the fact he crowd sources normal. These people were upset and so was I. And the people were surprised I was upset. Well, you're upset because they're making fun of you. Not because you killed people and not because you did horrific acts. Those other people are upset for different reasons. You weird little guy who can't see past that. This is one of my least favorite people we've ever watched because he has no compassion for anything he's done and no remorse. I don't care what words he uses. His body does not show remorse in any capacity. Mark, what do you got? Yeah. Is he a psychopath? Is he a freaky little post-modernist? Well, he is upset. He is upset by ridicule, mockery and satire. And interestingly enough, that's a classic of a dictator, a narcissist or a post-modernist. Like, you know, your classic dictator or your narcissist or your post-modernist will not like ridicule or mockery or satire. Now, why would that be? Because what humor does is to rebalance power. The idea, the word humor comes from the humorists, the medieval medicine whereby the humorists would rebalance the liquids in your body and they do that via drilling holes in your head or attaching leeches to you or making you laugh that one of the humorists' doctors' tools was comedy, to have some fun with you. Because the idea was it rebalanced the humours inside of you and would make you well. It would deal with the power disruptions going on in your body. And post-modernists don't like that because they're trying to displace power and therefore, once it's displaced, they'll have some power around that and they don't want it displaced again. So they don't like themselves displaced so they will tend to go, no, you can't joke around this, you can't do anything funny and definitely no satire. They even know what humorists will tend to do to get past this is do cartoons or puppet shows because then you can say, it's just a puppet, come on, we're just having fun with a puppet. The post-modernists have seen you coming on this and they will ban your puppet show as well. So look, to just finish off this piece here, I have a post-modernist joke for you that I think is pertinent for this particular character. I've had to write it down because it's a bit wordy. Post-modernist joke, why don't you ever see a pirate cry because it's a private tear? Okay, I'm not in your office Mark, you gotta go, does it? Because it's private tear. I haven't finished, I haven't finished. As every pirate in Bodd is a secret narrative, impenetrable, unknowable, fetishized by those who claim to understand. That's post-modernist. That's a post-modern joke for you. Greg, what do you got on this one? No. Oh, Chase, what do you got on this one? So when he's responding to this, you'll see a micro expression of contempt again about the media and I'm calling it out not because it's any more relevant than the other ones, but it looks like something out of a training video. It's more pronounced because of his mustache, but it's so perfect that this, if you're making a training video out there, this is the clip to take for micro expressions. But now we're getting into why he's upset so much and let's dig into the actual behavior profile here. Narcissists often relocate their internalized shame onto other people. So they project a false sense of superiority. So that's what makes them really easy to spot. When we say here's how to spot a narcissist on a date or whatever, that's what you're actually seeing is projection of shame or concealment of shame. So we know he felt a lot of internal shame about his desire for men. And when somebody feels shame, how they deal with that shame can be a very clear picture of their internal struggles, what's going on inside that's usually more detailed than they even know about themselves. Shame is a self-conscious emotion signaling inadequacy, unworthiness or guilt. And people often hide shame to save face, fearing some kind of exclusion or judgment. And this is unlike guilt. Guilt is different. Guilt relates to specific action, shame blurs the lines between behavior and self. So concealing shame can lead to withdrawal or addiction and all kinds of other stuff, but Bridell's need to hide his devalued self led him to appear self-inflating and entitled. That's what's going on where I'm hiding my devalued self, I'm hiding my low self-esteem. Another thing he's known for is clinging to religious symbols. He had a crucifix and all this stuff that he hung on to and all kinds of other stuff and frequently talking about saints who used to be bad people, but somehow made it some kind of transition or something. I don't know. I think this religiosity was partly a way to feel a release from shame as well. So we're seeing all of these shame outlets and shame hiding devices. So keep an eye on that in your normal life, especially if you ever have to interview a babysitter. Take a look on for that stuff. Scott. All right. Once again, we see the classic trait of a clinical narcissist or psychopath. He says