 A very good morning and great to be here at the Interpreneurate Media's Webthi Summit. So as a topic we will discuss about why blockchain is there and how since last night we keep hearing mid-fine and the rest of the stories. I think the main moment of blockchain eventually started in 2014-15. We will talk about how apart from other sector how banking is also getting impacted rather at least 60% of worldwide applications on blockchain are on finance, not only banking but insurance and other then raised followed by government and then the rest of the world. And eventually the way I always say like by 2030 we will not talk about blockchain, we will talk about only use cases, the way we don't talk about internet now, we talk about FATMs, we talk about Google Pays and we say our responsibility all together as an ecosystem, how do we nurture blockchain as a use cases. So we will discuss along with our internet panel on banking and finance, how it is impacted. Back in 2017 I started India's first consortium on banking, blockchain, bank chain along with the DCB bank, state bank, ICSN, many other bankers, service products like Intel and Microsoft and so on. And eventually we understood that it's not something group or consortium should be held but we need to have the right governance to run the blockchain use cases where we'll store the data and who will govern that data when multi-party banks or multi-party ecosystems or multi-party actors are in that use case. So in any a blockchain comes and says there are four types of use cases. Typically one of those use cases for a country the way we see DGR of foundation is not blockchain or DGE locker is a common blockchain. Another use case is around consortium use case which is typically bank consortium or insurance consortium where they may say KYC come on on blockchain. Third type of use case is at a bank level or at organization level we may say that we can have a zero knowledge organization whatever is moving as a data within organization, who are there as an employee we need to have a complete clarity that will be trusted by this trust layer and finally which is very important that's how the world will come together it's a cross-border payment having a unique passport across the world I think that's what blockchain comes and says this is what we will do and a banking person in an Indian context we have seen ICC bank working closely with the Emirates for a cross-border payment or we have seen ES Bank has launched one use case back in 18 with Bajaj Electrical for supply chain finance. IDPC bank working closely with summer start maybe Vishwa will guide how this is happening or we have seen large bank like SDFC quotas has worked something on 26 years along with income type departments. So if you say nothing is happening in banking so we will prove through this discussion yes lot of things are happening in a banking context and how regulators or banks and various experts and various startup companies are really taking the blockchain as an opportunity to make better banking for us so we will start with the Vipul, Vipul comes from SDFC bank you can introduce and immediately give back your thoughts how blockchain will change banking with a or how banking the way we do today is going to be changed with the blockchain technology. Thank you so much for that I'm really excited to be a part of this particular panel because it gives me an opportunity to really talk about good examples as to how interesting blockchain is when it comes to collaborating and working together in terms of creating solutions I've been fortunate enough to be in this segment for 4.5 years now work with two large private banks in India and my job has basically revolved around building collaborations with syntax and startups and one of the most exciting areas for me has been blockchain. The reason being very simple because private banks in India are very conservative in nature. We very closely follow the guidelines and have been set by different government entities and we pride ourselves in terms of being that conservative in nature. Anytime we work with startups of index in India or internationally what we bring to the table or what our teams bring to the table are insights into how compliance has to be looked at and adhered to and respected when you're building new products and solutions. In that regards blockchain solves a very critical part of the problem for us identification, reliance on information and also accessibility to newer ways of differentiating data that was not earlier accessible to the bank. To give you an example there are multiple applications in the insurance space in the lending space that we've been able to thrive upon both as a bank and a lot of NBFCs have been able to do that, fintechs have been able to do that because earlier on you didn't have access to data. Now we are talking about getting into the gig economy space. We recently had a conversation with some of the largest travel partners in India and what we realized was that we want to be able to give up quick cash and quick insurances and loans. You know to people who are let's say the drivers and who are driving vehicles, two-wheelers or four-wheelers and very closely what we realized was that these platforms like Oda Uber, Rapido and others have patent recognition software that's an information that's available to them. So you know exactly where the trip started and where the trip ended. They also are able to identify where the person who's driving that vehicle originates from in the day and you know finishes off work in the night. Using databases like that you know exactly if let's say the person has migrated from another region in India and is working back which is the predominant area he's living in. So why KYC is done on the permanent addresses, we've been able to do verification of temporary addresses in making it much more easier to build that trust in the system to give out loans and there are multiple examples of that. Blockchain inherently is enabling us to have better visibility into the ecosystem with the people that we're