 West Vancouver is a vibrant forward-thinking community and its diverse members share a spirit of striving for excellence with a cutting-edge neighborhood library to match. West Vancouver Memorial Library is known for our welcoming public spaces, the depth and breadth of our collections, our high-quality programming, and also our early adoption of new technologies. Now this reputation is a direct result of the funding from the Library Foundation. I think the prime reason why people donate to the library is because of a direct personal experience and interaction with the library. The library has touched them in some way and they want to see that continue and they want to see other patrons benefit from that for the long term. Donations to the Foundation have been absolutely instrumental in building the kind of library that we have today, whether it's our collections or the programs or the access to new technologies that so many of us enjoy. Foundation-supported enhancements throughout the library create an immediate impact and a lasting legacy. What contribution do you want to make? My name is Patricia Leshku and I am the Acting Head of Youth Services here at the West Vancouver Memorial Library. It is my great pleasure to welcome you to today's event, Manique Gray-Smith, in conversation with Katlia Lafferty. I would like to thank the West Vancouver Memorial Library Foundation for making today's event possible. Before we get started, I have a few Zoom items to share. Today we will be using the automatically transcribed closed caption feature for the hearing impaired. So to enable or disable these captions, select the live transcript option on your menu. There will be an opportunity for questions and we welcome them. For questions, please type them into the Q&A feature on your menu. You may also use that if you have any tech issues and need any technical support because we will not be using the chat or raise hand features today. Let's get started. While I recognize that we are all in different places today, I would like to acknowledge that for those of us on the North Shore, we are on the traditional, ancestral and unceded territories of the Squamish, Slewa-tooth and Musqueam nations. I'm grateful that I get to make my home here and that I can keep learning about how to do better and be better when it comes to sharing this land. If you're uncertain as to whose ancestral territory you live on, I encourage you to visit whose.land to learn more about the traditional lands on which you reside. Now, I am delighted to welcome Manique Gray-Smith. Manique is a proud mom of Teenage Twins and an award-winning best-selling author. Her first published novel, Tilly, A Story of Hope and Resilience, won the 2014 Canadian Burt Award for First Nation Métis and Inuit Literature. Since then, Manique has had seven books come out that cover a broad spectrum of ages, topics and emotions. I particularly love her picture books. Woven into all of Manique's writing, speaking, engagements and online courses is the teaching that love is medicine. Manique's novel, Tilly and the Crazy Eighths, was long-listed for Canada Reads 2021. She is currently writing the Young Adult Adaptation of Braiding Sweetgrass by Robin Wall Kimmerer with a November 22 release date. Also coming out in fall 2022 is a picture book, I hope, with workbook publishers. Manique is an appointed member of the Board of Directors of Royal Roads University and the Minister's Advisory Council for Indigenous Women for the Government of B.C. and is an elected board member for the Victoria Native Friendships Center. In 2019, Manique received a Victoria Leadership Award for Reconciliation. Manique is Cree, Lakota and Scottish and has been sober and involved in her healing journey for over 30 years. She is well-known for her storytelling, spirit of generosity and focus on resilience. Welcome, Manique. Thank you. Manique will be joined today by our climate writer and residence, Katlia Lafferty. Katlia is a Northern Dene novelist from the Yellow Nives Dene First Nation. Her memoir, Northern Wildflower, published in 2018, was the top-selling book in the Northwest Territories upon release and is used as a teaching tool in Indigenous literary studies across Turtle Island. Her recently released, Land, Water, Sky, was placed on the Scotia Bank Giller Prize Craving Candlet list and was nominated for an Indigenous Voices Award. Having grown up in Sombacay, Yellow Knife, Katlia currently splits her time between her Northern homeland and the traditional territories of the Coast Salish people in Esquimalt, British Columbia, where she is in her third year of the Juris Doctor in Common Law and Indigenous Legal Orders with the University of Victoria. She's a busy lady. Katlia is currently serving as our inaugural climate writer and residence. Welcome, Katlia. Thank you. And now I will turn things over to both of you. Okay. Well, I'm so thankful, Monique, that you're sharing your time with us today this morning to talk about your work on the adaptation of Braiding Sweetgrass, the beloved Braiding Sweetgrass. And we were just speaking before the opening about how, you know, it's been almost 10 years since Braiding Sweetgrass was released and it's still very, very relevant today. And I guess I'll just kind of start by asking you how this project came to be. I received an email one day from my friend, her name is Tracy Sorrell McLeo Linden. She's got beautiful picture books. We are grateful and middle grade novels as well. And she said, would you be interested in writing the YA adaptation of Braiding Sweetgrass? And I was like, is this a joke? That was my first response. And she's like, no, I'm serious. I'd like to pass your name along to a publisher. At that time, the publisher hadn't fully bought the rights yet for the book. So it took a while for the process to unfold. And then when it did, our timeline was so tight. So I started working on it in late August, early September, and then the timelines have just been so tight. It's now in the final copy edit place. And with the release of November 1st. Yeah. And I know last time we met, well maybe not the last time we met, but we were in the writing circle together and you mentioned that you might do a sequel to Tilly and the Crazy Aids. And has that kind of been put on hold? Yes, because of the intensity of this project. Yeah. Right, right. And so how much time are you devoting to this project, like throughout the... Well, it varies, right? Depending on the timelines and right now. So right now it's kind of a free space. So I'm doing my other pieces of work. But at points, it was all I was doing for sure. Yeah. And so are you feeling like emotionally, how are you feeling about this project? Are you feeling enlightened? Are you feeling a little bit of pressure at the same time because it is such a wonderful book? And you want to make sure to... I'm assuming you want to make sure to carry that forward as well in your work? For sure. Yeah. That was sort of why I was wondering if Tracy was joking because I was like, whoever does this, holy man. I feel for them and then realize that I was going to be feeling for myself. But it has been probably other than writing Tilly and the Crazy Aids, it's been the most joyous project. And I remember one day I was... My process was in the morning to really to write and then the afternoon to be outside in some way. And just kind of often I was listening then to the next chapter. And then in the evening I would just do a little more tinkering and wordsmithing, like not anything that took a lot of concentration, but just a little more tinkering. And one night I said to my wife, like just when I think I've worked on the most beautiful chapter, then I get another one. And that's what it was like. The hardest part was choosing because the whole book is 220 pages. So we've gone... I had about a third of the space of the