 First we have, now that we're back on Zoom meeting, just make sure, I know Ellie's already on and Carl and Owen. So if there's anybody else that happens to get on, Therese will have to just maybe call them out as they keep the rolling tally of people, so. Dave, that is not on. Yeah. Yeah, no, Dave, yeah. Probably down at the town hall trying to get in. Let me check my email. So far I don't see, I was just looking, but I think that covers everybody that's on right now. I'm just looking to see if I can call Dave Eddie. You want to call Dave? Okay. I'm not finding Dave Eddie's phone number in my contact, so I'll type call. You're just calling him right now. Okay, thank you. Yeah, I don't, he can catch up if he's coming. So we'll just move forward here first on the agendas to approve the agenda. And I'm just kind of looking to, Dave's on. There's Dave. So Carl on your end, are you willing to sit out the meeting? We were going to talk about the fourth class roads because it wasn't an agenda item, so we were going to talk about it at the end, but I'm more than willing to put you in there ahead of time if you don't feel like sitting around all night. Don't forget you're muted, Carl. Sorry. I just have a quick comment about it, and I can, that I didn't include in the reports, and I can make that during public comment. Sure, that's what I was gonna say. We could just do that right through public comment, so. Okay, perfect. So that was the addition was too, because I had done the agenda, and then even though I knew Carl's stuff was coming, I totally slipped my mind. So we should add that either at the end or fit it in wherever you want. Why don't you wait till I make my comment, and then you can decide what you want to do about it. Okay. Okay, sounds good. Any other changes on the agenda? We accept the agenda. Second. Second. Okay, all in favor? Aye. So we'll open it up to public comment. The now's the time to bring up anything that's not on the agenda for this evening. Yeah, just hold on one second, Carl, just for whoever else is on there. The easiest way, we'll let Carl go first, but the easiest way of anybody else has anything else that they wanna bring up. Usually you can in the messaging on the Zoom there, if you put a message in there or raise your hand up there, we'll call on you. If you're on the phone, if there happens to be a dead time space for Ellie, and if she wants to say anything, just take it off mute and talk at that point. So we'll let Carl go first. Yeah, okay. So I submitted those couple of reports on the roads that the committee went and looked at, and I just wanted them to get to the select board. But as you can see, if you've read through them, there are issues of private property rights and certain questions about legality. So I would suggest that you might wanna consider some of those issues before you, till you get some guidance on how to move forward in public. Right. So that was it. Well, I wanna say- Oh, and I would just wanna, if clearly if there's, after you get some guidance, we can try to clarify any questions anybody has. That's a thank you for it. I think they're great. And thank you, the committee has done a lot of work and they're so well written, which I appreciate. And I was reading it and I agree. So this was Harv and Don. But it was nice, the detail and the maps and you know, Carl, we don't get stuff like this. This is great. So I wanted to say thank you. And also thank you for fielding my question about the mud season. You know, it was just nice to kind of feel, I figured you had a mixed committee. So it was kind of nice to get your feedback. So I just wanted to say thanks. And if you could tell your committee, I said thank you and the reporting is superb. So thank you. Good. Yeah. I feel like we could, I could give you a quick update on the fourth class committee. We've found the files for every single road in the town and they actually are pretty well organized and we just felt like the report that you were asking for would be best in a narrative form. So that's what we took. So all right, appreciate it. And you can get in touch with us and at a later date. Okay, thank you. Great. All right, thanks. Did anybody from the board have any comments in regards to the material that Carl and the fourth class road committee had sent in? I thought that it did a good job. And I liked his comment on doing something about seasonal use of the four class roads to keep people from driving on them when it's money. You're actually the reason I, yeah, you're the reason I sent it to a mall. I said, hey, do me a favor. Cause I know that a mixed group of some people that like to, you know, do Jeep, some people ATV and they had a good group there. So I said, hey, you know, I'm kind of curious about your, how they all felt about class four. So that's why I sent it to them. And I, and he said that they'd talked about it before when he was a select board member, but he did never give them a good policy. But I did find a informational sheet from VLCT from the municipal assistance center about restricting the use of roads during month season actually gives you a resolution and some good information. But I was curious, you know, how they felt about it. So I thought it was, you know, it would get their, their inputs. So I'm definitely going to put that on a future agenda. That's good. Do we know if any of the, do we know if any of the, our neighboring towns restrict the use of fourth class roads and, you know, in seasonality into things and if so, what their feedback may be on that? I have no idea. I don't know. If any, I don't know if anybody else knows or we could ask. So Teresa, on some of these more specific examples with recommendations that fourth class road had looked at, do you want to maybe take a look through those and you can maybe start putting those individually on the agenda where, when it's appropriate. Yep. We'll have to look at a couple and see what the, we may need some legal advice. So that's good. Yep. Is there anything Carl from, from the board that you need at this point to keep being successful of what you guys are doing? The basic answer is no, but it has been a good jumpstart to have a couple of issues handed to us to look into it. So we've made our coins with the existing records and we have some ideas about how to make them a more dynamic, useful resource and I think that the narrative is something we're going to be adding to pretty much every one of the folders to try to help describe and reference. There was a couple of folders have things like that that came from newspaper articles that went or from reports to particular historians when they look into a road. So it's nice to have that contextual discussion. Thanks. Next time you get another idea, just shoot it our way. Otherwise we'll come up with something to work on. It looks like Dave had a question, but he hang on a second. Can you hear us Dave? Yeah, and it says you're unmuted. I gotcha. Might try to just re-signing out and signing back in. Sometimes if you don't connect to audio, when you sign in. Okay. Yeah, make sure you connect to the computer audio when he's, yeah, that's it. Let's see if, where did he go? I guess he left. So maybe he just said- All of our advice. Okay, but yeah, he says he has a question for Carl. I am unmuted, but seem not to hear me. So it must be, he's gonna try again. He's just gonna log back in again. So current membership with you guys, Carl, is three? Well, we have five, but in the last couple meetings we've only had three. We had a Zoom slash phone call the other night meeting and that was, it worked out pretty well. None of us had to go take a shower. We could leave work 15 minutes before we had to meet. But yeah, five people and I think we could have more. It's clearly just five people who've been interested in it, but it's five people who are interested in the issues and we've been kind of stimulated by the historical controversy, so to speak. Oh, there he is. Can we hear you, Dave? I think he had that issue once before when we first started Zoom. Nope, I guess he's still the same. Type it. Yeah, Dave, can you, let me just send you a message. Dave, can you, let me just send him an email. Okay, two, let me just text to me, send him a chat. Dave, you could try calling in. You can leave the video on because you're not gonna get river, like the feedback. If we can't hear you, that won't be an issue, but you could call on a phone. I just sent him a message that he could call in or type out his question. We're still light years ahead of our first one that we did back in March. I remember we had like, if I remember right, the number didn't work or something, remember we had to like redo it the last second? I think he's probably dialing in, maybe. So he's typing out the question. Trudyce, I appreciated that the agenda had the link in it and it was a Word document, so we could actually use the link as opposed to the PDF where you can't use the link. Yes, I- Right, then he had to type it in. Kelly, I think usually just scans it out and I attached it because I had to do it. So no, I thought that would be, because I was like, all right, this is a problem. People can't find the link. So, and I also make sure on the website, that you can get it there, but let's see, he's not typing. He's unmuted, but- It's astounding how well it works though. Dave's gonna have a super deal for somebody with a used computer here at the end. Works great until it does. Oh, maybe we can hear him now. Well, that was Judy. Oh. You don't have to let him know he's losing his comp time right now. Yeah. Yeah, that's a good message. I think he can hear. Yeah, I had that issue one time before I didn't, some reason I didn't click the connect to computer audio piece of it and it looks like he's typing something. Okay, does not work. I will be quiet. He said I was connected. All right. He's in timeout. Dave's in timeout for the night. All right. All right. So we'll, is there anything else for Carl or fourth class Rhodes? And again, we appreciate all the hard work you guys are doing. We'll try to find some more projects for you, Carl. All right, great. Thanks. Have a good night. You too. Thanks, Carl. We're still in public comment. So if there's anything, well, I guess Theresa have you caught up with the other joinees to the meeting? Yeah, everybody's here. I can see there's Jesse, there's Leonard and Thomas, Andrew or Rita, and then the other phone is Ellie. So we should be good. We're still in public comment or inquiry. So if there's anything that's not on the agenda this evening that anybody would like to discuss. Now's the time to do it. If you can, if you're on the computer, just maybe just type into the comment bar, you know, that you would like to speak and we'll just call on you. If you're on the phone, just feel free at this point, you can unmute yourself and ask a question. I can't, for some reason, I can't see the comments right now, Theresa. I don't have any. There's no comments right now. So. So here in none, we'll move on. Our first agenda item is the grant submission for the Vermont Department of Forest Parks and Recreation that the WREC committee is working on for some extra capital for the skate park. I think Ellie is on the telephone. Yes, I am on the telephone. In 2018, we had information to apply for the Land Water Conservation Fund, which this is, this is what we want to do. Greg Maggard, the town manager, he wrote the application. He submitted the application. He wrote it himself. He did get information from the committee when writing it and he submitted it and it was approved in the first round that was in December, 2018. And then we did a presentation in January. He and Dietrich and I went to Montpelier and did a presentation. The Land Water Conservation Committee had 10 towns apply that year and I was looking for the application and Therese looked in the office for me too because I think that that year applied for 50,000 because Greg said, well, we'll apply for 50,000 because the town has okayed at the town meetings to give us 50,000. So I'm not sure that's the amount we applied for. It might have been more because we had some fundraising on Tommy Hawk and Levec. So it might have been a little bit more, but anyway, so anyway, we did the presentation. We came in eight, eight of the 10 towns and they had money enough for seven. So we just missed it. And so the feedback I got from the program manager, Jessica Savage was that in a couple of years you can apply again. You had a good application, but we felt short in the presentation. So I have been in contact with Jessica Savage since then and she let me know in August of 2020 that it was coming out and that we were, it would be coming out and we could apply again. So that's what we're trying to do. I have gotten David Allen to help us with this. He helped us with the Terran Foundation grant. And so he's got all the information to help us with it. And so that's where we stand. Do we know if this grant has any matching fun parts to it, Therese? I don't, that's my question for Ellie, because where is it? Yeah, it would be that and basically what we did because our matching was what the town voted for. So what I was trying to see and what I put in there is that to show them that we have met their means of matching by way of the town voting for the 50,000 and our fundraising and stuff like that and see if they will count that as what they counted two years ago. So you're saying it's a, so if you get 50,000, you're saying the match is 50,000. Right, and I'm trying to prove to them that we have met the requirement by already putting in the 50,000 for what we've done so far. Okay, so basically what you're saying to them is we don't have a $50,000 match. What we have is already in the ground. Right. Okay. Do you know, Therese, like in the history of doing grants, will they accept a match as they passed or? I've never written the land, water conservation grant. So I don't know. I think that, Ellie, I think you should ask somebody before you waste the effort of writing the grant because I... Well, I've been in contact with Jessica and yeah, and I think it's worth a try. I'm always worth trying. And I've been in contact with