 Good morning everybody. Thank you so much for being here. I'm Neil Romanowski. I'm the Dean of the Libraries and you're joining online. Thanks for being here. I think we're having some video trouble, but hopefully the audio is coming through loud and clear and the slides are being seen as well. So I'm very pleased to welcome you today to our graduate research series. This is collaboratively hosted by the University Libraries, Graduate Student Senate and Faculty Senate. The series is a celebration of the research graduate students and it explores both the actual research topic but also importantly the research process and specifically how students utilize library and other information resources in that process. The presenters for the series are selected by the Graduate Research Series Committee which is a group of libraries as well as Graduate Student Senate. And so this morning I am very pleased to introduce to you Faustina Mensa, a doctoral and master's candidate in counseling and higher education in the Pat College of Education. And Faustina's presentation and appreciative inquiry of campus-based support programs for former foster youth pursuing post-secondary education in Ohio explores or research about support programs available to college students who spent much of their childhood in foster care. Faustina has had over 15 years of very professional experience including work as a high school teacher. She holds a bachelor's in business education from the University of Cape Coast, Ghana, West Africa. She is a graduate alum of the Institute for Educational Planning and Administration at the University of Cape Coast and holds a Master of Philosophy in the Administration of Higher Education. Faustina's academic interests include social justice, student achievement and retention in higher education. Faustina has also been very actively involved in student leadership and advocacy here at Ohio including being founder and chair of the COVID-19 International Student Task Force, Vice President of the Golden Key International Honor Society, past president of the African Students Union, member of the Provost International Opportunities Think Tank, current graduate student-san commissioner of equity and inclusion, and here and dear to our own hearts, here at the library is one of the founding members of the library's student advisory board. It's my pleasure to welcome Faustina. Thank you everybody who is online and it was a great time to be here with me. I am grateful also to the committee for this opportunity to share both my research with our university community as well as my personal. I wouldn't spend time because of the introduction already that we do here. So this is my agenda for today. I've asked Jen to keep me on time. I hope to use the first part to talk about my dissertation project, and then I would move into my other library story which I am excited about and hopefully I will stay in time and have questions or feedback from you. So just to give you a bit of a background to my research project, the issue about caring for children in the foster care system is a global issue and the challenges that go with it. There's been so much research all around but in terms of what has to be done, United States has been mentioned as one of those nations that is progressive in terms of the research. And the recommendations as to support systems for children or youth who find themselves in the care system. And so when you look at global literature on student support, there is an encouragement for more research so that there can be information and sharing. And that's why I am proud to be part of the process. When we come to the United States, according to the latest report and I need to read this because it's a marker from the adoption and foster analysis and reporting system, there are over 440,000 foster youth nationwide and we have about 300,000 of them exiting the foster care system. So just think about those numbers. The literature also highlights how Americans in general are still not informed about the policies and the harsh realities that affect our youth in foster care system. Also research has endorsed that there's so much struggle that our youth go through when they need the system at the time that is usually increased as emacication or they exit. And so they do go through so much struggle that may get to impact the ally. Narrowing it down to higher education. And higher education to one of the most cited parameters on the experiences of foster youth is online in 2005. And through his research, he was able to establish that our federal CHEO and JR programs are not able to support our students with foster care background because of the lack of knowledge I told you about and also because of their peculiar challenges. And due to that, almost all the research was advocating for targeted services for post-secondary students who had foster care backgrounds because they realized that campus support programming that were even targeted to students from low income, first generation college students were not adequately ensuring that our students were achieving that academic success we desired. As a matter of fact, according to the literature, retention is less than 3% of students with foster care background. They spend more time in college, over 60 less and a majority of them come into college on campaign. And so with that being said, the good thing is that colleges in the United States have responded to that call and they started introducing these college support programs. So we do have a good amount of them, but still it's a new phenomenon and there's still very little that is known about these support systems and the literature shows that there's so much more required call for research for us to understand what kinds of support systems are in place and how they reflect, so how they are designed and how they are implemented. One thing that I found striking during my literature review when I started focusing on this topic too was that majority of the studies are quantitative in nature and in my sense. And then they also focused on CSPs. When you hear me say CSP, that is campus support