 Wel, roeddwn i. Fy fydd yw gweld yn llwyddoedd mewn oed, ac mae'r llwyddoedd o'r cyhoedd. Mae David Maddich yn hyn. David, yw yw? Felly, yw'n fwybodaeth. Mae'n rhai fydd yn ddiwethaf i'r ffwrdd. Mae'r rhaglen yn gweithio fel y llwyddoedd, at yw'r cyfrifiad, mae'n fydd yn ddiwedd i'r cyfrifiad, mwyn i'r llwyddoedd i wneud. I'm feeling you're paying me at this barn at mate, honestly. Pet your shave. Pet your shave is all off, but I haven't got the bottle to go to Guinness, so it is, it is what it is. I'm not ahead, you know, about November either, so it's good. It's mad. It's taken me money. Just on this, obviously, the current situation at the moment, it's such a strange time, isn't it? Obviously, for the likes of yourself, I mean, we're struggling here with the football channel, trying to talk about football when there's no football, but what's it like being a football correspondent, and there isn't any football to talk about? We found it difficult. Well, I found it a bit impossible, to be honest. When the lockdown first happened and the football was stopped, it was such a serious situation because people were dying. So, you know, a lot of people were dying, and the country realised that this was like the biggest crisis for many, many years. So you couldn't really write about things like football transfers, things like that, you know, it's just seemed too trivial. So the only thing you could write about was how coronavirus was affecting football, how, you know, what the implications for football were, when it could possibly come back, that sort of thing. But obviously, there's only so much you can write about that, and then eventually you have to turn back towards the actual footballing issues. And, you know, that was a difficult judgement for all media. I mean, I think even for you, to a certain extent, you know, can you do trivial stuff, and if so, what point into the lockdown? I think eventually we got to that point, I think now hopefully, we'll be on the curve as flattened, et cetera, and we'll be on the worst of it. And we can start thinking about and talking and writing about football as a, you know, as a pursuit that takes people's minds off it again. But it was very difficult, and the worst thing of all is you're writing about football without any prospect of football matches, and that just seems pointless, you know what I mean? It's like, it's the whole point of football is the matches. And if there aren't any matches and you don't know when their next will be, then it makes it really demoralising that I found it. But here we are, and I think it's coming back, so. From there, I mean, I was just going to move on to that. I mean, it does look like, obviously, we've seen the players at the moment in phase one in training. I believe there's a vote tomorrow, I think, to whether they can go to phase two, which is a bit more, which is contacting in training as well. Before you answer about the Premier League, have you watched any of the Bundesliga football? I've watched virtually every game I could just because I've missed football that much. I've even watched the second division games and everything, but have you watched it and how have you found it? I watched the opening weekends, yeah, and like you, I watched sort of everything I could. And I'm not one of these who said it wasn't football, it wasn't the same. I think, you know, there was some, I mean, you can tell that there was commitment on part of the players, that they were, you know, they were, and they were running, they were fit, they were, you know, getting into it. It was decent football, but of course, there's no atmosphere, and that was the weird thing. That's the hard thing because even on TV, actually on TV, they tend to turn the crowd noise up at times to create that atmosphere, because sometimes it can be a bit sterile. And obviously no noise made it difficult, but I mean, it was interesting. I actually saw after the first weekend that some, I can't remember which game it was now, but one of the players I was watching was a run 18 kilometres in the game, and that's kind of further than they generally run. So I think in a way, you know, they're coming back pretty fit, certainly in Germany, they're coming back fit and ready. So I don't think it will be that bad. I think for me, and this has got mixed reactions when we've like discussed it, but I'd like to see or I'd like to hear some crowd noise, whether it's just an underlying, you know, I don't know. Because the way I look at it, David, and I don't know whether you'd agree or disagree, but for me, it's going to be a television sport for, say, the next six to eight months, it looks like, because at the minute there's no vaccine, there's no, you know, I've read something which is quite bizarre, but probably to scientific people, it probably makes massive sense that because the virus is dying out quickly, we're struggling to develop the vaccine and they wanted to anger on the bit, which it just seemed mad, doesn't it? But that's kind of where we're up to. But for the next kind of, like I said, six to eight months, before we're all allowed back in a stadium in close proximity, isn't, it's not a responsibility, but isn't it the opportunity to make it look and sound as good as it possibly can be while we're waiting to go back in and with that? That's why I want to hear some crowd noise, because I just find it a little bit, it is a bit flatter and the players screaming for the ball and stuff. Yeah, no, I agree actually. I see a lot of people