 We are live on YouTube. Good morning everyone. This is the House Committee on Commerce and Economic Development in Vermont. We are having discussions this morning with some of our businesses and our some nonprofits, our Chambers of Commerce, to understand what's going on out in the world as we start putting together the second piece of the good relief funds, our recommendations to appropriations on how to how to spend that money. So I think first let me pull up my agenda. Okay so first we have Amy Speer with us. She's the Vice President of Tourism for the Vermont Chamber of Commerce. Amy, good morning. Good morning Chair. Thank you for having me today. Thank you for coming. So just if you can just give us an overview of what you see out that's going on out there, especially concerning our tourism and hospitality markets out there or what's not happening I guess is more of the way we might describe it. Yeah absolutely. For the record my name is Amy Speer. I'm the Vice President of Tourism with the Vermont Chamber of Commerce. The Vermont Chamber of Commerce represents over 1200 members and we are also the state affiliate for the National Restaurant Association and the American Hotel and Lodging Association. With that we have hundreds of restaurant and lodging members and we do have continued and routine engagement with our membership and thus we've maintained an informed perspective on what really is impacting them and really what we see as the two most critical action items for the hospitality industry in this next round of funding is to use a significant portion of the CRF monies held and reserved as a dedicated rescue package for the hospitality industry and then we're also asking to loosen the eligibility requirements for the economic recovery grant program provided by Act 115 to allow more businesses to be able to be eligible and include businesses that have been left behind in the first round of funding. So that would be sole proprietors, new businesses and then also those that were innovative, pivoted and didn't quite experience you know 50% loss. Some of them might have experienced 49% or 45%. Restaurants are a good example where there are some that are hovering around 45% because they pivoted to a takeout business and now you know they've been left out of the first round of you know grant funding. We certainly acknowledge everyone's adjustment to the pandemic and providing relief to Vermont businesses and we are truly appreciative for the steps that the committee has taken and you know we're hoping that you'll listen to what we have here today. You know we do see the proposed $133 million from the CRF fund reserves as a positive that the governor proposed but what I'm going to spend my time today on is certainly on the rescue package and what would be most impactful particularly for lodging restaurants and related businesses such as events and weddings. So in the governor's proposal is a $50 million rescue package for the industry as I mentioned we're supportive of this proposal and encourage you to consider for you to consider increasing it as you consider the entire package. While Vermont's economy does continue to reopen the hospitality industry really doesn't see a path to return to thriving but is instead you know really fighting to survive I think you'll hear that today from those that are on the call to also testify. The proposed additional business relief grants for industries that have been disproportionately impacted by COVID are critical as this pandemic economy will continue on for many more months. You know as you're well aware these businesses generate tax revenues create jobs and unlock economic activity in Vermont communities. According to Bureau of Economic Analysis tourism is six percent of Vermont's GDP which places Vermont in the top five states whose economies come from tourism that's from the Pew Charitable Trusts and the hospitality sector which includes restaurant lodging and industries such as weddings and weddings and events has suffered disproportionately due to COVID-19 and I'm sure you've all read this it's evident in Tom Kovetz's report from his August 2020 economic review and revenue forecast. I just want to pull a quote out of here because it was really you know stuck out to us as we were reviewing this report. Meals and rooms revenue have experienced the most pronounced and lasting impacts from the COVID crisis. Restaurants and lodging businesses are the major drivers of the meals and rooms revenue and have been asked to hibernate in an effort to combat the pandemic. These businesses have done everything the government has asked them in stellar fashion to ensure the health and health of our people in Vermont but it has certainly come at a great cost to them. Prioritizing more funding that's easier to access is our number one priority going forward. There are as I mentioned individual members of the industries that are on the call today so I'm not going to go into heavy details but I did want to provide a high-level outlook and some information and data behind a restaurant and a lodging outlook really what we're seeing in the landscape. You know while restaurants have resumed operations at a limited capacity and have used their entrepreneurial thinking to reimagine their business models I think we're all aware that the path forward will not be smooth and based on data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics Vermont is the state that suffered the largest restaurant job losses which is a 71% decrease from February 2020 to April 2020 and this is directly related to COVID-19 operational restrictions. Additionally in a recent survey commissioned by the National Restaurant Association it's even more evident that consumers are well aware of economic damage caused by the pandemic with 88% of adults responding that restaurants are an important part of their community and many are worried that their favorite restaurant won't survive. You know I've had conversations in the last couple of weeks with many restaurants and lodging properties in particular and I've heard a story from a restaurant for example that's just wondering is it worth it for me to even operate I don't know if I can carry on at 50% because of these operation restrictions they want to do the best for their business to survive but also to treat their staff well and they're they're it's really weighing heavily on their mind and in an industry where their margins are already thin they're paying for enhanced safety procedures many of them are switching to a take-up model which tends to be the most expensive way to operate a restaurant they're really just looking for a path forward and this rescue package is going to be critical for them. On the lodging side you know I did want to point out there are three key metrics that you know the lodging industry uses to determine the health of their industry its occupancy average daily rate and revenue per available room kind of the gold standard that collects this information is Smith Travel Research and based on their information nationally occupancy was down 36% year-over-year in July 25 down 25% down 52% year-over-year for revenue per available room so you know while these might be national numbers and you wonder what does this mean for Vermont for Vermont it means that given the importance of tourism to Vermont's GDP our numbers are likely far greater based on industry feedback relating to occupancy and travel restrictions that are in place to combat the pandemic just something that I wanted to speak to anecdotally here is you know a lodging property that I recently spoke to who has been profitable in the past and you know fiscally responsible has healthy reserves even with all the support that's existed through federal and state programs already is really wondering if they're going to be surviving past October they see a bleak future you know there are many small ends that rely on summer and fall months and a strong fall without that on the horizon they see bankruptcy and in their future and for many small lodging properties as an example it's also their homes so not only are these lodging properties looking at their business they're looking at where they live being impacted by not having enough relief dollars available to them just something else that I wanted to go into on the bankruptcy and then I'll I'll finish out here is that there's a lot of you know many hotel properties and restaurants in particular have heavy fixed costs that don't go away and this relief package is really going to be critical for them to find a path forward for them to be able to hibernate in order to you know meet the need the occupancy restrictions to adhere to public health guidelines and do their part to help combat the pandemic and you know we really see in our very strongly supportive of the of the rescue package for the hospitality industry and we do look forward to being a resource as this conversation develops you did my questions for Amy yeah thank you mr chairman and thank you Amy for coming here this morning what if any specific recommendations do you have as you may well be aware there's a surplus of unclient I suggested yesterday with specific regard to hotels motels and ends that are recalibration of how much money they would be eligible for and I wonder what your thoughts might be on that and more largely or broadly what your recommendations are for us um you cut out just a little bit so I'm going to just summarize to make sure that I am addressing it you're wondering what our recommendations are to move forward for relief funds for hotel motel and yes yeah um so we're really advocating for a significant portion of crf monies to that are held in reserves to be dedicated to a rescue package for the industry um right now as these businesses are facing continued operating restrictions to combat the pandemic being able to have relief funds available in the bank are it's going to make the difference between survival and closure so really you know increasing the amount of dollars that are available to the impacted industries is going to be the the biggest impact for for them to make sure that they they do see a path to the future Stephanie you muted am I okay now yes um so Amy thank you that my question for you is uh in looking at the distribution of the funds already to this sector how would you see would you have any recommendations on how the fund should be distributed in a different way or should we maintain the same the same methods or did you see some do you have some perhaps suggestions on on distribution of these funds yeah so looking at how the funds are currently distributed you know you're looking at for you know there there was the $50,000 cap now it's $150,000 cap um you know there are loosening the eligibility requirements that were included in act 115 would be helpful for businesses because then that can address sole proprietors new businesses those that were impacted by this but then there's also the 10 percent revenue replacement cap that's that's in place and for some properties even receiving properties restaurants or those in the industry even receiving the maximum amount of $150,000 sometimes really only equates to three percent three percent return on what they might have lost due to pandemic restrictions so when you're looking at loss thresholds that's that's something there for the caps of the award amount that would be helpful because for you know a small lodging property to a large lodging property there are a lot of fixed costs that are associated with that and you know while restaurants might grow a linear on a linear scale increasing the amount of dollars that these businesses can receive would be very helpful because for some it might only represent a month's worth of payroll or several weeks versus of payroll depending on the size of the business should employees be a number of employees be part of the equation or do you I think with the hospitality sector in particular employees are could be a difficult number to have in there for figuring out the relief amount because every business operates differently so if you're looking at a like an in for example you might have an owner operator that's the housekeeper there the chef there the concierge you also if you're looking at a bakery for example you might have a husband and wife team that's that's running that I'm thinking of one in particular they don't have any staff they're just they're in there as a husband and wife operating their business so when you add in employees as a factor for getting relief dollars it can add some unintended complications for the industry thank you Charlie thank you Mr. Chair hi Amy it's a question I have of scale you know we're talking about 50 million dollars is that enough money to actually look at the lost revenue and the shortfall between revenue and expenses because I wonder if the chamber has taken a swing at trying to calculate what the actual cash flow impact is not just lost revenue but the bottom line and to to identify the scope of the issue because this is 50 million dollars even going to make a difference that way so we haven't done a calculation on that but I would say any any level of funding is going to be to a benefit to the industry you know I I think some of the the hotels and restaurants for example that are speaking later could go into really good examples on how cash flows impact at their businesses but really the more money you know if you are making considerations of the funds that are available in the 133 million dollar package that we're advocating as you know as much or more money to be put into that 50 million dollar bill that was proposed because we're really looking at you know the losses could be catastrophic for the industry if there's not a rescue package that is substantial and could really help them see a path to hibernate and survive right thank you I guess you know yesterday we were pushing the deputy secretary of accd to come up with really some kind of easing of the occupancy rate as a way to help the industry really recover and that long term that's really what's going to save a lot of these businesses is being able to operate with people coming from out of state because it's certainly not going to be supported from folks in state. New Hampshire tried something with their grant program the 400 million dollar main street program but it equaled you know 17.2 percent of people's estimated losses as much as they could estimate what