 Sadhguru, we're here in Davos on the banks of the beautiful stunning scenic Davos lake. But my thoughts go to the spiritual health of the country at this time. I want to ask you, as one of India's leading spiritual leaders, what's your sense of the overall spiritual health of our country at this time? Spiritual health, see the strength of this nation has always been, the USP of this nation has always been, we have been a land of seekers. But today, not just today, in the last couple of hundred years or three, four hundred years, slowly it has moved this way that because of strong religious manifestations, everybody is trying to be belonging to some religion. This is a nation where nobody belonged to any religion at one time. Everybody is a seeker. In the same house, all kinds of practices will happen. Different kinds of gods will exist in the same house. At different times in their life, they chain their gods. Everything was allowed because people were in pursuit. They are seekers, they are not believers. Slowly belief system is taking over. But that doesn't mean it is happening in, you know, really across the board. Spiritual process is also on like never before. Today, across the globe, we are touching over one billion people, just me. There are so many other people who are doing similar things. One billion people are watching our videos. At least minimum three videos, one billion people plus have watched. You know, I asked you this question, Sadhguru, in the context of the student protests that we are seeing. And I was very intrigued by the position that you've taken on the Citizenship Amendment Act when you came in and said that a lot of these protests were misdirected. Why do you feel this way, Sadhguru? I'm not saying this. Have you read the Citizenship Act? I have. You have read. Tell me against whom is it? Is it targeted against somebody? It's against the idea of India which says that we look at all religions as being equal. And if we look at persecution, we should ideally look at persecution regardless of which religion the persecuted person belongs to. Don't you agree, Sadhguru? See, we are talking about minority persecution, not religious persecution. In a adjacent country, not in our country. This has got nothing to do with the constitution of India as it applies to Indians. This has got something to do with people who are left behind during the partition time. They stayed back thinking they can live well there also. Nobody really understood these two nations will become so separate. Nobody understood what this line is. So those people who got stuck there and they've been persecuted for them who are already here for ten, fifteen years and they don't have anything. They don't have an identity. You're just trying to give them an identity. You're not welcoming new people. No, no, no, I want you to state this. You have read the Act. Tell me, is it against any Indian citizen? No, but here's the point. Please tell me that no properly. Yes, I'll explain. Should it not be about minority persecution regardless of religion? Why should it be that if you're Hindu, if you're Sikh, if you're Christian and persecuted you're welcome to India, but if you're Muslim then you're not. And especially from a spiritual guru like you. No, no, this is a completely wrong way you are looking at it. You want controversy right now on your camera. That's all I see. Okay, please don't do this because this is about the nation. Right now, this is minority persecution means religious minority because they are theocratic states. They are not secular nations. They are theocratic states and there is a certain level of persecution for all of them. So all those who are persecuted are one time. It's a one time pardon, okay? Because they're already here. After 2014 you cannot come. They're already here. Now what you're saying is why can't everybody come? Those who are persecuted. No, no, are you short of population in the country? Are you short of population in our country? We don't need anybody. Hindu, Sikh, Christian, nobody we need to have. But they're already here with us without an identity. That is all it is about. So if you want to make a issue out of it because you like a controversy you can make it. But I'm just honestly saying as far as I can see, it doesn't affect any Indian citizen. But I'm seeing on the television cameras, this poor Muslim woman, a young woman in her twenties with a child, some TV anchor shouts the microphone and asks, what is this? She's saying, we are all Bharat Wasis just because we are Muslims. Why our citizenship is being taken away? But the anchor doesn't make any effort to correct her and say, this is not true, your citizenship will not go. He doesn't say that. He just enjoys the controversy. Why are you guys doing this? Is it true that young Muslim woman will lose her citizenship? Of course not. Then why are we doing this? But what do you make of the fear? There is a sense of palpable fear of seeing what's happening at Shaheen Bagh. See the failure, that is because of the kind of things that have been communicated. Government has definitely failed in its ability to communicate the idea, okay? What is simply for somebody else nothing to do with you, your protesting thinking it's against you, but somebody obviously communicated it this way, right? And you are also trying to say the same thing now. Don't say this. This is not about Hindu Muslim. This is about the nation. This is not at all about the Hindu Muslim because it is not concerned with the Hindus in the country or Muslims in the country. This is about people who are already in the country from another nation without any identity. You just trying to give them one-time identity. You spoke of how the government failed in its communication. Where do you think they hurt? How should this matter have been handled? Probably such a benign issue, they never thought this will be organized this way. It is definitely a lapse. No question about it. It is a failure. Unfortunately, right now Indian states are here. Karnataka is here and Madhya Pradesh is here seeking investments and stuff. Tell me, right now if you want India's economy to explode into