kind of taking the piss out of piping noise in and things like that, but I think it's worth exploring because it would change things for the TV and obviously we're all going to be watching on TV, as you said. You can write off next season now for fans, there's no way next season there'll be fans in the stadiums. I suspect for the whole season, so I reckon, as you suggested, a year, i.e. the next season, before there's any prospect of fans coming into stadiums. The reason I say that is, just say Old Trafford, 70,000,000 fans there, and there's no way you can allow 70,000 fans into a stadium when you don't have a vaccine for this virus. People say, well, it's open air, and it is, but somebody, you've got our security, somebody's got to frisk down fans as they go in, and if you're doing thousands of them, you're putting them in harm's way basically. We are without football as supporters going to the ground. I reckon for the remainder of what this season and next season. So then you've got to start looking at how to best make that experience because we'll all be watching it, I'm sure. I'm absolutely certain. I don't think people say, oh, I'm not watching it because it's not the same without fans there. I'm certain people will watch it at home and when there's stuff riding on it especially. So making the experience, and I wonder whether these days, the technology, how surely there's a way to actually kind of create a noise, which, remember, always follows the action. The noise always comes after the action if you like. It starts to build as the action builds, and then when, for instance, if a goal goes in, the noise comes instantaneously afterwards, but that slight delay. So surely there's a way to build a noise if people are attacking and then drop it if they don't score, but if they do score, et cetera. It's not beyond the sort of technology, I'm sure. That could be an answer, but it is an area where I think they probably will have to look at. Maybe not for the rest of this season. There's only nine games left for each club or 10 for a couple, but certainly if they go into next season without fans, then definitely look at it. I know that the Bundesliga for their own fans who are watching on TV, they have two feeds, I think, with noise feeds. So it's, we're not, we're watching it on BTO, whatever, we're not seeing, we're not getting that, but I wish we were. I mean, as I watched them, I think it was Leverkusen game at the weekend and they had the cutouts in some of the sections. And when I first heard about this, it was just like, what? That is ridiculous. But actually, from a TV perspective watching it, it did look like there was crowd. So, I mean, I'm not condoning the discharge £17 a cutout pay person. I think the club should foot that personally or the TV company or whatever because I don't think any crowd person should be having to pay, you know, any fan should be having to pay that kind of money. But just aesthetically, as a TV sport, you're trying to make it look and sound as good as it can because I think it will put people off if it is anti-stadiums and you can hear the plays. I really do and think what you have to do if it is like you're saying. And you feel as though next season could be written off as well because at this moment, let's be honest, there's no guarantee whatsoever we'll be backing the stadium next season. Like you said, no vaccine, big crowds, you sat in my seat in the upper bullhounds, legs are touching and everything. So, you're right next to people. That can't be allowed at the minute. So, they have to as a TV and the Premier League and everything get together to try and make this look and sound as good as it possibly can. So, that's where I'm up to. In terms of the Premier League, you've just said before, it's coming back. You know, the projected date is anywhere between the 12th and the 26th, I think, of June, some next month. I mean, do you feel like at the moment it's the right thing to do or are you still a little bit like it's a little bit too early? I think it's the right thing. I think it's the right time. I don't think they'll come back until at least the 20th. So, I reckon we're looking now towards the sort of back-end of next month and by then, all shops will be open. People will be back at work, they'll be travelling, you know, on public transport and it kind of will be a different environment for football to come back into. So, I think that is the right time. It's a tricky one because for me, I mean, I've seen a lot of fans on Twitter, a lot of people, you know, contacting the paper on our online forums and a lot of people are saying, first of all, it's not going to be the same, but that argument just doesn't hold because if you wait for it to be the same, you could be without football for two years. It could easily be. What you were saying before about the vaccine, I could actually tell you the reason why it's hard to, I could go into great detail on why it's hard to get a vaccine. I won't because it's quite boring, but it's unlikely there'll be a vaccine anytime soon, certainly until next year. So, we're going to have to get used to the idea of no big crowds. I mean, you know, maybe some of the smaller clubs, maybe there's a way to have smaller gatherings, but not Premier League and absolutely not. In which case, if your argument is we can't have it, it's not the same, then that means you're just not having football and I don't, I think, well, you know, it's what it is, you know, things happen. So, you deal with