original manuscript. And I couldn't say because I feel like reading Sweetgrass is like sacred text. So I couldn't say, I cut this, I cut this, I cut that because it just felt so disrespectful. So what I've been saying is what I'm leaving for people to read in the original manuscript is. And there were some chapters that were easy knowing that most of the readers would be young adults. So the chapters, you know, about being a good mother and some of those were easier to say those will be for when they read the original manuscript. But then there have been some very, very difficult decisions about what goes in this adaptation and what's left for the original manuscript. Yeah. Wow. Wow. It's really interesting, I think, for listeners to learn about the writing process, especially those who may not be writers or who may be wanting to be writers. And so even for me, it's just interesting finding what you find challenging or what you find most rewarding. And I guess what have you found most rewarding throughout this whole process? I think what I've learned through the journey, I mean, the very first time I read Breeding Sweetgrass was in 2015. And after reading the prologue, I had to put it down and just kind of let everything find its rightful place. And I had a long conversation with Darryl McLeod, who wrote Mama Sketch about that prologue. And then we would have conversations at different places in our reading of the book. So I think that's been the greatest gift for me. But also, I'm a Virgo, so there's a part of me that likes to kind of chunk things and have timelines. And that really was part of this process was really figuring out how do we take this beautiful flower and trim it down into buds. And so I could maybe if I could share screen, I can show one picture of the process of my process. So can you see this? Can you see? Yeah. So this was how I, because I'm also very visual, this was how I had to do some of the work is take each of the sections. So these are all the different sections. And then each of these sheets, the orange stickies are the chapters. And then I had the pink stickies were Indigenous wisdom, the green stickies were the wisdom of the plants, and the kind of purpley pinky were the scientific knowledge. And I, because I had to have a visual way to make sure there was a balance of those three strands of the braid in each chapter and in each section as we moved forward. So that was how I worked. And then it allowed me to do that initial draft of what would be kept in. And then the initial writing that would bridge in a way that was different because some significant chunks were no longer in there. So that was the writing then for me of how do we bridge these ideas and concepts when, you know, 1800 words have just been removed that were the bridge. So that was how this unfolded. And then I wrote a whole new intro, and it's called Meeting Sweetgrass. So some of it is all my original writing that is attempted to sound like Robin Wall Kimmerer. And some of it are segments from different chapters that were important to be at the front of the book for a young reader as they went on this journey. Or not a young reader. I think that's one of the things with Braiding Sweetgrass as we were talking about earlier is that I've heard from a lot of people that the size of the text and the heaviness of the book and for some sort of the academicness of the book was intimidating. So I also, when I was thinking about the adaptation, for sure thinking about it for young readers. But also thinking about others who would come in at it from other places where the original manuscript wasn't a fit for them yet for whatever reason. And so it's sort of like when I wrote Speaking of Truth, you know, it's marketed for nine to 16 year olds, but I say it's for nine to 90 year olds. I think that's sort of the same with this adaptation. Yeah. Also, depending on people's different learning styles, right, because there's an illustration for each chapter and it's just a very different feel. A lot of visuals and things. Yes. Yeah, that's great. And so my favorite chapter of Braiding Sweetgrass was The Honorable Harvest. Are you working on an adaptation of that chapter? Oh yeah, for sure that's in there. Great. When the publisher reached out to me to say would you be interested in doing this, my first reach out was to Robin and said, you know, that's all the business stuff over there. But as two Indigenous women, I want to have a conversation first and see if it's okay with you that I do this adaptation. And so we had a couple of Zoom visits and I asked her like, what, when you think about an adaptation, what are the pieces that must be in there? And Honorable Harvest was the first thing she said. Wow. Wow. And so hers is very place-based in where she's from and are you incorporating place-based for you and where you're from and where you live now? I'm not very much because it is still her adaptation, right? Like if when you see the cover, you'll see written by Robin Wolkimer, adapted by. Okay. So, no. Okay. Yeah, and I was actually under the impression and I think maybe other people might be too that haven't really gone into seeing what's posted now on NetGalley for all the viewers to know that there is an option to read an excerpt on NetGalley right now. What chapter was it? Astros and Golden Rudd. Okay. Yeah. And so because it's a nonfiction, I guess this is maybe one of your few nonfiction, how does that feel for you to be writing such a very vast, you know, a lot of work getting into writing nonfiction? It's a place, I think that was part of why Rating Sweetgrass has resonated with people is because even though it's nonfiction, you can feel the love, right? Which is often what engages us in stories, right? Is that, oh, there's the relationship here. There's a connection in some way and nonfiction doesn't always give that, right? Because often it's for your head, not just your head and your heart and your spirit. And so I think that one of the things I've focused on on this adaptation is social and emotional learning and really weaving that in almost like, for me, it's like I think about, you know, the three strands or indigenous wisdom, scientific knowledge and knowledge of the plants. And then when that Brady Sweetgrass comes together in full circle, that circle is the social and emotional learning. And that's really a lot of the change that's in there is bringing that out. So it was a bit of a stretch, but it wasn't because that's sort of how all of my books, whether they're picture books or the novels or even speaking our truth was really written nonfiction, but in that way of love and being in relationship. And in this book, very similar to Brady Sweetgrass, it was like Robin was talking to you as the reader and in this adaptation, it's very similar, right? That feeling of, I'm talking to you, Robin's talking to you and Nicole is drawing for you. Yeah, how nice. And would you say you're really focusing on, like you said, the emotional and the social concepts and are you focusing on the positivity? Like in one in one page here, it says, why is the world so beautiful? And it's a question that you're posing back to the readers to think about. And that's really coming from a positive lens, right? When you think about all the things that are happening in the world right now. Do we often stop to think about why is the world so beautiful and what do we love most about the place that we live in? It's not. Social emotion learning isn't always about the positive, but it's about being able to identify what are the relationships. So there are relationships as humans, but also especially to the land and to the water, our relationships to the all living beings. And social emotion learning is also about identifying what are the emotions that go through me that cause me to change or cause me to act in a certain way. And that, you