 everybody tonight. We're debating how we should teach slavery to children. And we are starting right now with LP's opening statement. Thanks so much for being with us LP aka I hypocrite. The floor is all yours. Alright, thanks, James. Pleasure to be back here on modern day debate. And I didn't prepare this opening statement. I'm just gonna I'm just gonna spit from the heart. I want to start by saying that, you know, I wanted we had a bit of trouble titled titling the debate narrowing down the topic. I actually I hear myself hold on a sec. Fixed. Alright. I wanted to call this the white guilt debate. And to explain because I think that gets more to the heart of the issue of what we're really here to talk about. And I'll just briefly recap how we got here. So I follow a guy on Twitter beige frequency. He's a YouTuber. He makes good documentaries about comedians and stuff like that MMA stuff. And he put out a tweet, I'm just gonna read his tweet here word for word. He said, also, I'm gonna say it. What is so bad about critical race theory, even in the worst nightmares, it's kids being told that they should feel guilty about being white. Wow, that's so terrible. I wonder if anyone in America ever experienced anything worse than that. So I responded to him and I said, Well, you know, two wrongs don't make a righteous because something bad happened back then doesn't mean we need to like psychologically abuse children today, to which he replied, essentially, Oh, but there's all this like rape and torture and oppression. And I think the implication of what he is saying is that the American history is so objectively evil. On the part of white people that there's just no way that you can actually teach this to children without the white kids feeling guilty and ashamed. So then I told him, well, you should read this essay by Thomas Sowell called the real history of slavery. And he responded by kind of mocking me saying, Oh, yeah, I'm sure this one guy wrote a book that is better than this extremely well documented history of American period of American history. And this is where Robert kind of jumped into and was like, Oh, yeah, they're there. They have this myopic view. They're obsessed with this one book. I pity him and his small mind and this and that. So that's how we got to the debate. Now, the thing about this essay I recommended and clearly beige hasn't read it is that it has nothing to do with a downplaying the horrors of American slavery or the racism involved in that period. Rather what it is my phone sorry, put that away. Rather what it is is a more broad global view of the history. And when you look at that in this context, the context of white guilt, there's two key takeaways that you're going to get from reading it. The first is that slavery was basically a universal aspect of human history for like thousands of years. It happened in every civilization. And it was pretty bad everywhere. You can maybe argue that some places were more brutal and inhumane than others. But I don't think there's a lot of value in that slavery is always inhumane and wrong. But everybody engaged in it. And there's no reason to believe that there's anything uniquely pernicious or special about white people's role in this institution. That's the first takeaway. The second is that it was essentially white people to if we're going to use that kind of terminology or categorization, who were responsible for ridding the world of slavery. Of course, you can't completely rid the world of things like that is still there are still places where that's happening today. But there's no countries in the world where slavery is legal today. And if you think that's a good thing, you can thank a white person because they were the ones who went on the moral crusade at not small cost to deal with this issue. So I'll say on behalf of white people, you know, you're welcome and we're glad we could help. And that so those are the main two things that I'm curious how what Robert has to say about that. And then the third thing is I don't understand why people would have a bug up their ass about Thomas soul. This is one of the greatest, you know, conservative thinkers of our time. Well respected, historian, economist, cultural critic. So I'm curious to hear what the actual complaint is. Are these things I'm saying not true? Is there some kind of lying by omission happening here? I'll have to wait and see what what the issue is with Thomas soul, man, I greatly respect. That's basically it. Now I have also brought some evidence of how this is being taught to very young children. I've also got some academic things that in terms of like the validity of the construct of white guilt, but I don't know if those issues are even going to be contested. So I'll just leave it at that and throw it back to you and we can have a conversation about this. You got it and want to say thanks folks for being with us at your first time here at modern day debate. We're a neutral channel hosting debates on science, religion and politics. We hope you feel welcome no matter what walk of life you were from and want to encourage you to hit that subscribe button as we have many more juicy debates coming up. For example, the bottom right of your screen hunter Avalon returns to debate James Hake of the Hake report on gay adoption. So that should be a new and interesting topic. But with that, we're going to kick it over to Robert for his opening as well. And then we'll go into open conversation. Robert thrilled to have you as well. The floor is all yours. Thanks for having me. Well, I guess I'll start with one of the last things that you said because you you seem to express curiosity about it, even though it's my opening statement, I'll just sort of respond directly to one of the last things, which is what might be my problem with Thomas soul. Well, I remember, and I don't know how long he sort of been a like a fixture of the conservative movement, but one of my first sort of impressions of him was during the Bush era. And I originally started as someone who was, you know, very politically motivated by anti war. And that was sort of my main thing during that era. And I wasn't as focused on racial issues or, you know, how to teach slavery to children or issues like that. But one of the first things I picked up on from his writings was sort of this notion that the Islamic world was one of the, let's say one of the most egregious groups of people throughout history that held slaves. And, you know, I'm not going to necessarily debate on that subject exactly. But I remember sort of being provoked just sort of as like a lefty anti war person at that time thinking, you know, what is this guy's deal? Why is he sort of trying to push this, this narrative about the Islamic world, you know, simultaneously with the United States, essentially bombing the shit out of them. So I was curious about him from the Bush era, didn't really follow him, but saw his name come up kind of more in the Trump era. And oddly enough, he sort of popped up in my YouTube algorithm. I guess that's what happens when you start clicking on, you know, Ben Shapiro videos or Jordan Peterson videos, you eventually get around to one of Thomas Sowell videos. Or as it Thomas Sowell or Thomas Sowell, I think it's Sowell. So I'm going to say that unless someone wants to correct me. But one of the first videos that I saw of him on YouTube was, in my opinion, designed to downplay the egregiousness or the horrors of specifically American slavery. And when I say that, I mean that even though I agree with you, I on some level he is trying to broaden the frame. He's trying to widen the scope of, you know, what is this discussion about slavery? Let's talk about slavery all throughout history, slavery done by people who are non white, for example. And one of the things that I find interesting about that is that, in essence, he is downplaying American slavery by trying to act as if in comparison to all these other forms of slavery, it's really not that bad. And I do, I'm not saying anybody here holds these views of any kind, but it does remind me of, you know, a similar thing where people try to do with like downplaying the Holocaust. Now you can't necessarily make the argument that someone downplaying the Holocaust is a straight up Holocaust denier. But the I think that that sort of the action is meant to achieve a similar end. It is meant what Thomas old does, and he does it very well. And I, and I haven't I don't know if I read the exact essay you're talking about I, I have read part of his book about slavery. And I find it very interesting how many different, you know, historical examples he comes up with to try to make it seem as if American slavery is overshadowed by, you know, Chinese slavery, Egyptian slavery, Indian slavery. But I do notice that he's very vague with some of the specific facts. So one thing I'll point you, you know, before we move on to this topic of guilt is just this idea that, you know, the slaves that were here in the United States were basically almost like an imported product, imported over many, many miles over very difficult, long journeys where many people died and got horribly ill in a way that if you really do think about how, you know, how that was happening as late as like the, you know, early 1800s, it is pretty egregious, even in comparison to other types of slavery all throughout world history. In terms of the industriousness of getting that many Africans to be basically stolen and imported to the United States is is unique in the history of overall slavery. So I think that's something Thomas so well misses. And I think he deliberately omits things like just that specifically, to make it appear that this was, you know, relatively normal. And in the larger scheme of things, it wasn't that bad. And what I have to say on the idea of guilt, I mean, I grew up in elementary school, public school, learning very basic, vague sort of overview of Martin Luther King, we didn't learn that he was, you know, turning against poverty or the Vietnam War or things like that. But I don't, you know, this idea of feeling guilty. I mean, I guess my perspective on it is, I do, maybe I have some issue with the term white guilt. I think it should be almost more like American guilt, a collective guilt that Americans should at least feel to some extent of what our history is, and how we don't want to do, you know, act that way anymore. Now, the problem is, in a lot of ways, Americans still live in a lie. You know, for example, I'm, you know, very much on the left anti war, a lot of people in the anti war movement still think that something like the bombing of Hiroshima Nagasaki is okay, and it's not a war crime. So there's a lot of I mean, I think Americans should feel guilty over that I think Americans should feel guilty over and turning the Japanese. So, you know, just to give you some insight into how I think about what kind of guilt we should feel, or, you know, maybe we could argue about how much guilt one should feel. So that's fine. I'm done. I'm sorry. I probably went a little over time there. No worries. And I want to let you know, folks, we are very excited to let you know our guests are linked in the description. The guests are the lifeblood of the channel. Seriously, we really appreciate them. They're linked below and that includes if you're listening via the podcast, we put our guest links in the description box there as well. So if you want to hear more, you can but let's jump into the open conversation. Thanks so much gentlemen. The floor is all yours. Can I can I respond to that? Yeah. All right. So when you you're talking about the soul during the Bush era, and I looked up when this book Black, Red, Nex and White Liberals was written, it was written in 2005. And in this book, this is what contains the essay, the real history of slavery. He does talk a lot about what happened in the Arab slave trade. Also, just the slave slavery in Africa Northern Africa, as well. So it sounds like maybe that is what you read. But at the same time, if you read it, you either didn't read it carefully, or you glossed over some parts, because he goes into great detail about how and he's he explicitly states that more or that the slaves who went to the Middle East, not only was there more of them what went to across the Atlantic slave trade, but that they died at higher rates. They died at higher rates because they were marched across the desert. And they would often just die of thirst. And if they didn't have the strength to keep marching through the desert, they would just be left in the dust to die slowly run away. Again, I'm not trying to say like that's worse than drowning or whatever. But it's pretty brutal. Also, another aspect of the Middle Eastern slave trade that was sort of unique was the high demand for castrated slaves for Unix because they want they use them to guard the harems who the women in the harems were also slaves. There were sex slaves. But many of the men, mostly Africans, not only, but mostly Africans who were given this role, they were they'd be castrated. Many of them would die. Many like more than half of them would die. But it was still profitable to do that because they commanded a higher price if they were castrated. So that's something that's kind of unique to the Arab trade. But again, it's not about saying, oh, that's so bad. Therefore, American slavery is not so bad. You use the word downplay a couple of times in your opening that he's trying to downplay this like he like downplaying the Holocaust. So again, it's not about saying that what happened here isn't bad. This is an important distinction. It's about saying there was nothing specifically terrible about this compared to what was happening everywhere else in the world, including China and India, Europe, etc. So the question is, you know, if all civilizations engaged in slavery, why should Americans feel particularly bad about it when and especially when you bring in that second point, which you didn't address, which is that it was white people specifically who were the ones who said, you know, this whole like one human owning another, I don't think this is right. And then the more they thought about it, the more they said, actually, this is wrong and we need to put an end to it. And that that's also highly detailed in Sal's essay. So sorry, I never, I always say Sal, but I know that's wrong, but I just say it. I forgot to address the last thing you said. So the last thing you said is very interesting because my reading of history is that some of the most influential abolitionists originally were black. Now, I mean, or, you know, you say white people are the people who sort of are responsible for any slavery. Well, let's think of the context of the United States, black people were still not free. So really the only I mean, I guess it depends on what you mean by that. Like, are you saying that white people are the ones that had enough sort of political power and leverage to move the needle on that subject? Like, because I mean, there are a lot of people, a lot of black people, you know, including, you know, some people who used to be slaves, who