programs. They focus on the campus support programs that I've been well in Michigan, Washington, California has the largest and no mention would you find a high. So that's why I'm coming in. And also one thing I found striking was that a lot of the literature live on student experiences. So I'm a high education professional, so I started thinking where are my people in these conversations while they are not giving voice to administrators who are taking care of our students and then two, the literature is just predominant on the challenges students are having. While in college there are few that also highlight those who participated in the few CSPs and the successful ones. And so that actually dovetails into the significance of my study that I already have mentioned why. But for me there's so many reasons why it's important to focus on our students who have foster care backgrounds. The first being that they are often marginalized and promoting on college campuses. And in any research has labeled them as invisible. So with that being said I want to make sure that we are projecting the experiences and making sure that we do not leave them behind. The second one is I already mentioned this. Literature confirms that about 80% of them desire to come to college. 45% of them pursue college but less than 10% of them are returning and graduate. So when you look at that statistic please keep that in your mind. And also as I already mentioned a lot of the research has been skewed towards student experiences. Administrators or high and college student personnel who are providing these support services have not been given the opportunity to also share their experiences. And lastly also because it's a new phenomenon and as somebody who cares about human systems and organization systems it is important for us to learn more about the design and implementation of the CSPs. And lastly most of these designs have focused on challenges it's been deficit based and as a strengths based scholar I wanted to also look at what is working well. And so that ties into my purpose of the study where I am using this qualitative, appreciated approach just to understand what is working well in terms of the kind of support we are providing students with customer care background. And so drawing from the appreciative inquiry frame where my central research question is what are the life-giving elements of campus support programs that serve students with customer care experience in post-secondary institutions. So I'm using the appreciative inquiry approach and for those of you who may not be familiar with appreciative inquiry it could either be utilized as a research design or as a theoretical future. So for Paparanda and his peers who came up with the theory in simple ways that I can explain that they say when you think of human systems, organization systems when you focus on strengths based conversations we become energized, right? But when the opposite which we usually do is when we are looking out for what are the faults what are you not doing well but with appreciative inquiry as a philosophy it's focusing on what is working well. We do not ignore what the problems are but the focus is on what is working well. The other thing that I like about appreciative inquiry or strengths based approaches is that they give us the opportunity to reframe how we look at system problems, organization systems and with that it takes our minds off the negative. So when you want to use appreciative inquiry the model is made up of four Ds and most of the time if you're using it as a research design then it serves best if it's an action research because the third and the fourth Ds which are blocked out they move into where you have to partner with your participants to deliver, to actually design and implement what they read about in the first two phases and because I am not doing that it serves better that I use it as a theoretical framework where I will just get to learn from my participants what aspects they see are valuable because they imagine all of this as an ideal CSP for students in those second institutions and so for value using it is why I am just using the best in place. I just put this up, I'm not going to go into it just for you to see how I drew my sub-questions from the framework so that I would be able to make sure I'm staying within my frame to answer my central research question and so I will leave it up there for you to look at it but the most important thing is I will be asking them what do they find as most valuable aspects of their CSP and then you will move into what they envision as an ideal CSP for our first in-person use. And in terms of methodology, those students are qualitative, exploratory case study. I've already mentioned that my participants will be administrators who are providing the support services in post-secondary institutions in Ohio and in terms of my main criteria for inclusion is that from the Ohio Department of Ohio Education since 2019 they partnered with Ohio Reach and so now that's the state's program in terms of supporting post-secondary institutions and on the Ohio Reach network page they have 40 institutions that are currently part of that network and so I'm hoping to engage in these conversations with administrators from those institutions. For those of you who do not know, I just got my approval from our institutional review board and that is why I am excited that I get to present because most of the time I feel that those of us who are still in the process will get forgotten in this process and so in terms of data collection and analysis what I can best share with you now is what my plan is and for qualitative case studies it relies heavily on triangulation. I've had to do a lot of shifting in terms of access which I'll be talking about later but initially my plan is to use documents and conduct appreciative one-on-one interviews and observations. It's looking tricky with observations for now and so I believe that I'm very flexible on that but in terms of my analysis with the documents I will be using guidance from Pali. She recommends map analysis and map analysis approach