 Focus the live program brought to you by the government information service for the National Television Network on programs and policies of the government of Saint Lucia. We are happy once more that you've been able to join us and reminding you that some part of this program you get an active involvement by calling us on 4682162. We're also live on WVENT 93.5 FM and we're also streaming on Facebook and say welcome once more to my co-host Lisa Joseph. Good day Lisa. Good morning. It's good to see that we're in the coordination belt again for the day. I'm very happy about that Ryan. Today we have promised a very interesting show as always, one with lots of information and this one is of particular interest since we had the Minister for National Security, Justice and Home Affairs on I think that must have been like three shows ago and he gave us some insight into what the government is planning for the National Forensic Laboratory. So today we'll be speaking with the director of that facility and giving us some insight as to what some of those plans are and how the facility is hoping to improve under that strategy and of course there's also a big symposium coming up for the weekend which is of extreme importance to us as well so we'll unpack all of those things a little later in the program. Yes so today we get our program started and we go into our new segment looking at some of the major stories we've covered recently. The Ministry of Agriculture along with the Republic of China Taiwan has embarked on a project which seeks to reduce the country's food import bill. The enhancement of the efficiency of production, distribution supply chains in the fruits and vegetable sector project will focus on seven crops over a three-year period. With an annual food import bill of 4.5 million dollars, St. Lucia with the help of the government of the Republic of China Taiwan sought to undertake a project which seeks to enhance the efficiency of production distribution supply chains in the fruits and vegetables sector. The project will focus on seven crops with a view to reducing the country's food import bill by enhancing agricultural intelligence information systems, analyzing market demands and assisting existing farmers and potential farmers, plant production cycles based on market demands. His Excellency Ambassador Douglas Chen says the biggest challenge facing St. Lucia today is how to achieve food security and combat climate change. We all know St. Lucia people spend so much money as PS Felicia mentioned to import seven important fruits and vegetables such as cabbage, watermelon, cantaloupe and tomatoes from overseas. The import value is increasing every year. Therefore, Taiwanese government is willing to work with the government of St. Lucia to reverse this trend and promote local production and the consumption of the seven important crops on a sustainable basis. Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries, Physical Planning, Natural Resources and Cooperatives Honourable Ezekiel Joseph says with the introduction of new technologies and techniques, St. Lucia can produce these crops more sustainably, thus reducing the food import bill. One year we imported over one million dollars worth of lettuce. We can. So I'm saying that I have the fullest confidence that we can with the improved technologies that will be introduced to us from Mario and his technical team from the ICDF mission, we should be able to cultivate the crops when they are needed. The project will focus on cabbage, lettuce, watermelon, cantaloupe, bell pepper, pineapple and tomato and will receive technical assistance from the Taiwanese technical mission. With the support of the government and people of Taiwan, we have gotten both financial and technical support and the financial support will be for a period of three years. So which means that this project for the next three years we should see a reduction. You hear me? We should see a reduction in the importation of the seven crops that we have identified. Coinciding with the launch of the project was the graduation ceremony for the training of farmers who will be engaged as part of the project. The Department of Public Service has launched a same note to bullying campaign, focusing attention on bullying in the workplace. He has to leave the details on that. The week log campaign runs from November 4th to the 8th under the theme together let's stop bullying and brings together officers from the Ministry of Finance, Ministry of Home Affairs, Justice and National Security, Ministry of Health and Wellness and the Department of the Public Service. Permanent Secretary in the Department of the Public Service Ms Peggy and Sudat noted that while bullying is generally associated with the school environment and youth, workplace bullying is real. Although there are not reported cases of that level of violence with less than more young people in the last few weeks, there have been some questionable behaviour that has caused us to delve deeper into the issue with a view to possibly reviewing how we deal with situations of that nature in the public service. This launch is the first incest sizing people sell within the public service with the knowledge to recognise, address and resolve incidents of bullying in the workplace. But this bullying has different meanings of different people and there are many definitions. Simply put it is always the misuse of power or position. Bullying can be very simple or open. It can be physical and emotional. It can happen managers to staff, among staff, staff to managers. The Permanent Secretary noted that there are several steps that can be taken to address workplace bullying. As an organisation, as a public service, what can we do? And as a public service, I'm not speaking of the Department of the Public Service, but the Department of the Service as a public community. We must be proactive in communicating the expected review. The creative workplace where everyone is treated with dignity and support. Design of appropriate and realistic systems of work. Development of productive, respectful relationships. As much as possible, encourage people to follow the organisation's policy on expected behaviour. The workshops will be facilitated by trained counsellor, Mr Cynthia Alexander, who will address, among other things, understanding the types of behaviour which constitutes bullying, its impact on the victim and the organisation, and the best practices and procedures for dealing with workplace bullying. The Department of the Public Service as the next round of workshops will recommend in January 2020 and will target the remaining ministries and departments. The say no to bullying campaign is expected to become an annual activity. From the Department of the Public Service to Peter reporting. Stakeholders in the tourism industry are preparing for the thousands of visitors expected to fork the island later this month for the Atlantic Rally for Cruisers. General Norville gives an insight analysis of the trickle-down effect in this report. Some 300 boats with approximately 1,800 people on Sunday 24th November will set sail for St Lucia from Las Palmas de Gran Canaria. The voyage is expected to take approximately 18 to 21 days on the classic trade wind route. The Arc offers a two-week pre-departure programme, fun competition for cruising sailors and or competitive racing, and a spectacular welcome in Rodney Bay. With St Lucia set to welcome the Arc for the 30th time, General Manager of the IGI Marina, Sean DuVaux, highlighting the tremendous feat indicated that the economic impact of the Arc cannot be understated. In coming here I just thought that I would review some of the stats of last year which were provided, which were quite alarming and I thought I would share a bit of it. Of those art participants that came here last year, about 70% filled out the form, which ended up being somewhere about 690 participants. 100% of those decided that they will return to St Lucia for a longer period of time at a future date. $7 million was spent in St Lucia through that three-week period, and 48% of those that answered those had one or two or more family members on island to visit them either after they arrived or flying in to visit them to then sail on from St Lucia. Officials of the Ministry of Tourism, Information and Broadcasting, Culture and Creative Industries explained that the impact of the yachting sector has demonstrated clear and undisputable benefits on St Lucia's social and economic landscape. Ministry of Tourism, Information and Broadcasting, Culture and Creative Industries, Director of Product Development and Margaret Adams explained that St Lucia has a progressive yachting sector, one that the tourism ministry continues to invest in. A number of yacht service personnel who were previously referred to as boat boys have been trained through the ministry's intervention in collaboration with our other stakeholders. The ministry considers building and maintaining partnerships as critical to attain its vision for the development of the yachting sector, by ensuring of course that there are adequate resources for the hosting of events such as The ARC Plus and ARC are scheduled to commence on the 10th of November and the 24th of November 2019 respectively. For the Government Information Service, I am General Norvel. The National Competitiveness and Productivity Council has partnered with the International Finance Corporation, the IFC, which is a member of the World Bank Group, with support from the