 So when I originally decided to study art, specifically jewelry and metals, that came from a real interest in industrial design and thinking about the way that people interact with objects and physical space. And that skill set was really useful for me as I went on to design applications for mixed reality because there you have this virtual world that you're interacting with through physical space or sometimes through a tablet. And so that thinking about the way that people interact and touch metal objects and jewelry was really useful in thinking about how somebody might interact with a tablet or touch a controller. And also kind of the way that you think through jewelry and designing it and the step-by-step process of creating something physically that you envision in your mind is really useful in planning through what you need to do today in order to get to what you want to finally get to in the next week or month or year.