 Condo Insider Show, where we discuss everything as it pertains to condo and association living. I'm your host today, Cheryl Franklin, and today I will be joined by a really good friend I've known her for a long time, Julie Adamin with Adamin Inc. And we're going to discuss our world of property management in the age of COVID-19. So I'd like to take a moment and just welcome Julie. Hi, Julie. Hey, Cheryl. Thanks for having me. Of course. Of course. How are you? Good. Well, we're doing pretty good here under lockdown. I hear you. So of course, I've known you a long time, but let's just take a moment to kind of share with the audience a little bit about yourself and about what you do at the company that you are at the helm. Okay. Well, I just did a little bit about myself here. I've been in the community management industry for 33 years. I can't believe I just said that out loud. 33 years. Of course, I started when I was 14. Of course. Right. Yeah. It was great. So three years and I've done just about everything in the industry. I was a manager, portfolio manager, became a long story short, became an onsite general manager of a very large complex in the Palm Springs area. And then started my own business. And I was doing recruiting executives and managers in the community management business only. And then have done a tremendous amount of consulting since that time, including on management company sales, as well as management company operations and large scale association operations. I'm also a designated expert. So an expert witness type of thing. And my latest project is that I have online classes for brand new community managers or others who just start in the industry and also for board members. So that's my latest thing going on. Well, that's huge. And I think all that experience constitutes you as an expert. Yes, I think. Yeah, which is why I'm really thrilled to have you today. So in lieu of the topic, let's just talk about some of the trends that you're seeing in the industry as it pertains to our new normal for right now and how to manage associations, you know, remotely, if you will. Well, it's been a huge challenge for people. And I've talked to people all over the country about how this is affecting them, the positives, the negatives. It's been very, very fascinating. And, you know, I think that I think we will eventually for our industry now, we'll all come out ahead. This will be good for us in the long run. I mean, forgetting all the other stuff that's going on in the country. But for our industry, board members and associations, as well as for managers and management companies, I think this will be a net good. It just needs to shake itself out over the next six to 10 months. Yeah, that's that's a great way of putting it shake, shake itself out, because right now management companies are adjusting. And when it comes to, you know, conducting meetings or managing, you know, I think we talked briefly prior to the meeting that you're even of the understanding that on the mainland, not so much here, that associations are looking to consider having meetings be zoom remotely, just like we're conducting this show. Indeed. And I'm not quite sure what where Hawaii is at at this point, but on the West Coast, pretty much Washington, California, and I believe Oregon at the same time, the governors have exact by executive order struck all of the code or the statutes that say that unless the documents say so, we cannot hold, you know, virtual meetings. So now it's pretty much legal for the time being to hold virtual meetings. And this has been announced. Amazing and really mind blowing thing for our industry. And I, let me just step back here for a minute. I sit on two, not one, two boards of directors. Oh, fun. I know what I was thinking, but I do sit on two. I will tell you that I saw we hold virtual meetings. And, and I've heard this from other professionals as well is that the meetings are far more concise. They don't take as long. So I think what's going to happen for boards of directors is they realize as they go through this process is that, you know, we don't really need to meet all the time, which, you know, boards do love to meet. And I understand because I'm on, I'm on board of directors and we'd like to, you know, catch the people are thinking, but those of us who sit in on those meetings, three, four, five, six, seven or eight times a month as management, we realize that a lot of those are, those hours are unproductive and not just unproductive for us, meaning in the management world, but they're really unproductive for board members. And a lot of people, you have to remember this, people do not want to become board members because they see those three hour meetings, they're like, wow, they do that, right? So people have become far more goal oriented in their meetings. In other words, they just want to make decisions and move on. And they, they had their discussion, but it's not a lot of extraneous chit chat that really doesn't belong. So I'm finding, and what I'm hearing from other professionals is that the board members like it, and even the homeowners like it, I've heard people talk about having, like the town hall meetings that they would have with their, their owners and they have Zoom