Government of Canada to develop a modern secure transactions framework to enable increased access to finance for small and medium-sized enterprises. In a bid to improve access to finance for small and medium-sized enterprises, SMEs and St Lucia's ease of doing business ranking, the Government of St Lucia is moving to introduce legislation under the Security Interest in Moveable Property Bill. Access to finance has been a long-standing issue for the private sector, particularly SMEs. Last week, representatives from the banking, finance and legal sectors, alongside government officials, participated in a two-day workshop on secured transactions and collateral registry. Pullman and Secretary in the Department of Finance, Cointhe Thomas, highlighted that the lack of access to finance inhibits the firm's competitiveness and productivity, its ability to expand its operations and provide much-needed employment. This is important as 70% of firms' wealth is said to be concentrated in their movable assets. To support this initiative, a legal framework and a registry system will be put in place for providing credit using movable assets. The International Finance Corporation works with governments across the globe to develop frameworks that allow borrowers to obtain loans by using their collateral resources to help create new alternatives for SMEs to obtain financing. Elaine Makichun is the Senior Financial Sector Specialist with the IFC. Approximately 57% of the firms in St Lucia have access to finance challenges. Only 24.5% of those firms have a bank loan or a line of credit, and 98% of those loans to small and medium-sized firms require collateral over 1.9 times the loan amount. St Lucia is currently ranked 161 out of 189 economies on the World Bank ease of doing business getting credit indicator. However, this ranking is expected to improve with the passage of this new legislation. Once the security interest in movable property bill is tabled and approved by parliament, the design and the development of the collateral registry will be the next step in creating in the enabling infrastructure to increase access to credit for SMEs. Partner Grant Thornton, Richard Piddier King, said though this piece of legislation is very technical and many persons may not initially grasp the concept, it can increase access to credit for SMEs. I think many instances that there are bits and pieces of legislation that we still need as well. One of them is the Insolvency Act, which again we have a bill but it's not being passed and without that the lenders are not really going to get into lending to movable assets, so we need a number of things that have to change over the next year or so in order to open up our markets to a lot of new types of products that will allow transactions to flow and finance to be available to those who traditionally have a problem getting it. Business Development Officer Axel Finance, Movin Ages, said this bill aligns with his company's model of credit financing. It is of course hardening to see that everything is coming into place through legislation and of course institutionalization, so Axel Finance will definitely continue in the path that it has been to ensure that our small businesses continue to grow through the use of movable assets to secure their financial stability. Movin Springer, Business Development Manager at First National Bank indicated that the passage of this bill will go hand in hand with a new initiative his bank is pursuing. We're actually going to be launching a SME Competency Center in the coming weeks, which will be providing products and financial services to the SME sector, so the first secure transaction bill not being passed will actually enhance this effort. The IFC is hopeful that other member countries in the currency union will be motivated by Saint Lucia's advances and consider making this solution a regional one. The two-day workshop was held at the Finance Administrative Center November 5th to 6th 2019. For the National Competitiveness and Productivity Council, Glenn Simon reporting. Thanks Glenn also thanks Anisha Charles, Julia Tepita and Janelle Norville who provide us with those reports this morning that we are looking back at and definitely last week I started from the last report we had until the first day I'm starting at the first because I like fruits and vegetables and definitely that move by the Ministry of Agriculture actually was really stunning to hear the figure given by the minister for the importation of lettuce and you know for emphasis he's created in the Pasafasal Sanity so that really brought it home that we really need to really give attention to that particular aspect of our agriculture industry. Yes in this program I just pointed out Ryan it is not just as we would say good but it is critically needed. We talk about being able to eat healthy, we talk about wanting to protect ourselves from GMOs, we want to eat more green, making sure that things are chemical free and this is one sure way of knowing that when you go for produce on the supermarket shelf that when you buy local there is that extra emphasis that goes into having everything being organic as organic as it can be but you're right it's staggering to hear the millions of dollars that we're spending on importing foods that we can grow here that we used to grow here that my grandmother often forced me to eat and now I go to the supermarket down to the market and you can barely get any of those foods and if you do happen to come across them the price is sky high and of course because of the scarcity you know that price is going to go up so we need to do better in feeding ourselves and there's been a whole campaign across the world where the United Nations is encouraging all countries to look closely at feeding themselves because that's perhaps going to be the next big crisis in the world how are we feeding ourselves we don't want to have to resort to scientists growing foods in labs for us so we're not able to do that then we have to say hello to that world down the line so we want to be able to generate employment because if we have more food being grown we will need people on the farms we need more farmers to get in there so people have been self-employed and we know that trickle down effect of what can happen economically with that so I'm very excited to see the fruits of this project and I believe that we've had some degree of success with it already but we need to incentivize people as well to get them to come back to farming because I think that's part of the problem not enough people are farming then there's that other aspect Ryan of predinalosity so we hear the farmer saying but yes I want to get in there I am doing the best that I can but I am not again seeing the fruits of my labor because people are out there stealing before I can get a time to harvest and take it off you know so these things are very important so we have to have that holistic view of what the issue is and the ministry of agriculture I know they've been addressing all of those issues at various levels and so the incentives I can tell you that they are there it's just a matter of time for you now to go out there and find out what those incentives are well I love my fruits and vegetables was a lot of the focus was placed on that what's your favorite and how I cannot mention a favorite too many too numerous to mention too numerous yes but what I could say though is that I know it can be you're telling me to make a comment but I'll hold back okay please let me hold back I would really there's so many I really appreciate the fact that we were given fruits and vegetables on this earth but my problem is I would love to do the backyard garden I've tried it I grew some some lettuce my Catholic fertility got better and it sent seeds so I would hope that if you get the other persons who are much more able to time and know about the whole science of it to continue that way so your hands are just not for the soil yeah maybe not you see you need you need green hands yes but I I dabbled in some and some have been successful and not on the scale that I would love it too let's look at it you're trying to bully me now okay so I think we better move into that there will be an aspect of bullying in the workplace I want to say that you are but it was brought up and it seemed like it is something that really might be subtle but doesn't seem much to be experiencing it yes I yes you know you know you experience bullying as a child that carries through you know as an adult victims sometimes remain victims or they go on to be the perpetrator themselves I I'm not saying I'm on the fence with this one I just want my personal thoughts now I want us to be very careful with how we craft and continue because sometimes and I see this as a global trend and then you know there there's that phrase that's being coined right now sort of snowflake culture where everyone is so fragile and it is so difficult for you to express something to someone and you have to choose your words carefully and hell and damnation if you don't do it in the way someone would want so I agree that we have to make sure that people are dealt with on a level of respect at all times that really and truly no one is ought to be subjected to a situation where they are demeaned belittled and that sort of thing but also let's just be clear too that when you are coming to work you are coming to produce you are coming to bring your a game you need to be alert and present at all times and so there has to