Jessica and so far she's been right on encouraging us to do it. Even though she realizes you do not have, nor will have a $50,000 cash match. Well, she probably doesn't realize that yet. So I should, and I can correspond with her about that. I would, Ellie, just because you don't wanna waste your precious time writing a grant when, if you have to have the cash because you don't, and I wouldn't hate to see you and your committee put a lot of time in because I know that's a big grant to write. I would hate to see you put a lot of time into it and they say, unless you have the cash match, you can't apply because obviously you don't have the cash match. Right, right. Yeah, I would. Okay, I can do that. But also could, as a backup plan, could we buy from the Improvement Fund by any chance? No, I don't think so because you guys still have to pay $10,000. Yeah, I know. Yeah, I do know that. That we have $10,000. We do have the Terran Foundation has let us know that they are meeting in December. So we're supposed to hear about that $15,000 from them soon. Great. Yeah, so okay, so I will correspond with her and see what they say to that. Yeah, maybe they'll do it. That'd be great. Ellie, if you have Jessica on the line, it would probably also be worth finding out if they don't accept the previous cash match, would they accept in-kind match? Like if the town crew did some prep work on the site, things like that, like if you've got her on the phone and it's a no answer, find out if in-kind would work as well because that might still play to your advantage. Okay, all right. Yeah, okay, all right. I will do that. And I would just suggest is getting back to Teresa and letting her know the direction of which, you're able to go on that. I mean, you don't need a formal motion to approve the submittal of a grant. I know at the select board level, we like to know what grants are being written, but doesn't necessarily do it. Okay. All right, anybody, anybody have any questions on the board in regards to the land, water and conservation grant? No, just the same things we've talked about. Okay, all right, thanks, Ellie. Just let Teresa know what you need to get back from them. Okay, we'll do. Hello. I, Dave, we can hear you. Yeah, we got a new computer. I told you he was going to have a cheap one after this for somebody. That is a cheap computer. Hey, this isn't really cheap computer. It's not my Apple. So I don't, I don't know what's going on, but anyway, I do want to talk to Carl sometime because I had a question, even though I couldn't, I put it on the chat, but I guess you couldn't see it. I couldn't know. Whatever. Yeah, I think Carl has dropped off the phone call. But just so you know what I'm talking about, as I read that, they seemed very similar in his description and discussion. The only difference that I really noticed was that 42 had was, the layout was from another road, this old stage road. So that they discontinued in 2015, the other road, but 42 has not been discontinued. Now, 99 is also have a landowner that might want to use that for access to the backside of his property. So that was my question. If they'd looked at that. If they'd looked at landowner access. Right, because they talked about that on 42, right away in landowner access. Yeah. 99, he kind of pretty much says, no, we don't need to do that. It's okay. But I know from hearing in the past, and I thought it was at a slick board meeting that landowner was part of that reason that came up was he would like access to some of his back property. Okay. All right, we can, I can ask, I'll make a note on that one and ask Carl about it. Okay. Sounds like on from what Carl had said and you know what Teresa was saying earlier was, you know, even with the recommendations from the fourth class roads, it sounds like on those cases, we're going to have to go through and get legal opinion. Yeah, especially 40 reach out to all the abutting landowners. Yeah. Directed by it. Anyways, but. But we can't create landlocked land either. Right. So there would, yeah. So there's quite the process to go through on that. Definitely something that's not going to be done here in the next. Or two, it's going to be a, you know, months type deal. So. Well, like I said, my question was the, he treated them differently. But I wouldn't guess why because he talked about, you know, obscurity, where the roadbed might be. And so far, so far with both of them. So why 99 was he's ready to throw it up if we get the right legal opinion and not so much on 42. That's my question. Okay. I'll ask him. I'll ask him. I was just writing it down. So I'll ask him and let you know, Dave. Thank you. You're welcome. All right. And we have an appointment for. Recreation committee member. Trying to find it here in my stack of papers. I believe her name is Lindsay. Yep. Lindsay shell. And she's attended a meeting. Yeah. All right. Excuse me. Yeah. She attended and she's, um, she's a teacher. Yeah. Her background is, um, recreation. Um, she's got a degree in. And, um, some sort of recreation and she works as a toddler teacher at, um, at magic mountain. Yeah. Sounds like a good. Yeah. Therapeutic recreation. That's, that's interesting. Yeah. Yeah. So I guess, uh, if I could, uh, If I could get a motion to appoint, um, her to the recreation committee. So move. Second. Okay. All in favor. All right. So where does that put that now? Um, with committee members. Um, uh, let's see. Um, It's a six. Um, Cause wait a minute. One, two, three, four, five. Oh, seven, eight. That's good. So we're. I think last year at this time, would you have about three? Yeah. Yeah. You got the biggest committee. Oh, thank you. So that, no, it's, you know, it's good that, you know, People are expressing interest in. And some of these, um, committees that. Um, you know, we were lacking. Attendees are. Strength again. So. Okay. And the other appointment is. We have Mackenzie Hill to the. Equity and inclusion committee. There should have been a letter in your packets for that. Some people got it. Some people didn't because I had. Okay. With me when I was, um, when I sent the packet. Um, out because I was working from home, but, um, and she attended the equity and inclusion committee meeting, um, last Thursday and she had some good input and, you know, it was very positive. And I think that she, you know, I think she's going to be a good addition to that committee. Do you have the letter trees? You can, I didn't get one in the packet. Can you just give me a little background? Sure. It says, hello, my name is Mackenzie Gale Hill. I'm a resident of Bethel. I'm 18 years old and just recently graduated high school. I'm a part time student Evermont technical college. I'm studying art so I can one day, day be a concept artist. I have helped volunteer with project happy holidays, green up day and Bethel rotary. I enjoy giving back to the community I've grown up in. I'm interested in being part of the equity and inclusion committee because I want to help kids and others in our small town feel safe and welcomed no matter their race or sexuality. I would like to contribute more of my time to a community that has helped me. Thank you for your consideration. Mackenzie Hill. And she participated in the meeting and, you know, she, she had some good things to say and was definitely taking it in. I think that she'll be a good member. It was also nice to have a young person, you know, involved in town government. So I think. I don't, there's no reason she shouldn't be appointed. I think she'll, she'll be good. Thank you. So. Just need a motion to appoint Mackenzie Hill. Move. Second. All in favor. Hi. Hi. How many does that make on that, on that committee? Um, let's see. So there's Jesse Owen. David Christy Laura. Mackenzie Tristan. Seven or eight. I think. That's seven. Yeah. I'm missing anybody. Oh, and. Oh, Rita Rita. Rita makes eight. Yep. Good. You want to say something, Owen? I can't hear you. Oh, sorry. There you go. Hello. There he is. I think so. There I can hear you. Disconnected. How's that? There you go. Better. Okay. I just wanted to say, um, To Ellie or anybody on the rec committee, if you need any help with the grant, let me know. That's something that I do on the side for a living. So just let me know. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, and thank you. You're welcome. Right. Oh, and right. Eight people on the committee. I was just counting. Yeah, I don't know if you can hear me. Okay. So yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Very good. Two committees that seem to be. Yeah. Pretty much at full capacity. So that's good. Now we just need a little more for the planning commission. That's right. Getting there one at a time, but that's right. You know, I'm still working on letter to Thomas. Be my new planning commission members. Dangle the carrot. Okay. All right. Any, any further discussion on the two appointments? Well, good moving on. Okay. And we have the, um, The motion this evening to adopt the town plan. Did we have any further discussions in regards to the town plan from the last meeting? I don't, I didn't hear anything from anybody. I just wanted to make sure that we have a meeting. Um, So I'm moving handicapped. So leaving it accessible, which was a Laura's suggestion. So Perez. So I did that. Um, the two spaces. And I think there was maybe one other adjustment and I made those. And obviously. Two rivers has planned their time to adopt ours. So I told them, you know, you guys were going to make the motion tonight, which is good. That works out good because they already have a meeting warned on the next meeting, which is next, but I think it was great. People were, I figured, you know, must have been really happy with it considering there weren't a lot of changes during your, um, public hearing. Yeah. I mean, like we were saying before the, you know, when we did the other town plan, um, Five years ago, I mean, it was, you know, it was a lot to handle at the time because we had the bylaws, the town plan, the river core, our stuff coming down from the state. And, you know, it was a lot of information to sort through. And I bet everybody was, you know, all the landowners were accounted for and had, you know, the opportunity to voice their opinions and be heard and change some language and it would back and forth with me. So I was there with some clarification on the timeframes. Up at the front of the town plan. There was seemed to be confusion about what those five years or eight years. Yeah, I looked and it says what my, my, once I did a little more research, it looks like. I think you have to have one done within eight years, but it sounds like they kind of get you on this five year cycle because I looked at the law and it does say eight years. But yeah, it also says they expect you to work at every five. So I left the wording as is because exactly the way I got it from two rivers. Okay. I looked at the statute. And so it was still was one of those things that was clear as mud. So I left it alone. But I wonder if it's you, you know, if you don't have one that you're not working on, they maybe they renew it will let you do like a renewal in that timeframe. But I'm, I think we stick with the five years, but. Yeah, because we've got an extension. At one point, didn't we get an extension? You probably did. Makes sense. Why? Because when you, especially if you're in something big like that river corridor, it can take a while to pass. So my, maybe they leave you that leeway in case you need that extension. I think we had an extension this year too. Yeah. Yeah. It was like a six month extension. Yeah. There was, there was something. It was not, it was small. It was not like a year. Yeah, I don't know. I believe on these that, um, if you don't act within a certain amount of time, then your current one just becomes valid. Running under your current one again. Yeah. I think that's true. And they probably plan some of that out too, because there's grant money associated sometimes with this and. Yeah. You know, making sure that everybody's spaced out enough for the grant money. And the process takes what a year or two to put the plan. How big of a rewrite. Yeah. You know, and I think too, because you're. You know, you're trying not to be overly specific. I mean, they want you to be specific, but yet at the same time, it's a trick. Because you're, you don't want to put something in there. That's never going to come to fruition either. So. But, so I made those couple of changes that came up at your, at your, um, public hearing. And that was it. And I've sent the copy to two rivers and, you know, waiting once you guys adopted, there's, you know, I have to do some other stuff on my end, but watch it with the counter and things like that. I have a quick question that just came up because of the discussions we've been having. It's not going to change the motion to accept it. But, um, In the discussion of the handicap parking spaces in downtown. I had always been under the impression that the two spaces directly next next to maskoma bank. And you can even sort of see where they're the extra, um, sort of whites. Hash marks, um, that those two spaces were handicap accessible spaces, but they're not signed. And currently there've been some tenants that live on main street that have been parking in them. Um, And I'm just wondering if anybody remembers a moment in time where those were assigned or if they were designated as handicapped. Accessible spaces. Um, I don't recall them being signed, but I had sort of always been under the impression that they were. And so my brain had just sort of said, oh yeah, of course they were, but there are no, there are no signs there now. And you know, if anybody else had any recollections of that. I can look in the parking ordinance because it should list them there. Um, so it's the two in front of. Yeah. Directly next to the building. And you can even see their, their spaced out as, as though they were at some point in time. The accessibility ones. They have the extra spacing. On main street though. In the parking. In the municipal parking lot. Yeah. Parking lot. Yeah. Next to the building on the right. Yeah. So it's, it goes like the building, then