 This was very widely, there was wide consultation with all the tripatites, everyone was on board, the labor movement was supportive, the employers were supportive. Now let's look at what happens to the employees, employers have not been remitting, do they also benefit, do they qualify or do they lose out on the months that the employer did not pay for the pension? Well there are two ways of looking at that, we are taking a very reasonable approach in that all that we are looking for are 60 monthly contributions, they don't need to be consecutive, they just need to be 60, so you may have gaps as long as we have 60 will pay you the 20 percent. Now for those where the employer has never remitted, there is a scheme where we are now following up to see whether it was really an issue of non-remittance or it was an issue of misapplication. There are some like, I have a case today that two John Miller, they are talking to me, one John Miller in Chirila Bombay, the other one in Mufulira and because of this 20 percent partial straw, they have discovered that there is a problem on the account because both of them worked for the same company. The company would interchangeably use the social secret numbers, so in one time, in one bit the contributions will go to John Miller Chirila Bombay, in the other will go to John Miller Mufulira, but we are dealing with that, we are helping all those to get down to the bottom of that as long as there was a remittance we will be able to pay you. I want you to be very clear on this one, if my employer never paid anything at all to Napsa, but then maybe paid once and registered me, do I lose out and the deductions were made for my pay? You don't lose out, I mean this is not something that ends in a year, this is a new benefit that is introduced for life. So all that will do, the other works that will be doing in the background, make sure we get in touch with those employers, hence the reason we are asking for employment history as part of the onboarding process, so that we can now go back and deal with employers and say look, your employee worked for this period, you gave them an employment record, a certificate and you didn't remit in this but you need to pay. As soon as they make the payments, they make the 60 months, you are entitled, you do not need to claim that today, this benefit does not expire, it will not expire, it's part of the benefits that are covered under the pension scheme for life, so there's really no need to feel that you are going to be left out, whenever your account is ready you get access. Maybe I was going to ask you that, do you think residents understand fully the idea of partial withdrawal and the benefits? I think they do, if you look at the interest, if you look at the interest that the Zambians expressed the moment the president and the UPND government announced that they were going to introduce that, I think there was a lot of interest from a wide spectrum of Zambians and for us that is clearly an indication, one interest, second there was a lot of debate, those who were for the idea and those who were against the idea, that debate prepared a lot of people to understand the pros or what could happen if you may supply the funds. That's why as NAPSA we never shut down the discussion of those who were against, because we knew that they were actually providing financial education in one way or another, even though they were criticizing the move, but they were letting those, they would be beneficiaries that this risk that you need to address and the risk will be basically misapplication, but that's a risk that you cannot say someone is going to be supplied because it's a 20% partial. That's a person's outlook towards finances, you can misapply your pension. Now our understanding of our position is that you cannot design policies on the basis of the 2% that are not going to evaluate what the policy objective was. What about the 98, so the focus should be on the 98, that's our position. I'm going to get to that later, but then maybe I need to ask, there's a lot of information flying around social media, internet and everywhere, are these withdrawals being taxed as income? Not at all, the tax was done at the time the payee was remitted, so these are tax free funds coming through back to the owners. There's no tax on the 20% withdrawals, pensions are not taxed. So you get your free money. Now as of Thursday you had announced that 27 people had been paid and the amount was coming to slightly above 1.3 million kwacha. Others are saying 27 of a period of two days is too small a number and then is this how you're going to process 27 people every two days? No. Then it's probably going to take forever and where are you ready for this? I think we were, I mean if you are put in a position or if you are sitting as NAPSA and you know that is a reform that is coming through and you are part and parcel of that reform, I don't see how you can never get prepared. Most of the work that was done on that reform was from the administration side where we were working with government, our ministry of labor trying to make sure that we actually have a solid proposal or option of how to implement that on the table. Behind that there were dedicated members of staff that spent, I don't know how many hours just trying to crack and design a system that can help our members get access to their funds. So from the prepared position we were prepared and that's why from the first day that the president signed, the very next day we were processing. The number, the concern is the numbers. That number was at 27. That number was at Thursday. We are standing at 12 million, 12.4 million, 300 and 3. Many of people. 