be a sort of delicate balance of how maybe a supervisor can call upon you to do something and to really ensure that that line staff is getting something done or even a manager you know in in conversations perhaps with another manager or supervisor you know so we need to be able to ensure that we're not going to start a culture where asking people to account becomes a bit problematic that's as I say that's just my person of view on it I am not for foul language I am not one to say you know lose your temper on someone these instances can happen because we're all human when you if you are in and if you know if you have had such an experience be big enough to apologize and you know the person who was on the receiving end should also recognize if someone is being sincere and accept that as well but I am I'm not in defense I just want to be very careful as to the sort of culture we might be creating for ourselves here with this one yeah yeah I definitely agree and you know like the report open if ones probably commenting that probably they thought that bullying was something at school so I would hope that if it does happen if it does happen at that level at least the person so perpetrating that sort of behavior would at least graduate and find out maybe that just a phase in life and do not let it you know continue throughout their life so you would have instances where when it comes up as I said in the workplace maybe it's a continuation of that pattern in early life and it is important to find out what would be fuel in that and so I'm happy that this is program is looking at how do you address it from that sort of psychological standpoint you need counseling for the offender the person who's been offended and so you know for because people people bring their lives to work so there are times when someone may be so affected by something happening outside of the workplace that it really shows up in the workplace so you may be angry or not necessarily at your co-worker but because you are trying to deal with issues outside of the workplace and you don't have the proper coping mechanisms it can result in you being more moisture than you need to be and bully someone so there are as you say several dimensions to this and I'm happy that the program is here I'm happy that we can have open discussions about things like that because we never used to so I'm happy we're now able to do these things but we still need to be careful as to yeah the sort of culture we might be no for the next story is telling us about something that has been really coming around Senusha for a very long time brings back a lot of memories to me because I remember very well the initial days when the arc started coming to Senusha some of the issues around in it we are about to get in a stage where the Rodney Bay marina would be a buzz with yachts of all different shapes and sizes visitors coming in yachties coming in their families coming in afterwards on flights but I can remember like when the arc first came to Senusha the arc used to end in Barbados and it was a situation there when it came to Senusha and the first gentleman world cruising Mr. Jimmy Cornell took it from Barbados to Senusha because of the facilities at the Rodney Bay marina because the yachties wanted just after coming across the Atlantic they would just step on dry land or hard dock and there were many states at the marina contrary to what was obtaining in Barbados what they call the Carina or the Carina I'll just say depends on who's pronouncing it and there was a big difference and they had to tender and come to shore to get on the mainland so that was one of the main issues in which the Atlantic Rally for Cousins left Barbados and came to Senusha also the Minnesota tourism at the time where it's all a former Great West English fast bowler he was so incensed by that that he was even speaking about what's the possible areas of retaliation Senusha but it was just the matter because the Rodney Bay marina provided much better facilities I think over the years that has been augmented as well so we're hoping that you know going forward that this we're seeing there's a lot of benefits we cannot actually measure it is a figure that is given seven seven million spent yes but yes and what is actually accrued by having the event coming to Senusha which in the in the surf cannot really be called it it really was you know the tentacles reach very far so that's very important also and if it's my preamble to give you an opportunity I did go to Las Palmas Grand Canaria how was that for you it was great it was busy but it was part of a bigger delegation I think it must have been about close to 20 of us who had gone on that day I can remember the late chef Harry was on that there was Alpha Tisson and his group Madic Circle they were called at the time there were other dancers performers and it was like a good exchange Grand Canaria Senusha I think this happens now in various forms we also have a young crew that's going over make the trek back and there's also been instances where local yachts have been involved maybe not as much as I would have liked to have seen it but it's good to see that we have some young sailors who are going to be taking up this opportunity now so an exciting time for the yachties and for persons really dependent on those yachts men coming across the Atlantic and I love it that not just the Rodney Bay Marina is the host but Saint Lucia is really hosting leaving now that we've been able to go down to the then refresh fried down in Ancelary we know Grosle is always a staple but there are other activities taking place as well that draw the interest and so I'm happy to see that the organizers have not sort of allowed the the the arc to grow and not facilitate that growth so we're looking forward as you say to other aspects of the arc developing along the way and in our last story featured we're talking about transactions for the small and medium-sized enterprises and we know we are business month November and so I was happy to hear this as well as we'll be all smaller medium-sized business people because the number one thing they talk about is access to money money money money money so this project will be able to have a sort of unconventional way of being able to to access your financing and so to ensure the not just because I heard the report talk about the growth and the sustainability of those businesses because you just you have to keep on keep on and by keeping on now you are expanding and so forth so this is a wonderful thing for us here yes definitely and the stress on modernization and the security of the transaction just about time that we're going to wrap up on our new segment we're going to take our first break on infocus today we'll be back in just a moment the world's climate is changing and that affects all of us storms are becoming increasingly intense periods of intense drought and heavy rain stress farm animals and destroy our cross higher average ocean temperatures kill our coral reefs and change the migratory patterns of fish St Lucia contributes only 0.0015 percent of global greenhouse gas emissions but is doing its part along with countries around the world to reduce the emissions that are warming our world and changing our climate these efforts are called mitigation but decades of emissions have already changed the climate and the greenhouse gases in the atmosphere today will increase average global temperatures even more we need to adapt that is do everything we can to prepare for and respond to the actual and expected negative effects of climate change and everyone has a role to play we need to protect our crops build homes that withstand storms and keep our drains and waterways free of garbage to help us recover or bounce back from climatic events learn more about the government of st lucia's national adaptation plan and the steps you can take to protect yourself and your fellow st lucia's the seaside is a great place for recreation but you should be tsunami smart and know the natural warning signs of an imminent tsunami if you're on the beach or near the coast and you feel the ground rumbling and a long strong shaking drop cover and hold until the shaking stops then run to higher ground if you see the tide receding further out than normal run to higher ground if you hear a street or loud noise coming from the sea run to higher ground if you experience any of these signs run to higher ground at least 30 feet high or as far inland as possible or to the third floor or higher of a building and wait for announcements from authorities for the all-clear before it is safe to return remember run run run to higher ground be tsunami smart learn the natural warning signs of a tsunami there may not be enough time to send out an announcement in the event of a tsunami this message brought to you by the view for south district disaster preparedness committee and you know and funded by the u s aid office of foreign disaster assistance if you are in receipt of an abnormally high bill it is highly possible that you have a leak that leak may not always be visible before you contact wasco conduct a do-it-yourself test one record your meter reading two do not use water for 30 minutes to one hour three take another meter reading if the reading changes you have a leak contact a plumber to identify and fix the leak at the earliest a message brought to you by the water and sewage company incorporated wasco thanks for keeping the focus so we glad that you're able to stay around with us we