became free before the Civil War, who became like very important abolitionist figures. So I guess I'm just not sure what you mean by white people are the ones who ended slavery. Are you saying like America, because America decided to collectively end slavery, that means that white people are responsible for it? That's not exactly what I'm saying, although that would that would counter your idea that Americans need to feel guilty about slavery. But no, I'm speaking more specifically to so, so yeah, obviously slaves generally don't want to be slaves. So but but it's like you said, the slaves don't didn't have institutional power, they didn't have influence. So in order for this institution to be torn down, it required people of status to turn against it and to speak out against it. So that did happen in America, it is but it especially happened in Britain. And in Britain, they didn't have as many slaves as America, but they did have slaves. So the the British government paid the slave owners to release the slaves, like they compensated them for their property at a significant percentage of the GDP when they decided to emancipate everybody. But they didn't stop there. They policed the coast, they policed the coasts of like Africa to stop other people from engaging in the slave trade. And there's a lot of like horrific anecdotes that come out of that because the other civilizations like the Ottoman Empire, they didn't want to stop slave trading even when the British were sending envoys saying, hey, this is wrong, you shouldn't be doing this. We've stopped doing it and you know, we're fine, look at us, you don't need this to run your your society. But other societies, they didn't want to stop. So the they started policing the coast, like sending out navy ships to arrest slavers. This is well documented. Horrific things happened. Again, I know you seem to get a little bit uncomfortable if we focus on Arabs, but there was a lot of Arab slavers and their stories of how when the British would send boats after them, they would slip the throats of the slaves and throw them overboard to drown so that they wouldn't get caught. So that's what I mean. And then eventually the French started joining in on this. The Americans later also started sending boats to patrol places. There was a lot of slavery in Brazil and so they would send them down the coast of South America as well to try to intercept the slave trades. And speaking of this is kind of like a side note or an interjection, but just back to your point about like all the slaves who were brought over the transatlantic, the transatlantic slavery database project estimates that about 10 to 12 million slaves were brought over the Atlantic Ocean. Of those 10 or so million, only about 500,000 were brought to the United States. Most, the vast majority of those slaves were brought to Brazil and the Caribbean. And many of the slave owners in the Caribbean were black. There was thousands of black commercial slave owners in America. Of course, there was native tribes who bought black slaves. So again, just to speak to the race thing again, there was there's no innocent races when it comes to slavery. So sorry, I know that's a little bit all over the place, but I just wanted to get that out. Well, I will answer one. You're right. It does that his book originally captured my attention because of the it was it had a focus on this idea of Arab or Muslim slavery. And because it was during the Bush era, yeah, it did make me uncomfortable. I will totally admit that. And part of the reason it did is because he belongs to the Hoover Institution. Now, the Hoover Institution is strangely, this is what's strange to me. So we have this perception now in the Trump era that there's sort of these liberal elites versus, you know, the right, right? Well, the Hoover Institution is a part of Stanford University, which is considered a very liberal university. There's a lot of liberal academics, neocons at this institution. It's the director now as Condoleezza Rice. The former director used to be George Schultz, Ronald Reagan, Secretary of State. So part of the reason it made me uncomfortable when I found out so well as part of the Hoover Institution is I personally see things like the Hoover Institution as an arm of the deep state or, you know, that might seem conspiratorial to people. But it, to me, it appeared that Thomas Sowell was basically playing into the war on terror by coming into the side to the culture war, sort of, you know, schema of sort of like right wing information. And that's what it appeared to me at the time. And frankly, I mean, I don't know if that just his, and I still think he is downplaying slavery. I'll argue for that in a second. But I think that what he did back then, to me, I mean, it seems a little bit suspicious. I don't know his full background, but I tend to get suspicious of people who are sort of carrying out what I would consider like a neoconservative agenda. Even if he might have been, let's just say he was doing it totally organically during the Bush era, it is a little bit convenient to me. And I, you know, could it just been a money grab on his part? But I don't know. So yeah, I'm throwing that out there. And I'm also, I mean, when it comes to Thomas Sowell downplaying slavery, I do think when you zoom out from something enough, and you just say, oh, I'm just putting something in context and showing you all the other history, there's a certain point where it does become clear that the reason you're doing it, that the function at serving is to downplay a certain thing. And I think that's hard. It's hard to make the case that that's not what he's doing. I mean, I understand what you're saying that he, you know, also talks about a trek through the desert. I mean, how long ago are we talking about? How let's talk about that. How long ago in history was that, you know, that event? Is that something that happened simultaneously with, you know, the last slave ships delivering slaves to the United States or? It happened not only simultaneously, but it continued happening after the British started policing and cracking down on that. It was the Arabs who they were cracking down on. Those they were the ones who they were trying to stop from engaging in mass slave trading. And and it, like I said, it went back. It goes back hundreds and hundreds of years. And there was there was also the North African slave trade, which was like the Barbary pirates who were Muslims. And they took a million European slaves back to, you know, Egypt and Tripoli, Morocco. So, you know, a million European slaves. That's not the same as 10 million Africans. But again, it gets a little bit gauche when you try to play the victim Olympics and be like, well, you guys took more slaves and you guys treated them worse than this and that again, you keep saying downplay. He's down playing and you're saying by, by like zooming out instead of like, talk, you know, we should just talk about how whites raped black women over and over and over, rape, rape, rape, murder, murder, murder. Otherwise, we're downplaying it. You can say that, but you're not giving me any kind of compelling argument about anything that happened in America that is particularly egregious compared to the rest of the world. So I'll say to you again, if if everyone did this and if everyone's guilty and if it's all in the past, then why don't we just fucking move on with our lives? You know what I mean? Why do we got to sit here and numerate, ruminate, ruminate? That's the word. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I know what you're saying. I mean, well, first of all, I don't, I don't think that that's how the way you described the others, the flip side of how you should teach slavery. That's not how I think it should be taught. So I think that, I mean, part of the reason I think it's important to reflect on our slavery and even teach it to children here, first and foremost is because I'm assuming you, I don't know for sure because we didn't talk about this beforehand, but I live in the United States. I grew up here and as someone who grows up in the United States, you know, taking the argument of if it's more egregious than other past examples or not, just being an American, I do think we should reflect on our past, you know, horrific behavior. I mean, that in it, I think that in and of itself is important. Now, what was more egregious about American slavery than other forms of slavery? I would say that, you know, another thing that makes it uniquely egregious is that America as a country was largely built off of a surplus of slavery, essentially from nothing, you know, except for some, you know, settlers. So I do think that that does make America special, if you want to use that word, that if you remove slavery from the equation, I do think it's hard to make the argument that America would have been as prosperous as it was, nearly as prosperous as it was. So in terms of the prosperity, the wealth that America accumulated and the essentially free labor it got, I think plays a very huge role in fundamentally and why America is the way it is in terms of its, you know, what I call prosperous, successful for being a young country. So maybe you don't think that that's bad, but I think it's hard to argue against that, that that makes America very unique in that sense. There aren't very many other countries you can point to where you're like, that country has only been around for, you know, a few hundred years, and man, they really, you know, got a leg up with all those slaves. And that, I think that in particular, you know, what other country besides America has done that? Okay, so it's really not hard to argue against. And before I give my rebuttal here, I just want to remind you that, like, you said that, oh, this book, whatever. And I said to you, you know, just by reading this book, I probably have a better understanding of slavery than you do, which you made fun of me for. Now, again, almost everything I'm using here is taken from the sole essay, The Real History of Slavery. Now, I've already told you, there was only about, it was actually less than 500,000 slaves brought to America, compared to like 5 million brought to Brazil and another 4 million in change brought to the Caribbean. If slavery equated to prosperity and wealth, we would expect Brazil to be the world's superpower, not America, not only that, but, you know, the North of America, where they didn't have so much slavery, was able to defeat the South where they had the slavery. Again, speaking to the fact that, like, just because you have slaves doesn't turn you into some kind of great, all-powerful, prosperous country. There were more slaves, there were more people enslaved in Africa, way by orders of magnitude, than were brought to America. There were more slaves brought to the Middle East than were brought to America. So I do find it fairly facile to reject the idea that America was built on slavery. America was built on, you know, the founding principles and just a lot of hard work by everyone. I mean, even previous to the founding, if you want to, you know, just talk about the larger North America, I mean, it, slavery was around for a lot longer than, you know, the 1776. So you know, if you want to say, if that, if we're arguing about when the United States started, how prosperous was it simply because of slavery, it's a little bit more complex. I mean, I do think that you can't remove the context of all the slavery that was around previous to that. I mean, and there's some shared responsibility if you want to, you know, include Britain in the mix and saying that they're also responsible. So I mean, I guess I'll say that there's, I mean, I don't, I don't know enough. Yeah, you're, I will concede that I do not know enough about this international slavery history that Thomas Sowell is trying to present in his essay. But I would, I would say that there's probably other historical context out there that doesn't line up with his that's pretty credible. I'll just say that that's probably the case. And I mean, Thomas Sowell, you know, he's a, he's a very conservative guy. So he's not like, I think to base your entire understanding of slavery history off of like a conservative author who works for like a conservative think tank is just a little myopic on your part. I mean, so I would just say like you, you don't, you seem like a smart guy. I mean, so like, you know, maybe increase your pool of information about, you know, if you, if you're really interested in the subject, I mean, like you can't possibly believe that Thomas Sowell's essay gave you like the red pill and all education on international slavery, right? I'm not saying that everything there is to possibly know is contained in this like 30 page essay. I'm saying if you could give this essay to every American and have them read it, it would do a lot to, to move us past this, this racial tension that we have in the country. Listen, man, if you have actual arguments and citations to point out where Sowell got things wrong or what he's missing, I'm all ears, but rambling about, you know, neocon, Hoover Institute, deep state dude, weed stuff and just calling him biased. These are not arguments. These are, these are ad-homs. This isn't convincing at all. And, you know, we don't need to like go back and forth on this forever. I kind of feel like vindicated and satisfied with what I've heard already. I did want to add a couple of things just to like, just to go back to like the education, the pedagogy aspect of it. After we agree to this debate, there was a story published on the New York Post about a children's book called Our Skin That Was Being Distributed to School Libraries in the State of New York. This book is intended for two-year-old children or as young as two years old and it includes passages such as a long time ago, way before you were born, a group of white people made up an idea called race. They sorted people by skin color and said that white people were better, smarter, prettier, and that they deserved more than everybody else. Similarly, just a few weeks ago there was a story in Rochester about a teacher being under investigation for a lesson he did on slavery, where his mostly black students were given cotton and he told them they had to pick the seeds out of the cotton while he walked around the classroom saying things like don't look, don't make eye contact boy and stuff like this. So you have two sides of the coin here. You have white guilt on one side because any kid, if you take a young child and you read to them the passage I just gave you, they're gonna feel bad, they're gonna feel guilty. Children don't have the psychology or the understanding to deal with these kinds of things. This is just like psychological abuse to put this on kids. And then on the other side you have black children who are being made to feel like victims who are being told that the world hates them, that it's always hated them, and that the white man's keeping you down. This is like a terrible situation. There's also a video that was posted on Lives of TikTok a couple days ago, a kindergarten teacher talking