303 people, 12.4 million paid out. Paid out, yes. Now remember this number changes, it has no weekend because it's online. So even as I'm sitting here there could be someone somewhere who is getting paid. So once you push in the claim it's actually just through the financial system. It's like you making a transfer. When you make a transfer reversal you don't need to wait till the bank is open, the transfer happens. So that is continuous. The part where most of the people were coming back and saying it's taking time, yes. We were going through some of the processes that some people came up with very different problems and we're trying to fix that. Those who were successful we put in contingencies that went back to making sure that we're not losing an hour. And that's why you see that by tomorrow those who still have the view that naps are closes by tomorrow now when they go and check the accounts they realize that they are ready to make a claim. Because we have been processing over the weekend. Now the queues at your offices seem to suggest that you are under siege, you are overwhelmed. How are you dealing with that? On a positive side maybe that's how popular the benefit is, maybe that's a success. But now dealing with the people that are claiming. You notice that the queues start as early as 5.30. That's how we are at Zambians. When there is something like that we don't want to be left out. Is that a vote of no confidence in your e-platform? If people are going to choose to queue and avoid using their phone in comfort of their homes and offices then there must be something wrong. You haven't asked me if there are any numbers coming through online. On the first day we almost had 50-50 with people claiming putting in their staff online and those were coming to the office. All that we did was those that need to come to the office won't turn them away. And we are dealing with everyone who appears at the office till the last man leaves. So there is no one who will stand away and told to come back tomorrow. We don't operate on the tomorrow basis. We deal with you today. If there are issues to be resolved our back office is going to deal with the issues that need to be resolved on your account. So that we can push you to the next stage where you can claim. Overwhelmed. I think it's an issue of understanding that even when you design a system there is no system that has one option of operation. All systems have to have a plan B. And our plan B was to put bodies or staff to address. So while this was going on we were actually recruiting people. We recruited over 100 staff just to come and beef up the staff to address specifically for this and the Zambia National Provident Fund. So we are aware of what we are doing and we are expected that in case we have an overload this is what we are going to do. And at this juncture I must give a lot of gratitude to our staff who some of them even though they are not in that part of the business are volunteering to actually go in and assist. That just shows the commitment from the NAPSA perspective that we are focused on the objective pay the people. Now you've got complaints coming through particularly for the E-platform. Some people are saying it's too complicated. You're asking them for proof of employment history. And as of now a lot of complaints that we're getting is that only five banks are on your portal. Is there a way of simplifying this adding more banks simplifying your forms? I think we are open to suggestions on how to if there are any issues or challenges on the process where people are finding it a little bit cumbersome to deal. And so far we have changed part of the processes from the feedback we are receiving from the users. We go back and make amendments some of the processes. Now some of the processes we may not change them. Because there is an underlying security issue that we do not want to pay the wrong person. And that's very cardinal for us. So for some of those I think the members who have to bear with us that we are trying to protect their money and therefore they should be a little bit patient with us and would deal with it. One thing that we are committed to is we want to make sure that everyone gets their money as soon as the process is done. Why do we have a few banks then? The few banks we are not restrictive. And this is something that I'm appealing to our bankers out there that we opened up to every bank to actually come on board and make sure that they can service their customers as they are making the withdrawals. So banks are now coming on board some of those that came in late. But we are seeing also an interest from others that we didn't even consider as banks that are coming on board. Zambia National Building Society MD called us there and said well we have customers as well. That for us is a very positive reaction in that everyone wants to just come in and save. And really maybe people don't see the extent of this process what is involved. This process is not just restricted at NAPSA. It has the mobile networks involved. It has the banks involved. It has us involved. We have the registration office getting involved. So it's a much bigger scheme than what you see at the front end. But all that is just trying to make