continue our program today and lisa gets the time of the program that she enjoys the most i sort of actually reserve comment on me earlier reserve comment again today but lisa again opportunity to invite our guests on our program thank you ryan you're so good to me i appreciate it as people were saying on the very top of the program three shows ago we had the minister of responsibility of four home affairs national security and justice the honorable senator her mingled francis and he did speak to us about the forensic lab and so today it's more than apt to have the director of forensic science services not the director of the lab but that puts her in charge of the lab we're talking to finanda henry and alongside her is miss joy quinlan was a forensic scientist ladies thank you so much for taking time off and it's a busy week for you you have a symposium that's coming up towards the end of the week that you're preparing for we'll get time to talk about that but first let's talk a bit joy finanda we're very sure with you joy and your interest in forensic science and what is your the area that you specialize in so i am a forensic dna analyst and so everything dna i know everybody's very excited about dna is what what i would do at the lab yes what made you um okay so long story um i was i'm always i was always a curious child for sure um i always read nancy drew and hardy boys and i think from the time i was 14 when forensic files came on you know that show i really got my interest was speak to me from that time i said that's what i'm going to do and the journey to get there what was that like that wasn't so bad um i did three years in france i studied biochemistry and molecular biology and got my bachelor's degree i came back here got a job at the forensic lab as a dna analyst we did a year of training and got into a casework after that okay so ryan we are smart people yes and for you finanda i don't think many people are too of you know okay well with your story my story starts it started um in 1999 after i left the convent in 97 and i i did two years at a level i had no idea what i wanted to do with my life listen i i loved teaching and i had been having a summer school at my home for a long time so i thought well yeah i'll be a teacher however the summer of of 99 there was a vehicular accident a friend of mine her mom was involved in an accident and a gentleman who was inebriated had walked across the road and while she was driving in in his direction and and he succumbed to his injuries when i got and it happened close to my home so when i i heard about it i went to the scene and i observed what was happening there and i compared it subconsciously to what had been happening on csi csi in investigations yes actual had just come out was a big thing and you know and i thought well this is what we're doing in st luccia this this is horrible and because we were waiting for hours for someone to come to take photographs and i thought well you know because i i suppose i was busy doing something else and i thought well if we only have one person you know processing crime scenes in st luccia then that's what i need to do because we need more people you know to to process crime scenes and that's how it started for me it's a very interesting story very practical and so now you are here finanda and you are in charge of our forensic lab it's a facility that has it has had its ups and its downs but certainly the success stories are always not the most talented that's correct yes so we want to give some time today for us to talk about that yes following the closure it would have been in 2015 and for i mean for reasons that have been quite ventilated already yes once you got back in there so let's pick up from there once you've got in there in 2017 yes for you what was the game plan because there's a facility came on board all of these hopes that would have been this regional star yes and then that star fell yes so for you having to come in there what was that game plan that you had and saying yes i can see the potential for this facility to do well well that that was that's where it started seeing the potential and i thought you know we always think that somebody else needs to come and do it but we need to be the change we want to see and that that was where it started the vision that i had um for the laboratory was that we can do it ourselves and i wanted to be the one to lead the people whom i had worked with who are synclutions who i felt could lead it and build it um i i recognize the challenges we had infrastructural issues oh and aren't there there were many we had our staff complement had dropped from i mean to to less than half uh the building we had not been in there for about two years we had we were already struggling with humidity issues so can you imagine not having occupied it for two years because you're right there by that that's right we're at the water's edge um and and you know just just the controversy surrounding the the yes the public image that was now tarnished um so it was a daunting task but passion took over and love as i like to say um it was love i love it i love forensics i love the people i work with um i love the field i love the opportunity to serve and to really make a difference i think that's what life is about making a difference and i think that our laboratory is poised we are poised as a nation to serve the region we certainly are so for us to to lose that opportunity to be useful i think would really be unfortunate i know you did the staff very well and joey is a representative of that of being well trained and capable um let's look at that the the complementary aspects now of what the lab needs for it to be able to work and be that stellar example in the region um the equipment wise where do we stand with that because joy could be as talented as she can be talented but she needs that equipment right and and i'd like to invite you all to come to so you can see we are there yes that we have we have we have top of the line equipment as our forensic laboratory we have instruments that some laboratories in the U.S. don't even have you know and that's probably very difficult for for our viewers and listeners to believe but it's true and GIS will come so you'll see for yourselves we have we have a comparison a comparison microscope we have two GC's ms's we one is a headspace the other is a has a mass spectrometer on it we have two genetic analyzers in the DNA unit you know the DNA unit has complete redundancy we have two thermo cyclers two genetic analyzers we have yes we have a trace unit with a comparison microscope a stereo microscope we have a fluorescence microscope i mean you know the visitors so when other labs come in foreign labs or you know representatives of those labs come in they are always they're like wow this is yes the human resource is where we're rebuilding because as i indicated after 20 after the closure when we reopened we started with the five four of us four of us today we are at 13 and we have three vacancies that we are going to fill in short order like they need to be filled before the the end of this financial year and we will have a few more at the time for your ultimate goal for the human resource complementary be what i would like to have at least two analysts in every section and how many sections are there so you need to walk us through the forensic lab because some of you we see si junkies so what we see on television may know there's been quite a mirror of real life so you have to walk us through that and what are the different sections okay well i can i can start into i can take over um we start when you get onto the the first floor which is our technical wing we start with the chemistry section so we have the chemistry laboratory and then following that is a preparation room and the prep room is used for not only prep for analysis but we also do sterilization yes cleanup and so on we have a still we make our own distilled water and we also have a nano pure we can make DNA free RNA free water and that would be what so it's water when you do DNA analysis you want to ensure that there's no contamination or it's limited as much as possible so the water that we have um has microbes it has other things that we do not want to interfere with your tests so this water is distilled there's so much that you remove everything that could interfere with it and reduce your contamination so that's what we we would do yes and then following that we have the instrument room the instrument room has instruments in it as the name suggests um the instruments i talked about a while ago we have a gc headspace which we can use for blood alcohol testing we can also use the for fire debris analysis so we we expect to be partnering with the fire service for that then we have an ftir it's actually out of service right now but we are hoping to get a technician in to be able to fix it it's it's worked fantastically we use it it's it's there are cross units that use it the trace unit and the chemistry unit and then we have a gcms that we're finally validating so that we can use for control substances analysis we can expand our our capability there we're on we're only doing marijuana and and cocaine now we want to be able to do more a more a larger suite of control substances it's quite interesting to hear about your staff compliment because there's something i was interested in and it's good to see that you have your equipment at almost out numbers quote unquote in terms of the human resource that