 The All Progressive Congress APC makes a U-turn and fixes National Convention for March the 26th. And stop playing politics with the Electoral Act Amendment Bill, says the Presidency, to interest groups. For this, it's plus politics. I am Mary-Anne Cook. The Kerticker and Extraordinary Convention Planning Committee of the All Progressive Congress APC has approved March 26 for the National Convention of the Party. This was announced by John Akban Udoirege, the National Secretary of the CECPC. Some have expressed this content with the development. For instance, the former Director-General of the Progressive Governance Forum, Salihul Lukman, described the action as mutiny by fraudulent politicians. According to Lukman, members of the PGF are being disrespected and its decisions and leadership are now being snubbed. Well, joining us to break this down is Biyadu Shomi and Chique Choudi. Both of them are political affairs analysts. Thank you so much, gentlemen, for joining us. It's my pleasure. Great. Sorry, you missed the show with me. There's, I mean, campaign season, as I always say, is right here, is upon us. And so we're seeing a loss of movements within parties. Some seem to be taking 10 steps forward and, you know, one step forward and 10 steps back. We've seen dates scheduled and rescheduled, whether it be in states in zones. And now the APC has finally, as of yesterday, we had heard that the party may have to move its elections. And I also heard a party chieftain say that the APC would not be stampeded into conducting its national convention. Paint a picture to the average person what you think is responsible for the U-turn, the sudden U-turn by the All Progressive Congress. Yes, it's not totally unexpected if you look at how the whole thing came to a head that the convention has to be moved to March 26. There have been people who were opposed to Tinumbu's candidacy, who have been busy campaigning against him within the party, without throwing off any viable candidates that can really dislodge him or challenging particularly from the south-west. And you have all these amorphous forces, you know, fusing together, hoping if they can get him out, he will endorse one of their own. But rather, they came to the realization that Tinumbu intends to stay in the race, no matter the debt thrown at him. And because of that, there's a need to restrategize and see what do they do. Do they queue behind another candidate or look for a new candidate who can challenge Tinumbu, whether from within the south-west zone or any part of the south. So they had that difficulty to contend with. They did put a lot of pressure on Buni and eventually they managed to have their way by postponing the convention to March 26. Assistant currently, whether for a guest, when you look at the old debate is always around Tinumbu, nobody's talking about any other candidacy, particularly from the south-west. If you look at the vice-president, his name is being touted. People were campaigning for him. But the vice-president has never said he wants to consult or he intends to contest, you know, for that of it. So you can see clearly that the game is clear. If that convention should take place as earlier planned, many fear that it may be a fatal conflict that Tinumbu would emerge. So there's a need to restrategize and, you know, move the dates. As against, you know, when you look at the facts as against the claim that APC was being stampeded, that's not correct. APC, Buni led APC chose February 26 initially for the convention. Voluntarily, nobody compelled them to do that. There was no court action that compelled them to fix it. So they were not stampeded into it. And the arguments initially was because they needed more time because of the reconciliation going on within the states, you know. But that became a no-issue when it became clear that the issues are being resolved democratically. If you look at how Oshus case has been resolved currently, so they could no longer rely on using that as an excuse. If it had been a close contest between Aregwe Shula and Uyetola, they probably would have lashed on that. Look, the party would be divided. They would lose the state to the opposition. So when they lost that argument, there is nothing else to say or to do other than to just, you know, simply throw up the excuses and postpone it. From what you've said, I'm getting two things. You're telling me that the All Progressive Congress does not want the candidates from the Southwest, the only one that has emerged to pick the ticket because they think it's a bit too strong. Again, you're also saying that the party has called off its national convention because of one man. How is that possible? No, what I'm saying, basically, is that the APC more or less has agreed, you know, that the candidate, the presidential candidate, Shuley Mark from the South, if you look at all the people contesting for the chairmanship, they're all from the North. So it's clear what they're trying to do. The issue is, in the South, there's only one candidate that has the main dominant, you know, moving around, doing consultations, indirect campaigning, and that's the candidate they're talking about. It has those who are for him and those who are against him. So you have very powerful forces within the APC who are fighting them. There are also powerful forces against him. So this pioneering by postponing the convention in my view is with a view to see whether they can produce an alternative candidate that would upstage, you know, if they cannot get away with consensus. Don't forget the issue of consensus as its own drawback. All aspirants must agree, you know, to a consensus arrangement. And that's what the law says. And I suspect that's part of the reason why the new electoral act has not been signed. Let's look at other candidates within the party and see, you know, their structure, their