sure that the right crevaso gets his benefits and not the wrong one. People are wondering why are you insisting on employment history? Can you just deal with the NRC, identify them positively, check the number of months at 60, check the age at 45. You're good to go. It's important for employment history because if you came to us and said I'm missing, I'm two months out of the 60 that are required. I'm at 58 and I know that I worked for ZNBC. When we asked ZNBC they said actually he just worked for 58 months. That's why we're asking for that. Part of it is to actually clarify that you worked for the number of months that you worked over the number of years that you worked and also that we are actually dealing with you and not someone else. The pension administration part is a little bit more complexion that you actually have to always have the right confirmation that the member who is accessing a benefit is the correct member and not anyone else. Let's get this question. The arguments that the money that is actually being offered is too little to invest. Maybe I need to ask you, is one able to calculate what they entitled to on their own without waiting for you to give them the amount? Yes, they can if they know the formula. It's not the amount that you contributed that you actually get out of NAPSA. NAPSA grows that money to cover you for the wage inflation and also pays some interest. Now that money is not fixed. The growth factor if I may call it that is not fixed. It's something that is determined by the Zambia statistics office every year and then they give us the value. That's a value we use for wage inflation to cover you for wage inflation. But the good news is when you go to our system as you are claiming you actually find a calculation. It will show you your raw contributions and how much you are entitled to. And it will also go a step further and show you how much of the 20%, what your 20% would be if you waited one year, two years, three years. It will actually show you the amount. So it's a calculation that some people out there we know that they have been able to actually come back and do their calculations on their own. But we could share that it's not a secret. But it's there on our system once you go to the claim stage you find the calculation on your page as you access. And then you see how much you've been entitled to if you waited just a few moments. Argument that the money is too little to invest? Too little to invest. What you've processed, how much are people getting? Serious. Serious money. In the area of figure that you announced, the average. The average was $48,000. $48,000 by any standard is a lot of money. And that's just an average. Some people were going as far as $120,000, $150,000, $160,000. The lowest was getting maybe about $25,000 or $20,000. But the issue of not being enough that is subjective. The people who say that in, what, $200,000 a month, for them if they calculated at 20%, I'm sure they'll look at it and say this is very little. But if they just did a little bit of research and maybe like I said, go to the Citizenship Empowerment Commission, the CEC, and ask on average how much people get. Or have you seen applications that go as far as $15,000? And if the answer is yes, then our $20,000 is good enough. Because it depends on what you want to use it for. I have examples of young people who came up and said when I get my money, whatever it is, I'll make sure I buy a government bond. One of them said, whatever it is, I'm going to put it down as a down payment on my plot. There is a $25,000 quacha remaining, whatever you give me, I'll pay for my plot. So the issue of how much is subjective. It's a debatable issue. I want you to hold your thoughts, DJ. We are hosting the NAPSA Director General and you can interact with us on what's applying by sending a message to 0973433802. Or you can call on 2535. Just now, I think we get some messages and we can get to see what people want to ask you. So that you get to answer what they want to find out from you as Director General. You need to check. There we go. Please find out on my behalf from the Director General NAPSA why my contributions on my statement drop from 245 to 193 without an explanation. That's one of the messages. Good evening. Thank you for your wonderful program. Your system is so cumbersome. Have you considered making it user friendly? Not everyone who wants to claim is educated. In your know your client, well how long should someone wait for the money after applying? Then we've got another one. Give the statement that I received monthly for my contributions is different from how much is showing in the system. The missing months are about 60. How should I resolve the issue? If you're taking note today. No, but... I got the last one there. Good evening Director General. What are you going to do with employers who are not following NAPSA procedures or act concerning contributions? I find that the person has worked more than 20 years but the only contributions which are there is less than 30,000 kwacha only. I would like to know what happens when one has double contributions due to having two jobs at a time. How do you normalize the names of my husband which appears surnames instead of maiden names in case of female employees because the system is rejecting such. So you've got a handful of questions. Maybe you could start with the last one. Okay, I think there's always... We always go through a process of verification