you have yes within our justice system we know that there's been a lot of pressure in reference to forensics in terms of getting to the bottom of crimes and solutions and average do you feel that pressure and when you're going to work on a daily basis or is it something that you feel that you're beginning to cope with because i think the general public likes to know that there was a an instance and there was a resolution to it someone was charged and the case brought to a conclusion do you feel that pressure on a daily basis i do i do i think um what happens is the lab gets blamed for a lot and um we we are not responsible for reporting what we do in terms of to the public we need to report to the court and then there should be some kind of court reporting to let the public know where the cases are so a lot of what a lot of what happens is the public is like seeing nothing happening they see um no resolution but in the background there's a whole lot of stuff happening but there's nobody to report or go back to the public to see this is what has happened this is what we've used forensics for this is what the lab has done for us so all of that is where we feel the pressure because we hear and there are times when i send director messages and they're like what when does this come in you know so we do feel the pressure but again i don't think i don't think it's being fair to us um a lot of the time because we are not responsible to go to the public to see hey we solve this crime it's not our place to do so so basically you're interpreting the evidence for the court and what happens after that is out of your hands then we have to be neutral we cannot be um going to the public and having some kind of we have to be objective that's what we are we're scientists and i think that gets again CSI CSI is a little problematic and the effect is there because you see it's in CSI and everybody just expects the same thing to happen but this is not how it works it doesn't work like that i'm always curious i'm curious about the time frame that it takes and i suppose different analysis of different samples will take different time periods so walk us through for DNA for example because that's the hot bed right now because as you're saying CSI everything is solved within one hour and i've heard people say but how long does it take so long with that you can come out of that in two weeks you can get an analysis done right so joy how much time do you need joy to make it happen a normal case takes at least four weeks and that's a simple case when we talk about you get one profile or just a few bits of evidence and you process that so i think it might be best to take you through what analysis is so before we actually start working on a case we have the evidence come in and we have to examine the evidence you have to literally go through everything look at it you have to take copious amounts of notes you have to take photographs and then take cuttings of the evidence then you process it and you try to extract all of the cells that you want you're interested in after just to hold on just so that people are clear right the evidence can come in any form yes any form you could get food you can get clothing you can get weapons you can get hair you can get a hat you can get so many different things and um for within the lab we always i'm always saying jeans and you know we hate jeans because you have to end up coloring clothing they're difficult um so these things uh it takes sometimes three sometimes a day to go through um just looking at the evidence because you really have to comb this thing to make sure you're looking you're seeing everything um then we do extraction so we're taking out cells that could take um up to three hours four hours to just get that done and we're working with tiny what do you think is small is huge to me you're right by a million yes it is huge to me so you're really talking and then after that so you've processed for the evidence then you need to put it through extraction and then um sometimes you have to let this evidence sit so kind of soak the evidence to get all of what you want out of it then you need to put it through what we call PCR so you photocopying um the amount of the DNA that you have to get a little more um so that you can process it doing that could tell you how much DNA you have and all of that then after you do all of this you have to go and put it through um an analyzer so you're looking at the profiles and that is where the work starts all of what is I just said is not very difficult in terms of work the work starts when you're interpreting the evidence so like I said a simple key something that has just a very simple profile it's it's four weeks since the street forward you do that um but something that is complex and you have several different pieces of evidence to look at can be a daunting task and that could take probably three months or more and then after you do all of this and you write your report that report needs to be needs to be technically reviewed and so somebody else has to look at that report and look at what you have done look at the whole file and sign off and say hey we have done this according to the procedures that we see we're doing it we've done this um according to a normal procedure of normal standards and you've checked all the boxes and I agree with your interpretation and we can send that report off so that's taken as also equally trained yes in the same you know with the same protocol so that they too would arrive at the same conclusion if they were the ones conducting the testing so it'll be done the review before the reward would be someone based at the lab or you'll have to it has to be external we have both we have both internal and external reviewers well I'm looking at the whole process in terms of getting the outcome that we all want in terms of your outcome but you're not investigating you're interpreting what is brought to you so is it a case that the disenergy let's say CID the ones investigating most likely they are do they know that what is going to be crucial in that instance for them to bring to you that you can get the outcome that we are looking for in terms of your your blood saliva fibers diatracts based on what the situation is drugs alcohol paint chips in terms of arson and firearm residue so is it that sort of synergy whereby the investigators know what the scientists are looking for in terms of a particular crime and what they need to be more vigilant on the crime scene because when I look at all that and based on what you're saying it gives me a great appreciation of the amount of time it takes to process a scene and why it is important that there's this around to ensure that nothing is contaminated that's an encroach and that sort of yes there there certainly is that synergy we work very closely with the police we advise them as well based on on the circumstances of the crime scene or we visit the crime scene to have an understanding ourselves of what is going on and where we may find potential you know evidence so that's energy you know it cannot be overstated we must keep those communication lines open so that that we can we can achieve the end goal you know like you said but we I think we we have a good rapport yes yes we do we just completed one yesterday we did let's stay in pattern and then we invited them so every time we have some training at the laboratory and make it you know it's important for us as stakeholders to to work together so I always invite police and the prosecution you know as far as they can benefit to participate in training and I think well the quitting to joy I wasn't there I missed it it was excellent excellent training it was it was to understand bloodstain patterns and crime scenes because when they have a foam aggrasps it gives you some direction yes so do you have within an investigative period that as as Brian was suggesting this back and forth talking to each other perhaps you know the investigator may be thinking in one direction and maybe if he shares that with you then whatever you whatever the evidence is telling you along the way do you share that with the investigators so I think our evidence units is is pretty good we they are the ones who anchor the lab and so anything that goes has to come through the lab the evidence units will be in contact with the police and they will direct them and say hey I think this may be a better item to look at vis-à-vis this one and we we definitely speak a lot with them like director said we do training with the police we even do training with doctors because they are the ones who conduct the sexual assault kids so all of that we definitely have a good rapport with them yes because good evidence in yes DNA again you know collecting all of that in all of these samples and so forth joy but when you look at at the DNA of of a person forgive me if I'm not being able to phrase it correctly but so you have a suspect yes or you're trying to identify someone a perpetrator in a crime you need something to match it up against it's that correct so how does that work because we know we in St. Lucia I think we're trying to collect the fingerprints so forth but when it's going to the database so if the database is lacking for you to be able to find something to match it up against how do you handle a situation like that okay so we have actually found several cases without unknown cases without a database as much as a database is very important like we said last time we were here it is expensive