 Open Education Week, the session on how to be more open advice for educators and researchers. And we've got a wonderful panel of experts here with us today to answer the questions that we've posted on the Eden website. And also to answer some of your questions that you might have about how you can be more open as an educator or researcher. But I'd like to start first by introducing the members of our panel today. First, I'd like to introduce Chrissy Naranzi. Chrissy is an academic developer in the Center for Excellence of Learning and Teaching at Manchester Metropolitan University in the UK. She's a passionate open practitioner and open collaborator who has conceived and co-founded a range of open cross institutional and professional development initiatives for academics and other professionals who teach or support learning in higher education. She's got a number of examples of that, such as at OpenFDOL, at TLC webinars, and hashtag 101 Open Stories. Maybe Chrissy can share some of those with you in the chat so that you can check those out later. Chrissy is also an open researcher and a PhD student and member of GOGN, a key output of her research, is the openly licensed cross boundary collaborative open learning framework she developed. Our next panelist is Catherine Cronin, who is an educator and researcher in the Center for Excellence in Learning and Teaching at the National University of Ireland, Galway. Catherine's work focuses on openness and open education, digital identity practices, and navigating formal and informal learning. She's currently completing her PhD, exploring the use of open educational practices in higher education, something I would love to see when she's finished. Catherine advocates a critical approach to openness and is a regular contributor to conversations and collaborative projects in the area of open education within Ireland and globally, for example, co-creator of the GO Open Wiki, and contributor to the curriculum for digital education leadership and the author of Openness and Praxis, Exploring OEP in Higher Education. She blogs at CatherineCronin.wordpress.com and she can share that with us too in the chat. Our next panelist is Lorna Campbell, and Lorna works at OER Liaison, Open Scotland within the Learning, Teaching, and Web Services Division at the University of Edinburgh. Lorna has worked in EdTech for 20 years and has a longstanding commitment to supporting open education technology, policy, and practice. She leads the Open Scotland Initiative, co-chaired the OER 16 Open Culture Conference, and is a trustee of Wikimedia UK and the Association for Learning Technology. You can tell I'm reading notes here. She maintains a number of blogs, including Open World at LornaMCampbell.org and Open Scotland at OpenScot.net, and often provides social media coverage for academic conferences and events in the area of open education and learning technology. Our final panelist is Fabio Nassim Beni, and I told Fabio yet to tell me how to pronounce his name. He said, just go for it. Fabio works as assistant professor in the International University of La Rioja and is a postdoctoral fellow at the University of Sao Paulo, USP, where he collaborates with the CEST, Centro de Estudo Sobre Tecnologia e Soledad. He is a member of the Executive Committee of the European Dismissed e-Learning Network, even, of the editorial board of the Rotal Journal, as well as a member of a number of scientific communities in the field of learning innovation. He's an active member in the field of innovation at ICT for the years since 1998, by designing and coordinating more than 40 research and innovation projects and promoting early in international collaboration in different areas, from school education projects to higher education and life on learning. Further, he has coordinated a number of international development educational research, specifically focusing on Latin America, the Caribbean, and Asia. His main research interests are open education, learning innovation, e-learning, digital literacy, social and digital inclusion, and social networking. So, a big thank you to our panelists and thank you for joining us. And with further ado, I'd like to start out with the first question for the webinar today. We'll be discussing, we'll be having five different questions and then opening up the questions for people who are interested in it. Our first question to the panelists is, why should I be more open in my practicing profession? What are some of the reasons that you've seen? Different minds. We could start with Chrissy. It's often we talk about, you know, connecting with like-minded people, but there's actually a lot of value in connecting with other-minded people and open education and open learning enables exactly that. I mean, my personal research, and I think I'll let somebody else take over and respond, is in the area of academic development, like Lisa said already. But I've developed an open cross boundary collaborative open learning framework, which, through the research, it was a filmographic study. What came out is that actually what the individuals value the most is that they have the opportunity to work exactly with what I said before, with people who are different. People who are not just from another discipline in high education, who might be students, who might be teachers elsewhere, who might be the wider public, and they found especially extremely refreshing, and that boosted their confidence, A, in participation, and B, in knowledge, co-creation. So that would be my quick response, and I'll hand over to my colleagues. Thank you. Katherine, would you like to respond to the question? It's often difficult, I think, when you ask someone who has been an open practitioner for some time, as we are on the panel, and I see many of the participants as well, to think back