institution, not prison. I've talked to a lot of people in prison, they've been in prison never once. Have I ever heard him say, well, I was in the institution. They all say, yeah, I was in the hole or I was in the poke or I was in prison, whatever it was. They never said when I was in the, I never heard the word institution at all. So keep in mind when you're dealing with somebody like this, they have to make themselves look as normal or great as they possibly can. That's why he's saying that. He can't say, he probably can, but he's trying not to say that he's in prison. That's why he says institution. So keep in mind, if you want to get on, if you want to have a narcissist just spinning, not flip out, but just really close, you ask him this question. If you really want to get up a narcissist, you know what, then you say, what is the biggest mistake you've ever made? That's the question you want to ask him, because they'll be able to answer it, but they'll be trying to backpedal, trying to weave their way out of that. Fascinating to watch them do that. When you know one, ask them that. Just ask them in passing. You know, if you know someone who's a true clinical narcissist, well, you probably may not know the clinical one, but you'll know a narcissist. Ask them what the biggest mistake is they've ever made. What's the most wrong they've done? So when he's asked you, how did he feel about, when he learned about, he heard about that parody song, which I'm sure was just, can you imagine how atrocious that would have been anyway, just ugh. How do you feel about that? How did you make, how did that make you feel when you learned there's a parody song about you? He didn't answer that question at all. He starts talking about how the families of the victims felt. You know why? Because he doesn't know what feelings are. He doesn't understand that. He goes back to my sweet and sour chicken story. If you know what it is, you know what it is. So he doesn't know what feelings are. So he hasn't adapted to that. He hasn't paid enough attention to try to copy those things that people say. That's another thing. People think psychopaths are brilliant and really smart. Quite often they're idiots. This guy isn't very smart at all, you know, because he wasn't smart enough to start copying the emotions he saw. Usually that's what they do when it starts in their 20s, early to mid 20s, and they start discovering they're different than everybody else, the psychopath. They see these expressions and they hear these things made. For example, one time there was a psychopath that I knew. And I had some questions about it because he hadn't done anything yet. He has since then. And we were in this place called the Palm in Nashville. And it's a restaurant, it's fairly nice, but you know, people go there, music people go there for lunch and the entrepreneur people would be there for lunch and stuff. So I was having a meeting there. And two weeks before this, I'd been where this guy, don't even get ready to tell you about was. And we were saying something like about taxes, I think it was. And this guy says, dang it, I'm not gonna cast, something, something, and taxes. You know, I can't believe whatever. And he got all emotional. He had these specific things that he was saying. And he said it twice is how I know, because I'm the guy that said it. So I'm sitting there at this booth and behind me, I hear somebody say, dang it, taxes. And then he said the same thing that I was saying. So he had copied everything I had said. He just imitating the anger that he saw. He could have, he could produce anger, but he didn't know that the facial expressions that came with it. I didn't see his face. But by the way he was talking, I know he was imitating me. And so I said, I know that voice. And I looked around the corner and it was him. And then he went on to do some really horrible things. But that's why we know this guy's in the Spartan scouting world because he hasn't tried to copy those or imitate those emotions. He's just telling you that the families of the victims felt bad about it. They had bad feelings about it. Doesn't say how he felt about it. So he has no idea what feelings are other than anger, disgust, and contempt. That's all I got. Mark wins. He got that one, Mark, that was good. That was new. That was new. They're overzealous. Overzealous. He's a star, baby. What was it, though? Was it just skillful? I mean, what's your definition of skillful? We need to break down your vocabulary. Exactly what you saw. You just taught me how to do that. That's the post-modernistic approach to what you see. How did you feel when you learned that not long after your arrest, pardon me, the local radio stations, two of them at least, were running a Bob Bridella parody song and were asking people to come to parties wearing dog collars? Well, I think the newspaper article reported that even the families of the victims were upset by the song. I haven't ever had a chance to hear the song. I had also been told when I