 Tamil Nadu Chief Minister M.K. Stalin recently spoke about the Dravidian model. But what exactly is the Dravidian model? Does it amount to welfareism? Is it feasible in a neoliberal economy with centralized federal structure? Professor Venkatesh Atreya talks about it in the context of the Tamil Nadu budget 2022-23 presented recently. Dravidian governments of both varieties. Is it they have all been generally very reluctant to devolve finances, functions and functionaries to elected local bodies? That continues. See, this is the contrast with Kerala, where Kerala hemmed in in many ways even more so than Tamil Nadu, especially with the disaster they had to face in a series of disasters since 2016 and especially COVID, which they handled quite brilliantly, I must say. They have had a long legacy of decentralization, democratic decentralization, inspired by Kerala's Amadri Pada. Now, of course, people's plan already about 20-odd years old and so there is a tradition in Kerala's political culture of devolution and contestation for resources at the local level. And that has stood them in good stead. It is because of just contestation for resources, it is also participation. So, they have participated actively in development issues, including handling of the pandemic in Tamil Nadu because we have not devolved, we have not encouraged the culture of decentralization. There is still a resistance to, of course, the elections held. Yeah, that is very similar to the union government, right? Yeah, but no, this government has held elections to both urban and rural local bodies to its credit. But that is different from the powers you vest them with and the resources you devolve to them. On both those counts, much more needs to be done. Some little has been done, but much more needs to be done. So, the other area where budget could have done better would have been to promote greater devolution of both finances and functionaries as well as functions to elected local bodies. So, what is this conflict that you are talking about in the Dravidian model? No, no. You see, the Dravidian model is supposed to foreground people's welfare, right? But to me, it has always seemed like what is being given the name Dravidian model, whether elements of it is very valuable, okay, social justice, fighting caste operation and so on. What is significantly missing is, of course, core land reforms. The followers of the Dravidian model say, well, there is no need for land reforms. We have, you know, social justice, reservations and all that. And we have the PDS and some welfare actions. I do not think that is quite adequate. And I think that especially since you have PDS and other welfare expenditures are critically dependent on what the Indian government does in terms of the sources that come to you. These make it precarious. So, it is important. The whole idea of land reforms was not just about as an economic measure. It was meant as a measure that would have broken caste hegemony and caste oppression in the countryside. One reason why you see that the oppression against Dalits has still remained an important part of the public discourse in Tamil Nadu continues. It takes some very severe forms, as in the case of inter-caste marriages, is that we have never had comprehensive land reforms. And this is something that the Dravidian model does not consider as being necessary. But that is what Dravidian model has explained by academics. Now, the CM had referred to a Dravidian model when talking about the victory of the DMK front in the local body elections. I do not know in what sense the finance minister has used the term Dravidian model. He has repeatedly alluded to it. But there is a, whatever one may think of the Dravidian model and its limitations as well as its strengths, there is obviously an inherent conflict between a purely neoliberal policy framework and a policy framework that seeks to address the welfare needs of the population through PDS and other state measures. So, there is a tension there. And it is not clear that Jagrajini has recognized that fully.