to what it felt like to, you know, those first baby steps of going open or becoming open. But certainly, whatever I anticipated in the beginning when I began to use open practices has been far out exceeded in terms of what's actually happened for me as a learner, as an educator, and as a researcher. So I was motivated to go more open as an educator. I just felt that my students and I were networked individuals. We were meeting in higher education, and to actually go into bounded spaces, like within the learning management system, to learn in a small, isolated community only, failed students at some level, because when they leave higher education, they practice in a culture which is increasingly networked and participatory. So I began to use open pedagogy, open assessment, and so on. And my open practice grew from that. So, you know, I would certainly identify myself now as someone who benefits tremendously from my open practices in terms of support, information, friendship across the networks that I have. I know we'll talk more, but I'll keep that just brief for now. Okay. Thank you, Catherine. Lorna, would you like to add something? Yeah, I think just to say, I mean, I absolutely agree with Catherine. I think when you have been involved in open practice for so long, it becomes a very natural thing to do. And I think it could be quite difficult to try and remember why you started doing this in the first place and put yourself in the perspective of people who this is not a natural way of being. I mean, certainly from my perspective, I've worked a loss of my career on short-term research projects. I've moved from one project to the next very rapidly. Sometimes that's involved moving from one institution to the next as well. And I kind of found that it seemed more natural to me not to bind my work up to an academic identity within a single institution because my work was always out with colleagues all over the world, particularly when I worked in international standards. It was second nature to be working with people all over the world. And I think that's really where my own practice grew from. And it also seemed to be quite sensible for me to have a kind of identity for my academic practice that was without, out with the institution. And I mean, that's certainly the way that I've worked for many years now. I'm very lucky to work in a university now that has a lot of support for open education. But to me, my identity as an open practitioner is something that's kind of like, it's additional to my identity as my job in my institution. And as Catherine said, you build up these networks and to some extent, they become your professional practice network, but also your network of friends and colleagues and the people who support you. So I think it's quite hard to step back and think, well, why did I get involved with this in the first place? Because it's just such an integral part of who I am really now, I guess, to swap. Would you like to add something? Well, I tend to agree with whatever has been said. What I'm doing lately, I'm talking to a lot of not so open professors, basically my research, I'm trying to understand why educators refuse to open up a bit. And so my narrative there, and I think the answer to this question is that by getting open, you gain much more than what you spend. So in fact, let's say the effort needed to do things in a more open way, of course, that can mean many things. But let's say keeping it to a minimum is a very small effort. You're talking about reasoning or licenses, talking about sharing stuff, that's not a big deal. But the effect you can get and the benefit you can get is much broader in terms of not only recognition, but also professional networks and stuff like that. So basically what I'm trying to explain to people all the time is that getting open has nothing to do with changing completely your life. It is true that it then becomes a way of thinking and a way of approaching your job and your life. But at the very beginning, for people who have never thought of really getting open, what I'm trying to tell them is that you can do this step by step with small steps, which is not expensive, which is not time consuming and so on. And in a few cases, this works. And I get feedback from people like, you know, I was tweeting on my work and people are appreciating that. I would never have thought about it. No, people are replying to me. And this is, you know, if you've never done it, you don't think this could happen. It's obvious. So I think it's a matter of convincing the convenable professionals, which is not 100%, unfortunately. But I think the reason is clear and what should be made clear is the trade-off. I mean, it is not a very difficult and expensive thing in terms of time to be done, but the reward can be really big. Yes, I think Lorna's made a really good point here about small steps toward openness. And I'd like to move on to the next question, asking you how you practice openness. Not all of you are teachers, perhaps from your perspective as researchers. How do you practice openness in everyday life? And let's start with Lorna this time. Thanks, Lisa. I think there's lots of ways. I think one of the things that's really important is just very, very small things that mean you practice what you preach. So for example, I know that open education, the open education space covers a very wide area. A lot of my practice is actually focused around open education resources. So one of the things that I always try to do is whenever I'm writing blog posts, whenever I'm getting presentations, is make sure everything's properly licensed. Make sure I've got a creative commons license about everything I publish, make sure all my images are properly cited. And I think it's very easy to overlook things like that. But I think it's quite important if you are