 I was doing the rapper impersonation and stuff like that. And I remember, I really said, you know what, nah, I want to try to become an artist and stuff like that. So I stopped that all together, right? And of course, I had to go through the loss of followers. I think I lost like 40,000 followers in one summer type. And you know, I'm thinking like, okay, if this is where I want it to go, I have to fine tune it along the journey. I have to think about the steps before I even get there. So it's just not like, I'm moving without a plan because moving without a plan, that's how you dig yourself too deep. What's up? What's up? What's up? I'm Brayman, Sean. And I'm Colbert. And we are back with another episode of No Labels Necessary. You can catch us every Tuesday, every Thursday on Apple Music Spotify, YouTube, whatever you stream, your podcast, giving you information at the center of content, music, money, the artists, the entrepreneurs. We like to bring that information together because people try to rip artists off but y'all can make money too, baby. Now, this is No Labels Necessary and we got somebody today who represents that perfectly, No Labels because the way he's moving. We love to have people like Iso Kenny, who is with us today. What's up, Iso? I appreciate you being here. Yo, what's up? What's up? I appreciate you guys for having me on the platform. As I always say, you guys just give the best gems in a game to really tap into the secrets, the hidden things in the music industry that artists should really be paying attention to and really just understanding, like, yo, No Labels Necessary for us. So, yeah, for sure. Amen. I appreciate that. Like, first of all, this dude has over 20 million streams on a song called Speak Up that took off. He has millions of streams on multiple other songs. Like, we can get to some of them other songs. He's gonna be able to me, you are doing the best I've seen in terms of having a social media brand, like building with content, but like hardcore meme content, not just like I'm a personality, but figuring out a way to translate that into music in a way that people are taking you seriously. So we're gonna get into them gems, man, and get into how you go throughout your process because I think it's gonna be useful for people. But let's start with Speak Up, man. When you created that song, like, where did it come from? What was it about? That's a great question. Where did it come from? So, you know, when I made Speak Up, I was honestly in a very unique place in my career, you know, physically, like literally, because I made that song while I was in a cast, you know, I was in a cast, just in a crib cooking up, you know, and it was just really honestly, one of those Saturdays where it's just like, you know, like, I had to pump out this content, you know, like, take time, not the algorithm, not really going crazy right now. I need someone that's gonna wake it up. So when I made that beat, when I wrote the song, and for one, when I instantly heard the beat, I knew, okay, this something, something instantly drew me to it. And that's kind of how, like, you know, I make my song. I really pay attention to the beats, because I know that's, honestly, I feel like that's the main determining factor that allows a song to go crazy or not. So I made the beat, you know, instantly within the first vibe, I don't know what it was, because I already had the idea of, oh yeah, when your homie mom was on the beat for a minute, but I was like, I feel like this is the perfect time to release it. So I find the beat, I start, you know, just kind of freestyle into it. I'm like, okay, this has something. It's just definitely go something, like it could go crazy. So I start writing to it, getting the studio. And it just, it was one of those things that just flew like naturally to me. And then I just remember posting it on TikTok. What made me realize that it was going crazy was, I'd say probably within like the first 30 minutes, it had already like 50,000 views. And I know like, you know, in terms of TikTok, I was like, oh, guys, it's traction. But I'm the type of person where I don't like to be glued to the social media screen. I don't like to, you know, like, yo, like track down the views and all of that. So I said, I'm gonna put the phone down and I'm gonna just check the next day, see what's up with this, see what's up with this, that and stuff like that. So check the next day. I see it's already at 2.2 million views. I'm like, okay, we got one here. We got one here. But then what really made me realize that, you know, this could actually have like a life for a minute was when I clicked on the sound and I realized within the first day already, a hundred videos were made to it, you know. So then I'm like, okay, that's interesting. So I wait a couple of days, I'm going back to it. I'm knowing, okay, you know, this is going crazy. It's going from hundreds to thousands. And I'm seeing it go through a series of trends, you know, I'm seeing it go through at first, like, you know, a car trend of people showing off their nice cars. It was like just, it flourished well in the car world. And then it transitions to, you know, sports highlights, people showing, you know, their basketball skills are just training and stuff. And then I noticed what really gave it that life was when, you know, I clicked on a sound and a girl used it and she was pretty much calling out, like, you know, lies, like speak up, say what you really want to say. And then that really gravitated to other females using the sound and it just went crazy from there for a, for a, yeah. So you didn't do any kind of like push on that side, trying to encourage the trend. This was one of those true organic moments, right? It was one of those true organic moments and things that I really did though, honestly, was, okay. Cause I was in a situation where, you know, I was in a label deal, right? I was in a label deal and it was a tough situation, right? And this is just for, this is for honest transparency, you know, just really even giving game to the artist, right? So I was in a label deal where, you know, I had to fulfill the six months of a hold back period cause, you know, in certain label deals, once you fulfill the commitment, you have six months left in the deal, right? So I was in a situation where, you know, I'm holding the song, I'm like, damn, like, hmm. I know I'm in this hold back period of a deal. If I drop this song, I know they're probably gonna try to, you know, come after me, take the song down, whatever. Or I could just be like, damn, like, I don't know what to do. So ended up having to, I dropped it on my own for me, dropped it on my own because I knew the traction. This is a moment, two weeks after, I probably waited two weeks to drop the song because I was just in that dilemma. So I dropped the song individually through DistroKid, you know, and then, you know, it's going crazy. And then what I say, labels come like, yo, hey man, you can't really drop it on your own. We got to acquire this song. It's like, you feel me, you can't do that. So that was literally a defining moment of my career, like, okay, do I give them the song, you know, or do I just take it down? Cause they're just gonna, you feel me like, try to enforce it to take it down. They don't want to, you feel me, trying to see me going for over a road. But I was like, okay, let me look at the pros and cons of this. You know, me dropping this song, you know, it can be good for a sense of, you know, getting the eyes on me that I need, or, you know, even just generating the revenue and stuff like that. So I went through with that, you know, they acquired it, dropped it in, really doing much on the marketing side, you know, cause I didn't really want them to spend money on like the budgeting and all that. I just, you know, how like recouping and stuff like that goes. And that's how they keep you in the old. So I said, I think this has a really a life without even, you know, pumping the gas. And I didn't really trust that they could really take it to the next level, honestly. So just let it do, do what it do. It just went crazy. And I definitely feel like it was the right decision in the long run. Cause luckily, you know, I am out that deal as of like last year, you know, so now I'm just in the process of really getting a chance to really foster the brand, foster the ISO versus foster what I'm doing. So yeah, that's where I'm at now, honestly. Man, I love that because, well, I don't think a lot of artists really are aware of like that, that whole back period when you're done, you deliver, you don't have to do that. So one, just hearing you touch on that. So people can kind of see what some of the psychology can be and why it's, even if you're technically done, you still are, you know, kind of locked down and chained down. But like, I think leaning in still getting the visibility but making that move of saying, hey yo, like I don't want you to put money in behind it. Like that's a chess