there's two spaces and then the mass coma designated parking spot start. So there's actually two. You know, Oversized spaces that one in front of the other. Right. Yeah. Right next to each other. Yep. The same lane, huh? That seems like a crazy spot for them because there are statutory requirements for. Parking. So I'll double check, but two. Beside. Yeah. It was more just, I came up because of Laura's comment and I, I meant to ask it. Of you. Prior to this. I'll look in the municipal parking ordinance and let you know. Thanks. I think because of the slope, they might not be qualified for. Might be better off having them down on the front end and instead of the back end. And there's also specific, you know, specifications. You know, obviously a handicap space has to be a specific size and how many per parking spaces. It's all, you know, I'm sure Chris can tell you that it's all, you know, driven by numbers. You have to have. One. Parking spot per X. So. But I'll look in the ordinance and let you know, Linda. Thanks. And I don't, I do know from. Freeing the road there five years ago. That the. The major issue that we have through there and everybody that drives through their daily nose. Is that the streets not wide enough. And the street technically isn't legally wide enough to have. Two lanes of traffic and two Parkinson's, you know, parking on each side. And I, and when you get into the handicap. End of things, you know, the parking spot has to be a certain width to be able to accommodate that. And currently with allowing parking on both sides of the road through there. I don't think legally you could put a handicap parking. Through there. Without either taking away parking from one street or the other to the other side. So that's the challenge. The challenges that we have that we've. Have started to address, you know, what the long-term parking looks like in the downtown. But definitely. We do have those challenges down there. I guess that's a question I have then. Or more Dave Eddie is. Has, and I'm trying to remember as a kid. Did Beth will always allow parking on both sides. I don't remember. I don't remember. I don't remember. I was shaking his head. Yes. I was sure I couldn't remember. Handicap parking next to mass coma. At that time that was bank property. So it was privately owned. So it might not be anything in the, in a town records on it. Okay. Thank you. I think I remember seeing handicap. Parking. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know what to ask or. To be angular parking in front of central market. Yeah. Okay. I'll still look Lindley. Someone that might be a world of knowledge on that. Be someone like Chris bump or something might know. Legally what you need to. Yeah. To have a handicap. I don't know. Tip downs or transitions to sidewalk and all that. Did we have any other discussion in regards to the town plan? Or are we. If not good to, for somebody to make a motion to adopt. The. Town plan. Oh, Mo. Okay. On favor. Hi. Hi. Is. Good. And I believe now that we've adopted it, it becomes down plan immediately. Is that correct? Yes. So. Okay. And the energy compliance resolution. So this you'll have to sign. So I will put this on a clipboard and people can come in. The back door, you know, to my office. I'll just put on a clipboard right there for you guys to sign. So I can get it to. Okay. So. So this is something that we need to do by statute and. We'll take care of an issue our certificate. Okay. So we just need a motion to adopt the energy compliance resolution. Second. Okay. All in favor. I know it's not directly tied to this, but I thought it was kind of interesting as. You know, remember how the energy committee was working on. Well, up to, you know, one or two. Power stations in the downtown. That has been talked about over the last two or three years. And then. And then the state of Vermont, you know, decided to put the park and ride in down by the interstate, which they've. Mostly constructed. And that's supposed to have like 22 charging stations, but. I don't know. I don't know. I just barely put the lights up, but I don't see any indication that charging stations are going in there. So I don't know if. If that got pulled away or. I don't know. I haven't heard installment another time, but. Yeah, I was wondering that I noticed there was nothing, no infrastructure for it. Yeah, nothing. It's not like they left like, you know, here's conduits with lawyers to plug in to put, you know, maybe they're waiting on the stations themselves, but there's nothing. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. The only thing that was sitting there was just, they're waiting for the. The light, the lighting, you know, mass polls to come in, which they came in, they've been erected and. Yeah. Nothing else there. So maybe something for the energy committee to maybe look into. You know, I know the reason why we pulled the plug on the whole one in the downtown just didn't make sense to have one in the downtown. There was going to be 20 of them out by the interstate, and then the other one in the downtown was the cost was the fact. Yeah, sure. We're going to have to maintain that sucker after, I mean, they've got granted back out for it now. And I'm sure that Nicole and her committee will be all over it, but part of the deal was for those things as, you know, just if it's. Is a, I'm not sure how many people it's really going to bring to Beth all it takes up a parking spot, but also it was after it. You know, once the warranty runs out, that, that could be a pricey situation. Oh, no doubt. Yeah. I just thought it was interesting because I just have noticed that. Yeah. Like Linda was saying, there's no infrastructure for anything there. Yeah. I'll ask. I'll find out. I don't know if it just. Cause that was supposed to put Bethel and Wilton on the map. Yeah. So. I'll find out about it. And then we had the mask on the debt services note. So yeah, you can see that we'd had, I think someone else had had this question when the auditors went through the schedule. They asked me why, you know, how come I hadn't paid the whole thing. And I'm like, well, I didn't get a bill. And then when I went through their change in terms agreement, the loan date was listed as 1120. 1120. 2113, but the maturity date was listed as 1118. 2043. So I emailed Beth. And was like, Hey, I think there's something wrong here. And she was like, yes, she's like, that's, and you can see her. I gave you a copy of her. The email. I tried to piece it together. So, you know, she gave us a couple options. And she said, you know, I'm not going to pay the loan payment or Rhea. I'm a tricer. And I'm like, why don't you just give us the year back, you know, and let us just pay one more year. And she said, sure. I'm just an agreement on the part of the select board. That due to the billing error, they're requesting the extra year. She said that was totally fine with her. Did they give us back the interest payment for that year too? No, no, I paid the interest. Of course not. Lily's laughing. But, uh, the information is here and I didn't see it. It's a little funky. What, what would have been, because there was some discussions in there about the town could make the principal payment. Well, yeah, last year we could, what is that principal payment? So it was like the, we had budgeted for 82,000, but we'd paid, you know, that principal payment now, because the year's already closed. So I can't go back and make a principal payment, obviously, I can't access it. I guess the only thing that kind of doesn't sit well with me is just that, you know, we lost our ability to make our principal payment on it, so that, you know, we're gonna be again, hit with interest on the full note next year, and they collected an interest payment this year from us. So they're, in a way, they're gonna end up coming away with one extra interest payment. Had this a lot, so I'm seeing this differently. Yeah. So, which I feel is fair, I mean. Right, we could, I mean, you could. I know they said at the end, we could make our, you know, gonna make a balloon payment at the end, but I mean, it's their error, it's not ours. It's not like- I guess I'll ask her when I email her back what this, I'll make a note about that and ask her. Tell her that board's concern about the extra interest payment. Well, that's just my opinion. I don't know what the rest of the board members feel, but. I agree. Oh, yeah. We shouldn't have to pay the extra interest payment because of an error that they made. There's software. Right, and that's Theresa in a position now where we can't pay the principal, you know, we can't pay the principal, so now we're gonna get hit with a full interest on the principal. Or maybe the payment next year, we can just pay the principal and not the interest. I don't know. I mean, I don't know how it works. What our options are, but we still need to extend it just so it's correct. But, but yes, I will- Because- You know, I don't have to either. When we got the loan payment, I didn't, I was, I didn't think of it, thinking some loans we get, we make an interest payment one point of the year, then we make a principal payment later, and I was voting it. But I'll make it known. Now we need an extra interest payment due to your error, you know, options on that question mark. All right, so I'll ask her that and I'll find out. I mean, monopoly bank error in our favor, right? We get- Is that how it works? Totally how banks work, right? Yes, totally. Right, I thought. Oh, I, when, when does, when does the, or we have to be up this once a year? Oh, no, right now we have to do it because the terms are changed, I see. Yeah, it's longer term. This is your debt on the debt. So, so basically I'm just, she's just looking for a motion from the select board that due to billing error, we're requesting an extra year amortization. But at this point, if we make that motion, then we're kind of, we kind of locked into the new agreement. And at that point, the bank's gonna say, well, you know, tough. Yeah, let me see. When's the due date on this sucker? Oh, because I'd asked her for a new bill. That was part of it. Yeah, I mean, I could, I easy to see if this was our issue on our end and we shorted them or something, but clearly this, and they have, you know, it's clearly on their end. I mean, I guess I would feel more comfortable once hearing back from them on the plan on doing for us on the interest that we pay. Well, they're still gonna have to, they're still gonna have to extend your amortization schedule by a year because you're still gonna have a, you know, a principal payment. Well, I guess in fairness to us, if they're gonna extend the scheduled and they should reimburse us the interest payment, I guess. Well, we can table this next time. Maybe I'm just not a reasonable person, but that's the way I'm getting at it. He's always shaking his head. He wants his money back. That's right. Why don't we just table it to the... Yeah, I mean, what does the board feel? You want to table this? Yeah, it's only two weeks. Yeah, table it. It's not gonna really be a lot of money. It's all, I don't know what the number was, you said $42,000 interest. The next year's interest is gonna be 41 and change. Right. Because it goes out for 24 years and 25 years. I mean, I don't see her give us any money back, obviously, because we had access to their money. So we were still using their money, despite the fact that, and we would have paid that nonetheless, we just would have paid a principal payment too. So we'll see what she says. I'll talk to her about it. All right. Sounds good. And we have discussion in regards to town meeting day. So as we know with, as we know with, you know, the spiking of COVID, the governor's new mandates and directions that, you know, we are currently back into Zoom mode for our meetings. And, you know, we really at this point don't have the crystal ball to exactly what's gonna happen in early March. So the options, Teresa had run by these and, you know, being that we hold town meeting day in a public forum fashion, right now we can continue to do that as long as we can adhere to the governor's orders, which is no more than 75 individuals. But if you go back and you look at the footprint of the gymnasium versus one person per 100 square feet, it would be a max of 50 people that you could have, right? Based on the gymnasium. So we typically have around 200 individuals from the town and then usually probably another dozen non-voters that come in and out. So we're definitely shorted there. So the next thing we can look into is the Australian ballot, which from the information that's passed out, that the select board can decide to adopt the Australian ballot system for town meeting day. And the only reason why we can do that is it's in response to the concerns of COVID-19 Vermont Legislature passed Act 162. So it could allow the select board to temporarily for one year or two Australian ballot. So- And that's the key there is this is not an opt for fee. This is only a one-shot deal. This is- Yep. It's for this coming, you know, March 2021 meeting only. Chris had asked me to do a little research. So our last day to post a warning is January 31st by January 25th, anybody that wanted to run for select board or a Lister would have to have their consent of candidate form into the town clerk's office. But you don't have to petition because if you are from an Australian ballot town where you, you know, to get on a ballot, you have to get a petition of X amount of signatures, but they're waiving that requirement. So I, you know, Bethel's, you know, what I call Hootenholler town, you know, you vote from the floor. So, and it's a great tradition that you have. And it's, you know, but we're in kind of a time crunch here. So I looked at the calendar and our next meeting is December 14th. So at the latest you would have to make a decision that day, which isn't great for you guys because we could go through this whole process and then, you know, something terrific happens with COVID and it's COVID free, but even with the vaccine that's probably unlikely. So what this has you do is then we have informational hearing, you know, I was talking to