spread. I mean, so far within the APC, the abhorrent state governor has declared his interest. Dodgers or Kahlu has also thrown his hat into the ring. Basically, I spread with the former governor of Imo State, who was a former senator also. And he also is one of those people who has decided that he wants to be president. I'm looking at all of these people. There is none at all that can at least upstage the leader of the party. Very powerful candidates, you know, across possible candidates across the whole of the south. The problem is nobody is presently campaigning the way to know who is doing it. He remains a candidate to be challenged. No matter how you look at it, whether it's from the southeast, southwest, or south, south, he's the only one moving around to have a feel as if he is a consensus candidate. I have not seen any serious challenge in terms of consultation or campaigning or whatever, you know, to his candidacy. Rather, what you have is the media hate and the activists of other people trying to frustrate him with numerous allegations, you know, and that's what is going on currently. Whether for or against, whatever they're talking about in the APC today, is it about Inumu when it comes to the presidential elections? And that is also informing the debates on who be the chairman of the party, the new chairman of the party. People are thinking about this one would be too sympathetic to Inumu or he wouldn't. You know, when you look at that, what about other candidates? They're all there. But the fact of the matter is they are not, you know, persecuting the ambition, you know, on the same frequency as Inumu is doing for it. Well, I think we're being joined by Achikay Chude. Achikay, I don't know if the background sound is coming from you, but if you can turn down the volume of your TV, if you're, if that's what's causing the background noise. But quickly joining us, we want to hear what you think is the main crisis within the party. Don't forget the past governors are angry, of course, they feel snobbed and this is also part of the problem. We also know that there's been divisions within the party at state levels, local governments, even at zonal levels. And here we are. After all of the whispering, the pushing, the shelving, the speculations, the party has moved finally to say we're pushing the convention to March 26, even though we're going to at least have a zonal convention in between. But what do you think is underneath all of this? Politics is under it. What is going on? These are politicians and this is the period for politics. And so because there is a heightened expectation, heightened ambitions, and for them the stakes are very high. Don't forget that most of these people do not do any of that outside of politics. They are like fish out of water. Out of water, of course, the fish will die. So a lot of them see politics as a purely business and not service. That is why the country is the way it is. So in a period of heightened expectations, you have all kinds of political moves and political maneuvering. And of course, but again, there is a background to it. There's a context and that is the fact that APC has never really been a political party. It has been a conglomeration of all kinds of people that do not have any serious pro-people ideological agenda. And so it is not for nothing that the president at the time warned about the possibility of the PDP upsetting the APC in an election if they do not get their ads right. Obviously, the APC is a house divided against itself. And that is not to say that the PDP has not got issues. But the issues of the PDP pay little in significance, relatively, when you are talking about what is going on in the APC. APC in a way has become like the Fuji house of commotion. And don't forget that shortly after they came to power, one of the first things that happened, one of the major outings of the APC ended in chaos and disorder. And that was the issue of the presidency of the National of the Senate. And so we have seen all of this crisis one after the other. Look at the last state congresses, how it ended up. So this is exactly what is leading to what is going on. First of all, there is no consensus. There is no unity about what to do with the party. There is no cementing ideological compass that buys membership of the party together. So there is no ethics or ethos that wears the party together. So it is every man for himself, whatever you can grab, you grab it as much as possible. And then you have a little bit of a semblance of a party. But honestly, the party is now united. And that is why everything that we are seeing today, of course, it is all about 2023 who becomes president of this country. But Mr. Tudor, do you not think that at some point, or maybe the crack within the APC, I mean, let's ignore the Senate leadership in Broglieu. But the crack within the party started when the Boone-led committee got into office. Don't you think that this is when everything went post? The crack has always been there. Don't forget that immediately Oyegun led the APC to victory. In 2015, he began to have issues. And it was these issues that eventually led to his ouster. Of course, there are political differences. You had state congresses that did whose outcome did not exactly play some party big wigs. So there was a buildup of crisis and momentum that led to the ouster of Chief Oyegun. And then Adam Sosomole came in. And after some time, again, it became a game of musical chairs. Adam Sosomole was also removed. So you have, even when you have a chairman of the party that were elected as the leaders of the party, in that state it did not help. So it also did not help that Boone was a chairman of necessity. And it was all about the political maneuvering that led to the removal of Adam Sosomole that eventually led to the loss of a dual state by the APC in the