 Time to talk about one main sport, that is athletics and joining me is athletics consultant John Vaseline to talk about WAVE forward regarding doping in Kenya which is ravaging the country as we speak now of 300 athletes have been banned for consumption of banned substances Following information coming from athletics integrity unit Kutu see you John, how are you doing man? It's been long. Long man. You're keeping well bro? Good. You look like. Yeah, no worries. Kuma kawoka but we can't complain. Yeah, we always thank God, right? So what's happening bana? You know athletics has put Kenya on an international map as we speak. Elliot Kipchoga has done what he has done regarding representing our brand on the global scene. But you see doping seems like it wanna assassinate and erase the gains we've made in athletics. A lot, a lot, a lot. It's scary man. And things are not good on our end. Right now even it's hard to celebrate a win. Yes. And even you saw the two races, that major races that have just happened. You saw the Chicago and the London. Even taking our people there has become a problem now. You find in one race we are having one runner, one Kenyan runner. Even race organizers now are afraid of inviting our people. So going forward we might not even be meeting eligibility requirements to participate in those. It's terrible. It's really terrible right now. And I was talking to one of the officials at AK is we suspend ourselves. I think right now we need to suspend ourselves and put our house in order. Otherwise the beautiful name it's going to go to. We will be valueless at the moment because people now, everyone, whoever is winning in race, that question mark is it for you? Are you using something? It's good that people are being exposed, one thing. But again it's going to be costly for the nation. If we suspend ourselves, we have thousands and thousands of runners right now who are toiling up and down every single day waking up at 4 a.m. to do their long runs, to do their morning runs and even evening runs. So it will be very costly. This one will also, again, the impact it will cause, this psychological effect that it will cause to some of them they might quit. But we are lucky I think maybe few athletes are holding us right now. But otherwise where we are we are not safe. We are the lowest at the moment because so far this year alone we have more than now 31 athletes who have been suspended and there is one that is on the line again coming. Actually it's over 30, not over 300 like I had made initially. Yeah, 300 may hold some day. But on the month right now we are doing 31. I think Mando Chuzu will have another athlete who is on the pipeline that is coming. You guys as insiders you always speculate even though it's coming. We get in for, we get in for. We know people who have run away from camps. We know those who are hiding. We know those who are bribing their way out. So we have information but it's just that we want the relevant authority or the right authority to release the names. But otherwise we could be writing stories. That's our passion. For a journalist the headline matters most. So if you can get the first hand information why not. But we tend because it's so sensitive information or sensitive thing that is touching on a lot of people and individuals then you have just to lay back and let it come. But let them be exposed. It's ignorance and you know precious all over. Precious all over. One is quick money. We're running on the road is quick money. You run 42 km. You have millions, few millions in your pockets. And you will find the precious on management. Managers they want you to run. They want you to be in every race. They are pre-programmed you for everything that you have to do. So there's a lot of precious. We're putting again the same precious being put on an athlete. So an athlete has to do whatever he or she can to remain fit or good in what he or she is going to do or anticipating to do. So it's not just a one man game. That's what I was thinking is we need as the managements they need to be held accountable because the name is going. The government has to come back big. And I think the minister now the new CS he needs to reign on those camps. I think it's high time we close everything that is called a camp in Kenya. We just start afresh. I can't like Russia has pointed its reputation in terms of you know doping and at some point they are not getting allowed and not being eligible to take part in world athletic sanctioned championships. And is Kenya following suit? Ya I think so. If something is not taken up immediately I don't think we will last a month. We will be suspended by world athletics and it's going to be costly and it will be heavy on us and we will lose a lot because we get a lot from running. There's a lot of investment from running. We have many countries that are best here in the country that have athletes or have taken our athletes to run for their country. It's going to be costly on our country and costly on the individuals who have put their livelihoods on running and their families and the extended family and the nation at large because of the investment the huge investment that they are making in the country. So it will not be a one-man show. It's like they say what happened to footy ball. You know people thought it was a one-man show. Football employs millions indirectly. So it will affect that's the impact that it will cost world athletics. Talk to us about dynamics of doping. Not many of us understand the intrigues and intricacies of doping as a monster rocking athletics not only in Kenya but even on the