 I was having some, uh, there was like a glitch. You weren't there. Well, you know, I, I had another interview before you that went a little over. So I was about five minutes late. And then once I signed into the zoom, uh, you weren't there, but Hey, here we are. We're all down. Absolutely, man. Uh, it's funny because I've never met you and I, uh, we've been in the same circles for years. So, uh, great to have you on. I'm Dean Delray. And, uh, nice to meet you. I've had, I mean, I've been doing the podcast 11 years and I probably have had all of the greatest drummers on other than like, say Charlie Watts, but I've had pretty much everybody on except you, which is wild. Well, thanks. Better late than never. Right. Yeah. You know, it's funny the last time I saw you since twisted sister is going to play this weekend. Um, I brought you guys on stage, which I think is the last gig. Everybody says it's something else, but it was at the Roxy for the cat house anniversary. Right. That wasn't the last gig. I mean, I mean, that was the last, that was the last West coast gig. But, uh, yeah, I totally remember that. Yeah. I was wild, man. I was standing on stage and I had seen twisted sister many times in the old days, but to be like five feet away from like D Snyder, it was wild to see how, uh, how insane the impact of that guy just up there. It was like, wow, you know, all of them. I mean, they're all larger than life. They were kind of like, you know, I used to go see them back in the club days, uh, back in the early 80s before they blew up on MTV and they were larger than life. It was like seeing kiss, you know, in, in a small club back then, you know, they were all larger than life and huge. You know, D is a huge guy and Mark Mendoza is a big guy. So yeah. And they all wore the biker jackets with the colors and everything like that. So yeah, they always had a very larger than life kind of, uh, aura about them. Yeah. But yeah, that was, uh, that was, it's a shame that like that. We only played, I think four or five songs on that show. Yeah. And we're going to be playing this week in California as well. And it's only three songs. So it's a shame that in my time with them, uh, both times we played California or the Southern LA, uh, Southern California area. It was only like quick appearances, not a proper gig. It's got to be such a different animal. Um, cause I was thinking about over the years, of course, dream theater for, you know, 25 years or, you know, to play rock, cause that's like rock, you know, uh, event seven fold and this winery dogs record is rock. And it's, it's such a different animal. Do you, do you, do you get bored if you're just playing straight rock, you know? No, no, I mean, I made my name, uh, in dream theater for 25 years playing this incredibly complex progressive music, but, um, that's just one side of me. I mean, I think that's why after I left dream theater, I was so determined to do so many different things across the board, everything from like the classic rock sixties and seventies sound of the winery dogs to, you know, thrash metal stuff with metal allegiance and then stuff with twisted sister or revenge. I mean, I was always a huge music fan of everything. When I went off to Berkeley and we formed dream theater, I just met two other guys that were into the more progressive technical stuff like rush with a little bit of a heavier edge. But I also at that point could have had just as easily formed a band that was like the who or Zeppelin or cream, or I could have just as easily forms a thrash metal band in the vein of like Slayer and Anthrax and Exodus. My musical taste always has been very, very, very broad. So, uh, everything I've done outside of dream theater, kind of just extensions of all of these different sides of me. So yeah, I'm just as home playing with twisted sister as I ever was, playing 20 minute songs with dream theater. They're just two different sides of what I love to do. And, you know, not only what I love to do as a drummer, but what I love to listen to you as a music listener. Yeah. Yeah. Same here. I listened to everything always have, you know, from Prince to Carol King, to Slayer, to, you know, the country, you know, outlaw country. So yeah, I get it. Well, that's where you lose me. Yeah. Well, not a country fan, but I don't go deep on country, but I do appreciate some serious killer songwriting, say, in, you know, Willie Nelson, even some newer country now of say, Jamie Johnson and these guys that are, you know, Sturgell and these guys that are like, they're basically kind of rock with these like heavy songs, you know? Yeah. Yeah. No, look, variety is the spice of music, man. That's, I, I love to listen to as much as I can and love to play as much as I can. That's why I play in 48 different bands at the same time. And I was going to ask you this because, you know, if I look at the history of drummers, you