 that Angus Kennedy from Nature Northwest has joined us in the studio. We're streaming as well. Nature could or Angus could see Nature too. It's good to see you Angus. I've been called worse, John. Thanks a lot. Good to see you too. And it's been a while since we talked. It's over a month I think. Over a month, yeah. A lot of changes out there. Yeah, spring is sprung. So let's chat about a few of them. I suppose one of the signs for all of us that it's spring is frog spawn. And I saw some on Saturday out at Walking the Dog. And I always associate frog spawn with stagnant water. Just we shots as I would call them or maybe a pond or something. And it's very distinctive, especially if you get a large area. And there was a time when we were younger and we were growing up. You know, you may have been tempted to play around with it or take a bit of frog spawn with you. And maybe try to grow a couple of frogs and we bucket at home. That's discouraged anymore. Well, we're starting to realize, well, we have realized for quite a while, I suppose, the importance that frogs pay in our ecosystems, the amount of animals that rely on them for food. And early food, you know, at the winter time when an awful lot of the winter forage has been depleted. Frogs appear very conveniently. Middle of February normally they appear for us. And then they go a little earlier down the country. And it's the males that come out first. And they go back and they try and seek out the same pond that they bred in before or that they were even born in. And they think the same frogs coming back to the same pond year in, year out. Same. Yes. So along what frogs live for? Well, they can live five or six years, five or six years. But they won't breed for their first two years. But after about two years, they'll start breeding. Where do they go during the winter? They hibernate. Well, and they call it dormancy, really. It's very similar to hibernation, but they pretty much shut down. So sometimes they can go to the bottom of pools. They'll go to damp places under piles of logs. But as long as they're kept damp and the temperature is reasonably stable, they're happy enough. Yeah. And then once that little bit of extra light comes, that little bit of extra energy, that triggers them to wake up. The males wake first and they try and get back to that original place. So in the middle of February or so, you'll often get calls or people wondering why is there so many frogs on the road? Why is there so many frogs in their garden across their field? And that's then they just head single-mindedly through whatever barriers we put in place. They try and get over them and get back to that original pond. And they'll call and call them to attract the females and the females then they're left. And what do we see when we see frogs born? What exactly are we seeing? Because they're distinctive little jelly bits and the blacks in them. What's the black bits? Yeah, the black bits, well, the black bits are the eggs. So inside that little jelly piece, which is everything that protects them, and also it's initial food. So they're effectively free-living embryos, which is kind of amazing, because most embryos are either wrapped up in a shell like an egg or they're, of course, inside a mother of an animal. Whereas the frog spawn is amazing, it's free-living embryos, huge amounts. Each female will lay about 2,000 eggs. And then the males is a big rush for the males to try and they compete with each other to try and fertilize those eggs as they're being born effectively or being laid, I suppose. But frogs are amphibians and we've very few amphibians in Ireland. And amphibians means, well, it comes from the Greek word amphibious, which means a double life, because they start off as something very different in the water. Once the frog spawn that survives, the little bit that does survive, will turn into tadpoles and it is gills. And that's a completely different breeding system then to what the adult frog has, which is effectively lungs. They can also breed through their skin, which is kind of amazing. Hence they can stay so long under the water, but they have lungs as well. Whereas in that baby stage, in that tadpole stage, it's gills that they breed in. So that's where they get that amphibious double life name. Okay, okay. And it's just the one species of frog that we have in Ireland, is it? One species of frog. So we've one toad, one frog and one new, effectively that are native to Ireland. Now there are little pockets and patches of other amphibians that have been introduced. Normally they tend not to spread or quite often not do very well. But the frogs that you come across, even if it's a completely different color to the one you saw the day before, it's all the same species. Same species, European frog. And they can change color. They're quite amazing that way. If they emerge out of a damp, dark pool, they'll be quite black. Whereas if you see them on the bog, they'll quite often be quite orangey or that kind of rusty color. And the difference between a frog and you said a toad and a newt? They are quite different altogether really. So the newts really, if you think like a little lizard, the newt looks