meetings. I'm not endorsing Zoom. I'm just saying it's what we're all using. But, and so all the people can still participate, but they don't have to leave their house. And frankly, that's pretty convenient for a lot of folks. I mean, you know, if you got kids or if you're, you know, fixing dinner or whatever, because meetings tend to be whatever, dinner out, right? Close to that. So it seems to be, that's a really productive thing for us in our industry. And it seems that if you're, if you're management staff, and you're, and you're not traveling to meetings, plus a meeting that's an hour longer than it should be, and then traveling back from meetings, think of the hours that management staff can save. I mean, it doesn't mean you could manage another association or two, or you could have a life. But, but the same thing goes for our volunteers. I mean, you know, volunteer board members, I mean, they spent a ton of time doing this and, you know, they're not compensated as you board members all know, I'm not, you're not all right. And you're spending hours and hours doing this. So I find it a really interesting silver lining that's happened here. Yeah. And you know, I, I totally agree with you on that. To conduct meetings virtually opposed to, like you said, driving to a location, engaging with a board and owners for hours, when you can basically cut to the chase, if you will. A few things that I think might be of a challenge that maybe you can shed a little light on. You mentioned a moment ago, town hall meetings. Now, just thinking of that, or trying to visualize that, if you will. Let's say you are managing an association that has like hundreds of owners to conduct a town hall meeting virtually could get a little hairy or maybe not. I think, no, I agree. I think it can get hairy, but zoom can can handle and not just all zoom. I'm not again, I'm not endorsing it can handle dozens and dozens of people. But you know, my suggestion or let's just say, I mean, you're a large scale association like what I used to manage in a well over a thousand units, right? If you don't, you could have more than one town hall and you say, Oh my God, that's still that much of a matter of time. But I don't know, you know, you could have two one hour town halls and probably get through all your people who really want to say something. And it also doesn't mean that you're having a town hall, but also board meetings, the homeowners are able to dial in or to, you know, video conference in. So it's not like your board meetings are all just you while you're on. You still have, and we all know that at most association meetings, there's the same homeowners that show up all the time with their same list of concerns that they want to address. And at least my personal experience and I've kind of heard this from some other people is that now that we've moved to these virtual meetings, oddly, those people are not motivated enough to get online. And it's very, very simple process. Very simple. They're not motivated to get online and talk about a lot of those problems. They can still pick up the phone and talk to us. I mean, I've all board members, you everyone knows who you are, board members, as you know, they call you up if they can't talk to you, but they seem motivated to get on to the meetings. So it's really interesting. They can still have their concerns addressed, whether it's a town hall or whether it's a board meeting, but they can still all talk to you. And it's just that the timeframe to do this has just shrunk that they really don't need all that time. And a lot of it is for your board members, especially your time and attention and managers too, obviously. But it just seems and all their concerns can be addressed. It just seems to get a little shorter, which is not only great for current volunteers as board members or committee members, right? But it's really good for future volunteers. And why is that? Because, you know, all of you board members out there, you know how difficult it is and managers to define new volunteers and new good volunteers. And why is that? Well, typically it's because those volunteers go to a board meeting and they're like, Oh my God, I never want to have to run through that because it was three hours. Right? Well, those people are seeing a far more efficient, a far more efficient process. So you're like, you know, this might be something I would volunteer for. Who but us crazy people would either be managers or board members and sit through this stuff. I know we care, but a lot of other people have to be kind of brought into that process. So I think overall it's going to be a positive thing. Yeah, no, I like it. I'd like, you know, the idea of it. I hope, you know, that at some point I'm sure we'll, you know, we'll follow suit, you know, here on the islands. We tend to, you know, sometimes lag lag behind just a little bit. But I find it interesting that you mentioned that, you know, homeowners may or may not be more inclined to attend via zoom. In my mind, you know, it's easier to jump on zoom than to, you know, kind of go to a location or something like that. But at the end of the day, you just establish new rules. Even if you have an association whereby you have 100 homeowners that just want to sit