first came into jail that the Fox radio station had run a promo giving prizes to their listeners if they showed up at the station in a dog collar in Wilhelich. The people here in the institution, the correctional officers, the case worker, even the psychiatrist, were I think surprised to find out that that upset me. And it did upset you? Very much so. We recall, we mentioned before, that there were reports in the Westport flea market where you had your shop. That people would say, oh yes, I do remember, he had these strange smelling dishes of food that he had bead bones. And later on there were speculations at least in the community and in some aspects of the media that the remains of your victim were somehow being transported and prepared as meals and prepared as jewelry in your shop. I was quickly able to identify to the police the other dealers in that section of the market where we rotated pot luck rather than eat the flea market food again. And that you could question any of these people and they'd be able to tell you that the food was good. There was nothing suspect about the turkey or ham or beef that was in these dishes. You said, I want the police to explain why they allow the loved ones of families to die in the convenient area of Tent and McGee. I don't think any family of my victims or anybody else that has been killed now related to Tent and McGee are going to be happy to find out that their loved ones is basically written off by the police as far as investigations go, et cetera, because they died in a convenient neighborhood. The police knew what was going on, so it's no big deal. And that accounts for your remark to me and I don't mean at all to make light of it that I killed six, but they, the police, by allowing us to stay open, they killed more. Yes, this has been something that's been going on for over 20 years, to my knowledge. It seems to me that you're suggesting that had the police done their job, had they followed the leads, had they really been on your case prior to April 2nd, 1988, that would have caught you and some of the suffering could have been prevented. Maybe not caught me, scared me off maybe, prevented things from happening after how? Definitely. In a way, do you wish they had? Yes. Who's this guy look like? I know he looks like a muppet accidentally washed on hot, but who does he look like? Ned Flanders. Yeah. He looks like a fat Ned Flanders. Yeah. Okay. I've never said they're a neighbor. They're a knowing neighbor. Yep. I'm good for that. All right. Mark, what do you got? Yeah. Okay. So postmodernism is often defined by a broad skepticism, a broad skepticism. And so he wants to create a skepticism around the idea that he turned human beings into food at a market and be broadly skeptical around that. So he's saying, you know, it's suggested he served victims as food in the market and he's saying, look, that objective reality is just kind of naive. If you ask them, if you ask them what it was, they'll tell you it wasn't that. Well, that suggests that intuition is as good as knowledge, like test out their feelings. If they feel it was pork, then it was pork. Well, no, just because you feel it's something doesn't mean it is that thing. But that's the line he's going along, is that intuition, you know, your intuition about something is just as valid as anybody's strong objective knowledge around it. And that's the beautiful deconstruction that post-modernism can do. And I think he's kind of, you know, tacitly doing that. Now, he says this phrase, what do you think is going on here? What do you think is going on here? Sorry, the question, the question to ask him, the question to ask him would be, what do you think is going on here? So rather than go and ask some people and get their intuition or what do you feel about it? What do you think is going on here? And what you have to do is not let that person then deconstruct that question. You can't let them go, well, how would you define you? Or let's kind of understand what thinking is or isn't. And what do you mean by is going? And how would you define here? You've got to push them into their own thoughts and feelings about something. So they can't dismantle those. Another thing he goes on to do is dismantle the hierarchy of the police saying the police. Now, look, obviously, you know, police can be good, bad, and everything in between. But where he's going with it is the complete social dismantlement of the police. All police are terrible and bad and therefore that places him in the place of power, of being the victim around that. Look, we'll have some more of this to come. Greg, what do you got on this one? Yeah, I think one of the things that you said earlier, Chase, this is classic is where a person transfers all of their blame to another person. That's classic narcissist. And I think that's what we're seeing here. I mean, that's a classic. It's the police's fault. They should have kind of got me or they should have at least scared me enough to stop. The other thing is we