those losses may be so I don't know if taking that approach is better or worse but they now have different occupancy guidelines than we do so it's really trying to figure out how to move forward that way so that's why I was thinking about that cash flow loss should we be basing a formula based on that instead of just lost revenue and if you're looking at you know the black and white numbers using looking at meals rooms and alcohol taxable receipts that's a way to formulate there and it helps to create particularly within the hospitality industry or restaurants and lodging in particular that creates a level playing field for what people are paying into because whether it's a sole proprietor or if it's someone that has 50 to 100 plus employees they're all paying same tax rates and into that system but yeah certainly occupancy is continues to be an issue when you know just because lodging properties could be at 50 percent right now for example doesn't mean that midweek travel is actually 50 percent often you see a peak on the weekend when you're looking at Friday Saturday Sunday maybe they're reaching 50 percent I think some of the iconic properties might be stabilized at 50 but you know you're looking at down to 10 to 15 percent midweek for a lot of smaller properties so the weighted average for the industry is likely much less than 50 percent right now because they're not hitting capacity and generally speaking from my experience lodging property needs to maintain 45 to 50 occupancy in order to make any money and not operate in the red so if we're asking them to operate you know essentially operating in the red or barely surviving right now that's why these additional funds are going to be so so critical to survival to you know help them you know get through this this hibernation and restricted occupancy. Thank you. Kristy. Thank you Mr. Chair and thank you Amy. It was a pleasure to listen to your your comments and stuff so I want to take a little different approach perhaps and maybe asking a lot of you to give an answer but you mentioned looming bankruptcies heavy fixed costs operating at a loss those are all I'm sure it's real and I'm sure it's it's factual we have no doubt about that the legislature some of our critics are saying if money goes to these businesses that are heavily in debt already and they were filing for bankruptcy is this just not money going into pockets for example for them to survive and maybe close up shop and go elsewhere type thing or not reopen that's the critics that's not my opinion but we're also hearing from the legislatures that some of the focus is trying to how do we stimulate the economy into a rebirth if you will once the pandemic has subsided and disappeared hopefully sooner than later so the money is looked at as working we best put that for stimulating the economy and I'm wondering if you couldn't speak a little bit about your involvement with the restaurants in lodging facilities of how this could look like what their intentions are that you're hearing and I realize you can't speak for everybody and also there's another economic stimulation package within the next round that is looking at perhaps a like a gift card for businesses or whatever to be used but I'm still not sure that that would is the best way to stimulate the economy but if you that's a lot I just said but you could speak a little bit about on the ones that are in trouble the ones that want to stay and and and what's going to be necessary to get the economy growing again and I realize it's dependent on the pandemic obviously so I'll um I'll take a I'll tackle each one uh individually so first if we're looking at businesses that are in trouble so many so often if anyone's used you know financial advisors in their business or if they're trying to be fiscally responsible they have a certain number of days of operating reserves so let's just say that number is 60 days of operating reserves so for example the the lodging property that I referenced earlier it wasn't that they were in financial trouble before the pandemic it's because of the pandemic because they've had occupancy restrictions there are travel restrictions to the state of Vermont so it's not necessarily that they were in trouble and they need the money to get them out of trouble for pre-pandemic conditions it's more of they've shut down their businesses sometimes you know they're operating at 50% or less and they really need these funds to to bridge them through to a post-pandemic world when they can start accepting um higher occupancies again or they can start having more people dining at their restaurants so you know that's often the case you know we've seen I've I've been um resiliency is a common word that I've used when I've spoken with a lot of businesses is they have been incredibly resilient and resourceful they've either you know shut down their business temporarily because they knew they had to for cash flow they changed to takeout models they've become contactless you know these the hospitality industry they're the ambassadors for Vermont and they want to see a positive future for the tourism industry and so while I would argue that yes they they need these funds now to get them through to the other side of the pandemic or to help them get them through the winter or the coming months that we have before there's a vaccine or a solution on the other side of the pandemic so really these these funds are to help them not because there's a problem they've created but because it's a result of the pandemic I think the tent company you know Perry would be a great example where you might have had every single weekend sold out with multiple events in summer of 2020 and because of the pandemic you know the weddings weddings are gone for summer 2020 in reality but many of them have rebooked for 2021 already so although the businesses lost this summer they already have the business booked for 2021 so I think that's really why I use the term hibernation is because people have been asked to really hunker down and operate at a reduced capacity a significantly reduced capacity in the hospitality industry in particular has been asked to disproportionately to others to operate at a reduced capacity if we're looking for those that want to I guess the I'll kind of combine the the next two buckets a little bit those that want to stay here for the future stay in business and be here for the future as everyone's being I think resilient again is a way to think of it and they're looking at how to shift their operations in order to you know stay afloat um and in order to come through on the other side you know the it's people come to Vermont because of the iconic experiences you know the Vermont brand is made up of all the businesses within our communities you know every community has a different flavor I know I see Eric from the Mad River Valley on on the call here today and the experience in the valley is very different the than the experience that you would have in the Okimo Valley with Carol on the call and you know they're these businesses create the personality of Vermont and they're really working and trying to find their way through to the other side and and without the relief dollars it's difficult for them to get there um and when we're looking to the future um you know there are two things that have been very apparent from the beginning that have come out in research is you know perception of safety and space is going to be critical for people to feel comfortable to return to travel somewhere and Vermont certainly meets those two things there and you know while you know the first intent to travel to a destination is for someone to book lodging and while lodging is only able to operate at a 50 percent capacity you know there's they're not going to be able to fully you know return so when we pick we have people coming in that are staying at lodging properties they disperse and they do other activities they go to restaurants they do outdoor recreation you know they're they're um they're at all the other businesses so really if you can stimulate the economy by having people here you know that's going to be a high yield for for Vermont and we do recognize that now because of the health and safety of you know Vermonters and our visitors there are these restrictions in place and that's that is why it's critical for these businesses to get um to get relief funding so that they can be here to provide the iconic experiences on the other side to allow people to travel here when it's when it's safe. Very good information thank you so much. Any other questions for Amy? Okay I just have one. Oh Lynn go ahead. Yeah I just want to say that as a member of the committee I'm not concerned about whether or not we have to justify this money. I'm more concerned about what I want to hear from everyone is what they think we really need to do I mean this is money some of it that I believe was put aside from the first 400 million that Governor talked about when you first set this up like earlier in the summer. I want to know what it is you're going to need and what it is we're going to see going forward because this it's getting it's getting to the end of the year and we want to get this money out while we still can and we want to get it out as quickly as possible and I think there are some issues that were raised yesterday by Charlie that are important the occupancy rate is important we are we are hands down safer than anybody else and we are super conscientious about being very conservative about how we reopen and restart but I want to know what it is all of these vendors and these businesses and these people need so that they can put their people back to work and so Vermonters can be going out and earning a living and not just looking for some kind of $150 to a household I want to get something that's really going to help and make us all safe and that's what I'd like to hear from everyone thank you okay Amy the only thing I didn't hear from you is I'd like to know what the chamber feels about the hundred and the 50 million dollars for the consumer stimulus that's been proposed by the administration I think while all the programs are positive that have been proposed by the administration because it's getting dollars into Vermont business hands and into individuals but if the committee is really making considerations on which programs to enhance and what would be the most beneficial we certainly think that adding additional dollars to direct to the rescue package will help Vermont businesses which will then be able to continue to employ people get to the other side of the pandemic okay thank you anything else for Amy Amy thank you very much thank you for your time today so next Eric good morning welcome to the committee thank you for taking time out to speak with us this morning and just kind of fill us in on your experience and what you feel we should be looking at to help help our businesses yeah well I'd like to thank you representative Mark and the other members of the committee for the opportunity to testify today my name is Eric Friedman I'm the executive director at the Med River Valley Chamber of Commerce and we represent about 165 members and prior to that I was the marketing director at the Med River Glen ski area for about 20 years I'm here to share with you how the Med River Valley's hospitality industry has been impacted by the COVID crisis so that you fully understand the stress that these businesses are under and by extension the stress that our chamber is under chambers generally speaking are relying upon member dues events and advertising to fund their operations we are not supported by government entities impacts on the chambers across the state have manifested themselves in in layoffs furloughs and reductions in services the Med River Valley Chamber is emblematic of that situation the Med River Valley Chamber has been forced to let go of one of our two employees this comes at a time when our members are requiring more of us than ever before like um like our business community the chamber has had to be flexible and the stepped up to support our community a year and a half ago I was hired mostly because of my marketing expertise but since that pandemic began I've become much more of a counselor to our local business community and each and every day I'm communicating with business owners in crisis they've been incredibly appreciative of the information guidance and support that we've been able to provide to them and they found it difficult to stay on top of all the changes updates and programs that they need to know about the chamber has become become an important lifeline to them it's a lifeline that there will continue to that they will continue to need as we emerge from this morass it's hard to put into words how much has been added to the chambers uh bellywick with the advent of the COVID crisis chambers have dutifully taken on extra workload to help our businesses and regions survive and we hope recover meanwhile our own revenues have suffered every bit as much as our member businesses have Vermont chambers of commerce are not your atypical chambers we are not the bastions of a faceless multinational corporate business world in fact we're grassroots local organizations dedicated to advocating for and representing small local businesses in ways that they could never afford to themselves we provide critical technical support and assistance to our members every day normally organizations like the matter of valley chamber are also here to market our region to visitors our particular mission at the matter of valley chamber is the economic well-being of our of our local businesses through leading destination marketing building brand equity and creating a unified and engaged culture we create and execute an integrated year on marketing plan we're the champions of the matter of valley brand we foster and engage community culture of aligned goals while we demonstrate and inspire the matter of valley's ethos of optimism and enthusiasm the matter of the matter of valley business community is depending on us now more than ever while our community has already lost some businesses for good because of this crisis i prefer to dwell on the positives i'm so proud of the way that the matter of valley's business community has stepped up in so many ways across all sectors i'd like to take a few moments to share with you two stories that exemplify the matter of valley spirit and vital