Chris, I always recommend two because you're talking about the budget in advance. So you'd have to make a determination whether or not you want to spend the money to program the ballot machine and have special ballots printed or whether you're gonna hand count, you know, and just like you used to do here. So it would be all of your officers, excuse me, would be on the ballot and then the budget would be on the ballot. And if I'm correct, I'd have to double check but I feel like I feel pretty good about this. All of your social service appropriations are individual yes or no line items. They don't go as one group. You vote Red Cross, whatever, Tritown, transit, you know, I think they're all separate but I'd have to double check on that. Then of course you're gonna have your school budget which would be a separate ballot and then you'll have, and your school and your officers. So Pam obviously and I had this conversation so she's hoping one ballot would be, you know, who's running as school directors plus their budget and the other one would be the town ballot which obviously would include your budget. So, you know, obviously it's gonna be a lot different. I would not at all recommend doing what the state did which was mail ballots to everybody on your checklist. The always the process has been if you want absentee ballot call and one will be mailed to you. I would suggest that you, you know, that's the same process and you go through that. And then of course too, you would either, we already have permission to have the election at the school. So, you know, just as Pam, you know, held a great presidential election, she'd hold a great town meeting day election and people would be able to come in and, you know, obviously people would be wearing masks and just like she did, you know, for the presidential election which went wonderfully. So I'm sure it's nothing any of you wanna hear but because it's such a great tradition in Bethel but I'm not sure you really have a lot of choice here this year. Yeah, and like, and like Trace was saying in order to get this change temporarily for one year, there's a lot of pieces that have to get going and looking at it, we, you know, today we took, you know, town meeting day and started to back from those dates and you had to be like, what was it, six Monday, six previous- One day prior to the election. You know, to get people on the ballot and you know, you keep working back from that date and really gives us the 14th, which happens to be our next select board meetings when we would have to make a decision on it. So- Yeah, because then we can obviously, you know, we have the mail town report at least 10 days before the elections. We all know that goes to the printer, you know, in January, the end of January. So it's gonna be information. It's gonna be having Lisa, you know, once we do that, Lisa put an article in the paper. It's gonna be us advertising in the newspaper, on Facebook, on Trump Porch Forum. Obviously we'll put a big write-up in town report, which I hate to rely on because we get a lot of those, you know, back. And then we also get a lot of situations where people don't, you know, that's a bad thing about, when we had it in person, a lot of people would come and grab a town report at that point. So we will have to do a lot of public education about how to call and get a ballot and all that. So, but I'm sure the BCA and Bethel is, you know, you guys used to do this all the time. So I'm sure they're, you know, have that right now. Although you've never voted your budget that way, but- Yeah. I would think the only complications would be having to do the line item, human services appropriation part of it as opposed to dealing with it as a chunk, like we usually, like we usually do, that's gonna leave, that's another 18 or so slots that will have to be voted on. Yep, I know, it's true. I've seen other towns do it and sometimes it takes up for towns to do a lot of them. It's like one whole side of a legal-sized ballot, Paul. But, you know, even though you vote that as one question, you allow conversation on all parts of it. Do you know what I mean? Yes. So, you know, so I think that's why it's separate, but of course I will look into that and double check, but I have seen it that way in the past. I actually know towns that went to Austrian ballot on purpose for that article because they felt that people would vote stuff down and they didn't, so. So, but you're right. It's a lot of the ballot is that. So I- My opinion is, go ahead, Tris. No, that's it. No, my opinion is, I think we ought to just, it's pretty much mandated we got to do this, so we might as well agree to it tonight and so that Tris can get going on what she's got to do to get it together. And some of it's Pam, you know, she, we talked, she knows somebody who has a ballot that they, because they do this, you know, for towns that do this every year, it's the cake. I guess the question is whether or not the select board wants to pay the money to have the ballots specially printed so and also program the card for the tabulator or do they just want to hand count it? What's the expense on the card? Pam's, you know, Pam's out this week. My guess is that you're talking 800 to 1,000. Whoa. Because I'm pretty sure, I mean, I haven't done it for a few years, but I'm pretty sure that when I used to pay LHS, five or 800 and that was a few years ago. So my guess is it's got to be eight or more. And then of course the ballots have to be specially printed because you notice they have all those little black lines around it, it matches the counter. So they would have to go, I don't know who she uses. I always use L Brown and Sons and they print it and make sure it goes with the card and then it all goes through the reader. But certainly what we could do is certainly Pam and I could make phone calls to get actual costs on that. So I don't think you need to decide where the ballot is going to be printed because the consent of candidate forms aren't even due until January 25th. So you could approve the town meeting portion just so we could start looking into stuff and getting costs and letting people folks know that we're gonna go that route. And plus it would help me with the warning and some other stuff. But then Pam, when she gets back in vacation next week, she could call LHS and L Brown and Sons and get costs. So then on the 14th, we could give you an estimate and you could choose either hand count or machine. Obviously the machine is sweet. And when it goes through a bing bing, you're done. I think Dave and I are the only ones that have actually hand counted for elections and things every day. Yeah, I have. Yeah. One I wonder is if we're gonna find out that this is one of those costs that we're gonna get reimbursed for through the CARE Act or something, I don't know. I think they would qualify somehow. Yeah, I don't know. Well, I can have her get accurate costs. Yeah, the only thing we'd have to deal with is if there are any write-in names on some of the candidates. And that always happens, right? I mean, especially for local elections, that's a big thing. And if you have an empty Lister seat, for example, but still, you know, the laws, you gotta look at every ballot anyways, but at least if you went through the machine, you'd have a better idea of how many write-ins you were looking for, certainly to balance. So, you know, I mean, I can. And you probably have to figure into, I mean, typically at town meeting day, we have, you know, 200 votes from the floor. 160. And I would expect going to Australian ballot, you'll probably have more. Oh, yeah. So you just got to kind of, you know, if you do count them by hand, you know, that. Yeah, you could be doing. 200 could turn into 400, you know, but. Or more, especially because. Just something to think about there when we are talking about that piece of it. So. Especially, you know, you have people that just got used, they all voted the presidential election by mail. So people are used or, you know, are understanding that process better than they ever were. So you're right. I mean, you could see, you know, you could see, you know, 800 people. And all of a sudden you're going, ah, you know, I don't want to be hand counted. Yeah. You get an Australian ballot and it would be an all day thing, right? A seven to seven kind of a, yeah, I'm praying. Yeah. Whatever hours you normally run. Yeah. I think they do that in Randolph too. There's several of their articles that are voted Australian ballot. Yep. Worldhood does too. Okay. But just so you know, it's a one-shot deal. It's not every year after, but Chris, I think Lenny has a question. I have a question. If you are going to spend this money to do this for the Australian ballot and you don't get reimbursed, what's the reason this can't continue? What's the reason, oh, that you can't do it from year to year? Because I think this to me, it sounds like a greater to get more people involved in the town issues. So what's the reason? Like, let's say you go and do the Australian ballots, you get the machines, you do all that money you're putting out there. So typically, well, two part answer on it. So typically in order, the Vermont legislation is allowing the select boards to make a temporary decision to move to, if you do in-person elections to go to this Australian ballot for just one year. If the town wanted to, let's say, go to Australian ballot permanently, that would have to be voted on by the voters. So it would have to be a, it's own warning to everybody, go to one of the Australian ballot. I do know in, you know, Mo and others have been here longer than I have. I mean, the 15 years I've been here, well, some of the neatness about how we do elections and, you know, we even have, you know, TV stations that show up because, you know, we're probably one of a handful left in the state that still do meetings in-person. And, you know, it's kind of a, it's a uniqueness of our town of, you know, people take a part of their day to come and literally voice their opinions on the articles as they're brought forward. So... But there's only, nothing to worry about, there's voting this way, the gate still having the town meeting so people can do that. Yes. Yeah, it's like one or the other. Oh. Yes, what happens is with an Australian ballot is you have to have informational meetings. So, you know, within X amount of days prior to town meeting, you have an informational meeting which my experience coming from a town that used to vote Australian ballot, not a lot of people attend. And then there's that, you know, you don't have that face-to-face discussion about a budget item, they just have either hopefully read something you've published, read their town report or, you know, attended one of your budget informationals. Is it? That's a great job because you know, they have Pi and they have all their committees out and people get to see each other and it's this really wonderful way to connect and talk where if you go Australian ballot, you lose that. I mean, we still had Australian, you still had, we still had town meeting at night and we voted our budget only off the floor. All the officers were elected the next day via Australian ballot. But I think coming to Bethel was a great, you know, to see it like that is just really such a Vermont tradition. It's kind of neat to, you know, to see and be able to participate in and I think it's that nice sort of way to connect with people. And also too, Vermont law has changed. So you, you know, your employer, there's rules about them giving you town meeting off and how that works. There's specific state statute on that now. So hopefully that answered your question, Lenny, you know, kind of two part on how, how we could go about doing it permanently if you wanted to and then, you know. But I'm still wondering, why can't we have the best of both worlds? Just to double the advocate. Like I'm looking at it from a perspective of getting more people involved. And if you say to me only a certain number of people come to the town meetings and then you say with this Australian ballot, you might get double that, double that kind of participation in the voting processes then why can't we do both still? You know what I mean? I'm looking at, I'm just going to double the advocate. Yeah, no, no doubt. I mean, and I'm sure and you know, maybe it's something to look into. It's, you know, there's definitely pros and cons to everything, right? Yeah. You know, I know one of the really cool things that I liked about it was when I first came because the town I lived in previously, that's what you did. You got a packet in the mail. You know, it told you everything that you were going to vote on. They had informational meetings, but you're probably more apt to not, not visit the informational meeting. And then you kind of went, you went to the vote. I wouldn't say not as informed, but you know, you go vote and then, you know, they're kind of like a disconnect. It was all, you know, there wasn't really that connection. And then coming to Bethel was kind of neat because the first year, you know, lived here was, you know, you're all packed in a gymnasium. I came through when there was, there was some budgeting challenges. So there were people that got up and voiced their opinion about the budget and what they didn't want to see or what they wanted to see or, or, you know, making tweaks to the budget the last minute, like, you know, instead of, whatever, instead of $30,000 of this, we would like to see 40. And then they would make an adjustment from the floor to vote on that. And the process is really cool. And you know, you would have people that maybe on that day would run for some sort of position that normally maybe they wouldn't have, you know, because it was open and they'd get up and make a speech and, you know, it, you know, they got nominated by somebody. And second, it was pretty, it's a cool process. It really isn't, it's really too bad that more people would or don't take the time to participate in that because it's really a, to see it work is really cool. So it's true. And there is option, I'm sorry. And you can do some, you can do, maybe you just vote your officers by Australian