like a little lizard, but it's an amphibian again. So it has that double life thing. So that's what makes it a bit different from a lizard, which would be born in a different kind of way. And your newts and frogs, well and toads as well really, they'll all use the ponds. So they'll go into the ponds to hunt to a certain extent and to lay their eggs to breed. But then they want damp areas. So they don't necessarily live in the pond all the time. At the time you'll get them in the pond at this time of year. As the frogs and the toads in particular, they'll tend to move out of the ponds and they'll be just in damp areas, damp grasses, damp ditches. I am hunting flies, hunting bugs. I am pest control for us. And the newts themselves, they'll tend to stay in and out of the ponds quite a lot. Although not always in ponds because I remember when you'd be at the hay, that occasionally you'd see frogs as well. So that's where the drain or the pond would ever dried up and they're just out in the middle of a hay field. Yeah, and we're lost, we are losing and we have lost a huge amount of our wetlands. All sorts of wetlands, from bigger wetlands down to the little mini wetlands and the little mini ponds effectively. And in our drive for industrialization, industrialization of our towns, of our areas, but also of our farming, we've tended to drain an awful lot of land. And that has lots of effects, of course, effects, flooding effects, water quality effects, all sorts of things. But one of the things affects is all the different characters, the insect life, and then the bigger animals like the frogs that rely on those ponds for their breeding. And then the likes of the otters, big mammals. We don't think of draining a little ponda that could possibly affect an otter. But nearly 20% of the otter's diet is frogs. So if there isn't as many frogs, well, then the otter is gonna suffer and many other creatures are gonna suffer. It all has a knock-on effect. It all has a knock-on effect. Another advantage of having ponds or leaving those little wet areas alone or even managing the wet areas so that they stay wet all the time, well, first, you're creating an area that can flood. So if there is some excess water and we're seeing very heavy bursts of rain, so it's an area that can spill over a little bit. But the other thing it does is they trap an awful lot of pollution, those little ponds, those little mini wetlands. So if there is anything coming out of septic tanks or coming out of things that have been spread onto fields or whatever else, those ponds can act as a little trap, as a filtration process, effectively, which helps our water quality later on, too. Okay. So if you do see a bit of frogs spawn, the advice would be to leave it be. But if we can, to go back to it, because it will develop, they'll go into tadpoles and then tadpoles into frogs. So we will see a change. How long does that process take? So the whole process takes around about 12 weeks and that depends a little bit. So now this cold weather will delay things and you'll probably see quite a lot of frogs spawn after this week. If it gets as cold as its forecast, you'll see a lot of it will go white, those little eggs will go white and that's them not doing so well. The ones on the surface, but each kind of blob of jelly full of eggs that you see, the ones on the surface, they might freeze and not survive, but the ones underneath will probably be okay. And then it takes about eight weeks or so. Well, after about three or four weeks, they turn into the little tiny tadpoles and then it takes about another eight weeks for those tadpoles to develop. And it's well worth going down, even to look for yourself or if you have any children, grandchildren, bring them down to the local ponds, bring them down to the ditches. People often ask me, how do you engage young people? How do you get them away from the PlayStation? How do you get them away from the TV? And frogs spawn is a perfect way. Bring a little jar, bring a little bowl, scoop up a little bit, have a look. Now put them back into the pond, but have a little look at them. And if you do that on, I say, a weekly basis and you will see them growing. First of all, you'll see their little back legs, they emerge first, then their little front legs and then eventually the tail comes off and then you'll be rewarded with these tiny little froglets about the size of your thumbnail that are starting to emerge out of the pools. And it's a fascinating thing and it's something that children will never forget. As you say, it's great way of engaging kids. Someone's texted in to say, I found loads of frogs spawn on top of some heather away from water. Will this survive? Probably not. And I've been noticing that too. That's eagle-eyed by that, that listener. I was out with a school group up in Glasson National School, actually, just outside Chrysler and we went for a little walk looking at their area around the school. And the kids, the students were spotting frog spawn, most likely dug out of a pond of a puddle by, say, a heron or maybe some other bird, maybe even a crow, or it could have been fox that it could have tried to get some out or something else like