to build a database there's a lot to take into account so most cases will come with their references and any case that is not does not have a reference sample and it's an unknown and we get a profile we keep those those profiles right but we're not searching them and a lot of the time it's everybody asks about everybody asks about DNA databases I would suggest to anybody listening in terms of ministers people that could make policy it would probably be in our best interest to have something regional rather than local only we have to consider to our free movement of people so I think if we were doing something within the OECS it would benefit us more financially resource wise to create that kind of database vis-à-vis a database with solutions only. I think people there's a misconception that a database is just profiles yes and people are forgetting that it's more than that you then have to do statistical analysis of those profiles for you to be able to use the database with unknown unknown samples so it's not just about keep taking people's DNA and keeping their profile somewhere you know on file it's just a little bit more involved and I think I actually think if they understood all of it they would be scared to have a DNA database because you're giving loads of information you're giving yourself to if you look at the international community when they talk about the genealogy and the ancestry databases people are in an uproar you're like no we do not want you to have this information the information is precious and it's something that has to be regulated so we're not only talking about just going and get a swab we need to have legislation in you need to understand what you what you're doing we need to decide okay if this profile it's all the profiles are not going to be nice and clean they're going to be profiles that are degraded are we going to still use those degraded profiles to compare with somebody else is that fair to do that so all of these things need to be taken into consideration and I remember Dr. King had given a great example last time your your DNA gives me a lot of information about you could tell me what color your eyes are it could tell me what diseases that you you could be prone to if I have that information then probably your insurance might want it and say hey you're prone to this disease we're not giving you insurance so all of that is very very important for people to have a look at we we're looking at it in a very small at a very small scale but we really have to look at all of the implications that it could have so by simply wanting it only to solve a crime we're at some point I need to be victimized by the system because I have volunteered yes so all of the regulation has to come in okay ladies interesting very interesting we can open a pandas box when we come back and we're going to have a break on the program on small please stay with us we're in focus one of the eight university recognized rights of the consumer is the right to be heard this means that every consumer who is dissatisfied with a good of service has the right to lodge a complaint to the provider of that good of that service this should be the first point of lodging a complaint ensure that the receipt as proof of the transaction is available the same choice can also change money if you want to keep it on the side and go to their side this list can contribute a small gas in a space when TPI we can try to do everything we can do to ensure that we lower the amount of gas in our service to prevent the earth from getting hotter and it is necessary to lower the amount of gas in our service is mitigation to change he has shyly lived in one of the only ones that have cabbages gas wheel excrements etc and it causes the earth to be much hotter that we can do all the time if you adapt it does everything we can do to prepare and recover for these negative consequences on climate change we all know what to do for example we can ensure that we protect everything that we plant it is a chemical life that naturally we can do a lot of damage to the cyclone and goblins construct a canal for the people who need it and as soon as they have it, they can do it do everything that is possible to live in climate change find information about the great adaptation of the national government and even take measures to protect the body and all our citizens welcome back we continue our discussion in focus with our two in-studio guests Fernanda Henry director of forensic science services and also Joy Quinlan who is forensic scientist within the entire setup of the area of science of forensic sciences in this forensic science services it is before we went to the the break during one of your interventions we spoke about a fingerprinting I noticed is one of the first applications in the whole forensic sciences tell us a bit more about it because it's something that's common in terms of everyone expected at the scene one of the first things that would be done is fingerprinting yes tell us about the complications of that well fingerprints are unique fingerprints are more unique than DNA twins can have the same DNA but twins will not have the same fingerprint and your fingerprint just is a reflection of ridges on your finger coupled with sweat oils from your from your body that we produce naturally fingerprinting is like you said it is is forensics 101 it's you know the first the go-to forensic analysis that should be done I must tell you that we have successfully used fingerprinting to prosecute cases burglaries especially here the crime scene unit does excellent wait pause and repeat we because often people say what yes somebody walk into my house and they are doing nothing so just repeat yes we have successfully prosecuted especially burglaries we've prosecuted perpetrators with fingerprint evidence in St. Lucia we have a fingerprint database it's called AFIS um it is regional so we are able to share profiles strip chair I guess fingerprint profiles quote unquote um so it's it's very instrumental in in crime fighting and because it is so fundamental we cannot we cannot discredit you know the the value of fingerprinting it has to it's your your your front runner but but you know as as um Ryan was saying there are implications to fingerprinting for example somebody breaks into your car well it's your car you use it your kids use it your friends use it so it means that we're always touching it so we would definitely have all sorts of smudged fingerprints all over it now when someone comes and breaks into it they may leave a print but it's the challenge is to decipher that print among all the yes and that I think is where that I'll cry of or the police can never find fingerprints when they you know when when I have a situation of of burglary at my home it's because of that because of the prevalence of all these smudged prints from your everyday life um you know so when someone comes and and they may or may not leave a print simply because you know there is there they're just the proponents of all the other stuff there and the surface yes the type of surface thank you joy is also significant as well because textured surfaces are quite difficult to to dust for prints so it's important to have all other technologies available to us to use chemical ways of finding prints not just the the brush with the the fingerprint dust we have um liquids that you can spray on and you can visualize the print so most prints are what we call latent prints they are not visible to the naked eye so we have to use that additional um powder or yes to be able to visualize the print a patent print is one that you can literally go for example if I touch the table now you will see my print and that's called a patent print so you know it's a it's a little bit more I don't want to make it seem like a rocket science but it's a complex yes it is complex yes it's not yes doesn't see as how you think so i don't know if it's exposure to the elements as well yes yes certainly yes the rain sun all of that can degrade that's right yes so we so what and that speaks to how significant it is for us to take that step back when something occurs so if there if your house has been bugled you need to take that step back because now you don't want to compromise your scene by going and touch things because you're going to smudge any print any recent print that's there you're going to now interfere with it if you touch so we really need to to take that step back call the authorities let them come secure the scene or the exhibits as we call it and um process it to be able to get the maximum result it is something very significant in terms of recent prints because that i think that's the one it will actually help you decipher between a recent print and one that's been there for some time is it how prominent it is that's right yes how prominent it is yes because you can you can you kind of see it in layers as well when you do the the um the dusting yes just to remind listen before you go for the next question to our viewers that you can participate the lines are open and you can call us on 468 to 162 we're also available to get your questions via facebook right as i think you know we've heard the talk about having an offenders registering for the forensic lab how much of an asset would that be for you it would be i think it would be great because like we're going back to the database um having an offenders registry would give us um the legislation and the authorities to be able to get um DNA samples from offenders what