it and then you just, you adapt to it. And I think the Premier League has to adapt. I think people have said, oh, the conditions they're going to restart in are not the same as the conditions they stopped in, but so what? You know, they're the conditions. You just have to accept them and get on with it. And that's that, you know. And actually, we might come to this later, but I think it might just help Everton as it happens, but we'll get on to that later. The other argument is it's put in lives at risk. I understand that argument and it's a very sensitive subject, but for me, the safety of the players particularly, I think, is almost enhanced by the tests that they'll be doing, the checks that they'll be doing, and it's not just the actual testing for the virus, which they'll get three times a week. They'll also have heart rate monitors as they do, as you know, you know, every training session. They'll have their oxygen levels checked. And actually, if any of them get the virus, they will know much quicker than probably had they constructed it as many did before you know, before the lockdown or during the lockdown. So it's been proven that the earlier you detect the virus, far more chance you have of surviving it. And the reality is, if you leave it really late and you end up being taken into hospital, put on a ventilator, 80% of those people die because it's too late. Whereas if they were able to get treatment earlier, then the vast majority of people don't suffer those problems, don't get to those dangerous levels. And I think, you know, so the argument that, oh, you're putting them at risk, I think you could counter that argument by saying, well, actually, you know, it's going to, it will help. And I'll give you an example. There was one of the six who tested positive had no idea that he obviously had the virus. In fact, I think all six who tested last week positive were asymptomatic and had no idea, didn't have any symptoms whatsoever. And they have, you know, I think three of them had families, something like that. And so they were then able to isolate from their families. So, you know, therefore not pass it on, whereas they may well have done to their families. So I think that's a difficult argument. But for me, I think now they can make it safe, safe. And I'm not suggesting for a second no one is going to contract coronavirus in the return of football. But I think the numbers, as we've seen in Germany, will actually be quite low. And that being the case, you know, the safety is probably pretty very high. Yeah, I think you're right. I mean, it's, it's, there's obviously people will have the moral view and everything else. And that's right. I'm never saying I'm not going to argue against anyone who's got that opinion. But I think in terms of people are saying like, why is football got to come back? I think if we don't play it, we can't, like you said before, we can't just leave it until a vaccine is, is, you know, magically appears and we all take it because to pick half the football clubs, if not more, wouldn't be in existence by the time it returns because you can't simply run businesses that don't create any money because you're not doing what the business is for. And football clubs can, we've made Crystal Palace, we've made Brighton talking, Burnley saying if we're not back playing by September, we won't have football clubs here because we can't afford it. So it's a tough one, but that's what it is. I absolutely agree. And I think, you know, you look, other businesses are coming back now and actually a lot of businesses are going to come back and be less affected than football will be. So football, like a lot of hospitality businesses is going to suffer more than most anyway. So to say, oh no, you can't have football, but like, but you can go to a department store, you can go and play golf, you can, you know, you can meet your friends in the park, but you can't watch football on TV. I think that that's that that will no longer hold water. And the reality is, as you say, I mean, Malaga basically, the football club, and they were a big Spanish club only a couple of seasons ago. They've just announced a load of redundancies and effectively filed for administration and effectively gone bust because already their financial situation wasn't great and the lack of football and the problems caused by the virus have put them into real financial difficulty. There will be a lot of clubs in the, not just in the lower leagues in the UK, but actually in the Premier League is some of the names you put it out, they're going to struggle if they don't come back very soon and don't come back to complete this season either because a lot of money will be lost otherwise. Just don't, you said something before about, I think it might have been when we were off air actually, we were just mentioning about the transfer window. I mean, how do you, it's difficult obviously to talk about a transfer window because we don't know, we don't know what's going on, we're reading, we're all reading stuff about clubs struggling one minute and then the next minute, coming back with £100m, especially our club Everton, we're signing everyone and you're thinking well are we because there isn't any money. How do you see just in general the transfer market going, not necessarily for Everton, but just across the Premier League maybe even in your opinion how do you think it'll play out? Well, if we're looking across Europe, I cannot see any other outcome than the transfer is deflated massively