and that's what this onboarding process is all about. So whatever the names that are different from the system and what the member has, that's something that we can solve. It's just an issue of providing the required documentation and we should be able to deal with that. So it's not a short stopper if I may put it that way. The member who is asking is still able to get there 20% as soon as we resolve that issue. So you've got a problem there. Others are asking about disparities between the statements they receive and what they're getting now when they want to apply. Where is that problem coming from? That's quite strange and I would like to receive most of those so that we go through and find out what is causing the disparity. It's not supposed to, we are not supposed to have a disparity. Someone is missing 60 months. Missing 60 months, that's missing 6 months. I hope they are not saying it from the fact that the area statement at 60 months, the other one does not. Because if it's an issue of checking and you are looking at your employment record and you are missing 6 months, that is something that we know is possible because of the compliance levels of employers. So this process is actually helping us to deal with that as well. Now for the first time, and I think I can firmly say for the first time, every member is now interested in knowing how much money they have on their account. Prior to this, I don't think anyone paid much attention to the NAPSA account. They were paying attention to their commercial bank accounts but not the NAPSA account. This partial straw has changed the game. Now everyone is going to be interested in knowing how much money is in the NAPSA account. And that for us is a positive. This has a long-term benefit. As long as we can get your account, now that you as the owner, you are going to have time to look at your account and make sure it's up to date, that simplifies the process of paying your benefits going forward. Because if everything is up to date, you have no queries, at the time you are retiring, you don't need to remind us. We remind you, Gravazo, you are about to retire. Which option are you exercising and here is how much money you have. Because we are confident and we are going to do our part making sure that the employers are also paying up the contributions that is for due. They have very little excuse now. The penalties we are talking about have been slashed. The new law allows for the waiver of penalties. So really it's now just an issue of compliance. So that question keeps on coming up. The one on people whom employers are not remitting. Oh no, we will deal with that one. And what does the employee do? All that the employee needs to do is just fill in the form. No, not really filling in the form. I think this does not need to be a one-off process. That only happens because 20% withdraw is at stake or is offered. This needs to be a process that every account holder goes through. And if you ask most of the account holders now, they are receiving two types of SMSs. They are receiving one which confirms that ZNBC has paid for crevazo. They are also receiving one which says your employer has not paid for it. Why? We need you to come up quickly to be part of the enforcement that you need to remind your employer my pay slip shows that you have deducted. Napsa is saying you haven't remitted. We are also going to do our part and make sure we deal with these employers as quickly as possible. They have very few excuse now. These are people's sendings. Everyone needs to get involved. The employers need to do their part. The owner of the account needs to do their part. Napsa will do our part. Your system is cumbersome. The system is cumbersome. Not everybody is educated. Yes, and that's why we had plan B. For those who cannot deal with the system, they can come through to our offices. And that's what we have been getting to get help. They are available. We are now even looking at ways of ensuring that we can deal with people as quickly as possible by maybe possibly extending hours. But we'll get back to the people with announcement very soon. The idea is to those who are not tech savvy can come to us and help them. So you can interact with us. Like we said earlier by sending a text on our WhatsApp line. 73433802 or you can call us on 2530. 25. We have a caller on the line. Sunday from Kichwe. Good evening and welcome to the program. Yes, good evening Mr. Gravasia. And good evening to Mr. Muyango. Please go ahead and make your contributions. Yes, I would like to ask the question concerning a situation whereby an employer, I mean an employer receives two contributions from the two employers. That is the previous employer and the latest employer. There are questions whereby someone has got two contributions within the same month, two contributions for September. Now we are being told that we need to submit those first statements that indicates two contributions. Why can't not just follow up where those employers were emitting money to NAPSA? I mean why can't NAPSA make for a percentage of asking the employee to submit the first lips which might be due to the longest period of time that has taken place since those contributions took place. Sunday, thank you so much. You've got that question. Yes, I think I'll start off by saying our system actually accepts two contributions in a single month. So that should not be a problem Mr. Sunday. And now on the issue of why we're asking