governorship election. So this is what has happened. Of course, obviously, from the moment that Boone came in, there were people who were on the side. He had the blessings of the president. But obviously, there are also people who were really opposed to him. And so this is what we see playing out. The substance, for instance, the postponement of the convention indefinitely, and then a few hours later, it was fixed for March 26th. It's clearly an indication of a chairman that is exactly not in control of the navigation of the APC ship. But again, I'm sorry. As much as we would want to look at Governor Mele Ibooni as someone who should be in control of the party, we also see that the party does have a loss of strongmen, just as Mr. Showami has been saying. He feels that at the bottom of this, you know, it's the fight for supremacy. And of course, some people trying to dodge the leader of the party emerging as the final flag bearer of the party. So can you say that Boone is a strongman or someone who can really stare the ship when there are many other demigods within the party? Well, the crisis that has been there for the APC, even under his chairmanship, his leadership, is an indication that he has not exactly been able to study the ship of state. Don't forget that there have been all kinds of reconciliation committees that were set up in the past by the APC. Most of these, you know, efforts at, you know, fostering peace within the party did not exactly work out. So many centrifugal forces are claimed right now within the APC, pulling a different, you know, in different directions. So it is part of the challenge that he's having. He has not somehow been able to have, and I don't know whether, and I can't exactly say that it is not because he has the clouds, but it is about satiating the interests of all of these people, because miscepolity is a game of interest too, as well as, you know, it being a game of numbers. So how do you bring all the various interests, all the various egos, you know, into the mix? And then ultimately, at the end of the day, you come up with a formula that is acceptable to the vast majority of membership of the party. I think that has been a very big problem. And I'm not even sure that by 26th of March, when the convention holds, that all of these, you know, problems, you know, will be taken care of. And it's a very critical issue, a critical period for the APC. People do not, people tend to forget the fact that in the last election in 2019, that the APC actually did better than the PDP in terms of the number of states, the PDP actually did better than the APC, in terms of the new number of, the new states that were won under the PDP platform. And then the various, you know, elections at both, you know, senatorial and then, you know. But you can also say that most of, I mean, as much as the PDP did well, most of their governors have also defected back to the APC. So did they really do well? Maybe those people just wanted to win elections on the platform? Well, again, again, it's also part of the politics of 2023. The governors who defected, we know did not defect on the basis of any ideology. They don't believe in ideology. And that's why it is, they find comfort with each other. You display somebody at the PDP, goes to APC, displays them, it goes back to the PDP. And so it's a game of musical chairs, you know. And so it was based on the tentative promise that some of these governors were given at a particular point in time. But even beyond that, there is no, nobody can say for sure, they are not going to have a lot of party big weeks, leaving the APC for the PDP if they do not handle the present crisis properly, especially after the conversion. So, you know, they are all on sleepless, on sleepless nights. Okay. Let me come back to you, Mr. Showmey. Let's talk about the adgrieved governors, the governors who feel like they have been snubbed, just as I said in the beginning. How does the party even begin to deal with that? I mean, governors, whether past or present, I mean, we've also seen the class of 1999 governors also trying to raise their heads within parties. And I'm talking about both political parties. But within the APC, seeing what's happened in AKT states, seeing what's happened in Oshun state, what's going to give in order to deal with the governors, whether they be the class of 1999, or the present governors? Well, of course, we are talking about very powerful people within the within the APC. And then I don't know how many of them are as powerful as the governors. Of course, don't forget that the influence that governors have overdelegates that come to the national convention. So you need to actually appease some of these governors, how they are going to be appeased, because you have all kinds of contended interests. So what I mean, and the danger of appeasing a particular governor is that in trying to assuage him and appeasing the basis of satiating his interest, you end up displacing some other people. So obviously, there has to be a way to bring all of them to the negotiating table. All of them with disparate interests and disparate views, and then get to hear from them. And then also emphasize the fact that the president has emphasized some months back that if they do not get their house in order, they are going to suffer very huge losses during the election. Perhaps it might be the fear of these losses, which will also affect their fortune that might get them to try to be reasonable and to try to work within the structure of the party, within the guidelines of the party. Obviously, they're going to put their cards on the table. They have to be able to express themselves and tell whoever is in charge what exactly their problem is. And then on the basis of that, you look at the aggregation of the different interests of all the contended governors, and then look for bottom