which what it does is I will be trying to make meaning from the information I'm getting from the documents and not just the content analysis of the text. With my appreciative interviews I will be using Saldana as my guide and then with observations as I said I'm not even sure due to FERPA and FERPA is family education, right? Educational Rights and Privacy Act and students with foster care backgrounds are protected by FERPA so you cannot do anything without making sure that you are not violating that act so I'm very flexible on my observations for now. My hope at the end of the day is to present a single case report using the theory building approach where I will be pulling out themes to provide the description of the kind of support we are providing to us posting every student with foster care background. So I'm excited about that. That's about it with my research and I think it's important I highlight this before I move into the next aspect of my presentation. Then I'm open to the world. So I want to start off by letting you also know why I chose to focus on our use with this background is because when I got admission to Ohio University before I came to Atlanta I decided I was going to devote my dissertation as a goodwill guest about the United States and so I took that whole process a bit too seriously I think and I was really looking for something that would mean so much in terms of devoting my dissertation company to give back. Also as a scholar in training in high education and student affairs as I mentioned the more I got to learn about students and the support systems and I realized the literature, the background of the researchers from the literature I was reviewing were largely social work professionals. So I questioned where are my high education people and especially high education and student affairs because we have the cast students or students with their college so I was worried that we were missing out the table and we were not partaking in these conversations and also I had to do some gatekeeper process in relation to my study and in doing that I realized that I realized that there is a small number of high education professionals who are trying to put the work out there and so I'm proud that I am going to also be part of that small group but most importantly I'm proud that I won't be contributing to the advocacy efforts when it comes to the kind of support systems we have in place for students with what they can experience. So this is my position going into my later growth and I want to start the second part of my presentation with this group and I went for a savory writing and proposed out for a research study that will use qualitative methods it is valuable to win three interrelated concepts do ability should do ability and wants to do ability and this is a quote from Marshall and Ruslan and I start off with this because I have had big challenges in putting together my research proposal mainly because of access as I mentioned earlier and so the feasibility of my research truly heavily impacted the sustained and sustaining interest piece and I think it's important to share this because you understand everything I share really well so I intentionally put this up so you have a fair idea of my process and what my research process has been through and depending on which side you are looking at it when you look on the left side and you see all the challenges I have been through I may not go through every one of them though but my presentation phase as I mentioned I took that commitment a bit too serious so I kept changing topics because I didn't feel like this is not good enough so that was a challenge and then on the right side for me now it's my left side though you see the library services that I utilize and if you take a close look at them as a matter of fact if I'm to draw a Venn diagram sub-desk librarians are doing nothing and I'm going to talk a lot about sub-desk librarians today I gave Dr. Gruden hands up and I went in but yes I will start with cultural understanding and linguistic and technical challenges because the others are actually forward or they are intertwined so for those of you who do not know I come from Ghana and English is our first language so when you see linguistics there please just have that context in mind as well but I use cultural understanding in the sense that I have not had any personal experience with foster care system everything I knew about foster care was what I had read from the literature and so when I started and at the point where I decided this was going to be my focus I actually did not realize how not having that cultural perspective will impact my ability to craft my research story so that was a big challenge and I was going round and round and round in circles and furthermore with that challenge I was having challenges being able to know what keywords to search for so I couldn't find literature to even further move myself forward so as a result of that I had to spend about one year with the gatekeeper courses and for those of you who are not familiar in simple terms gatekeeper was finding people who might end up being my participants talking to them and asking whether they were willing to participate with my study and so I did that and it was helpful but then the other pieces was the scholarly piece where I had challenges in figuring it out and that's where our library services honestly in terms of meeting the subject librarians and using all the other services came into me and let me also say this I got to this phase very prepared my college my departments I had patient experience and patient research and evaluation they didn't prepare me well I have taken over 60 hours of methodology classes and that's a full creation so I just want you to have that perspective in mind as well and so that moves into my favorite slide which is about my album story and I say when it comes to the resources yes I have used them and I continue to use them so if they're graduate students listening to me and you're not utilizing it you're missing out on something but I have outlined them just to highlight some of the experiences