in and listen, you establish new rules. And I like the idea of the chat function, you know, and you can ask questions and, you know, they can be brought up that way opposed to, you know, giving everyone a platform to voice their opinions vocally within an hour if you have like a town hall meeting or something like that. It becomes a lot more controlled. It's more controlled, but also controlled. Yes, I would say concise because when people are on a video conference, it's my observation that they have a tendency to compress whatever that doesn't matter. I don't know, I'm not talking about even just these kind of meetings, HOA meetings, not that, but any kind of meeting that people have a tendency to compress their thoughts because they, they're, they're on deck, they're right, they're from, they're compressing their thoughts. My personal observation is it's better for them as well, because you have a tendency not to meander off onto, you know, the wild of where I was thinking as opposed to, you want to, if you have your points, you want to say it and you want to get it out and then the board or whoever will take it under advisement or they'll actually answer you. And it's very concise. So there's not this, there's not a lot of, so there's back and forth, but there's also not the extraneous three or four other attendees going, well, wait a minute, back then, and well, what did we do? I don't know. What did we do? Consumes a huge amount of time in the meetings. Massive. Good point. Good point. Good point. And it's a great place for a break. So we're just going to take a moment and head to break. Please come back and join us. Thank you. Aloha. I'm Lillian Cumick, host of Lillian's Vegan World, the show where we talk about veganism and the plant-based diet located in Honolulu, Hawaii. I'm a vegan chef and cooking instructor, and I have lots of information to share with you about how awesome this plant-based diet is. So do tune in every second Thursday from 1 p.m. Aloha. So, I'm Julie Adam, and we're just talking about our new world and the midst of managing associations. And before we left off, we talked more about virtual meetings and the benefits of having virtual meetings, and how they may make things a lot easier and more concise going forward. And I'd also like to mention that I think that it's kind of the saving grace of our time, because in the past, you know, homeowners may have not been as readily inclined to move towards the future of virtual meetings. And so COVID-19 has completely changed all that, and that's kind of the deal. And so we have, you know, more buy-in in terms of virtual meetings. It's almost like it's how we have to do business. It's not something we can decide to do. I also think that, especially here in Hawaii, we have a lot of neighbor islands and such. We have a lot of snowbirds, and we also have a lot of retirees. The challenge I see potentially is getting some of our retirees, if you will. I've often heard, you know, well, I don't have email and all these things. So there's going to be some maneuvering as that, you know, is concerned. What do you think about about that? Well, I hear that, and I think it is a concern, but I think that concern is going away as the baby boomers become, you know, older and older. You know, we are both part of that generation. I can say that out loud, but it's true. So it's getting older and older. I mean, having a computer or, you know, this device, your phone, you can do this. Zoom can all be done in your phone, folks, or it can all be done. So I think actually it's a net positive, especially for snowbirds. And the reason I say that is because, you know, if you're in Hawaii, you know, X amount of months or any resort area, X amount of months a year, and then you're back home, wherever you live, the rest of the months, this device right here allows you to attend a board meeting, which you never would have had that opportunity before. And you can, if you're concerned, you can keep your pulse, your finger on the pulse of what is going on. I, you know, I think, and I know a lot of people will say, well, I never had to do that in my life. I didn't have to run a computer. I had someone who did it or whatever. Number one, I think it's true. I mean, that's, that's starting to go away. Most everybody's had to use one, one at one time or another. And for those board members or homeowners who still don't have that, I would say talk to your adult children and they'll be happy. No, but seriously, I mean, no, no, you're absolutely. Or your next door neighbor who's older than you who can set you up on it because it really is nothing to be intimidated about. You can get an iPad or anything like that. Set yourself up extremely simply. Just have a neighbor or someone help you with that. Even if you, all you want to do is attend meetings. It would be well worth the investment. I mean, and if you're renting your property and you still want to see what's going on, but probably really want to see what's going on at board meetings then, I think it's, it's a, it's a wonderful expense for you to undertake so you can see what's happening in the corporation that you belong to. Yeah. No, I completely agree. It just becomes, you know, a matter of just training. It's simple. It's