 is i youth and politics uh on our discussion uh today we have a lot in stock for you including i e b c vacancies vacancies that have been declared in a gazette notice dated 14 of april 2021 about where the president uh said that he declared vacancies in the positions of four members of the independent electoral and boundaries commission now these four uh left office during the last electioneering period we're talking about vice chairperson consulate and kata we're talking about commissioners to migrate moachanya we're talking about paul kurgat and roslin akombi what next for i e b c this is the conversation we are going to have this morning on youth and politics i'm joined by evans amaru to my extreme left he is a youth leader karibu san evans thank you so much and thank you for finding time to join us this morning uh i'm also with kenedio dweyu who has been with us since the beginning since morning he is um uh an aspirant for the member of parliamentary seat at butula constituency karibu sana asanti san ya asanti sana the hashtag as always is one in the morning be part of this conversation as you give us your take in regards to the topics that we shall be discussing today at ram agugo at y254 channel on twitter and on facebook at y254 make sure that you give us a take as you continue this conversation uh shall sample or read a few of them later on my name is ram agugo if you just join us you in time for this conversation youth and politics starts now now we are looking at um the issues into gas let me let me start first of all with this process is it too late to uh we know start looking for commissioners considering the time that is left till next year for the elections let me start with you evans according to the krigula commission we can point out that there is an issue with time but uh on my opinion i believe that the president is just in the right track because ibc has been there it's only that some membership in terms of the name of commissioners have been missing the four of them so by announcing about the vacancies and the position to be filled i think we're just on track that's no problem yeah we are on track that's no problem uh ken would you think about this are we on track considering the time some between now and the 2022 polls uh i feel like we we take jokes too far sometimes i ask myself what stopped the president from announcing those vacancies 2018 when those people resigned why now you see at the end of the day ibc is a very critical critical aspect of our democratic system is actually the second one after the political parties now we are in a situation where it's less than 18 months to an election and the process might take more than six more than six months so we are likely to enter the final year the of the to the election without a well constituted ibc and lest we forget the court indicted the entire ibc commission someone who has been indicted by a court why would why would we why would they even be in office at this time because the moment you preside overflowed process processes don't run themselves they are run by people so i think for me there is something that was supposed to have happened in 2018 or 2019 so that we can give these people ammo time to acclimatize give these people ammo time to understand the processes it's far much easier so that that is what professionalism calls for organization timely organization so that the structures if there any changes if there are issues with the secretariat they're able to put everything in order so you'd feel like it should have been announced in 2018 the day that those commissioners the three in fact it's supposed to be when roslina kumbe resigned immediately when someone resigns seek a replacement because they're supposed to be there there's a reason why the commissioners supposed to be seven because seven heads need to come together to do that well the same will happen with the other ones let me for those who are watching let me just give us a background in regards to this just as a reminder the vice chairperson that is consolata kata uh commissioners margaret moachanyu and uh Paul krugat resigned in a joint press conference at anaerobic hotel on april 16th 2018 now they cited lack of confidence in the commission chairperson that is wa Fulache Bukati. On the other hand, Roslyn Acombe, who fled the country, had announced her resignation while abroad on October 18, 2017, barely a week to the presidential election rerun. Now, according to Roslyn Acombe, she said that the commission could not guarantee a credible election and that she felt unsafe serving at the IEBC. These are the issues that left IEBC chairman Wa Fulache Bukati with only two commissioners and these two include Boya Molu and Abdi Yakub Goliye. These two, including the chairman, have been running the IEBC since then till now when the vacancies have been declared by the president on Agazet Notice dated April 14, 2021. Now, I'm looking at the reasons for their resignation. We are looking at what the chairperson and the two commissioners said. They were citing lack of confidence in the commission. Chairman, that is Wa Fulache Bukati and Roslyn Acombe will say that the IEBC could not guarantee a credible election. Confidence in the chairman and the IEBC guaranteeing a credible election. These two, do you feel like they have been sorted out and are we on the path towards their solution? Okay, first I believe. Roslyn Acombe, she left spontaneously uncontroversially. It was during the electioneering period during that process. The country was charged. There were a lot of demonstrations. So there are a lot of pressure of doing the right thing at a wrong place, you see. She left and of course left the country free. But let us look at these three who resigned later in April 2018. Post resignation, were they? They were rewarded by the president. One of them, they are, they hold some positions outside the country. One in Moscow, Rome, and I'm not sure what the other one, I think she's in France. To me, this was a predetermined thing. Most probably by this state. The resignation was predetermined. Yeah, of course. Even regardless of the accusations of lack of confidence in the chamber. This was just, it was just a make