about how they gave a lesson on white privilege and when, because it was on Zoom, because it was during the pandemic, some of the parents called in to complain and when some of the parents said, yeah, I don't like you treating my child differently just because they're white. And then on the video the teacher says, I'm like, was that hard for you? Very smug, very condescending. There's this mentality that white people need to atone. This has been happening for like 40, 50, 60 years we've been teaching history this way. People don't know the stuff that's in this essay. That's why I tell people to read it. People don't know about slavery in a broad sense historically. People don't know that white people went on a moral crusade to end slavery. I wish I could explain it better. I don't have the greatest memory I did try to reread the essay last night but I don't have a photographic memory so I can't get into the specific dates and names and places and stuff like that. I'd encourage everybody to read it for themselves but people just don't know this stuff and that's the problem as I see it. I mean you said again that white people led the crusade to end slavery. I don't understand I still don't understand what you mean by that. I mean I'll let you respond to that. I just think it's a very bizarre oversimplification to use considering how many black people were instrumental in the abolitionist movement. I mean so like I don't I just don't get why you keep repeating that. The other thing is I mean you also say that for 50, 60 years children have been learning about slavery somehow in a way that's wrong and that's something I wish we could touch on more because I don't like when I think about how I was thought about slavery in the 80s when I was growing up it was pretty tame and I think it was essentially like a pretty much a whitewash of what how bad slavery actually was. I mean I don't even remember learning about how reconstruction was fought at every turn by races and you know including Democrats like Andrew Johnson at the time who were essentially conspiring against reconstruction trying to prevent black people from being you know having the rights that they were given when you know after the Civil War and I didn't even learn about like the Jim Crow era until I was you know until I started getting to like politics as a you know college age person I didn't even go to like college in that sense so I don't I'm curious to hear from you what is what's so wrong about the way that that like this should say American public schools like the American public school curriculum and then the other thing you touched on and I feel like you know like I do see people doing this a lot where it's sort of like conflating together a lot of different things and saying like you mentioned there's this mentality that people want white children to feel guilty well you really haven't pointed to any type of like curriculum that's like being distributed in schools in mass if you had something like that you were reflecting on and wanted to discuss like here's a curriculum taught in these public schools that explicitly teaches white children to feel guilty about themselves I feel like that's something we could both sink our teeth into and argue about but like the only thing I mean the only things you're saying is there's like videos posted by teachers you know some really lib teachers acting you know like acting really ridiculous or you know some of these other things the book that you mentioned is the only thing that's really specific that you know I don't like is that you said it's meant for years to two years old enough is that something that the this is like being distributed to like you know because like preschools like how is this being distributed in school like that's information I I would need to follow up on so I think without some kind of actual public school curriculum that's explicitly making white children feel guilty or white people feel guilty this is the cut a lot of this just feels like shadow boxing and I do understand that there's like a lot of people talking about this mentality and there's all this discussion about CRT and things like that right now but I just feel like it doesn't necessarily match up with the reality in like public school curriculum so I mean but at the same time like if you want to talk about how alarming it is that certain teachers are acting really lib or you know saying things on these TikTok videos or whatever we could talk about that I just I'm not sure exactly how to talk about the idea of like the right level of how much guilt a child should have surrounding you know these horrible things America did in its past and I don't even like I said at the very beginning I don't even think that white children explicitly or only should feel guilt about that I think all American children on some level should have some a little bit of guilt or maybe at least reflect on you know call it guilt I don't know I mean that's another argument to make what level of guilt is reasonable and I feel like basically what you're saying is like zero guilt like no none is the is the level yeah American children should be patriotic they should love this country they should be happy to be in this country and I think you're being a little bit disingenuous when you take these racially charged issues like slavery the treatment of the Native Americans or the genocide of the Native Americans as people like to say you know the internment of the Japanese all these racially charged things and then act as if we're all Americans we're all in this together we all shoulder an equal burden and responsibility for this no it's white people who are blamed for all of these things now I grew up in Canada I do live in America now but I grew up in Canada in the 80s and 90s that's where I was educated and we learned not only about slavery not only about the poor treatment of Native Americans but also the civil rights era and so I'm surprised to hear you say you didn't learn about that in America I'm really surprised to hear that because we were learning that in Canada back in the 80s and I'm not surprised to hear you say that all of the civil rights leaders were black because that's what you learn in school you learn about Rosa Parks you learn about Martin Luther King you learn about Harriet Tubman you know you're basically you're left with an impression that black people ended slavery through their activism and their resistance that's the oversimplification and then like I said all this other stuff you don't learn you don't learn that everybody had slaves you don't learn that black people own slaves that there's slaves in Africa yeah I don't even repeat myself but so it is a narrowly constructed version of history that does have you would assume people would feel guilty and you would assume that white people specifically would because they're the ones who are put as responsible for all of these things happening all these bad things so it started in the 80s and 90s because that's the way I was taught I was taught with that kind of look I don't think it was like psychotic that people did that I think it was well intentioned but misguided I think the idea was these things are terrible slavery is bad racism is bad we don't want history to repeat itself and so we're going to teach this in a way that makes everybody understand just how oh so terrible and bad it is but the unintended consequence of that is that you ended up basically making it seem like one race is worse than the others and more guilty than the others and so now you have like this feedback loop where the people who grew up learning that in the 80s now they're the ones teaching in the schools and it's gotten more escalated it's gotten more intense I don't I didn't come here with a bunch of like official curriculums or how they laid out we just we know that what I'm saying is true because all the stuff that I'm pointing to people don't know about it if you want to know what people learn in school you can go ask them on the street they don't know about the Arab slave trade they don't know about the Barbie prior slave trade they don't know that out of the 10 million slaves brought across the Atlantic the vast majority were not taken to the unit people don't know this stuff so that's how you know it's not being taught in school while whether or not it should be taught in school is is somewhat debatable like how detail and specific you have to get about everything as far as the the children's book I mentioned here in the New York Post article it says that the book aimed at those ages two to five has been distributed to at least one Manhattan Kindergarten one on Staten Island as well as a Brooklyn school and appears to be part of the Department of Education's new universal mosaic curriculum the Department of Education announced the plan under former Mayor de Blasio to standardize instructional materials and better reflect the system's demographics it is to begin in 2023 so you know this passage from this book about how white people invented racism because they want they thought they were better than everybody and they wanted to have more than everybody the fuck are we putting this to giving this to children for it's literally insane it's it's literally mental man it's evil it's ontologically evil and I sleep like a baby at night knowing I'm fighting against this stuff I mean I could see I'm trying to get into your shoes and understand what you know what it is that's so provocative and I guess like if I'm trying to like make you not worry as much about this stuff it would be like you know this is like one book I mean I guess this is this is what I I wonder sometimes with people who have your point of view is it like you're almost like thinking if like do you feel like there's sort of an army about to sort of like come over the hill to like indoctrinate all the children in American public schools to feel this deep sense of white guilt or is it sort of like you know this is the you're worried that this is the future at some point and you're trying to like catch these really extreme you know more extreme examples as they're sort of coming through because I as I'm talking to you I'm not sure if you think that this is like the norm now in American public schools or if this is like kind of a little bit of an exception and you know that's that's not happening everywhere so I'm just curious like what how you feel about that it's not coming down the piker over the hill it's already here it's already happening and it's been happening for decades like I said it's just so innocuous and not innocuous but it seems innocuous that that's what makes it so insidious is that people that on the surface a lot of this stuff doesn't look that bad but you have to look at the effects of it um I lost what I was going to say so the way we teach it nah I lost it I don't know but yeah it's already here it's already happening okay well I mean that oh sorry I got it sorry I've been a little bit under the weather and I don't think I'm getting dementia or something but I remember what I was going to say so if you look up white guilt on google scholar there are like pages and pages dozens and dozens of published articles and scientific journals dealing with the concept of white guilt so that's not like hypothetical that this phenomenon exists we can argue all day about where is it coming from is it coming from the schools is it coming from the teachers are white people just naturally prone to guilt because they're so evil we can argue about that but it's there it's there you can look it up on google scholar the articles by the way they don't talk about like oh we're psychologically abusing white people to make them guilty they talk about how like white guilt can be used to make people more positive towards affirmative action and more likely to be social justice activists like they talk about it like it's this force for good or they talk about it in a way that's like oh poor white people do you feel bad about all the evil stuff your ancestors did you can go look up the articles for yourself on google scholar so but like I said so that phenomenon exists you can sit there and deny that it's that the public schools bear a responsibility for the fact that it exists but what you haven't done is given me any compelling reason that white people should feel guilty you keep saying that you know you're kind of retreating from the Mott to the Bailey and saying oh well all Americans should feel bad about what happened and it's like you can say that that's not how it plays out in reality and the way it plays out is that white people feel bad and they shouldn't so there's obviously a problem somewhere okay well I'll address what you just said so yeah I mean even though that is my view that if that that Americans have a lot to feel guilty about let's just talk about specifically white children learning about the history of slavery because that was what we started with I think that the history of slavery at least in most public school I mean and I and I you know I don't have curriculum to pull up either to show you but my understanding is most public schools especially elementary schools do not teach much about the post-slavery era the struggles of black civil rights up until the Civil Rights Act you get sort of a snapshot portrait you know Martin Luther King it's almost like there's a missing time and in my understanding my memories of learning about not just slavery but the black experience in America so I mean I guess inherently you know I do think that you know a little get a little bit of guilt is probably a good thing to reflect on not making the same mistakes that were made in the past or also just having a greater understanding and context of how after slavery black people were not you know completely free and given equal rights to white people that they had the Jim Crow era is very complex reconstruction you know the fight against reconstruction is very complex and I mean I think just the fact that that's was pretty much omitted when I was growing up all that stuff basically says that you know the default is they don't they're trying to shield they're already trying to shield kids from feeling guilty by omitting aspects of American history including even history with slavery I mean I don't remember you know learning in school that George Washington may have pulled teeth from some of his own slaves to make a pair of expensive dentures out of I mean that's something that's largely been verified over time that he used human teeth some of them were from slaves so it's things like that that you know I mean is that going to make a kid feel guilty to know that the person he's taught is a hero George Washington had a denture made you know made out of human teeth some of them belonging to slaves I don't know but maybe that should maybe that should at least plant a seed in a child's mind that these American heroes are this patriotism that you seem to sort of hold so dear even though you you said you were born in Canada I mean is pretty phony and you know maybe children should not be worshiping the founding fathers and for a lot of different