move. That is a chess move, bro. Chess move. People don't even know what to, like, you know, just because people spend money don't mean they're gonna spend it right too. So I think that's part of, it probably sound like you were like, all right, if you were confident, it would have like went super crazy if Lenny got, he might have done it but it sound like you didn't even really have confidence. Maybe based on what you had seen before that the song could have like, it wouldn't have been spending the right way anyway. Right, yeah, exactly. Cause I'm not really, cause based on things in the past, you know, I've had other moments, you know, that really could have went crazy. And I just felt like, you know, you know, the label is what they didn't really know how to really make a life out of those moments. You know, it was just okay. You had the influence, I had the influencer campaigns but it was just like, was it really like the right ones for, I don't really know, like was it really the bang for the buck or all of that? So just based on prior, you know, engagements with them, I was just like, nah, I don't want to really mess this moment up for a, for me. So, yeah. That's dope to see, man. Well, you alluded to the ISO versus what we get to that. Yeah. I think that concept is just, is crazy. Like the thing that allowed you to do what you're doing in general. Yeah. Your content, right? I would love to hear, like, let's start with still speak and then get into content in general. Okay. It went viral, won the song, like the crazy, it's just such a concept. So, that whole speak up and elevate in your voice is dope. But then putting the content together with it, like how do you see content? Because you consistently create viral content with different types of song. Like, do you have a specific method or like a amount of time that you use? Like, how do you break stuff down? I honestly, like this is literally, like this is the gem I have for, like, you know, creating content. So, when it comes to really getting in that bag of, like, you know, creating something, like, I get so passionate about like the visual aspect of it. Like, I visualize how I want the video to come out before, like I even just touch the camera. You know, I already have a concept in mind. It's like, I'm treating in a way, regular content for social media, like music videos in a way. Or like, what's the theme? How can I, like, because I'm understanding when it comes to social media, there's certain language that you have to adhere to. Like, you know, there's TikTok language. There's Instagram language. You know, so specifically with TikTok language, it's more so, okay, you gotta, of course, pay attention to the trends, but how can you put yourself at the forefront of that trend? You know, so when it comes to making content for myself, I really just try to visualize, okay, how I want it to look. How is this gonna communicate to the people on this platform, to the people on that platform, and really just make it to a point where it's okay. Now, at the end, they're invested in me. They're invested on going to the Spotify. They're invested on going to the SoundCloud. Any social media platform or music platform that I'm at. So I really just try to visualize, you know, okay, if I want this to give a certain feel, what's really gonna, you know, I have to put myself in the viewer's shoes. For instance, like, it all gets so crazy to the point, like, I'll kind of like visualize myself scrolling down, like, and seeing if I just saw my video right, if I just saw this video right now, would it make me stop and just think, like, when I read the title, is it's gonna be something that allows me to be like, oh, wait, yo, like, yo, this is different, and he's actually showcasing what he typed. Something that really pulls you in instantly, you know, because you do, of course, have to, you know, really, in a way, kind, you have to play the game for it in a way, but still have that out to know that, okay, this is the thing that drew you in, but now I'm drawing you to me at the end of the day. Now, it sounds like you definitely focus a lot on the hook, right? Yeah, for sure. Bring them in, but, you know, a lot of people can figure out random ways to get people to stop. Yeah. The people who do really well at content. Right. People actually are satisfied at the end, you know what I mean? I could just do some random shit and then get your attention, and then you don't care about the video, like, so how do you make sure you consistently deliver on expectation and people, like, replay your video again and then share the videos? I think what it definitely does come down to for me now is every time I try to, like, the way I do content is, of course, I don't try to go all out at first, you know? Okay, because I don't want to burn myself out, right? So for instance, when I first started with the ISO version, first started it, I was recording, it's crazy, I was recording, like, some of my biggest songs off the $40 microphone, like, it was crazy. So that was, like, the first standard I started at and knowing, okay, you know, it was novel in a sense of, okay, now the idea is something that never, you know, was there before, so I can get away with using the $40 microphone and just the idea. But now, as people are seeing the videos more and more, now all becomes a question of what can improve. So now when I knew, okay, there was, I know people are kind of familiar with this, so now what can improve? Now it's the sound, it's the production. So now more so when I drop things, I focus more so on the production because I know, like, it's that kind of, you know, thin line between, you know, hammering a song but then feeling a song, like, you know? So now when I make the content, I try to really focus on the end goal of, okay, you know, this can be something that, you know, at the end of the day, somebody could just list to, like, always, you know, it could be a song that, you know, I could just turn on and just, you know, like, I feel like bumping that ISO. So now the way I'm able to really consistently bring that is just really focusing now, what can I just improve on and what, if the viewer is watching if somebody's listening, that they really are able to, you know, get the message that I was trying to deliver in a way. So, yeah. Oh, yeah, that's hard, man, because I was scrolling, I was on YouTube last time I was scrolling and I notice every single song you do, like, people do these covers and flips of people's songs and things, but you definitely treat every single flip like a real song. Right, exactly. That makes a difference. Like, even now you're doing it, like, even the edits of the videos feel like they're all mini videos. Where did that come from? So honestly, what that came from was definitely, of course, like trial and error of understanding, okay, like, I know if I'm doing something different, you know, I have to make sure that it embodies when I'm, if the production is there, the video quality has to be there. Even now I'm rethinking the way of how I'm, you know, dropping music, you know, because one thing I know I definitely need to do more is drop music, but now instead of, you know, because my formula was, okay, I post this crazy idea, people want it, but then, you know, at that moment, the demand is so high, but okay, I just have a pre-save linkin' about. And knowing how the consumer is, nobody really, like pre-saves is tough, but it's really hard for somebody to get to that pre-save for like, cause the only way you can really know that is knowing your own, like, your own kind of behavior when it comes to pre-saves. Like, I barely be pre-saving stuff, you feel me? So something has to really give for me to pre-save. So that's what's make me think. So the next time, the way I'm trying to reinforce and really pump out content now, music and stuff like that is, if I introduce something, instead of it having the demand for it, it's just already gonna be out there. I'm taking more of a, I'm doubling down on myself to know I'm not missing on that window of opportunity of as soon as somebody sees that video for the first time, you know, you don't even gotta wait. It's already in my bio, it's already there. So I don't have, it eliminates that thing of the pre-save of just running it. It's just more, so it's fresh, it's there. The conversion is instantly there. So I try to really look at it to a point is how can I quickly get the listener to the Spotify so you know that these different platforms, and I feel like the best way for my type of style and my type of brand, since it's based on novelty, it's just giving it to them as fast as I can. I definitely have seen a lot of people. I mean, Jacory talked about a lot where you're gonna drop the ball. Yeah, people drop the ball, man. Experiences campaigns we've been a part of where song takes too long to come out and it just like fizzles. I mean, you're, I think to a point is even greater need of novelty. And sometimes it seems like, I mean, the