see him do something is not done to now. He is very meticulous with the way he answers this question and is very detailed. This is a redirect. I went and helped the police. He slides away from the topic to start with. The guys didn't ask him outright. Hey, did you serve people as food? He didn't ask that question. So the guy goes, boom, I was able to quickly go and tell them. And everybody would tell you the food was good. The turkey, the ham and the beef were good. Stay away from the pasta. We don't know what else he did there. We know that those three things nobody ever complained about. So when a person does that, what they're doing is disqualifying every other possible thing. So I'll talk about these. You didn't ask me about those. That's a qualifier. You didn't ask. So I didn't address it. And that is a new thing for him to do that we've been seeing here. It would make me really suspicious. And he's just tough on everything he's doing here. Everything he's doing here is pushing up blame on the other people, classic narcissist. And if you don't believe it, watch that rare brow involvement when he raises his brow and he says, maybe would not have caught me. I'm too smart for that is the insinuation as he does a lip punctuation and a brow rise. And he's saying, you get me, you get me. I think this guy thinks he's smart. I don't think he is. I think he is just a broken toy who has no idea how society works. And he's done a whole bunch of the same stuff over and over and over, gotten away with it up to a point and then got caught. Chase, what do you got? Yeah, I mean, he, he shifts the blame for his crimes on the police. So their failure to act effectively is responsible for the entire crime. He said that he wishes the cops had stepped in earlier, which would mean a few things. Maybe he really feels bad about the people he hurt. Maybe he just wanted to help stop everything. Or maybe he's just trying to make himself look better, which I think is the case here. He also talks a lot about how he fit in at the flea market. And Mark, I wish you, I wish he would have asked like, Hey, yeah, go talk to Deborah. She does the chicken salad every Thursday and she can tell you how, how the food was. So even though what he was doing behind the scenes was horrific and this kind of double life is something you often see with serial offenders. I think the truth way that he's going to go down in history is viewing himself as original when he's a copy paste of all the other ones and just doing the same crap that everybody else does. So he's a textbook. He's boring. Run of the mill killer who does everything that all the other ones do. There's nothing special about him at all and he's not even interesting or expressive. He's a kind of just a boring idiot. Scott, what do you got? I think he nailed it. Yeah. And let me say this. Let me say this about that. The reason he's boring and the reason he's like all the other ones because when there's nothing in there, when your brain isn't working properly, it's just something that's running around with no anything in there. It's just a body run around, trying to please itself and they'll do quite often the very same things. That's why you have profilers who can spot these things so easily and you can look at that and say, oh, I understand what's happening here. This is what those things do. It will do this and it will do that. And I say it because there's nobody in there. Sometimes the trollers get in there and wail on me or say, and you called that person it. Well, it isn't it. There's nobody in there. They do horrific things in their monsters. That's the reason why. So you can fight. Wait, let's clarify that you're not saying all psychopaths in the world are idiots. Right. Oh, no. There's people like the ones that are like this guy, like this guy who do these, who torture people for hours and do horrible things with them. And then, for example, yeah, yeah. And then feed him to other people. I think this cat probably did that, man. I think you probably fed him to those people. Probably. Let me ask you this, Jason, you're fairly observant when you say, what is Mark not said that he usually says? What phrase is missing from his thing this week? I think you're thinking of a phrase and I think I heard him say it two videos ago. Oh, really? Is it this idea? Yep. He said it two videos ago. Okay. You're more observant than I am. Okay. Yeah. I ticked it off. I ticked it off. Okay. All right. I thought I had anyone there. Well, yeah. If you're watching this and you go back to when Mark says that, you'll see my eyebrows shoot up and then I look at Scott for a confirmation. And I got. Oh, yeah. Okay. I totally missed it. I totally missed it. So, all right. Well, back to eating people and serving people. When he's sort of accused of this, when the question that's brought up, what would you do if that happened? You would say, wait a minute. Hang on a minute, man. Yeah, I did all this stuff and I'm not feeding people to people. You would make a big