up. It was just a make up to wink the public. But at the back of their minds, there was something going on. And again, the president, being the appointing authority, he was trying to set a precedence. You see, he was trying to set a precedence that if you do this, anybody will be coming post these commissioners. If you do this, we will reward you. We got the point. You get to dance to this kind of tune. So in your opinion, you believe that the resignation of the vice chair? Yes. That is Consulata. And the commissioners, Margaret Machanya and Paul Krugart, was predetermined and preplanned. Yes. Do you agree with that? To some extent, and that's why I want to quote something by the late Magufulya. Magufulya is the same. Okiharibu katawe unaribiki hapo hapo. Howa wa liaribu? In Kenya, it's the opposite. Okiharibu hapo, unapele kwa puzuri zaini. So dab dab wa ribu kutengi. So niwa wa, I would say. That's why most of these people, they are corruption scantals and then someone is elevated by virtue of... So it's like this. Like he's saying, there are some prearrangements. Like when you achieve this, then you... So we find someone is moving from the Minister of Health after five billion scams, then he goes to a moon who created a transport minister. You know, bigger games are played there. But all I can see is to some extent I agree with him because why would someone be part of such a problem in system and still get a a diplomatic job. You know, for that thing, for that level of impunity to be... But the problem was with the system, not with that individual. The systems don't... Would you blame issues of the system to a particular individual? The systems don't run themselves. That's what I'm saying. The systems are run by individuals. Yes. I'm telling you about the jokes that we take so far. You ask yourself, these people say they have lost confidence in the chairman. Did you hear any investigation being done on the chairman? Because by that indict... These are people who are four people saying that this guy cannot be trusted. These are board members. They sit, they discuss everything, which means they know what the chairman is planning and everything. Irregardless of the personal differences or any other political and stuff like that, that warrants an investigation. Because the IMBC was indicted collectively. And then when these ones now came out, they said it's like they were saying the problem is the chairman. But nobody cared too to move ahead and we are moving forward. So at the end of the day you're like there are four people who are coming in and then there will be other political dynamics. It just looks like there's a... It's supposed to be very strategic. And to that, to an extent, it's like all these things are just choreographed towards a certain predetermined objective. The IMBC has been accused of many things, including not being able to guarantee incredible elections. If we were to go for general election right now, would you be confident in the IMBC? No, I wouldn't. Would you? I will not. I will not be confident for the IMBC. Why wouldn't you be confident? They have run previous polls this year. We've had bi-elections. Why not the general election? You see, when it comes to general election there are a lot of interest at play. There are a lot of interest at play. Let me put on the table here. The bi-elections that we've had including the different seats that were taken place in different regions. Yes. They were lit mass papers for the general elections according to how analysts may look at it. Not just for the politicians but also for the IMBC. Do you agree with that? Of course, IMBC has to cleanse itself this bi-elections. After 2017 we get to restore confidence in the public that we are no longer the IMBC which was there before. That we've adopted we've adopted a new face that we are no longer like what people used to used to see. But I want to take you back to 2010. In 2010 there were two bi-elections in this country. One was in Makadara, sorry. We also became the MP for the first time. He was there with a ticket. The Nakanya ticket he won. Jujajs with Kabogo winning there parliamentary parliamentary seat with the the same party. Did it become anything? Did Nakanya become anything in 2013? Mata Karwa became the presidential candidate but was she even something? That's why I'm telling you that in as much as we can have the bi-elections maybe in Matungu in the one in Kostu where we were Kuala where the independent candidate was that one does not really play I think it gives no sleepless nights to the president or the people who are interested in this kind of in this in these bodies. But the reason why I'm saying I'm still not confident with IBCs because the first of all the structuring the structuring the constitutional provision to this that the constitution provides that the chairman should be there one is the one charged to announce the presidential election winner. You know it it should be a bit different I think this thing should be it should be stratified to the point that maybe every county you get every county should be announcing its presidential what should be announcing the presidential candidate within the presidential election winner with the figures with the numbers like let's say we are in Mombasa county this is what maybe president who has got this is what so that the country can't no like the way they do it in the US but now if you come to Kenya you will you will realize that we've we've submitted the results maybe from Nairobi county these results they can't be announced by anybody inasmuch as we know from the back of our minds that this thing one candidate X is winning is beating candidate Y but it has to be taken somewhere the boardroom meeting to be and maybe our phone call is is made from from somewhere in the city for this people to determine by themselves maybe it is cool but then how should we look at the structure of the IBC so that we know we have a free and fair election in the long run Ken for IBC what we did is just professionalism once we have professionalism then people have responsibilities that have consequences if if not played by so for example you see what we are doing is doing the same thing and