role played by the chamber the in at the round barn farm is an iconic institution here in the valley lovingly restored in the 1980s this gorgeous facility hosts many weddings and events throughout the year they along with our local wedding venues inject millions of dollars into our local economy year in and year out with the advent of the covid crisis the owners kim jim and their staff were forced to postpone or cancel nearly their entire event schedule their loss of revenue was compounded by the fact that 70 of their annual roommates are associated with the weddings that they host to make matters worse they had to return a lot of deposits put down for events creating serious cash flow issues for them in the face of all of this their first priority was to take care of their staff and keep them employed like so many businesses around the state they nimbly put pivoted their business model in an effort to keep revenues flowing and keep their staff employed they began using their catering kitchen to offer affordable meals to locals and second homeowners while they did this they learned that the matter of valley community was hurting and that vulnerable people were becoming food insecure they also realized that their loyal customers wanted to help for them this created an aha moment that encouraged them to begin work with other local restaurants the matter of valley food shelf and the matter of valley community fund as well as the matter of the chamber of commerce to develop the mrv eats initiative the idea was to pay restaurants to produce food for folks who needed it this kept restaurant staff employed it gave residents and second homeowners a vehicle to fulfill their desire to help those in need finally and most importantly mrv eats is feeding local people in need truly a win-win-win situation while taking this on they also worked hard to expand their dining options for takeout the takeout services provided them the ability to offer picnic in on their amazing grounds giving locals and visitors an unprecedented chance to enjoy the rent the round barns beauty that normally wedding guests are the only ones that can take advantage of it's become a special and popular addition to the summer here in valley truly a silver lining to the covet cloud that all being said no matter how many lobster rolls lobster boiled dinners and fried clam rolls which by the way are really awesome that they might sell it pales in comparison to the wedding revenues room nights ancillary spending and state tax receipts that are generated by what the weddings that they normally host the round barn and our other wedding venues and restaurants need help and they need it now if we're going if they're going to survive and ensure the long-term and ensure their long-term survival the other story I'd like to share with you is how the matter of valley chamber has been working with one incredibly vulnerable sector of our local economy our lodging establishments in mid-march the lodging industry was forced to shut down in the midst of what had been an incredibly strong ski season the governor called on our hotels spend breakfast and lodges to shut down for the greater good and they gladly complied prior to the pandemic the chamber lodging group would meet a couple of times a year share information and mostly to socialize afterwards we at the chamber realized that they had a desire to get together far more often and we created a way to make that happen for them ever since they've met weekly and they continue to do so initially they wondered how to handle cancellations and how they were going to pay their staff then they began to think ahead to the summer and how they should plan for that all the while the chamber worked diligently to provide information guidance on ppp and idle programs they continued to meet to commiserate and help each other as they encountered various roadblocks then the governor started to reopen our economy the lodges after being some of the first to close one of the last given the outward the go ahead to back to get back to business albeit in a limited way their conversations turned to how to open best practices for cleaning policies and the like I can't begin to tell you how many times these businesses and their owners express the gratitude to the chamber for giving them the form to communicate support and learn from one another without the chamber structure and our affinity with this sector the matter of values lodging establishments might not have had the ability to pull together and collaborate they needed the chamber and they will continue to need it even more as we move forward the matter of value chamber and our colleagues around the state need operational funds to make up for losses created by our members hopefully temporary inability to pay their dues and support our mission our hospitality sector is hurting badly our lodges were asked to sacrifice from the beginning of the crisis and they continue to be the frontline of contact with potential visitors whoever would have imagined the specter of lodging establishments needing to follow state imposed travel guidelines vetting potential customers based on where they come from and in many cases denying them reservations only to see them simply contact unregulated short-term rental providers that don't necessarily follow the rules that they have to if lodge owners hope to be in business after the crisis fades they need relief and they need it now this is an investment in vermont's future if the state hopes to see its revenues come back the establishment needs establishments need to be there when visitors return rooms and meals taxes have always been vital vermont's revenues now these establishments need your help to make sure that they exist when the crisis has passed restaurant owners that have heroically flexed their business models by offering a fresco dining takeout and dramatically altered what they do in an effort to keep their revenues up are facing a winter of uncertainty many will have to make a very difficult decision whether to close up or stay open at limited capacity and hope to break even if these businesses don't survive where will future tax revenues come from these businesses need to bridge need the bridge that a rescue package could provide to get them through to the spring these are unprecedented times and vermont's local chambers of commerce are expected to lead our communities through the turbulence our steady hand and strong leadership will be vital as our economy reemerges investing in chambers like ours will return in so many ways please help to ensure that we are here to support our local business community we asked the state award a one-time one million dollar appropriation to the vermont association of chamber executives a proposal supported by the state's regional planning and development commissions these funds would be equitably dispersed to chambers allowing us to continue to provide the organization expertise advocacy and support of our local business communities that they need during these challenging times thank you very much for your time and for your consideration of these vital requests for meaningful financial support i appreciate it questions for eric charlie hi thanks eric nice to see you again yeah absolutely i just want to ask you about the chambers and looking at the the revenue mix that your chamber or most other chambers have been in aside from membership dues and know a lot of the chambers rely on events to generate income to support their ongoing operations i was wondering if you can comment as to what your revenues are in terms of the coming from events versus membership dues uh or and if that's indicative of the rest of the chambers i think each chamber is a little bit different charlie and so thank you so much i really appreciate you coming and talking to our community a while back that was really helpful every every chamber is different and i think that's one of the strengths of of the chambers of commerce within the state of vermont we are basically 100 percent rely on membership dues and we are assuming that we're going to have serious loss in revenue from dues this year and that's what we're budgeting for and trying to make make that work um you're right there are some you know i believe it's qui chi chamber of commerce they're like hugely um reliant on their the balloon festival down there um or that's your neck of the woods so you know you know about that um and you know so they're very different and i think that there's a mix for other ones and um you know and you know as i said you know in my testimony you know i think the chambers of commerce have this you know reputation of being um you know these you know representing big corporate entities and and we don't hear in vermont um and you know we're we're just representing small businesses in ways that they couldn't represent themselves and work collectively and that's what we need and again every and every chamber is a little bit different thank you jim thank you mr chairman um eric um i've got to be quite frank with you um and please don't take this the wrong way the chamber is a private organization and you're coming hat in hand uh to the state of vermont to help uh uh to help you and i wonder you know the the frustration that i've felt about the chamber in general is that while you're you're willing to uh reach out to chamber members there are many more businesses in your and throughout the state that aren't chamber members who still need help and i wonder if you would be willing to step outside the box of the chamber organization to reach out to those businesses who aren't members yeah absolutely i'm really glad that you brought that up jim because that is absolutely something that since the advent of the pandemic we have done that and all of the updates and information that i'm providing that normally would just go to our chamber members goes out into our entire business list every time i send them out uh we have our annual meeting coming up uh in in the first week of september and i invited absolutely every single business in our community to attend that meeting um we are not differentiating between members and non-members at this point well good on you and shaman thank you yep uh zach thank you mr jared thanks eric um i uh sort of just going off a jim's comment i i live in an area that doesn't have um my my constituents don't have um oops sorry um and and as a result um it was pretty much uh just just me um working with my businesses helping them through the pua um i'm the one that's communicating all these different programs that are available to them and and simultaneously sort of um also seemed to be fighting against what appeared to be misinformation coming out of the chambers which was especially frustrating um so i i i appreciate that you are you all are expanding but there is no there is no chamber to expand into hartland windsor and west windsor as far as i know so how can the chambers um use this money uh to reach these communities because at this point with the limited funds that we have um giving you all this million dollars that's taking away from businesses in my community because at this point it's not going to serve them you know fair fair enough um i would say that you need to differentiate between local chambers of commerce and the vermont chamber of commerce and the us chamber of commerce they're very different animals okay and i i think it's a mistake to lump us all together um and we all do very different things you know we haven't historically not been a lobbying organization the matter of rally chamber um i am finding myself the fact that i'm here testifying for this i is not my wheelhouse i'm a marketing guy and uh for me to be here doing this because i know that i'm talking to businesses in crisis every single day and i'm sure you folks are too i hope you are because i'm realizing that um you know that that they they just need support and wherever that's coming from whether whether you have a chamber where you are and if it's if it's you that's you know that's falling on you it's unfortunate they don't have a business organization or a downtime organization to help them we do and we've supported this organization has been supported by our members and we have been successful for something like 40 years and we've been able to do that for a really long time um and a lot of non-members benefit from what we do um because we're attracting people to our community uh and you know doing what we do to do that um doesn't differentiate between a member and a non-member uh and the fact that someone comes here uh and comes to the valley to stay they might go down to grandville and go to the bull mill down there or go to the glass blown studio good down there or go to moslyn falls or go uh you know to wooster or some crazy you know you know little town that you know that they just don't necessarily realize that you know we send them there because we you know i can't tell you how many times i send people to the cemetery in barry because it's cool and um you know so we're not that myopic and um you know fortunately your constituency has a representative that's willing to help them and i think that knowing our representatives here in the valley they've done a nice job in helping us out but they don't have the bandwidth to deal with what i'm dealing with and if i'm not here helping in our organization is not here helping i don't know who's going to help them and yeah i you know i appreciate what you're saying and and by the way eric also thank you so much for what you guys are doing what i really really meant to say was um it we would really like a change i think a chamber would be a beneficial organization in our area um i've seen how beneficial it is in wood stock i've seen how beneficial it is in hardford that change these local chambers play an invaluable role for uh the businesses in the communities they represent and um so uh you know uh to rephrase the question is i hope that we can i don't know if there's potential but um to use some of this funding to help create other chambers in in underserved areas in vermont so that we can have the same access to these resources because right now without the without a chamber as i mentioned before this funding is not going to support my community other or other communities in the state that don't currently have chambers that serve them yeah and if i can add i mean one of the things we're talking about a million bucks