deal about that. He said, no, man, that's crazy. No, I didn't do that. No. No. Uh-uh. He doesn't do that at all. Like Greg was talking about, he sort of griggles around it, starts talking about other things around that. Then he starts talking about the stuff that's in the food. You know, the chicken and the roast beef and the ham. You got to be kidding me. I think this guy fed these people to people. I think he did. That's my opinion. I could be completely wrong. But you know, because we saw no emotion. Like you were talking about Jason. Nothing changed on his face. He didn't go, what? Nothing when that was brought up. You're going to say, wait a minute. You're going to correct that. You're going to correct feeding the people you killed to somebody. You're going to say something about it. Anything. You're going to see reaction. Why did you know that's not okay? If your brain works. Yeah. Oh, you know what? You're right. You're right. Well, that's then proves my point. And everything is not okay in there. There's nobody in there with that thing. It's, yeah, he's nuts. But nothing. It doesn't ignite anything in him because there's nothing in there to ignite. That would spark an emotion because he's not able to have emotions, to feel emotions. Well, I think that's, I think that's classic psychopathic behavior we're seeing there. That's all I got. You guys covered everything. This next video is the best. We recall, we mentioned before that there were reports in the Westport flea market where you had your shop that people would say, oh, yes, I do remember. He had these strange smelling dishes of food that he had bead bones. And later on there were speculations at least in the community and in some aspects of the media that the remains of your victim were somehow being transported and prepared as meals and prepared as jewelry in your shop. I was quickly able to identify to the police the other dealers in that section of the market where we rotated pot luck rather than eat the flea market food again. And that you could question any of these people and they'd be able to tell you that the food was good. There was nothing suspect about turkey or ham or beef. It was in these dishes. You said, I want the police to explain why they allow the loved ones of families to die in the convenient area of Tent and McGee. I don't think any family of my victims or anybody else that has been killed now related to Tent and McGee are going to be happy to find out that their loved one is basically written off by the police as far as investigations go, et cetera, because they died in a convenient neighborhood. The police knew what was going on so it's no big deal. And that accounts for your remark to me and I don't mean at all to make light of it that I killed six, but they, the police, by allowing us to stay open, they killed more. Yes. This has been something that's been going on for over 20 years to my knowledge. It seems to me that you're suggesting that had the police done their job, had they followed the leads, had they really been on your case prior to April 2nd, 1988, that would have caught you and some of the suffering could have been prevented. Maybe not caught me, scared me off maybe, prevented things from happening after how? Definitely. In a way, do you wish they had? Yes. Are you saying you feel remorse or that you've been misunderstood? I'm not going to sit here with my finger to my chin and say nobody understands me. Yes, there has been a lot of remorse. There was a report in the Sunday Kansas City Star in December about the dangers you might face after you leave the Jackson County Correction Facility and are moved to another larger prison. How do you feel about reports like that? Do they make you anxious? They didn't give me some reason for concern, but one of the reasons I'm concerned is that these were not just reports. They were digging out quotes from unnamed prosecutors implying that the inmates down there are waiting to get their hands on me. I am at this point less concerned about the inmates acting on their own, as opposed to the inmates or the inmates acting in response to maybe some directive or coercion from the police officers. Do you think you're being set up perhaps? Well, I think the star and times have, since they haven't been able to get a court to put me to death, are now trying to get the inmates to do it for. Chase, what do you got? If you're watching this right now, press pause. Type in the comments what you saw in this clip as a profiler. We're going to go through and take a look. Let us know what you saw. And here we go. I'll read it. Yes, Scott reads it. Obviously, there's a distancing statement here. There has been a lot of remorse. I'll let you guys pile on to that or dissect that further. But perceived persecution is the only possible way he can now view himself as special and different. Please think about this. That's the only pathway to being special and different from other people. So there's some real stress and fear when he's thinking