know, for years, a large percentage of the population has grown up only knowing mad, sad and happy, right? And so this book also kind of deepens that, right? And with the focus of gratitude. Like throughout the book, there are huge focuses on gratitude. And you know, the neurobiology of gratitude is that it lowers our cortisol and increases our dopamine. So when we focus on what we're grateful for, our stress hormone goes down and our feel good hormone goes up. So why would we not want to book about the importance of changing our relationship with the earth? It doesn't do that, right? So that was, that was sort of the approach I took it in the adaptation. Yeah. So almost like instead of focusing on climate change, it's like the default is like you're taking care of the planet so that we're protecting it from further devastation. Yeah. And so would you say that there's sort of that theme throughout when it comes to tackling climate change? That we each can individually do our part in some way by just taking care of the places that we are from and the plants? For sure. That's a huge part of it is. And that's why I'll see, I don't know if I can bring it up, but let me see if I can bring up on the share screen. The Astros and Golden Rod. Yeah. So can you see this chapter? Okay. So this is the adaptation of Astros and Golden Rod. You can see the very first page on each chapter will be one of Nicole Nighthart's illustrations. And in this illustration, she do Robin as a baby the first time that she sees Astros and Golden Rod. And in here, this is the beauty is what illustrations can bring to the text is a teacher or a family member or the reader. If they're reading individually can unpack so much from this illustration. Right. Like when we come back to social emotion, you'll see Nicole. That bundle of Astros and Golden Rod are in a heart. Right. You see the but the bees there. And we talk about the importance of bees are talked about in this chapter and their eyes they're drawn to the beauty. Right. The vibrancy. And it reminds us as human beings that we actually are usually drawn to beauty and vibrancy. Right. When you go into a room, if there's 10 people in there and eight of them are authentically vibrant. That's where you're drawn to right. If you go outside, it's the same the plants like oh wow. And just that beauty of a baby, you know, being held and, and, you know, being just gently covered by their mom just opens doors for so many conversations about the beauty in the world in many ways. And then you can see the light green. We had wanted circles. I'd really advocated for circles. But because of the small number of pages, the circles would take up so much space on the page. We've put them in. If there's a word that I was wondering, I wonder if a reader might know exactly what that is. So we put definition there for ease. And then there will be photographs throughout also. So if somebody doesn't, you know, not everybody knows what an astro flower is not everybody knows what Golden Rod is. So that's there. And then in the dark green, these are the social and emotional pieces. So these are the questions that I've created that just help the reader to pause for a moment and to think and to reflect. And in a couple chapters, Robin talks about the importance of reflection. But I really wanted that to be part of this book that we just slowed down. Because I think that's part of the importance of understanding our roles as individuals in fostering climate wellness, right? What is my role in limiting climate change as much as possible? And you can see more definitions there. The braid of sweetgrass are sentences that just popped out for me. So, you know, you gave this example a moment ago, Katlia, what is why is the world so beautiful is a question I hope we are all exploring. So every time there's a braid of sweetgrass is like one of those sentences that just is like if all the reader does is goes through and sees those braids of sweetgrass, it'll alter them. And then at the very end of each chapter is a call to action. And so some of them are bigger. And some of them are very what might be seen is very small like go for a walk today and notice something new in your neighborhood or where you live. Yeah. It's very interactive. Yeah, that was designed very specifically for that. And it's very educational as well. So that's great. And will it be as long as the original braiding sweetgrass? No, I only had a third of the word camp. Oh, right. Okay. Okay. Yeah, the reason why I ask is, you know, for young adults, do you find that it's harder to get them into a book? Or, you know, nowadays it seems like most young adults are on technology. So how do we get this into their hands in a way that they're going to interact with it while they're reading it and they're going to, you know, hopefully it'll get into the school curriculum. Is that something that you're hoping will? Hopefully. Yeah, I think that would be fantastic. And that's also part of why we made it very visual. So that if a young person's like, Oh, God, I got to read a book, which, you know, but then they pick it up and they're like, Oh, it's a little bit engaging. Oh, I hadn't thought about that question. Oh, I have a friend who loves art. I got to show this to them. Right. So that there, I really attempted in this adaptation to have as many branches of connection as possible. And it won't reach everybody. That's the truth of it. The other piece that that that I did a lot of work around is that, as you said, reading Sweetgrass came out in 2013. And if we think about the knowledge of, I'd say, at least half of the population in both what we call Canada and the United States around Indigenous people has changed in the last 10 years. And so there has been a lot of massaging of that element around Indigenous wisdom about discussing. So there's, as you might remember, Robin talks about Carlisle and the impact on her family. So there's a whole new piece in there about boarding schools, the impact, the ripple effects, because there will be readers who won't know what that means or won't have a sense about why that's important. And then the illustration that Nicole did is just like, wow. Yeah. So you've taken a little bit more relevance of today's what's happening in today's world right now. Yeah. And the other thing is every time where there's writing about either where Robin was living, just outside of Syracuse, or where she grew up. I've given questions or the call to action specific to where the reader is living. Oh. So like I'm blessed to be living on the Wasanic Territories. So it would be like, you know, what is, what is the name of the nation where you live. Right. So that it takes what's in there more to a personal level. And for individuals will go, I have no clue for them to then find out, right. Yeah. Grounding themselves in place and know they are. Yeah, that's important too. So what was your favorite chapter to write? I think the Honorable Harvest. And that was my favorite chapter to adapt for sure. The chapter that hit me the most that was being a good mother. Because as I was listening to that and listening to the book again in preparation for writing in September, I was getting prepared to take my son to school in Minnesota. And so, you know, I was going through a lot of those emotions that she talked about in that chapter. Yeah. For sure. I'm going through that too right now with my son. It's hard. Bittersweet. It totally is that balance between joy for them and our own grief of what, yeah, but yeah. Just, I guess, like a few more questions. I was wondering what your take is on the intersection of science and spirituality and how she's done such a great job of really combining those and whether or not you've got any local knowledge experts to speak on that as well or if you really just honed in on your own personal experience and knowledge to adapt