working with and also encouraging us to work with multiple areas where we can define new directions for the back and for the user. So it's a very interesting work in space. Wonderful land. Just to support the vehicle Sima and when you sit inside an app, so I was blessed with that apportionment care work with PCB Bank sitting in the back for 10 years. So anything comes to your hand as a mobile banking, internet banking or any service or anything comes to employee's hand as a last-minute service. Everything is weighted by process note and if you look at the process note which is signed up by compliance officer, CISOs and all the business guidance, it has a lot of manual work to do and Blockchain comes and says that we can really augment that. So what does it mean that what we've said or what regulators keep saying since so many years with a lot of regulations comes in our way? Example like video privacy or example second-hand authentication, example to keep a tamper through auditory or example is like how do I see that integration between Pintek and a bank, how it should be future food, full fruit. All of these are the use cases of Blockchain. If you sit in a bank, you can come back and say that I can bring another 60 plus use cases in a the better for better money. So I think we should not just upon your experience, how do you see the traction between bank and Pintek companies on Blockchain adoption? Absolutely so I come from the start point so where we interact quite a lot with the progressive banks and their innovation strategy for Blockchain right. So one of the major scenarios that is now coming to the fore definitely one of the most used use cases is the trade finance. So trade finance and supply change finance majorly but domestic invoices where there is a lot of tampering of these invoices and the volume that you actually can imagine from various corporates and their distributor network or from the retailer network is really high. For example, let us actually take as an example like maybe Britannia's invoices. There are small ticket sites, there are a lot of them and we do not know whether they are really putting the right invoices maybe from the retail perspective how Britannia will actually verify how bank will actually verify, how you know the insurance can actually verify in case if it is credit insurance done. So these are the different areas where the distribution happens. The other use case which we are working on is the international trade where importers-exporters would actually communicate or collaborate over this particular Blockchain we actually do new party intelligence, third party new intelligence and K by C AML which could be a record for enabling the limit within the bank. So this is like translating that again into invoices, trade invoices whether it is an LC that would have credit as an instrument or PG as an instrument or if there is a change in the invoice, nobody in the changes. Here if you actually say the importer is exporter, the bank which is the major trust partner, the insurance the trade insurance, the cheaper insurance and most important to be able to have free providers of the world. So all these parties have to be on the same page, usually that will be happening on paper based frame where Blockchain will be the chief collaborator across these ensuring the data integrity and data security and to my knowledge the way it works in the bank as a concept that I can see there are a lot of tech companies in the audience also and you may go to any bank safety that is a Blockchain, it doesn't happen in the day one, the way it happens for mobile banking and internet banking first of all awareness, why do I need a Blockchain in a banking use case. Second thing is around how it will impact how will new numbers like business, what businesses will be more. What are the possibilities, I think it takes different science altogether when you pitch a Blockchain really back there. So that's where I always start with a small use case, do the PUC pirate, learn from it and then look for some other use cases and that's how we have seen how banking, banks are not coming together we have a bank chain, I give an example which is failure and that's what we learned that we started IPDS or internet banking Blockchain in a certain company to bring actual blockchain adoption among all banks and that is well spoken to by regular we will talk about. So what's your first take on Blockchain do you really feel that's a really long way to go as far as banking you went through all of those use cases. So I have been, during the period of demonetization I was handling ATMs and chaos of the bank where there was a lot of chaos and the entire country all of us would remember. So that was a time when people started adopting debit cards, internet banking and I think because cash was not available so easily. So that was one period. And everyone of us know after COVID pandemic the situation again changed, everyone started using, embracing UPI. So even the so-called conservative senior citizens, VPR, parents generation or even a small vendor, every body started using UPI. I think for blockchain initially there can be some resistance because there is definitely lack of awareness. There are so many misconceptions and concerns which needs to be addressed and regulatory wise also RBA has still not allowed banks to do any dealings with the cryptocurrency and we are not yet supporting. So there should be some kind of clarity from the regulator and now CBDC has anyway we've got central financial currency and we are also one of the first banks to run the pilot and we are actually using CBDC. So we are literally forcing employees to start using it by doing some transactions and start using it. So unless you find value in this, I think the customers and the citizens will take some time because there will be initial resistance where definitely once they know the security features of blockchain because a lot of cybercrimes are happening, OTP frauds, SMS phishing and you know tele-calling you and getting your KYC details and just update the