international scene. When is somebody said to have doped? When he has taken something that has been prohibited. Sometimes we are told that you never disclosed details. You need to. Even leave unknown the whereabouts and at least there is a system that they have that runs world athletics. So for instance if an athlete is right here in Nairobi and tomorrow or the day after tomorrow he is going to eldorate. He has to update the system the whereabouts. So he tells the system he has to say okay from tomorrow to 13th I will be eldorate so that the DO's those are the doping officers. If they are in eldorate they are able to reach you. You see so the doping officers they have been placed in every corner of this country wherever there is a run or an athlete. They are called DO's. DO's in short doping officer. So those are the people that come in they come to test you anytime that they want anytime they feel they don't tell you. That was why there was an issue with Asbel and I still stand with Asbel up to today. Asbel Kipro. Asbel Kipro because they was vindicated. Ya ya he was but you know that guy suffered a lot you see but there is nowhere that he will take anyone because people were involved. There was bribery, there was impesa transaction and all sorts and then there was information that he was informed early on that people are coming. You see all those they come the intrigues behind that suspension or this doping ban. It really brought a lot of discussion. So when an athlete there are medicines maybe you are sick. Yes. If you are sick there are prescriptions that a doctor prescribes to you. You might take it's allowed for you to take any medicine. The only thing that this athletics integrity unit wants you to say to do is to tell them into the system. Tell them I'm from the doctor. The doctor has given me A, B, C, D. They want to see those medicines so that they see now where they will advise you now. You have taken these medicines and these are prohibited medicine. When courage you now you will not participate in this time of race until this medicine is out of your system. So once they have told you that and you violate and participate Yes. That means That one you have gone against the rules of the game because you have a pain back you remember the Komanyalas issue he had a pain back and he took that medicine but he said you see you have to disclose the type of medicine you have taken because if it's among those and then when you go to the doctor again you have to go with the list of those medicines that have been prohibited. You have to tell the doctor this one it's on the list of banned medicines so the doctor himself or herself knows there is an alternative of this medicine but if you don't disclose that information then I will come on you and when they come they come hard because for them they want a clean spot they want you to run with your own energy not an aided energy So you are talking to us about disclosing your location and where about so where you are before wherever you go what is the significance of the same because you might be in their plan for testing you might want maybe to come at your place at 4 a.m. to take the urine sample you must be there so when they knock they find you in the house if they don't find you and then the system indicated you will be here at KBC then you are wrong that's a mist and then they only give you three times and then if you are genuinely you are genuinely at lead doping tests because they don't just burn you for once they give you duration you have a hole here so once you miss three times something is suspicious why do you run away three times you know one time you can say maybe you had an emergency we understand they are human beings the second time they still understand you but when you miss the third time then there is an issue because in the system indicated KBC those people they will come at 4 a.m. waiting for you to wake up when you wake up the first thing they want is your urine when you wake up they want medicine and then there are two types of again testing there is in competition testing and out of competition testing look for example this guy Maria Kipserem who was banned recently I think a day ago this guy just came out came back to because he had in January in February he had an accident he rolled his cow while taking going to pick the school kids so he was out of competition for almost 6-7 months then the guy is coming back and then the guy is going to take and then he took an IPO not just any other and IPO is an injection you know this one you cannot light once and then come you defend yourself that oh CG I took it I wanted to put it they put it in water no so there is no way he did it he knew what he was doing you know when you are a professional athlete and you have been in the game for more than 10 years there is no excuse about that go lie to children or go tell those people who don't understand the rules of the game but as an athlete it was meaning a game even right now as we talk young kids or young upcoming athletes are being taken through the doping processes but my question is this you know Adak is being funded and a lot of people came on my back even some were saying this I should not come here you cannot deny me a chance to come to your office if I have an issue because it's a public office you are being employed by the government we need to tell these things because for instance you look at the team that went to Oregon look at the team that went to again to Birmingham you see an athlete has left Kenya today an athlete is going to rest in the next 2 days you know an athlete reaches there