some of the spiritual qualities of the book. Well, keep in mind that she's the author right on the cover so a huge part of it is still her voice in there so I didn't include anything of my learnings of being a visitor here on the wasanic territories or my own teachings. You know, a square was a Kree woman because that would alter the authors. It was a dance. Yeah, yeah, that must have been so difficult to do that without. It's almost like an editorial process without adding your opinion in. Right. Yeah, that must have been a difficult process to always continue to remind yourself. And but what's so interesting though is that it's like, it's like we're kindred spirits because when, when we first visited, I was like, oh my gosh, like, I was just looking at her and she's like, you look like you could be my little sister. And we look similar. But then when we were talking, our language was often also very similar. Like I always say like contributing to the wellness of the world and she said well I say contribute to the well being of the world. So much of what was already in there resonated for me in such a deep way that yeah. This came naturally in lots of ways. Wow, just meant to be pretty much. And I really love how you say climate wellness. I think I might start saying that as well. Well, that's great. I mean, I don't have much else to add other than I'm just really excited to delve into this and for me I mean it was a bit of a daunting task to read the book as well. Especially because it was so it was a very big book right and it takes quite a while to read, but it's it's so important for us to understand what she's talking about and because each of us, it can resonate with all of us and it's important to learn from those traditional ideas as much as possible and I guess just wondering what your thoughts are on on traditional knowledge in general and when it comes to climate wellness and how important it is to kind of lead the way in that or to teach others on how to care for the planet. I think it's absolutely instrumental for sure. And it's also part of what what what I was over there was like what are and and to find a way to say like what are the teachings of the people where you live without having it be a burden then on the people of where they live to share those teachings I mean like there are teachings that are known of the nation where you live that are very public and then there are teachings that are very deep and then some teachings that are not appropriate to be shared at all. So what I was looking for was for them to get to know the teachings that were public and to begin that journey for themselves to understand that of where they live. I think that's a really important piece to to this adaptation is helping the reader explore where I live what what are the ways that people take care of the land here what are the ways that people take care of the water here. What used to happen here. Right like when she talks in there about the cornfields today and what used to be there. Right like just some of those reflective questions for the young people are the not so young readers to go I wonder. No wonder. Why does that riverbed look like there was a river there and there's not a river there now. Well it's happened. It was a dance to not put burden on the local people the traditional indigenous people the first peoples of of where the young readers live but also not to have a panhanding. Right like that was another piece that was really important was like helping them realize that where they live there are stories there is a language there is a vibrancy that is different than when they go to the next nation it might be similar for sure. But there are elements that make each nation unique and their stories in their language and their connection to the land and the water and the stars and how they care for those is different or maybe similar, but there will be some elements that will be different. So you really put it back to the reader posing those questions for them to do their homework. That's really brilliant. And I hope they do. I hope they all take that. I hope so too. And it really gives opening doors for educators and conversations around the dinner table right. Yes, even for educators to learn alongside when they're educating and to ask those questions themselves. That's really great. Wonderful. Well thank you so much I think we might open it up to questions now. If there's any questions from the audience I see quite a few coming in so. Let's see we've got anonymous attendee one of my favorite things about Robin's book is the deep connection to nature. How can your book help city kids find that connection to nature. I'm from New York City, and it can be really hard to find plants and animals. Well hello from all the way from New York. That's pretty much what we were just talking about. It is and I was thinking about you know one of the things is we said I said go for a walk in eight like I want to try go for a walk in each and then I'm like. But what about those young people who might not have nature around them anywhere. What can we have and so I talked about having a plant like one plant in your apartment or in your bedroom or in the classroom. And what we unpacked in that was that when we smell the earth right that first inch and a half of the floor. Whether it's in the plant or it's out in the forest or it's in Central Park or wherever it is. Here I go to a place called calls also known in English as Mount Doug. When we smell that dirt is called humus. It lowers that stress hormone again and increases our oxytocin which is our love hormone, which is what is needed for bonding and attachment and attunement. And when we look at moving back into being with each other, we need that ability to bond and to connect again. And it also increases our dopamine. So I really explored in there like if you if you don't have a green space. Is it possible to get one plant to have. Is it possible if you have a balcony to have a little garden like just some of these small pieces. If you can't if you don't have a balcony. Could you grow a couple things on a ledge in a window. If you don't have a window. Is there some green space in the alley. Or you could grow something so just helping instead of the automatic I don't have anything. Okay well what what might you have. Even if it's tiny and that's what I really hope the readers and thank you for this question. Because it's even if just one tiny change changes us. Then how we show up in relationships with the land and the water all living beings and each other. Changes. Then that fosters climate wellness. It isn't that we have to do huge big things and sometimes we do. But it's the small small changes that change the trajectory. And that's really what I wanted the readers to get. So thank you for that question and I did talk about also. You know on a whiteboard educators can have when students come in in the morning all beautiful scenes. Of the earth coming up. And again that will just lower that stress hormone for them even if they don't have a smell with it. Just the beauty. And when our stress hormones lower all of us are different people. Yeah. Yeah. So thank you for that question. That's a great answer and it sounds like he thought about all the the difference. You know all the things that somebody might not think about you know you've really taken into consideration the possibilities of what they might not have at their exposure so that's really great. And I love the smell of the forest I'm going to have to take my dog for a nice hike in the forest today because it's just so sweet. So Pat says he has a question here. Adapting nonfiction for a YA audience is a challenging undertaking. What writers helped inspire you. Is there a model for the work that you are doing with breeding sweet grass. Oh, thank you for the question Pat. I looked for a model so I bought