reasons other than they also were slave owners so I mean yeah well so you know this is a someone goes into this in his essay this like relativistic morality or anachronistic morality of looking back at people who were alive 400 years ago and judging them by today's standards as if you would would it be influenced by your environment if you were back there now I've never heard the thing about Washington like stealing teeth from his slaves to make his dentures I always heard the dentures were wooden maybe they were made from real human slave teeth that's the first I'm hearing about it I'll have to I'll have to look into it let you know even if even if it is true which I'm a little bit skeptical of but even if it is true George Washington is still a great man who who like irreversibly changed the course of history for the better I'm not going to judge him based off of something that happened something that you know you know it's a different time people viewed slaves as property it's not right it's not right that they did that but it's just the way things were back then but I lost it again yeah I guess you know this idea oh yeah I remember you seem invested in wanting to make it seem bad so that's why you bring up like the you know the teeth stealing thing it's like oh but this was so terrible it was so bad but when you when you hear about the Arab stuff it's like oh why are you bringing that up oh what it what is this you know oh you're trying to like push these neocon wars in Iraq or what so it's a bit you know it's a bit picking and choosing what atrocities you want to highlight which is kind of the core issue here in terms of how do we teach this to children if you pick and choose because of your own personal biases that you're going to wind up with these you know pathologized adults well I'll can I'll can see this all all I'd be okay with children in elementary school learning about forms of Arab slavery while they were also learning about how their parents tax dollars are paying for bombs that are killing you know several million Muslim people for the last 20 years I would be okay with that if they simultaneously learned about that maybe that would make them feel too guilty because that's something happening you know it's not didn't happen 200 years ago it happened not that long ago so I don't know I mean if you so like highlighting atrocities only you know omitting others I mean if we want to really shine a light on all the atrocities then we you know let's talk about all of them so that's sort of just like Trump since you're so anti-war you mean the guy fan even Trump fan the guy who who got peace in the Middle East the only American president who didn't start any new wars out of like the last four presidents that guy no I mean I could that's a whole other debate to have come on man Putin wouldn't have even gone into Ukraine if Trump was still in office you know that why because Trump's such a swing you think he just Putin was that's right he's he's a man who knows how to negotiate well I'll get you here then George Washington as much as you think he was a great man was very much pro-vax and in fact he actually threatened death on some of his own revolutionary war soldiers who refused what the fuck I hate George Washington now fuck George Washington smallpox everybody you got it this is a great opportunity to go into the Q and A if you guys are ready yeah I think we're winding down here for sure and folks want to say hey if you love juicy debates like this and maybe you have friends who also are kind of sick like you and like me and they love these kinds of debates hit that share button and get the word out for us as we host controversial topics and controversial people such as I hypocrite so that sometimes I worry what's with the far right thing in the thumbnail I put it to be fair I called Robert you didn't try to do me dirty James I called Robert was far left I thought I was like is this offensive I don't because I thought I was like you know it's not inherently wrong to be far right or far left to me at least but nonetheless we hope I'd rather be far right than far wrong so juicy but I've got to tell you folks I worry because we do host these controversial people or topics I worry sometimes that YouTube may not promote us as much because they might see us as kind of a black sheep channel my point is help us get the word out good old fashioned sharing really does help us grow and we appreciate your support that way this first question coming in from Contrarian 420 says has the panel watched Professor Tony Martin's lectures on slavery if not you really should there are players in this history who refuse to take responsibility I haven't but I'll check it out was it Tony Martin's is that what he said I don't even know who that is I hope it's not from like the Hudson Institute or something I don't know but it was Tony Dr. Tony Martin this one coming in check it out Joshua Larson says the best way to learn is by experience I don't know what that was from but Samar Rao says saw a pretty convincing historical argument that the higher ups during the U.S. Civil War were primarily concerned with slavery while the rank and file were mostly concerned with states rights thoughts I would say that's pretty accurate I mean there was a lot of virtue signaling going and maybe this is one in one area I and I would agree is that you know a lot of the a lot of the abolitionists who were around during the Civil War I think had the other alternate agenda of also just wanting to destroy the South and consolidate power I mean I think that that's the more Civil War history you learn the more obvious it gets that it wasn't yeah the idea that it was all you know this heroic you know end to slavery is not is not necessarily true I mean even Abraham Lincoln Andrew Johnson as I was saying earlier fought you know secretly fought against reconstruction which is sort of supposed to be you know the way to give black people equal rights so yeah I'll pass it down on that it rings true with me I'm really not an expert in the Civil War stuff like I hear the arguments that it wasn't about slavery and it's not it's not something I've done a lot of research so I don't have strong opinions on it you got it there's someone coming in from Hake of the Hake Report amazing he says and I'm gonna try to I think this is what he means but I'll read it verbatim I think he's saying America has helped blacks and let's see I'll just leave it at that because I uh he says America built blacks and I think what he's saying is like America helps support or like help the black community overall I would guess you maybe disagree with this Robert I'll let you speak for yourself I mean I yeah I like yeah that's a hard one to answer I mean I mean they they hurt I get and then like try to help by you know doing things to lift them up later on with like public you know certain kinds of policies and things but it's yeah it's a very complex portrait so I wouldn't say that helps is the right word to use you got it this one coming in from do appreciate your question as well Jer Creason says who or why downplay 500,000 whites worked to death in chains not sure what they're referring to I think this is me I don't I'm not sure either I know well LP I know you mentioned like slavery other examples of slavery besides the transatlantic and I don't know if they mean like the Barbary Pirates I don't know if they enslaved whites or if it was I honestly don't know so I'm not trying to the Barbary Pirates did enslave a million whites like I did and like through most of history people were enslaving their own race so there's a lot of slavery in Europe where it was you know white people enslaving other white people look at it that way right they had like different nationalities or whatever but I it sounds like he's referring to some specific tragedy or atrocity but I'm not familiar thoughts Robert uh no I don't know what he's referring to but I mean I do think that there's one of the things that Thomas Soul I didn't see him touch on this and maybe I have seen something he's written it where he did but this idea that sort of you know black slavery in America was not as bad or was similar to all these other examples of slavery I mean there were different you know slaves throughout history that actually had like a lot more rights if you want to look at the spectrum of whatever you could call civil rights for a slave class was compared to black slaves in the United States I mean you know so I think there's a lot more nuance to probably what what that actual portrait is and I you know I'll I'm definitely going to do more research on it so that you know I could have so I can have something other than soul to lean on when it comes to that history you got it this one coming in from do appreciate it is this from James of the Hague Report he says quote reconstruction unquote was oppressive to the south I think that's for you Robert I think he disagrees well that I mean well I mean yeah I mean I'm sure from the south's perspective they would have seen it that way and a lot of you know southern sympathizers did because it essentially it made them have to completely dismantle their entire systems surrounding slaves I mean so there yeah there I mean so I like the idea and also but I mean that's also a little bit weird for someone to say because in essence what it was on its face was trying to integrate black people into society as free people so letting them hold elected office for example is something that was part of like the the whole reconstruction effort I don't see however that threatens the south I mean unless you're you mean that like people couldn't handle it on a psychological level to see a black person holding office you've got it and thank you very much for your question this one coming in from sunflowers says Rob in 2017 students at evergreen college Kent what was the name of the professor from there he's got the dark horse podcast Brett Weinstein's college through a cup or a coup in which they held white students and staff hostage while shouting demands what are your thoughts on that oh man I got I gotta put a tinfoil hat on with that one I watched a fucking epically long great documentary that someone made on that whole ordeal that was like 10 hours long on YouTube I forgot that guy's name um is it Benjamin Boyce it might be it was like and he I think he went to evergreen and it was I mean as someone who's on the left like that was some crazy shit like I was I was like damn like what the hell was that and at the end of it honestly I'm like the administration of that college was pulling some shenanigans because they like it basically let these protesters just like control them and like take over the school for like months on it it was weird it's a weird situation so like I don't know that to me was as an especially bizarre situation I don't even think that fits in the mold of like even like an crazy antifa action or something like that like it's a totally odd situation so I recommend people watch that doc I don't think it was that especially strange it was just a little bit more extreme but you see similar things happening in higher institutions all over America I mean where the CRT stuff gets absolutely crazy is once you get into college and looking at what they teach in college watching just watching videos of the protests that happen on college campuses and stuff like that I mean it's mental you got it there's one coming in from Hague of the Hague Report says oh gosh I don't know if I can read read it there are is you know I could say it wait I'll tell you the other last night the other two nights ago someone said T-Jump they said T-Jump was arguing that racism isn't real I said no it wasn't T-Jump it was it was actually his opponent mango tea who happens to be black and I was okay with it if mango wants to argue that but I feel like if I have a white person who says that if they make mango's case I can't read it I have to worry about YouTube TOS I will say he did he did say this though this is he's well let me let me put it this way he's saying that oftentimes people call things racism with very little evidence that there's actual racism going on and he says the reason is to smear whites and to basically try to take control or overpower people socially speaking yeah a lot of this is just about extracting resources from white people that's where the like that's really like a big driving factor behind the white kill and stuff like that now I will say racism isn't real but that's a whole y'all aren't ready for that conversation but you can you can watch Jesse Lee Peterson because he'll he'll school you on that juicy amazing D Bedro let me know if I pronounce it right says little kids are sitting in a circle on a rug in school learning letters and numbers that's it this is all nonsense fear mongering stop it feeling it's for you LP oh wait am I fear mongering I think they're saying I I think that they're saying you know LP you're trying to make it out to be like the crt craziness but in reality kids are really just learning what they've always learned letters and numbers and things like that no kids are being told that if they have white skin that they're they get unfair privileges and that if they have black skin they're going to get treated like crap that's not good you got it and thank you very much for your question by the way Samar Rao said do you read questions from the regular chat too yeah we absolutely do and so if you want to tag me at modern a debate in the live chat we read super chats first but we'll actually read non superchats as well assuming that we have the time so we've got another 20 minutes and then we've got to wrap up this one coming in from Hague says the quote unquote civil rights movement was actually bad in its effects for black people and the U.S. as a whole he doesn't say why so again this is something I learned from watching soul I mean this is why I respect the man so much because I learned a lot of things and one of the things you learn if you if you watch some of these these Hoover Institute interviews on YouTube that blacks you know they had much higher marriage rates much higher rates of children being born in wedlock before the civil rights movement this one coming in from do appreciate your question Hague strikes again and says slavery okay I just can't he says abortion is wrong he I'll read part of it and then the Herman Cain Awards responds I think to Hague and says abortion doesn't exist it's just individuals making individual choices according to Hague's logic then Hague responds saying pre quote unquote civil rights blacks actually had family but now they don't oh okay so I think that's what you were getting at LP I mean I have heard this this framing repeatedly from conservatives and I mean I just don't see how that makes the civil rights act bad I mean it if there's I don't think that's what we're saying I mean whatever someone said that earlier one of the commenters said that earlier was going back to that but like it is I mean like I could see there I mean I have heard more complex like conservative arguments about like welfare and