across the board all across Europe and I just don't think you'll see clubs with money to spend like we've had in the past. It's always been top down in football, the big clubs spend a lot of money and that forces prices up and then it forces the clubs just below them to spend more money and it's that terrible inflation re-effect. Most clubs are going to lose a lot of money and it takes a couple of English examples, Manchester United have already said they've lost over £100m already because of the effects of the coronavirus that they've posted big losses. I think their debts went up by over £300m in the last financial year in part because of that. They will have to look at how much they're going to lose over the next year and I did a few calculations and I reckon that clubs in the top six or eight in the Premier League and you'd include Everton in that could lose upwards of £100m just without fans at games and the money that they will have to renegotiate some TV deals just for this season and then let's say next season without fans. The top eight at least are going to lose minimum £100m probably closer to the say United Manchester City Liverpool. They're going to lose £150m over just and that's if football this season ends and next season is played behind closed doors. You'll quite enjoy this because I can give you the example of Liverpool. Liverpool have actually only got two players out of contract this summer and next summer it's the same. They've only got two players out of contract and that's great if you think oh yeah well you know we're going to want to keep all our squad together fantastic and it you know it was it was good management in a sense but now when you're looking at a fixed wage cost which is what they've got because every single one of their big players is on a contract until 2023 or 24 that means they they have to pay those wages there's no getting rid of the players because they're all on long contracts but their income has reduced so when you out go into a fix but your income has reduced you've got a problem what do you do about that you try and sell players but there's no market anymore to sell them or you just don't buy players and I think that's that's what will happen to a lot of clubs they're just going to have to basically take into account the losses they're going to make over the next 12 to 18 months and then look at their wage costs and look at their you know their transfer spending and the transfer spending is the one thing you can easily affect i.e. don't buy players so I mean you know there'll still be transfers but you won't and Everton are a great example we probably would both agree they needed to sign four or five players in the summer they can't do that now and certainly not not like in terms of spending say over a hundred million you know that sort of thing they're going to have to look at maybe a key player and then loan deals etc clever ways of getting players in if they want to bring more than that so across the board the spending is going to be affected there's no doubt it's going to be really interesting isn't it like you say because every you know virtually everybody will be affected by it and it's whether there's another way to look at it is if is ffp going to be relaxed or the P&L regulations are they going to be relaxed well we're not hearing at the moment that there's going to be any changes to that and if there isn't if it's staying as it is then you're right it's going to be it's going to be slim picking certainly on transfer transfer from for big you know big these big trans you say in 150 million for Jadon Sanchio and you're like united aren't paying united aren't paying 150 million barn this summer when they're having to pay back money already 20 million or whatever it is so so i saw that you know that nappley centre off i can never pronounce his name yeah that's it curibali yeah emerson were linked with him man she said he'd been linked little pool were linked with him for a little while and they were saying 200 million 200 million for a centre half this summer when everybody's going to be losing 150 million or whatever it's ab and i'll notice the last couple of weeks suddenly this 200 million transfer fee which was being banded around in the italian papers only about three weeks ago the last week or so suddenly that's 40 million you know and it's like so there's no way that you know these players that the sanchos and the curibalis and even the team owner were they were saying he's going to cost 55 million i don't think anybody's going to pay 55 million for for when in a year's time he'll cost 25 million you know so it's everything keep getting linked with so many players and and i mean i can see them making a sign a sign in a you know transfer sign for money and then i can see them making signings in different ways i think that's the way it will work out totally agree with it and then just just on everything just because we're on a day with with anti a lotty like moving forward i mean i know we had you in when when marco silver was the manager and we had it we had a really great chat and we'll have you backing when we can when we can not socially distance and we'll we'll talk a bit more we'll talk a bit more about anti a lotty when you come in but just basic just a basic overview of it because in your opinion a good bit of business by evidence to bring him in and and do you think he is the right kind of manager that the club needed yeah i mean good bit of business great bit of business unbelievable