way you create, you might not even know exactly what it's gonna do, but the titches band is shorter and shorter. Of course, it's getting shorter, bro. Yeah, when it goes, song takes off, you gotta drop. Exactly, gotta drop. Man, you know, like we only, I don't got time to be waiting for that at least five days for Spotify and digital kidding and stuff like that. So I gotta give it to them. I gotta double down and really know, okay, I know the production is there, so I know people are gonna want it. So it only makes sense for me to just have it there as soon as I drop it. So, yeah. Cause I've really just been paying attention to even like Russia's strategy, you know, Russia's strategy, you know, the Song of Week strategy, that's literally what I'm gonna like really try to adapt to, you know, because I know with his fan base, you know, he feeds it to them. He gives it to them and that's why he's able. They have that comfortability of knowing, yo, whatever Russia previews, whatever, you know what's coming out. They know they're gonna get it, you know? So I feel like, you know, his fan base is kind of like identifiable to like my fan base because it's always people just wanting it. They, yo, so you gotta drop it. That's my biggest issue. I don't really be dropping as much as I want. So I feel like with that kind of, you know, format, it's definitely gonna work out for sure. Yeah, I can see that based on the fact that a lot of people struggle with visibility but you already have visibility. Right. So it's like, you could drop a song a week and make sure every song is seen to a certain extent. Right. Exactly. Good. Because even like, you know, just looking at the, because people don't really know, I went through a series, I went through a series of phases in terms of my career, you know, first time I really came onto the scene was 2018. You know, I came onto the scene impersonating other rappers, right? I was known for doing like, like, I ain't gonna lie, like, I was like AI before AI, I ain't gonna count. People was like, yo, how was he like, cause you know, you get those parodies of people like doing other rappers, but I was like one of the few people that knew like their voice to a T, you feel me? And that really popped off in 2018. I'll never forget it. I did like, oh, when you ask PNB Rock and A Buggy what they want to eat, went crazy on Twitter, went viral like a world storm. And I was just, gave me the incentive, okay, this is going crazy. Let me start doing things of other rappers. But it kind of hurt me in the long run because now realizing when I brought in my music, it kind of confused people to know, like they're more so interested in other people and not me. They're more so interested in what I do. I'm another rapper and not me. So it kind of ruined my identity in a way. So then that really forced me in like 2021. That's when I really started the Isoverse content to a point where it's just like, I had to double down on myself. I had to invest in the studio equipment because I really want this music to be heard. So I put that to the side, more so, focused on these characters. But even in a way too, like it's still kind of a dilemma there because still like, it's always that thing in the back of my mind. I don't want it to overshadow me at the end of the day. So it's of course finding that medium of knowing like then at the day, people are knowing that it's Iso Kenny for me. So yeah. You know what, what to overshadow you. So like, let's say like, if I'm doing these characters, right? You feel me? Like there's always that confusion of people saying, go, yeah, like we like when you do this or the quiet kid and all that. But it's all me at the end of the day. So people like meet me in public and they're used to seeing, you know, the quiet kid. And in me and my videos, they only relate to me as like the engineer or something. I don't really have anything of a significance if that makes sense. So now I'm stretching it in a way. Now that just means I have to double that in the content and understanding, okay, I got to be an appearance with these characters. I have to just be as significant as them. So when I'm at a show or something, they're able to identify with me like more efficiently that, oh, not as Iso. Like he really, you feel me? He be for me going crazy. He's not just the dude behind the computer. Cause I feel like that's how people identify me. That's for real. But if I hopped out as a homie from the 1800s in public, they were like, oh, did that homie from the 1800s? No cat. You feel me? I haven't really heard that kind of level before. But I mean, you do when there's like an actor, like let's just say, Erko, you go back, right? And people expect them to kind of be like that or whatever. But you're both of them in the care, like in the actual thing. And there's somehow still acting like you're the character. And you just got multiple characters. So some artists and managers are just waiting for lucky moments when the ones who are killing it have systems to consistently take artists to another level over and over again. And if you want to see what that looks like, we just did a collab where we not only show the system that we use, that's resulted in Billboard hit, some of the biggest viral moments on TikTok, Instagram and YouTube. But also we got J.R. McKee to break down how he took an artist from zero to one of the biggest hit songs of 2022 and getting a Grammy in January of 2023. This is recent stuff, not old tactics. If you want to check it out, go to www.brandmannetwork.com slash Grammy. Don't forget the www or it won't work because J.R. gets into the details of looking at the data, decisions that got made, how much content got created and how they adjusted the content over time for different parts of the campaign. This is real behind the curtains type of stuff. So again, go to www.brandmannetwork.com slash Grammy. If you want to check this out and apply it to yourself, back to the video. So I guess before we go further, can you explain the Isoverse concept and all the characters in the Isoverse? Right, so that's a perfect question. What really honestly birthed the Isoverse? It was honestly just a musical inspiration because one of the first people, one of the first characters that came onto the scene was the quiet kid. And you know, the quiet kid to me was somebody, you know, of course it was like more so. I see these characters as a figment of my imagination and my personality honestly. So the quiet kid is like, let's all the more reserve the heartbreak. But musically, he can tap into like, you know, xxtentacion world, the juice world. So I use it as outlet to even communicate to other markets. You know, 18 from the homey from the 1800s straight gimmick. You from me, I just, yo, like, yo, I was just in college. Let me just do some funny stuff. And I just made that job. Freight kid to me, you know, that's just me, you know, growing up where I grew up, going to the college where I went to really being introduced to the fraternity world and knowing like, yo this is how really they act. So I wanted to in a way be able to identify which is much marketer than I can, but still having the origin, the foundation of everything, you know, be musically. So it really made me, it started off as something that, you know, of course, like, yo, it's content. But now realizing the opportunities within these characters, it's like, I got to make it deeper. I got to make it really mean something. You know, what's the origin of each character out? Like they're, they're really just, you know, figments of me and you know, just my experiences through life, you know, the smart kid is just really the fact of, you know, like people expect me, you know, I got Dresden signed, I ain't really smart, but I'm really smart in them all. Like, you feel me like, I didn't get ungraduated and like you feel me all of that. So it's just like, figments of me and just really just conveying that musically. So now I'm at a point with the ISO verse where, you know, I'm focusing like, okay, how deep do I want this to go long term? It's something I can honestly feel like I can make a whole series out of it. I can make a whole TV show out of it. It could be something that, you know, now my shows, they're just not ISO Kenny performing. It could be a whole play. It could mean making skits on stage performing as these characters and stuff like that. You know, the merch comes together when it's just like, oh, he dropped this, he finally drops a merch for intelligence or he finally drops a speak up merch and all of that. I want to get to a point where it's all the system and connected, but it's just like, it all works within each other and it favors each other. You know, so yeah, man, that's, that's crazy. We talked about all the different types of opportunities that come from these characters, right? Yeah, right. This universe, this Marvel like universe spawned from one person. Yeah. And then the you're working backwards or is like, yeah, who is the