about being hurt in this new prison. His chin goes down. There's an uncharacteristic pause. His eye movements are different from the other times. He's closing his eyes and we call that eye blocking way more than we've seen in this interview. And his only emotional reaction to anything was about his own importance, his own safety. And still, there's not an ounce of remorse or even a social awareness to discuss that he feels bad for the victims. So he scheduled this interview to reshape a narrative. Then he forgot, to Greg's point, he forgot that a normal human, that they might want to hear at least words, just the words that indicate remorse or feelings of guilt, much less an apology. So this oversight that he made is one of the most profound indicators of what's going on inside this guy's head. I'm not talking about his lacking remorse. I'm talking about he's not even realizing that even just faking some kind of empathy might do him well. So the oversight is so pronounced that it shows that there is a hollow, soulless creature that still can't understand even how to fake connection or understanding of any kind of social intelligence. So we talked about temperature and how winter has a potential for nervous system issues and brain development. There's even a study done on this where they measured something called P3 amplitude, which correlates to an increased likelihood of childhood impulsivity, which, if you have time, is a fascinating study to read. But what's truly incredible is the environmental factors that are unique to winter that could trigger some kind of epigenetic change that really influences how genes are expressed, and particularly those in the brain development function. And what I've found, I dug pretty deep this morning, and this is just what I found this morning. I did not see a study on this, but the closer babies are born to the equator, the lower the chances are for both psychopathy and schizophrenia, interestingly enough. Scott, what do you got here? All right, great. I'm not going to cover all the stuff about the emotional part of that information. He just nailed it. But he does feel concerned. I think you're right. He doesn't feel anxious about that, but he does show concern about that. There was a study done in Wisconsin, the University of Wisconsin, and it involves shocking students. They had a group of students and they would shock them. They would tie them down on this chair, and they put this thing on their arm, and they would shock them. They'd say, we're going to do it again, and they would start counting down from 10 to 1. And the focus was on the individuals to anticipate the pain that was coming, the response they would have when they anticipated pain. They found out that people that had high psychopathic traits, they had no fear of that. They showed no anxiety as they counted down. The other ones, their heart rate would go up, their blood pressure would go up. They'd get kind of panicky because it hurt. Excuse me. And the people who had psychopathic traits, they didn't show any of that. And so there was a fascinating study, and if you're into it, you can search that and find it. There's a fascinating study on what some of the hallmarks of psychopathy are, and that's one of them. And I think that's what we're seeing here. He's concerned, but he doesn't show anxiety about that. And I think the worry that we're seeing is just part of that concern that I've got to watch myself so I don't get hurt in there, so nobody kills me. So I think you're right, Chase. I think that's what that is. But there's no anxiety with that. Because with psychopaths, they have that, that explains their impulsive and fearlessness going into specific situations like hurting someone or sneaking around somewhere where they can almost get caught in that kind of thing. So it's a fascinating study from the University of Wisconsin. Greg, what do you got? Yeah, I'm not sure that he doesn't show anxiety here. Let's talk for a second about that second part, because it's really powerful. When he's asked about violence, his respiration increases. And he breaks eye contact down to the right. We associate that typically with emotion. Whatever emotion he has, whether it's anger or fear or whatever it is, negative doesn't matter. But then his eyes do something we haven't seen. And Chase, you're talking about his eye movement, and he blocks, but then his eyes open and they flash for just a split second there, like recognition, like, uh-oh, here's a problem. That is anxiety to me. And this is one of those, this is only the second time we also see him when he talks about under somebody's directive, do that brow-up, eyes-open thing, like, do you get me? Like I'm too, we did earlier when he said I'm too smart to get caught. That is interesting to me because what we would expect from a person, a human being, is when you ask them about remorse, their face would do that. Instead of the anxiety of this, the anxiety of remorse, the pain of remorse, all that stuff we would expect