you see what i think most criminologists most people who deal with crime are aware that most of the offenders are repeat offenders so if you have that information you you would they would probably do it again most of the time so at least you have that information there to reference so it it would be a good good thing but again we have to start that ball rolling before we just call for it yes now rape has been um in the news in in in recent days but this is it's it's a horrible crime that we know that that happens in st lusia and most times it's under reported um for so many various reasons but i think to sometimes stay um victims believe nothing can be done yes um but over the years we've been able to be more systematic and systemic about how we address um rape once it is reported uh so walk us through what happens um in in those cases um from at the medical point at the facility you know rape kits what exactly happens with the rape kits if you well i can't i can't speak to that i can start the ball rolling and i'll let you continue we're very passionate about about rape and sexual assault and we're we both would very i think tirelessly to improve um our approach to sexual assault in st lusia now one of the of the things that we were able to do as a dna unit was to standardize the sexual assault kit and we used to have this box kit i'm sure uh our listeners and our viewers probably have seen it before but it was it was about this big maybe and it's it's a half by like 10 box and it had there were like 30 something steps that you had to complete to be able to take the full kit head hair pubic hair pubic core means and pulled head hair and pulled pubic hair can you can you imagine that listen can you imagine after you have just been traumatized your your personal space has been so violated that someone now has to come and take hold of pubic hair from you um so we were we we pared it down we pared it down to 10 steps one to make it faster for the doctors to be able to go through the kit and and try to complete it in its entirety because that's important and secondly first to really zone in or hone in on on um dna the dna evidence that we can collect from a sexual assault kit so i'll let joy take you through the next stage okay so um you wanted to know how what happens exactly yeah so so the kit is like um and under said it's a an envelope now so it's no longer the box and we felt that it was important because like she said after somebody has been traumatized and that we already we knew that st. Lucia is very small and as soon as you get to the the medical emergency department everybody is going to look at this person who walks in with a police officer and that is sad it is it it hurts every time i have to think about it so that is one of the reasons again we we um decided to pared down and um so a victim sees a doctor a medical doctor who has to do a physical examination and i like to tell the doctors you are now the crime scene analyst as sad as it is the victim is the crime scene at this point and so we have to really look at the um the body and try to get as much information for it from it as possible and we have several um envelopes several swabs that we take from the victim to send for DNA analysis what is difficult i think and something that we are really we're really passionate about is to try to get that step out of the emergency department yeah i would love private yes get it to a private setting get yes very safe some place that already a traumatized person could feel safe get um somebody to speak to um get the the um exam get the medical intervention get the exam done in such a way that it's not rushed because imagine and we've spoken to the doctors in an er if somebody comes in with a gunshot a doctor is going to deal with that first rather than somebody who has been sexually assaulted as sad as it is that is what happens and so taking it out of the er would be the best thing for for that um after the kit has been processed the police get it they store it and then it comes to the lab for processing now you know you've recorded successes um with at least two high high-profile i'd say high-profile um yes okay well we can tell you about our successes with sexual assault yes since we're on the topic um joy would you like to share go ahead most recently we've been able to identify five serial rapists two in the last before before the lab closed yes um between 2012 and 2014 and three between 2017 and now um as as frightening as it is because we are we are very perturbed by it we have serial rapists in our society once and um and we're not talking one two victims three victims we're talking a lot yes multiple victims upwards of two digits in some instances so and and i must add that joy did this work let me tell you um that's the with with in one particular instance the the cases had no known perpetrator so the the survivors as we like to call them the survivors who were not did not know who it is that that assaulted them and that is very uncommon by the way between 80 and 90 percent of survivors of sexual assault know they're assailant so for to have you know an unknown assailant is is uncommon however there you know this had happened over with several survivors and um and she was able to to link one individual to all of these these um survivors so those are those are some of the success stories of sexual assaults and and we have them with you know with cases with pediatric cases kids from three to six eight we have them with you know teenagers and we also have them with this there's one of our um of one perpetrator who who kind of graduated from being being someone who sexually assaulted him to harm his side yeah so and we we worked on on all these cases i think the room has been stunned into silence because um we say we have serial rapists and if you probably figure okay that two people but you say in that five and and then you know in that old in the medical field when you let me tell you it's always just a tip of the iceberg kind of thing exactly um so five that we that we've been able to identify and so then the question would be then at what point um does that information prevent the next because i think because that's talking over a period of years and so if we knew back then that we had identified individuals with their propensity or a serial rapist intervention and how how what what what happened that we cannot speak to you know i think i think you're talking about how can we deter other people using that information so once you have that information yes what happens what happened to that information at that point yes so it has had to go to the court yes yes so i think i think that with the prosecution then then we will understand you know what happened with the case and and based on i suppose what what the sentencing is or the outcome of the case we don't know we even know that we will we will get a successful process so these cases are still pending yes wow so then but isn't that part of the frustration of the whole yes experience as well because if we are taking this long to have yes sort of backlog of cases that's what is also affecting your own and it affects the survivors too that that it affects reporting so you know it creates that perception that that you said nothing will happen so i just won't say anything even though i've been that's a very stunning revelation i i knew of some instances when i remember this is in an awful dialogue there were reports of a person who would like to be a serial rapist but from what you've just said is this something that we should be much more concerned about or that it might just be an isolated instance where a person is did have in the north and several it's something that we should be very alarmed about is something she's very very alarmed i think so well as a as a in doing this job i am i can tell you that i'm very i'm a little paranoid sometimes and i'm anytime i meet young people young girls especially i always give them a couple of tips listen you need to remember these things and i think sometimes we take these things for granted not taking a drink um from somebody you don't know not taking a ride from somebody you don't know all of these little things um i think as much as it's it's it's this heartening to know that we have to literally think of protecting ourselves all the time and we're not free to to to be um the things that we have to to keep in mind and i would tell anybody anybody we need to be vigilant yes and so that leads us straight into what's happening this week and with the symposium so we have a combination of local regional international export to our island and you're looking at closely at the protection of our young people yes so why why that particular focus it came out of the the last conference this one is the fourth the fourth installment it came out of the the i think the the audience yes the third um last year the topic was on sexual assault and it was held in um St. Vincent and i think after our two days of their liberation and all of the discourse that is um what came out of it probably we need to go and next the the step food and go into because children are very um they're very unique and so we have to look at that even the sexual assault examination of a child is different for an adult an adult yeah yes and not to mention that that our children are our greatest resource i think our children are investment in ourselves in the future of our country so we felt that that focusing on children and in light of the passage of the child justice