really easy. Like you said, your kids or your grandkids can show you how. And I think once everybody's on board, they're going to be amazed and might even think, you know, why didn't we do this sooner? Right? I think that's actually right. Why didn't we do this sooner? And I even, so forgetting our board member end of this and our homeowner end of this. And I said, I sit on the fence. So I'm on both sides, right? But for the management company end of it as well, I think this pushed us to doing it. There were lots and lots of management company executives all over the country that were just, just loathed to bring their people, to let their people work from home. On the other hand, I've known companies that let their people work from home from day one, quite successfully. And so I think this has forced all those other folks to think, oh, now we can do this because you really can supervise your people. You really can know what's going on. And in fact, you can sit on your people's board meetings from your own house. So that is all win-win. But I will say that I think it's not like we'll always only have meetings. Of course, that's what we're doing right now by Skype or by Zoom. But I think that we can't ever lose sight of we're a people business, we're a human being business, and we all need to touch each other virtually right now and six feet away. But we all need to touch each other, meaning, and we need to, we need that human contact and that will come back. But I think as our industry evolves, board member end, homeowner end or industry management company end, I think that this will be just an incredible leap forward in what we're able to do and the time it takes us to do it. Because as you know, Cheryl, the only widget we have in our industry is time. Time is our widget. So everything takes X amount of time and that's what we have to charge the associations for. If we can compress that time, if we can, by doing, let's just say we do half our meetings when things get back to normal, we do half our meetings virtually, let's just say that saves each manager 15 hours a month. I mean, as an executive, Cheryl, what would that do for you? I mean, what would you tell your people? Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. And I've spoken with several managers at this time and they're touting exactly what you're saying. They're more productive, particularly those that have the resources to work from home. They already have the operational infrastructure, if you will. And this is also going to force some of those companies that maybe lagged behind them just a little bit in terms of technology. It's going to force them to kind of look at their operational infrastructure as it pertains to technology and it's going to kind of force them to go ahead and spend the money and get it done because it's going to save you time and money in the long run. And what's happened so often in our business, as you know, is that we know that time equates to money, but a lot of management companies, especially some of the maybe, I don't want to say, oh, I don't know. I just say some management companies just do not, well, you know what I'm saying. I mean, some of them are just like, I don't want to spend that money because, oh, I just don't understand it. Well, now you're being forced, being shoved into it and I guarantee all you people out there in management company world who haven't done this yet and you are going to have to do this, you are going to look back and go, I should have done this three years ago, five years ago. And I think you will be very, very happy with it. I mean, it's just an amazing thing to me. As horrible as this whole situation has been, the loss of life, the loss of the economy can't even talk about. But all of that loss for us, there is a silver lining and I take open that. Yeah, no, I'm glad we're talking about this because I think even though we were all in the throes of it and we were doing it, you know, to kind of hone in on that and just say, hey, you know, at the end of the day, it is going to make a huge difference. It's going to make things better. It's going to force us to rethink the way we do business. And that's ultimately going to benefit everyone in the long, in the long run and just make everybody more efficient and how we, you know, manage. I think like you said, we're going to get more volunteers because, you know, having a virtual meeting opposed to, you know, a three hour meeting where half of it we're eating or talking story or, you know, a lot of distractions can sometimes come up when you're meeting face to face. No, you know that. Yeah. And it can be a little more challenging to raise some of those dynamics and, you know, face to face opposed to a virtual meeting where you can have a more concise meeting and have a lot more control. So are more constructive? Well, more constructive. But again, it's not that it's going to completely replace face to face meetings or face to face town halls. Right. But if you could hold those kind of meetings quarterly, as opposed to monthly, if you're an association meeting monthly, I think you would find the productivity goes straight up. I really do. I mean, it's just an amazing thing to watch. And I'm frankly gratified because I wasn't sure, wasn't sure how that was going to work if it was really going to be that productive, but it is. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I don't think anyone was sure about anything at the onset of all of this. Right. I think, you know, we're still not, by the way. Yeah. I mean, it's changing every day. Everything is changing every day. But I think this will make us more prepared for anything else. Should we have to work remotely? This time we were kind of caught off guard, you know, but moving forward, we can put systems and procedures in place that will make us more efficient so that we're not scrambling. Should there ever become, you know, another need? God forbid that, you know, something else happened, kind of forced into this dynamic. But other than that, I think I agree with you. I think, you know, after this is, you know, back to our normal, I think there's going to be an absolute new normal, a normal that includes virtual meetings, new systems in place to help you kind of manage, if you will. I think managers will be a lot more productive. I think that things will get done a lot faster. Because let's face it, there are still some property management companies that are still doing a lot of things manually that could be done, like even automated, you know, and things like that. And even a little, you know, it's AI, if you will. The future is now. Let's face it. It is. And I think to a big degree, we can embrace it without fear. I just, at the moment, my opinion is, I think the upsides of the virtual meetings that we're talking about here outweigh the downsides. And I think anyone who's been a board member and who has sat through three-hour meetings, everybody chit-chats or other stories, or you're sitting through a you know, the homeowner forum, and it's on and on and on and on about the same stuff, not that it's not valid. It's just maybe you'd rather hear it every quarter as opposed to every month. And all of those people are still, everyone who wants to say something to the board, they're not, it's not like they're stopped from saying anything. Of course, there's always email, there's voicemail, and they can attend the regular meetings every quarter or whatever we're going to do, and they can attend the virtual meetings. So, but it just seems to me that this is going to be a game changer for us. It really does. Yeah, no, no, I absolutely think you're right. And it could be, could be a lot of fun actually, you know, to kind of figure out our new normal and ways of doing things better, it's going to lend itself to happier, hopefully happier board members and happier managers. Because like you said, at the onset, I mean, we signed up for this. Sometimes we wonder how or why, but I think it was right. Yeah, but it could be a lot more attractive, you know, to to garner, you know, new talent, you know, if we have these things in place that make make the industry a lot more attractive. On both ends, new talent in volunteers and our volunteer homeowners, board members, committee members, and new talent in our industry, because as you know, despite what's happened right now, and I oh, and part of my executive recruitment life, which I also do, is that finding new people for our industry is so hard, because up until six weeks ago, we were absolute over full employment. I actually think we will go back to that within eight months or so once everything starts picking up. So I think I absolutely agree with you, it will bring new talent in everywhere. Yeah, yeah. And so you're you're going to be an even hotter commodity. And on that note, because I think we're running out of time here before we do, I want to give you the opportunity to share with the viewership how they can contact you, you know, for to take advantage of some of those services. The one that's a hot button for me is particularly training property managers. And I know that. Yes, I mean, I've spent a lot of years in this industry, and I have a publication HOA news line actually in Cam 101 resources, I do. And all these years I've been doing nothing but writing educational articles and speaking all over the country on educational topics to board members and managers. So I have taken all of that experience 20 some years, well actually overall 30 some years, oh, 37 years online education, streetwise education for managers and streetwise education for board members. What it is to do it, what the job is, what's expected of you, and what all those terms are that you need it. I mean, they're very lively, they're very entertaining, much like me. Well worth your time. If you're new to the industry or a new volunteer. Yeah, yeah. And you can reach me through my website, adamantadmianadmin-inc.com or give me a call at 360-265-7100. And I'm happy to help you. If you just need to, you know, talk about something or find something out about your association or your job, please give me a call. I do it all the time. And I can vouch for that. True. I can. This was fun, Julie. So we'll have to do it again, but you know, we're going to have to close. I told you the time just kind of flies by here. She did. Yeah, but this was fun and we'll do it again at some point. Sounds good. Thank you for joining me and on that note, stay safe, everyone. Aloha.