growth, the most important thing is external investments. We are looking at two trillion dollar investments. Who will invest their money in a place where buses are burning on the street? All of you guys just enjoyed this, unfortunately. Please don't do this. Buses are burning on the street. First of all, buses don't belong to the government. Buses belong to us. Why are you burning it? It's our money. And who will come and invest in our nation when buses are burning? Why don't you tell the people clearly this is not about you, this is about somebody else. So why do you think these students are protesting? One is you spoke about the Muslims protesting. There are lots of young students from IIT, IIM, all kinds of colleges and universities. Initially it happened. I don't think they're continuing to protest because I think they all realized some are protesting about fee hike, some are protesting against police atrocity, whatever, whatever. Those are different issues. I don't want to get into all that. These are law and order issues. Don't make it into a national issue. It is not. Local issues, local sub-inspectors and DSPs should handle. For everything you want to make a national kind of a crisis, it is not. But people are hurt. Some people are feeling insecure. Please reassure them there is no danger to your citizenship. It's very, very important. Indian citizen, whatever, whatever religion you have or you have no religion like me, all of us are safe because this is not about, CAA is not about us. It's about a few people who come from outside and living in our country without any human identity. What's the way to heal? What's the path to heal? Please sir, all of you, media should speak. I'm asking why is this anchor pushing the microphone in her face and when she fears and she's crying. She's genuine. Her fear is genuine. That young Muslim woman is genuinely crying out of fear that my citizenship will be taken away. There's a law like that. Why can't you say that's not true? You won't say that because you want the drama to go on. Why? Would you say there's a need for greater communication as well? Definitely. They're just sitting at Shaheen Bagh for members of government, ruling party to go out, speak to them, assuage their feelings and concerns. Definitely. Whatever needs to be done has to be done to tell the citizens of India irrespective of what you've… what I practice is not government's business, first of all. See, when it comes to communication of an idea, when wrong communication happens by vested interests, whoever did that, I don't want to go into that detail. Isn't it the responsibility of every citizen, particularly media, that this is not true? Has any media come out clearly and said, this is not true? Don't get excited about this. No? Do you think that a lot of the apprehensions were also created because senior ministers initially linked the NRC and the CAA? Possible. Therefore, you know, a lot of this is not necessarily media creation. There's so many different comments in parliament, statements on media. I agree with that. I agree with that. Some… some people gloated about it. How are we going to hit you with this? Because even they did not understand what the policy is about, what the law is about. So, some people gloated about it. Some people misused it. All this has happened. But let's understand, we as a nation, we still have four hundred million people who have not eaten properly. What is our responsibility for them? We need investments to grow. You will not get any investment from anywhere when you show pictures of burning buses on the streets. I don't want to invest my money in a place where things burn. Who wants to do it? You've been here at Davos. What's the bus that you picked up about India? These burning buses, social unrest, has that been because we spoke to Kamal Nair? Everybody… everybody is excited about India's possibilities. At the same time, this question has come up to me again and again. What about the civil unrest? People asking you about it. Yes, yes. What are they asking you, sir? The same thing. Is it really in control? Is Narendra Modi's government in control of what's happening in the country? I said it very much is because they're young people, they don't want to deal with them harshly. Things are happening, whatever. I am not… I'm not a spokesperson of the government, but I'm definitely speaking for the nation. I'm saying if there is something with disagree, there are places to debate. There is a parliament to do that. If parliament is not good enough, we can set up various debates, media platforms are waiting for debate always. Debates are possible. Why burn the buses and create this visual which completely puts the country backwards in a negative picture? Do you believe it's a bit of a wasted opportunity? At a time when 400 million people still don't have food to go into their mouths, this whole focus on very divisive issues. Is that in some sense is a wasted opportunity? No. How… one way of looking at this is, see there are contentious issues in the country. Sir. If you don't have the courage to deal with them, then you cannot make the economy grow. So putting them aside quickly and focusing on economy is a wise thing for any government to do. But people should also understand and participate. We must understand right now, India's only and only focus should be, doesn't matter who is in the government. Whoever people elect will be in the government. People think I'm supporting one party. This is going on all over the social media. No. I'm working with AIDMK in Tamil Nadu. I was working very closely with Chandrababha Naidu. I was working in… I'm working in Telangana with very closely with the governments. I'm working with Kerala with the communist government. My thing is I value democracy. If people elect whoever they elect, I'm willing to work with them. You know, you… You elect somebody. Within eight months you say, I want to change. What is that? You make this point. I'm very curious to know your view on the current dispensation because when you made those comments and see a lot of people came out and you would have seen this sub-guru and they labeled you a