expecting different results we need to look at we talk of the system this this system is managed by people and I'll let me let me mention something on the bi elections the bi elections were not were not if that is how the IBC are going to run the presidential election it will be worse off than two or seven because you mentioned something about the juja aspirant who is supposed to be the school who is facing investigation from east they are accusing him of forging academic documents I read somewhere that there's a there's a class 7 dropout who recently became a senate I read somewhere so we have an IBC that in itself looks like he's operating under someone instructions that's the first thing so could the problem be with the chairman you are the problem because you have a job to do and you're choosing not to do it you're choosing to follow instruction that are not within your job description and that's why I see this man was indicted by the supreme court he was supposed to have left immediately and face charges because they are committed and left to offense now that we are having the the the the vacancies you are looking for the commissioners is it in order that they join as the chairman is still in office or are we looking into a revamp of the IBC I'm looking at what happened in parliament whether there is a report in parliament by the public accounts committee that indicted the commissioners so could this mean that there is a problem for them that could mean their removal from their positions or from their seats by virtue before we go to the parliamentary report the commission was indicted none of them none of them came forward to give a record of what happened that is what is supposed to happen in a civilized and functional democracy where this election was bangled the supreme court declared this as such they were told to open the servers they refused these people are supposed to be called in for questioning so that they tell us as Kenyans we spent money we need to know what happened we cannot be spending money without without substantive and proportionate returns so those people by the time the commission which with the parliamentary committee was doing which was just which is just as usual those are just formalities to earn people allowances and just make people look like they are working when they are doing nothing you see at the end of the day the supreme court decision was enough the next thing was to indict these people the DPP was supposed to the DPP was supposed to the DPP and the DCI were supposed to initiate DPP DCI and ESC was supposed to initiate investigations against these people while they are already out of office but I think as we discuss what is the I think we need to be a bit logical first of all you need to ask yourself that when Akumba left she pointed out that there are some commissioners whom she accused of leading the commission to have the burden that the election they preside over cannot be free fair and verifiable that time this commissioner who later resigned they went ahead and presided over the election that one a lunch will tell you something let me come back to what you are asking you see the president is a product of this process the courts which is a product of which process of this electoral process whether it is whether it was fraudulent or he was elected by the people he was elected right got the point so when you first you want to ask what you will do about the people who made him the president he will look at you and he will not come with a clean heart logically so when you say that the DPP may be the the investigative agencies it should come in who is holding the button who is holding the button the product the product is holding the button so it's the one who to direct the DPP go and investigate or maybe the DCI or what have you those agencies are you saying that there is no independence at the independent electoral and boundaries commission I want to confirm from my own opinion though that there is no independence in the IBC but is it also a fallacy or or misguiding the public when you say that the president has a take in the decisions that are made at the table at the IBC offices the president this one you can you can tell by the the unfoldings is the one appointing this commissioners is that true though there is the committee which they according to there is a an act of parliament of 2019 I think it from the senate which which states that the parliamentary service commission I think should come with that commission or around four people who should be nominating these people to the president and they should be but you need to know something that the president has shown and demonstrated in several locations that is so much interested in 2022 politics is so much interested in who will who will succeed him this one he said in Sagana he's been saying this he's been saying this in public rallies I will not leave power in Sita Hachawongosikwa music that one shows you how much interest is invested in this thing so he will not even these commissioners who are about to be presented to Kenyans they will also be they have to to convince their appointing authority that right we can do we can do what you want okay yes if let me give you time to have a rejoinder in regards to what he has said do you agree Lord with what he has said about the independence of the IEBC and those that are involved in in it you say in other words that there are strings that are attached to of course any institution that starts with independent is real independent any country that starts with people is never people do you have facts that can book up that allegation why must you write independent because it is independent why must you kumonsentikalik it is independent come on because that is the name of the now you see that's the name of the commission now that's where we that's where we take our jokes too far now as Kenyans we are told it's independent just the name and then whatever happens there is nothing close to independent so the IEBC you know it's a so I usually say it's very difficult to you know these are human beings with interests needs and all that stuff people will always have interests but once you have systems that are functional