that. They would be dropped off there. And then dropped off there. Yeah, quite often you'll see frog spawn dropped in funny places. If birds ingest, if birds eat a whole lot of it, they might not be able to handle it. Their stomachs might not be able to handle it and they can end up regurgitating it and they can end up in funny kind of places. But it's a sign of just how important they are. There are many, many creatures that rely on them for nutrition this time of year. Now, the ban on cutting heteros and burning land is in effect and is in place now until the end of August. And they're for a good reason. It's to protect wildlife, to protect our birds and mammals. And I suppose through these summer months, it's a busy time for them because they're trying to find a mate and a nest and rare their young. So it's about giving them the position and the space to do that. It's hugely important. And this is a big debate we have every year. And I'm very confused with it. I must say I don't understand why it's a debate at all. I think the knowledge is out there. I think the awareness is out there, the importance of hedgerows for our nature. And also people, I think the awareness is really growing if it's not fully out there of how much of our nature is in bother. And a lot of the small little birds that rely on the hedgerows, their numbers are dropping off. People know that now. Maybe it's the case of just listen, you're not gonna tell us what to do. This is my land, the hedgerows are my land. I'll cut it when I want. Well, there's rules for everything. None of us like rules, none of us like extra rules, but we all have to comply in society with different ways. We can't speed our cars, we can't dub our rubbish, we can't pour nasty things down the drain. And things like leaving hedgerows should be very straightforward. And to be honest, any farmers that I talk to, they get the benefits of hedgerows. They see the drainers that they provide. They see the soil erosion that they prevent. They see the shelter that they provide for their livestock and whatnot. It's very straightforward to keep them. And most of the farmers who are lucky now, and most of the landowners really, I think the message has got true to it. And an awful lot of them are leaving the hedges alone in from this period onwards, but they need to be left alone all the more. We shouldn't be, we've an urge to neaten things up. And anybody that's driving around, listen to this now, just glance out your window. And any hedges that you see around them, if you can see through those hedges, well then they're not worth a huge amount for wildlife. And that's something we shouldn't be just protecting our hedges by not cutting them. We should be enhancing our hedges as well. Because if you can see through it, yeah, the denser the better, and if you can see through it, well then the cat can see through it and cats decimate our birds as can the other predators. And it just won't be able to support a huge amount of wildlife. Our hedgerows, if there's dangerous roads and road safety, obviously they need to be managed then. But other than that, we should be leaving them alone and you should be cutting one side of your hedgerow one year at the top, another year, another side, another year and leaving it at that. So there'll only be one third of your hedgerow effectively cut each year and let them grow big and tall. We have a terrible tendency to cut them down to waist level and make them very nice. The ban doesn't apply to ordinary hedges that you'd have around the house, like to, you know, if you're doing a bit of gardening. Well, officially it does. Now nobody's going to come running into your garden chasing after you, but officially the ban is for all hedgerows and hedgerows to be left alone. So I certainly was trying to, my willow hedge, which is full of other things as well. It tends to grow incredibly fast. It gets about an extra two metres of growth and shoot out. So I was tending that myself a little while ago. We need to need things up. We need to be realistic about what we have. We need to manage what we have. However, we need to manage it for nature. So try and leave things alone. We've talked so many times on this show about leaving little corners, leaving little patches for nature about our birds and how they're doing and how they're struggling. And we will feed our birds quite happily. We will try and leave a corner out for our birds. We'll try and leave some fresh water out for our birds. But then what's the point in chopping the hedgerows as those birds rely on all the more if we're doing those kind of actions, you know? Okay. And speaking of managing things, a lot of farmers would set off a hill fire to manage some hill land. Not a good idea. I suppose not really a good idea any stage of the year because I was watching the news last week and there were firefighters out battling a gorge fire there. And I was thinking at this time of the year, normally something that we associate with, maybe during the summer when it's a lot drier and kind of, you know, in the back of my mind, I think, oh, maybe that started naturally, but all too often it's not. It's people trying to manage. Yeah, there's no