Michelle Obama's why adaptation. I brought one of Renee Brown's YA adaptations. But what I found was the size wasn't any different. And it seemed like what had been done was that the language had just been changed to a grade eight level. That not much else had been done so I couldn't find a model I went to Monroe's books with the head librarian Kristen there or had bookseller there in the children's section. We went through everything and we weren't able to find anything we went online. I went to Bowlin books here in Victoria also with the head young, the head library librarian I keep saying because we're doing a library visit but the head bookseller for the children and young adult section and we couldn't find anything either. So I didn't have a template. Except for sort of what I knew I didn't want and that was just a simple change in language. Yeah. Um, Riannan, I think our library correspondent has asked how do you decide what gets left out of your adaptation. That's been the hard I mean other than those chapters that I said, originally were really easy. I sent in an outline to the publisher which is learner publishing and to Robin and said here's what I think needs to be kept. And here's what I think needs to be left for when they read the original manuscript. And then Robin came back and said, I think also you could remove this chapter in this chapter and I was like, Oh, thank goodness. There were really huge chapters that I was like, I have no idea how to adapt this like if you think about like some of the chapters are over 40 pages. How to adapt that to seven or eight pages. Right. Yeah. It felt at some points insurmountable. But then I go for a walk. Or I would listen to the chapter again that that was my other go to was I listened to the chapter again when I worked in my yard and then I'd be like, OK, that's what has to stay. Or no, that's what has to be left for the original manuscript. So did you hear something different every time I'm curious how many times you've actually listened to. Um, well, for the honorable harvest, I know I've listened to it 13 times. Wow. Because I knew because it's also such a big chapter. It's a chapter that has so many stories for each of the teachings of the honorable harvest. And they were all together. And I knew that this adaptation had to have it a little bit more concise for the reader, especially if the reader was nine or 10. And just their cognitive development yet wouldn't be able to piece all of those together if the stories were as they were. So we've taken I've taken all the main teachings out of the honorable harvest. The other thing I did was that I watched almost all of any presentation Robyn's done on YouTube. And any visits because in her presentations, because she had less time, she had to be more succinct in some of the teachings. And so that was also how I began to pull down some pieces like, OK, this is how she talked about the gift of strawberries here. And when I took that, I'm like, OK, there's 300 words instead of 1300 words with the same messaging. So it was a lot of detective work as well. Just studying that you're an actor studying how to play the part. Yeah, anything very interesting. Anonymous attendee asks, is your cultural connection to sweetgrass similar to Robyn's? There were a number of threads that are very similar. The importance of sweetgrass and the teachings around sweetgrass, how my family's been impacted by residential schools and the other legislative and policy decisions that have also come as a result of residential schools. My family's love for the land and for gardening. My parents always had gardens and we were when I was a kid, we were all I have this picture of me in kindergarten. Because we were always outside and there's this picture of me in kindergarten painting and I had out like a white smock on and I looked so serious. Because it was like, oh, I'm supposed to be in school, but what I loved was being outside like we were always outside. So there are a lot of similarities for sure. And a lot of differences. Yeah. Another anonymous attendee asks, I think your writing is a great way to engage people on climate issues. How do you use your writing to send this important message while also appealing to a wide audience? I think that's going to be the interesting piece when the book comes out is how do we do that? Like you think here we are having this visit and the book's not even out for another 10 months. A presentation I'm doing this week at a college in the States and the book again isn't even out yet. That there is already an interest and I think as the book comes out that that's going to expand and it will allow then more people to come to the conversation in a way that upholds dignity and respect. Right. Like I think that's sometimes what happens when we talk about climate change or climate action is that it doesn't always uphold the dignity of everybody who's involved, but especially the earth. And when we talk about climate wellness, it is then we are in a relationship to keep this place well. So what's my role? What gifts do I bring that I'm responsible to share? What gifts do you bring and how do I support you to bring those gifts? I think that's the difference that allows people to read this and be inspired. And, you know, when I asked Robin and she's been asked this question many times in interviews, if people only did one thing to change and to contribute to climate wellness, what would it be? And she says plant a garden. And if you don't have a plot to do that, again, like I said earlier, plant peas in your window or plant tomatoes in your window or grow lettuce in the kitchen window. Right. Like one small thing makes a huge difference. Yeah. And we are not, we're not separate from the earth. We're one. And I think that's something that Robin really conveys very well throughout. I have one from Justin. When we talk about going out into nature, how do we avoid King of ourselves as separate from nature? Okay, I haven't, I didn't actually read this until just now. Sometimes it feels like we think of ourselves as something outside of nature that is just visiting. So that is exactly what we just talked about. Yeah, it's changing our worldview. Right. Like, in many ways we've been raised that way. When we harm the earth, it doesn't hurt. But what we don't realize is that it hurts anyways when we harm the earth. Right. When we other the earth, we can make decisions. But when we realize we're in relationship, then we make different decisions. And often those different decisions don't benefit economy. And so that's actually a part of the book that we've kept in is talking about the economy. Talking about the decisions that are made from a corporate level, because these readers will be or are depending on their age reading them are the decision makers of the future. And so wanting to make sure that they just like you asked Justin realize that they are in a reciprocal relationship. So what they do is going to come back to them. And I don't think when I was doing my research, I didn't find any other books that talked about that for this age group as explicitly as the adaptation does. Yeah, for sure. That's really great. I love your work and I'm excited to get this adaptation into our school libraries and the hands of our kiddos. As usual, thank you for your interplay of wisdom, compassion and gentle reflections. I hope there will be an audio version where you are the narrator as part of the editing process. Do you have kids, young adults read what you write. Thank you. There is talk about the audio edition. So we'll see what unfolds. I had two young people read the book. The publisher right now is also working with a group of young people. And I also had the head bookseller of a youth section at a local bookstore really support me in the adaptation as well. She would write back and say, I think this sentence