here in the overall scheme of the the hundreds of millions of dollars that we're talking about i think it's a pretty darn good investment and as you said you wish you had one let's make sure that the ones the the uh communities that do have them continue to have them thanks eric thank you thank you any other questions for eric eric um did your chamber apply for the for the grants for which one the the ones currently yeah the ones that accd has uh yeah um well i'm not sure i gotta tell you something i'm confused by all the different grants the ones that i'm literally writing a uh grant request for right now uh is for the restart grants is that what you're talking about or the accd ones prior well the the recovery grants that we put out in june no we did not because we're not eligible you sure are there's uh i have a list of of um a list of chambers that have been funded um there's been about a hundred and fifteen thousand dollars that's been given out to one two three four five six chambers so far no we have not so i hope you you do uh you are eligible to apply so we hope you do mm-hmm anything else for eric mr chairman jen um eric um just to follow up on what mic uh or the chairman said there's been an expansion of the dollar amount so please go to my v tax and accd to apply for that well and help as many people as you can i'm on it yes the chamber would would apply to accd not to not to the tax department okay eric thank you very much thank you uh so next to carol good morning thank you for joining us morning everyone good morning chair good morning committee um eric it's not good to have eric go before me because he or it was very good because he was so thorough um you know i'll try not to be redundant um but i think there's some important points that i i probably want to tease out a little bit so i'm carol light hall and executive director for mokimo valley regional chamber of commerce um our chamber covers 12 towns we have about 350 members our focus is tourism also the service industry today i'm here wearing two hats probably so the okimo valley chamber and also the um the base organization so the association for 30 chambers statewide representing local regional and statewide chambers base uh mostly is dedicated to professional development networking and information sharing between chambers i'm a base member i'm also a board member each base chamber is independent has its own board of directors um and we follow local priorities whatever those are chambers big and small are funded much the same way although as eric said um uh within varying levels uh so membership dues events revenue business advertising covid has impacted all businesses across the state covid has impacted all chambers across the state our member businesses are retail restaurants lodging many mom and pop shops main street businesses and they're struggling to survive chambers are struggling as well membership is weighed down events are canceled business advertising is limited chambers have laid off employees or reduced staff hours the stories that eric told about mad river valley um is consistent in the northeast kingdom and brother burrow and herford and springfield and st. albin's in bennington these are all chamber colleagues that took time to send me an email and describe what's going on with them and there's a lot of consistency across the board um and you know maybe uh something else they're trying to figure out how to keep going how do we keep going we know we're needed all the while the work we do our mission to keep our businesses and community strong has never been more important um so i'm relatively new to chamber world and a big question for a long time is the relevance of a chamber to serve its community and you know and i would tell you this is a great example of what chambers need to be doing they we need to be connected to our businesses we need to keep the wind um on their back or is that the saying um from the beginning with covid we provided information resources referrals technical assistance problem solving for businesses i had businesses trying to figure out how to feed their family and i stopped them in their tracks with that and i just i wanted to them to feel like um it was safe to talk to me about those kinds of things that's what we're that's what we're doing um whatever it takes we provide a lifeline we provide hope we provide encouragement um so far the access to resources has been first of all uh we appreciate it we appreciate the resources for our members we see the encouragement that they feel um some of the resources just have not worked very well for us so i'll tell you this the accd recovery grant really wonderful some of the stories i've heard uh from chambers and what we experienced ourselves at okimo valley was just the so chambers have three vital revenue sources membership events and advertising in most cases and so membership um in some cases needed to be removed from the calculation for the recovery grants and that was based on the format for their text filing so in my case membership was able to to go through okay in other cases with chambers that wasn't the case events so fundraising and events is really how we live um and so that needed to be removed from the calculation so in some cases it was either one or two of the main revenue sources needed to be removed still appreciative um but it's an important fact the paycheck protection program i've had my fingers crossed on that for a very long time thinking we could cover our overhead and our staffing levels um however chambers were not considered an eligible applicant were 501c6s for the most part and not eligible for the federal program um and let's see um there there is another comment i was going to make about that um in general and i guess i would i would say to representative watson for heartland windsor and west windsor we're in okimo valley we're a regional chamber where our our heart is big and we want to help whoever needs help in the same way that um eric said uh we open the door and we really have open the door to businesses we want more people on the bus um you know long term uh if if businesses if we have earned their trust if we've earned their loyalty um and membership is appropriate later on that's great but that's not our motivation in this case our regional economies in my case are dependent on all of us you know we know we'll lose some we've seen we were losing some businesses um but we need to keep moving forward and stay optimistic so our request is for uh a million dollars as eric talked about we're very thankful the regional development corporations of vermont the regional planning commissions of vermont our friends our partners when we don't know a question we go to them uh and and they help they're supportive of this request they want us available and helping uh let's see just checking my notes i think in general and and eric did a good job of touching on this but chambers occupy a very interesting niche and it's a niche that you know and i think of it as the the soul of the economy um when we conduct an event and right now events are a huge challenge for us when we conduct an event it feeds our regional brand it supports the state brand we're brand ambassadors we nurture quality of life in vermont we highlight quality of life so as people maybe especially now are seeing vermont in a very positive safe kind of way people are also wanting to come here to live and that's that's a focus um we've applied for every grant we can apply for um we've made sure as much as we can that the businesses we have contact with are applying um i send either a text an email i pick up the phone i call people did you see that email don't forget the deadline call me with questions um so it's that kind of thing the stimulus grant uh that has a deadline on monday it's a very short window and i'm racking my brains i'm calling towns i'm calling partners to just say um we need to put something together something regional that also resonates locally for folks so that's what we're working on between now and monday uh thank you for allowing us to provide testimony today i'm happy to answer your questions thank you questions for carol carol hi carol um and thank you for organizing those early spring meetings too among your chamber members uh to help get out information about what the programs were uh between and thank you to woodstock yeah that uh what's the chamber did a great job i just wondering uh you just mentioned the stimulus application is that through the vermont department of tourism and marketing for the regional stimulus package yes that's not part of a gift card per se but different than it's a regional marketing approach is that right it is yes it is all right just want to make sure and i was thinking that you probably are working closely with the springfield economic development corporation as well right with bob flinton his organization you're working with those guys with businesses or on the on the stimulus or just generally uh generally when you have businesses that are members of yours that you're looking to help or point the right direction are you utilizing them as well well yes uh for sure and bob has um uh he's the fastest rooster he has a fastest response time i send an email i ask for help i get the answer and i just really appreciate it um i say too that it go it's a two-way street with us for sure so if he has something that's important to his organization that he wants coming to our organization shared to businesses we do it freely and widely we want benefit uh businesses to benefit and we don't really care where the information comes from the rdcs are just important partners rpcs for different reasons are also important partners okay thank you very much i just want to just clarification thanks thank you yeah thank you um when you talk about events maybe anybody from the chambers can talk about this but carol you might be a good person since you're representing the association um when you talk about events and you talk about the fact that they have been canceled almost statewide for any number of reasons um i suspect the biggest one of course was of the fear of large groups of people and we're talking about occupancy rates and re-examining that as maybe as a potential help to both our lodging and other we're getting out at the end of the summer and a lot of these were outdoor events you know the under tense food yes ceremony food celebrations and whatnot um is this something that you did because the governor put in the state of emergency or is this something that the state told you had to do or is this something that maybe um you can re-examine and um i don't know how much more time you have to look forward to it but we've got the fall coming we've got the uh you know the foliage season is that something that maybe you can get some permission from or get some way of sort of yeah doing those on a smaller scale so just in answer to your question it was kind of all of the above just um you know following the governor's guidance on what was safe keeping crowds relatively small um and realizing that uh a lot of that guidance was contrary to what we typically would be looking for an event we want something big splashy something that unites people and so on and so it's really rethinking you know um an event for instance that tourist people around the region keeps them in their cars that's a great event people like that the big big you know we run a magazine we ran a feature on the best cheeseburger best burger in the valley kind of thing um i serve on the new england association of chambers too and i'm always uh have my ears wide open to how we need to do things now so at the base level some of what we want to do with this money is to think about what are the covid best practices how do we retool how do we rethink uh our work plans and i think we can do that anything else for caro caro i'd i'd really like to delve into a little bit about your experience in in applying for the recovery grant and uh i think we need a little better understanding of you talked about some chambers can include their losses from membership and others can't and uh also events um you were not able to uh to use your events as a loss and so i'd like to understand a little better or get your understanding as to why um why that is yeah uh certainly and so um we've compared notes a little bit so i know that it wasn't just stokemen valley uh regional chamber so the the process uh for the accd recovery grant was wonderful it was just smooth all the way through um maybe the the piece related to uh we needed to attach uh last year's uh vermont uh tax return 990 and so uh that was and that would include all revenue sources so in my case i submitted that and i was told to review uh to remove uh all fundraising i reviewed the guidelines and the guidelines um uh said not for profits needed to um remove fundraising so i think we weren't and the the instructions weren't clear for that so that is so that is so my understanding it was the same rule for all not for profits not just chambers um the other the other piece uh with membership now our membership uh dollars were included because it was included in our 990 when it was submitted um another chamber that i talked with um and they didn't sub they weren't using a 990 and they were told they needed to remove their membership uh she ended up getting a check for a hundred uh a thousand eight hundred dollars and so her chamber currently she's trying to get her work done for 10 hours a week um so those dollars would have been really important i don't know if that's helpful is that helpful um it is um i it really i'm not sure that accd is following the legislature's intent we had specifically said that charitable donation so anything that someone could um get a tax um a tax yes question on on their taxes um was not we would not count that but anything else would be counted so and it's our understanding from what we learned from our legislative council is that um any fundraisers that you may do um raffles anything like that are not tax deductible and so they should be counted so i think we need to have some more discussions with accd as to how they're applying um applying that to everyone um i know i i did see that the okimo chamber received um 22 683 dollars yes and thank you um but i'm wondering if we'll have to have those discussions i think with accd and better understand that i think that um i think the chambers could be getting