 Welcome once again to the breakfast this morning on Plus TV Africa. We apologize we may not be able to have our guest join us for the conversation on Afghanistan and current situation in that country. Hopefully before we also wrap up the conversation we can play show you a few clips to at least paint a very very clear picture of what it is at the airports in Kabul. Clips of people fleeing the country doing all they possibly can to ensure that they survive what the country is currently dealing with. There's also of course you know clips of the United States Army trying to protect what they can in the at the airports. People scrambling to get into airplanes as many of them as they can fit into one plane as possible. It's really really shocking scenes but I'm going to share something from someone who I saw one of her comments that basically details exactly what my thoughts are on this issue. Her name is Claire Daly and she says if you want to understand why Afghanistan has fallen to the Taliban examine the years of foreign intervention of US supported by Europe. It was the entry of these troops not their departure that has resulted in this day. And that's pretty much what I had said earlier you know that it's not you know the decision of the Joe Biden or Donald Trump administration to exit Afghanistan. That has led to what Afghanistan is currently dealing with and what the world is currently seeing it is mostly the entry of these troops in the first place. And of course you know the things that are still halfway documented some of them undocumented. The atrocities that have occurred in the last 20 years that has resulted the failure and the politics. The you know the financial grain again rather the national interest political interest that have come you know as a you know as a priorities instead of the fight against insurgency and the defeat of the Taliban. It's also you know a little bit more of you know the personal beliefs Islamic beliefs of some in some regard that has led to some of all these things that we're seeing today. It might be difficult to explain the extent to which the country itself has been damaged in the last 20 years. And I also made mention that yes you might blame the US and the Western Europe and all that but you cannot take away blame from Afghanistan itself as a nation and its government. In the last 20 years they've had enough time to develop their own structure to develop their own security agencies to develop whatever was necessary for them to stand strong as a nation and be able to defend themselves at a time like this. But they failed and the president simply you know fled the country because that's what he has left to do to flee and go somewhere else with his family. Whereas the results of terrible leadership and failure of government for the last 20 years whether you want to say it is not their fault only maybe because they were held back by the West and by the United States. It really doesn't matter but they've also obviously failed to strengthen the country itself to strengthen their security agencies in the last 20 years. And that's why they simply crumbled like a pack of cards in you know just about two weeks. It's sad we've related this to what we're dealing with here in Nigeria and you know the fact that we should look at these things with as much urgency as possible to understand how important it is that we start to do what is necessary here in Nigeria to ensure that we don't ever get to that stage. If we're going to put our foot down against insurgency as someone asking yesterday you know how do people put religion over humanity which was a very very big question how do you put religion over humanity. But if we don't put our foot down in Nigeria and ensure that we completely rid the country of terrorists and terrorist ideologies and that includes sacking people that have terrorist ideologies that have had terrorist ideologies when they were young and in the world. And you don't simply say that they were young and they were kids back then when they made these statements and so they've changed now. That doesn't work. That's the type of food that we should put down if we truly want to rid Nigeria of insurgents, of terrorists, of bandits whatever name that you want to call them going forward. And that also includes arresting and prosecuting people who commit crimes against humanity. People who commit murder, people who commit arson in every single part of the country in southern Kaduna, in Borno, in Katsina, in Joss, wherever you want to name in Benway state. Every single one of them should be prosecuted to ensure that Nigeria takes its stand against murder, against insurgency, against communal clashes, against death. And until we do that we're going to keep dancing this same dance until it becomes too late. So what lessons should we learn? They're pretty obvious. Is Nigeria doing what it should do? I don't think so. Is Nigeria putting its foot down? Is Nigeria taking a stance against some of these things? I don't think so. I think we're still playing around with it. And I hope that it doesn't eventually get to swallow us. The fear really is running high. Not just in Afghanistan, but especially what I've seen from people in other parts of the world. Especially people in neighbouring Afghanistan because definitely this conflict is spiel over and affects them in one way or another. People and groups that are especially of concern are women and children. We know that in any situation of one chaos they are the most vulnerable and they should be protected. But unfortunately they're the ones who really bear the brunt of these actions. And when people remember the misrule of the Taliban back then, it really explains how much and why people should fear so much. Because suppression of women's rights, child abuse and things like that. So it really reminds us of the President's running away. It shows that the political class would definitely look out for their own interests. They tell you they're there to serve you. But they're definitely looking out for their own interests. When this was happening, there was no presidential declaration that there's a state of emergency. This is about to happen. Find safety, nothing. No effort by the government. The President fled the country and left the people to scamper for safety. Most of them would be trapped in that country under the misrule of the Taliban. Even though they've promised that they're going to have a peaceful transition of power under their new Afghan presidents. We don't have faith in that based on what we've seen in the past. And licking it up to how we wrap it up and you know, link to our own Nigerian situation. You know, Mr Tunde Kolaouli went on there when we talked about this during off the press saying that it really portends a lot for Nigeria. And it makes us ask questions regarding what lessons can we learn. And when we compare that to the Bokram Insurgency, is Nigeria really nearing the Afghanistan reality? It seems so. Yeah. You know, I understand you mentioned in the women and children part which can never be ignored with times of crisis and war. But I think that every single life is important here. Yes, they are victims of war, but at the same time there's also men who will be victims of all of this. Not everybody is a fighter. Not everybody is born to carry a gun. They will all be victims of all of this. And unfortunately it is the poor. I think it's mostly the poor that will be the biggest victims in this situation. The United States itself, you know, has a lot of soul searching to do here. And I hope that the world can see some of all these things and realize that world politics has always been very, very dirty. And the things that you see in the media, the things that, you know, other foreign media organizations might tell you, you know, with regards to motives of government sometimes can be really, really, really, really false. But it's a sad picture of what is currently going on. Just look at this. It's a really, really sad picture of what is going on in the world today. Not all of you can enter that plane, Oga. It is holding ladder. It's really, really sad. Really, really sad. And no country deserves any of all of this. Failure of leadership, sadly, sadly, never affects the people who truly fail the people. Because they are rich enough to fly to any other part of the world, that's the asylum. They are rich enough to relocate and buy an island someplace. The failure of leadership never, never really affects them. It affects the people. And this is where, you know, we should then bring back a conversation about how important it is when you're making the decision who takes over leadership for four years or for eight years here in Nigeria. Because their failure would last for either eight years or would last for 20 years or would last for eternity. The failure of those four years. So when you are making that decision, because, oh, this person has failed, let's kick him out or let's kick her out. Elections aren't really about who you are taking out. They are more about who you are putting in there. Because it's the future that matters. So when you are angry with a particular government and you say, this one is such a disaster, never let those emotions make you decide anybody but this person and go put yourself, you know, with the devil next. It's a very, very important angle that I think Nigerians in particular need to learn. It's not about who you are removing. It's really about who you are putting there. Because their actions and their failures would either last eight years, four years or a whole lifetime. Afghanistan, very likely this will last a lifetime for some people. Only God really knows just how much intervention it takes to restore civilian rule in that country. Really can't wait to see how this ends. It'll be alright. Anyway, we need to go. Thanks a lot for being a part of our Monday morning here on The Breakfast on PlocTV Africa. If you missed out on any of our conversations, remember to catch up on social media at PlocTV Africa on Facebook and Instagram. And same thing with our YouTube channel, PlocTV Africa and PlocTV Africa Lifestyle. I am Osaugi Ogboa. And I am Annette Felix.