almost have to play in 48 bands now to even make any money. But I always thought that because I played music for years, the downfall, if the drummer didn't have anything to do with the songwriting, they were just screwed, you know? Well, I guess I don't, I honestly never looked at, uh, you know, I didn't get in this business to make money and, you know, it to me was always just wanted to play music and be creative. And everything I've been a part of, I've always been an equal songwriter other than these higher gun gigs, like Twisted Sister and Avenged, obviously, but any of the bands I'm a part of and have made records with, I'm a, you know, an equal part of the writing and, you know, in a lot of the bands, uh, I produce the albums as well. So yeah, I guess for me, maybe for some drummers, if you're not part of the writing, I guess that that would be an issue. But for me, it's never really been an issue because I've always been a part of the creative process with everything I do. Yeah, man. I mean, that's, you know, that's the, the way you got to do it, you know, stay in the room and, uh, let the magic happen. You know, I'm not looking, I'm not saying, yeah, you know, you got to make money, but I'm saying years down the road, you see guys that were drummers and they're like, ah, you know, so yeah. Well, I'll tell that to Lars Ulrich, right? Oh, man. Well, he's a wise, or Dave Grohl. Yeah. Those guys are definitely hand, hand in there for sure. Uh, you know, it was wild. I didn't know, but you lived in Carmel for a while. I grew up in the Bay Area. That had to be kind of weird out there in Carmel. Well, I didn't, I didn't live there, but my father did. My parents got separated when I was really, really young and he, uh, re relocated to Carmel and I would spend the summers with him. And, uh, in fact, that's where the band, uh, got the name dream theater because there was a movie theater in Monterey, which is right next door to Carmel. And I used to go see all the midnight movies there. I'd see the Rocky horror picture show and rock and roll high school and the kids are all right. And the song remains the same. And I used to go see all those midnight movies at the dream theater in Monterey. And, uh, when we put the band together, uh, yeah, we were looking for a name. My dad suggested dream theater as a name. And that's where it came from. He was a radio DJ. That's pretty cool. You know, like playing classic rock radio. Yeah. I used to, I used to, uh, DJ with him. I'd do the morning show. I was a little six year old kid. He'd let me pick the records and I'd be playing like Cheech and Chong records and stuff on the air. But, uh, yeah, he would let me pick stuff and spin it. And my first claim to fame was, uh, you know, I was around six or seven years old, placing a phone call and the operator recognized my voice. And it's like, are you Mike Fortnoy? And that was my first, my first taste of fame. I'm a comedian and it's funny you said Cheech and Chong cause we're the same age and that, you know, there's such a big deal to me back in the day going to a party like you put on Ted Nugent and then you would put on Richard Pryor record or, or Cheech and Chong, you know, they were the same, uh, kind of thing. It was rock and roll. I grew up on those, those early Cheech and Chong albums, the first three or four of them. I knew every one of those gets by heart. I mean, people don't realize now, you know, when we were kids in the 60s and 70s, obviously there was no internet, but even, you know, there were no DVDs. There was no, no videotapes. Even you, I mean, we had VCRs, but that was just to record stuff. So honestly, if you wanted to like hear comedy or whatever, you'd have to buy the records and it was Cheech and Chong and Richard Pryor and, you know, all those early comedy records. I remember that early, Steve Martin albums, uh, you know, that's how we got our comedy back then. Yeah. And it was so wild too, right? Because you're young, you're like my age back then. So you're, you're, usually you're sneaking it from the parents record collection and you're putting it on and you're hearing about drugs and, and the word fuck and stuff. You're just like, whoa, you know, it just seems so outlaw. No, that's how, I mean, I learned about sex, drugs and rock and roll from, you know, those Cheech and Chong albums or, or going to see these movies, you know, going to see Woodstock in the movie theater, watching people smoke pot. And, you know, that's, that's how you learned about stuff like that when, when you were our age and you were kids. