 In any case, we're back to the miscellaneous subjects that we love to discuss. It's essentially subjects that are more or less swept under the rug when it comes to the main Islamic dialogues and discussions in the community. And we're at this time joined by Saif Mohsin Shah. Assalamu alaikum. Assalamu alaikum. How are you doing? OK. Thank you. How are you? I'm good. Thank you for having me. And today's discussion is interesting because in the UK, this is quite a predominant issue within politics as well as the British society life as well. It's more or less about hunting or specifically fishing, for example. And a lot of people take for granted as fishing as being just a recreational thing that they'll do. But actually, is there an Islamic perspective on fishing? And then to a wide extent, hunting. I'm not sure of any Muslims in the community that actually go hunting, but perhaps it could be. Actually, definitely fishing. I know it definitely is an issue. But yeah, fishing. What do you think, Sarah? Yeah. And actually, the aspect of UK law, for instance, how does that impact fishing? You can't just go and pick any fish and things. Or I think trout has some sort of limitation. Are they preserved? I think so. I can't say for sure. But I know there was a fish I was hoping to get. So tell us. Tell us. It was something you could actually go and get. Yeah. So fishing and hunting, essentially for sport. Yes. Is it allowed or not? In the name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful. According to the laws of Sayyidina Sa'adah, our grand marja, hunting for other than food is not allowed. Especially if it's bringing harm to an animal. So in this country, there's always been an issue with fox hunting. Exactly. I myself, I'm not a supporter. It's actually really, really inhumane. So for something like that, it's not allowed in Islam. So what about fishing? Because fishing is also a sport. When a lot of people that go fishing, they'll catch the fish and they'll throw it back into the water. Yeah. This is not allowed simply because this is number one, play. And also that this is your causing harm for no reason whatsoever. There's no real purpose for you actually trying to catch that fish. It's animal cruelty really. Indeed it is. Unless it's for eating, you're not allowed to do that whatsoever. When actually catching the fish, now, you know, what fish is halal and which is haram, you know, we don't actually slaughter fish. So how does it actually work? The fish you're allowed to eat is the fish that was alive in the water. When you take it out, it dies. Okay. That fish is halal. Even if it's damaged a little bit, but it was alive when you took it out of the water, it's halal, it's allowed. Right. If the fish was dead in the water. So a lot of people want to throw in dynamite as we see sometimes people cheat. Okay. That and it kills the fish. Yeah. It's like rice to the haram. You can't eat that fish. Really? So the fish that die in the water, haram, you're not allowed to eat that. They have to be alive when you extract it from the water and that fish is halal. What if a certain fish was contaminated? Not that, obviously, if you eat that fish, something bad happens to you. But what if the fish that was brought out is alive, but it's contaminated with some sort of substance you can clean it off or not clean it off or maybe just risk it, not risk it. What happens then? That's fine. Would you risk it? I wouldn't. I know. I wouldn't. A bit of dirt, for example. I don't know. Something... I mean, you know, we hope, we hope that there's nothing inside of the fish. Yeah, you don't know. I mean, you don't know. I mean, when you cook the fish and you open it and you get to... You can see the meat. Now, that meat is contaminated or it's gone off or this fish, unfortunately, has been poisoned or something. Then, obviously, you don't really want to... Please don't eat it. I know. I think the Japanese are quite famous for having certain delicacies where the fish is very, very poisonous and you have to cook it in a certain way. Yeah, cut it in a certain way. I was going to say, actually, sushi things. You know, you get the sushi plates, but you don't actually know the origin of that fish, do you? So what would you say about eating things like that? Well, wouldn't they tell you if it's, for example, salmon or shrimp or something? Yeah, I would say... I actually never look... I just look at the sushi plate. Cod or trout or something like that, right? Going towards that. Okay, so one issue is with sushi is the meat cooked or not cooked. I mean, there's no really Islamic law to tell you to cook fish or not cook fish. You know, if it's edible and it's not going to cause you any harm. You're not allowed to eat it. Of course, you're not allowed to eat it. With sushi, there are certain fish which majority of the mirage have this ruling that you only eat fish with scales, okay? So, you know, your cod, your haddock... Trout. Trout. Salmon. Salmon. I'm a big fish eater, yeah. I'm a big fish eater, you know what I mean? I'm a telapia fan myself. Telapia. So, yeah, these fishes are allowed to be eaten. Okay, so let's just go back a bit. Okay, fish without scales that are actually halal. So, for example, things like shrimp. So, people would assume that people do categorise shrimp and prawns as shellfish. They put them in the same category as crab and lobster. And further investigation, we see that these prawns and shrimp, they don't actually have a shell. It's actually scales that they have. Oh. Yeah, so what we assume to be a shell and what we say and identify that this is the shell of this shrimp, it's not actually a shell, it's a hard shell that we have on crab and lobster. So, it's actually thin like a scale. So, the Maharaja have deemed this to be scales. And that's why you are allowed to consume shrimp and prawns, which are quite tasty actually. I didn't say so myself. We were saying that in terms of losing its scales, because obviously sometimes some fish will lose their scales. And they might give birth to fish without any scales. Indeed. According to Sadiq, half of Allah, he says that if the fish had a scale and the species of fish has scales originally and then lost the scales, that fish is still deemed halal. It's still allowed to be consumed. And if with this condition it has offspring, that also don't have scales because maybe it's genetically hereditary, which you've got passed on disease, you can eat that as well. That's not an issue. So, if it had scales and it was removed or they've lost the scales, that's fine. You can still eat the fish. And if that fish has offspring with the same condition, you are allowed to eat that fish as well. That's not a problem. That's really interesting actually. I think, I don't know how many people actually because it's a very good source of protein and health benefits aren't there? Is that why you have it? Or is it something you just prefer to eat a lot