the black family unit and things welfare is bad but just straight up saying that it's like we shouldn't have done the civil rights act because there's something that happened to like the black family after it's things like a pretty oversimplified framing so yeah yeah I wouldn't say that either you got it and thanks very much for your question this one coming in from none other than Arcade Outpost who says hyper focus on slavery is the first chain in a progressing link in academia that ends in a defense for crime being overrepresented in certain demographics yeah I mean the way it really ends is with a guy who should be in jail getting out on bail and then driving his SUV into a children's parade of white people that's where that's like the end game of all this stuff he's absolutely right thoughts Robert I mean I don't know what to say that last part but like the the thing about the just that this is some kind of you know being I guess I'll just say fundamentally I don't understand the idea of why people are so sensitive it just seems to me to be this like overly sensitive attitude toward just learning about slavery that somehow conservatives are the real snowflakes here we go just just the why do you not want to learn about history if you want to learn about all types of atrocities that's totally fair game but like why not why shy away from learning about the atrocities of slavery just on a fundamental level I mean you got it and thank you very much for your question want to remind you folks our guests are linked in the description the Herman Cain awards says to the panel why do you think conservatives were so apt to want to keep slavery and progress progressives were so apt to get rid of it wait what did he just say conservatives wanted to keep slavery the push to end slavery came from Christian conservatives the people who you would call far right now these are the people who took moral issue with slavery and started to rail against it it was conservative Christian people this one coming in from arcade outpost says Waukesha was a real world and result of this academic chain namely the chain that they said before the hyper focus on slavery and it I think they're saying roughly speaking being a distractor from crying being over represented in certain groups they said Waukesha was a real world end result of this academic chain due to early release policies made on historical racism ideology 100% correct I mean my my perception of that was is that a lot of these DA's around the country are becoming it's not racially motivated why they're becoming like more soft on certain kinds of crime or removing bail amounts so like I mean I just don't see that those two fundamentally linked together like this you know it is it absolutely is linked to race and white guilt and whatever you know we need a there's like there's another side to that it's like black pity or something like you know what I mean the other side of the white guilt which is like oh black people commit a lot of crime but it's because of racism systemic racism so that's why we got to be lighter on crime and have restorative justice or it's absolutely racial in nature this one coming in from Hank says anti-discrimination laws feed suspicion and division I don't exactly know like what he's getting at I'll give you if you want to hash it out I have a crit do you know what it might be a haker do you mean something like if there's anti-discrimination laws in terms of like old school quotas can you say again I didn't catch I didn't catch what it was he said anti-discrimination laws and so I think of like 64 civil rights act so they say he says they feed suspicion and division and the only thing suspicion made me think like are you talking about people thinking that people might have gotten certain positions because of their demographic background rather than their competencies so affirmative action does cause that kind of thing as far as like the like the concept of protected classes I'm not a big fan but I'm not diametrically opposed either it's there there are problems with it but the the problems of not having that might be worse so it's you know I don't know well this I mean then there's also I mean if the if the person is talking about anti-discrimination laws that are like currently in effect I mean maybe he's making an argument against the idea of like hate speech laws that someone can get like a larger sentence or the crime could be you know considered greater for doing something you know like a racially motivated attack like assault or murder or but I mean it's interesting because like someone like Ron DeSantis is along with sort of a lot of these other conservative governors who have pushed what they call an anti-semitism discrimination laws and public institutions to combat what they claim as anti-semitism but when you actually read the laws it essentially makes it illegal to work at a public institution and get paid if you criticize the state of Israel so that's that's pretty fascinating I hate that shit too man that's something we could definitely bond over you see to say the least and this one coming in from appreciate your question Eld Elrondur one says Robert wouldn't you agree that we are hypersensitive regarding generalizing bad things of any other group other than whites yet ridicule mental harm against white people as white fragility I think they're saying like hey you know we can I think they're getting at like hey we can say that white people are fragile if they get bothered by certain things of CRT or whatever but they're saying but like if we generalize maybe like if we say a certain group likes a certain I don't know I don't want to like say it out loud so I think they're saying whites you can kind of beat on with generalizations a little bit you can get away with it more but with other demographic groups he's saying like don't you think people are a little bit hypersensitive yeah I mean I think the the premises talking about I mean yeah I've heard people come from this direction and I mean I think you know this is going to make me sound very generic lefty but like the idea of white supremacy as a as a general concept I mean I think needs to factor in here because like it is true that you know white people do hold most of the power in the United States and historically and they still do so I don't think that it's I mean I think I think maybe just on a fundamental level like I agree that it's not a good thing to teach a child or anybody that they're bad for being born a certain way like no matter what that circumstances so I mean but like I don't think it's going to harm anybody by like pointing out more that like you know I mean but I maybe in a weird bit away this guy is saying like I'm being unfair to white people by saying that they're overly sensitive to learning about slavery I'm not exactly sure what he's saying but I don't know if you want to comment on this I just wanted to respond there real quick I mean a country that is built and founded by white people is going to have historically and currently white people in power that's that's what what a white country is going to look like I wouldn't call that white supremacy in the same way I wouldn't go to Japan and be like damn y'all got Japanese supremacy up the wazoo over here that's a weird way of framing it and then you know about about what the super chatter was saying this speaks back to or it makes me think back to what I was saying about the education that I got as a youth and how it wasn't it was well-intentioned it wasn't like really pathologically like saying like white people are evil but I think part of the reason that it seemed okay on the surface is because we were taught about Martin Luther King we were taught about the idea of judging somebody based on the content of their character and not the color of their skin and we all said yeah that sounds pretty good that sounds fair let's do that let's do it the Martin Luther King way and now here we are 25 years later and it's not Martin Luther King it's white privilege white fragility blah blah blah blah blah just like the super chatter is saying so this is why we have to go back to the drawing board because things got off the tracks at some point you got it and this one coming in from do appreciate your question as well the Herman Cain award says will conservatives admit that they think the difference in race is genetic instead of always dancing around the topic I'm not conservative did he say race is genetic was that just the question or they said will conservatives admit they think that the difference in race is genetic I don't know what difference they mean yeah I'm a race realist so the short answer is yes gotcha this one from Hague says quote hate crimes are illusions and cries of racism exploded I'm guessing they mean when he says illusions I don't know I'm just trying to give my best at what I think he's saying I don't know if he's referring to like the hate hoaxes like juicy or if he's talking about something else seems like he's kind of talking about the maybe just the concept of like people like yeah like burning down mosque or synagogue or something I does it seems like he's talking about I mean it's like I always try to like avoid making any conclusions on when I see that stuff in the news after yeah a lot of that stuff has been like staged by someone who's like the other you know the other side of politics or you just never know you know until like all the facts come in so I've tried to like not even like retweet stuff like that until I you know at least like a week has passed or something you got it this one coming in from Chris G thanks for your superset chat says want to buy James's Beard Thickener is it soy based it is indeed soy based all of my products are Hague says since the quote civil rights movement unquote blacks and lives have become have begun crying quote unquote racism at the drop of a hat in slander and division has proliferated okay I think he's saying that like since the civil rights act of 64 now people call I think it's kind of like I said before he's saying people are jumping the gun on calling things racist too quickly I mean I don't think that the civil rights act I mean I was I was it wasn't alive back then but I mean I would say that that maybe more applies to like the very modern era that I is more concerned seemingly concerned about like rather than like the immediate aftermath of the civil rights act I mean just like I agree I agree with that at some time in like the 2000s late 2000s where we hit this exponential explosion of you know wokeness or whatever you want to call it you got it and thank you very much for your question coming in from the Herman Cain award says Hague says quote racism doesn't exist but also says quote anti-white hatred has never been worse juicy a little bit of rivalry you then chat there and want to go oh wait do we have one let me check if I got that I did get that one and then let me just check I've got any last ones want to remind you folks our guests are linked in the description and as I mentioned hey feel free to share this content as that really does help just classic word of mouth it really does help and we appreciate that support last one I think we've got them all cut up so I want to say thank you to our guests they are the lifeblood of the channel thank you Robert and LP it has been a true pleasure to have you guys with us tonight thanks yeah thanks for hosting appreciate it pleasure to be here 100% and so here he goes again Hague says yes Obama would have made race relations even worse or no no he said that Obama did make race relations worse prior to him coming into office I don't know how much responsibility I'd blame for him I think over the time period things did get worse I don't know specifically there's not a lot of things Obama did there's some things but I don't know whatever yeah I would say that it coming from the left side of the spectrum on this I felt like Obama was kind of talking down to black people a lot like he was he disappointed a lot of black people probably expected him to be a lot more you know trying to like move the needle in the direction of what how they wanted and I feel like he I feel like maybe he's just his mere existence maybe being the first black president maybe cause stuff but like I don't yeah I more or less agree that it was just probably other circumstances other than him but he was a really bad president but I don't know what he specifically did to inflame racial tensions in a way that's particularly egregious yeah you got it and want to say folks we do appreciate all of your questions so thank you guys for your support oh wait we got this one in the live chat Chris G says if Obama made race relations worse you think a white president would have advanced race race relations better? again I don't think Obama was particularly egregious I I think that he was just kind of there while this stuff was happening so I don't have a strong opinion on that you got it and want to say folks thanks so much to our guest they're linked in the description I'm going to be back in just a moment letting you know about juicy upcoming debates such as the one at the bottom right of your screen like as well as many others thanks for being with us tonight and I'll be back in just a moment but one last thanks to Robert and LP it's been a true pleasure to have you guys thanks a lot thank you my pleasure I'll be back in a moment folks stick around let me just adjust this screen I've got to tell you I am excited to tell you about some of the upcoming debates we have we do have some juicy ones you can see in the bottom right of your screen Vosch and Dr. Thomas Bogartis it is going to be a juicy one you don't want to miss it whether or not trans women are indeed women controversial to say the least so you don't want to miss that one and then let's see sorry Hank I saw you just said did a last minute super chat I can't read it because I don't want to take sides given that the speaker isn't here to address it but I do want to say my dear friends we really do appreciate your support of the channel and that's and hey we're at 110 likes which is epic we can easily get to 120 we only need 10 more to get to 120 that really does help so go ahead and hit that like button if you want to support the channel that helps us in terms of our engagement comments likes all of that it really does help as we do to be fair we get a lot of impressions from youtube and by impressions I mean youtube does recommend our videos a lot now I do encourage people I always say like hey like it really does help if you share because I do worry and maybe it's not yet because like I said we've got a pretty good amount of impressions but I do worry oftentimes around like his youtube eventually gonna kind of like shadow ban us I gotta be honest I don't have a reason to think they already have but I worry that given the topics especially we've had recently as well as some of the people we've hosted recently I'm kind of like we're walking the line in terms of terms of service and I want to say thank you guys for your support even just hanging out with us here you really do