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Are you a comedy fan now? Do you watch comedy on the bus when you're cruising around? Yeah. Yeah. Of course. I'm a comedian. That's why I was asking, you know, because it's a, I know a lot of musicians always wanted to be comedians and comedians want to be musicians, you know, right? No. I mean, well, like Bill Burr, for instance, I mean, I like, I like the music, the, the comedians that also have a, at least a knowledge of music. And it's, you know, kind of crossed over, you know, like Don Jamison does that as well. And, you know, people that are, there's a, you'd be surprised how many comedians are musicians or at least are music fans. And once in a while, you know, when I'll see that, it's pretty cool. Yeah. Bill's like my best friend. We tour together. So, you know, yeah, once a year we do this ACDC. I do this Bond Scott tribute. You know, yeah, we have all kinds of big guys come down and play, but Bill plays drums on a few. And you know, I can just tell he absolutely loves it because he's up there playing. And there's like Nikki six and we're from Primus and you know, Scott Ian. So he's just like, Oh my God, you know. Yeah, absolutely. And Brian, Brian Poussin is another one and Tim Heidecker. I mean, Tim's not like a metalhead, but he's, you know, got a big deep appreciation for the Beatles and stuff that he and I connected over the Beatles just because we're both Beatle fanatics. So yeah, there's definitely a lot of crossover between comedy and music. I was in a Beatles guy. Every, you know, I'd listen to Beatles and I like the Beatles, but I'd never go like, Oh yeah, the Beatles. And then after that documentary, man, it's just over with now. I'm just obsessed. Yeah. Yeah. That was amazing. Yeah, really was. And what, what a great time to, you know, later in life, you find these bands that you love, like all of a sudden you love, like later I found Bruce, you know, or later like or growing up, I wasn't into Pink Floyd. It was like Stoner Rock. And now Pink Floyd's like my favorite, but any bands that you didn't like growing up that you're into now? I grew up listening to so much shit and I loved everything from, from childhood. I mean, I grew up with the Beatles and the who and Zeppelin and the Stones and Bowie. I mean, that's what I grew up with. I can't say there's much that I've recently discovered from then because I was listening to it all then. I listened to Hendrix and Cream and the Doors and Zappa and Pink Floyd. I don't know. I was listening to stuff literally from day one because as we already talked about, my dad was a disc jockey, so I grew up surrounded by this stuff. So I was kind of hip to it from, from very early on. Yeah. I mean, I was hip to it too, but it'd be like Chicago. I'd be like, no way. I love Chicago. I love them now. I mean, I was listening to stuff that I probably would should be embarrassed to admit, but I was listening to like the early Bee Gees when they were still doing pop rock stuff and, you know, Chicago and the Monkeys and the Osmans, you know, a lot of stuff that I should be embarrassed to admit I listened to. I don't know. I had no shame. I was pretty open minded all along with everything I listened to. I was so into the disco and I would just shout it out, you know, and also like Earth, Wind and Fire and Ohio players and all of that. I was way into that. Yeah, man. I mean, that's the key to like, you know, the key to music is an open mind, man. Yeah. Let's talk a little bit about the new record coming out February 3rd. I know Richie Cotton quite well. Richie has played one of my Bond Scott shows and we both have the same birthday. That's when the record's coming out February 3rd. Yeah. And I've known him for like 35 years. I've had Billy on. But the interesting thing about this Winery Dogs record, it's called three and it comes out on the third, like I just said, you know, if I sat there and thought about it for a little while, this kind of feels like a record that would be in between Edam and Smile and Skyscraper minus the vocals. The music feel of it really has this incredible kind of that that era of Diamond Dave. Well, I mean, inevitably, Billy, you know, puts his stamp on everything he's a part of. And I remember when Billy got the David Lee Roth gig, I was already a fan of his from Tallis. I was going to see Tallis in the clubs on Long Island and Brooklyn and stuff like that. So I was already a fan of his and I was already a fan of Steve Vai as well. So when Steve and Billy hooked up in Dave's band back in 85 or six or whatever it was, I mean, to me, that was like the dream team. And, you know, they did their version of Shy Boy, which was originally a Tallis song. So, yeah, inevitably, you know, what we do in the Winery Dogs is going to have touches of that, especially because Billy and Richie do a lot of unison lines and stuff like that. And that was kind of the trademark of those those David Lee Roth albums. But, you know, I would say, you know, look, we all love Diamond Dave and Van Allen. I mean, I'm a huge Van Allen fan. But I think what the Winery Dogs do is a little more predated in the classic round classic rock sound of like the 60s and 70s. I think more like