ballot, but not your budget. So there's different ways, you know, different towns do it. But yeah, I think, I think that Chris hit the nail on the head by saying it's unfortunate. Sometimes people don't make the effort to come because it is a neat process. And I know towns that have changed their town meeting from a, you know, a Monday or Tuesday to a Saturday. And it has not changed. They still got the, you know, same amount of people, maybe just a little bit different group, but didn't really change their turnout. My experience was a little different, I have to say. When we first moved here, I went to the first town meeting after we moved. And if you were living this town for a long time, it might be different because, you know, a lot of people, I didn't knew anybody and I felt a little intimidated because I was asking myself like, okay, if there's an item that I wanted to vote against with Robert's rule being maybe the only person in the room who says nay, you know, I didn't feel really that great about it. So for me personally, it wasn't all that wonderful, you know? That's just my experience. Sure, I think that's the case when you're, you know, sure if you're feeling that way. And I think it's, I think that probably occurs even if you are a long time resident. Yeah, yeah. People are like, oh, you know, I've got it, but sometimes it's good because a no isn't met with this, oh, you know, sometimes it's met with a really good discussion or someone be like, oh, hey, you know, I didn't think of it that way. So I always felt that those nays or signs welcome because you were, helped everybody talk about it to figure out, see the other side or why someone felt that way. So plus you're missing really. I think another thing, you know, we could, we could probably talk, you know, probably have a whole select board meeting in regards to, you know, the election process in town. You know, and typically, you know, when we do have informational meetings, you will see that, you know, our attendance on an informational meeting, if that's the town plan or anything else is usually, you know, maybe 20 people, you know, at the most where another thing for having in person is you have 200 people in a room, right? And, you know, if they want to change something or, you know, a lot of people are heard at once where, you know, 20 people get on and, you know, then you're only up till 20 people changing the budget, let's say, rather than 200 people. But an ideal situation would be nice for everybody to turn out, right? Plus there's pie. Plus there's pie. And you get to see local legislators that will come and talk that normally you wouldn't get to see that. Our committees, the Girl Scouts come, do cookies, you know, so there's usually, we try to do a little more of an event than just voting, so. But do we want to, do we want to pose a motion tonight to adopt the Australian ballot system for temporary voting in the March 2nd, 2020? I think Leonard had something else to say. Well, just a question on, I wasn't quite clear on the town meeting. How is that going to take place? Is that going to take place? So what will happen, Lenny, is if we decide to go to Australian ballot, everything that normally we would do from the floor now would be on a ballot system. Right? So on that day, you'll have the whole day to go to the polls to vote the candidate for the budget. That's what I understood. Okay, I just wanted to make sure. Okay. And then what we'll do is we'll end up having probably two informational meetings prior to that to go over all the particulars of not just what's in the budget, but candidates that are running and any other nuances. Those would be Zoom meetings. Yes. Yeah. So this is Ellie, wouldn't it be March 2nd, 2021 instead of March 2nd, 2020? Yes. Actually, I forgot to change that. I had a note at the office. I think it's still on my desk. Thomas emailed me and said, hey, didn't you mean 2021? And I was like, oh, yes, I did. So thank you, Ellie. Well, we'd all like to go back to March 2nd, 2020 because we did have those issues, right? Yeah, Thomas emailed me today and I had a note to change it and I forgot. So yes, thank you, Ellie. And thank you, Thomas. What happens when you're doing six things at once? Yeah, that's the way. We're going back in time. That's right. So once we decide that we want to go this route, if we do, then there's no going back to the other way. If for some reason something happens that those restrictions are removed for as far as the numbers of people. Right, but what they're saying is in the literature we received was they were saying we could do it as close as 30 days prior. I mean, how in the board's name would you even be prepared to do that? And of course, yes, Lord willing, we've got a couple of vaccines approved by then, but really in all likelihood, the odds of everybody being vaccinated and us getting permission to do this are unlikely. I mean, I don't know. I've heard rumors about other towns going moving it to a different month so they can hold it outside. And I was like, yeah. Well, I mean, that's another option you could do is you could move your meeting to another date. But as far as the vaccine goes, it sounds like, you know, that in the early January and if everything goes well, that's when they'll start vaccinating individuals and it's a two-part vaccination. So if there's 40 million vaccinations, it's only 20 million people that are gonna get vaccinated. So, and then they said, obviously that'll be high risk and then anyway, it's not high risk. It's more like next summer, so. I'm right. And, you know, the idea of putting it off is just, I don't know, that's difficult too. I think people are used to it and, you know, when town meeting is and even, you know, someone, maybe it was DeTree or Pam, someone was telling me someone was gonna put it off to April and do it outside. She's like, April in Vermont, like gamble. I don't know, I might rather do it in March. Yeah, I know. So I was like, yeah. So yeah, if something changes, then. I don't know if it was last year or the year before, but we had town meeting day and it was really warm that day. And maybe it was the year before because I remember just pointing in on just my dress shirt and didn't have a coat this morning. So even, so the good thing is this, if the things changed, while we would still vote Australian ballot, you could at least do your informational hearings in person. Yeah, great. Yep. You know, that would be the only thing I could think of, Paul, that would change. How could you do that if you're limited? I mean, if we had that at the town hall and have a lot of people that wanted to come to that. Yeah, I'm saying only if things changed. Oh, okay, thank you. Yeah, that's what I meant. It was the only part I see that we would be able to change. If yes, if they increase the amount of people we have. So what does the board feel? Do we want to make a motion to move the 2021 town meeting to Australian ballot system? I guess I would like to see the dollars. How much to do the machine? Is there extra amount of money for the ballots that work in the machine? Is it $800? Is it $8,000? Well, we're not making that decision. I'm not doing that right now. This is just about whether or not we'll vote by Australian ballot, not how we'll do it. Well, if you say you're going to do by Australian ballot, you've made that decision. Well, as soon as you say Australian ballot, you've decided you're going to spend that money. No, she's saying, what I said earlier was I'd give you a cost so you guys could decide on December 14th either you're going to hand count it or you're going to go to the machine and have it programmed and have the ballots printed. So on the 14th, I'll give you a cost for you to make a choice on how you're going to count it. So I'm asking? Yeah, yeah, no, that's what I'm saying is I, yeah. And I could be high on my estimate. It's been a while since I've been a town clerk, so, but I'll go with whatever you guys say, that's my vote. Yeah, I think Pam told me that number was pretty close. I said 700, something like that. Yeah. I mean, again, I mean, we, you know, we, we could wait till the 14th to make the final decision and Teresa could start doing things behind the scenes as it seems to be favorable to start going that direction. And, you know, we could get some final information on what printing would cost, I guess. Sure. That's what we want to do or? Yeah, I mean, you know, it's the only thing I'm going to do is I will get costs or, you know, from LHS and from LH Brown and Sons About the Ballot. I will also ask out there if they think we're going to get any money for this, for the, you know, from the CARES Act to reimburse ourselves for this. And, you know, and then I'll know for drafting the warning. So that's fine. I don't, you know, I don't think that if you don't want to make a decision tonight, that's fine. I don't have a problem with that. I'll continue to move forward. Obviously, let's be frank. We don't have a choice. You're going Australian Ballot because you don't have a choice. You can't legally do this any other way. So I'm happy to move forward and get you some prices. And then we'll take a final vote on the 14th, whether you're going to hand count it or whether you're going to program the machine. And I'll also see if maybe if anybody knows if we're going to get any reimbursement of those costs. So we did get approval for our, grant for so far for COVID, but we'll see if they're going to let us add to it. That's all immaterial now. I mean, all we're doing is kicking the date down the road. So we might as well decide to do it tonight. And then we'll figure out how we're going to pay for it, which way we want to pay for it. Because all we're doing is kicking the can down the road for the date of when we're, because we got to do it. Yeah. You're right. Okay. So I guess if somebody wants to make a motion. Sure move. Second. Okay, all in favor? Aye. Sorry. Okay. It's like the eyes have it. Okay. And then Tariq, she'll give us, for the 14th, you'll give us some information on what it will come between, let's say regular printing for the ballots versus if we went to the machine. Mm-hmm. Okay. Absolutely. Can we, this information packet you gave us from Vermont League of City and Towns, very informative about that. Can we hope, put that on the website, the town website? Sure. So we can refer people to it that have questions. Once the word gets out that we've gone this route, we could direct them to, you know, to look at this information packet. It really covers pretty much everything. Yeah, they did a good job with breaking it out. I can also do a post on Front Porch Forum and put a link to it there too. A link, yeah. Yeah. And we'll definitely have to figure out how we're gonna inform everybody on, you know, because now there's gonna be different deadlines, right? There's gonna be deadline to, if you wanna run for a position, there's gonna be deadline for, you know, printing and, you know, everything else that comes with it. So I don't know how we get that out there if that's through the website or... Well, it's gonna be the newspaper, it's gonna be, you know, via the Herald and Front Porch Forum and Facebook and you're right. I mean, this way people are gonna have to say whether or not, you know, they're gonna run, you know, for, you're gonna have an open select board seat. And so people are gonna have to put their name in, you know, in advance. So it's printed on the ballot and they're consenting to it. So they're gonna know all these years. So we'll have to reach out to, you know, the Stan Capron and Jason Rogers, the people that fill in the town agencies and things and get them to agree in advance. And I was just thinking as well, we obviously need to get the town committee, town meeting day committee informed as well. Oh, sure. Yep, I'll let Rick... And they may be able to help with some of the process as well. Yeah, I'll let Rick Benson know. I think he's on that committee. I don't know if he chairs it or not, but I'll let him know and pay him the people. Yeah, I couldn't remember. It looks like Thomas has his hand. I'm just saying if you guys need any help with, if you decide for hand count or if you need any help with that or anything I'm volunteering for that. Oh, thank you. I'll let Pam know. She's the town clerk. So she's our local election official, but I will not... No, I was there for the presidential. Yeah, I'll let her know. I'll let her know. One thing too, Terese, because if we do go this direction, right? That we may want to... Well, sorry. We may want to ahead of time post what we believe are going to be the open positions. And then maybe, because it always comes up at town meeting day, there'll be certain positions that will... That maybe we can post a little description of what that position is for. I mean, we've done things in the past with like bailiff and there's what is that position really for? Okay, because you're going to have an opening on the slack board and a Lister position, I believe. But you're also going to have the other positions too. I mean, you're going to have the treasurer in the town clerk and you're going to have the person to pursue legal... Town agent and all those... Yeah. Yeah, and those guys will probably run again, certainly Pam is, but yeah. I know it always comes out to be, someone will say, well, what does the town agent do? You know, maybe we had a little blurb about what that is. Yeah, the Secretary of State puts something out that tells you what all the positions are about. So I bet, I'll ask Pam about that. Because I know usually, Mr. Benson does a good job of communicating that to everybody at town meeting day through moderator of what those positions and title before we vote on them. But, or take nominations. Well, we won't have to elect a moderator this year because we won't have an open meeting. That's right. There you go. That's right. That'll shorten it by a question. So yeah. Well, that brings up a good point. We can do these elections by Australian ballot, but do we still have to open and close a town meeting to legitimize the voting of these various topics? No. No. So you would still probably vote on the