core person, right? The single person. Exactly. Right. Well, what's the of Pokemon? I think it's Eve, right? But it has like five different types of evolutions or maybe yeah, there we go. Like a type of thing, right? Like all these evolutions that you pay attention to, but then we still got to figure out like, how do you, how do people like appreciate the core thing? But I think right now on the way you're positioning it and then even just continuously calling it isoverse and characters recurring. Right. At the point, if I like two characters, I have to address that you're the commonality, you know, right? But then I like you about happens, but it was just one character is hard to escape that one character. But now you doing with doing it the way you're doing it is going naturally, I feel like bring it all together. Like, you know, this dude is doing some dope and you're where most people try to escape like content altogether, which I guess we because people are like, oh, I created all this on this visibility on social media, but people know me for this thing. You alluded to it. Oh, man, I got stuck in his rapper hat. I mean, we'll acting like other rappers, but then I got these characters. I'm stuck in these characters, but instead of like just like jumping off the roof and like, I just want to be an artist and forget about all of it. Yeah. Problem solving your way through it and figuring out like, how can I make this content connect but still deliver analysis? How can I make these characters move? But then at the same time, like help them respect the Kenny, right? Me personally, more like you keep thinking and level to level like what drives that? Where is all this, you know, coming from? I feel like it really honestly comes back to the fact of like, you know, I'm really an overthinking when it comes to this type of stuff, you know, and, you know, I see it as a way of, you know, I'm a type of person, like I really thrive off of consistency. I thrive off of, you know, adversity and seeing things and understanding, you know, I've been through those tough times of, you know, it was a period of time, you know, when I was doing the, you know, the rapper impersonation and stuff like that. And I remember there was one summer, you know, there was one summer I really said, you know, nah, like, you know, I want to try to become an artist and stuff like that. So I stopped that all together, right? And of course, you know, I had to go through the laws of followers. I think I lost like 40,000 followers in one summer type, right? So, and, you know, I'm thinking like, okay, for one, I'm understanding, okay, looking back at that, looking at the past experience of stuff, I'm realizing, okay, if I'm going to do this right, then I have to make sure that the long term goal is in mine, you know, because what makes people jump ship and really just like, you know, kind of feel like they're stuck is because in the beginning, they just, they just go through what they're attached to, okay, yeah, the numbers and all of that, like, though, this is working now, but deep down, they're abandoning that true passion of being an artist and stuff like that. And I knew I didn't want that to be me, you know, so what took those past up and downs of this and that to really gather where I went wrong to understand, okay, if this is where I wanted to go, I have to fine tune it along the journey. I have to stop and pause and say, okay, what is the brand communicating? I have to think about the steps before I even get there. So it's just not like I'm moving, I'm moving without a plan, because moving without a plan, that's how you dig yourself too deep, you know, before when I was doing the rapper, I was moving without a plan. But now I realize, okay, with this, I got to make it something that I'm not even just selling these characters, I'm selling, I'm selling, you know, something that people can relate to, I'm selling a feeling, you know, so that's why the music comes involved, where it's just like now with every character, they elicit a feeling. For instance, when you get the smart guy, you're going to feel smooth, you're going to feel like groovy, it's going to give you that groovy vibe every time you're on a track. You know, I really just try to build the brand of everything. And I realized, you know, I had to look at my weaknesses, I had to look at the fact of I was just going to look, you know, you know, with the show, I'm not really ready to let's say people want to see the iso kid at this event, I mean, see the quiet kid at this event, you know that and I honestly just seen it as it's opportunities, you know, like let's say, for instance, with the frat kid, I make songs within that fit within that world, you know, allows me to go do college tours at certain universities and stuff like that. But still, I can go crazy and with the quiet kid, I can be on a bill with Pink Panthers or something, you feel me like it gets so unique and different like that, where I just don't want to abandon any opportunity, but make sure at the core of it all comes down to music. Yeah, yeah. It's funny you bring up the Pink Panthers thing because I was thinking about when you mentioned the getting away from the other rappers stuff. Yeah, but you have a period where you were using their names heavy, and then you flipped into your own characters and now it looks like you kind of figure out a formula where you can do both, right? I saw like a quiet kid on the beat, you know what I'm saying, whichever kid on the Pink Panthers beats. I mean, this is me looking from consumer side. Is that okay? Like this is you trying to figure out like this, a way to bring both of these different words. Exactly. Like even like this Friday, I'm planning to drop like an Afro emo song, you feel me? So it's something that's different. It's novel. I'm going to give it to the fans as soon as it's ready. You know, I'm looking at it now, even how I drop music, you know, because before people were used to getting something new every week, you know, they were, oh, damn, he just dropped the discos on there. He going to drop an EDM song like, yo, damn slow down. But I'm trying to process this, not like for me. But now it's, it's at a point where it's just like, now I'm trying to focus on themes. Maybe, you know, it's a summer vibe. People are going to want more Afro beat. They're going to want more upbeat pop type stuff. Maybe I'm building projects, you know, to a point where I could go crazy, be on some LA Russell drop a project every month for like just based on things like that. You know, so now it's allowed me to focus and hone down on a certain niche that I'm building and really making it ISO verse that niche, but still, you know, putting it away where there will be projects versus solely ISO Kenny. But even when it comes to content, like the ISO verse, I just don't have to package it the same way where it's still something that grabs people attention. For instance, if we use an example, let's say, you know, I love R&B a lot, maybe on something that because I know one thing that makes songs go crazy. The reason why songs are going viral is because they're either calling back to something or it's literally packaged as something that people have never like seen before. So for instance, in the future, I plan to drop like a 2000s R&B theme project. Let's say I bring back the next content I make with the song is me wearing like the 2000s R&B inspired clothes. It's 2000s R&B inspired beats. I'm on like my love don't cost the thing type drip you for me. I'm just doing the a skit idea is me playing the radio outside the girls house and stuff like that. It's all about capturing people within that certain moment. And then they're like, yo, I'm buying into this next wave. And then boom, it's going crazy for a man like that. That's funny because everything you're doing is such an experience. So it's so rich for ideas, products, and engagement. Like where some people are like, what's my next move? How do I engage with fans in different ways and create content? But it's just there because that you're creating is so thoughtful. Like you mentioned, yeah, pouring with somebody or just performing with somebody. I had dawned on that before. Like we talk about these different characters and creating the show, play styles, get and be able to have them interacted. But like, you got your peak panther panthers through joints, and you can just hop on a show like in real life with her for a tour. But then you got some joints, you could tour with another artist where most artists are stuck. They're stuck with the artists that are in their lane, which is the way most artists moving and doing it successfully, by the way. Right, exactly. Most figure are having struggle to figure out how do I do this, this what a variety with diversity. Like how do I do this diverse thing well, but I think that you can actually pulling it together. For sure. And I know that's the thing. That's why it's like a double that sword. Because there are