I've had and I've attended workshops even way before I needed and one of my favorite workshops was the one on data management if you have not watched it I think I saw the recording on the website please go watch it super helpful made me think about things a bit more critically things I wasn't considering in terms of data management we have a live chat feature as well which I utilized and helped me solve my problems instantaneously so think about that as I said the scholarly materials everything about student support services and course study is new and so the literature predominantly is is also relatively I recently needed a book that was published in 2021 couldn't find it but thankfully Dr. Wooder was able to help me order that book and I'm grateful for that study spaces it may seem my name but yes please you can scan, you can print you know something that I don't think you need in the library that you should think about but for me as grad students we're doing this whole time so you have no limitations with your time you spend doing school you're here 2am to 3am and sometimes you find yourself in a building by yourself it's scary when I'm out in those wee hours because there's going to be somebody to help you and there's going to be other students as well so it is also an icon of safety for me now moving into the writing pieces Zotero so I was one of those students who came in and I said well in my master's degree I'm one who did my citation so those of you who are not familiar with Zotero it's the citation reference electronic system so I was one of those students and I said yeah I did my first two years doing all my citations manually and then a fellow doctoral students recommended that I try one of these electronic systems I tried manually it didn't work for me it works for some people and then I said okay I will try Zotero I didn't even know we had tutorial videos of the library website so it was during a consultation that Dr. Gugashia that link with me so I was able to use that link to teach myself how to do Zotero and it has been my life saver since then I worry about the contents and I allow Zotero to worry about the reference I would also want to say that if you don't watch the videos please do them butka this is another life saving event that I participated in which I know was a collaboration between the library and graduate college and so shout out to Dr. Kelly, Dr. Becky and Dr. Cynthia you know for putting it together and organizing it I'll be honest with you all Azar Nation 2021 was my heart I was here for so many years but the biggest of it was I was exhausted from the gatekeeper process for those of you who also didn't know my cohort is the 2018 cohort in the HESA program Oman who presented on Tuesday is my academic buddy he's far ahead of me and we even graduated one of our peers so shout out to Gascop and if you ask any of my professors I am proud to say I am not a SLA 9 class I work hard and so the issue with access that Marsha and Rosemar talk about seeing how it impacted my sustained interest I was almost at a point of thinking will I ever finish I was at a point of thinking do I have to change and I was almost going to change my company and so I just didn't have any energy and thankfully I signed up for the 2021 good company and I came out energized I connected with students who were at different levels but we could share resources and so I bring this up just to show that the visitation writing phase is just so isolating is so tasking and there are different forms of motivation that culminate into the research and creative activity you see but once again those of us going through it comes across as if you are wallowing or you are not doing the work and the actual fact is just everything those three considerations that Marsha and Rosemar talk about that could be put in use but it has nothing to do with your competence to your research and yes, the graduate thesis series since I learned about it in 2019 I have been following it I participate, I blend and I wanted to be honest so this is a dream come true and I may talk a little bit more about subject librarians and I told Dr. Gouda those of you who don't know Dr. Gouda he is our subject librarian for education I want to make sure I don't forget anything but the biggest thing is that throughout the process when I was struggling and I didn't know what to do and I was going around in circles always working on appointments and go for consultation I don't know if the library gathers data on student interactions because if they do, I should follow them the top five good consultations would not do and I say this to the point where our faculty recommend that we talk about our research right, I'll be honest no grad students need to follow a grad student and you want to talk about this and you want to do that we don't want to talk about our research but I appreciate the space that our library leadership and our institution have created that you can go to an expert you know of some sort and have these conversations and I bring this up for one key reason when preparing for this presentation I was trying hard to remember what it was but I remember there was a time and that was a defining moment and crystallizing what I wanted to do I was having a consultation with Dr. Buda and I realized the follow up questions he was asking me wasn't really aligning with what I thought I was saying so I asked him why he was asking me those follow up questions and he had to do with the key phrase and he said because in high education and I don't remember what that phrase is that phrase could have multiple meanings and honestly that was a key defining moment because I think I was going around and around and I kept saying that and I was getting everybody confused and then I realized probably through my gatekeeper process I was getting a similar reaction and so I mentioned this just to also emphasize the same way when we go to the hospital for me for research I say our subjects librarians are my 9-1-1 and I'm bringing this up also for grad students who are not utilizing these services I have met with other subjects librarians as