for information, there's always a first option that you have to exercise. And when that option does not work, we go to the second option. So he's suggesting that we should deal with the employer. Yes, as we get more numbers of a particular employee that has a list of queries coming up who know how to engage that employer. But where some are providing that information with ease, other members are coming up and when they're uploading the information that we ask for and we're able to process. But don't despair Mr. Sunday, we are there to save you and we'll walk through till we solve your problem and make sure you get to 20%. We have another call on the line. Efrem Shleshe from Makeni, please go ahead and make your contribution. Yes, I just wanted to find out from the director how long does it take if someone applies for a partial payment, how long does it take? Thank you so much Efrem. How long does it take for the money to eat your account? But then I think with this question you need to get it together with an earlier question which we saw in the text. If you have double jobs and you're getting double payment, does it reflect how do you deal with that? I'll start with the double jobs. If you have double jobs and you're getting double contribution our system handles that it allows for that so that should not be a problem. The two employers can remit using a social secret number. The social secret number is a key number that identifies where the payment should go. So that should not be a hindrance in any way. Now on how long it should take? I must admit that in the first few days when we started the process is much slower but our intended turnaround time is within one day you should be able to get your money in your account as long as everything is updated. So the system will actually tell you when you have completed all the requirements when you fulfilled that it goes green by going green it means you are ready to make a claim. The moment you make a claim that second part of the process is much faster than the first part of the process. So you get your confirmation as well as your payment within 24 hours. Within 24 hours if the process is done successfully without any hindrances. Like I said, I must admit that in the first few days yes there was a delay but that's something you should do you should see most of those that made their submissions before Friday. They should check now. I'm sure they will find that they have been pushed to the stage where they are now going to make a claim. We have another caller. Thank you very much. Good evening Gravasio and good evening Digi. My comment to the Digi is that don't you think you announced a bit too early that the platform would be open for partial benefits because the day that you announced that the website would be open there was nothing until late in the evening and even then it was very difficult like to make attachments and there was so much confusion. So my question is did you go through rigorous testing to ensure that the many errors and challenges that people are facing were resolved. For example up to now I still can't upload my documents that are required to prove that I worked for a particular employer. Thank you. Thank you. We're ready. I think we were. Did we anticipate all the problems that were going to happen? No and I think that's part of system development. Anyone who has worked with the system development will know that there are certain issues that arise that we may not have provided for. One thing that people keep on talking about is the fact that Napsa was not ready because the system was behaving this way. You cannot test for 150,000 people trying to claim at the same time. You can do simulations but you will not know exactly how the system is going to behave. Some of these issues we are learning as we go and we are addressing them. The key focus for us is a process is not a hindrance which I'll solve the process and make sure that the people get their money. That's our focus. Our focus is to push you to a stage where you'll be able to make a claim and get paid. Are we going to have tithing problems? Right now our IT guys have not taken a break. They have just been working 24 hours trying to find some of the issues that are causing the slow process and they have identified some of the problems and we are dealing with them. What have the other staff been doing? The other staff have been working over the weekend making sure that everyone who had a claim going through they are ready to claim. We have planned B on the issues as they arise but one thing for sure is if people are talking about systems the choice is simple when we supposed to wait till we have a system that is perfect before we start paying people the partial I think for that question we should ask the people on the queue which one is your preference? We wanted to wait. As we get in some messages I need to ask you this question others are asking and explain simply when I retire will I have enough money to meet my basic needs accommodation, food, medical bills? I'll put it this way first of all we should recognize that the 20% partial is not mandatory you actually make a choice and that's why part of the choice is that you have to realize that your future benefits will be reduced by 20% 80% Now there is a second question in that graph also that you are posing which says would that be adequate? The issue of pension adequacy is something that we should tackle not because there is