advocating for open practice that you're seen to really practice what you preach, because you can't really sort of encourage and advise other people to do things if they don't see you do them themselves. Also, I think just keeping communication channels open is very important. I make a lot of use of Twitter. Whenever I'm participating in events, I use the hashtag. It's just become again second nature for me if I'm attending events to tweet. And the reason I do that, I think, is really to engage other people, to make sure that other people who aren't able to attend an event in person can still have some of that experience. And I think it comes back to a conversation that we were having actually before we went live about the whole issue of access and equality and inclusivity. And I certainly see that that's a really important affordance for openness. And so certainly just tweeting from a conference using a hashtag is a very, very simple thing to do. But for people who can't be in person, that they're rooting, that's our challenge. So these are just a couple of the things that I do to try and just practice openness. Sure. I think that's a beautiful example. That's just that whole idea about that it's embedded in all your practice. And as your open practice grows, those different things become connected. So if you do a presentation, you might blog about it and then share it on Twitter. And those are all kind of mutually reinforcing. And I think just in terms of, as an educator as well, that power of modeling is so important. I mean, I felt that although when I was teaching undergraduates and using open practices with them, open tools and blogging and Twitter and open conversations and so on, many of the students chose not to be individually open. And I didn't require that. My philosophy was that I'm an open practitioner and model that our course is a node in the network. Our course is open. And then every individual student in that course could make their own choice about how open they wanted to be. So in that setup, modeling is incredibly powerful. So just presenting myself as a learner, as much as a teacher, when we have open conversations, asking questions of people who we invite in, which might be the people whose papers or blog posts we're reading. So just picking up on what Lorna said there, that modeling I think is just so, so powerful. And recognizing that through our open practice, people will see us and learn, possibly, but ultimately make their own choices about how open they wish to be. Yes, I mean, very good discussion already. I totally agree with Kassel and Lorna and probably what has been said about the importance of modeling, but also the importance of doing a baby step and sort of not reinventing the wheel. There's a lot to be do already that we can perhaps open up. What I would like to add is also if we want our practice to become open, sort of student-facing work, learning and teaching to become open, it's also important to invest in open academic development, sort of help academics to immerse themselves as learners to experience what that actually means and then get ideas for their own practice. Thank you. Okay, Fabio, that's been at least. I'm trying the resistances, but at the end of the day, we were able and we might be launching this pretty soon to convince the leadership of the university to endorse an open education strategy for the university. This is probably the first, one of the first private universities strategy in the sense. And this, I'm telling this because, I mean, one thing is to practice openness on one's own, so in a sort of half-hidden way that's what I'm using my power points and I also share them on slide share. Nobody will notice that. That's fine. I'm doing it for the sake of being open and that's it. But this is me and a couple of guys at the university and that's all. The other level is to try to convince the system or to try to change a bit the institution and that is the most difficult step. But of course, it's also the most important one because then things will become sustainable. And so I would say I have two levels myself. One level is what I do sometimes in a kind of a guerrilla way. So I just share stuff there and nobody either notice or care. And on the other side, and I think the people in the other, my fellow speakers have the same, some of you have this experience to try to convince policy that say at the institutional level but also at sometimes governmental level that things should change. And this is a different but pretty important I would say way to practice open also. Now we come to a question that I think is probably on the minds of many of the researchers here and probably those that are pursuing their PhDs. And that's the question of how do we deal with publisher perish? It's a reality within academia and what do you do? Where do you start? How do you put your step out there to make it open when your institution requires that you publish and maybe the open journals aren't where you want to publish or where you're being asked to publish. How do you handle that situation? Well, this is a very difficult question. If you want my honest opinion that this is, I mean as long as researchers do not make a serious move to change the thing and the status quo this publisher perish reality as you rightly point will not change. So it's blind alley you say in English. It's something that is like that and it is a reality that has been created by academics themselves so it's even more complicated to change it. What I can say what I'm trying to practice myself is to pre-publish a number of things or to pre-publish or also post-publish sometimes pieces of my research that sometimes again because of the system I'm forced to publish in journals which are not fully open. Let's say to try to take out pieces of my work to restructure