well I've met with HANA when I needed guidance on systematic reviews I've met with Antara about when I needed help when I was writing a paper and they wouldn't turn me away so for grad students who are going into disciplinary research you know feel comfortable to schedule without subjects librarians they tell us during orientation but honestly we forget about it and I want to use this opportunity to give a big shout out to my college Patent College of Education because all my faculty are taking over 15 methodology classes in the past 3-4 years all my faculty bring in our subjects librarians so they are the ones who make us care about bring this up also so that faculty in other colleges if you are not encouraging of bringing in the subjects librarians so it's on the mind of students please think about it and add that to your course content and then lastly at the end of the note of well-being I think that we take that for granted a lot of the time or some of us may not think we know that during finals with the library as the well-being stuff going on I come in for batting making or I come to pick up a care pack to do some coloring and I know sometimes they bring down emotional support friends so look out for these things school is hard friends school is hard so if there are little things that you can do just ease your mind you have no idea we have all these resources and I realize that we don't utilize it especially my international student friends I do a lot of peer support I realize we don't have subjects librarians at the back of our mind I realize they don't even know how to when to schedule them to encourage students they do a good job asking us questions and helping us read things through our research focus I brought this up so I won't forget to talk about this those of you who do not know our library we have seven floors and I went up to the seven floor and I realized actually that's the floor we have our thesis and dissertations and I didn't know they have these fun chairs I don't know what they are called but instead of me to focus on what I want to do I just want to sit and roam around for a while and so if you do not know and you just need something to sit and roam around just decide to go up to the seven floor but also I bring this up so that my peers who have children that's the same floor where we have children's collections you can take them up there but you can take them up there go do some reading but also have some fun seating areas I also added this just so you know there's so many ways you being a student can interact with the library I always say that as a student at Ohio University I am blessed to have the library on my laptop right and in so many modalities I have this message for help so please think about it when you go to the help page you have all of this if you need an ambassador I am willing to do that but yeah with that being said I cannot honestly close out I cannot close out without extending a half of gratitude to everybody who has been part of my journey it's been four years I was so much energy but definitely by my second my second year back I was exhausted and I was almost hitting your point of leaving I didn't have what it took to move forward but it's taking academic and administrative advices and mentors who keep reminding me what and who I have laid up it's taking family care, the investing community at large, Athens community at large that I am still here you know and also most importantly for today the focus is on outing services and the support I have gotten by all support services that we have I don't think I will still be starting I don't think I will be here today if I didn't have the support that happens up here just to also re-emphasize that for those of you who are not familiar with research on graduate retention especially doctoral students the attrition happens largely during the dissertation writing and the literature shows that it is not an issue of ability but most of the time it's the social isolation and motivation does come from different forms and I once again want to say a big thank you to the committee for giving me the opportunity to represent students who do not have the flamboyant data to share it but also to show that this is the process that every graduate student puts together a research process you know it's not easy we don't get to talk about it all the time hardly do you get to celebrate us during this phase but it is the most critical phase to us being able to go collect that data and come share with you so I also share this so that faculty who are supporting grad students have this at the back of their mind you don't hear from a student you don't think they are just following and deciding not to care about those three considerations Masha I was going to talk about to my peers I did mention subjects like being exiled but I also want to say when you go into these consultations they are not going to solve your problems with so please go in present it took my observation of the photo of questions that Tabruda was asking for me to realize there was a mismatch so if you go into these consultations and they are going to solve your problems for you that's not going to happen and so yes once again to everybody who is entitled to my world I just want you to know I'm still standing I'm not giving up on myself neither am I giving up on you and so whatever you do for me it does make things worse we already have a question from our online audience Fassi bear with me while I scroll up and read it to you this is from Mary Magdalene she says I might have missed you saying this but would you I would like to know what provisions you have made for obstacles in the process of your research for example when I filed for IRB I mentioned that my participants won't be given any compensation so as to maintain the integrity of the responses they give however when I got to the field I realized that my participants could not afford to miss out certain number of hours of work just to sit with me without being given anything to supplement the work they were missing I had to quickly re-strategize and figure out a way to compensate