sync. So all kind of cybercrimes are happening because there is a central point of failure because everything is maintained in a central server and once the hacker gets into access of that particular server they can manipulate. Recently also one of the software developers have manipulated the mobile banking app and there is an eight-mending fraud by the developers from the public sector. This is the way tampering can happen whereas if we know the blockchain technology it is decentralized and it is tampered proof because whatever is written is inevitable. So the hacker should compromise at least 51% of the entire network to do this and it is very, very time consuming as compared to the traditional banking. So it is more safer. So when we create this awareness among citizens and customers, I think everyone would love to adopt blockchain technology. So I think we spoke about yes, fundamentally blockchain is very, very important for banks. Three of us spoke about what are those use cases are doing and you touched upon the security aspects is very, very important. At an organization level, the fourth quadrant of use cases how do you safeguard organization? Like we have seen this one-and-a-half end of the Vosmos Bank and malware, we have seen that 32 lakh cards compromised in 2018 at Visa cards. All this can be minimized. I am not saying it will be wiped out but because of it, it gives a challenge for every packet which is coming inside my bank. It gives a challenge that are you authentic source to get into. And even if the signature changes at a data center level, we can immediately highlight that something will change because of malware coming. So I think that's kind of why you use cases and you touched upon very nice use cases which is like ATM, debit cards and all, a lot of searches happened during demonetization. And there are really use cases is called as a cash-based organization. Typically you get a cash from ATM but you know that's an operational activity to print the cash, move the cash from RBI to the banks. Banks to specialize, branches to purchase, branches and from there move that into banks with the third party partner and the guy who is actually putting the cash in the ATM. Instead of 10 lakh, we could 9 lakh, 90 thousand something but in Excel you will put, yes, I have put it. And at the end of the financial year, it will be thousands of crores amount will go in systems. Just because of this block chain out there so that everybody is on the same chain. We can save that much amount of money. That's one of these use cases. Now bring your second right, which are the specialized use cases. You touched upon the same thing, Vishwa you may want to talk about which are the specialized use cases of block chain, right. I keep hearing tokenization, I keep hearing digital currency. You may want to throw some mic. The next big buzz words you will see in this industry. So definitely asset tokenization. So real world asset tokenization is one of the largest areas where we actually see greater reduction that's happening. Be equity be it bonds, be it the ESG loans or ESG green bonds. So everything can be tokenized. So if you actually look at what tokenization does is to enable the banks to give a practical ownership to also enable the retail investors to put it to low liquidity pools, right. So for example real estate has been already been disrupted and quite number of nations are already adopting this. And banks have been the forefront in leading this innovation of tokenization. And this becomes one of the statements that were done and that was given by J.F. Mogan is that it's not just an evolution or it's just not a revolution but it's an evolution. It's a mandatory evolution that the traditional assets which were managed manually has to be tokenized and has to be actually made and one good aspect of it is it's a lot of cost optimization tools. The cost optimization is the biggest advantage that we actually get when you actually make any transaction manual and as well a lot of parties have to be enabled. Tokenization brings in at least to start with one of the banks have achieved the cost optimization in enabling this particular transaction. Apart from that one more bigger trend which we see is the CPDC so central bank digital currencies this is going to be one more bigger innovation and revolution that's going to happen. Already detail is in place detail CPDC we have experimented we have done with the pilots and I think so you are in the forefront of the innovations of their CPDC space but wholesale CPDC also you know when you actually look at entire I mean some of the advancements have already done the digital currencies strategies and already so these are two major revolutions which I see with the back end of blockchain. I think just to support you like HSBC, JP Morgan CT and DBS already doing a lot of concept pilots on asset organization. The way we see banking has moved from branch to mobile internet and that's why what has been going on and we can't survive without that kind of banking. Eventually next 10 years it's all about tokenize. Everything around will be tokenize that's the next level of business model. Sitting here if you want to really purchase some part of the fraction of one flat in Dubai or sitting here you want to own one pending in a new museum that is going to possible with the right regulation and with the help of blockchain because blockchain bring that trust the way we will do transactions and in real context IFC is creating a framework around asset tokenize and it's well supported by banks and CPDC you want to touch upon and there are a lot of misconceptions, UPI is already there, I am able to transfer so immediately, why do we require CPDC? You may want to touch upon So first of all as a bankrupt it becomes very difficult to touch upon newer technologies because like we said we have very conventional nature and we have to very clearly follow the guidelines that have been put across by different government bodies but I love talking about blockchain and I love talking about the fact that there