such thing as natural fire in Ireland. And we know that. All you need to do is stand outside and feel the Atlantic on your face most of the time. If there's ever a fire in Ireland, somebody is set on purpose either maliciously or in some kind of aim of promoting growth for sheep or some kind of thing like that. But it's, again, it's a devastating practice. And that is something that Charlie McConnelog, our own minister, can address and his own Department of Agriculture. I don't necessarily blame landowners for that. Landowners get payments and they're directed by those payments and they don't have a huge amount of choice in that. But the Department of Agriculture and with Minister McConnelog at the head there, they could change that with a stroke of a pen if they wanted. The idea of setting fire to our mountains while still giving money to a curlew project and curlews breed up in those same mountains and then giving money to poetry and artistic projects lamenting the loss of the curlew and wondering about, and I've been listening to some of those recently. There's been some great projects and shows and songs and what's not on radio recently about the curlew and how much it used to mean to people. So government is paying for us to remember the curlew, it's paying for us to try and protect the curlew and it's paying some people to burn down the curlew's land. That makes no sense to me. And of course it threatens so much more than just the iconic curlews. But is there not a ban in place on burning gorse or is that just- No, there certainly is. There's a ban in place from now. In my own opinion, you shouldn't be allowed to burn those kind of things at all. There's different ways of managing land. But currently from the moment, yeah, they are banning them. And interestingly, there was some big fires set down in Kerry recently and people knew what they were doing and knew the time of year and it's been a very settled winter. I don't think they should be burning at all, but they could have burned earlier in the winter because it hasn't been a wet winter at all. But there was a strong response from government. They have sent out drones to try and survey the land, map the land, all the rest and there'll be all sorts of consequences for payments and whatnot. But it's just, it's an incredibly damaging thing to do. It makes no sense. Absolutely, for wildlife, for nature and I suppose for the environment as well. Air quality for the whole lot. Yeah, okay. All right, we've run, actually just before we go, there is a question that says, I have washed my backyard back door. Oh, I have to wash my yard and back door and carry a windscreen. Every day from bird droppings, how do I get rid of this daily plague without doing something drastic? Okay. It's difficult, but if you have a couple of good trees, birds will often tend to roost in them and I suppose I'd want to find out a bit more of what birds are there. Is it, do they have rucks and crows that are there or is it starlings that have passed through? Quite often you can get a huge number of starlings that might land in the bushes and shrubs and they can leave a bit of a mess orish but they would move on quite quickly whereas other nesting birds might stay a little bit. So I need to find out what kind of bird I suppose, you know. Finally, you're involved in the Trail Gazers project and that's coming up on Wednesday briefly. You're one of three talkers. The project just reminds me. Yeah, so the Trail Gazers project, it's the opposite of what we've been talking about, burning things and chopping hedges. The Trail Gazers project, as Johnny Goldstein to Council have been leading it, it's a cross European project and it's looking at developing trails but for the first time, what I've been excited about with this project is that they have been incorporating in, not just giving a nod to the environment but incorporating in the likes of National Parks, other people that are interested in the environment as well, to see how can they develop trails in a way that preserves, looks after biodiversity because one of our biggest assets for visitors and for ourselves living here in Donegal is our wonderful nature and we need to protect that and if we want to increase numbers and if we want to steer people one way or the other, we need to protect the nature that we're attracting them to effectively and the Trail Gazers project has been doing that very well. So they have a launch, their final launch, their wrap-up project or wrap-up event I suppose is on this Wednesday in Ungreen On Hotel by Inch Wildfile Reserve and it's on at 11 o'clock and it's free for everybody. Now you do need to register. If you look at Donegal County Council's website or I have it up on my own Facebook page there, you'll be able to register on it and there's a few interesting talkers. There's Jason Black who'll be giving a talk and launching their new tool kit which will help other people to develop trails killin but Lachlan from Wild Ireland will be talking at it and I'll be doing a little bit of that as well. Very good, 11 o'clock on Wednesday. Let me talk a little bit. Hey guys, thank you very much. John, thank you. Around the Northwest with Donegal