bit of business because he is a top class manager there's absolutely no doubt and you know what in the i mean it's a shame because i haven't had too much time to get to know him because obviously all press conference stop but in the time that i had to sort of you know in press conferences etc to to speak to him he's a really nice guy as well you know by a genuinely decent guy he's very funny and um he he also he's not afraid to speak about stuff which you know you think like top class managers who've been at all the top clubs they tend to be coached and trained into not saying anything and being diplomatic and but he seems happy to talk you know and and and talk in a in a you know a really right way as well his humor is is good and he's a clever guy and i mean i think he's i mean how can you not say he's a great signing with his record he's every single place he's ever been he's done remarkably well and people say oh yeah but he's been at all the best clubs well he didn't start at the biggest clubs he started in Palmer if he was and and you know turn them into a big club and he went to Napoli and he actually did remarkably well with Napoli as well you know so he he's shown that he doesn't need to be at the biggest clubs to do it it's just that he's such a good manager he naturally you know went to work in the big clubs i think i think it might be a slightly difficult situation now because there's an absolutely no doubt that he was promised funds and i think he expected some in January but that didn't arrive and then he was certainly promised it for the summer and and you know most football clubs are going to be affected and Everton i can't see however Everton won't be affected so he's going to have to sort of do different things because he won't be able to bring four five six sort of big money players in but you know he's he's a he's a great coach proven over so many years and he's not lost his appetite for football so he hasn't come just for a payday he you know he genuinely sort of it came to to to have success with Everton and and and and he's still got that ability as a manager as he did show at Napoli you know qualifying for the Champions League getting them through the Champions League as well you know he he's um he's top class and he's got a good coaching team around him and actually i sort of suggested earlier that that sort of football coming back now might actually benefit Everton a little because you know they were looking at european football you know making it into the the Europa League next season has been a very very very long shot but he's a he's a great coach and he's got a good team around him his son is a is a quite a scientific coach Danny Donaghy is good on the sort of you know on the fitness side brilliant on the fitness side and i think Everton have been doing a lot of good work to get the players ready and and i can see them you know with a great coach sort of coming back and and and doing well and and you never know you know it could just be that that that they can just sort of get on the coattails of that Europa League with other clubs who are maybe not as ready or you know maybe finding it difficult because i think you know some teams will struggle without the atmosphere or or whatever you know and then so it might just help Everton a little bit in that sense in terms of what they want to achieve and they definitely definitely want to achieve european football this season because financially that was always a big thing for them. That'll be typical Everton will qualify for the Europa League and there'll be no wait no european football next season because a quarantine or whatever but there will be european football but again will they will they be allowed to allow fans to travel i doubt it but but i think the clubs will and i think that you know that's the the kind of the way forward now um you the the the europe they're going to try and finish the champions league and the europe league this season so you know definitely next season i'm sure. I mean i think just just finally with the european thing because i think it'd be a good way to finish is how do you see because being fed up being speaking about this how did he start the like europealy because the qualifying starts next month normally well that's not going to be on the table is it because so that's i mean is it do you think it'll be a case of all of those minor leagues are just going to be cut away for this one year because i know in the FA Cup the talking now about next year's competition just starting at the first round with no i think it was there were 739 teams in it last season and this year there's there's going to be 64 or something just cutting away all the preliminary rounds you think europe would have to do that because it'd have to surely wouldn't it well i mean they're going to have to do something there's a few options on the table apparently but there is that you know looking at getting rid of all the preliminary rounds um probably a more sensible idea would be to get rid of the groups you know and just have it as a kind of straight knockout because that way you're not doing quite as much traveling and and you know especially in the early part of the next next season's competition which will still be this year you know you can envisage there's still a virus around in europe and and you know there's some certain danger in in traveling for the clubs themselves so you know maybe maybe they just say oh just we'll change the format for one season i think that