those some days where I just realized that's a fact every artist is popping right now. There really are sticking to their niche. And there's that's honestly the best way to do it allows you to stay focused, allows you to really just hone down on your sound and craft it. You know, and that's why this thing this this what I'm doing it feels like such a riddle. You feel me because it's tough. It's not easy to understand. Okay, like how how what's the perception of me to do this and do that. But I know once I really continue to, you know, really hone down on what I'm doing and over time once it really clicks, I know it's going to be like one of the biggest things because I know it is something, you know, that is not what's never been done before, but it doesn't mean that is easy it's hard for real for real. But I know once I really click it, and it comes together and it's full entirety and really lock in on it, it's going to take off way bigger than now for real for sure. You got the key, bro, because yeah, start being strategic with it. That was I think that's the difference. Yeah, if you don't, if you're not willing to go through it, yeah, been through the ups and downs, you realize all right, I need to create a plan like you said, yeah, and then being willing to not see the numbers be mastered for a period of time, maybe some bigger numbers, way bigger numbers than most, but like not hit where you want to and feel the progress. But at some point when it all hits together, because you play that groundwork, it's going to be great. Red top, red top, that's a fact. I have this theory, man, like I see it with you, I've seen it with like other clients who have that are like content creators, time artists, y'all seem to be a lot more patient about certain things than I was like the typical rising artists, right? Yeah. And I personally feel like a large part of that is because you guys have the, the, I guess the safety net of the audience kind of like, one, you're not like starving for attention, like most new artists are you have it already, right? And then two, you're not a completely starving artist in that degree either, right? Because you're able to monetize the audience and things like that. So this is me, like I said, me looking now, I always kind of felt that way about the different clients that fit that box. Do you feel that way? Like, do you, do you feel like you're able to kind of have the breathing room to make smarter decisions as an artist because you've already built the foundation for yourself as a, as a creator in certain aspect? Yeah, definitely a hundred percent. I feel like, you know, there is more patience that goes into it because, you know, like you already put in the words to be a consecrated and I was just, you know, it's just putting in that same word to be an artist. You know, I feel like, you know, when it comes to the reason why we're so patient is because we know we have a vision in our mind when it comes to how the angle wants to look. And we know we invest in time. I know, like, you know, guaranteed it's going, it's not going to take overnight for me. That's, it's, I feel like it's the fact that, you know, because I knew, I knew how it was to be a consecrated before TikTok came into the picture. I knew it was a rarity. I knew it was something that, yo, it was rare to be a content creator on Instagram, poppin and stuff like that. But now being an artist that's just coming up, you're literally seeing people go, you're scrolling down, you see somebody's life change overnight. So I can understand a feeling of why, like, yo, like, am I wise? I'm not lit like this person type. But I feel like, you know, what allows me to have that stability in that patience is because, you know, really been doing this for years and understanding I was really able to see the life cycle of where being concert, the life cycle of really being a consecrated wasn't as prevalent, but now it's in a way like people say oversaturated, honestly. So I can understand why, you know, some artists may feel like I am like, I'm not really lit like that. But I feel like, you know, the fact that, you know, I was able to go through those ups and downs of a content creator and an artist and just allow me to be more patient in the long run. Which bag has been the biggest so far? The artist bag or the creative bag? I'd say definitely not creative bag. And more so the creative bag in terms of, I'd say, you know, randills and sponsorships and all that. Because, you know, when I was going crazy, I was like going crazy on YouTube, like when I first started, because it took time for YouTube to really start hitting, you know, to the point of, you know, making like, you know, five to 10k a month, you know. But now when the bag of, you know, the brandos, that's about I really didn't know about you for me, because I didn't have a team for I didn't have a team of social media, a social media team that really just went crazy and went out the deals. But honestly, like when I first seen like, yo, like this, how do you want to dig in for this, bro? Like, I'm like, oh, nah, this done crazy. There's a whole market right here. So that would just made me realize, okay, like, yo, like, this is, this is how it's supposed to be. You're adding value, you know, you have people that, you know, that really want to see you, you know, build and build your brand, get money and stuff like that. So I say, yeah, definitely that content bag, because you know how it is with this music stuff, right? Is this crazy? They playing out half a penny and stuff like that, man. They going crazy. Yeah. So which ones bigger between platforms, like just straight platform, like TikTok monetization or YouTube monetization on what you're saying? Keep it up. Honestly, I say definitely YouTube, but people sleeping on Facebook, like Facebook is definitely, but now it's a gone to Facebook. So I say, for instance, like, you know, YouTube, I'll make roughly like, you know, five to seven on there, you know, because with YouTube it makes, it's a really more so about, of course, like, are you a long form content type of person or short form content type person? You know, I make like one minute video, so it's not going to go as crazy as if I'm making like a 15 minute video for a for, right? Facebook, you know, when they had their run, I wasn't getting none crazy. But I think the most that I made off of there and one month was like, I'd say like $5,000 or so, you know, because YouTube, I mean, Facebook is based off of at the time, most based off plays on Reels and stuff, but they took that meta, took that away entirely from Instagram, can't get paid from that anymore, which is crazy. So the long form, you still get paid for that as well. So now you just been making a couple of thousand off of there too, as well, you know, just grinding on that. So, but I say definitely that YouTube bag is always different. You know, you always, you're always going to see people out on YouTube because they know how lucrative it is, you know, to see like, yo, damn, like I just posted a 20 minute video, it could be at 100k and that really equates to like a couple thousand dollars like that, you know, so it's just it's insane for a for a. Yes, I just knowing that does that does that affect which platforms you spend most of your attention on? And I guess what I'm trying to ask is like, is your content creation process dictated more by where you feel like the content is better based or whatever or how you're feeling or you paying attention to these things and tweaking your content model in regards like how the platforms are treating monetization. Yeah, for sure. That's a that's a great question, you know, because it's like with these platforms, you definitely have to hone in knowing like when it comes to Instagram, right? Instagram is more so like professional based, like it's more so I feel like honesty to Instagram out there and they got to fix that because it's not really is is not it's hard to grow on that platform for a fruit. So now I'm understanding okay when it comes to a sense of importance and the sense of urgency to post, I'd say TikTok will fall last on that list. I mean, Instagram will fall last on that is then it will probably be more so second TikTok because TikTok, you know, it's more so to the trends. It's always going to be updating, you know, and then YouTube, of course, that's probably the truest platform mainly because I feel like on YouTube, you have your like hardcore fans on there. Those are the people that are actually going to send you money for a fruit. You ask and like, yo, I'm down bad, but I need like, they don't send it to you for like, they don't give it to you. So I feel like when it comes to YouTube, it's always been that platform for, you know, family, it's always been that platform where people can relate to you, you know, they really invest in who you are. But when it comes to Instagram and TikTok, it's just that's when you really know their attention span is just like, nah, they just