without it coming directly from me so that it doesn't look like I'm trying to take advantage of them excuse me this is just one example of how plans can change and how IRB does not provide for certain circumstances and getting approvals for any changes might take long yet you're in the field do you foresee any such challenges in the field and how might you plan to solve them and I actually did I just came out of one of those challenges so my initial my initial plan was to focus only on institutions that had established you know campus support programs and using the list on the Ohio Beach Network only for institutions in Ohio who have targeted services the others are different so right state to invest in clean land states Columbus Community so when I set up my design my initial plan was to talk to administrators in those four institutions when I put in my application for IRB that's when I stated I had no idea that I would need letters of support from these four institutions I submitted my application I think in April and the whole of summer went by and these schools wouldn't get back to me and at a point I didn't know what to do but I think it could be because they cannot just out of their own accord say yes I spoke to them during the gatekeeper process they had given me their word and now I needed the letters of support and it took how many months six months my IRB was just sitting there so then once again one positive outcome that came out of the good camp was I've been having accountability dissertation hours with a friend and any time you go for these meetings you have to come with a go for your dissertation and so this semester it was through that process I was forced to think hard how to move beyond that then I eventually had my harm moment so I said well I try to focus on these schools and not get letters of support but why don't I just open have the call to all administrators who form part of the Ohio Internet and pray Jesus that's how come eventually I got my IRB so thank you for that question yes I have waited on this and I was supposed to use call to collect data and here we are so now that alone leaving time so you're still right just having conversation thankfully just having conversations during the good camp and follow up conversations you know I was able to talk to Shawna Shawna and me as permission she's using a similar framework and that was one benefit too I didn't know anything about Shawna's research but finding people who are using similar framework and she's advanced I could talk to her learn from her and learn from my gaps that I could fill so when I spoke with her and I realized she used a different approach I decided to add a compensation for the elements to mine and I hope that thank you so much Mary for sharing we do have a few more if no one has a question we have a comment from Umar please let Foster know about the following comments it's a good job Pastina it's been rewarding having you as a colleague as a faculty partner and academic girlfriend in this journey thank you Umar and then we have a question from Shawna she says greetings from the sunny Bahamas which it's currently snowing here how do you keep on top of finding the most recent publications and articles related to your research area I'll do the library that's a simple answer but no I think the biggest thing is thanks Shawna the biggest thing and at some point I would at some point I hit a writer's block and what I realized was I wasn't constantly going back to my literature you know and so you have to continually checking in for what's going on in terms of the research as I also mentioned identifying a conference that aligns with your topic helps so through my gatekeeper process I was able to find out that there's a small group of higher education professionals and researchers who started annual meetings on any populations so I signed up for the newsletter and they would constantly be sharing resources I also participated in the conference and that also helped me in terms of staying abreast of my topic one thing that happened to me that I wasn't thrilled about though was one time I think it was early of 2021 or 20-20 late of 2020 I was looking for one reference one reference just to fix a citation and wrote a whole new list of articles that were published in 2021 came up so I ended up spending almost 6 months not more updating my literature because I wish I didn't see them then so I didn't see it but no I did so and that further pushed me back which ties back to what Mary had said so just finding ways of staying connected with professionals who are setting research and setting outlets on Google's call as well I just want to say thank you so much for this fantastic presentation and I deeply appreciate your comments from the library and that you enjoy those chairs I've never been a personal favorite but I just had a question about the phrase that you use in your research question which is like giving aspects it's really struck by that can you say a little bit more about what those words mean Definitely as I mentioned earlier with the appreciative inquiry approach the emphasis is to find out what aspects of people's experiences give them life or what do they provide so in terms of the use of that phrase in relation to my research what I will be asking administrators is in providing support for students with foster care what are the aspects that keep you energized what are the aspects that are working what are the aspects that make you wake up every day and go back to that because to be honest if you get to understand the literature of students with foster care you go through so much challenge even with their transition into higher education and for any administrator or staff who is providing that support the gas requires so much more beyond your patience to stay in that field and so with the prokonence of the theory they give you the opportunity to do some reflection exercise to think about your life in relation to this work that I am doing or in relation to the sense again thank you for your presentation and as you were talking I just thought of this when you were doing your research