more dollars um through the grants which they my opinion should be um and and all nonprofits so long as the formula is being looked at correctly following legislative intent anything else for carol thank you carol appreciate your time thank you thank you sue you're up um thank you for joining us again um i'm sure i'm hoping things are a little better for you than they were when we last talked to you but we i think we want to know a little bit more um and what you see going into the fall and winter time um and see what we then get your recommendations on what we might do great so welcome great hello everybody thank you um see you all again um so my name's i'm the owner of blueberry barbecue in grillington and i'm also one of the co-founders of the vermont restaurant coalition and we're just a volunteer network of restaurants that that formed early in the covid period and just been working to gather information uh share information with each other and help preserve our sector through this um so i think today i'll speak a little bit broadly from like a general restaurant perspective and then maybe share a couple things uh from my own uh lived experience here um first i really want to just recognize thank you for for that initial round of grant funding um it certainly made a difference to many and uh we appreciate the acknowledgement of uh our industry and and what we're going through um i think amy did an excellent job showing hospitality sector impact um you know the restaurant the restaurant sectors we're still in the crisis um even with vermont maintaining a very high level of safety and without the significant covid impacts that we've seen in other states with restaurants under capacity restrictions um and our limited availability to build back revenue it's kind of like we're still enduring the ongoing crisis at a pretty deep level um broadly i'm trying to think like what's most helpful to share today you know broadly our businesses are built on capacity so when that is reduced and restricted there's not a lot of flexibility um we've many of us have pivoted to go to go and other models and kind of working to to bring in as much revenue as we can but um it like the math doesn't always work so a brought up the word resilient you know i think there's definitely a commitment to resilience and maintaining and seeing the other side of this but uh i think what's important for you at all to understand is you know our business levels are restricted but our fixed costs our loans our leases all those um commitments that we made as business owners are maintained so there isn't a lot of change there um so it really becomes uh every restaurant in a unique position it depends on what your relationship with your landlord was what your loan relationships are how big your facility is how much it costs to fuel like it's really hard to give detail on all that because there's so many different components but i think what i would just share is uh restricted revenues um you know for the good of the safety of vermont um but revenues are restricted but many of our costs remain um so you're kind of in this real ongoing bind which is not the most pleasant experience but um what we are able to do this summer is is pivot to outdoor dining that was certainly helpful um it's you know known as like a safe way to to gather and eat out that window is going to close really soon we're going to lose outdoor dining here in vermont that's going to kind of map directly with the run out of any restaurant that uses ppp funds uh so we're looking in about eight weeks at a very different scenario here for burlington restaurants or my own restaurant one of the things to note too is generally our summer revenue has helped offset winter losses so it's just kind of the the cycle of business and different regions in vermont are going to be different but we're kind of emerging at a summer without that revenue to offset losses so i think i'm just sharing that just to recognize like i think what you're seeing in a restaurant landscape is this currently intact people are operating we're seeing to go we're seeing outdoor dining we're seeing a lot of entrepreneurship um we're seeing incredible generous support from vermonters choosing to take out or eat out you know i think in the next eight weeks we just might see a very different landscape going into winter so i just kind of wanted to to bring that to your attention um just to talk about the initial grant funding um just my own personal experience uh it really helped create a lifeline to to cover the expenses and hurt over that that initial kind of covid shutdown period which for our company was a couple of months so we were able to use the grant program to pay off our utilities pay off our lease pay off all the fixed expenses that we incurred um and uh it was incredibly helpful but as time goes on our it's like everything's continued so that that need is going to kind of continue as long as we're under restriction um i think there's just two points that i really want to just kind of bring to attention on the grant program um my business qualified we were above the 50 loss threshold so we were able to access the grant if you were not able to get in that initial grant and you had losses of 49 percent or up to you know and below or above like you really missed out like it was a real hard line so you were out of the grant program and i think we might have left a lot of restaurants behind in that with that 50 threshold number and i understand that we had to pick a number but i do want to raise some concerns for people that didn't meet that criteria um there's potential that uh a restaurant was uh take out friendly the initial uh shutdown started they pivoted to take out quick experience revenue loss but were entrepreneurial and worked throughout the early covid period and it's almost like the 50 threshold may have punished those restaurants that participated and i just want to raise a hand there just looking to acknowledge restaurants that um maybe 25 to 50 percent revenue reduction within that same look back period is something to to consider as as far as what we're looking to to save a sector because if you did not meet that 50 threshold you really you're really missed on the initial grant proposal and with our margins being in that five to ten percent like any revenue loss is really a critical business impact and it's kind of like you can drown in the deep end or the shallow end of the pool like it doesn't you know so if you're if you were in you know down 35 percent it could be as critical as 50 um so just kind of raising the hand for restaurants that didn't meet that initial threshold that got left out of that original grant proposals i think that if there's a way to recognize and acknowledge that uh it's really important uh to preserve the whole sector um the second piece just to keep in mind uh that just want to bring the attention of you all is i think that there's maybe a thought process that we all kind of had that like a bigger restaurant or like a larger restaurant group would have um more access to capital or be better prepared to weather the storm but actually uh there's some parts of this where uh big is not better um because you have a higher overhead higher fixed costs um and you're you're you're more leveraged and we just don't see a lot of access to loans capital or anything right now um so i'm just bringing this up because the way that the cap was established a 2.5 million dollar restaurant had access to the initial $50,000 grant the same as a under a million restaurant so that $50,000 could cover four months of fixed expenses for a smaller restaurant and two months for a larger restaurant um i think in the new in some of the expanded that that may be a remedy but i just want to this is not the time you want to be a big restaurant um and i think if we're looking at this as an economic impact like preserving our larger restaurants that employ more vermoners that contribute more to the rooms and meals tax that we want to just be able to note that to keep those restaurants intact um so just if anything i think it's looking at the distribution so it's proportional to contribution um that was just something i think representative Jerome that was a question that you led earlier so um i think that in addition to everything that Amy Spears shared um my summary is we're a resilient industry we want to all be here next year i think we are it is unknown what the impact of the restaurant sector is on the Vermont economic ecosystem like i i think the loss of this sector is not just about rooms and meals tax lines not about payroll tax not about unemployment but there is like a network of vendors and farms and cheese makers and brewers that we are at the hub of so it's a good place to invest and i think these grant programs and all the economic aid really is investment in keeping the sector going while under restriction um the second piece was looking to recognize restaurants with that 50 to 25 percent revenue loss those that missed out on the initial grant funding because i think you can make a case that restaurants that didn't have like the significant revenue loss were operating during the early covid period to serve their communities and it doesn't seem right that they would potentially be punished for that and um any revenue loss 15 percent below year over year is is enough to kind of put a restaurant business in crisis um so just looking at that i think it's important i think for future grant programs just looking at the proportional impact the businesses have on the economic community um this is not a time where it pays to be big um obviously in my own heart and soul it's so important that like the corner deli and uh the big restaurant on church street both make it through but i just wanted to kind of paint the picture that that the church street restaurant with those with that lease number and that amount of fixed cost is very vulnerable right now um just as much as like a smaller operator and i think that that is my uh story to tell today um maybe i'll just finish by adding like as a coalition we've been doing everything we can to advocate for significant restaurant sector relief at the federal level um representative welch uh cosponsored the restaurants act which is sector specific uh federal aid um our senate delegation has been looking at it and advocating so we we know that this sector the hospitality sector is so vulnerable right now we know that we need federal monies coming in to support it and i'm so sorry but it doesn't seem like anything can happen in washington dc right now and i think that there is a necessity for vermont to look at this sector as a critical part of the economy and do everything you can to help keep it intact while we kind of wait and wonder what is happening in dc um but if you look at it from a restrictive mandated part it's like hospitality and airlines um as far as businesses that are that are dramatically affected uh through the crisis and uh i'll take any questions and and uh thank you thank you sue um just for just so you know it wasn't the legislature that instituted the caps um but i believe that accd now has raised the caps um so that and um i think everyone that had gotten a at least a $50,000 grant can reapply again um so i i think that will be helpful and of course we are looking um we'll be looking at the draft legislation this afternoon um and having discussions on reducing the the um the 50 percent down to i think the the recommendation from the from accd has been 35 so we'll have those discussions as well jean thank you mr chair um not so much a question as a comment i have watched one i'm a i'm a major takeout from bluebird i mean they've got the best barbecue i've ever had and the takeout is absolutely spectacular i have watched this business grow and thrive in a tough location and i just want to underscore that that they do their job so well and they're struggling it's so important it this is not a situation where you've got a business that might have had a problem earlier going into it and covid hit it this is a thriving business that is just brilliantly run and with entrepreneurial spirit and great barbecue and i just one quick question is do you think you're going to get any bounce from the students coming back well thanks jean and thanks for being a fan and thanks for your support big fan i'll hop on my step today thank you um i don't know what the uvm impact we we we tend not to have a uvm trampoline but we tend not we see that impact on the graduation weekends and on the parents we're not as heavily involved in um the the kind of night long story short i'm not sure thank you that i i i didn't think we would see it and that's i sort of wanted to get that on the record to say yes we got 10 000 kids coming in but that does not translate into your business or most businesses and i think in downtown linoospey is really impacted also with their restaurants i think that we don't have the data but i would say what i would think happens is that restaurants and dining restaurants are impacted by the college student populations for parent visits dining out right and then more of the fast casual deli fast food have the ongoing support so it would be different based on a style of restaurant yeah yours is wonderful though i'm a huge fan thank you okay one more question um we do have five more people in half an hour left so um charlie you muted yeah just it's gonna be very quick um so i think when you last talked to us it was um there was a concern about ppp loans and whether or not to actually use them and then the guidelines changed the guidelines change in a way so that uh you're able to use that fund those funds and be assured that you can have them forgiven assured that around forgiveness is probably a concern still for many just because they there's still some guidelines even within the the uh the new wave of uh that that are unknown um ppp has been such a difficult loan for this industry because of the initial rollout happened while we were in predominant shutdown period but the initially it was you had to use it by at certain points so many restaurants even without being open rehired their team to take advantage of the ppp loan while they were in open collecting revenue ran it out early and we're out early when i didn't need it yeah yeah if you waited and you it's been like a like this poker game you know if you waited and now you're using it while you're