on the platform, they'll just go to the next thing for a fruit. So yeah. So I definitely have that incentive to know what I post. I may post on this platform, but I ain't gonna post on here and here for a fruit. I'm not going to be as consistent on this platform as I would be on this one. Yeah, I got you. Okay. Man, when I hear the some of the things you ran through, it makes me think back to just that stigma of the content creator transfer burn over to the artist, right? There's been some who have successfully done it. Is there anybody who's blueprint that you're following or you kind of like at least take note of their path and consider and how you move? I'd say definitely a lot. Of course, you know, he wouldn't like to give DD Sheer a lot of credit, but he's definitely been somebody, you know, that is just changing the game, you know, in terms of like, you know, being a content creator artist specifically a YouTuber and he's going crazy, signed to Epic Records. Another person who that people really don't even realize is Joji. You feel me? I feel like, you know, in terms of my music, and Joji probably had it, he had it way harder than me for a fruit because he was doing the filthy Frank Johns and I was like, yo, that's a break out of that because I chose some crazy content. But even just knowing like, that's really how you become successful. You're literally success leaves clues. So I was literally at a period of time and understanding, okay, there are definitely people that have done it before me. What are the things that they have done that I could translate to myself? And I knew when it came to Joji being successful and, you know, DDG being successful, what they relied on was the fact of giving hope and time. You know, I remember even Corey saying something so powerful was like, you know, things really do take time. You know, for instance, you know, you could post a song right now, but let's say months down the line, somebody's going through something and they just find your song and it releases them and that feeling they make a TikTok to it and it goes crazy for that's how I see things. I see things. Okay, you know, we're living such in a fast paced culture, content creative culture, everything is just, you know, it's just where we're adhering to what's in front of our face. Once you plant those seeds and now, you know, I'm willing that I'm understanding. Okay, like, you know, maybe it'll take, you know, two years, three years for it to get to really where it want to be. I'm fine with that. You know, I'm not living in that six months period of this and that. I'm going to put in those words. I'm tracking those monthly goals to make sure, okay, this is just a plan, but definitely I feel like it's just about, you know, giving that time, giving it time to, you know, go with the plan, you know, fail. And people are afraid of failure, but I actually plan to fail. Like, yo, like if I post this, I want to see what they're going to do. If they don't do crazy, and it's cool, I'm able to know what works and what doesn't work. And it's just about being authentic with, you know, what you're doing and stuff, because I feel like that's something that's needed across social media. It's just being authentic, being unapologetically you, you know, so yeah. Hey, man, then you throw on actually having good music. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Right. Right. That chance to record. Look, you, I think people recognize pretty early on. It's like, yo, man, like this is one of those playful songs, but like this shit hard. It's hard. Right. It's a song song for real, because you presented it that way, put it in that word. But then I remember when you were saying, we were all talking, you were saying that you wanted to focus on like the R&B wave, but I hadn't heard R&B stuff. Well, you hadn't really dropped any like serious. Exactly. Free agency. And I was just like, oh yeah, this shit is great. I could see him going that direction because I love R&B. The lyrics, like the whole concept tied it in. And then I love basketball. So to see, I just feel like, oh, off my roster. No. That whole concept was crazy. So like the story telling, like I take a note of all those little things, right? That was happening. So I'm just like the talent's there and he's done it in different ways. I didn't even really understand, like realize your voice was like that, like that. So I'm just like, I mean, the music, you have enough of an audience. There's always going to be somebody at the quality of making that lights, what you put out. Exactly. And that's the thing that I definitely had to understand because I'm not going to lie. I did go through like a, I went through like a crisis for, because the thing, you know, going back to that situation, you know, being in the label, right? It was at a point where, you know, I dropped the song. I had, I dropped it in October 4th. I was in the deal up until December 28th. So it put me at a thing where, you know, this song is going crazy. People want the follow-up. Like, you know, that's usually what happens when you get to it. You want to follow up. But I knew like, damn, like, yo, I could do a follow-up, but I know it's going to have to go through the label for, for, and it could be something crazy. And it's just going to be that process. So I just said, you know what, I'm going to just have to wait it out. I'm going to be sitting up real quick. I'm going to just keep posting, speak up, you know, and stuff like that. And I realized in a way that was kind of a tough thing, because it got to put my own followers as tired of me posting, speak up so much before me. But then now, you know, when I got out of deal, it's like, yo, damn, like, do I follow the, should I go down that lane and to speak up? Should I, you know, make something like it? You know, labels, when I dropped that song, it really showed me too how labels really move. I talk to every label and like literally every label for and realizing I'll call them like, oh, bro, I so I love your music, bro. I ask them, yo, what's your favorite song? Oh, that speak up joint is crazy, bro. Like, I'm like, yo, I have a catalog deeper than that. So I knew like, in certain that way too, like, you know, signing to a label at that point would kind of be tough, you know, because it's a test to see, okay, they would definitely want me to make something just like that. But there was some labels too that I talked to that, you know, I really appreciate it. Oh, yeah, like, we seem to speak up, but yo, we listen to run, we listen to disco dancing, we have a catalog. Once they say stuff like that, it really makes me realize, okay, okay, they would definitely know what to do with me. But you know, I was stuck in that dilemma of realizing, yo, like, what, what kind of path should I take? I don't want to be that guy that just, you know, went straight into this just because it was what was popping. I really want to build something from the ground up, which would be that R&B, the Isoverse type of stuff, because I do think it's going to flourish. It's like you said, no matter what, there is somebody, I have that mark to where somebody's going to gravitate towards it and like where I put out, regardless of what it is. Yeah, bro, you got like the Kcamp type of versatility. Yeah. He will give Kcamp his flowers. People say I look like Kcamp. Somebody said, I look like a mixture of Kcamp and Victor Oladipa. I was like, hey, yo, I was like, yeah, I was like, yeah, that's hilarious, that's hilarious. I can see it. I can see it though. I can't actually see it now. What I respect about that though, like, is just the constant patience, like what you already said, man, allows you to actually move with a plan, like smart. You can have a plan, but if you don't got a patience to actually carry out that plan and deal with it and have those moments, I'm going to sit down on my music for a second because I don't want to be in this safe situation with this label anymore. Oh, I got these new labels reaching out to me probably offer me a good amount of money, but oh, I don't got the sound out that I even want to be it. Right? Yeah. And then I got to, I mean, I had content waves. I'm popping with this, but I'm going to chill out and then take lower numbers as I transition to something else. I love to hear you talk about that again and again and again, because I think people just think the game is like this one wave of up or you down. Don't not knowing that it's like those ups and downs, you're not trying to go all the way down. That's the trick is like, how do I not go all the way down until I can get my next two levels up? And how do you kind of see that that I just walked through from like a bird's eye view? Right. Facts at facts. I feel like, you know, even that's a fact. People misconstrued the, you know, the ups and downs. They think that ups and this is up. And what makes people think that is just the perception of social media. Rather, they don't know what somebody had to go through. And