are so many applications that are being built on top of it to the extent that I would say that it's also spoiling bankers in a way because our expectations have been raised everywhere when we look at solutions coming on blockchain and when we get solutions in other spaces is blockchain better, where does blockchain figure into this it's a win-win situation for the banks, for the users and for the government entities now CPDC is a great example of how that can be leveraged and while there are a lot of people who would be talking about CPDC I would also want to introduce a very quick example where I think a lot of people have not started realizing that actually what you mentioned in the beginning of the talk was very clear in the long-term people will not open the platform, they will talk about the application of the platform so in my case I have realized that even embedded finance solutions are actually being built on blockchain and in Russia part is that we get a good set of security from those solutions we created for example there is a company that we are collaborating with, they help us identify use cases where we can give out loans to Kiran Storobov and again this is built on blockchain, the wonderful factor is that we are working in companies like BigBasket and ShopKirana and these other integrators of the world and we have been able to give out loans to their partners and their investors using this particular format and I remember being in the room and this idea was being pitched and they said this is how the system is enabled, how it is built on blockchain I don't think there was anybody in the room that had any questions after that, they were like great let's move ahead and see how we can scale it up. Similarly now coming back to CPC I think the great part is that the organizations and the ecosystem has been so fast on that that it encourages us to experiment on those platforms as well. We are seeing great examples internationally, we are seeing RBI and organizations like RBI Innovation Hub focusing energies on that, talking to fintechs, talking to banks, taking our inputs and creating that right and in fact there is a lot of information that is already ready in terms of step by step processes on the websites for these organizations that anybody would have access to but to sum it up I would say that because it is such a great equalizer for everyone, it is a wonderful tech solution to have and to build solutions on, great examples like you mentioned but what I don't want people to take away from this session is to also identify what are the other ways that we can build solutions on blockchain. How can you leverage the existing systems and build on blockchain. Look at what would be the next evolutionary power. There are a lot of gap areas that still exist and you know can also be built upon and you know quick action can be taken to build good solutions. Yeah wonderful, I think a lot of radical use cases about tokenization, CPC, next level is going to be on blockchain. The way we are at that which is a centralized server or digital author. They are already working on the fourth concept layer while we have seen paperless payment and data is already being solved with the UPI and account aggregator. Next I think concept layer which is going to come on blockchain that is why we see a lot of digital public infrastructure companies, digital author I spoke about, digital author foundation, OEDC, Protein, all of them are looking at blockchain as a long term foundational technology and CPC is going to be revealed for long period, almost 100 plus countries are adopting CPC. Ten are already live, India is not exception and India CPC will be the best of the best because all the railroads are ready in form of banking ecosystem, good governance guys RBI and last but not least Aadha. The way you were speaking about security part which is another radical use case of banks, you got to work on how security can be changed and whether production is really secure you may want to work on it. Security is never 100% that is for sure but when I speak about the core triumphs of security it is the confidentiality, integrity and availability all three are going to be satisfied by blockchain because we are not dealing with the BIA, we are dealing with the cryptography keys in blockchain so that is anyway going to provide us confidentiality because everything is decentralized, immutable and nobody can change all the data so that is going to anyway give me integrity, nobody is going to tamper with my data. Availability for sure because now we all face veiled transactions among gets debited but it does not get credited to your merchant whom you are paying and after 2-3 transaction days or within 7 working days it may take different bags and different things so it will get credited to you. So there is a lot of transaction failures are also happening whenever you want to pay someone very urgently it will never work. So this kind of transaction failures will never happen because it is decentralized and availability is more because it is spread across multiple nodes that way and just you were speaking about the concept mechanism which not forget the need which is just now come. Our act gives all citizens the right to withdraw our concept also. Nowadays we keep getting so many spam calls because we would have given whenever a pharmacy also asks I purchase foods or medicine they will ask for an entire database and give us another pan and we just give it because we are in the urgency to purchase something even in the malls hospitals we without our personal data we don't even care even when we check into hotels whenever it is asking that you are sending it through WhatsApp also bank out also everything you are sending no idea who is tampering all these things and what they are trying to do with your data nobody is having that's a fundamental crux of the every security or every problem. But whereas in blockchain it gives us the right to withdraw our concept also because we are using typical teams to identify where the information is not directly used