them a bit and to publish them in blogs so that you have two ways the official way which unfortunately is not always open and the unofficial way or the more underground way where you can publish and especially and this is clearly telling us that open would be much better this is the way where you get feedback where you get comments where you get your work enriched typically when you publish on a big closed journal well I don't know what's your opinion I would like to hear the opinion of my colleagues but I never got any feedback I mean if I publish a proper blog or on a lively blog I get much more feedback and therefore my work is rich it gets improved. So my suggestion there I do ideal is by also publishing in non-official or in let's say semi-academic or practitioners through practitioners vehicles. Yes, thanks very much pre-publication I think is a terrific way to get around that in a way just in terms of context I think it's useful and kind of empowering to think that we are living through a time of culture change in higher education so there will be resistance that's just part of what's happening and trying to find the soft spaces where we might be able to make progress is part of driving change and one of those ways is to work closely with library staff because I think in many cases even where universities don't have open education policies or position statements yet libraries more and more are having open access policies and you will often find people in the library who will help you figure out how and when you can publish depending on what the journal is and I've recently had some experience with this and then apart from that Lisa you mentioned you know academia.edu and ResearchGate and other kind of open access repositories but you know if you can have an institutional repository and really kind of drive that that can also be a great way of modeling that for your colleagues as well so I really think every point that we push around this every paper that we get into an open repository every time we do this every time we blog about it we are part of that culture change so we who are the open practitioners are helping to facilitate that change so it might feel like just an individual act of individual blog post or paper but in this particular time of change all of those together are very powerful so we're once again back to modeling behavior in order to affect change thank you Catherine I'd like to add on I think we are in the same of change I think we need to keep pushing forward in terms of open access for funded scholarly works and I think the open access movement has made really important strides forward and I would absolutely agree for publishing academics make the most of your library and your librarians because they can help you in this area, they can advise on open access publication from my own perspective I think it's also important to do what Fabio said and work around the edges academic publishing is a bit of a racket to be perfectly honest but I think we do what we can to try and subvert that in little ways and whether that is to publication of publishing blog posts or publishing different versions or making things available through other channels I think that's really, really important and I think it's interesting that we're starting to hear more about copyright reform about open peer review about different ways of working that I hope will eventually start to challenge the power of the academic publishers so I think it is really important that we do keep trying to find ways to change practice while at the same time I think I do recognise that there is enormous pressure on research academics to publish through particular roots and I think maybe as open practitioners we need to try and sort of like leave the way and try to show how we can I just read that I find that all really complicated to publishing and maybe that sums up how many people feel about research more generally what I would like to add perhaps to the conversation is based on what Fabio said about getting feedback, publishing, sharing more half-baked research or scholarly activities through blog posts or other online means and getting that feedback because ideas can only grow and evolve I think if they are shared so I think we do need to be brave and get them out there and through that conversation, through the dialogue and through the academic debate we are going to have A, we will grow personally and also the knowledge base will grow and we will connect with loads of exciting ideas and colleagues around the world but also I think and then I'll stop here it's about also developing different kind of opportunities for academic development as an academic developer I look at ways of how we can engage academic in enhancing the teaching practice and why academics will be involved in disciplinary research and we talk about open access research in that area there's also an opportunity to engage in academic CTD through a more scholarly way of looking at their teaching practice and doing that in an open space and forum so there's a lot of value in that because we often complain that we don't get the academics, we don't get everybody involved in academic CTD so could this be something that should be considered further? Thank you. Thank you Chrissy. You've all talked about how to be more open both through your example as practitioners of openness and also in some of your advice about being open I'd like to ask a little bit more about what kind of platforms you use or environments you use that support you in being more open as an academic. There's been mention of research gate as an example there was an example posted by Graham who talked about Wikipedia pre-print in order to provide research early. What platforms do you personally use to really demonstrate your openness? Well you always have difficult