about the use and foster system video find when it comes to demographics what that looks like in the foster care system so should you come into higher education I do have that in terms of demographics and I should have written that down the main thing to that the current based on if my memory serves me right the current literature shows that majority of them are actually white and not necessarily what we think that in the world of color even though the challenges across all demographics but in my literature we do definitely in the last report we do break it down in terms of the percentages from the latest one majority of them are white and also I think if I remember the main reason for I think neglect child neglect was number one in terms of why they end up in the child welfare system well I'm curious to know if you haven't probed this yet since you haven't done your interviews but what have you learned from your literature about the relationship between support systems in high schools and college support systems for foster care children that's a good question so one thing to acknowledge is that they move schools out because you know family they are in and out of schools and in and out of families and so the CHEO programs and the DIA programs are supposed to provide that gap of support but once again because they are coming from a trauma informed background and the lack of awareness these programs are not adequately supporting them for for foster youth to another big thing that I have struggled with is the third part so if they do not self identify it is a violation that's why again this year I didn't delve much into high school literature but what I know in connection to higher education and in connection to high post secondary education institutions is that they come unprepared they are in and out of school they are changing families so academically and they are also dealing with all these psychological challenges which side we translate into behavioral issues as well so there's a lot of disruptive experiences that they have to go through and corrective action because of their trauma informed background so when you take all of this into consideration that's why it's so complicated and they need those targeted services and lastly what makes it even more difficult is that the age of emancipation the age that they are leaving the post secondary education when they come into post secondary institutions so states have advocated initially the age was 18 that you have to leave and if you don't have a family to go to your own so that abrupt transition from childhood to higher education impacts them so badly and then now some states quite a number of states have advocated for the age to reach 21 some states are doing well and some states it's even through 3 but still when they come here just think about some of the social programs moms who give, dads, sims all of that and they are on their own and so and most of the time one interesting thing I also found in the literature which I wasn't expecting was even some of them did not want to join these campus support programs because of the stigma and they felt that being part of those programs fed that you know, deepened the stigma because then it's so obvious that you know, trustee has this background that they wouldn't be involved and the reason why they are seriously marginalized so that's a good question I'm giving Bill much into it but as an in-floor you know, they are coming with the back end it just shows there isn't much to it because if they are coming into higher education you know, less prepared academic heavy challenge then it is obvious that the high school and K through job system is also a big handicap for building just as high education is grappling with the gas pipeline no more online you mentioned data management help you've talked more about that yes, I would love to I'll be mindful of time as well, but as I mentioned I had not thought intentionally about data management because when you are praying for your research your whole focus is in putting together your design and the proposal and everything but when I sat in that workshop it helped me reassess what structures I'm putting in place to make sure that I am not compromising on the privacy of my participants you know, and also thinking thoroughly in terms of the process of how I'm going to manage the data that I will collect on my participants and some of the technical things and the resources that I could also use in managing the data that I will actually collect for my political visitation so I may have to go back to it once again which I'm grateful that the recording is up or I have my notes because I took what was relevant for me based on my process and the only thing I can say for sure was how that workshop in addition to the resources I have and putting together the ethical considerations I could put all of that and think about it from a holistic perspective and make sure that whatever I submitted to IRB I covered all those all those points I can confidently and humbly say they didn't have any feedback on my content and it is because I was intention of putting together everything that I submitted and because I benefited from moving to the sources the only thing that I needed to send back that kept me waiting whether it was for whether it was standing question and to be close enough I also want to say thank you to our university leadership of the library whoever thinks about the resources for students I'm so grateful that they are continuous in thinking on how best they can best support our research and completing activity but I also say this so that our university leadership will realize that these resources are valuable I also share this so that faculty across campus will share these resources with students and lastly also to our donors if we have them and they are ever watching for them to know that whatever they are investing is going to good news and we are grateful that we find ourselves in a space where we have professionals who are constantly thinking how do we make this process for our students for those who are here for those who may time online