a partial but because we need to make sure that there is sufficient money in retirement for people to survive that's not because there is a partial issue But then the partial aggravates because you take away my 20% after that am I able to get an earning and the choice is yours Now if you take that money and invest it wisely which is what most of the people that we are talking to are trying to do then you are actually creating your retirement revenue streams wireless you still have the energy and that's the whole issue about the partial and let's not mix that up with the fact that some people may be supplied even if they are going to get the pension they may be supplied that is just a fact of life we cannot run away from it but let's look at those who are doing something I have a Misheki Kaoma who when he got his ZNPF went to his royal highness Mukuni and asked for a piece of land he gets a piece of land he buys goats and he buys orange trees he comes back and says I'm getting my partial and I'm going to beef up I'm getting my red dan on my small land in Livingston that's a story about partial and that's what we should be focusing on the few people that might misuse the money that's life but when you say few maybe you haven't done the research and you're saying few will misuse many will not misuse but I'll allow you to hold your thought to begin a call and I'll take messages I think it's too long there we go good evening can the NAPSA did you explain why we can't edit employment history when one has made an error why are we why we are supposed to account for stray contributions yet NAPSA knows where all contributions came from and lastly why can't sign up because we entered vice versa from NAPSA records yet the NRC number is the same so you've got that that complication I hope you've noted I registered with NAPSA earlier before the announcement was done in my case I've forgotten those security answers and my account has been blocked what should I do to proceed to inshape my claim the issue of the banking details needs to be looked at seriously why can't NAPSA just allow the member to submit their banking details like the ZRI pay as you and refund so you've got the questions before you get those maybe let's get Jackson Jackson please go ahead and make a contribution yes my concern is about the system these stray contributions the stray contribution and the the document that I needed like the proof of whether one and the the termination letter some of us we stopped work years ago and how can I retrieve all those the documents and for the system to for my procedure to go through the history of my employment it is there but they want me to add the documents which are not with me right now how am I going to be assisted how are we going to go ahead thank you so much so you can start with the question from the caller then we go to the messages I think I'll start with the message with 80% the issue I was saying we didn't cut out the research I think you need to ask yourself a question if I'm assuming that you are saying I said 2% maybe the bad they failed to utilize the money properly maybe vice versa ok so let's look at the Zambian economy right now if we say vice versa the people that have made something out of the 95% and when I'm talking about 95% I'm talking about your salary once we take out the 5% from you that's what remains is 95% you've seen people create 2 revenue streams out of the 95% an extra revenue stream sorry out of the 95% first of all they have the employment income and then they have another business by the side why aren't we talking about those are the same members of NAPSA they were able to do that in the 95% why are we making an assumption that when we give them the 20% it's wrong now the majority of the people in this country let's talk about housing would you say that most of the houses in Usaka were built before someone got a mortgage the answer is no they were building it out of the 95% salary that they have why are we now making an assumption that someone who can build a house you don't build a house in one year in so many years when they get the extra money I think we are being unfair to the Zambians that have shown a lot of entrepreneurship spirit you see them walking the streets you see them trying to make ends meet let's talk about village banking our ladies who participated in village banking they were withdrawing 5000 some of them 15000 and putting it to use how can we turn around that now that they are getting a 20% they will not know what to do with it that's unjust and grossly unfair to the people that are actually showing the entrepreneurship spirit and that even before the 20% partial straw came in they were already doing their side businesses I know people who are employed they are selling cloth I know people who are employed they are doing a sheffing business over the weekend are you telling me that when they get an extra income those people would rather go I want you to pick the questions now editing employment history I think some of these issues are questions that you should raise would take note of that and engage you on a one-to-one basis to find out what could have happened employment history is very critical so they entered wrongly but then they want to edit yes but employment history is very critical you allow that to be free text and no one entering that and changing it anytime so what we are saying is there is a way we can do with that and all that we need to get