questions with me I would say I'm thinking mostly of what I mostly use are specific are not the environments which are thought for publishing for publishing scientific research. To make an example when I'm talking about practitioners platforms I'm thinking of the open education Europa platform which now it's a bit changed and it's going through a renewal which in my opinion is not that good but the way it was pretty useful because you could really get comments on your research by practitioners by teachers, by people on the ground and then of course you can use this feedback in your research so it's enriching also from that point of view. Of course research gate is useful especially when it's about publishing data this is also something which is not of minor importance I mean most of us have some data to be published and publishing that open is also quite important and on the research gate or academia you have a specific place to publish your data which is also good even if all this open data I have a concern on the fact that I've never heard of somebody using data for models particularly researchers love to use their own data for their own research so there is another barrier I think in terms of you know if I'm using data by somebody else then I perceive that my research is less valuable which is totally not true but this is something which I also feel myself so I understand the issue but nevertheless I think sharing data is also important and this is I think it wasn't like that in the beginning but now for example research gate is giving us the possibility to do that but mostly my advice would be to go for the practitioner's journal in the states you have this I think it's called teachers 2.0 it's a massive online community I mean like thousands of teachers super active it's impressive how much they are working and collaborating or another idea another platform I've been using quite a lot is the wikieducator.org which you might know that is very good I think to be seen in I think I got 2000 when I put there my research project I got like 2000 views in the first couple of days so it's really good reach especially from again from the English speaking world but okay this is our world we're going to go with it not so much in terms of feedback I didn't get a lot of feedback I got some but it's mostly I think to be right then to be viewed the good thing is that being a wiki you can keep up with your research and again every time you update your stuff if you are brave enough you should let everybody know so that then you get bit into into a into a virtual circle commenting and at least of showing that your research is alive and going forward did I answer your question? you did thank you Fabio Lorna would like to add something a point that Fabio made about open data and the reuse of open data I think open data is an increasingly important part of the open education environment and I think it's something that we all need to be more aware of more attention to a couple of resources I'd like to highlight one is really excellent resource a report written by our colleagues and we will have a man for the open knowledge open education working group about open data as OER and when I stop speaking I'll put the link in the chat that's a really really useful resource that presents case studies of how you can use open data as OER another really useful tool for sharing open data is wiki data which is really starting to take off so again I would really encourage people to have a look at wiki data and I think we might have some case studies from the University of Edinburgh and we're working indeed in residence here about how you can use wiki data both through your research and your teaching but the other thing I wanted to mention is a project that I'm involved in in the University of Edinburgh at the moment which is actually to develop an online course to highlight to the general public not just academic researchers but actually the general public people are out with the academic to name but universities produce all this stuff that is free and openly licensed and that they can use it and here is how you find it so it's going to cover everything from open access and scholarly works to open data to open archives and collections and it's going to be a very short course running on future learn which will be aimed at the general public entrepreneurs and small and medium enterprises but we all know that MOOCs are questionable in their openness shall we say so we're also going to make all the materials we produce openly licensed you see by and they'll be available from the open.ed website as well hopefully so that's just something we're trying to do to help address this problem is we produce all this open stuff but are other people using it particularly in terms of open access research and open data so I just want to throw that in there in terms of that I'm so glad Fabio and Lorna are here that is just two of the best people who could discuss that aspect of open data so thank you when you first asked the question Lisa my I was thinking of something else maybe people who aren't involved in research or to the point of dealing with open data but just wondering how do I even engage with openness how do I take those first baby steps as we called them and one of the questions that I find really useful whether working with students lecturers, librarians support staff, wherever people may be it's just what conversations do you want to be a part of and depending on who you are and your context the answer to that may be different so what conversations are happening that you would like to be a part of so perhaps it's the people whose work you are studying people on campus who you really admire people in the public who are doing work that you would like to do so just see where they are openly online what tools are they