to see there. But it's not there at all. It's not there at all. And then when he says there was a lot of remorse, Chase, you covered it distancing. If you were sitting face-to-face with this kind of a creature, you would want to lean over and say, who had remorse? What was that about? When was it? Were you remorseful? You got caught, Bob? And just poke him and give him a chance. What we know is if you start to feel and smell like bad guys, bad guys talk to you more freely. There's an old guy named Chief Nykoff, long before me, who was a CW-4 or 5 when I was the NCO. By the time I made interrogator, he'd been there forever. And he would always say we're the bastard cousins of prisoners because we have to smell, look, and sound like the people we're talking to to get trust. And as far into this conversation as he is in this 10 minutes and he could have leaned in and gone, it's okay, Bob. I understand if you don't feel remorseful. Do you have any remorse about being caught? Do you feel bad about being caught? You may have to even teach him what remorse means because he doesn't have that feeling or the vocabulary. But we see him feel anxiety or something associated and Scott, maybe it's not anxiety. Maybe, you know, we've batted this one around. But certainly that respiration increase that I break down right in that shock in his eyes, make me think something is up. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, let's have a bit of body language first with modernism. So he says right at the start, I'm not going to sit here with my finger to my chin. What's he talking about? What is that? What is he? I mean, I guess I'm kind of thinking, put down below what you think he thinks that pose would mean, you know, as to the state that he's in. I mean, if he's saying, look, I'm not going to muse over this. I'm not going to overthink that. I think then he'd be thinking about Rodan's thinker and Rodan's thinker has the fist right over the mouth. I mean, there's just no, there's just nothing coming out here at all in Rodan's thinker. So I'm not sure what that is that he's posing there. Quite interested what your, your thoughts might be. Stick them down, down below. Anyway, here's where he gets, which there is a media conspiracy to kill him. He says the star and the post are going to influence people in prison to kill him because they didn't get the results that the star and the post wanted. The news media wanted in court. So they're going to cause people to kill him in, in prison. So this is classic postmodernism because it's the idea that we're in a simulation and the media control everything, the media control how people think. Now, it's, it's a, it's a generalized, you know, it's a, it's a, it's a big generalized idea, whether you're postmodern or not that you tend to go, oh no. You know, I think the media are telling people how to think, how to feel. It's possible to some extent, but is it to all the extent, because postmodernism suggests it's to all the extent that we live in this complete simulation, which has been designed by media and we're all consumed by it. So the response to that kind of postmodern ideal or ideology is in the case of like people are going to kill you in prison. What other responses do you think inmates might have? So you just open it out. What other responses do you think the inmates might have to you in prison? And you can do the same with somebody who's taken this postmodern idea of, you know, the media influences absolutely everything and controls everything by going, what else? What else do you think? What, what country? What would you say contrary to that? Or what other subtle avenues can you take somebody down? It's interesting because ideologies on the whole, including ones that like postmodernism, which suggest they're going to disrupt thinking and open out thinking. Actually what they tend to do is narrow down thinking a hell of a lot and don't really open it up. Even the ones that say we're taking this idea, ideology to open up ideas, they kind of narrow them down in the end. Yeah, that's all I got on that one. It is pseudo-intellectualism. But I love the shit out of John Baudrillard. Well, yeah. And that's his simulation. It's his thing. It's a good, you know, it's good. It's thick to read, not the book, but it's like the information is so... Yeah, it's a little book. Yeah, it's like a pamphlet-sized thing, but I've had to read it, page it three or four times before I fully feel like I get it. It's like most of this stuff. It's good in its place, which is usually where it was written, at the time when it was written. For who? It's like people when they go, well, you know, Marxism, that doesn't work. Well, it did for Russians, at a very specific point, going against, getting themselves from underneath an aristocracy. But then when you displace it somewhere else, it doesn't work. You know, post-modernism works really well if you're a student in France in the 1960s. It's like an incredible post-modernism. But then you place it