make the channel a more fun place in several ways one we want an eclectic community a mix of different people from different walks of life politically left politically right you name it and that's important to us so we do appreciate you you guys help make this kind of collage of this mosaic very beautiful of all these different people and it makes up this like beautiful you could say complex comprehensive community with different ideas and so I appreciate that but I want to say hi there in chat as well and Sayde Matish thanks for being with us Rob Banks glad you were with us as well Chris G good to see you it says with soy sprinkles we are all about the soy here that is so true and Lewis Joyston glad to have you with us let's see here Bandido Max glad you were here as well as my name my last name good to see you back Joshua Larson good to see you again Samar Rao says have you considered switching to a different platform we in the long run want to stay on YouTube because it's just great for you know they do market their there's you know their creators well we have for example like one of our videos alone has like four million impressions namely that means that YouTube has shown it to four million people and that's huge that helps us grow I think YouTube is the best way to start and then we do plan on once we have a little bit more time and energy we do want to expand onto these other platforms so I'm absolutely I've already created an odyssey platform I am on mines it's just been difficult for me to consistently get content up there so as of now we're on YouTube but we do want to indeed branch out we do have a podcast too did you guys not know this if you haven't already if you're like oh it's like really I mean I haven't even checked it out is it really there believe me it's really there if you open up your phone right now I can show you myself because I know a lot of you are watching even on your phone right how convenient it's in your hand already perhaps you can click on your favorite podcast app I just clicked on podcast addict I'm a boomer that's the podcast app I like and then you can just click on whatever you like or I should say if you haven't already searched for modern data bait you can search for us we're on every major podcast for real you will find us no matter what podcast you're using pod bod we're working to get on I will admit pod bod we still have to get on it's on my list of things to do but in terms of iTunes in terms of like Apple podcast what's the green one Spotify we are on all of them believe me Steven will good to see you it says right on modern data bait I appreciate that Steven and Willie pal says cool debate James I appreciate that and I forward it to the speakers as they really are they're the light blood of the channel we hope we treat them well and some yeah I've been thinking about like how can we encourage or like you could say support the speakers as best as possible I personally am biased but I think that modern data bait does the best job of treating speakers well and you're like well how James well some channels I'm disappointed to see this and you know I used to debate myself and there are even debates of me on on YouTube like a modern day debate but I've got to tell you one of the things that I notice and one of the things that I'm like eh come on channels you can do better than this is a lot of them they'll have people on as they're gassed in a debate but they won't link them at all and I'm kind of like eh seems kind of lazy like you won't even link your guests like they're the lifeblood of your channel at least temporarily that night if they're maybe they only host debates occasionally and so I'm thinking like but I think honestly a lot of them I know this is cynical not all not all not all not all but a lot of channels I seriously like they're happy to have the person on for content but then they honestly I think oftentimes they treat the person like crap and oftentimes the moderators will like jump in and take sides and I'm like which by the way is like wow do you think that's really convincing if one side wins or if they look more persuasive because the moderator jumped in and took their side because a lot of them are like james you got to jump in and it's your responsible if you look you know if a flat earth or if they're winning or like or if they look more persuasive you've got to jump in and like correct what they're saying and I'm like listen we leave it up to the other debater I don't care what topic it is it's up to the if the other debater is terrible which frankly some people on all sides all sides like it doesn't matter flat earth globe earth christian atheist and all sides have some pretty strong debaters but I'm gonna tell you it's sometimes it happens where I like the stereotype side that is kind of stereotyped as the favorite maybe doesn't do as well and some people like james you gotta jump in and set the record straight and I'm like I'm not doing that if your debater sucks that's your problem they've got to get better so that's the trick is it's a little bit like the wild west on modern day debate and that's what makes it fun and spontaneous though it's so oh gosh some of these channels are so boring some of these so called debate channels they're so controlled and overproduced in terms of like oh if it's not going our way you know I as the moderator all jump in and make sure that this person or this side wins and it's like okay wow that's like seems really fair and it's kind of like if you knew that the referees in a football game were purposely helping the other team it really undermines their victory like nobody takes the victory serious anymore and likewise but for debates honestly I think a lot of people are like they would rather have that they would honestly not all not all but some people would rather have the moderator jump in and save their side and then James you you go on the moderate or you get in there and you just and they would rather have again this is a small percentage of people so I think most of you maybe even all of you you're not like this but some people they would they really would they would like yeah I want the moderator to jump in and save the day save my person that is debating and I'm like that is so sad and it's not going to persuade anybody because the average person sees that and they're like uh the moderators clearly taking aside here so even whatever it is whatever side that happens to look like they won because of the moderator taking their side like people are going to really take it that seriously in fact they might even it might backfire because people might be like oh I was like huh that globe earth or needed help it looks like they were kind of not able to respond quickly on their feet and don't get me wrong I'm a globe earth or a glober myself but I am saying like there are I've got to tell you not all on all but some for example just you know a few globe earthers will sometimes say Jimmy you got to jump in and it was like oh my gosh such I hate to say it sheltered people that you know like they needed to be controlled but we like it where it's spontaneous anything can happen here that's what makes it fun and when we do have calm debates we like that too we're not against calm debates we let it happen naturally that's the trick we don't like force it into some sort of like okay you have to be really nice and you can't swear and you can't be too loud this isn't your grandma's debate channel as sideshow nav in the live chat might say Samar Rao says where what are your thoughts on Spotify it's been operating at a loss for a while will it collapse eventually or be acquired by another entity I don't know how big the losses are I given how big I think it is and given that Rogan's probably going to stay it's just it's a lot of trouble for Rogan to actually leave I think they'd have to be pretty brutal to him for him to leave I honestly like maybe they deserve to like collapse I don't know what they've done I frankly yeah I was like so I don't see it happening I don't know if they deserve I'm not saying that they deserve it or not but I frankly I don't know if it's going to happen maybe I'm wrong I mean I do think want to know what I think while we're on Twitch I hate to say this Brooke because we appreciate everything you do if you're in the Twitch chat I do think Twitch might be sold within the next few years Twitch has had getting a beating from YouTube is doing a great job of appropriating Twitch's assets or features to their own channel as an example I don't know if you guys notice this in the live chat if you click on you know go ahead and hover your cursor or even just if you're on your phone click the three dots that are just to the right of a person's name in the live chat so like I'm looking at Brooks Barrow's I can click you know I click those three dots I can say go to channel report I can click remove moderator you can usually I don't think I can do it here because I'm a what's the word I'm looking for I'm the channel like owner but you should they just released this you can now buy other people channel memberships so it's just like Twitch where on Twitch you know you have subscriptions where it's like you pay five bucks a month and then it's like ad free at that particular channel and it's like that on YouTube now you can not only on Twitch could you buy other people's subscriptions you could gift a subscription to other people but you can do that on YouTube now too so like let's say you're a member and you're like oh I want to see other people become members too you can click you know those three dots and at least I saw it last night when I was in a live stream I noticed it was on another channel like I said I don't think I can see it on my own channel but let's see here Matt Cero thanks for coming by glad to have you with us and let's see here Elrondr1 says so true of you pointing that out I could go on and on on the people who are let me use Cytonav says the speakers may be the lifeblood with you is the heart of the channel I appreciate that Bob it's always fun for me to do this and I honestly enjoy it it's a blast for me to do it and but I've got to say thanks for as well Elrondr says so true of you pointing that out yeah I mean a lot of people are like think about this folks and you can let me know if there are objections to this but first before I get to it I want to say hide more people in chat because I've been I got on a soap box but for so first I want to say huh Johnny thanks for your kind words says love the show James good to see you back in the saddle thanks so much I appreciate that that really does mean a lot brother Delling Conley says is there a prize maybe next time but I appreciate you asking and I don't prize for what I like oh for the debaters winning that's a juicy idea we we thought about like how can we do polls we might do polls more often and then let's see thanks for your kind words Mr. Anderson says modern day debate the best debate platform on this side of heaven I appreciate that Mr. Anderson that really does mean a lot and Chris G says I missed the meeting we got any dates for live stuff also hey did you guys know there is a Patreon for modern day debate it is true we do have a Patreon so if you like this channel if you want to support this channel we really do appreciate that is you can find our Patreon link in the description box and there are different perks I highly encourage you to check it out hey why not and Mr. Anderson says they took that away James oh they already took away the gifting memberships to people wow that was fast well I'm sure it'll be back they're probably just working out the bugs because they do have raids now you can do a raid on YouTube it's really complicated it takes a lot of time and it's just it's cumbersome nobody's gonna do it they made it just too difficult because they wanted to frankly they wanted to make sure nobody could do a hate raid and by in so doing so for example like basically you have to go into your settings and you have to like basically for me like as a YouTuber I have to go into my settings in the creator studio and I have to specifically type in or copy and paste in the links of the channels that I want to be allowed to raid me so that way like let's say I don't know whatever channel hates me let's say they want to do a hate raid on us and have all their people flood into our chat and talk smack is which by the way I like I don't care anyway like I'd be fine with that that was just why you two should give you the option it's like just just let me just be rated by anybody I like we can handle them like the barbarians like we're all right but man bear pig says I love modern day debate because you can get whatever you want all topics all kind of debaters dumpster fires and productive discourses don't change ps you're a good mod thanks for that man bear pig seriously that really does mean a lot and we really do try and we like the variety yeah that makes it fun like you don't know what you're gonna get it's spontaneous it's authentic it's not overly produced and Anton Gomez thanks for your kind words and your super chat says hello mr. modern day debates this channel is nice I appreciate that Anton seriously that really I appreciate your super chat and your kind words it really does mean a lot because like I love doing this I enjoy these aftershows getting to give updates letting you guys know what's going on and so yes it is cool though that they have gifted memberships or they had it and I'm guessing they're working out a bug and they'll bring it back to YouTube I did see it I think two one or two days ago they also have these raids I think you can still do the raids I think that yeah I can't for example like I think destiny streaming live right now I couldn't stream I could not raid Steven unless he said unless he entered me as one of the people that can raid him or if he's or if you're subscribed to them that also means that they'd be able to I don't know if he is subscribed to us but I would say this it is it's a way to cum or some nobody's gonna use it no youtubers will use it it's just a pain they should just have it be like in Twitch or you can just type in into the chat and you can raid whoever you want that's the way it should be I'm happy with whoever wants to raid us smash potatoes thanks for your kind words love your beard james I super appreciate what you built that means so much friends seriously I am pumped about this channel and we're just getting started for real the other day somebody said you know you hosted so-and-so and they're a bad person and so I'm not gonna come on Ronald Day debate and I'm like all right like it's okay if you don't want to come on I said but you know like things change and like this doesn't seem very professional on your part and when I said things change I mean we're just getting started we're a small channel at this point and the ironic thing is like you might be thinking oh james like and I'm grateful because 70,000 is way more than I ever imagined we'd get to in three years because we've been doing it almost four years now so three 3.5 years or so I am super grateful thank