building revenue there is a you can make a case where it's helpful but it so the forgiveness and the um flexibility act made a big difference for hospitality but some restaurants used it in that early period because that was what we were told to do so they didn't have the act they didn't they weren't able to take advantage of the flexibility act others have so i think just the rollout and the changes to the program and the inconsistencies of it um still waiting for some final guidelines from the sba on some details like it's just not it's never been like a foundational this is how we're going to use it long i would say it's helped many i would say some never had access to it and i would say that others used it like they were told they're definitely okay thank you very much i know i know it's a complicated subject so maybe it was like yeah maybe all right thanks 2021 i don't everyone here pivot or ppp again thanks sue thank you very much um appreciate your time and and uh all the best to you and and your association will do our best to see what we can do to help thank you talina good morning morning thank you so much hey everyone i really appreciate the invite uh being able to testify in front of all of you on behalf of the vermont association of wedding professionals i have to say throughout this pandemic i have received quite the civics lesson out of necessity uh and i really appreciate all of the hard work that you guys have been doing i hope you got to enjoy a little bit of the summer uh during your short break uh it was incredibly i was as well as our members were incredibly thankful to know after our initial testimony in june that many of our recommendations did find their way into h966 and s350 thank you so much for that the vast majority of our of our members were able to benefit from the recovery grants the grants were absolutely vital as you heard amy and many others mentioned uh the speed and urgency from both the legislature the accd and the tax department did not go unnoticed i was impressed with the application process you know rolling out these programs in the given time frame is no easy task sure there were a couple of hiccups here and there but it was truly well done um i did get an opportunity to listen in yesterday and i you know you guys mentioned some of the barriers many didn't know that they qualified um many didn't understand how much they would get how it was calculated uh i personally called several of our members assured them that they qualified walked them through the process gave them all of the materials we found ourselves on zoom you know at eight and nine o'clock at night i helped them get their books in order and uh you know anyone who found it intimidating i was really there to help them through that process because i knew how much these funds really meant to them as you heard from the accd the data is in the tourism hospitality and event sectors have been hit the hardest how hard well i own premier entertainment a dj photo booth and lighting business year to date we're down 77 percent this is also the average within our membership of over 200 businesses that rely heavily on wedding uh weddings for their revenue uh foliage my favorite time of year is just weeks away and certainly the most sought after time to wed in vermont september is by far our biggest month for revenue for september to december i'm projecting a loss in revenue of 90 percent that'll make a total annual loss for 2020 of 83 percent again this is very representative of our membership how did we get here i think many of you know we're forced to close in mid march through june until we were able to gather even in small groups uh the average length of engagement for a vermont wedding is 17.6 months and wedding invitations go out at least eight weeks prior so all these events are heavily preplanned uh and cannot turn on a dime so even once we got the go ahead uh all of the weddings chose for the most the majority of weddings chose to either postpone or worse cancel their weddings all together uh later those who held on found the restrictions on gathering size or the mask mandate something that just didn't fit their vision of their wedding day so again we found more rounds of postponements and cancellations uh so now we've been whittled down to just a few remaining celebrations of a smaller size i do want to underscore this by saying that we do fully support the governor's commitment to keeping us safe and greatly appreciate his science-based approach uh so how can you help us we too would like you to approve the money for those who fell through the gaps specifically within our membership and you heard you know in the mad river valley new businesses weren't able to access these funds and not just new businesses sometimes these were businesses that exchanged hands so they were just uh new ownership and there's some uniqueness to those contracts and the way that that happened as well that made them ineligible so they definitely need these funds even more so because they've been waiting longer sole proprietors within our sectors of all races and genders yes they they do get pua but it's nowhere near a wage replacement most of our sole proprietors this is their full-time job they are high wage earners who have created their own jobs within rural areas of the state where jobs at these wages they don't exist um you know they live in towns like lincoln and st johnsbury and waterbury and again very rural areas of the state and if they didn't have this Vermont wedding industry they would not be able to reside here they have young families that they want to have grow up in those communities that they support but again they won't they'll be forced to leave if they're unable to stay here and maintain their level of wages their needs are also greater because beyond just salary with many of the canceled weddings they have been forced to return retainers and deposits and yes we have consulted multiple lawyers gotten second third and fourth opinions across the board and by and large that is what is necessary uh it's also very important that you make sure that everyone within these sectors has a chance at both a first and a second grant so i want to make sure there's no restrictions that say anyone who didn't get in the first round such as a sole proprietor or a new business or anyone like that is not precluded from also tapping into the 50 million or if you're able to increase that uh bucket for the hospitality sector so that that way they're equal with their peers um our road is definitely a long one given the timing of the pandemic and the event slash travel season um so as as ted mentioned to you the the 10 was really designed to cover a couple of months this as i mentioned happened in march of all times the worst time when the acorns that we saved up to get us through the off season and through the winter are pretty well depleted and we're really looking forward to may and june uh to get our revenues going again so we've lost all of our revenue for this year and we don't have any acorns for this winter so that is presenting a significant challenge um you know no one and no one within the business world would advocate for any business having 12 months worth of reserve just hanging around they tell you to to use that money and and make money off of it and and better leverage yourself uh also we want to make sure that uh the 48 women-owned businesses that were approved and promised funding are funded first um i believe the number that came out is 325 thousand dollars to make sure that they are funded first since they the 2.5 was exhausted in the event that following september 1st they don't have access to those funds and then if at all possible uh lift the quarantine requirements uh i don't know if you guys have seen but within the last week the cdc has changed their guidelines regarding those uh this can be done prior to the upcoming foliage season in conjunction with occupancy restrictions to assist our lodging members to accept more guests uh that won't necessarily help all of us as i mentioned the lead time for planning a wedding is significant so for most of us that ship has sailed but certainly those that are able to accept new reservations and people can make these decisions and say let's go up to vermont next week um they can capture some of that revenue uh also it will allow them possibly to create some acorns so that once all of the cares funding money uh is gone by the end of december they have something in january february and march to get continue to get them through until that travel and wedding season is back certainly a large part of why you guys should be supporting the vermont wedding industry is because we're going to be a big part of bringing this economy back the vermont wedding industry contributes four hundred and fifteen million dollars of economic activity annually to the state uh you know jone may not have a crystal ball as you mentioned uh but when it comes to the wedding industry we kind of do uh we have since everyone has postponed an incredible amount of business and people who have said we promise to come back next year but we have to make sure that we're ready for that um the money that people spend on a wedding is spent in vermont it's spent with local vendors it's not spent with big businesses um and again by and large our members this is their full-time job they're using it as their main source of income to support their families it's not part-time work that is just extra cash to spend um and also when couples choose to marry in the state of vermont they bring a hundred to two hundred of their friends and family with them and expose them to the state of vermont which is a really big deal um 46 of the couples that get married in vermont do not reside here and just shy of 425 000 guests attended weddings in the state of vermont last year a tremendous number of people uh we need to maintain that vermont brand and like i said the only way to do that is through exposure and experience so these people are coming and they're saying wow i went to my friend's wedding you know they're from colorado they're from california whatever it is because they went to college with whoever got married here they never would have chosen to come to the state of vermont until they got that wedding invitation so now they've come here they've experienced what it's like to be in the mad river valley to be in stow to be in woodstock and the next time they plan a vacation or a ski trip or something like that they remember what it was like in vermont and they come back also i know there was a little bit of a concern about the calculator and especially with many in the hospitality sector maxing out and whether or not they would see a duplication of benefits i did play with the calculator uh yesterday and between uh and you know along with some examples from our membership even people who received these grants people who receive ppp money and it it says in there uh whether or not you um i'll read it to you it says risk of experiencing a duplication of benefits from your prior grant no risk your current losses are are greater than the grants you received additional grant money your business could apply for zero dollars risk of experiencing a duplication of benefits if you receive additional grant funds no risk uh that's those are the answers that our members by and large will get they desperately need this money as i said we're looking at annual losses not just losses over the months of march april and may um these are continued sustained losses for the entire year what's next to lina if if i could we we're down the 15 minutes and i have um three and four more people that need to testify yep i really appreciate um what you've told us it gives us a good focus on on looking at making sure that we can get more dollars in just want to make sure that that you and your members know that they are able to reapply right now for more grant dollars oh they do know that every single one of them knows that that's good and i hope that i hope they do that um to help continue them to sustain while we go through all of this yeah so the the number one big ask is that that 10 percent goes to to being able to get an additional 10 percent in that hospitality second round of grants and i don't believe that 10 percent is anything that we put in i think that's something that accd has has um put in part of their criteria so um i'm hoping that they've heard heard you all out clear of your needs i'll be speaking with joan this afternoon so i think they will thank you very much let's see next courtney welcome thank you thank you very much and i appreciate the time here my name is Courtney low i am the vice president marketing business development for the woodstock in a resort in woodstock vermont um i'm going to echo a lot of what amy sue and talena have talked about um but uh i'll try to keep portland sweet um but it's been it's been a tough road but we appreciate everything this committee and the legislation what has done for for businesses businesses thus far um but as we know we acknowledge that it's a uh it's difficult choice to be made there's a lot of people suffering and there's no easy answers but um just so you know i'm also representing the vermont lodging coalition newly formed i think many of you may know that we had a vermont restaurant lodging association that uh went away in 2005 the chamber commerce vermont chamber commerce took it over um and of course it took this event for us to get our act together and get back together so um you'll be hearing a lot more from us in the future but i'm representing dozens of hotels and a growing number of membership right now um you know the big thing is definitely a dire situation for so many iconic vermont businesses um that definitely defined the state and the hospitality industry uh it is one of those um you know so many brand names independent brand names uh in our state uh in the lodging industry that that really help us put vermont on the map um and we bring hundreds of thousands of tourists in the state here um and you know the expectation of those those visitors of the vermont brand um is a very uh wholesome uh very accepting hospitable atmosphere for them to visit so my worry in the long run is that the vermont brand is right now is kind of shut down um and i worry about that but i'll get into that in a little bit um you know the from the wood stocking and resorts of viewpoint we we closed march 16th and