moderator. So you have one for next time, but we used to use the moderator, let me try to think. Well, this is unusual because you're doing every single question. So no, because you're going to Australian ballot poll, you're basically foregoing your town. Your town meeting is replaced by an informational meeting or hearing. I maybe some towns have their informational meeting chaired by their moderator. I don't know, I've never done it. So I've just done regular informational meetings and the select board chair has always run it. But no, but just like the presidential election or a state election, anything, it's set by its hours in the warning that's generated. And so I'll generate a warning just like we usually do for town meeting, but this time when you do an information and when I print certain items are informational discussion only because they'll be voted on and then you tell them where and when and that sort of thing. But that's a great question, but yeah, that's the way it works. Okay, and there won't be any pie. I know, we're all sad about the pie. This is gonna be the first holiday that we're all gonna lose weight. We can't have gatherings, now we can't have town meeting pie. We're all gonna be like 10 pounds lighter and we're gonna need to make this up like four people next year or something. We're gonna have to really like click it to get extra food. You really don't think that's gonna happen, do you? No, not a chance, but. You just flicked out of your waistline. I mean, come on, I can dream, right? So, all right, any further discussion on the town meeting day? Lisa had a question. You said, Chris, the eyes have it. Did someone say nay about voting on the Australian ballot? I believe Dave didn't vote for it, I don't believe. You say no, Dave. It's okay, we just wanna get it out. That's correct. Okay. No problem, we just want it right in the minutes. Right. And maybe, Teresa, at the next meeting, the 14th meeting, we just have a little more information on all. I'm sure this is gonna be a learning curve for you and everybody else. All the things we gotta do. Yeah, sure. To get this thing going. Yeah, it's really honestly, it's not, I mean, you'll have a regular select board meeting. That's most likely is gonna be your informational meeting. And sometimes, because you leave the fourth Monday of the month, so that will be your informational meeting, which is right before the election. Sometimes I used to hold a special meeting that third Monday before, instead of part of the select board. So you'll have two informational meetings and then it goes to, that you'll hold as a part of your regular select board meeting, most likely, unless you choose to do one as a special meeting. It's gonna be just a select board meeting and you're gonna be doing the same thing except fielding all your questions about, will be strictly about the budget. Okay. And then, and you know, so, but I'll let you know anything that comes up in the meantime. Sounds good. Okay, then we got the last piece of our budget discussion. We've been working on all the other pieces. We've got the public works, town office, constable fire department. Yeah. So this is still a draft because I have not gone over it with Alan. He was supposed to meet today, but he was busy. Something kind of came, all he was had to do something, East Bethel for the, putting up a guardrail here at East Bethel Bridge. So, so it's still like I said, so it's still in draft form, but I didn't try to, I tried to include everything. So I know it's still, this is obviously at 3.46%, which is higher than we wanna see it. I know that. And, but as I said, it's still a draft, but it's pretty complete. Not a lot of changes in the revenue. It was up, but mainly that was because of land use. And I did speak to both, to Judy and Louise about that to make sure I had the right number. I also revisited the rec fees with D-Tree. And since we wanna open the pool, but are unsure what the situation is gonna be with COVID, we just budgeted for pool passes but not lessons for like the younger kids because if they can't get it within six feet, if you have a young, maybe levels little to level three, COVID is still an issue. We can't get, you can't be that close to the kids. So we tried to budget money for the older children for lessons. So not a lot of change in the revenue. It's up over last year, but 5.78%, not a big jump in revenue, but we did take another stab at those. How do you wanna do this? Do you just wanna go department by department through the budget or do you just wanna ask questions where you have some? Well, I was just gonna, based on examining and I went through it with Therese pretty detailed earlier on the phone. So I could just give a brief overview of kind of how I see the budget after talking with Therese and then everybody else on the board can weigh in if you have any individual questions in regards to a certain item or any of the items I don't bring up. Just kind of looking at the budget overall, the revenues overall are up $3,000 from last year. And in this draft form anyways, the cost currently are up $75,000 from last year. So the net right now is an increase of $72,000 in budget, which if we approve the budget the way it is right now, that would be 3.67 cent increase. So just kind of going through some of the highlights of the budget. What I look for is any of the, any new items. So most of the items in this budget are the same thing it was last year would just slight adjustments due to you know, some insurance increases or something like that. These might one, two, three, four, five, six. So there was eight items that kind of stuck out for me. If you look at under the public works, there is a request in there to install a repeater on North Road. So there was $7,000 that's in there for that repeater. There's also under public works, you'll see that we've gone from $20,000 to $30,000 on the ditching item to increase some mileage on the ditching. Under the Constable item, you'll see there's an increase of $7,400 for the, well, I'll call it a new speed sign that has solar capabilities. The speed signs that we have are, I don't want to say outdated, but they're getting pretty weathered and need to be replaced. And, you know, these speed signs will be something more self efficient that you won't have to keep charging batteries and running in and out. People won't be calling in all the time to say, why is it not working or why did it work last week and not this week? I do know from town meeting day, probably about five years ago, six years ago, this was on the docket for town meeting where the townspeople at that time were spoke very positively on wanting the speed signs in the downtown. So now it's basically the time before we use grant money to buy the signs, now there is no grant money. So if we want to keep it going, we're going to have to purchase these. There's the under public, parks and public places, there's increased money in there as you saw for mowing equipment. There was some discussions that we've had over the past year, year and a half in return in regards to selling the band tracks and in return of selling the band tracks, buying a zero turn mower, sweeper attachment stuff. So that's in the budget. As it was brought up to our attention, was it last meeting and the one before in regards to the, I believe it was Linley, in regards to the wall in front of the municipal parking lot. So there's some money in there. We've increased that by 10,000 right now. We don't have the quotes for it, but increase the maintenance by 10,000 to do repairs to the stone wall in the municipal parking area. Under the town hall, if you've noticed out front of the town hall that there's some repointing of the bricks that needs to be done. So currently we're carrying some cost in there, waiting for again, A Mason to give us a quote on both of those items, the repointing and the wall. So there's an increase of $4,000 in there for the building repair. The library under appropriations, the library has asked for $2,500 extra dollars this year to replace some outdated computers. So that is in there. And then a combination between the capital improvement fund and moving forward with the new municipal garage, there's about an increase, usually we budget about $55,000 for the capital improvement plan. But if we move forward with the garage, we've budgeted a total of 80,000 this year, which would be money that we have in the fund plus paying our first payments on the garage type deal. So that's an overall increase of 25,000. So just those items, those eight items that I had there is about $73,000 in well, say extra costs that's in the budget, which about makes up the difference that we have. There's a couple of other things that just wanted to point out under the public works. Even though we don't have it currently, we do have it budgeted for hiring another full-time person with that also comes with full-time benefits because we don't know if the person's gonna take a family plan or not. So you'll see that the difference right now, there's about a $27,000 difference in the highway department and that is basically on that family plan. So if the person we hire takes the family plan, then it covers us. If the person that we hire doesn't have a family plan, then it saves us money on that. And then right now you'll see the E-Rath that we're budgeting $91,500 to pay the E-Rath, which would be a combination of the work that was done this year and covering the Pinella Bridge. And Theresa and I were talking a little bit about this earlier. So that would cover everything that we, over the last two years of and Pinella Bridge of what we would have to pay as a town. The Pinella Bridge, the likelihood on the schedule on that is, you know, realistically it's probably not gonna happen until summer, fall of next year. So even though we've accounted for all the E-Rath money, some of that E-Rath money might not have to happen until the year after, just do the construction sequences. And then there's an extra 20,000 that we put in there on the re-appraisal fund. And as we know that we have a re-appraisal that is upon us. And, you know, if that's in a year or two, and, you know, we had talked about some numbers in there on, you know, between $250 and $300,000 to have the town-wide re-appraisal done. And I believe where are we at currently with that? We're about halfway. Yeah, depending on the cost. What did I tell you? 160, I gave totally a number, I think. So, but yeah, we just don't know how much it's gonna cost for a town-wide re-appraisal, so. So those are just some numbers to kind of, you know, at this point, do we budget more money for the re-appraisal? At this point, do we not? Because we're gonna have to probably, for more money anyways, you know, so this is, think about that. I did, again, Tres, I got all these going backwards and forwards and sheets. Yeah, I think that was it. And that sounds like you hit the highlight. So that's just kind of in a nutshell how the budget looks. If anybody has anything specific that they would like to go through. Again, as Mo knows, we're, you know, we've again put $10,000 in the assessor services in the Lister line, just in case, because we're still a bunch of who will be doing what and will we have to outsource any of that? We were pretty fortunate that so far that we haven't, but we wanna make sure that we were covered in case we did. So a couple of things I wanted to mention were, yes, I'm waiting on a quote from the Mason for the town, for the municipal parking lot and just repointing the face of town hall. So I, you know, I'm not driving up money in there. I don't know. I'm not sure because I'm still waiting on that quote. So everything else in here, I think was pretty much explainable, obviously the flashing signs. I found a place to get them cheaper than the one we bought originally. I called the gentlemen and Barry Mahoud got their business name. And he said, those things basically are meant to fail. I feel like, you know, you've gotten a few years out of your two flashing signs, but I found a couple that are solar. So we would be able to, you know, be less maintenance. So we're not always trying to change the batteries out. And one of them, Richard is pretty sure that the motherboard fried in it. So when I called someone about fixing just that, he kind of laughed. And the motherboard on one of those is like 800 bucks. So that's kind of crazy. Yes, I budgeted some mowing equipment. You know, I feel like that's an area where a zero turn, you know, where a mower would actually make someone more productive and would actually free up some time. So while it's a, you know, a piece of equipment, it's still, you know, I think it would save us some man hours personally. I've got a question on that. Oh, sure. Instead of, what's the difference of the cost of having this sub-debt that people are doing in the cemeteries for doing all the mowing? That's a good- Would we save money? I don't know. That's a good question, Moe. I- Because we'd have less labor and no new machine. Yeah. Let me find out. I can ask S&S Otto. We'd actually only just have, you'd lose the maintenance on the equipment, but you still got the bodies, is still working the number of hours. So it's the equipment cost that would be different. So S&S Mowing quote on town property. Sure, I can get an estimate on that. That's a good idea. And I had, we had talked in the past about getting a zero turn if we sold the Ventrax, which I have not been able to sell the Ventrax. And we didn't even have anybody in. Well, I had hoped VTC would buy it, but it wasn't, they didn't feel it was, it wasn't gonna work for what they needed. It doesn't seem to work for what we needed. So we did have somebody possibly interested in a dealer out of Middlebury, but I haven't heard a number yet, but I have a feeling it's, you know, I'm not sure if it's gonna be what we wanted on it or not if it's half. So I kind of budgeted half the cost of the equipment in hopes I could sell the Ventrax because the longer we hold it, it's still not doing what we needed to do. But I can ask about, I can look at an S&S Mowing bill, Mow and figure out and find out what their hourly rate is and then