of? Fish. Good question. Because I'm... It's funny because I have this conversation with colleagues at work and my diet is very limited to either vegetables, cheese or fish. So when I go to a local Tesco or a local retailer, there's not much I can get and because fish is halal and it's a bit of a meat alternative, I'd often use that. But I think within culture it plays a massive role. I think there must be some hadith here and there that mentions fish to be something that's recommended to eat. I know within the Iraqi culture, on Wednesday, it's for me fish day. So I know that on Wednesday I'm going to have fish. I think here in England as well, Friday is fish and chips. Is it really? Every Friday you see canteens give fish and chips. But in terms of hadith, I mean we have loads of hadith that encourage healthy diet and fish being one of those. Do they actually name fish? It's fish by name, right? They'll actually say fish by name. I don't know how I'm ready. I'm sure it is. I've come across a hadith like that. I have to say the Iraq fish is just one of the best. There's a gulf. I think masala fish has a very, very... I don't know. competing stance. I keep getting told if you go to Baghdad there's a certain place and they pull it out, you choose it, and they barbecue it. The process is really, really cool because as I was saying you get to actually choose the fish that you want to eat. So when they do it, but that's when it gets a bit barbaric because I've actually seen them like smash their heads in. So they don't take it out, let it die? No, they take it out, they let it kind of just wiggle around for a bit and they'll just... So even when I go to the fish monger here I have to say to remove the head and tail because I don't want to be looking eyes in the oven, I just can't do it. Really? Yeah, I can't do it. That's one of the delicacies. No, I'll pass the one to you. No, not eye, as in for example the head of the fish. Yeah, the head, no. Other than there's a lot of benefits to brain, fish brain. No, I can't. That's just like, I'd rather just think it's a bit of protein than if you think it actually visualizes. The tail is amazing. No way. The tail, the head, the head, the thing is what I like about fish, especially if it's like grilled and there's a foil, that's what I was saying. It's great because there's certain parts of the head, if you get it right and you extract it properly, then it's really, really nice. It's unbelievable. I think it's a man thing, I don't know. But that's really interesting actually because I think a lot of people, we know about the scales, but I actually didn't personally know that if they genetically change, modify them and they lose their scales. I don't think that species, but that's actually permissible. So it's an interesting conversation to have to know that this is what the law says. Yeah, definitely. Look, I mean, that's a great point you're making. Actually, there's a question from Jalal in Manchester who was saying I'm a keen fisherman because I think Manchester is quite close to a place called Lake District, which has a lot of fishing outlets there. I'm a keen fisherman and go once a month to fish in local rivers and lakes. I'm not sure about the rules of fishing and what sort of fish I'm allowed to eat. Can you give me a simple format to follow? I think you did kind of touch upon the fact that you can't fish for sports because you're causing harm to the fish, but you can fish to eat. Can you delve into that a bit more? Because a lot of people, it's a recreation for them. They're not really seeing it as harming them because they're just taking it out and then they're not dead and then you put them back in themselves. I mean, I understand that. The other thing is that this is considered play and there's no real benefit to what you're doing. Unless you're technically practising for hunting and then you keep the kill that you've actually hunted. But what about the people that do fishing for tranquility, peace? That's the kind of a place where people can actually go and switch off. It's quite mindless, isn't it? As a form of meditation, you mean? Not necessarily meditation, but... Just to find some peace? Yeah, exactly. People kind of... The lake is nice to be honest with you. Yes, it is, but you're still causing harm to the fish. You're technically playing with their life. You take them out. How would you feel? How would you like it if someone strangled you and you couldn't breathe? And then they let you go and you could breathe again and then strangled you. And there was, I'll find peace and tranquility in this. Yeah, we've got to think about it as well. That is quite an example. No, it's true. If someone lured you with a bit of meat and then you're like, oh, what's this, what's this, what's this? Grab the meat. The apparatus isn't created to be fed. They're animals that you're saying, unless it's to eat, we can't fish, but that's their purpose in a way. Yeah, but they still have... It's not like I've been strangled. They still have rights. Yes, of course. I'm not saying they don't, but... We should be playing with life like this. No, but what you're saying in terms of finding peace and tranquility, you can find peace and tranquility because you can sit on the boat and lake, or you can sit on the lake. It's fine. You don't actually have to physically bring a fish out. Or you can just mimic the act. Indeed. So you have your son sat there saying, sorry, you can't pick the fish. I'll say Jalal, just keep all the fish that you catch and... Sell them. Sell them or eat them. Keep them in the freezer. But then he would say, which type of fish can I... Well, like we said, depending on the margin you follow, the majority of them I would say fish with scales. So, you know... Pick your fish. Mr. Father here has a whole list that he can tell us about the fish, but yeah. Salmon is very healthy apparently, so fish that are streamed upstream. Now is good time as well for salmon. Yeah. Have you been fishing? You're not going now. No, no, no. It's all gone. So it's actually Haram then? Yeah. Wow. Because someone asked me to go fishing one time. I wanted to, but then I thought I didn't get the time. But actually thinking about it maybe is... And this is for eating? No, no. Well... Wow. Okay. I think that's... No fishing for you Ali? Yeah, I think that's a good place to end. No worries. The conclusion, ladies and gentlemen, is that fishing for sport all types of fish with scales is halal to eat according to most noraja and I'm not allowed to fish. No. That was the main conclusion there that I'm not allowed to fish. Oh and dead fish in the water do not touch. Dead fish in the water do not touch as well. So we'll leave on that note during the last one. No. Have a great day. Say it, really appreciate your time once again. Thank you very much. And we will see you on the next episode, ladies and gentlemen, the viewers of Manfred St. TV and morning. Thank you.