 By the way, I forgot to hit record, so that's my bad as a facilitator, so jumping in. And for those of you who might be joining us, we're looking at a spreadsheet that Stacey has shared about sort of helping identify some activities or performance based assessments around the framework. Any other questions from the, from the folks to join the breakout group because this is your time to to ask questions of Stacey. Yeah, I was just wondering, you know which of these assessments is sort of an online, you know, assessment that people take automatically and you know scoring those and which are more hands on or you're doing something on paper. Now, how did they buy that. So, I'm sorry, also, sorry, also just assigned like dumping like so there's an and maybe I can share. So I would say that most of them are are kind of like the ones that we are working with are not interact like they're, they're on paper or like maybe in the more traditional survey type stuff format. And those I should say that the assessments that are a little bit more kind of can be lifted and adapted for different contexts right. So, I think that's what's everybody. I talked to a lot of people that want digital skills assessments. And, you know, really what's best about, you know, assessing somebody's skills that's within a context right and which depends on, you know, your learner and kind of what they're interested in. And so, so I think, again, yes, some people kind of integrated within other assessments that they're they're doing as part of a part of a class. So, there is, and then, so then you have some interactive assessments like that are built into like a program or curriculum. So like Google has built in kind of assessments, or in the kind of lessons that they do and there's a certification you can take so there's a lot of applications that are kind of standalone pieces, which, like, you know, is usually cost money in a lot of time really it should be a real need a reason why you're spending that much energy into something like that. But then of course then you have more star, which is probably this the most popular most common kind of digital skills assessment, which is this, it's a interactive like multiple choice questions that you can take. And their assessment is available for anybody to use and then you can pay to to access their curriculum and track users and things like that. North Star is it came out of adult education in Minnesota as curious if is anybody here use North Star at all. Okay, Rachel. Yeah, curious about your experience with it. Yeah, I mean it's kind of like a almost like a simulator like if you know that you're clicking on a screen a simulated screen of something and maybe their opening files. It was, it was very useful we used it for like a pre assessment in a basic, you know, computer course that we gave. And so we had different models on like file management and stuff it helped us really gauge where the students were in a post assessment to the question I had actually for you was if you know if there's anything like North Star for mobile phones if anybody is doing anything with mobile phones like in that same vein where we can gauge students ability to toggle between apps or something like that. I don't think anything exists now. I think that North Star may be working on something for that. You know, it's so funny because it's been so I got mentioned briefly in the talk that our group has done a lot of international work and actually I for a project that our group had worked on and then I also picked up. We kind of co created this mobile information literacy curriculum, like some years back, and it was originally developed for, you know, again for these kind of context where people were starting with mobile phones so like some years ago it was like oh you know man Mar all of a sudden like their first interaction with the computer is using a mobile phone. And so from our experience with that, as we started seeing these trends in the US of mobile only we were trying to like. What about mobile like let's focus mobile let's integrate mobile and I feel like that it took this pandemic to like really like be like, okay yes, it's important. Because yeah, because far in my interviews and conversations with organizations and you probably have more knowledge about this is like you know they, you know trying to do everything remotely and so you're going to start with what people can do use with their mobile device because that's what they're most familiar with and then you can build upon that before moving to the computer. And so I see a couple of comments. Yeah, so I think that North Star one of the things that I am not crazy about some of the things North Star especially their basics assessment I feel like really focuses on things that I don't think are really as important to start with, like you know, you know, I think one of the things is like you know tell the difference between like a monitor and it's CPU like things like that. And it's like yes sure like that's good but again thinking about somebody who is like really beginning coming in, like, let's not get bogged down until like some of those terminologies like let's just like, let's get them doing what they want to do and then we can you know backfill some of that. And then, and then again there's no, there's no mobile abuse to that. I think what's, what's with appealing about North Star is it's, it's something you can use out of the box. They have a lot of support to it, there's a lot of people using it. I know our state library is actually like bought a license and that's going to for libraries to be able to use it. So, so it'll be interesting to see how, how they, how they end up doing that scale. Any other quite I think you know where we're some of those shortcomings of North Star is I think why there was a couple questions around that performance based. You know, sort of element I think one of the things that we've seen here in Chicago, or even say Illinois with the words that are using there's language barriers, obviously with North Star and just that setting in general. You know, being in a proper test can be intimidating, whereas if you're just asking a student to do something and just