we reopened uh july 1st um you know 50 occupancy for us uh we can get there relatively easily um our demand was so great before this so many people want to travel here one thing you gotta realize is that the pent up demand of drive uh of the drive market is so huge because nobody's flying anywhere so in the in the area of the country that has the least about our cases uh those people want to travel within that area so that's important to think about our property like many others uh since 2009 and uh hurricane Irene coming through uh we had to rebuild tremendously this way we had to rebuild twice we started in 2009 and we had to start over again in 2011 and the big thing for us is about building cash and and all these and putting some cash there so we can survive in the long run and unfortunately this event you know took uh took it all away in a blink of an eye it's almost like our savings account was hacked and everything was gone so and uh larger properties like myself and some of those iconic properties i talk about like uh like the woodstock in a resort and others out there um we actually don't qualify for any relief just so you're aware of that um so we've got to take on many other means to survive in the long run and i believe it's said a couple times today it's it's about getting to next June if everything is okay by then getting to next June normally through most years getting through the winter and spring is difficult for any of these properties even even if we're having a good year so um that's tough so that support is is incredible i am worried about some of these properties that we know from small small ends to larger places uh that are family owned that we may never see them owned by families again we may see them owned by private equity groups in the long run we may see other brands in certain areas major national brands that you may not want here in Vermont who knows so those are concerns um as you know we provide tons of jobs right now i think the job market it's it's interesting the job market was difficult before this it's difficult coming back in uh even uh when restrictions get lifted more it's it's gonna be a tough job getting people back to work so many as i said many of our businesses would be operating at near capacity what's interesting what i found out is mostly central southern Vermont can hit that number a lot more than some of the northern uh part of the state and i think a lot has to do with the Canadian border um and then some places it considers on certain times like if you're a more rural area like Woodstock is uh people are more willing to come there and spread out um but uh one thing you got to understand is that the hospitality industry has always been uh in the the cleaning and safety business and and in this event we've been doing better than than anybody and it's it's amazing so um although i would love to have a wedding business and the conference business back right away i think we're all completely understanding that that is really the one of the main issues right now in the short term that uh can affect us uh with with new cases leisure travel was very interesting and i know charlie's brought this up um and representative dickinson thank you for bringing it up as well uh leisure travel is uh a very safeguarded um business right now and if you i know this group doesn't make that decision so i'm having an opportunity to get in front of the health department this week but um if you are talking to people just realize if you look around our neighboring states that leisure travel has not had any effect on anything and and i say that uh and if it has it's very little but in some cases like k cod cases have gone down and visitation has gone up the the graph kind of looks like this uh it's pretty amazing so when you look at it people come here for two days and then they go home um they literally don't stand in front of people for 15 minutes they're they're out doing their own thing they're out hiking they're riding bikes or not and because of restrictions on bars and we're okay with that too because um we can still do spread out cocktail service and bars are another place where people meet people that they don't know and they get together so if you really do the uh homework on the science on leisure travel alone um you'll see two things one is it can help out our economy and it's an easy way out for us uh it's not having it's it's less dollars having to be found to help save us if we can get at least save the fall uh time period um and uh it is um you know it's easy much easier for us to manage so we don't see groups of people getting together and and doing that and i think uh that's something we have to seriously think about um so um i am concerned about the vermont brand being closed i think we've got a long road ahead so those marketing dollars that are upcoming um the timing of the use of those marketing dollars has to be is crucial um however i am one not to rest on our laurels um at the wood stocking resort we're spending dollars that we don't have to keep our brand out there and make sure that for our future when we do open more whenever that is that we're ready to go and people are know that we're here and i have colleagues in both new york state and massachusetts and cape cod that are thanking us for being a 50 percent because they're benefiting from it uh right now um so the uh as was mentioned earlier the lodging um the light industry is highly capitalized their fixed costs are tremendous so right now with the lodging restrictions i mean we're bleeding it's just it's just mitigating a little bit of the bleeding but we are uh we're hurting and you got to understand we are very low margin business to begin with so um if i were to share with you what we have to make in revenues and what we bring home at the end of the day it's unbelievable i mean it took us years to climb to a positive number and again i said we built that pot probably over the last five years and again it's gone um so uh yeah i think i really think going back to that leisure travel really missing opportunity a very low risk uh opportunity um i've seen in neighboring states the proposal for the dollars a property like mine um you gotta you gotta go really high to get a number that even makes sense you know 50 000 dollars even 150 000s a drop in the bucket and even 50 000 for a lot of these restaurants and lodging places are only going to get them by for a few months and that's it so i'm concerned about the long term and what we're going to be able to do uh there so um the disproportionate um disproportionate uh funding has already been mentioned i was going to give an example of that but um i think that was already spelled out so you understand that i know um it's at least something hopefully the accd can can take a closer look at those parameters um i did want to mention something about the gift card program i think that's a lot of money going into something i'm not most of the lodging coalition does not really understand how it's going to work and we know we feel very much that we're not going to benefit from it we'd have to develop great campaigns to try to draw people in to utilize it with with our industry so we would prefer that that money be shifted to the lodging industry and utilize that for for more aid we think that direct hit into to our targeted at our industry would be very helpful for the hardest hit industry in the state and the entire entire world so something to think about because i think a lot of those funds will certainly be used in good ways for some people that really need them especially to get maybe groceries on the table um and pay mortgages and so forth if that's the way they can use my don't i don't actually i don't i don't know all the eligibility of that but i do know like grocery stores seem to be doing very well right now and things like that so i think really have to take a look at what targeted industries should benefit from this gift card program if we continue with it so something to take a harder look at um and that's about it um you know i appreciate i know all of this is really hard and you guys have heard monster numbers i think when our coalition realized all the way up until about june we're going to lose it's a multiplier number of what how we affect the fact tourism it's about 1.2 billion dollars of revenue that's going to be lost and lodging alone is a 560 million dollars um so they're astronomical if you can imagine when we first started doing this i had a committee of eight of us talking together between the eight of us we had 70 million dollars lost through uh december that's crazy so um it's a long way to go for all of us i appreciate your time today um and i hope uh you can continue to do more for all of us thank you thank you court me one thing um i believe you were talking about your business that you couldn't access the grants and i'm assuming that has to do with the revenue gap that they put on that's correct yeah but if we will one thing to consider too on a larger property side um is uh the fact that let's take wood stock in a resort is example we sit in one village and we are pretty much the main business in this town and the other lodging facilities fill in very nicely with all of that but we pretty much support a large bit of what we do supports this town in this immediate area tremendously and and it affects everybody here no doubt um maybe someday you you can meet your state rep charlie kimball and i would like to say that charlie's been extremely helpful in providing us all the information and communicating for us and uh he's done a wonderful job thus far i'm sure he has thank you very much adam i'll pay you later to court me good morning uh so mr chair thank you for having me here today committee members uh i had some prepared comments um but really want to be mindful of your time and how best to use this opportunity um so i think i'll just start with a couple brief comments uh in support of the governor's proposal uh for the continued use of the carers funds um as well as supporting uh the vase request the the rdc's um of which i'm the former president i just to clarify i'm no longer uh the the president of the rdc's and for the record my name is adam granold executive director of the brattle bro development credit corporation um rdc's have been having conversations across the state with chambers you know we strongly support their mission and their their purpose uh and what we see is just an inability uh due to everything that you've heard today from events uh to membership dues to sustain their operations it is it is an extinction event um for these organizations and they are so critical to the the small business network that keeps vermont what it is and we really are supportive of finding some way to ensure that they can get through to the other side many of them have brick and mortar expenses many of them have already uh reduced their expenses through now almost volunteer staffing um and are really just trying to get through so rdc's are happy to support that request that's been made um i think we heard about some of the challenges that the chambers faced in applying uh to the funding in regards to donations or charitable or fundraising events um so maybe if that's clarified that's another path forward um but we we support that request um i think many of the the programs that have been laid out and discussed already today uh in the governor's proposal for the use of these funds the rdc's are behind that we see the the economy having received the vermont economy having received almost three billion dollars um from outside sources recently that's been sloshing around and that's really masked what's going to happen um you know when those dollars came into the economy they moved throughout the economy and we're we're still seeing them move through so it's a billion dollars uh in ppp the the CARES money the ui all of that money is is really keeping our economy moving right now so as bad as this is personally i think is it's as good as it's going to be for a year or or more um because what we did is in the hospitality industry covid hit right when the hospitality industry and all of its employees were already preparing to hibernate they know that seasonal ebb and flow uh so they they anticipated that they were ready for that um employees actually ended up receiving additional income unanticipated income that they were able to put out into the economy that otherwise would not have happened uh as as restaurants reopen um they had some some support both from the state and the federal government to help those operations as those go away in winter hits we're facing this looming cloud of being forced back inside um while still having diminishing outside resources the the way we describe an economy to people who don't necessarily understand the economics is a swimming pool um if you picture a swimming pool in the summer kids getting in and out they bring the water out with them water's evaporating uh eventually the water disappears there's no you can't swim in that pool anymore unless you bring water from outside sources back into that pool or into that economy um if we're not able to generate enough revenue our pool will run dry and we won't be able to share that those dollars or that water uh within the within the state um really briefly what we've seen reported by FEMA uh recently is a couple of declining indicators in the in the new england manufacturing so we see layoffs happening um in manufacturing 50 percent of manufacturers have laid folks off um a couple other data points uh 60 percent are restricting funding um and 90 percent have experienced a decrease in sales so it's it's not just tourism it's manufacturing uh we see just this week consumer confidence nationally is on the decline um so we do have concerns about the coming winter um want to thank you for everything you've done uh for vermont business for vermont industry um in providing uh access to these funds to date and thank you for the opportunity to speak today and happy to answer questions thank you adam charlie thanks and i know we're short on time but adam you have the enviable position of also knowing exactly what's going on with the cdbg grants for the sole proprietor stabilization fund because you guys are administering that so we heard a little bit yesterday about um the fact that the lottery was not terribly oversubscribed that you had i think 300 businesses that you were funding