using really really gently like that and then if there are some open practitioners in your immediate area again have a chat with them, have a cup of coffee with them and you know I've helped many people kind of get started with open practice and my advice is just really mostly to have fun with it so it's not another project or another task so for example if you start using Twitter I would say create your account on Twitter and then on a Friday evening sit with a glass of wine when you're relaxing and just put it on your phone and have a look at it and look at who you know, see who they're following build your network slowly and really enjoy it because that's what it's all about as well that's it yes I can add a little something is that okay I mean have you started talking about getting feedback on our work publishing it openly maybe as a blog post etc but this does happen automatically and Catherine already indicated the importance of having conversations and the importance of giving and engaging so I think that's really important to highlight because often there might be an expectation oh I've put something online everybody's going to read it and millions of people are going to respond it's not going to happen, you need to develop these networks, these contacts these connections with the people and their ideas and also reach out and connect with other people's ideas because it's not so much about ourselves, I think it's more about others and how we can connect to them so keeping that in mind and trying to to take the risk for some people it might be something completely new and alien but we need to make that first step thank you yes I just wanted to okay Lorna you wanted to add the question and to you know again as Eva said Catherine said about platforms and environments and tools to use for openness and I think one of the really important things to communicate and to colleagues who are perhaps maybe a bit unsure about openness is just to encourage them to use tools that they're familiar with you don't need special platforms or special kit you don't need expensive softwares to become open you can use a lot of the tools that are just there and that's I mean that's something I very much do myself I mean the main tools I use are WordPress and Twitter SlideShare Storify these are the tools that I use every day as an open practitioner but you can also scale that up as well and I think within the University of Edinburgh where we do provide a lot of support for us in this but we still base that around a wide range of tools some of which are institutionally supported systems like Media Hopper which is our main multimedia management platform and that's that large investment that's essentially supported software but Open.Ed the site for open education resources that's just a WordPress blog and it pulls in content from Flickr and from YouTube and from SlideShare and I think you know there's a lot you can do that's quite simple you can use those tools that are already out there and you can use those tools to further your open practice and I think what you'll find is that there are already people there there are already communities of open practitioners there and it's just about connecting people up to these communities Thank you I'm really glad that you mention that because I find as an educator getting my students to use social media to get out there to connect and it's hugely beneficial to them into their learning process so well those are all the questions that I had and I'd like to know if members of the audience members of our participants today would have any additional questions that they would like to ask the panel go ahead and enter them in the chat box and they'll be happy to respond does anyone have anything they'd like to add while people are thinking about their question we told you that we would have difficulty by it didn't we? Okay we got Catherine and we've got Lorna A thought that just listening to Lorna there that I was thinking was in just becoming open and kind of embarking on open practice I think yes use the tools that you know and be gentle and have fun but I remember the spark for me was particularly with blogging was I was using a lot of open resources I was using in my teaching and in my learning and I realized that you know there was this notion of the common that the reason that there was all this great stuff out there for me to use and to share with my students was because other people individually were sharing their work using the creative commons and just sharing without any knowledge of whom I'd pick it up and how and that was when the penny dropped for me and I thought if I am partaking of all this knowledge and resources and networks that are there then you know I need to give back and to share as well and then I think that is really the whole ethos in openness and I'm sure all of us here would agree and once you start it only grows as Fabio said but I think you know just that journey of an idea was really what changed everything for me. Yeah I just wanted to actually respond to a point you made yourself Lisa about the challenge of engaging students with social media for their learning and encouraging students to become more open learners one of the initiatives that we ran at Edinburgh is 23 Things which if you look in the chat there you'll see my colleague Charlie Farley who ran this short online course which basically designed to engage people with social media. Charlie will be able to tell you where the course originally came from I don't know who developed it but we adapted it for use in Edinburgh and it's a lot of fun and it basically just introduces you to a different social media tool every week. I did it myself despite the fact that you know I've been using social media for years and it's second nature to me but I had a lot of fun doing it and I