Zeppelin, Cream, Hendricks, Grand Funk, Vanilla Fudge. I think that's more in the vein of what the Winery Dogs do. And of course, Richie brings that whole soulful, like funky R&B angle as well. So, yeah, it's a big melting pot of all that stuff. Yeah, absolutely. I'm not saying it's it's exacted. I'm just saying it would have been the cool record after Edam and Smile because Skyscraper went a little too far with the keyboards and everything. But it's definitely got a fantastic flavor. I like some of the weirdest stuff on the record like Stars. I think that is a fantastic song. And that and that outro jam is amazing. Yeah, thank you, man. Well, we have a couple songs in the album that the last song in the album, Red Wine and there's another song called Pharaoh, where both of those tracks, the second half of the tune, we're just jamming. I mean, that's what we do a lot live. We just jam its old school, you know, when you see Zeppelin back in the day, they would just go off on these tangents and jam. And that's a lot of fun with what we do with the Winery Dogs live. So there was these two tracks on the new album where we wanted to just do that in the studio and see where it went. So what you're hearing on those jams, that's just like no discussion. That's just it just happened, you know, and and it's left on the album. Now, Pharaoh is amazing and Mad World. Those are some great songs, man. When you get into the middle of the record, it really just kind of goes somewhere else and I was just like, wow, because I love Zeppelin, you know, 77 era where they're really bloated and way out there, you know, no quarter, 30 minutes and stuff. And it's just like, oh my God. That stuff to me is just fantastic. And and that's what I like about the middle of this record. It really is just kind of not your standard rock. It's it's it doesn't have the formula verse bridge chorus verse, you know, it really goes for a ride and Richie is playing his ass off on this. And I got to tell you, man, the groove and the pocket on this plane, it is fantastic. I can feel it so fiercely. I was like, man, this pocket is amazing. Awesome. Well, thank you, man. Well, I mean, I get to I get to wear that hat with the Winery Dogs. You know, I kind of made my name 25 years in dream theater, just doing this crazy progressive technical shit that isn't necessarily everybody's cup of tea. You know, either you love it or you hate it. There's not much middle ground. But what I get to do in the Winery Dogs, it's like people people really get this man. It doesn't matter if you're a fan of mine, if you like Prague or metal or if you like classic rock. It seems like Winery Dogs has a little something for everyone that they could gravitate to. And you know, the pocket is so important. And me and Billy get to just really lay it down in this band. And it's a lot of fun. Yeah, the towns are amazing on the record, too. Was it done online or did you guys go into a studio? Went into the studio. Definitely. Not I wouldn't even call it as a studio. It was Richie's Richie's he's got a little jam room in his house that's the size of like a bedroom and it's really close quarters and tight and just turn up the amps and jam like like old school, like when you're in a junior high school band, like playing in your garage. And that's the way it's got to be. You know, we've never worked in the Winery Dogs, like trading stuff online and emails. And no, we got to be in the room together, bouncing ideas off of each other, just feeling feeling what's going on in the room for sure. That's fantastic. And then how long did it take to record? Well, the song, the writing of the basic music and the arrangements, that was over the course of two sessions about a week each. So, you know, the blueprints and getting my drum tracks done, because I would track my drum as soon as we finished arranging a song, the music, I would track my drums right there. And then while it was fresh in my head. So that process was only a couple of weeks. But then the, you know, there's the process of tracking the guitar and bass and then Richie writing all the vocal melodies and the lyrics. So that process obviously takes many, many months for Richie to, you know, do his work on. But, you know, the overall process was about a year over the course of a year, because we took our time with it because we knew we couldn't tour until 2023. So we had time to let it all simmer and develop. Yeah. Yeah, it sounds fantastic. What, uh, where do you have the East Coast? I'm in Pennsylvania. I mean, I grew up in New York, Long Island for 30 something years, but I've been here in Pennsylvania for about 20 years now. Back then, where were you going to see your shows? Like, were you going to the garden? Did you ever get to see Zeppelin? I missed him. I'm like one year or two young. Yeah, I never saw Zeppelin, but I did see most of the classic bands back then. I saw