then the systems that are functional are able to check the hunger and the personal desires of the people serving and running those systems to a level where we are able to minimize their influence and serve greater good the elections are pre during and post we have failed in all aspects I want us to wrap this conversation or for the IEBC and move on to the next discussion for the commissioners still I stick to that to that part for the commissioners will they or could they lose their seat could the chairman also lose their seat we are talking about these two commissioners that remained with Wafula Chibukati the chairman we talk about commissioners Boya Mulu and Abdi Yakub Goliye together with the chairman Wafula Chibukati that we have the parliamentary the parliamentary public accounts committee that in these commissioners also we have sources saying that there is a scheme involving presenting a petition to parliament citing gross misconduct by the commissioners during the 2017 election polls it's 2021 we are going to the elections next year why bring a petition now the crimes were committed in 2017 why not then could they lose their seat regardless of the duration that they tested the 2017 crime was committed collectively none of the commissioners if you are not an accomplice that's what I was telling you none of the commissioners if they want an accomplice has come out to give us facts you know what we call actionable action by facts Rosilina Kumbes they said about Chibukati and the team they are politically they are politically influenced they cannot preside over a credible election the issue is she was supposed to have come and said these people have already been invited as criminals if you are not part of the syndicate come forward and tell people this is what because you know as a commission before you announce the results you know the calls that were made you know what happened you know what the secretariat was doing because you are the people who who created advice on calls could they lose their positions they are supposed to have lost the position immediately the supreme court made the ruling that nullified the election my opinion is this the president is trying to flex his muscle on these people why would he involve the president in this he is the point of the policy he has just made a declaration he just made a agazet notice declaring vacancies of these positions at the IEBC why would he involve the removal of office for the chairman things that happen in parliament there are two things at play here the public interest and the political interest the public interest is this before even a company left there were particular commissioners and the CEO who were grossly accused of manipulating and interfering with the commission Chiloba was one of the accused people where is he he is not there public interest appointing authority and what have you the political players had to kick him out get the point so for the chairman and the two commissioners they are most likely going to be kicked out I don't believe so the reason why I don't believe so is that whoever is doing this because there is a game there is there is some kind of stream being pulled from the from underground the unseen hand pushing one two they have confirmed that provided we have this number of commissioners we can dance to our tears the chairman doesn't matter get the point it doesn't matter so it can just be there but provided we have at least this threshold this threshold in the number in the name of commissioners we can the agenda can still be fulfilled now we have the commissioners that we are looking for the the the four commissioners so if what you're saying is true then they will join the current two commissioners spread the chairman and they'll continue working together yes yes regardless of the duration between now and the election regardless I believe so is it constitutionally correct is the timespan not too short by law the timespan is very short and that's what I'm seeing these people we have it's like we have a kabae that deliberately sets up things to fail so these people the vacancies fail open in one in 2017 another one in 2018 why take two years or three years to fill them these are these one of the most critical aspects in our country one of the hottest institutions is IBC because it's everything our chaos that's the only place where our chaos come from and all that stuff why would we be so casual with IBC to a level where we don't even care whether they are commissioners we don't care whether it's functioning they are not held to task you are told Palliamen is investigating a petition is coming up this thing is so done in a casual way to a level where you really wonder are we really interested in solving the issue of electoral injustice in Kenya your question has instigated some insight in me that first of all we need to ask ourselves is the commission there there is it is there on paper just a minute you feel it's not there no we are asking is the commission there to me the commission is there and it is stable and it has held by elections in various parts of the country as you are saying it's there on paper no of course it is there and we can see it can do its functions it can declare vacancies in the constituencies which have no parliament MPs it can conduct elections so the only problem here and that's why I don't think Uru can kick Cebu Kati because it will bring a lot of controversy and it will be maybe it will go against the law that you are kicking out the IBC maybe a year before a year before the general elections so you will not do that the most probable thing you can do is to bring these commissioners you get because you know that from 2017 maybe Cebu Kati was for this idea yeah maybe it was for it was for that these things should be done this way but because we are the commissioners we are this maybe this threshold who can dance to our tunes we will influence everything inside there okay I want us to wrap it up I believe you you got your you take it regards to that let's head over to the next story of the day the KCPE remember we are taking highlighting stories that took set a stage in the previous one week regards to the IBC give us your take