in the eve of the rest you are being tested there are particulars that are found in your blood then something is wrong with the doping systems because if you cannot detect something that is being going to be detected in the next 3 days then why are our systems working are we having apparatus that are not up to the standard it is our fault and for me and that blame goes to Adak they are the ones who are mandated to do the testing here you have a team that has been in a camp for one month then you want to tell me this team an athlete has been flown from Kenya to Birmingham when you reach Birmingham infact it was a very huge embarrassment because we had 3 2 ladies who were suspended they could not run for a marathon they denied chances for people who are eligible here but the Adak officer official was asked what really happened with these athletes they say they are sensitive it is upon you you have failed and the best thing to do you know what you saw recently the prime minister for breathing she stepped aside for a very minor thing I think the whole house of Adak should go home that's John Vasling declaring that Adak and doping agents of Kenya should go home the top leadership has failed the country because for one year from January till today we have 31 athletes who have failed the doping test we have those that they were directly involved when they were announcing the team to go for world championship and the team to go to Birmingham they were involved directly because they were with these guys for almost a whole month when they come they need to take responsibility and the only thing is this I will pray and I will push so that that house they should be swept home because they have failed us they either tell us the things they are using they are not working those are the only things we will or they need more funding so that they can be empowered more but at the moment 30 athletes 2 athletes have been doping Whom are they supposed to be working in partnership with to ensure that their equipments are not faulty and are delivering genuine results is it word and doping agents? Ya they get I think a lot of funding from them even A.I.U. they attend recently and someone was telling me that there are some a few individuals who are big names in Kenyan Athletics Fraternity who might have also doped but the information has not been declared publicly you know is that close to the truth? it's almost close to the truth there is nothing you can deny there and one thing for sure that I know is they are calculates who work with those officials they are officials who work with and then they are doping I have like around 6 officials officials other officials who even do they threaten athletes you wait for a wrestling standard chart that is coming on 30th of this month you know when standard comes the doping process is so unique because they just pick randomly they don't pick number 1, 2, 3, 4 to go to be tested they will pick maybe number 1 they can pick number 6 or 7 they pick randomly it's not that they take those podium people so they pick randomly so when you go to fill that form of doping you are giving your personal details on that you are giving your ID number you are giving your phone number where you come from and then the position that you took on that test so these people have your data if you are not in the assisting forest because Kenya is talented you have so many athletes who will come so they have something to take home you see that's the very first time they are getting your number or they are getting your details into their system so they have to take the details so they have even the contact number for these athletes so for instance maybe you took number 2 position you were tested your test came negative these guys still call you tell you you know we have found something in your blood you see what they do those are the threats these people do so they know this guy has 1.5 million so they are telling this young man 500 Lasmut it is bad it is bad what are you trying to tell that young man that one you are destroying the life of that young man because this young man doesn't know even what doping is they are clueless about it he is clueless about it this is the first time he is coming into the system you are taking his blood for the first time and you are crying to this young man that we have some issues with your blood they want money that's what I'm saying the simplest thing we can do at the moment the simplest thing we can do at the moment is one the top leadership of RADAC they have failed the country then two all camps should be closed at the moment so that they start doing everything afresh three all the agents that are here in Kenya and who have many athletes they should be called back so that they are questioned why are you at least failing if you look at all these top names they are coming from one management camp although now the other camp is also now the effects because if you see this guy called Kacharan if you see the recently they are coming from global so again the camping and all that the other camps are also coming into into the public that doping now is even not in the same camp as we are looking at it but now it's all over and it is terrible John Vaslin was latest consultant and of course giving his fantastic insights and quality conversation it's been though brief but well educative and informative regarding doping in the country which is ravaging Kenyan athletics scene and the way forward thank you for joining us and it's been a pleasure doing this with you obviously every Saturday same time, same place very good afternoon and good place