is our officers will support you to make sure that you can edit that all that you could do is just make proof available so some of these are not your stoppers and that's a message I want to put forward the fact that you try something and fails does not mean you are not going to get your money it's just an issue of going now to option B where you engage us on a physical face-to-face basis and then we help you on a physical face-to-face basis there is no one who is going to be denied the 20% partial because naps are designed in the system that's not our intention that's why we have some steps that we can take to assist you as a member once you prove that you are the member to go through the process and get your 20% stray contributions like I said this process is helping us to get to even identify some of these problems like the two John Millars that works for Vambi without this we may not have known that there is such a problem but because now they want to claim they have raised that as an issue I'm sure we are going to get the bottom of that and help them and make sure each one of them gets a 20% as we are saying the staff on the Kopa belt are already dealing with the two Millars case and that's the way naps are is approaching this we are not going to turn you away and say because there is something wrong with your account you are not going to get your 20% we will wait with you absolutely same registration yes that's why we have national ideas why would you swap your names I think these are some of the issues we should be taking seriously when they ask you first name, second name please don't take liberties and start putting your surname as your first name but will that be addressed and those using husband's names all those there is proof in this country maybe unless someone got married in the traditional system but even then there should be someone a chief who can attest to the fact that this is a husband we have marriage certificates those are some of the issues that can be used to rectify some of the issues that are rising here let me get the last caller let's go ahead and give us your contribution good evening good evening good evening good evening good evening yes please this program is a very good program and we thank you the president and your naps are now should be on each dose to really support the civil servants and the other employers who are in abject poverty so my concern is the issue of some banks we have some banks that are not registered with naps on the platform there are some banks like standard credit bank we know there are those banks that may not ever come to see naps over this program and these are salary accounts for ofta and we expect naps to take it a step over approaching those banks thank you Charles you've got three minutes so we need to answer that one I know you've answered it I will repeat and as you go answering these I need you to also answer the question this is more like a run on the bank everyone wants to withdraw how safe is the pension scheme that's one question you need to answer as you go but then you can pick the question as well so I start with Charles and the banks we approached all banks and the banks have an association and there is a way we discuss with them on how certain measures we want to implement to work with them to implement certain measures it's all now up to the banks working with us their reaction time and what changes they have to make to the system to make sure they are on board but at this juncture I must thank Zanako because Zanako is almost like the our go between that is helping all the other banks to come to come on board and they are doing a very good job and it comes up to Apsa that have come up and actually said they could help us remove the congestion from the the cues from our office by actually opening up registration points in their premises that is a kind of collaboration that we are very thankful for and this is not something that Napsa is doing alone we are working with other parties to make sure that is delivered and that's a collaboration we encourage other banks to come on board most of these banks will be on board there is a risk for the banks that are not coming on board because I don't think the owners of the money will be waiting for their banks to come on board they might open accounts with those that are available that's a very big risk and we don't want to be to take it to that level would rather the banks came on board and save their members the fund how safe is the fund it's a pity actually that I think most zambians do not know what Napsa is Napsa services the financial system the money that we collect from our members goes to service the financial system we hold deposit with these banks that the money they lend so there is no run of 11 billion kwacha that can ground Napsa Napsa is much bigger than 11 billion in short Napsa is liquid enough to pay both the zambianashu provident fund and the partial store and the retiree we will not find the money gone it has never happened it's not going to happen that's not Napsa people should not mistake us for the other pension scheme that's not Napsa Napsa has never failed to pay retirees never Napsa is liquid thank you so much for coming you would want to talk and explain more but then we've run out of time thank you so much for coming we've been watching signed the interview and our guest this evening was a Napsa director general Mr. Miangwa but next week sometime thousand people