would be a sensible idea but obviously they're still looking at that and they still haven't decided how they're going to finish the competition this season though i suspect and i strongly suspect it will be a kind of almost like a mini tournament sort of thing one-off games and maybe based in in one place you know that that could be the way for that to finish yeah i think you're right i think that's probably the only way that it can finish i'm going to put you're on the spot here the last question before i let you go and and get back to your busy day is give us a date when you think the premier league will resume okay i'll yeah you can put me on the spot because i'm prepared for this i'll give you no i'm going to give you a date i'll give you a match okay okay june the 20th everton v Liverpool there you go that is that is what i believe i'm not honest anymore on it but june the 20th everton v Liverpool be interesting you've just got me all nervous again now for no reason june the 20th well there you go it's you know that seems probably about right we did the 12th and then we knew that people wanted to put it back a little bit given the wafford situation and the Bournemouth and everything going back but so june the 20th very very interesting day over there not a game i'll be looking forward to the first game back but what can you do what can you do um for me that is that is actually if that were the case then that would be a great game for everton because you know obviously there's nothing to lose for everton in that sense in you know in the game it's it is the first game back after a big break nobody's got any great expectations but you know Liverpool are trying to win the title still and and everson can beat them and you know get some local bragging rights i think i i i actually think it's it's it i mean there's some logistical things be it you know to sort out but what a game to come back with you know i don't think there's a better game to come back with and and the tv will definitely be thinking that way as well so you know an everson fan as an everton fan you'd be saying 100 give me that game let's let's let's play that game while Liverpool still can't win the league you know because they need to beat everton and then you know and then go on and win another game so that you'd want to you'd want to play Liverpool to beat them to make to prolong them having to win the league as an everton fan for sure they'll be probably probably accurate that will beat them when none of our fans are in the stadium to witness it yeah it won't be great um and just finally sorry this just come back into me i just very finally what's your opinion on the neutral venue do you think it's it's better for them just to play at the stadiums like they are in germany or do you think that the neutral venue thing should be should be held up and everybody should play at neutral venues and but i'm glad you've asked me that um because it's sort of angered me this a tiny bit about neutral venues it was kind of the police and actually the government a little bit pushing the neutral venue idea and to me that smacks a bit of this whole thing we've always had in this country around football fans as being this different breeds who have to be treated in a certain way and i think it was a i've heard the word insulting bandit or band around i think it's even worse than that i think it's kind of slightly dehumanising because look what you're saying is football fans can't be can't be trusted to behave like the rest of society you know like men you know dominant Cummings doesn't behave like the rest of us but most of us have respected this lockdown you know and you don't see mass like in america people protesting taking guns out you know saying i want on my right it's all crazy this country you've not seen that we've respected as i say apart from uh unless you're a Tory Tory bigwig and you can do whatever you like but um so why why are football fans going to be different you know why are they going to why are 40 000 people going to stand outside goodison in the plain Liverpool you know it's just it's it's to me it's not only insulting it is dehumanising and wrong and i think you've got to come at a different way and say we've trusted the people so far in this lockdown we we want to trust them again and and why not i think the police are capable of dealing with it i think the clubs are capable of presenting a coherent argument to their fans and and a compelling case not to turn up outside grounds and i think you know let's let's not go down that road because we know where it takes us when you dehumanise football fans when you make them out to be these people that you cannot be trusted in any way that are going to do these violent crazy terrible things then we end up in a you know in a in a terrible place so i actually believe that we'll be played on on each each club's home stadiums now you know home in a way as as as it should be i think that will be the case and i think it's right i really do david brilliant scatting to you today thank you so much for for taking time out of your day to join us you had to sleach back your hair to do it as well but it looks good it looks good mate it looks good listen thanks a lot i've enjoyed it it's been great and actually i've just noticed the sun's come out as well so i can get back in the garden now go and enjoy the sun and listen stay safe thanks very much and when we can get back in and see us very soon out next year yeah definitely cheers david thanks a lot