it is common then we have a right to withdraw our concept also and when it comes to data minimization of the purpose limitation these two are the clauses in the beginning. So if you are purchasing medicine simple medicine and apolipan is your somewhere why you really want all your data so they have to collect specific data which is limited to that purpose only. Your purpose is to get treated in a clinic or if your purpose is to purchase something from a mall. So the data purpose limitation should be there you cannot collect unnecessary data and should not be storing so that is achieved by blockchain and even the concept withdrawal is always available but right now if I want to withdraw I am saying basically we don't have idea where all our data is send to where to withdraw how to withdraw suppose if I want to ask some of the bank stop calling me for personal, stop calling me for readycast where do I approach and where do I withdraw that it is still complicated but whereas in blockchain that is definitely achieved and it is kind of more secure because hackers also needs a lot of time to tamper with the data and if you tamper with one node it is impossible to tamper with all the other nodes that kind of validation is there so that way it is more secure. Yeah, wonderful. I think we just do some more debate maybe today we have Aadha which is centralized database and the way we use Hapini, Mishewara, Aadha even we share Aadha and Aadha to the banks. If you close the bank you cannot steal the data even it is not something like you have to withdraw the data and Mahalo's QSC which is coming on is centralized QSC and this is my own bank account it takes 5,000 to 10,000 rupees to open a bank account and happens you are not happy with that bank you go to another bank and the price is of 10,000 RBI as a governance body for all banks imagine you have a six bank account that you have entered at least 6,000 rupees for one bank, for all the six banks and you are banked with at least two banks. While you display QSC can be shareable, you can do the QSC once and that is available to other banks for it and same as you have and the next skill of your QSC is decentralized or rather same story, same story where you know where I have given my QSC and we can withdraw on the spot from my mobile wallet that is the futuristic way as a regulator we are working at a regulator RBI we have a community committee to work close with the banks which are all QSC we spoke about blockchain, impact on banks we spoke about use cases, how security within a bank every bank is of infallible security I think it is an audition take we take it so time to really move the right use cases awareness followed by governance everything is will be taken here while we make it free being there is no recognition of crypto I am really not required right there are right use cases there will be always a regulation available in that manner the government of India regulators are working in that direction so nevertheless most of the bank will happen over a period of time on a blockchain process while you may say blockchain is so secure indirectly if you will not copy it well it is in scale one of the in scale because once you write data there and it is available everywhere so public private which blockchain you are utilizing which platform you are using how you are working around that we have that kind of resources, skill available it is a long way to go but the way the base is there for blockchain adoption is huge compared to internet thank you so much for all the inputs India Digital Bank last few seconds what is your advice to the audience so that we are on time I mean I think so this is going to be the property one of the secure war for the data so and I also turn this something called convergence of technologies so as a person I rightly pointed out if you leave open even the blockchain in some of the areas without the proper security so what we need to do is you know blockchain can be used in quite a few cases as the action is all right one is the new ability and then we have the stupidness and we are also looking at the network effect so there are quite a lot of use cases that could actually be used so why do you have to name the brand blockchain you know you also need to come in when the data records are insecure in the part of the blockchain with more security or the design the architectures that have to be done is very very important the innovation is a very important role in the blockchain in banking why because the transaction system which has seen it for a long years we cannot just say that we will increase it what is your advice for the audience so why you know all the aspects of blockchain has to be discussed man only one thing is that you know it is a great platform to build on consider them like this and this so is that can be done please use your imaginations in terms of what else can be done I will give you a very quick example you started working with an organization from Assam he was the next partner, came back to Assam and realized that most of the women saved their money in the form of a whole team and those were owned by women in the house and what he did was he figured out that everyone in the whole team multiplied and it was like a return on the restaurant and women folks he stated a complete system on that on the basis of blockchain I am sure you guys are going to start hearing about it I just wish everyone is aware of what you are doing do not download unauthorized applications please do download it from App Store or Google Play Store yes App Store, yes so just be careful whatever you are using in the blockchain technology see whatever you want to use just be aware of what you are doing and do not pray for the managers actors, thank you I think we had a good panel I think the last part of my idea is that see blockchain is very either you witness and be part of somebody else's or be part of the actual change happens, it is a foundation stick and if we change the way we talk the way we communicate so thank you very much for bringing this discussion for us