legally is it according to the constitution does it how what are the allowances that we have in regards to removal of these commissioners according to the constitution what does it say do we have the is the time span right do we have enough time before the elections of 2020 how long should it take for us to get these commissioners give us your take the hashtag is why in the morning got Ram Aguko at Y254 channel last week we had the KCPE exams released that story was also highlighted today on the people daily where we discussed that previously briefly during the newspaper review but now many commissioners are saying you guys we don't have money we can't go ahead and pay school fees for children okay they have done their KCPE but now what next parents are crying at the same time there are students who got the results so I'm happy so I'm sad about it what is your take generally as we bring giving us your opening remarks on the KCPE examination have results that were released on Thursday last week okay first of all I want to congratulate all the people who search for the examination just by sitting for the examination alone is a plus and is a commendable activity second I want to commend the resilience of these children having undergone through the having suffered the pandemic going through the problems societal problems actually during the pandemic we could hear a lot of reports about girl child some of them becoming pregnant a good number of them but it is good that at least some of them performed well and looking at even top 15 as you said earlier they are dominating so it is something of it is something which we is commendable I'm looking at it what is your take in regards to the conduct of these examinations during a pandemic I think it was I will comment as I congratulate the the candidates I will also commend the government for having done its best to ensure that the exams go on of course there are hitches here and there the some of the students were not or some of the pupils were not well prepared considering the different the different environments where or as a country where these people come from so we discovered there was a bit of an unfair advantage on some but at the end of the day it's good that we are able to push through and achieve that that said and done it's good we say yeah the moment we are talking about now we have over one million people who are supposed to 1.1 million who are supposed to transition to to second and we are talking about a 100% transition yeah and then you ask yourself in the last years how the last the last year how much have we invested in the infrastructure expansion of the secondary schools where there must be 100% transition because at the moment education is no longer about quality like it used to be during our days it's about compliance we just want people to pass through it's a system people just passing through people just want to pass through school people just at the moment that's what you believe that is the image that the government is portraying that we must you see to enhance quality in education you need one the infrastructure you need the human resource and then there is the support there's always wars between TSE and Nat and Kupet about teachers almost all public schools under under resourced we are talking about a cabinet secretary who comes and says it's fresh to learn under trees it's okay to do that we have a we have a system where we have the we are talking about a shortage of teachers we have a shortage of classrooms and other and other supportive measures so we want to push these people to the next level and yet we have not created enough space on that level and that's what I'm saying it's what the government is doing is more about compliance not quality education for all at the moment quality is let me say one of the least the least considerations of the government if we didn't have quality would we be seeing people passing examinations the way they did last week you see what is happening is that people are passing exams and that's why we have others who are failing because if we had a purely quality best system someone would not go to school for eight years and still have a system that classifies them as a failure because that is what because you are saying these ones should go to these schools these ones should go to this irregardless of this if whether this person has a talent that could fit whether irregardless you know there could be someone who got a hundred marks but this person could have a talent that can help that can boost the image over school where the 400 are supposed to go you know that kind of balance because when we talking of the CBC we are talking of the CBC CBC we are not focusing on on academia alone we are looking at creating a system of empowered individuals in the areas of abilities and interests so that we still fall short in that aspect even as you come in do you agree that with what he is saying that we are not concentrating on quality education in the country I don't agree with that you see the education system is that the government has come up with a lot of initiatives including addressing what he is talking about to do with the quality by bringing the CBC competency based curriculum to mean that government is trying to do something you see when we come to the current what he is talking about I think we should we need to start from somewhere you get we need to come from somewhere that at least we increase the number of enrollments for the students sitting for there national examination that one alone we need to to comment the government that at least it's doing something we need not to see things negatively every time I think sometimes we need to to give credit where it's due yeah and these things cannot be done at a one go like we are doing everything radically when the CSI said that we need 100% transition that's a good statement but the question is what is it that can be done to cushion Kenyans especially the Kenyan parents who now have the burden or the or the luggage of ensuring that they pay their school fees to their children now that they are all going to from one yeah I think for it to be transformative and to to meet its course it is important