needs to come back in. She really was very detailed in the feedback because she's the one that's selling the books, right? To not only the young readers, but the adults that come in, the educators. And I think what's beginning to happen is, and I don't know if we'll ever see this. But I think that that YA wall of, okay, only young people go into that section, whether it's in the library or the bookstore. I think that that wall is coming down a little bit. And many are realizing that some of the most beautiful and prophetic books that have been written might be for young people, but they're also for us as adults. Especially, I don't know about you, but I've really found through COVID, like to read something really intense or heavy deep and real. My brain is just not, I need lighter, I need wisdom, but not in a way that I have to really pull it out. Do you know what I mean? So I think YA is evolving hugely. I hope so. Anonymous attendee asked, do you keep the scary people statues in the forest in your adaptation? I think they might be referring to the wind ago. Oh, yes. Wind ago is in there for sure, because there's such important teachings from wind ago. Right. If we don't, if we don't talk about wind ago and the wind ago that's in us and the wind ago that's everywhere, how do we help these young people realize what the change is? Right. Especially when we talk about wind ago in regards to social media, when we talk about wind ago in regards to what's in our closet, when we talk about wind ago about what do we either don't eat. If we don't have that, then we don't give opportunity for the reader to reflect about what is it about me that might want to change? And then what's one small thing I can do to make that change? We've got one here. I am a primary school teacher and I am so excited about your book, even though it will be aimed at a teen audience, will I be able to use it with my grade two and threes? I think that there will definitely be some illustrations you can use. I think there will be some pieces you can pull out for sure to use. There will be some that might not be yet ready for them. But like when I think about the chapter, the gift of strawberries, for sure, right? The honorable harvest, for sure. The chapter on gratitude, for sure. And so many opportunities to do art projects, to do projects of kindness and community as inspired by the book. Yeah, for sure. And you had mentioned that you had a grade nine or age nine, ten in mind when writing. Do you have an actual person in mind that you write for sometimes? Or even an elder, for instance. I know elders would probably really love to read this book as well because it's easy, easier read. I thought a lot about my mom. Her reading, she has grade four, so her reading isn't, you know, hugely expanded, but she loves to read. And sometimes she reads a paragraph and then she has to really pause also because her cognition is beginning to change. She's 81. But I thought about her a lot when I was writing this book about, okay, how can I get these 2,400 words to 300 words in a way that my mom would understand? Yeah. Wow, that's a task. That's such an important task. Such important work you're doing. Anonymous attendee asks, I love the wall of post-its. I love the wall of post-its too. Do they always figure in your writing process or is it unique to this book? No, they often figure in my writing process. Yeah. Because it's my visual way. I also have charts for each section in which chapters, what's gone through the first draft, what's gone through the second draft, what's the third draft, what the illustration has been done, when it's come back from Robin, so that I can see also what's unfolding. Is that a way for you as well to keep organized? It must be hard to keep organized when you're, yeah, version control and all those things can get a little messy sometime. Yeah. Kate asks, all of Monique's writing is so amazing. Her books, whether story books or the incredible speaking, our truth should be read and shared by everyone. I know Robin's book adaptation by Monique will be so important and how was kinship included in the book? Oh, thank you. Well, this is part of the very beginning of Meeting Sweetgrass is, and I'm not sure we're going to do it. There is a lot of conversation unfolding right now. At the very beginning, I talk about the pronoun key, right? And you might remember that there's just a small section in Meeting Sweetgrass where Robin talks about key, about our relationship that she went to the elder and asked like, what word do we have that would describe our relationships? And especially our relationship with the earth and the elder said, Anishinaabe key, b-n, I think it was, b-i-a-n. And the elder said, but really it's key. And that's about our life force being reciprocal with the earth, that when the earth is dying, our life force is also dying. And so it started her thinking about, well, could we instead of just, she said, you know, children when they're little, they talk about, you know, the rabbit is they or he or she. And as we get older, we talk about it as it. And so right at the very beginning now in Meeting Sweetgrass, there's a big section about that pronoun and the relationship in other languages like in Chinese, the qi, right about life force, and her conversation about kin, about our relationships and being, all of us being related. So we're having some discussion about if I change all of the he and she and they in the book to key. And part of that's also going to a group of young people to say like, is that would young people, would it, would it land, right, really. So we'll see what happens. I'm just trusting that whatever is supposed to be will be. So yes, kinship has talked about a huge amount in this book. Very, very cool. Yeah. Thanks. We've got another one from Justin. As a future educator, I'm curious if there is any companion book to Braiding Sweetgrass for educators, suggested activities, discussion, questions, etc. Could there be a companion book for this why at YA adaptation one day. I think there'll be a teacher's guide. I think that will be worked on that I guess supposedly would be called a companion book. And I'm hopeful it's a very small publisher in the US that's that bought the rights to publish this called learner. They do a lot of nonfiction books. One of the things that Orca book did with speaking our truth only I do have it here. This book here is they created a full website for educators and families to go on I did lots of videos is all kinds of things for that book. It's an ideal if the publisher was able to do that for Braiding Sweetgrass. Again, kind of coming back to your question also Cali about the different learning styles right and the young people who are so used to learning via technology that if there were portions in a website or some way to be able to use Braiding Sweetgrass online in some way would be. I think a gift. Yeah, even in an app or something as well. We've got a few more here. My teenager will not let me recommend books for her anymore. How can I get your books into her hands? Give them to her friend as a gift. Maybe a friend will give it back to her. I'm not sure I think that's a good question. Yeah, I think like for me I have a teenager as well and she won't get into something that I know she's going to love like I know because I know her you know and just as long as she even just reads the first page. If I could just get her to read the first page. So that's a question I have to because I want her to read so many other books instead of being on her phone. So if you have the answer that would be. I think also having them around right, especially in the times when nobody might see them looking at it. Right. And that their friend influence and their peer influence is so strong. So if they say, you know, I saw this YouTube and they were talking about this book or her. That's why