you guys for your support I can't say that enough you guys do really you guys help this channel more than you know here's another example because you think I'm just blowing smoke up your arses but uh is arse that is a slaying is that let me put this really quick I also I found out what metrosexual means today yeah yeah arse works okay so metrosexual is a heterosexual male who strives to look fashionable and stuff and I was like you know I thought it's like always you know I wear the what is it called the blazer which I kind of like wearing blazers but I at the same time it's so hot now especially at summertime I was like ah it's like you know it's looking like such a metrosexual so it's like very you know like they're very very rooted I was like it's like if you're if you're a metrosexual it's there's no judgment but I was like geez you know I uh I feel like frankly this is my more like natural like I don't so here's the thing I don't actually wear glasses I I normally wear these when we stream so you guys normally maybe remember like I usually wear glasses and there are a couple of reasons I don't anymore one is I'm getting on a later sleep schedule and all these do is they block blue light and that's good but like I'm like well I'm not going to sleep particularly soon anyway and so I'm kind of like eh I'm not as worried about it that way and then it's just hot so I'm like why wear the blazer and so anyway no more metrosexual James but anyway not blowing smoke up your arses here's how you help the channel I'm very serious about this the Q&A if you ask questions during the Q&A we need questions for a Q&A it won't work if people don't ask questions but so that's another way we do appreciate all your guys' help and we are pumped to get to 70,000 subs I meant to put out a thank you video but as you know my life has been unusually it's been it's been very different and I'm catching up on a lot of things I moved back to Colorado as I was in Wisconsin for about six weeks but I want to say we are so thankful that there is 70,000 subscribers but we are just getting started I'm very serious about that this summer I purposely have taken a shorter teaching load the reason being I want to put more into modern day debate we are going to go after a lot of big-name people that we have not had on before as well as some people that we've had on before but we haven't had on for a while so for example like Stephen Molyneux we'd like to have more Vosh and Destiny on we haven't had them on for a while we want to like I said mix it up so big names on the left big names on the right and then thank you for your kind words Samar Rao says can you tell us a little more about your PhD candidacy I'm thinking of pursuing one myself but not sure I have what it takes so I'm in my fourth year technically I'm not in the candidacy phase because the candidacy phase you have to you have to I'm close I'm like so close and I have maybe one or two more years until I'm officially Dr. James it could be one year like I could probably wrap it up that fast and but I at the same time if I want more papers to get published before I apply for teaching jobs I'm just going to take the sixth year because that it takes sometimes it takes a while to get papers through the peer review process and I've only got what have I got yeah we just had okay so I've got two peer reviewed publications and I need probably more like three to five so to be sure that I've got at least five I'm taking a little bit more time but long story short I would say if you really enjoy it then go for the PhD hear a couple reasons one it stretches you it challenges you and some people are like oh that doesn't sound good it's like a challenge and you know it's like it's hard it's like I like hard things like I want my life to be challenging in the sense of me being able to personally grow as a result of my PhD like I like that and so that's valuable to me but be sure you love it and be sure you appreciate a grind because it is a grind but like the PhD that I'm doing right now in some ways is the hardest thing I've ever done it is a really mentally grueling at least four years you'd have to be really fast to get it done in three that's just not the convention it's not even I mean four years used to be the convention and now basically five years is the convention in terms of how long it usually takes so I would say only if you really really enjoy it but you could always get a masters and see how you enjoy it especially if those credits might transfer because some credits might transfer and then it's kind of like hey you know yeah it takes a little bit more time compared to if you just got into the PhD right away but it lets you know like are you going to like this because grad programs are always going to require research it's very rare that they wouldn't and so if you want to get a taste for like doing a lot of research a masters program is oftentimes a good way to do that and it gives you a taste of it letting you know if you want to keep going or not frankly most people in my experience the people that I got a masters with so I got a masters in philosophy at Texas Tech I got a masters in general psychology at Stephen F. Austin and so most of the people that I went through those programs with to get the masters and this doesn't mean don't get the masters like but most of them were like okay I thought I wanted to get the PhD but after going through this masters program or even just a year going through the first year of this masters program nope I'm good I don't want any more school I'm done so that's just the truth and you know there's nothing wrong with that you know like if you don't want to do school like more power to you like I think one thing I don't like is sometimes people have an attitude of college everybody should go to college everybody everybody should and likewise on the opposite side you have people who are like college is a waste of time college is stupid it's a waste of money and I'm like well it's somewhere the the actual answer is it's not a one-size-fits-all it's in some ways if you want to become a medical doctor if you want to become a psychologist if you want to become a lawyer if you want it like there are many many jobs you're not going to do it unless you go to college and so for those people it's a good idea like if that's your dream if you want to be a pediatrician or any type of doctor go to college and I hope you enjoy it and have a good attitude about it but for a lot of people it's like I don't want to do a job that requires college education great don't go to college then it's not for you like that's cool too so I would say it really depends on what you want to do because I just sometimes I I'm not like the internet sometimes is just sometimes the way people state it it makes me think on both sides it's oftentimes stated as like this one-size-fits-all and I'm like no it's not but let me catch up on chat pardon my delay Samar Rao says what kind of qualifications do you need to come on to modern day debate as a debater you don't need to have like any sort of credentials in terms of college like you don't like nothing like that just so you know uh just so that's clear and then I would say we always require people to go on camera now that's one thing we do ask if people have prior debate experience if they don't like which I'm really uncomfortable with usually their first one is in a 2v2 a two tag team debate to two people against two other people and that gives us a feel for like how bad they are how good they are because if they look like a star and we're like wow like I did really well then great we can have them in a one by one one versus one if they suck like just to put it bluntly I'm not trying to be mean but you know like it's okay if you suck at things you just work at it and you get better but in the meantime until a person is better like there are a lot of things I suck at I'm not like hurt to say it like I'm not a good dancer I just don't care the idea here is if the person sucks at debating they can work on it and we can have them in a 1v1 eventually but for a while we're only we're only gonna have them in 2v2 but Nikki says God bless you and your family James modern day debate thank you for that Nikki sir you say I appreciate that that does it means more than you know Mr. Anderson says know they took away our ability to click a name and go to the channel oh I didn't know that maybe it's just that I only have that because I'm like the channel owner or something I don't know but let's see it's I had no idea I wonder if I'll have to do that on other channels let's see if I can do it let's see Hake says thanks to modern day debate Hake has been on hippie-dippy and the crucible etc that's right absolutely and those are yeah so let me know hey if you ever go on those feel free to I was gonna say this is what I want to do is let me know if you ever go on those I would be willing to retweet it like feel free to tag me or send me the tweet and I'll retweet it because I want to publicize or you know promote that as well and so totally let me know and Nikki says we love you James thank you for that Nikki and Willy Pal says modern day debate is I don't know oh it says oh amazing thanks for that Willy and Hake thanks for your super chat I appreciate that support man and then BLM like that let's see let's see says Hakester and compadres Hola Mamma Mia to you Mamma Mia that's right that's one of my favorites let's see Lux Strapentis says James censored all comments about his sexuality I'm yeah it's like I don't I don't have much to hide I'm a pretty like plain Jane type I'm an average Joe like heterosexual guy like pretty standard Willy Keenan says welcome back James nice to see you thanks for that I appreciate that and then let's see you do it who deleted your message about censoring the comments of my sexuality I was okay with that I wasn't bothered by that and then says Samar when a youtuber like James directs everyone watching V their stream into another person yeah that's what a rate is yeah we can take a live chat like let's say theoretically right now we were like destiny is streaming live we're gonna go I'm gonna take all of you who are in the live chat and all of a sudden just your page is gonna reload and you're gonna be in destiny all of us will be in destiny destiny's live chat so Anton says sucking at something is the first step of being kind of good at something I agree there's nothing wrong with sucking at things you have to be honest about like it's good to be honest about when you aren't good at things and you know what to improve on right and like you don't when I say sucking I don't mean to like beat anybody up so maybe you know some people that's like too blunt of like to how they put it but like it's just normal you start at things most people when you started things you're not good at them it's like that's all right you just learn truth snaps says is the debate over yes it is glad to see you truth snaps dark phantom glad you are here ours is Scottish thanks for letting me know that that you're right not irish and then luxer pentas says homosexual in all caps oh yeah I was like I mean I'm flattered I mean you know gay men usually have a great sense of style so thank you you know flattered that you say you don't think I'm gay but um yeah no I'm just I'm just straight I uh I've never been attracted to men now you know that if I if I was trying to think of what if what I'm about to say would be politically if it would be partisan I'll just leave it at that I'm not I'm I'm just straight but Samarao let's see Leon says what is it giga chat James I appreciate that Leon Matthew Culbertson Metro James lol thanks Matthew that's right that's right Metro James is done Anton Gomez says you already have 70,000 you're right and we appreciate it we are thankful and then BLM says I'm super cool so you're welcome for my subscription thank you for that BLM we BLM crooks is technically your name we appreciate you becoming a subscriber thanks for your support and we're I think you won't be disappointed we're planning a lot of juicy debates coming up we're excited about that and let's see heat shield says did you ever get in touch with Malinu about coming back no but I am he's on my list I just added him to my list today of people that I want to contact this month I've got about 10 people big name people like on the level of stuff in Malinu that I plan on contacting this month most of which we've never had on before we are going to go big this summer a lot of new big guests in panels and debates SpiritTobi says I'm very interested in you building this channel more very good to hear thanks for that SpiritTobi seriously that means a lot and it really does for real it really helps us a ton sharing the channel it really does just classic word of mouth because if I promote our content on Twitter people aren't as like it's not as compelling for people to think like oh okay let me check it out they're like well of course you're promoting your own stuff it's kind of like if it's a friend you know they'll always tell you that you look good or whatever like they won't tell you that you look bad or you know or bad in outfit or whatever like is but if you folks like if you share something with a friend and you're like hey this channel is like pretty fun I hang out here a lot they've got a lot of controversial debates that really does help us because it's third party testimony it's kind of it's got more credibility because you're just an independent third party who's saying that modern day debate is good it's not me tweeting about our debates and how people should watch them it's you you know if you're sharing about how people should check out modern day debate that helps so much so let's see my name my last name says I was offered masters but I didn't want the debt and my job does not need it yeah I say if you're job if you don't need it if you don't want to do it don't do it oftentimes not all masters some masters are paid for and some are not so if whoever it was that was asking about the phd there are masters out there so for example like my masters at Texas Tech in philosophy was paid for and so not all masters programs do that some do some don't just something to keep in mind and then BLM says I want to learn how to drop kick someone still we'll try to have a debate on that and then Nikki says took me five years James I can't remember what was it that took you five years Willie Powell says cool stuff James you're you have a very promising channel I appreciate that man that means a lot Steven Wilson is right on James I appreciate that thanks for that support seriously and then Lux Serpentis says philosophy quote unquote yet he mocks like I like are you talking about me why are you so salty but uh yeah I always wonder about like fake accounts and if they're you know like if there's trolls sometimes who you know like because I know like some of our usual haters you could say and I wonder like do they create like fake accounts and then they come in and just try to say you know let's see Lux Serpentis says I make more money than you okay good for you I'm like I'm happy