ask Richard how much, how long it takes them to maybe kind of back into a number there. And then I can also ask them for a quote. They'd give you a bid on it anyways. Have we ever sold that case tractor from the sewer plant? Nope, we had, we had it out. Did it ever get it put out for bid? Yeah, honestly, I'm trying to remember. I don't think it has been. I don't think so because we were going to, and then we had COVID and we weren't gonna be able to let someone come and see it. And then I think we just got basically carried away with the whole water project, but I will double check on that because I know the board had given Tim the authority to sign the agreement and stuff. So let me follow up on that. I remember having a conversation with him at one point and we just hadn't got to it. And then, but I'll ask him about it because I know that that goes to the sewer fund. I remember you specifically saying that. So I'll make it a sewer sale. And COVID would make any difference on somebody coming looking at it anyways because it'd been an awful lot of equipment sold since March. Yeah, that's true. I know he's been busy. So he's probably not meeting anyone, but I'll ask him if he's put it out yet. I know we had a couple of people who would approach him about it. But I don't know if he ever put it on Craigslist. So that's a great question. I'll find it out. I'll ask him tomorrow. So that was, so see, so we hit those. And then... Back to the Ventrac for a minute. Yeah. The only difference is in what piece of equipment you have. I mean, Richard is working eight hours a day doing whatever. So if the Ventrac is functioning, the difference would be you'd have a cost for that zero turn more. It's not really going to change anything other than the equipment cost. Because he's there one way or the other doing something. Well, I guess what I'm assuming is obviously if it has a bigger mower deck and he can mow more, then yes, he'll still be working for the town, but maybe he won't be mowing. Maybe he'll be doing something else. And certainly the Ventrac has its issues. It doesn't seem like it was designed for what they wanted it for anyways, originally. But like I said, I know we had talked about getting rid of the Ventracs and I just haven't had anybody who wants to buy it. So it feels like, maybe we're not getting... It's just another piece of equipment that somebody bought that it wasn't really right for the job. So that's what we're doing. We're stuck with a yet another piece that's not quite doing it. So my concern is that in the past, it has not been put away properly at the end of the year and taken care of. So I'm feeling like maybe we should, if we could cut bait and get rid of it and get something we do need that could be taken care of, then we'd be in a better position. But like I said, I just put it in there because it was something we were still being on my end. The other thing was the talk about was the town garage. What you want to do there. So ideas I had was to set account of a cap of $700,000 for the town garage. We've had the structural engineer come through and take a look and that is gonna save us some money on that end of the building. So we could reuse that the steel on that side as well as the concrete. We will have to pour a little bit, put some stainless steel and some replaced some grates when you first come into the building where the floor drain is, but we could add on to the back. So what my thought was, we also have obviously a list now of problems at the town office. And so while we have updated the electrical and now have it spray foamed, we found out that the roof decking is rotten. We know the siding is rotten. We know I have a 10,000 gallon now fuel tank that apparently needs to come out. So all sorts of presence happening down there. So if you have about 225,000 in the town building fund, we could put that into the town office. Then you could borrow $700,000 for the town garage and we'd make a payment of about 50,000 a year for 20 years. So what we are putting away currently for the capital building fund is 55,000 a year. So we would be able to do both buildings and still put away 5,000 a year moving forward while you're making a loan payment. That would mean the town hall is repaired. The fire station is in good shape. We've been doing maintenance there. Then the town hall would, the town office would be fixed and the town garage would be. So you would end up with all of your town buildings, not sewer water, but the other buildings in functional condition. One of the biggest complaints I receive is about the town office. People say they come in and while there's some properties on South Main Street that are not attractive, people feel that the town office is also an eyesore. So right now we know we have issues. We need a new roof. We need insulation up there. All the fascia, the soft, it's all rotted. The siding is not in great shape. And so structurally it's sound. And as we all know, it doesn't owe you anything. You know, it was given to you. You've obviously not done much to maintain it. And you put a roof on it at some point, but which didn't work out for you. And sorry. And you made the town manager's office, but that's really it. So, and while I know it's tough to put a cap on the town garage, it is what it is. You know, we can only build what we can afford. We can't, you know, put a $1.5 million structure, which can't. That's, you know, and if we have to, when we put it out, if we have cuts we have to make up there, then so be it. You know, I like to say this is not build it and they will come, you know, we can't. You know, this is what we got. This is what we can afford. So that was my suggestion. I told you, I would try to get you two buildings for no raise in tax rate. And that's what that would do for you. But I did have to budget an extra money this time because I had kind of doing it. I need rent because I would have to put the town garage somewhere, you know, obviously. And we'd have to do something in the summertime or whenever when they were building it. I'm a little concerned about metal because of COVID, how far out of metal building would be, but I won't know until we put an RFP out. That loan process would have to go before the voters. Right, yep. And it could go on as a town meeting question. On the Australian ballot. And they'd end up with basically a depleted capital building fund except for the $5,000 amount, which is, if something went wrong somewhere else could get eaten up pretty quick. Sure, yep. But with, you know, the, we know the town garage, we know the fire department is in good shape. Their furnace is fine. We know the same thing about town hall. That's in good shape. You put a bunch of money in there. You're still making that loan payment. So really, as far as buildings go, it leaves you with the town office and the garage. We could also say, you know, we do less. And who knows once we get an estimate out there, the town garage or even the town office, maybe it comes in less than my estimate. Or maybe we say, okay, we're going to cap it. Maybe you want to leave 20,000 in the capital building fund. Then so we say, okay, we're going to spend X amount on the town office. And the same thing, we get what we get for that price. Does it make sense to roll this over into the discussion about the parcel on church street, town office? You can talk, yeah. Obviously that's on the agenda is the places I received a call. I talked to Chris about this, that I received a call from Mrs. Placy's nephew who said that apparently at one point, she, Mrs. Placy or Mr. had had a conversation with Dell Cloud and the town might be interested in the land next to the municipal parking lot up by the white church. I said, okay, I'll talk to the board. There was no more given. For me personally, my opinion is that I don't think we need anything else off the tax rolls. It's obviously, they have not evicted the tenant. I asked that, but there's somebody still living there. And if that property was to be cleaned up, you don't have a lot of land in the village. It would be nice for somebody to build a new home there, which would be nice increase of the tax rolls for you. I'm not sure what your plan had been in the past. I've heard rumor of town office. We're certainly not gonna build a new town office over there for 200,000. And then I'd heard rumor of tearing it down, the trailer out and then making it parking, which the municipal parking lot in the village isn't fully utilized, so I'm not sure. I guess I don't know the history of it, Paul. What was the plan? I think the thought was the municipal, that would be a place for the town office to go back in the past. If we're gonna put 270 some odd thousand dollars into the cremary, doesn't make sense to even think about doing something up there instead. Yeah, just to restate that, I was like 200 or 220 was the number for the town office. And it could be cheaper. I mean, I just, I added up a bunch of numbers together for different, you know, costs. And hopefully it comes in less than that. And we could also scale back. I mean, what we know what we have to do is the roof, the siding, you know, upstairs, insulate, put in, you know, we know there's some things we have to do. But obviously if we did nothing, what's gonna happen to them? Why would someone buy it if we were gonna sell the town office? And we also, you know, you're gonna try to sell it with a 10,000 gallon buried fuel tank that someone said, pull it before it leaks. Or, you know, that's Harper environmental. Well, you can leave it there till it leaks. And then when the sludge comes out, you really gotta get it out of my cost. We've also discussed all the building's flaws in public session. Yeah, exactly. You know, but you know, everybody would know by walking through them. So, you know, certainly we've painted and, you know, so we know we'd like to cover the asbestos tile in the office, but... I think we just have to be careful, you know, spending more than the building's work type deal. Oh, sure. You know, absolutely. I know originally the game plan was to build a new structure for the public works. In the meantime, you know, figure out how many tens of thousands of dollars need to go into the municipal office to make it work for, let's say, 10 or 15 years until we could do the opposite, build a new municipal office and, you know, be debt-free of the other one. Yeah, so I think too, I mean, the key is going to be that obviously it's going to be the roof, I think. And if we, you know, do the roof, then, you know, deciding, and who's to say, my numbers could be high. I mean, I certainly was taking everything off the report that we had, adding it all together, saying, okay, if we did all this stuff, and maybe it's, I could get it, you know, we could get a cheaper price. And maybe it's, that's it. We'd just say, okay, we'll do it with a roof and I would say, as far as the church property goes, you know, in the past week, there's been different things like you're saying from potential municipal office to parking to other things. And, you know, it's probably not a bad idea, Theresa, maybe just to reach out to the owners and say, you know, what are you looking to get for it? And we can just kind of kick it around from there. Is it something worth the town acquiring or not? Or does it hurt to see what they want for it? And, you know, and then we can kind of go from there. I know the last thing that we had talked about was, it was right on, you know, Greg was heading out of town. We were, you know, some of the buildings in town, in the downtown were being purchased at that time. And the thought was if the downtown does come to fruition, like we all hope that we need more parking than just the municipal office parking or municipal parking, that that piece up there could potentially be parking for, I think we had talked about either tenants of some of the park, you know, either some of the apartments or even some of the date, we'll call it day tenants that, you know, like, you know, the iron block and people that, you know, may work but could walk across the bridge, you know, for parking type deals. So I don't know, I just, I would just say, just reach out and see what we can, what they want for that property. And, you know, just go there and it doesn't hurt to ask. Yeah, that's fine. I'm happy to do that. And then, so what was, hang on, Trapper. Sorry, the dog's carrying on over here. And so, I said this to Chris earlier, so I'll have to, so I'd say to you is, you know, probably December 14th would be the, your next meeting is when you're gonna adopt the budget, you know, for sure. So I will meet with Allen in the meantime and take a look at some of these other items, revisit a couple of them, but you're gonna have to make a decision about certainly about the town garage. And, you know, I guess my opinion, you know, on the budget end of things, the, you know, setting aside money for a project, if it goes forward or not, it's not a bad thing, right? I mean, we have it in our fund and, you know, go from there, right? You know, we can have all those discussions, you know, more when we know how much it's gonna cost us and things like that. I do think that, you know, like we've done every year is kind of, you know, I think the board does need to kind of pick a spot of which, you know, if our budget does increase by how much, you know, I know I like to use cents, some people like to use percentages, but, you know, I know we've kind of have told the tax payer for the last three or four years that, you know, to get to where we need to be, you know, we were gonna do gradually increases of, you know, two to three cents a year to get there. Last year, unfortunately with the ERAF, the ERAF made up of five cents worth of debt. And this year, the ERAF makes up about four cents of the debt based on what we're currently budgeting. So. Yeah, but we did not have that big of an increase last year on the tax. Oh, no, no, but that I'm just showing you that. Yeah, yeah. Last year, for instance, if we didn't have the ERAF, yeah, we've gotten everything we did and the budget would have went down to by two cents, right? I think we had about a 2% increase last year, I