observing them, you can sometimes get a little more insight and sometimes they're just doing it in a different way than the way that sort of prescribes on that test as is the case with any. You know sort of box there can the standardized I guess test if you will. Yeah, and there's some good points in the chat here too I think something else that kind of. I don't know if North Star necessarily does that some of these sort of same sort of assessments do where it's, you know, it tests to see if you know, you know, like, you know, can you click on the right menu first to go where the edit button is or that and it's like, who cares, like I click around on menus all the time because I can't remember. Yeah, I will say that I am there were some assessments that I didn't score that one line only because I had some other route of copying and pasting or something like that. Right. So, mm hmm. To that point and one of the other comments that was made by Amy thank you is the challenge is being outdated so you had mentioned that you know that's one of the things that you're looking at how do you envision sort of, I guess, maintaining this framework, knowing that like a lot of you know, the genesis of the framework itself is because you were looking at the things that are common across these assessments and this curriculum. As a sort of mechanism for defining what are the skills folks need but when you're looking at things like the skills need people need for work, or which is sort of going to be changing in an ongoing basis what do you have plans or thoughts in terms of how you're going to work to sort of update the this the framework. No, I mean really. I mean somebody came to me and we're like, here's some money to do it. Okay, let's talk. You know, comes down to comes down to funding. And I, you know, I think that if we were to do an update. I think that one of the first steps would be to then go back to. Yeah, thanks Rachel. Yes, very interested in this my email address is available. You know, would be that we would talk with a little bit more back again to the organizations, you know, going back to this idea of kind of around, you know, it's original purpose and talking with organizations and like what do they need and how is this useful. I think it's, it's interesting to see kind of where it's been a constant, you know, it's been, it's being used and adapted from. I mean I would love to see others take up on it and riff, you know, kind of improve upon it. And, and move this forward to so I think that's one of the nice things about research right is you can put something out there, you put something out there and then others take it and and make it better. So, yeah, no, no, no plans at this moment to do further updates. Yeah, I just to that and I chatted a link in the, in the chat. And that is the way that we had developed actually as part of digital us that it includes the Seattle framework as well as a number of the curriculum assessments that they used for that, as well as some interesting studies that actually released around the same time last year. There's one sort of just understanding like the implications of these changing skills that that are needed for success using technology, and it is it's it's not going to, you know, stop or go away and it's not. There's like the baseline skills that are that sort of are part of digital resilience so that one can adapt to a new technology when it comes around. And there's even things that, you know, we continue to struggle with even as seasoned professionals there was a great podcast by Ezra Klein, last week I think on how email and slack have actually made us less productive because of sort of the nature of the intrigue and the sort of idealism around being able to immediately contact somebody and how that really actually creates more noise than. And I've said this for a year, you, how can you name something slack for something that is about productivity that makes no sense to me. No, and that's anything that's in it goes to like this, you know, thinking about digital literacy and this intersection of like 21st century skills right and like you know strategies around, you know, managing all this, all this stuff. Although I know that we're about I think about out of time, but unless I have my calendar wrong, but I didn't want to mention going back to kind of what you talked about there. Like building up for it to work, I have like these, I, what I what I'm hope to be hope to work on within the next year or so is really is writing kind of a larger paper about digital skills like building upon all these pieces of research that I've been doing with these different organizations and conversations that I'm having, like with, like people with youth, it really is, you know, thinking about, you know, digital skills in the placement of kind of technology, you know, you know, trying to synthesize things to be again like a kind of a kind of a different angle the resource and again kind of making this can you're talking about the digital assessments that are available and not available and how they relate to these other kind of frameworks and stuff and it's, I've got a lot of things kind of swirling around and I'm hoping that I can put some time aside this summer to kind of actually get that down. Get some drafts going. Great. Well thank you again so much for your time today. And for all the work that you've done it's, it's helpful and I'm hopeful that the work that we do can help to amplify that great sort of start. Yeah. Yeah, thanks so much for having me this is great I love that. You know you're taking, you know, building upon our framework and building it out and you know into this completely different kind of these resources that's fantastic. You know why we, you know, do the research for people to use it so it's great to see it being used. All right, well everyone enjoy your afternoon I don't know if we all have beautiful cherry trees around us but it's like sunny here in Chicago so hopefully you can enjoy your afternoon and weekends and thank you again stay safe we're joining us today. I put my email address again in the chat feel free to reach out if you want to talk some more. Thanks so much. Take care everyone.