for you you're a charmer and Samar Rouse says I really appreciate your perspective I graduated with my undergrad just a few days ago and I'm at a crossroads in my life that's cool oh yeah it maybe just think is uh but yeah Samar yeah like I said I think it's not a one-size-fits-all I think that so I think that Lux Serpentis might be angry now Lux Serpentis you can let me know if I'm wrong about this but my guess is you were maybe you were unhappy that I said that college can be a good thing I think it well for one thing remember even if you think that academia is biased and that it is brainwashing people which I don't even deny I think there are some ways in which academia has serious problems in terms of being biased and where it's just like like many like and so I'm not denying that but remember that you know if you go to college you can kind of be cautious about what you believe because I've got to tell you there's a lot of stuff like conventional stereotypes and things in academia that I hear or see and that I don't adopt myself like I'm just kind of like yeah I don't I don't buy that that just seems more like like there's not evidence now I'm not saying that about everything in academia because you know you got you sift through it but let's see Saichunaf says man if sucking at something is the first step to being great then I am most definitely on the right path you definitely are Bob and Joe Schwartz is Jay's do you ever fight it hard to stay neutral during a debate only once in a great while really rare Hague says some want to be great at things but should let go you got it yeah that's it that's true it you know you may want to let go of some things that you know you don't have to be good at everything like I I don't care that I'm not good at dancing Joel Houston says big energy James I appreciate that Joel is it Joel or Joel Joel Aaron Chance says modern day debate during the Colonies in slavery period oh okay sorry the the guests are already gone so I was guessing that as an older question that you put in Joe Schwartz says what is your favorite video game it's Zelda Ocarina of Time hands down I like Nintendo 64 games and I still play them sometimes seriously Mr. Anderson says I would so I love like Zelda Ocarina of Time Super Smash is good if it's playing with somebody else just like Mario Kart is what else is there what do I like to play by myself if I'm playing 64 I don't play too much by myself let's see Mario 64 I play sometimes Samar Rao says James have you ever gotten backlash at CSU from students admin about the things discussed for people you've hosted at modern day debate let's see yes there is a professor who tried to shut down modern day debate like she went to the chair of the department and she said you know this is not okay that he's doing this like you shouldn't be allowed to thanks for your super chat by the way I appreciate that Samar Rao thanks for your support they basically this professor is like hey you know James is you know I guess they tried to make me able to be a loose cannon and they my advisor told me that they just had a list a laundry list of things that they were unhappy with me about and I'm open to changing like I said I'm willing to meet with this professor if they want to like talk to me about what they think I can change I'm willing to hear them out hear them make their case doesn't mean I agree with everything but I have to at least be willing to hear a personnel right at least understand what they're saying that never happened and man I don't know if there have been others I know some others know of my channel I also wrote a book a long time ago that I would not recommend I think there are good things in it but it's like old and it's just I was like 29 when I wrote it and it's also got a ton of typos but they they didn't like that either it's called real masculinity and it was like 30 laws on like becoming like improving self-control improving like physically and dating and which and a lot of people you know some people like I think that the professor thought oh it's like a red pill book and I was like no it's not a red pill it's like in fact because I don't know if you guys know about me like I I am well I won't say that I don't want to be biased but I'll say this it wasn't a red pill book at all it was more like guys oftentimes do things in their dating lives that screw things up for them and they should just stop doing them sometimes like guys can be too like they text several times in a row before a girl responds and if it's like within the same five-minute span that's okay but if it's within like the same day and he sends three text messages like she's gonna like get turned off by that and that's just like I don't know how that's controversial or how I'm like bad for saying that and by the way it's probably also pretty obvious most men have figured that out by the time they're like I don't know probably way earlier than I did but the idea is just that that book I like I just triggered some people even though they haven't read it they hadn't even read it and they were like this is inappropriate I was like okay I guess it's inappropriate but so I'm being sarcastic it wasn't Nikki says took me five years to get my doctorate all in Texas good for you Nikki that's impressive that you did do that that's awesome let's see but yeah I would say when I say that academia is you know that it can be a good thing like I said I wouldn't agree with everything in academia it's like I and likewise I wouldn't recommend it for everybody do it if you enjoy it and yeah it's true be careful about what you believe like you know it's it's okay to be critical in academia too and and I'd encourage it let's see SpiritToby says James find some church of the flying spaghetti monster to debate people will be hilarious oh that's true yeah I forgot that existed that'd be juicy somebody in chat said they want to see a black Hebrew Israelite somebody I think it was Mr. Anderson we just has somebody reach out to us about that no joke so that probably will happen soon Anton says I have Ocarina of Time Stickers for WhatsApp that is based that is really cool yeah I'm a huge Ocarina fan it was so fun Steven Wilson self-published or it was just self-published on Amazon so like not like a fancy book deal or anything Lenio Barcelos thanks for being with us says James you should play some Sunday Night Mario Kart at the Geeks Plus Gamers Channel sometime that'd be dope oh that's kind of a need let me check this out I'm kind of like gamer channel let me type this I'm curious I'm like intrigued I'm like that's kind of a cool thing I'm curious about it let me type this in and see what it is oh no this is cool I've never seen this channel I like this this looks awesome Obi-Wan Kenobi I I'm a little bit nervous I love Ewan McGregor and I love Star Wars believe me nobody loves Star Wars more than me like I love Star Wars big time but I'm a little nervous that people are over hyping the Kenobi show that's coming up I don't know if it's going to be as good as people are expecting and I doubt that it's going to be because I just think I'm like yeah it's going to be good but I think a lot of people are really like they're anticipating that it is going to just be amazing and I'm like I don't think it's going to be amazing that would be good but I don't think it's going to be amazing and it's just it's hard it's not you know it's not easy to create amazing and uh you know like Book of Boba Fat like was it amazing quite I thought it was good I liked it I think I liked it more than most people for sure but you know I didn't think it was amazing and I just think too many people think Obi-Wan is going to be Samar Rao you're funny I got can you help me get a girlfriend I would say it's I I you know it's fun to be playful that's one thing I would recommend in dating is and I I need to work on this because I'm I'm more playful on this channel but in real life I'm sometimes very serious like like seriously it's a problem to where I try not to be too serious because sometimes sometimes I get myself to snap out of it but Aaron Chan or mango tea thanks for your super chat says what did you think of the debate I had with T jump it was controversial to say the least I haven't gotten to finish it yet what I saw of it was juicy and then I've got to say I don't know if we could have gotten away with that this is something it's controversial mango tea I don't if it was a white guy making the case that you made mango tea oh let me just reopen this two seconds my zoom I've got to go pretty quick I hadn't realized how long I've been here chatting in the after show but this is I just I love this this is fun is but I do have to go it's getting a little bit later here and I've got to do a few things before bed yet mango tea I don't know if a white person made your case do you think we would have bet would we have gotten in trouble I don't know like you tell me but Aaron Chan says modern day debate as an example of white blank views justified by Western European imperialism colonialism was Lord Cornwallis who said every native of Hindustan is I believe very corrupt I don't know what you're seeing I must have been for the debate and maybe you're watching it and it's delayed Brooks Barrow says Cosmic Saptic would be a great guest agreed and I am working on getting him on no joke we are going to invite him back on it's it would be a lot of fun so amazing let's see Darth Revan says with me right here James really fight me on that love of Star Wars buddy that's awesome that you love Star Wars I'm really glad to hear that and then I'm glad you're a Star Wars fan Bob I don't know if we talked about that before Hague says as black Hebrew Israelites go JLP debated Elder Rajwa Vegas those Israelites there seem very polite and professional not too hateful terms and not too unfriendly toward terms of service that's good to know yeah like we've hosted BHI before and there wasn't a problem so I'm looking forward to doing it again so juicy to say the least and but yeah I want to say thanks guys I should be going but I want to say thanks for all of your guys' support I really do appreciate it thank you guys I am excited about the future like seriously we've got some cool stuff happening we've got so many people to reach out to that I'm like optimistic we can get some of these people to come on that's going to be awesome because we're excited to get people for panels or debates we're going to start doing more panels political panels maybe religion panels but definitely political panels so we are excited about that you guys it's going to be a blast and I'm excited frankly I think we're going to take our channel in a slightly more political direction it's fun I enjoy it we will still do religion and science debates each of those still so just letting you but we will probably on average do more debates on politics it's always so hard to go I always say goodbye like 1800 times but I just enjoy this I enjoy this so much you guys I want to say thanks for everything I let's see I'm peeking around just to see if there are any messages about I liked this debate this is fun and then my dear friends what do you think of crypto juicy things have been going on I've got to go but I can't stop talking I enjoy this you guys I like getting your opinion and but let's see thanks Darth Revan appreciate that love you too and Darth Revan says in the in the love of Star Wars I recommend the new Jedi Order book series James Great Read that's a good idea and I am actually I've got to be honest I'm a rookie when it comes to the books so you do you have me there for sure I have not read a lot of Star Wars Saisho Nav says SW pick is Saisho Nav trying to offer photos of himself again in the live chat man he's just you got to keep an eye on that guy he shield says James just brought one of those fitted t-shirts that make your beard look bigger that might be Nikki says Cosmic Skeptic versus William Lane Craig they debated already did you know that it's at least on the column they did but yeah I'm still figuring out crypto too but anyway I love you guys thanks that'd be a fun you know if we get like Peter Schiff on for a debate on crypto that would be pretty cool but want to say thanks guys for all your support you guys series these always say it's hard to say goodbye and then Saisho Nav says if you buy me some I'll take it James we're writing crypto that's funny amazing but yeah thank you guys for your support thanks gross patat gross say potato let me know if I'm saying it right and oh yeah it's a Darth krait dark horse series was beautiful to read interesting I think I heard that this the Darth Vader comics were like really good because does it there's a dark Vader series I listened to the youtube channel stupendous wave sometimes and I listened to Star Wars theory so let's see Spirit Toby says crypto just passed the 10 year mark I didn't know that that's really interesting Christy says Saisho Nav is selling soy coin his new currency now that's pretty based in Redfield Oliver Catwell says I think that was me trying to ask Nav what his favorite Star Wars movie was oh okay but oh okay okay gotcha pics like what which would you pick as your favorite movie not like pictures okay gotcha but yeah no I know Saisho Nav is not a pervert I want to make that clear in the chat folks I tease him about being a pervert and trying to offer his photos to people but he doesn't do that he's he's a very honorable man so but yeah I just like to make fun it was Oliver Catwell who was offering photos of himself no it was but you guys I just enjoyed that's my love language is like teasing people I just enjoy it it's fun and let's see gross potato thanks for letting me know said it right the first time but yeah I gotta go it's getting late so I want to say thanks guys I love you this is always fun thanks guys for making this fun I enjoy you we're excited about the future as we are passionate about fulfilling the vision of providing a neutral platform so that everybody has their chance to make their case on a truly level playing field that's important to us and so we want to say thank you guys for your support of that vision thank you for joining the vision and we're excited that we've got a debate tomorrow night in fact and then another one Saturday I think I'm hosting tomorrow and then I think that tomorrow on Saturday Amy's hosting and then I'll be hosting more regularly though like this is going to be pretty regular for me doing about four probably four per week and so I love you guys thanks for all of your support and I'm excited to see you I think that'll be let me just double check yeah tomorrow night we've got one scheduled Friday the 13th so looking forward to seeing you guys then and then we've got next week or yeah next week we've got Hank versus Hunter Avalon on gay adoption that's going to be controversial to say the least we've got a lot of juicy ones coming up and oh yeah a lot in the work so thanks guys for your support and I will see you next time I love you keep submitting all the reasonable from the unreasonable we'll see you next time amazing isn't that amazing beta he's a beta male