KISS at the garden in 77. And I saw Paul McCartney and Wings at the Nassau Coliseum in 76. I'd go to, you know, most of the arena shows growing up on Long Island, where at Nassau Coliseum or Madison Square Garden, I'd seen everybody at the garden through the years. And, you know, there was a lot of clubs back then too, growing up on Long Island in the seventies and eighties. You know, the club scene was still big. And I'd go see Twisted Sister and Zebra and, you know, Talis, like I mentioned earlier. So yeah, it was, there was a great scene back then on Long Island in New York. Yeah. I remember the first time I played New York in the nineties, I guess it was a lot of the bands in New York would just play covers. It was kind of wild. I was like, wow, these guys are all cover bands. Even Twisted played a lot of covers, you know. Yeah. I mean, that's what they all used to do. Twisted would play like three or four sets a night. They do like two sets of covers and then get around to their originals later. But yeah, I mean, that's what most bands had to do on the Long Island New York club scene back then. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's how you had to make money. Zebra was doing Zeppelin and then they would do their own set. You know, that band's fantastic. Even now, I saw him a few years ago, right before COVID again at the whiskey and they were just killing it. Yeah. I love that the first Zebra albums are classic. What was your first drum kit? Was it a good one or just a piece of junk? A piece of shit. Sparkle, blue, Royce. I don't even know like, you know, just some low-budget name brand. But I got my first kit when I was 11 and I was around 78 and I was a huge Kiss Fan at the time. And, you know, my grandfather bought me from my 11th birthday bought me a little three piece drum kit. And that's what I started on. And then a few years later, I started saving up money, working jobs, saving up money. And then I bought my first mammoth Neil Peart kind of drum kit. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just the drums are such a bummer because it's a million pieces. Then you got to get a vehicle to move them around. What would your mom drive you to gigs and stuff with or did you have a car? Well, my my first gigs with my first man, we were just a local, you know, we were teenagers were junior high school, whatever. And we'd have friends with older friends with cars that would drive us around. But we would just be playing like the local church and stuff like that. You know, just playing, you know, playing covers. We were doing like all, you know, Ozzy and Sabbath and Van Halen and, you know, early first motley crew album, you know, a lot. That was kind of what we started with back in my first man. I had Jean on the show and, you know, it was just insane to have them on because you're like me at the same age. Kiss was beyond anything. They were just they just you can't superheroes. Yeah, you can't even believe what you're seeing. And I saw him, I didn't see him at 77. They played in San Francisco on 77. The night Elvis Presley died, which is wild. Yeah. But I saw him on 79 on the dynasty tour. Yeah. And it was it was insane, right? They just come out of those boxes, you know, I saw the dynasty tour at the Nassau Coliseum and Judas Priest was opening. Judas Priest was out for Unleashed in the East and Kiss with Dynasty. Yeah, I mean, they were superheroes, man. They were like, you know, like a superhero version of the Beatles. You know, the Beatles were the first man where you had four strong personalities and Kiss took that model and, you know, took it to the next level. You ever meet Peter? Yeah, of course. In fact, I've I played with Peter and Ace the first time Peter and Ace played together in like 11 or 12 years. It was it was about almost 10 years ago. Eddie Trunk was doing a 30th anniversary party or the concert at the Hard Rock in New York. And the Winery Dogs played at this party. We Winery Dogs did a set. And then we did another set afterwards where me and Billy Sheehan were kind of the house man for all these special guests to celebrate Eddie's party. And we had everybody, I mean, Lita Ford and J.J. French and Jeff Tate and who I mean, it was a little list goes on and on and on. All the anthrax guys were there, the overkill guys. But anyway, we had Peter and Ace out for a bunch of songs. And Peter played my kit and then I played on a small kit next to him. And I got to play with Peter and Ace for the first time. They had reconnected and played together in like 12 years. So, yeah, that was a huge honor. Wow. What songs did you guys play? Like shock me and stuff like that. We did the band for that. It was me, Scotty in and Frankie Bello from anthrax, Bumblefoot. And then we had Ace and Peter out. And first we did got to choose before they came out. But then Ace came out and we did Parasite and Peter came out and we did Hooligan and Rock and Roll all night. Maybe one more. I can't remember off hand. But yeah, that was that was as you know, as a kiss fan from childhood. That was amazing. That was one of the career highlights for me. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, that's got to be crazy. Absolutely. He's looking over and there's Peter, Chris. Did you have all the posters in the room? I had them all, you know. Oh, yeah. Yeah, not only all four walls, but the ceiling as well. I knew your dad was a DJ and he was way into music, but was your mom cool also? Like because, you know, I lost my mom a few weeks ago and it's been absolute. Yeah, it's been it's been brutal. This is the first podcast I've done since, you know, with a guest. And but I just think about having a cool mom. You know, the cool mom should be inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, you know. Yeah, the one was the coolest. Yeah, right. The one that brings you to gigs. And when I when I saw a kiss, you know, we talked about kiss in 77 and I still got the button right here. Yeah, she took me, she took me and she was smoking a joint with the guy sitting next to us, you know, oh, man, that was like my first time being in an arena just filled with pot smoke and my mom was was hitting the joint with the guy right next to us. So yeah, she was the coolest. She passed. I lost my mom when I was 17. She passed away in a in a plane crash when I was 17. So yeah, but she was the coolest. She was so supportive. Yeah, man. Sorry, dude. That had to be brutal when you're young, you know, it was. It was life. You got a life lesson that hard pretty early on. It toughened me up, you know. Yeah, damn. Yeah, my mom took me to kiss. She went and she also took me to see this. You're gonna like this, Bill. It was a day on the green and Oakland and the opening band Cheap Trick. Then it was AC DC on the Powerage tour. And then the next band was Journey Infinity Record and then blue oyster cult, Nugent. That was the another show she took me to. And that was the game changer for me from that day on. And I still listen to all those bands right now. Right. Yeah, those were the days, man. You know, those were concerts back then, man, it was just so, so fucking special. Oh, God, yeah. Now you're 55, been playing drums all your life. I always have a drummer, you know, people hit me up and go ask the drummer if they have any pain or, you know, stuff like that and how they take care of it. What's their regimen to get theirself together and fix yourself like arthritis or shoulders or anything? Yeah, I'm the worst, man. I mean, I'm so out of shape. And I mean, I could play a three hour show, no problem because it's just muscle memory for me. It's just those are the muscles that I've been using for 45 years or whatever. So I could play a three hour show, no problem. But if I had to like freaking jog down the block, I would die, you know, I can't do it. So I'm, I don't know, man. You know, my body is starting to feel it at this age. You know, my back is always hurting. What do I do? I don't know. I try to try to take care of myself the best I can, but it's hard on the road when you travel as much as I do and I don't have the answers. A lot of Advil. How about yoga though? I mean, stuff like that, stretching and everything. I'm so bad, dude. I can't even touch my toes. Oh man, that's, you got to get it together, dude. Cause you play at the times. I know, I know, man. I did, I mean, to be honest, I had issues when it, when I was in my thirties, I was having bad tendonitis in my elbow. So I had to start wearing a brace on stage when I was trying to recover from that. And at that point I started going for massages regularly, you know, legit massages. I would have to go and I have a real masseuse that would come to the gigs each day and I'd have to get a massage before going on stage each day. And that helped me a lot actually, getting massaged regularly and maybe going to the chiropractor as much as I can as well. So that helps. Yeah, man. Yeah, it's got to be brutal. I mean, drumming and also singers, like I was a singer and you know, when you're young, you're just hitting all these high notes in the studio because it's easy. And then you get older and you're like, oh, shit. I mean, imagine Brian Johnson has to sing, you know, have a drink on me. That's one of the highest vocals I've ever heard, you know. I know. I know. Well, some guys could pull it off, man. Dio is singing fucking great right to the end. Rob Halford still sounds great. So there's some people that could totally pull it off. Yep. I think the people that it was their natural voice, that's, you know, so they're good to go. I think it was the other people that were maybe like, well, it's a fad right now in the 80s to sing as high as you can. I don't really sing that high. And then it gets pretty rough, definitely. And also, you got to think