that the government is not going to is not coming to the bridge you see like it's not consulting the parent or it should it should be that the government is dealing with a kid like Mr Kevin maybe Kevin Oteano yeah from maybe Khyambu County got 403 marks the government knows of this student it was maybe is is in is going to alliance high school so it's told the government knows that this guy the parents are the parents are disadvantaged economically so let's check the burden not that we question the parents that maybe we give the parents I don't know what you mean by questioning maybe you mean that we boost their their their their business as well I think it should be that this the student is the one which the government is interested in in this education right now so it should be the one to be to be to be sponsored Ken you regards to this high cost of living is the worry for many Kenyans but now that their students are done with the KCPE they are honoring what next yeah and then that's where it also exposes our leadership as a country because the economy has literally been shut down for the past one year then we have students who must go to school, must report because it's a 100% transition in schools there are only politically free politically education in Kenya is free and the government will live and tell you will be arrested if you don't take your child to school someone has been jobless for a whole year and they are supposed to take a kid to school so at the end of the day that's why you know if we had I don't want to say if we had thinkers if we had progressive thinkers in government you see you're looking at a situation where next year people will not have money and that is a fact when we close the economy when this year people will not have so as you're planning people will be having KCPE at this it's the same thing I want to give an example the kafu apparently supposed to run up to 29th but schools are supposed to open on 10th May so you see that kind of clash it's the same thing lack of lack of how do I put it collective oversight where don't focus on one thing you make a decision after patching up all the different corners so these people have no money but you will arrest them if they don't take to schools their children to school where they are supposed to be paid where school fees are supposed to be paid so it's a big challenge and that's why we have assist in where and that's why it worked of compliance because at the moment if we were purely focused on quality then we might not be forcing parents to take their kids to for the 100% transition because and maybe to specific places or specific schools because once we are based on quality then we identify the key aspect of that kids life that can make them a better person are you against the 100% transition to high school I'm not against the 100% transition but you see we are in a very academic country and that's why I say it's just about passing through the system you can do the 100% transition but the question is what do those what does that 100% transition result to in terms of the human capital of the country that's my only concern because without this what I'm saying we should not be negative I'm saying there are people who lead through conformism and there are those who lead through conformism and there are those who lead through revolt both people can inspire so let the conformists remain bureaucrats let the reformists be the revolters who are there to remind these people that yes you are doing good and this is the right thing to do but what we are doing is we can do more let's do more based on the resources we are investing a lot of resources but the truth is like my biggest problem is that our return on our investment is very minimal because we we don't have a calculated formula that attaches value to every shilling that we spend our time is almost up you wanted to respond to him? just a little bit we need to look at what do we have now 844 system the syllabus well said ok according to your opinion maybe it's that the quality is not enough to maybe prepare children for the for the global skills but with the ministry and the CS is doing the things according to what we have maybe this other one is talking about creating making value for our money the return on investment to our kids is pronounced in what they become in future actually the government is trying to the government is trying to address that by bringing the CBC but right now what we have KCAC, KCP the transition children passing and only that alright I want us to conclude with this just give us your thoughts politically conclusively monke then politicians have laid out demands for the deputy president in regards to the region and their block demands that can ascertain them economically regionally and demands that can ascertain them seats in their particular area I want to look at it this way you see about a fortnight ago there has been a lot of political talks with some even alleging that the deputy president wants to form a coalition with the former prime minister Oparana is also coming in you know when you hear Rigadiga Chagwa and the other Mount Kenya region in peace coming they are trying to sound some sense of warning to the deputy president they want to restore their positions which they held before from 2018 to this year the deputy president has been has been rapidly campaigning in Mount Kenya region when they see him trying to vea off that grid they have to bring demands so it is just demand to bring back the deputy president to track which they want him to so it's all about the deputy president the Mount Kenya in peace having a meeting definitely it's about but Gashagwa say then I quote we have very good brains in the region and serious ideas our economic team and has some of the most solid leaders who understand how to package the views of the people into a coherent reasonable and beneficial economic revival plan if the news I watch sounds me right Gashagwa said that the deputy president will be given the first priority inasmuch as the other presidential candidates will also come in but he will be given the first priority to mean that all this thing is done first are they speaking for the people you see these