I feel like what stops somebody from going all the way, what makes somebody go all the way down is giving up entirely, you know, giving up in their true vision entirely, but staying true, staying true to the course and really thinking like an artist, thinking like a content creator, thinking, you know, in the longterm, you know, going through those shoves, those ups and downs, I feel like it comes down to understand like the road isn't perfect. It was perfect. Then, you know, everybody would be doing it, but it's just understanding like, yo, it gives more, much more meaning to why you do what you do, you know, and it's really just being in a way, you know, in a way like it's nice on crazy falling in love with uncomfortable situations, you know, because you know that uncomfortable situation is going to mold you, you know, when it's a comfortable situation, you know, when it was like to hear that uncomfortable situation so you can maintain it, you know, because there was that rabbit hole of, you know, me, you know, I could have just been that, you know, that guy that made speak up and just tried to keep doing down that lane, but that would just hinder the whole iso verse as a whole. Because now when I did talk to labels, the question was, okay, let's say you make this big record now, usually the thing that artists do is, you know, they slide down that lane. If somebody went crazy off the club song, they're going to keep making that type of club music. But I did it a way where it's just like, nah, like, I know I can really be something universal. I could be, you know, the next straight or so, but the first iso, Kenny, you know, so that really just comes down to, of course, honing on the production. It comes down to continuing to study and be a student of concentration of making music and all of that. So I feel like it's just important really to just have faith in the process. People forget that, you know, based on just the current times that we're in now, they're just focused right now on just like, yo, I need this happening now, but not, you got to see five years ahead. Did you feel like anybody was looking at you crazy when speak up was taken off and then the next joint you drop is a R&B, completely different type of vibe? It's one of those things, right? Like when I did drop it, you know, people are like, you know, like, of course, you'll get those haters like, yo, bro, like, bro, we like the rap, bro, stop singing, bro, like, you feel me? But I feel like, you know, people didn't, they were, in fact, I'd say surprised. I was actually even, because I'm gonna be 100% transparent, you know, I was kind of in a way kind of, what's the right word to use, kind of reluctant about the R&B, you know, because I knew it was just like, you know, I've had songs like that in the past, but it's just like, yo, are people going to be, it's people going to really gravitate towards to it. But when I dropped it and really people understood and just understanding the love that I got from it, it allowed me, you know, to say, you know what, like, yo, like, all I had to do was just consistently give them this, now apply, when I make the R&B music, it just has to, you know, be at such a, such a significance as, you know, the other type of content, you know, whether it's just like, you know, how I shot the video, it's a theme around it to draw them in. Because what really made me realize to what could flourish in the R&B was, I remember when I was first going crazy, I made like the R&B drill song, you feel me like, and I knew that was the thing, okay, that's the thing that could pull people in, like they realized, oh, damn, he could sing for her. So when I did drop it, it was crazy for people like, yo, they definitely expected a follow-up or speak up and stuff like that. But I was just like, now, like, if I'm this my first time really being 100% independent, I really want to start it off right for her, so I can know I put something out like that, even if I do it online, I drop another rap song or whatever, you know, that's a cat, that's a, I have a catalog for them to go back to, you know, so yeah, show. Man, what you saying, 100% independent. I want to make it clear for people listening. You're not like an artist who is like, where your following came from, like, oh, you were signed to some label deal and the money was put back behind you. Right. Know a lot of people here, oh, somebody had a label of, you know, yeah, he's indie now, but he had a label first. He's like, nah, it's not really, I'm not going to say sign, sign, because I don't know all your information, but like, it's not that, that image of let's say Meek Mill when he went independent, right? It's like, is that even that, even that situation too, so the really the whole story behind it was like, you know, um, popped off in 2018, signed, signed the deal back in like, honestly, like 2020, signed the deal back 2020, I was like 20 at the time. Um, and it's crazy. It's, it's funny because, you know, it was so weird because I signed a deal thinking that, okay, they would want me to stop making the content, but they had the one that told me, yo, start making a content again. I got back into it, but you know, not me to talk, not trying to talk down on them or anything, but it's just like, you know, it was unfulfilled promises for, for like, I'm thinking, oh, I'm signed, slave. I'm done doing this content. They said they got playlists on deck. They said they got this and that. When I dropped, now it's excuses starting to come in like, yo, you actually got to drop more for them, you know, to pitch out the playlist, got short presents and stuff. So then I realized, okay, I got to put in this work for her. So then, you know, that's when I just got the incentive, you know, to just do my own thing. And then of course, once they started seeing the traction, once they had something for them to work with, that's when they going to start putting the work for you for, and that makes sense. You know, it's, it's understandable, but it was just like my idea of a label. Oh, yes, I ain't gonna lie. I mean, I was that kid, I was like, yo, I thought signing two labels, the biggest thing you go to the label meeting, you take a picture by the local. Oh, yeah, like, you feel me working silence? And you know, damn, you ain't even talking about that crazy prayer. So that was me. But then realizing and going through it, I was just like, nah, like, yo, this is totally some different. It was a learning process. I'm actually glad I was able to go through it. So I'm at this point now to know, let's say if I never signed to a label and I was speak up, came up and I'm getting the offers and I'm geeked. I'm super hyped. I'm quick to jump the board. But I'm realizing I've been through this before. I'm just going to invest in more time and just, you know, see what goes from there for sure. Oh, man. Just, it's just so much to pull, but I feel like I want to see just some of this next, some of this stuff that's next in a journey. Because I know we got to have you back, man. You just got such a unique journey in this path that you're for, especially the ISO verse, bro. Again, that patience, like even hearing you talk about dropping speak up a whole lot of times, right? And then I want to hear your truly woes going to your head and how did you convince yourself to drop a video on speak up again, even after you see people complaining about it? Like, how do you get yourself to do that? Because everybody kind of goes through that, like, can't be back and I want people to like me. They hate it. Like, what were you doing to convince yourself to keep going? Honestly, it was the fact of like, truthfully, genuinely, like, I wanted to drop, I wanted to make new content. I wanted to make new things, but I just, it was just in the back of my mind. If this went crazy, it's not, it's not going to be independent. It's going to be for me. It's not going for me. It's going to take some time before I see anything for a, for a, so it was just like, you know, I want to just give it away like that. So it was, it was just the fact of like, yo, I just endure. It was all about endurance because knowing like, yo, come December 28th, come to like, I only had to wait about two months, like two and a half months and just focusing on speak up and then I could do whatever I want. So definitely when I first started seeing the complaints and stuff like that, I was just like, man, I don't know, so should I, should I just go ghost? But then I'm like, I don't like going ghost. I'm not that type of person where it's just like, I take a hiatus. I'm not Kendrick Lamar. You feel me? They ain't go like, I'm not to me. I can't take a hiatus like that. So I'm like, damn, like, you know, I'ma just stuck it out. I was just like, yo, I'ma just stuck it out for a, for a, see, you know, that they don't really understand knowing to in the back of my, they don't know the situation I was going to. Like this is actually the first time I'm letting people know for a, for