lines, a minimum level of trying to satiate every single one, not all of them is going to have a negotiation. And the negotiation, you don't come with the desire or with the mindset of win-win, of picking everything. But it is all about all of us winning and then all of us losing if we have to. So the most able to give in order to get, that is the essence of a negotiation. And I think that that's right now that this is what the party needs. And then maybe the ultimate player, they'll be able to come up with a consensus. But again, even beyond that is the fact I would agree in your last discussion with Show Me. There are certain contended forces in this country that do not want certain politicians to emerge as president. They do not want politicians that are strong, that have strong way, that have character. I'm not talking about their moral disposition, because I don't exactly how much what the ethical or moral foundation of most of these politicians are. A lot of them are mercenaries. I mean, you just said that somebody achieved them of the party, accused them of being Yahoo Yahoo governors, and some of the governors, even some of the godfathers of these political parties also could be described as Yahoo Yahoo. Otherwise, the country will not be where it is. So what people have been doing all this while is to get access to political power and the basis of that, of their access to power, to be able to loot the treasury of their states and the treasury of the federal government. That is the primary motivation of a lot of these politicians that everyone wants to run for the presidency of this country. And if you look back, if you look back at the performances of some of these governments, if we had an enduring democracy, if we had during democracy with proper democratic institutions and proper anti-corruption watchdogs, a lot of the people that are contesting or that want to contest that are aspiring for the presidency of this country will be jailbirds at this particular point in time. So it says a lot about the nature and character of the Nigerian state, that all manners of people who have looted the treasures of their state and some factored the institutions of their states across the entire country are today also just to be able to have the opportunity to do the same thing at the federal level of the Nigerian situation. All right, let's try and see if we've gotten Mr. Showami back. Mr. Showami, can you hear me? I think that we're still having connections. Yes, I can hear you. Okay, you can hear me perfect. You've heard most of the things that Mr. Trude has said about the party. So I want to take you back. I remember last year when the APC was doing its re-registration for members of the political parties, we saw a lot of problems in states. I remember clearly what happened in Quara state. It was, I mean, it was a terrible situation. People were fighting and going at each other's throats. We also know that that issue within the states are still lingering. States, just a few APC states barely have problems, but almost every state in the APC has a pending issue. And then at some point the party, the CECPC said they were going around sending committees to address these issues. But then the states will still come out to say that no issues have been addressed so far. And until those issues are addressed, it might affect the Congresses which have mostly been paralleled for the past year. I'm calling states like Rivers. I'm talking about, I mean, even in Zamfara state, they still have issues. Quara state also is one of those states. We saw what happened between the former governor, Rebekah Shala, and of course, the sitting governor. We've also seen what's happening in Eqiti state. Even though seven members of the party have gone to court, the others have said, well, we'll see our swords and, you know, walk in the interest of the party. So looking at all of these teething problems, do you think that this zonal convention that the APC is going to be doing will help address those issues? And how will that determine the level of committedness or everybody coming together for the success of the general convention or the national convention in itself? Mr. Shalumi, can you hear me? What is going on? Even I'm sure there are these issues between sitting governors and past governors, except in the case of Zamfara and Rivers state. Those are two exceptions where they are not between the governor, the sitting governor, and the past governor. But in the case of other states, this will continue and you're likely going to see a realliance between political forces in the state. You are likely going to have some in APC who are dissatisfied, you know, trying to align with PDP. And also you find people within the PDP who are dissatisfied with the way the presidential candidates are also aligning with APC. So we're likely going to have these mixed march, you know, these twists, twisting and turnings, you know, by the two major political parties. APC certainly is right on stage currently. That's why we're looking at it. PDP is also in a very precarious situation when it comes to the issue of presidential candidate. But whether... Mr. Shalumi, I think we have lost you. Well, to wrap things up, I want to say thank you, unfortunately, because time is not on our side. To be able to show me who is a political affairs analyst and to Achike Tudde, who's also a political analyst. Thank you so much, gentlemen. The internet has not been so fair, but thank you for being part of the conversation. All right. Thank you. All right, we'll take a short break. And when we come back, we will be looking at the issue of the electoral act bill yet again, because the president is telling those mounting pressure on the president to sign the electoral act amendment bill that the right thing will be done within the law full-time. Stay tuned and come back on top.