are politicians and for even information they get to they get to lace this thing with people interests tea, coffee, what have you they get to lace it with what people want to to hear for it to to be pronounced you see one of the reasons why it's difficult for women to be elected in Kenya it's not because women there don't like women it's just that people don't like electing outsiders people want to elect people who have experiential exposure to their problems you grow up here even if you went to the US there's an experience you understand how does that connection to women I was using that example I bringing that because there's talk of the struggle to elect women even when the women are the majority I'm saying that because these people who are talking about having ideas of how to revive the economy who are born there have been there all their lives some of them have been in parliament for more than 15 years so have the women they have grown up in this particular area no they got married there most of them it's easier for a woman to be elected where she was born as opposed to where she got married we all know she has done more where she's married than where she is okay let's go back to the topic you go up and panoras both I will let you we will talk about that another day now the point is these people are born here these people have been in power most of them have been either in power or close to power all their lives they have been in power they have been in power they have been in power they have been in power or close to power all their lives and that's why I mentioned during the review this is blackmail politiki you see these are people yes politics is about interests but like he said we have people who are pursuing their own interests and then they are coming out to purport to be acting on behalf of the people because if you are acting on behalf of the people then you will come up you don't need to meet the deputy president privately for you to tell him what he needs to do for his people if he is not listening you can call a press conference and say for coffee we need to do this and this take a bill to parliament if it's not passed stand up and say I proposed a bill in parliament to take care of the coffee and tea farmers but they have refused the president has refused to ascend to it that is representation for me and that's what I was saying when you talk about coffee farmers which professionals within the agricultural sector from the Mount Kenya region are they engaging so that it's easier for someone like me to believe that they represent farmers when I see either professionals or I see there was a meeting and then there is there is a non-political approach to things but what they are doing now I just feel like these are people who are just trying to realign themselves like he said you see it's tough now it's tough now and with the uncertain future in politics you have to try and flex and the easiest tool is always the people so you say we as the Mount Kenya region we have decided so you really wonder how did 5 people alright what I'm still wondering is why you don't play that and the fact that even we've had evidences that prove that they are trying to fight for their region and their people let me look at in January to the president on the economy and development of that particular region ahead of a meeting at Sagana state that letter for the people in regards to the economics stability of their region isn't that also something that is that something that you don't play and say that hey they are just doing it for the sake of their political interests number 2 the mountain as according to Gashagwa he said that we want our region to be guaranteed minimum returns under the root of presidency so they engage Uto he said all agricultural sectors are on their knees and we want him to tell us what he will do to resuscitate them end of quote 1 there are different levels of leadership in our country and governments really for the people why have they never come together to give the same demands to the county governments because there is a lot of development that the county government is doing there are a lot of law that can be why have they not brought together even the mcs to pass laws that can support the regional governments 2 on the issue of the second question was just about the economy now you see you are talking they wrote a letter to the president about the economy why would you write a letter to the president when you can take a bill to parliament alright to me I think this is a tool for political mobilization is a tool for political mobilization to the grassroot level because first of all you get to know my people what are their desires I need to speak what they want to hear when I talk about coffee I know I will instigate their minds to endia themselves to this particular candidate whom I want them to be part of whereas I say you see they are talking to in that meeting Ruto is privy to it it was privy to it so when Rigadi Gashagwa is coming out to give the recommendations the past as the MPs they talk they talk to the people through Ruto but they talk to their people you see the way it is it is like we hit you so that you reflect it so they will go and tell the people from the mountain that this Ruto we have already told him that he has to look for the issue of our economic empowerment he has to look for coffee he has to look for farmers he has to look for all these things so because we as Mount Kenya people alone then we took this to him he has agreed he has agreed that he will take care of all this so let's vote for him let's vote for him because he will do what what we have told him this conversation doesn't end now we have to continue this especially on the issue of women that you said there I was with Kennedy O'Dwyer an aspirant for butula constituency member parliamentary seat and Evans Amaru gentlemen thank you so much thank you that was to the end of this conversation right on Y in the morning it's a pleasure as always thank you so much for keeping it tuned to Y254 my name is Ram Maguko on behalf of everyone that ensured this show was a success thank you so much see you again next time right here on Y254 may God bless you Y254