actually learned a lot and it made me stop and think and reflect about how I use social media or don't use social media so again that's an open resource and all of the things that we produced for that course are really nice. Okay, I mean if somebody would start or have an interest to become an open practitioner I mean I see it as a continuum I would say and perhaps for it to start would be to listen and watch, to be there but maybe a fly on the wall I think there's an English question I would say the next stepping stone might be to start and you know take this if you like and be there and participate, establish a voice and the next one the next step from that would be go for it do something innovative creative with others because you are not on your own in the open you have loads of allies that you are not aware of they are out there waiting for you to take the first step so go for it so there's a space out there there's all these people and ideas that are floating around online but also offline I think what we haven't perhaps mentioned is the offline dimension of open learning, the local dimension how we can actually connect with people locally in our communities so there are loads of opportunities and if we take these stepping stones what are the possibilities and surprises I have a comment that is sort of also maybe responding to the question in fact my consideration which is a bit controversial to all the questions which I forgot to tell before I think one of the keys in my understanding both to convince people to build capacity of educators especially and to keep them being open maybe you give it a try and then you go back to your normal life I think is to focus on all aspects of openness of all activities related to openness I mean typically we have one thing of openness and you think of open licensing and OER and reusing which is very good that is very important and so on but then you have of course open pedagogy which as was mentioned there a whole world of possibilities and a whole world of debates but then you have open evaluation and of course the open badges which was mentioned many times in a single chat line before by Debbie it is also something which could change the system sort of and open design so at least what I am looking at in my research are these four aspects design, content, pedagogy and evaluation and the relation among themselves and on how openness can be approached or should be approached from different perspectives so when you are if I have to convince when I have to convince an educator or a decision maker on going for openness on going for it as we said in the chat I try to find the weak point so the area where he or she is more open already of course if somebody doesn't like to share his own content but likes to talk very much I mean in Italian so you might understand that's what we do all the time so I like to collaborate and to talk and to network okay that's enough you start with that and you discover that then the next step is sharing your content because once you are once the trust level has increased then you will be sharing and the licensing openly your content so my point of advice there is to try to try to keep in mind different entry points on to openness and to try to use them depending on whom we are trying to work with or to convince let's say very good point Favio we've got a question from the audience and that question is just a second I need to scroll down there's been so many comments in the chat box is there any focus in the general open approach to considerations of accessibility of open content data pedagogy and strategies is there anyone from the panel that would like to speak to accessibility I'll jump in there oh sorry okay I think all I was just going to say very briefly because I think a lot of in terms of accessibility a lot of the good practice that's required for openness should also aid accessibility and I think it's important to bear that in mind that there's there's good practice for good practice for making your resources and your data open should also help with ensuring that they're accessible as well I think sometimes maybe you need to go a little bit further than that but certainly yes I want to say along the same lines definitely good practice is inclusive practice and that means having a variety of approaches in the design embedded in the curriculum design so if we are concerned about the quality of the open design of open education in general I think we just need to get back to what actually good practice means and the principles of that also apply across open practice and variety is key I mean in my what I found is I had actually one participant in the study who was dyslexic and she obviously struggled the person struggled with the tech but there were videos, there were a variety of audios and all kinds of different approaches to engage fully and that variety was highlighted as inclusive in that certain sense but there were different things working for different people thank you yeah that was a overarching question so I'm not really sure I'd like to address the open pedagogy piece perhaps the question can be clarified if I'm going off track here but basically there is an awful lot of work and growing body of work around open pedagogy and open educational practices and I'll put a couple of references in there but it was one of the aspects of that question so if you want to clarify the question please do keep the conversation going and I'll put in some links there some wonderful work and wonderful people to follow in the area of open pedagogy and always well everything has been said more or less I think here the question is is there any focus on all these things I think the focus most of the times is not there what I find most of the times is that open experiences are really connected to one person or to one