about like speed metal drummers, you know, like Gombardo, he still kills, man. He's a good friend of mine and he was telling me, it's just all about just the drums are just right here. He's not high swinging Tommy Lee type of stuff. It's just here. And you know, so his body's still together. Yeah, I'm good friends with Dave too. We've played many shows together. And to my play his kit, it blows my mind how compact it is, but also how low he sits. He's like practically sitting on the floor. So yeah, I mean, the way you set up your drums has a lot to do with it too. There's some people that have set up shit with all over the place and they're gonna have way bigger physical problems. I keep my shit pretty tight as well. So hopefully it's, hopefully I'll be able to hang in there still. What do you think Alex and Getty think they're gonna do something? I doubt it, I doubt it as Rush, but you know, they've come out of their shells and they've been doing some appearances. They played with Primus together and they did those Taylor Hawkins shows together. So I think that's cool that they're doing that. I would think that's probably the extent of what they'll do. I don't think they would ever officially do anything with another drummer, but I'm glad just to see that they're still playing together even at that capacity. Yeah, I'm glad Zeppelin never got a guy and went for it because I think it kind of keeps that mystique and that group, they're one of the few bands like Rush that just has this, well, no, we're done or the clash, you know? Yeah, I saw Zeppelin with Jason Bonham at the Atlantic Records. Yeah, I was there for that and that was amazing. And then I also did some shows with Page and Plant when it was just the two of them and they had that guy Michael Lee playing drums. And it was amazing just to see it again. And I wasn't at the London show with Zeppelin. I saw them play with Jason at the Atlantic Records 40th anniversary show. I think it was around 87 or 88. But yeah, it's cool if they just did special things, you know, and if Gettie and Alex do it that way, I think that's important to preserve the legacy of Neil or the way that Zeppelin did with Bonzo. That dude that played in Page and Plant, that guy was unreal. Yeah, he was perfect. He nailed it. I couldn't believe it actually. I saw the Page Plant and I was like in the third row at the shoreline, you know, that place. And I was just losing my mind. Like I just kept looking at him like what is going on with that guy? Who is that guy? Once in a while, it's weird when a guy comes out of nowhere and you're like, who is that guy? Yeah, no, he was killer. He passed away a few years after that. He died. Yeah. God, it's such a bummer. Well, look, man, it was great to talk to you and congrats on the record. Really cool. It's called Winery Dogs 3 and it'll be out February 3rd. Now, what do you got coming? You got some tour dates with the Winery Dogs? Yeah, we start up mid February and a few weeks from now. And we're going all year. I mean, we have dates on the book already all the way through November. So, yeah, it'll be a lot of touring, man. We're starting in the U.S., U.S. run throughout February, March and April. Then we go down to Brazil and South America over to Europe during the summer and just, you know, continuing on all throughout the planet through all year long. What type of venues in the States you guys doing clubs, theaters? What is it? Yeah, like clubs and theaters. Yeah. That's great. And who's opening? Do you guys have a cool open or anything? We're not carrying anybody. We just have various different, different bands in different markets. Yeah. I just did a two month tour opening comedy opening for Marcus King. It was that's killing. It was a hard. I opened for Metallica two nights and that was that was crazy hard. But opening for a band for two months was even harder because you're like, I got to do it again tomorrow. I see, I would find it hard to be a comedian and and and like use the same material. And like, I can't tell a joke for my fucking life, but I used to do drum clinics back in the 90s. And I found myself like after like a hundred of them in a row, like saying the same thing. It's one thing to be playing the same thing. But when you have to put the words together and repeat yourself from night to night to night, I would find myself saying something. I'm like, wait, did I already say this? Or was that yesterday? Like, you know, I would have trouble like actually talking night after night after night like that. Well, you kind of you know what you're going to say, but you it's just like Zeppelin, you know, you're riffing in and out of the jokes. And so it always feels, I mean, hopefully you're doing that. You know, I don't know how you could do it without being a robot, but and you riff in and out and it keeps it fresh for you. And also knowing that these jokes, I'm about