I've done some YouTube pieces that are on my website and just to kind of attempt to reach people in all different ways and intrigue people. Yeah. You have a very distinctive voice says one participant when you write is that voice in your adaptation or have you changed out of respect for Robbins own voice. Well, I'm going to be really curious what readers say. I think actually what you get is a blend of our both of our voices. Yeah, which are very similar. But I do think you get a blend of both of our voices. Another person says what is your process of collaboration between yourself Robin and the illustrator. If you go to my website you can see we had a visit with Robin a kitchen table visit with her in December I went to Santa Fe where Nicole and I had heard the illustrator lives and we spent a week. I part of my original outline was I had to say what I thought the illustrations could be in each chapter. And then Nicole and I sat together and really worked through each chapter and pulled out. Many of them were the same illustrations but we added pieces or or some of them she had a totally different idea that. Like, well, you're the illustrator so yeah let's go with your idea. And those were all sent to Robin, but that kitchen table visit is the three of us visiting Nicole and I have had a very, because we're friends and because we've worked together before we have a very collaborative back and forth. I'm also grateful that this publisher sends me her work. I mean, I see it but they also are sending it to me which doesn't always happen with publishers. And then each edit each round of edits goes to Robin so this last final round of edits is with her right now. And I'm not sure how much will change or not change and then we'll do copy edits and then pretty much it's off to the printer. That's exciting. So you're busy now. Imagine how busy you're going to be once it's published. How do you manage your time. I am. I'm really wanting to do a lot in this capacity of zoom because I for 30 years run my business and traveled a huge amount and, and I knew there was a cost for me, but I didn't realize until coven and we had to slow down how much of a cost there had been for me, even being away from my family. So now that my kids are out of school and my son's actually in the States playing baseball going to college and my daughter will be in commotion next year. I have more flexibility to travel. But I don't want to be traveling a huge amount. So, and I also feel like traveling a huge amount to promote this book is an antithesis to this book. Right. Like when we think about our environmental footprint. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. So zoom is working well for you. I love zoom. I mean, I miss the personal but in regards to being home. I'm very grateful. Yeah. The questions keep coming in. So if you have a little bit more time. Sure. Okay. So this is such an exciting project. How has this experience inspired you and how has the process of adapting and others work changed the kind of project do you want to work on next two questions. Mm hmm. Well, I want to get back. I'm working on a novel that is like nothing I've written before. When my first novel Tilly came out I was interviewed by Sheila Rogers and she asked me this question didn't make it to air but she asked me when are you going to write about your Scottish ancestry. And so this novel that I'm working about is about two Scottish sisters growing up in a home with their mom and their grandma. And the incredible dysfunction in the home and how these two adult women are looking to find love and figure out what love really is. So I want to get back to that. And how what was the first question again Kelly. How has this experience inspired you. Mm hmm. Well, I have a bigger garden, bigger garden area. My yard looks different. The amount of time that I'm out on the land is different. It's way more exponentially more so without any question. My own curiosity about the neuroscience of being on the land and our emotions has also hugely been inspired. I've been taking courses and getting mentoring from neuroscientists that focuses on human behavior in and trauma in Ontario. And I think it's also been healing in my relationship with my family because we did things so differently than my friends when I was growing up and I never really understood it. I never really got why we spent so much time like we would go on the weekend and we wouldn't come back till Sunday night. And I'd be filthy and my nails would be dirty and but all my friends were at home or they were watching happy days or they were doing whatever. And this writing this book has allowed me to understand what my parents were how they were why they were raising us the way they were. And how important that has been for both my sister and I. So almost like a newfound appreciation. For sure. Yeah, for sure. And gratitude. How do you teach the Honourable Harvest in the adaptation? So in the adaptation I've taken the main themes so it starts off actually with them kind of as a list. Because also I wanted to think about the different learning styles and then some learning styles like things 1234567. And then in each of those there is a story and then a little bit of the teaching is unpacked just enough that if somebody doesn't fully get this the teaching in the story it's unpacked for them. But also is enough that then they can go deeper. So each of those teachings within the Honourable Harvest has a story and a little bit of unpacking. Okay, that's great. Does Robin herself appear in the book. I mean she appears throughout. I guess maybe this question is more of is there a forward or. I don't know if they'll be forward it'll be I'm. I think that's sort of a marketing piece and I'm not sure. Yeah, I'm not sure yet. Here's an interesting one. What are you reading right now. Well, sometimes I like to read what my son is reading. I just finished reading. The new book by Jodi Pico Pico. Oh my gosh the name of it has just left me the blue cover. Any of you librarians with this who can help me. It's about covert superlatively written story book over and so my daughter is has just finished reading it but my son is reading Napoleon Hills. Yes, wish you were here. Thank you Patricia. So I just finished reading that with my daughter and my son's reading Napoleon Hills thinking grow rich. I think that's what it is. And so that's what I'm reading right now. I know totally out there. But sometimes we have to do that for me alone at sometimes I have to do that read something that is so out of what I would normally read. Yeah. I love biographies and I had, I went and bought a bunch of books from the library, you know, hoping to read them one day and my Will Smith book has been sitting there for a while so I picked up my Will Smith book recently after all the things that have been going on. Well, interestingly, I had it on my audible and I've deleted it after. Really, really. Yeah, you know, I have such a, I had such a respect for most of them. I kind of want to figure out what's going on there but anyway. So, a couple more questions they just keep rolling in. What indigenous writers writing for a YA audience do you recommend and what about YA writers who write about our climate crisis. So, yeah. It depends what age for YA because I think your books Katya I think five little Indians that just one Canada reads for some readers in YA for sure. One of the books that I think is really important for YA that hardly ever gets talked about is Whistle by Richard Van Camp. I think it's like 28 pages. When we talk about taking perspective and about empathy and about critical thinking, it's such a beautiful book. And again, it's like 28 pages. I also, I love and I look forward to what's coming more from Carly Baker. And, well, of course, there's always Eden Robinson, although I can only read sometimes some because I'm a