a, so they know that, yo, like, damn, like he was on crazy label situation. That's why you had to promote the song so much and stuff like that because if you dropped his own music, you know, they'd have to acquire it and stuff. So then I just realized and just put it in my mind, it's just only a matter of time. I'ma just keep posting it. And then when I'm out, you're going crazy for a, man, that makes a lot of sense, man. When I think about those type of moments, my best example, like current example is like the Warriors, when they were going to the championship every year, right? People felt like it was going to be every year, every year, every year thing. And I don't remember if it was a coach or commentator, maybe one of the Warriors, they were just talking about, like, it feels like that now, but at some point this is going to end and it's going to be a thing of the past, right? So you appreciate it while it's here. You got to go hard and just like do what you got to do in that moment. Because now it has been like, what, two, well, no, the Warriors still came back, but it's not that same, like we got, we're killing everybody, y'all, untouchable. It feels like that was forever ago now, you know what I'm saying? And people are not even thinking about that. So they had that kind of hate for them in a moment. But now it's kind of like a fresh thing. And it's the same thing when you look at, like, okay, I'm promoting, I'm going hard and I'm getting in people's face, like I might be line stepping to some levels. But then once this promo period is done, then I'm moving on to the next thing they're not thinking about. You kind of have to have that energy and like, and almost like coming up. I think once you get a certain level of professional, it might be easier. But like coming up, I had to almost feel personally uncomfortable to know that I was doing it, right? Because you start off, I want to say, like, humble or a little bit, you know, like, hesitant, like, am I doing too much? Yeah. You got trained, right, to like, do what you're supposed to do. So I was like, no, I really got to do like 10 times what I wanted, what I feel comfortable with, just to do what I'm actually supposed to do. You know what I mean? And it seems like you developed that kind of muscle too. That's a fact. Now that's 100%. Because even I remember what you guys said too, is like, you know, you said, that's the key, like, you should already have like 40 to 50 pieces of content made to your song. And it's just the fact, like, you know, we get tired of what we're doing before anybody else does it. So I did this kind of like mental hack in a way to kind of, if I'm ever feel like, you know, like, I don't know, am I overdoing this? I kind of think in my mind, okay, if this other artist posted a snippet that they already posted today, would I really care as much? No, I really wouldn't. Honestly, I'm probably just going to see it and just keep going. So that just puts me in my mind to know like, oh, people, people are not really going to think about it like that for as much as I'm thinking about it. Because if let's say if Drake just posted, you know, three times a week, he posted us on the snippet to rescue me, like, nobody really going to care for a for anybody. Kendrick, Sofago, any, any artist for if they posted a skit, if they wanted to focus on that posted it several times a week, I know it's like, okay, I'm just going to scroll and see, oh, wow, okay, he's really promoting the song. So it kind of gets me out of that anxious moment of, you know, doing so much because nobody ever wants to seem like that guy that's doing so much that seems like they're forcing something. But we wouldn't be doing that if the algorithm was sturdy, like you feel me, but it's not sturdy. So we have no choice but to just pump it you feel me. So now I just get back to that as like, yo, y'all gonna see this from me, I'm gonna make sure like, I mean, that's how I think about it for 100%. Man, well, like last thing that I want to ask you about that we got to get off is that thing we touched on before, like your first show. Yeah, people do that experience. Yeah, 100%. So like even the show experience was crazy for me. Because before Speak Up came out, I performed really last time I performed, I say it was like 2018, you know, because even performing it brought something to my attention, it brought something to me so crucially that I never thought about focusing on these videos and content. But I never really stopped to think, yo, like, how is this going to translate to a live audience? You know, because I was saying before people are so used to seeing me on social media, you know, kind of put me in that one room and put me in that room where it's just like, yo, like, when are you going to step out of it? When are you going to make this tangible? Where are you going to bring this to the fans? So when my first show came around, you know, I ain't gonna lie, I was nervous. You feel me? I was nervous and really like, you know, just and like, what's really the thing to get the crowd engagement? Do I look cringe when I move or something like that? You feel me? So it was a dope experience, but I realized, you know, that was an untapped thing that I had to work on. I had to work on being a better performer, really embodying the song and stuff like that. You know, everybody has something to work, especially being an artist. Being a performer is one of the things that really separate the good from the great, you feel me? Because you could just sell out a show for a few just based off your energy. You know, you're going to give the audience a good time. It's going to go crazy. So the first experience was definitely a learning curve for me. It was definitely learning, okay, what's my swag when I'm on the stage? What's it? What's how can I incorporate my personality on social media to the crowd? Maybe it's every time before I perform. I say just a funny story or something that, you know, it's really going to make it riveting or even to a sense like, you know, I'm realizing the understanding like people, I never thought this, but like people actually plan things on their shows. Like they could literally like, you know, like have a fan do this for a friend. Nobody's going to think anything of it, but it's those type of things that go a long way because it's social proof and you're social proofing the people like, yo, bro, like, oh, damn, like, he going, he crying on the show. Like you found at the show, like, oh, damn, like, I mean, going crazy for us. So just stuff like that, knowing like, yo, it's a whole different market that you just have to take just as serious as you take making the music and making the content. So of course, there's a lot of people that, you know, they love making the music, but when they get on the mic, they're nervous or they love, you know, they have great stage presence at their music, but their music is mediocre. I'd rather be that artist where they have great stage presence and their music is mediocre because they really sold that feeling at the concert for people like, yo, I just like his personality. I like that the fact like he going to turn me up when I go to a show. So I realized, you know, I have the good news, I have the great music, but now it's just like, okay, you know, really getting better as a performer, really making sure that, you know, it's the conversion is there. Okay, boom, he got the, he got the nice quality music. He has the content, but now, okay, now he needs that performance. That's something I feel like I definitely have been getting better at, you know, so, but it was, it was definitely a learning experience. The first show, you know, I really love performing. I love, you know, being able to connect my fans, you know, the fact that I went to a show and I had a New York people are telling me like, yo, bro, I like, you know, you're, I show my people your videos all the time. I love your music. So it really gave me a sense and like, yo, this is the thing that you really want to think about because being on social media so much, you could kind of put yourself between, like between you and, you know, the person, because you're just seeing a username, comment, you're not seeing an actual person for, and I really think about it like that. But really, once you get past that, you break that fourth wall, that's how you're able to build something long-term that's bigger than you for a fourth. Man, that was, what you said, that was beautiful. What you got, either? Man, that was a great way to end it, man. I appreciate you hopping on. All y'all follow ISO Kenny or just check out ISO Kenny. You can learn a lot just how he's moving. You see how thoughtful, bro, is. So, I mean, perfect representations of no labels necessary in many ways, right? And always, basically, every way that we mean it, you represent that. So, so yeah, I'll grab that shot. This is the end of another episode. I don't cover. And we out. That's okay. Thanks, you guys. Yes, sir.