somewhere else and it's a complete disaster. It's annoying. It's not annoying in 1960s France. It's fantastic. It's very loud socially. Are you saying you feel remorse or that you've been misunderstood? I'm not going to sit here with my finger to my chin and say nobody understands me. Yes, there has been a lot of remorse. There was a report in the Sunday Kansas City Star in December about the dangers you might face. After you leave the Jackson County Correction facility and are moved to another larger prison. How do you feel about reports like that? Do they make you anxious? They don't give me some reason for concern, but one of the reasons I'm concerned is that these were not just reports. These were digging out quotes from unnamed prosecutors implying that the inmates down there are waiting to get their hands on me. I am at this point less concerned about the inmates acting on their own as opposed to the inmates or the inmates acting in response to maybe some directive or coercion from the police officers. Do you think you're being set up perhaps? Well, I think the star and times have, since they haven't been able to get a court to put me to death, are now trying to get inmates to do it for them. We've been watching psychopath in play or what we believe to be a psychopath. Mark has a different outlook. Mark, why don't you tell us what you think you've seen so far as we go around and say what we've seen. Well, I've loved dismantling the idea of psychopath and bringing down that power structure there in a very postmodern way while explaining to the extent that I can postmodernism, which is very meta in itself. So it was a postmodern act in of itself. How tedious is that? About as tedious as this guy is, I would hope. It's a pretty tedious interview because he ducks and weaves his dismantles and you can't get any sense of feeling or thought or real humanity in there because it's hard to find any humanity. At least some postmodernism does actually have a beautiful germ of humanity in it and he doesn't, but not to dehumanize him because that would be what he did. Chase, what do you got on this one? I bet that he thought this interview went really well. I bet he laid down in his bed that night and was like, man, I got him. Nailed it. This is a portrait of not just a psycho, but I think it's a mirror to maybe our societal fascinations. And I think this really shines a light on how this mental disconnect in psychopathy is more likely to be glamorized than understood in the realm of crime. And I think it's still fascinating to me how this kind of sickness can be so transparent to people who interact with them every day. That is fascinating. And when it comes to the media and what we see on TV, I want you to remember this while you're watching, none of us, us included, are immune to being influenced, none of us. And with this in mind, I want you to just write this one thing down, no matter where you're watching this, as long as you're not driving, and keep looking at it for a month when you see social media or even the news. I want you to write this one question down. What is being normalized in front of my eyes or my kid's eyes right now while they're watching whatever? Greg? A fish tastes like what it swims in. I say it all the time. And this kid, whatever age this person started to develop the way he developed, fed the wrong side of the equation, kept feeding all this dark stuff. And you'll even go, if you read his story, you'll see he saw some movie with the idea of keeping these people hostage, captive, and tortured in his house. If you are around a person who is doing that, who is feeding the wrong animal, you need to interrupt that young. Because if they don't, look, we all know there's a lot of people with poorly formed amygdala that don't grow up to kill people, that don't grow up to do horrific acts. But if they're feeding that side, that's what you get. And if they have no idea what the lines on the paper are for and they're coloring outside and they're feeding it, now you've got a recipe for absolute disaster. And I think what we're seeing here, nature, nurture, and a lack of any kind of control. And we come up with this. Scott, what do you got? I'd like to say what I think about this in a body language gesture or an emblem. I think we'll sum up my whole thing with this guy and the psychopathic behavior we've seen. You ready? All right, fellas, thanks for another Goodman. We'll see you next time. That makes her skin crawl. So when he's asked... For Scott, that was starting that OnlyFans page for you. Well, you know what? Because you got your feet page, right? And there's a lot of people into elbows and like this part of your arm. So that's my pages focused on that, man. You know, it's the elbow. What do you call your... What is the name of your page? It's just a feet-pick behavior boy. Okay. Let me write that down. I'll text you a link. Okay, thanks, man. Just look at your credit card statement. Scott, it's on there somewhere. Okay. So what do you got?