very tender person and so sometimes the graphicness of the incredible way she described scenes like leave me just only thinking about the scene. A little bit disturbing sometimes. Sometimes, yeah. Yeah. And I think that's an important. I think just for young people, but that's an important thing to think about is like, what am I reading and what am I ready to read and that happens at different times different seasons. What I'm really looking forward to is more of our books about joy and about love and about happiness and about our reclamation because, you know, when Tilly in the crazy eights, when I was shopping it around one of the big houses really was interested in the publisher said give me a week don't show it to anybody else because I got to take it to the marketing team. And the marketing team said there wasn't enough trauma in it they didn't think it would sell. Yeah. And so, you know, that's really my hope with YA is that it is, it is the place where the books about our love about our joy about our hope really begin to be more prevalent. For sure. There's just too much of the other stuff in the world so we they need a place to go where they can get away from all of that. Yeah. And a few other authors mentioned here are Catherine of her met David Robertson Christine day Tracy Surrell and Melanie Florence and Cynthia Lighting Smith. Yeah, especially for younger but her more recent one Hearts Unbroken is a beautiful book for YA for sure. Yeah. Yeah, the victim narrative definitely needs to get gone. Some of the things that I try to work on to is more focusing on empowering. Right. Powering people, empowering our communities for healing. How do you celebrate after a good day's writing a walk in the forest or working outside. Yeah. And do you write every single day. No, no, no. And neither do I have to be in the mood for it but there are some writers that say you have to sit there for 10 minutes a day and just do something like it's like exercise or something but like no I'm good I'll just, I can binge right or I could do it so many other ways right when you get the inspiration to do it. And I think it's my nature also when somebody tells me I have to do something. Exactly. Yeah. Um, yeah. Um, so for many kids and teens the climate crisis might feel out of their control. How do we give them hope without putting all the responsibility on their generation. Thank you. I think I do think that this book does some of that, because it allows them to realize that it that they as one person or a generation can't change everything. But it's reflecting on what can I change and then what can I help those around me change. So is it that I put get one of those great big liter bottles of pop, fill it with water and put it in my toilet tank, the back of the tank so that when I flush it takes less water. What if we don't flush every time. What if I plant a garden or even if I just plant lettuce in our kitchen. So I have lettuce for my salad. Like just so that they begin to realize that just these small changes bring us hope. And they are part of the solution. They might not change things dramatically and they might feel like well that's not going to help a huge amount. But if we all did it. Right. If we all put that leader thing in of water in our toilet would have a huge impact on how much water was used. I'm not sure that fully answers that question but I think it's a piece of it. Yeah, there's a lot of things we can do small changes and big changes and as my job here as a writer in residence for climate I've been finding that it's a paramount. It's a big responsibility that's impossible to conquer and it's just something that we have to continuously work at. And I think that's come up for me is this climate anxiety this notion of climate anxiety that a lot of us have now. And this defeatism almost or this impending doom that is kind of feels like it's upon us. Do you think that this adaptation will help to relieve some of that. I hope so because I think that anxiety is is feeling like I don't have anything I can do. I know that when readers read this that they see one or two things that they can do to just begin and then once we begin we see more opportunities. But in that in that anxiety we stop right our brain when we are feeling anxious the neurobiology of our brain is it doesn't look for answers right we just remain in our chest usually and have a hard time breathing. And even though it doesn't feel safe it's actually safe because it doesn't mean we have to change. And I'm hopeful in this book that that's what people realize is that we do have to change doesn't have to be huge or drastic it can be little. But when we make that change some of our anxiety will decrease because we are in movement. We are making change we are contributing to the wellness of the world. Even if it's just one cause or 10 causes. Yeah. Um, any any thoughts on a possible documentary and it going one step further into the film world. I have no idea. That would be pretty cool to see that it would reach a lot of other audience to. I think we're we're out of questions so I mean, oh there's Patricia. Oh, we've got one more. Yeah. Last one. Can you share one of your favorite passages with us. Oh, I, I don't have one hand like I'd have to pull up the manuscript. That's okay because we can. I think I'll share a little bit I think at the very beginning. I think I think it's not in the original manuscript maybe but halfway through the first chapter where Robin talks about sky woman falling. And pure wetting through the sky and all the things that she brings with her and and how when you know she lands on the earth that it is the all the animals that the geese catcher and they bring her down to earth. And all the animals realize that, you know, the earth isn't there yet they bring her down to the back of turtles back and they realize they have to do something in order to keep her alive. And all the animals begin diving in the water to bring up some earth, some of the soil and and none of them are able to until muskrat goes down and actually gives up its life to bring up just a tiny little bit. That's the bottom of the lake and how that becomes earth puts it on the back of turtle and becomes part of Turtle Island. And one of the things we've done with this manuscript is that actually Nicole's done a form of a graphic novel of that story. So when the reader first opens the book that's what they enter into is like graphic novel form of the story of sky woman falling. And on the top of the first page. I'm trying to remember the exact words. She felt like a pirouette falling through the sky. And then the very last words of the book now are, let me tell you a story. She fell through a pirouette falling. Whatever those I can't remember the exact like eight words. So the first words of the book are the last words of the book now. Very full circle. Oh my goodness. One of the things that I do every day is I walk through the world looking for my bright spot. And I really want to thank you both for making it such an easy task to find that bright spot today. Thank you for sharing your kindness, your process, your, your wisdom, your experiences. It was it was just a joy to hear you talk about the adaptation for Braiding Sweetgrass and I cannot wait to read it. For those of you like myself who just cannot get enough of Katlia, we do have our climate writer in residence for another couple of weeks. So please consider joining us next Saturday for an amazing event, Indigenous perspectives on the climate crisis. Katlia will be joined by a remarkable group of Indigenous leaders and activists who will speak to the climate crisis. And you can also follow Katlia's weekly blog on our website. Awesome. Thank you both very much. Thank you Katlia. Thank you. That's a beautiful way to spend the morning. Thank you, Patricia. Thank you and goodbye everyone. Thank you. Take care.