Modi Bhakt. They said, here's Modi's fan, Modi Bhakt. He's a spiritual guru but see what position… See, I'm telling you this. Now I'm asking you this question once again. Is it genuine that this CAA… CAA is aimed against a particular community? Is it so? Well, it excludes members of one community from seeking citizenship in India if they are persecuted in their own countries. Not true. Anybody can seek citizenship in India. The only thing is people who are already here and block certain people are coming in. Rest can come through normal process. I come from a Sikh family in our Gurudwara's. You come in and you eat langar no matter who you are. We don't check whether you're Hindu, Muslim, Sikh, Christian… Let's talk practical things. We have just partitioned about seventy-two years ago. On what basis? Unfortunately on religious basis. It should not have happened. We did it for whatever reasons. At that time that was our wisdom. Today people who are left behind, who did not, who thought they will be okay that side and now they are not okay. Not okay means as I pointed out in my video, marriage was not legal. Hindu marriage was not legal till 2017. Now the people who are talking about this is, oh till 2017 they corrected it. What about 1948 to 2017? Your marriage is not legal. Do you know what that means? No, but what's your counter on Ahmadiyya's, Hazara's who have persecuted minorities in their countries but persecuted nonetheless because of their faith and belief? See, do you have enough population in your country? Sure, of course. More than enough? Yes. Or too much? Yes. You have too much population. Do you want to have fifty percent of Pakistan back in the country because economically they are not doing well? Small minority. No, no, because economic minorities will come. Okay. We cannot welcome, we cannot afford to. We cannot afford to bring anybody. Even if they are Hindu you can't afford to bring them. We are only talking about, this law is only talking about those who are already inside. What do you want to do? Where do you throw them? You, they won't take it back. Take them back. No, these people can go back. They have nothing left there. What will you do with them? What kind of logic is this? You spoke about too many people already. Does that indicate that you would strongly back a population control law? Is that something? One hundred percent. I am the only one for last twenty-five years talking about it and being popular with every religion. Hindu, Muslim, Christian everybody hates me because I'm saying first of all control your populations because we are too many people for the land that we have. You think they should be, we two are our people. See life. See you can, in a democratic country you cannot control forcefully but by incentives you can control. You can incentivize those who consciously decide certain things. Incentivization has to be there. Otherwise it will, nature will take care of you. See if you don't do it consciously nature will do it in a very cruel way. So you sidestep my question on responding to critics who are labeling you as Modibal. See there are, see you are a journalist. Yes. Your name is on. Yes. All right? Your face is on, your name is on. There are a whole lot of them who are anonymous journalists. They can say whatever they want to say. See if I say something, if there is a lacuna in what I have said please point it out to me. You talk about my mother, my wife. You're not only illiterate, you're also uncivilized. That's all I can see. As we come to the end of this interview. Now I'm asking what kind of people will attack the woman in your home. No, it's not fair. It's not right. It's not right. Because you're uncivilized. That's all it is. It's not right. What do they have to say about them? They can have a view on the positions you're taking but to attack some of these family member is totally not right. That's all that's happening. Has anybody pointed out what's wrong with what I have said? Has anybody done it? Can you do it to me? No. Because there's nothing wrong. You just don't like it. If you don't like me, it's for your problem. What can I do? You just soak in your own bile, I don't. I'm fine. You can say whatever you want. I'm in a place where nobody's opinion does anything to me and never ever I have identified with any political ideology or party. My only thing is if people choose somebody, I support them for five years. After that if you choose somebody else, I'll support them for the next five years because I value democracy. If you think democracy is nothing, your opinion is everything, I'm sorry I'm not with you. Sadhguru, as we come to the end of this interview, which is just a beautiful setting here along the Dava Slick, I want to get you to tell all those who are watching a bit about the mindfulness retreat, the sessions that you're doing over here in these very, very stressful times. What's your… These are not stressful times. Of course. Everyone in different ways. No, no. Times are not stressful. Individual people can be stressful if they wish to be. I am not stressful. Okay. So what's your message for the youth in terms of keeping their sanity, the heads on their shoulders and not getting swayed by all the busy around? So we need to understand this. If you want to create a quality society, a quality nation and a quality world society, the most important thing is you create quality human beings. If you don't do any work on quality human beings and then you think they'll be a fantastic world, those who talk about your mother and wife for every small thing, how do you create a quality world with these people? Unfortunately, they are minority, okay? If that becomes majority, you'll have to leave this world. Fortunately, they are minority. Here, I'm saying in the economic forum, in a business place, they're dedicating half a day for a retreat, okay? This is because they understand without creating quality human beings, there is no quality world. A good human being is a good world. You've spoken as you always do from the heart. We leave it to those who are watching to decide what they think of this. Satguru, for joining us. Thank you so much. Thank you.