to drop a hammer on these guys and they're going to laugh their asses off. That kind of feels so, you know, it's the magic of it, man. You're in the room and bam. But when you're opening for a band, it's just like, if they don't know, they're like, why is that roadie talking about his dick? You know, just tune the guitar. And you're like, what the? So it's really, really hard. A matter of fact, when I got off the tour and went back and did a set at the comedy store the first night, it was like the donut was off the bat and I was just killing because I was like, oh, comedy crowd. You know, right? Yeah. You're you're coming to town. If you want to ever see some comedy, let me know. I know you'll be here for the. I'll be in New York while you're here. I was going to go see that that twisted sister. Short thing. But when are you playing in LA? I'd love to see the winery dogs. We actually the dates we're doing February, March and April. Don't make it out west. We're actually out for almost two months and still only covering like half the country. So I think we're going to have another leg in May for the West Coast. So hopefully that'll be announced soon. So hopefully if you're around in May, come on out. Oh, yeah, it'd be great. Yeah, it'd be great to me. Yeah, I've known Richie all my life and I had Billy on the show. Oh, by the way, if you see Billy, he did the show about eight years ago and he said he has like massive hard drives of bootlegs. And he goes, Oh, get them hooked up for him. Yeah. I've been dying to hook up with him and get these, you know, get these hard drives of just because I had them all on CD. You know, you go to Japan and you go into stores and you buy like a hundred CDs. I had every Zep show. Everyone all different versions, you know, sound boards under the fucking stage. Yeah, look at that. I mean, that's all I got like thousands and thousands. I'm a huge bootlegger collector myself. So yeah. Oh, yeah, I used to go any time I toured Japan, I would go with an empty suitcase to bring all the shit home. And I'd go to airs and back then that it was VHS tapes like before DVD. So I'd go to that video store airs and just literally fill a suitcase with shit. And you sign a couple autographs and they just give you everything for free. So it was that's the only reason I used to want to go to Japan back then. Same with me. I work for the Stones. And the guy's like, Hey, can you can you get me inside? Buy a couple of tickets and get them in. They go, just take whatever you want in the store. I get a double bag sent at home. I love that label fishheads. That guy fishheads, man. He had the best Zep stuff and that totals TTOZ or whatever. Totos. Yeah, that that shit is insane. The packaging alone would just give me goosebumps, man. I know, I know totally. I mean, thank God for YouTube now. I mean, it's put most of those bootlegs places out of business. But now it's all at our fucking fingertips, man. The shit that you sometimes I'll spend hours just going down these rabbit holes on YouTube with different concerts, you know, find a fucking Pink Floyd show from 77 or whatever. Just crazy stuff and go down these rabbit holes and spend hours on YouTube. So well, there's these guys, these guys now, too, that they're taking the stuff like the guy that has the Fresno Van Halen stuff and they're remastering it and running it through all this amazing programs now to where the quality is just stunning. Amazing. Yeah, totally. Yeah, there was a whole bunch of really cool kiss stuff that was released a few months ago. Some guy had like all the Holy Grail stuff, like stuff, like footage from, you know, the night they recorded alive or whatever in Detroit and all this amazing stuff. And then it all got taken down. But I ripped a whole bunch of it before it got taken down in fear that maybe it would. And sure enough, it all got taken down. But I had genome, I had genome right when that stuff was up. And I was like, where the fuck did this shit come from? Somebody obviously, I mean, they had like those rehearsals, you know? Yeah. And where to get all these? And he's like, I don't know. You know, like, and, you know, because I think that, you know, yes, eventually you should just put out all of that. You know, it's so good. Yeah, it was fantastic. That stuff. Well, looking forward to meeting you. Thank you so much. If you ever want to see some comedy, let me know. And thank you, man. And and when you come to town, I'll see if Bill's around and we'll come together. Absolutely. Yeah, man. Good to meet you, man. You too, man. Thank you so much. And got a great record here. And I'm hoping to get some radio play that Mad World Song has got a hook that's just crushing. And it's it's got to get out there. So it was really cool to have you on and the people know. Thank you so much. Thanks, dude. Good to see you. You too, man. See you later, buddy. All right. Take care.