group within an institution so I think whenever we speak about open content of the pedagogy and even open strategy the big challenge there still is to sort of mainstream or institutionalize it so I know that some of us here have been doing some trying to do something in this respect so I don't need to got the question right but to me the focus should really be on moving from the experimentations to the system level I have Fabio a question is that allowed so Fabio you said institutionalize open education that almost sounds painful to me I have to say as a term but I do understand what you're trying to say I'm just interested in how it makes that happen if you are an individual an open practitioner in an institution and there is no buy-in at the moment how can we make that change spread and actually institutionalize or normalize it yeah well I think it depends a lot on the institution or on the moment in the history of an institution or of a country let's say I can bring you two short examples the first I was mentioning before our strategy for open education within junior I was writing before the two lucky coincidence where first the existence of a UNESCO chair and an ICD chair which pushed a lot on this and of course when you have big institutions like that you tend to abide sort of and at the same time what we did was really to engage everybody in the leadership of the university everybody I mean that we had like 50 contributors to this document out of which I think 45 did not know what it was about but they contributed anyway because of course they want to write such an important document and as soon as they have contributed even with two lines then they cannot say this they cannot say anything against it so that was a bit the trick but a very basic one but it worked and in terms of more let's say another example is what is happening I wanted to quote this what is happening in Morocco and where we that is an institution normalization let's say even at a broader level we are we have been working on an open med project by in order to to launch soon well to prepare it to launch soon the open education morocco declaration which is taking a lot of a lot of inspiration from the open scotland declaration by Lorna and there also there I think the lucky circumstance was that in this specific moment the country is in search for some leadership in the region so in that case you know you propose to them something where they can lead and that worked so I think it's a it's a matter of finding the the good hook the good way in depending on the different moment of or the different institution or or counter in this case I don't think there is a recipe for that and I agree with you it can be very can be very difficult and very frustrating especially because in many as in many South Africa the UNISA for example case you know things were fantastic for the first year and then they slow down dramatically and if you ask people there nobody knows why so it sometimes is also a matter of you know ups and downs and moments in the institution so it's a difficult exercise absolutely but but worth I think are there any final comments could I give you each perhaps one minute to say something that you think it's very important for academics and researchers in response to what do they need to my suggestion would be to have a wide open mind well my advice would be a larger networks in fact what I'm discovering more and more is that people feel very at ease within small networks with people in the other room or in the other confidence of people they know very well but then the next step is to really get open so to basically a large network a matter of confidence as Lorna said so my advice would be a larger networks well said already here but in the spirit of openness I would just say that anybody who's here in the webinar I think all of us on the panel and you Lisa would be willing to continue the conversation and find us very openly online everywhere so the conversation doesn't end here let's continue it and more than happy to do that. Exactly what I was going to say here also is that these are some wonderful people to follow so if you're not following them on twitter or other social media networks be sure to get out there and do that because they model the kind of open behavior that we want to see within academia so please do get out there thank you to the panelists for participating today and for those of you in the chat and everyone for all of your insights and your comments not just from the panel but also from the participants extremely helpful lots of resources available I think some of the key takeaways that we have from this webinar today is really you know there's different levels of openness there's different levels of how we approach openness and that it's really about connections connections with other researchers with other academics connections with our students students with other students students with researchers so it's really about building those networks and opening up those networks to new ideas and new approaches so as I said thank you everyone for coming today I would like to remind you tonight there will be an Eden chat on MOOCs in soft skills development and higher education that will be at 8 o'clock 20 o'clock CEST Antonella and Fabio will be providing the moderation for that discussion so please be sure to join us there and also if you did not register for the webinar and you would like to get a copy of the recording you can sign up I think we're going to provide that link let me just copy that really quick into the chat area and then we will send you a copy of the recording and open badge as a result if you could Christina could you maybe copy that for me thank you again thank you to all the panelists it was a wonderful discussion and I really enjoyed meeting with all of you today