and the child care protection and adoption acts by our parliament last year it it was very relevant you know it's very fitting that we can we are discussing this topic so what are some of the talking points several so many yes because the the symposium is called a medical legal and forensic symposium so we're looking at mild treatment and abuse of children through various lenses so we're looking at it from the forensic perspective what it is that we do how our analyses can help with the identification of mild treatment and abuse we're also looking at it from the medical perspective how do doctors see this in their private practice how can they recognize it in the emergency room how do they recognize non-accidental injuries you know you come in and you say oh he said yes he broke his arm you know and and versus understanding what what what really is happening um what be under the surface then we also have forensic pathologists who deal with the the deceased victim you know as sad as it is so they too you know will share on how to recognize mild treatment and abuse at the autopsy and we have the legal yes we have the lawyers who are who will talk about what it is like for them in court how do you defend you know someone who is who is on trial for mild treatment and abuse and then the prosecution will say well how do we prosecute these cases to be successful and we also have the the social aspect of it we have social workers and psychologists who will talk about how do you recognize this what is trauma informed care how how does the yes dr budd how how do you you know how do you approach a child um who has been traumatized because you can't you can't do it in your conventional way so it's really a holistic approach to to discussing child mild treatment and abuse and it's going to be a wonderful learning environment i'm excited about it i can't wait to see you know my friends my colleagues um in the in the you know the community and i'm excited for the networking i'm excited that people from my laboratory will get to be exposed to to these other people what it will be for us are the training opportunities you know that it will open up um with the networking and and just just that that environment of learning the continuing education for you to to learn from someone else and apply it in your field i would imagine it also puts the microscope on st lucas and how we do we are doing things here with respect to that so if we can talk because like over at the lab lots of things are happening but people are not aware um i believe the the dealing with with social services it's such a mammoth task um it's under staff under resource but there's so much going on and the needs are so great yes so when it comes again to the to child sexual abuse or just child abuse um i know for certain the numbers are up so how from your perspective what is it can be done within the governmental framework or the support agencies what are we not doing to holistically address what the situation is on ireland what do you think i think we're not talking yeah we're not communicating enough we're working in isolation and that it's looking to the detriment of our children i that's that's my perspective i agree i could agree with you um also i think what will come out of the symposium is that exact answer so we will be seeing what other people are doing um how it has benefited them and how we could probably adopt some of the things that they're doing to improve our situation so i think that is that is i think what i'm excited most about also it's it the symposium really opens um as a scientist you you're supposed to you you're supposed to get continuing education and all of this and so this is what the symposium will do it will open up our our scope open up what we're doing and get those answers that you the exact question will probably be answered in during the symposium since we've gone this way it gives me an ideal opportunity to come in on this and something that has been just at the back of my mind while we were into the program in terms of the demands that you might have locally in terms of opportunities and how involved is the lab and your general services in detail may i notice you're laughing because we spoke so much about CSI and then Maury came to mind you're not you know on my page how much of a demand is there on your lab to do that vis-à-vis what you might consider much more serious and kusha masses into themselves and crime so the reason i laughed is um anybody who people i meet and i i i tell them because i don't tell everybody what i do um that i am a dmd analyst the first question i get i'll do in fertility i'm always just okay i think there is a demand um again it's something that would actually help us at the lab because it would generate um income and it's because our services it can be quite expensive we can put that income back into the lab and help us grow as a lab so i think it's definitely something that we can look into and um it's we can open it up to the other islands also so we have it for st muesha but as well as the other islands i i i i think it's for higher well not yet yet but but we should be yeah um and and that's the path we're going on we have to we have to be able to maintain our our very high you know maintenance bill um electricity you know you can really imagine once an instrument breaks down at least be repaired so that your unit can keep going so um you know having that income generated you know will certainly help i'm and i'm also looking to use our our control substance testing laboratory to generate income for us as well we need to be able to be a little bit more self-sufficient that defense attorney's can also access yes and we really want them to know and understand that we are not a prosecution laboratory we are objective we are unbiased and and the evidence speaks for itself we we we carry out the processes and will the results come as they may we relay the results you know in us in a scientific and an objective way so we want the defense community to understand that we're not looking for anybody we're looking for the cause of justice that's what we do and on that note then finanda moving forward what are some of the areas you're hoping that a lamp will be able to get into to give thing to show a more rounded forensic scope yes the laboratory certainly needs to to change that the the landscape of the lamp needs to change our services need to be amended so that we can cater to the needs of our society those needs have changed over the years when we first started and i must tell you that the laboratory the original design of the laboratory is nothing compared to what it is now the original design kind of you know made it like a processing facility and we we were able to to manipulate that to make it a little bit more to make it make more sense to be more analytical i'm so introducing you know dna and trace examinations for example so we need to move into firearm examination because we have a lot of gun crime we should have been doing it as you know we should have been doing it already even if on a small scale but we definitely need to move in that direction and and i'm sharing with you you know the the plans you know for the coming financial year we also need to move into digital forensics because everything is digital our we barely use cash anymore you know physical cash we have cell phones and we have computers and we have you know iPods and your name is and we're talking to each other you know for international years via whatsapp and skype yes so you know our our community is a lot smaller because we can reach people faster so we we need to be able to analyze that type of evidence to assist with with with criminal investigations so we need to we need to grow and that is our thrust and we need to reopen the dna unit let me say i i i i guess i assume that that we're not saying but our dna unit is is closed in terms of our physical um analysis so we need to get that back online it's wonderful so we've really learned a lot this morning yes and it's really being a really part 90 minutes we're really happy that you're able to come to us and we know that you're going to achieve the success you're looking at because we can feel the excitement and they're passionate about it very very passionate i'm really impressed and with a great disposition yes and because this i'm sure the job the job is very stressful it's very important but yeah you're very cherry people yeah even that you have found time to be for today it gives an indication that you know you've been able to really put a lot of things in place and to ensure that you push not just the work of the laboratory and the services that you provide and you know that you're very much involved in letting the public know what's going on and the interaction you have with other persons who are going to assist you in getting your job done but it isn't yet i mean it's being focused and you see you had as much fun with me this time as you've always had me so you had some great ideas and maybe we can ask them you know the forensic uh um input on why you seem to be coordinated with me even without communicators really so yeah we'll have to look at the genetics i know you have your suspicions already i think i want to let them solve it well you know me yes so ladies and gentlemen we've had fernando henry the director of forensic science services in st lusia and also joy quinlan forensic scientist with us today on in focus you can join us next time for another program in focus