i think something like that um can you speak to how much money you have left or when people know what they got and then you've got another chunk of money coming right absolutely thank you uh yes so the cdbg cv was for the sole proprietor uh program and uh statewide uh we were able to distribute uh 1.4 million um which left about a hundred thousand dollars left to roll forward to the next year um the reason it wasn't fully subscribed is uh there was some challenges with people receiving some other uh program funds through cares uh so the duplication of benefits so they had come in they'd sort of taken a spot in that lottery application and it wasn't discovered too late that there was duplication so fortunately the rules are changing so next round the funds will be available and they will find a path either directly through accd's sole proprietor program or the cdbg cv round two program that will be administering and kicking off in early september okay man and how much money is going to be available in that second round um i'm not entirely sure that's been finalized but i think it's going to be about another 1.85 million okay thank you great thanks Stephanie just two quick quick quick quick questions um adam was the a lottery a success it was that a good way to um administer that program uh well it was a success in that uh the applicants were were fully funded um so real quickly you know i can just read through these uh there was um about 25 who received uh grants of five thousand dollars uh there was about 16 who received seventy five hundred dollars uh and there was about a hundred and ten who received ten thousand dollar grants so those are sole proprietors small businesses uh who all went to bed with a big relief last friday and my next question is this combination of the rdc's and the chamber and i noticed that in rutherland the chamber the rutherland regional chamber of commerce has merged with the rutherland um development corporation so is this a sign of the time is there redundancy between these two organizations and will you see more of them folding together or do you think it's just a one-off in a unique position within rutherland county yeah um we've been having a lot of conversations that affect i'm a former chamber executive so i know that world well um i think like all industries um everyone has got to look at their model um and and consider it uh so i think there will be some more regionalization of those efforts um importantly though chambers reflect a very local community a local effort so if there's ways in which uh the division of roles and responsibilities could be shifted um so that some of those local efforts were more focused on the needs of the local of the smaller businesses within that community and allowing some of the other perhaps marketing or um industry representation efforts to be more regional in nature uh there may be a stronger sustainable model for all of those entities okay thank you you're welcome when yeah thank you um and i'm building on what Stephanie just talked about um the chambers take care of the local small businesses and the rdc's take care of the larger businesses you just mentioned manufacturing uh just in 25 words or less how are your more traditional clients doing in this situation i mean other than manufacturing and other larger groups and in the industrial parks and other places that you're working with yeah i think it's really hit or miss uh you know some businesses are thriving um still seeking additional employees um and then other sectors are are challenged so take a small food manufacturer perhaps they used to sell bulk items to grocery stores no longer can they sell bulk now everything must be bagged so they need to find a new process they need to find new ways to sell that so those entities that are able to do that more quickly have been able to find new avenues um and some just need some more help to do that some technical assistance to get to that point did they get any of this money that we've been talking about uh oh absolutely well i mean it depends on their sector and how they would apply um and then you know coming up there will be some technical assistance programs that the accd is administering um that they'll be able to apply to as well okay thank you you're welcome adam thank you for taking time to spend with us this morning appreciate everything you're doing yeah thank you so uh last is perry i'm strong perry welcome back again um thank you for taking time to talk to us we're a little bit in overtime now but um we can still spend uh spend some time with you this morning okay thank you chair um thanks everybody for inviting me back um my name for the records perry i'm strong and i represent the vermont event rental companies of vermont and i'm president of reinerstein tent here in randolph vermont um so just to kind of give you a little overview of where we're at um most all of the event rental companies which there's about nine of us have experienced a 70 to 90 plus of revenue since march we don't expect that's going to change much um we have been picking up a little bit of work uh early we were looking at doing stuff for restaurants but obviously some of those restaurants weren't able to afford our services and so they didn't have the cash themselves and their grants weren't available at the time so a lot of them kind of rebooted and did different things um here locally i provided four tents to the local restaurants at no charge to help them along um other things that recently happened is we're getting a barrage of requests from school systems right now looking for outdoor classrooms the problem with this is there's not enough inventory in the state to cover all this so i've actually gone out bought some inventory that i think i can cover you know and and we're not going to make a lot of money on it but we are supplying a need a covering a need that seems to be out there so over the next week or two we're going to be uh installing those through the college systems that we've worked with and some of the high schools and and some of the smaller elementary schools so all of us are doing that um we uh we desperately need some assistance here most of us um you know we're thankful for the the grant we got and i believe we're hoping that we're our i n c s code it allows us to access some more here we know we were kind of lumped into retail but i believe we fall under hospitality so i'm hoping that we can pick up some some additional funding here because we know that this was for two months but that money's pretty much exhausted um i personally you know ran out of ppp in june i laid off all my employees um we're been unsuccessful at the present moment to try to find any way to um hibernate our debt um i have been working with community national bank and have been reached out i reached out to kevin moore house at sba and a number of us are trying or attempting to get into the sba 7a loan program before the 27th of september's deadline so that um is a vehicle that we believe will help us um but as you can imagine it's going it requires a lot of extra paperwork um the rdc's have been extremely helpful here uh bob hains agreement economic development you know got us connected with ross hart who runs remont's uh my branch of the sb dc and so he worked with us over a week long period of time to generate cashflow statements helping us to look forward and we were pretty sure we were able to do that but we greatly appreciate his assistance and so with that um three of the other tent companies at the present time are going down that same path but in order for us to survive we really need to figure out how to park this debt you know that was the conversation we had back in the spring when we were talking to you and right now we we're not feeling like we've got some answers here because the problem is i'd actually applied to a different bank and we returned down because they won't take on the risk they just feel even with the federal um even with the sba support you know buying 75 percent of the loan back they're not interested in the other 25 percent so we're struggling right there um i did get a small grant slash loan from green mountain economic development to knock off some some pieces of equipment that we had um payments on so that relieved my monthly payment burden by about 1500 bucks a month but we're still needing 17 18 000 a month to get through um i do know and i'm concerned about the lodging slash restaurant venues and i understand that you know there's a big need here in hospitality but i will share you that i really believe and i listened to this yesterday um your your session yesterday and there's a very fragile ecosystem here of what really goes into this vermont um events industry you know so you know the sole proprietors are part of that the lodging venues are part of that you know you guys talked yesterday i think jim discussed a gentleman farmer who who is supplies food to that to that network and so that ecosystem here is truly responsible for a lot of tax dollars that come back to you folks and i really hope that you know you'll find your way here to boost this program to get us through to the spring um so that's kind of what i've got right now if you guys have any questions i can uh can answer those for you i think in a nutshell that's kind of it so i'm trying not to burn up too much of your time here any questions for parry jim thank you mr chairman um parry um in the governor's uh release of our extension of funds that i'm looking at uh it's the economic recovery grant program did you apply for that yes i did um the challenge here is the cap and i think you've heard that i mean a lot of what you already heard is very similar our situation we applied for it we received the $50,000 we've now reapplied for this round two that jone mentioned yesterday um i think we're gonna you know i i believe we're going to be eligible for some of that um and so if we do pick that up you know that's going to be helpful in addition but it's not going to get us through to next may mm-hmm well i hope that uh you know just speaking out loud that we can expand it um because there's there's a very evident surplus that jone talked about yesterday um and um i hope we as a committee can do whatever whatever we can to uh expand that and i thank you for your testimony and wish you luck oh thank you i do want to mention a couple of the things i just forgot so one of them and i'm not sure if you all are aware of how new hampshire rolled out their aid program but it was very transparent um they actually surveyed their business members and they got an idea of what they needed they allocated four hundred million dollars to that main street relief program of which currently i believe they've expended three hundred and fifty million dollars plus or minus a little and they've serviced i think they've provided grant relief to five thousand three hundred plus businesses i'll show you what happened that some of that money some of that money that they rolled out early went to the you know restaurants who actually purchased tents from our vendors and we actually got the call to go put them up because they really weren't interested in renting but they had the revenue at that point to boost their outdoor dining space and i can tell you right now i've been in contact with those restaurants and some of them are having record setting years because they were able to provide space for their uh clients so that was extremely helpful to those folks and i do know that one business that i'm very much in communication with most of the time over there a similar business to ours uh you know they received the two hundred and forty thousand dollar grant and this guy tells me he's good till next spring he doesn't need anything else he's had six months of deferral payments he's back to pick it paying his payments in his bank and you know he's feeling pretty healthy i don't think any of us on this side of the river can say that zack barry thanks for coming in and appreciate that you are were you know donated tents to businesses so they could set up shop outside i was curious if there was um if there was actually any opportunities for you to recuperate some of those those costs in terms of you know it was a donation that could potentially be considered cobit expend cobit related expenses um i was curious if there are opportunities to recuperate those sort of goodwill efforts um or if that would be something that you think that we should look at because i can't imagine you're the only business that that went out of your way at your own expense to help out others um that is true i think a number of the businesses like mine did what they could do for their communities um to the best of our knowledge right now um there's nothing that we're aware about that would compensate us for that i think that you know if there was some money rolled out to the downtown programs which was discussed early on that would have been beneficial and truthfully you know right now those tents i have sitting out there you know those four tents technically they could be generating revenue for me going forward because i'm short to give to the schools so i'm okay with it you know trust me it's helped out the community here a lot you know a lot of people have been you know under the tents they've used the tents for some events in the community you know just to kind of get people back engaged so thank you very much for your compliments on that thank you barry anything else barry thank you for taking time to come speak with us today and we uh we hope all all sugars off well for you and and for the industry and we're hoping to do everything we can um that's an hour power to help thank you thank you guys for your time and i really appreciate your efforts so i think uh we're we're in a little bit of overtime but not bad um appreciate the committee's indulgence and and uh willing to stay on a little longer and i want to thank everyone that joined us today to that testified we appreciate you taking your time to be with us and and fill us in on what you see going out going on out in out in the field that we may not see we will do like i said do our best to um and do everything in our power to make sure that we um we can help you going forward and let's just hope that we can open up the state a little bit more so that we can bring some more business in that would i think ultimately that's what's going to save everybody so thank you committee