think. So I always shoot for three. This is high. I know it's high, but it's still draft because I haven't talked to Alan. I've got an extra 10 grand in repairs and maintenance for him that I'm not sure is accurate. And I certainly, there's a couple of things I could prioritize over another. I think that the repeater is a higher priority than the mower because the repeater is safety. There's times when the guys cannot hold somebody. They don't have cell service or the radio is not working, but I can certainly sort that out. As far as the town garage is concerned, that's fine. I can take out that extra 25,000 that I was thinking about for rent. The only reason I was thinking that you guys really need to start thinking about making a decision is because we are going to have Australian ballot already. So it would be the time to do a bonbo instead of having to do a bonbo later, which is easy. We did it with the water. I mean, easy peasy, three minutes to count that thing. I was there and so, but still it's another election and it's a whole other process. So it's something to certainly think about. Yeah, it just seems like, I mean, I'm a dreamer. I think we should shoot for zero, that's a pipe dream. But things are, when I talk to folks on the street, everybody understands that certain things increase every year, health insurance, things like that increase every year, but it seems like there are several items that are increasing in this budget that are not necessarily those types of things. These are additional things like the wall repair, you know, some things like that that aren't just natural increases. So those are the things we need to look at, I think, and... Absolutely, and I could, like I said, it's why it says draft on it for a reason. But I also think, you know, you have to be stewards. And you guys know that wall has been failing for, or that stone wall has been in disrepair for a while. And it certainly was very noticeable this year during construction. We didn't want to touch it this year because we knew we were gonna be there with vibrating buckets and vibrating rollers and things like that. So, you know, we can't kick every can down the road. But I certainly am making a revisit. And as I said, it's a draft. And I don't have an estimate. I did put out a request and sent photos to a Mason to get estimates on repointing the front of town hall as well as that I could also reach out to the Historical Society and say, hey, you know, you guys see if they have money to put into, you know, paying, they pay you $200 a month rent for town hall. So to see if there's a way for, you know, people to come up. But I'm certainly, I'm planning on taking another stab at it. It's just a draft. Sure, Teresa, I'm curious. I know Preservation Trust has released a whole bunch of new grants. And a lot of them are facade based on historical buildings. Our municipality is allowed to apply for Preservation Trust grants because that could be a potential way to address the town hall. It wouldn't cover the wall, the stone wall, but something like town hall, it's obviously a historical building and, you know, if grant money could cover that piece, that could be, I can forward you some emails that I've gotten from them recently. Yeah, that'd be great. I have, yes, I think municipalities, yeah, we've gotten one from Preservation Trust before. So that would be good. If you could send me that, that'd be great. Yeah. We could see, it's not a bunch of the building. I mean, I only walked around, saw the front part, but I mean, you know how that is, you've got to be nice, we've caught it early if we can get it taken care of. But I want to say they just released some last week or the week before that might address this exact type of thing. So I'll forward you what I found. Oh, that would be great. Yeah. And so like you said, there's another 10,002 and in repairs that maybe I can take out Allen's budget. I can split up the ERAF. And so there's definitely some things I can do. I just wanted everybody to see, I went through the first time and it was, you know, much lower and then went through and was like, okay, what are some pending items here that we have to address? And so I'm certainly, you know, like I said, haven't gone over Allen's budget with him, but we can go through again and take a stab at things, but it's great to have a discussion about them. So Therese under the long-term debt for the town hall. Do you have any concept of how much is left on that debt retirement? I don't have my town report here with me, but if you have your town report at home, Paul, there's a long-term debt schedule in there. And there's still quite a ways to go. I want to say it's like 2030 something maybe. I feel like you're, oh, you know, maybe partway through that long. All right. I don't have my town report here. No, it's okay. I could check it out. Thanks. Sweet. All right, good. Thanks. So just for fun, that grant that I was talking about, you would qualify for, but the applications due by December 14th. Oh, that's fine. Send it over. I'll take it. I forwarded it to you already. I have plenty of time. Yeah. Can you approve it tonight so you can apply in time? There you go. I have one due November 27th. So I'm still for the sand hill and I sent that to two rivers. Rita, who was great at two rivers. She's awesome. She's taken a peek at it and gave me some advice and pointers. So we'll get that one back out too. And Theresa and I were talking about it earlier, but, you know, looking at this for a second time, I would think that the library, there would be some money out there for technology equipment, computers, or if you wrote to one of these manufacturers, Dell or somebody, I would think that they would want to donate, you know, to a library. There's probably money out there for that somehow. Yeah, or else at least budget for one a year instead of, you know, they all died at once. That's wrong. That's thanks. Yeah, Lisa. Being on the trustees for the library, we already do get the computer second hand from a company, one of the trustees sons works for them down in Boston. And so that we get their second hand computers and he manages them for us. I think it's just a matter of, they're getting increased usage. I mean, people are coming in and they're applying for welfare and they're applying for jobs and they're, you know, getting some training on them, you know, all that kind of stuff. It's getting used for a lot of different things. And I think that they're just looking ahead and saying these particular, we've been given the high sign, these computers aren't going to last much longer. Yeah. I hear what you're saying, but I, you know, I think like everybody grants and foundations are struggling too. So however, if you hear of any particular grants that you think will do that we're more than happy to apply. Yeah, I'm going to take a look because yeah, I actually have a friend who's a librarian and so she runs a library in another town. So I'll see, because she was seemingly always, whoops, always getting grant money. And so let me, I'll pick her brain, Lisa, see. That would be great. Thank you. We can find something, but yeah, I noticed in the letter that they all had kind of like worn out at one time. I was like, oh, man, that's things. So we'll see what, I'll see if I can find anything for you. Okay. I'll ask her, especially with COVID, you know, I mean, they must know there's a burden on small libraries. Right. And it's, you know, we're working on updating the collection so that it's, you know, more pertinent to modern, you know, readers and all of that kind of thing. And it's all happening at once. But it's, you know, it's been a relatively low cost feature for the town over the years. So. Sure. So the library is not part of the town, right? They're not owned. So do you guys have some sort of like investments or something that? Yeah. Yeah. There's a Mary Brandler set up a fund for them. So it basically runs off that fund, which is great some years and not so great others. So anyway. You guys maintain your own building and all that, right? I mean, that's all for you guys. Yeah. I wonder. Yep. Yep. Interesting. So. Well, I'll see if I can help. I'll send her an email tomorrow. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. So anything further regards to the discussion of the budget this evening? And, you know, this is kind of the first time that we've now kind of put together the draft budget, you know, gone from sectionals to one piece now. And, you know, I would just a little bit of tweets and we're probably there. So. Yeah. And I'll revisit it. Like I think it's December 14th. You're going to have to pass it. I'll double check now. I look at the municipal calendar one more time. Maybe you have another shot at it two weeks later. I'll find out. But I did get everybody else's signed off except for Alan and like I said, there's a couple of these budget that I estimated to tie in, but I want to double check for him. And I also think I forgot to tell you, I don't think I wrote it down. It happened suddenly. It was Jason Baloo resigned on November 16th. No notice. Just gave me his keys on Monday morning, worked two hours and was done. He has a new job at UPS and certainly wish him well. So I'm not, I don't think I had, maybe you all know that at some point, well, I saw the ads in the paper and there was kind of a question I was going to ask you about it. Yeah, I'm sorry. I forgot it happened suddenly. And so, and obviously I haven't had in the paper and interviewing attempt another seasonal tomorrow just to get us through, just to get us through. So we're going to see, but yeah, it was unexpected. So we'll, Doug, we'll see you at six o'clock tomorrow morning. Yeah. Doug, I gotta tell you, Doug has been great. Oh, I didn't make that. Yeah. He's been mentoring and he has been wonderful and doing some driving with Dave Bergeron and we may have him do some more at work with other people. There's talk of having Doug come in and do some greater lessons with people who want to learn how to drive the greater. So Doug has been wonderful, as well as Dietrich told me he was great on us Friday and helped her with lighting and flags. And so she said that was great and that her and Doug had a good time. And it looks really nice in the downtown. And thank you Doug for all your hard work down there. They're putting some more lights out and I know Paul washed buildings and we're getting some lights, some things down that Kevin Berry agreed to put in his windows. There's some old lights up at the shop that used to be decorations up at the shop. They're gonna get to move downtown. I think Dave Sam worn off or to clean them up. And so it's great. So if people can really try to get people to light up that fall. And so it was a really nice push. And so thank you to Doug and everybody who helped and there's a helping now. I know Kathy and Dietrich, we're gonna go out and put lights on the bridge either today or tomorrow at four. Nice. Okay. Is there anything that we haven't gone over yet, Teresa, it's on your town manager report? Honestly, Chris, I don't know. I don't have it in front of me. I think we just felt covered at all. I think so. I didn't cover, I don't have the agenda and I don't have my town manager. You mentioned they were finishing up doing the guardrail over in East Bethel today. Is that? Yeah, yep. Cause we had to take down, we had that cable railing there. So we had to remove that. And so Lafayette was coming in to do some guard rail, guard rail there. Oh, you know, when we finished the project on Spooner Road, I talked to Bill and Michael Crossman. They both were very, very happy and said, they thank you very much and that I wouldn't hear from them again. So we'll put that in the minutes. And so they were great. So that's done. The Deetree talk to Michael Parker about the skate park. There was a couple of issues there that BMX bikers I think had brought to their attention. Deetree met Michael there. He skateboarded it and he understood some of the issues and was gonna take care of that. And Deetree is working currently on getting a price for redoing the piping, tearing out the side, I'm gonna use the term sidewalk, but the walkway I guess around the pool, that's gotta come out and we've gotta redo all that piping underneath. We're thinking that we may have an issue where water and the fiberglass in the pool. So we're obviously trying to get that done sooner rather than later because we'd have some savings in this budget that we're in due to not opening the pool. So she's gonna get us an estimate on that because we need to redo the piping and we also, they said that the black top, the way that is it's not reacting right, I guess with the fiberglass around the pool. So it looks like we need to do some work there. And she's gonna get some pricing on that. And you mentioned you were drafting some RFPs there for Pinello Bridge. Yes, I started on Pinello Bridge's RFP because I have a hydraulic study back from Ripple, Chris Bump at the state said he'd helped me with that. I started that this weekend. And then I am on hold. I need to do an obviously an RFP for the town garage and maybe any town office work. So, but my focus will be first will be Pinello Bridge just because I think it'll be, we're gonna go with a Bailey or maybe tight bridge, whatever name brand you choose. You need to get that out so people can get that. There's an order time, a wait time on that. Right. We had the select board meeting minutes from November 9th. Does anybody have anything to address with those? Are we good to approve those? There's nobody. Motion to approve as written. Hey, all in favor? Aye. And then in our packets, there was some information, obviously the fourth board's committees meetings were in there, the conservation committee meeting that was in there as well and the DRB. And then there was also where we stand currently on our budget at 33%. There's some minutes from the planning commission and DRB. It says design review board. It's actually development review board. Oh, that's me. I took those minutes. Sorry. Well, that's a habit. She was trying to get out of having to do it now. Yeah. Yeah. No, I do. I gotta find something, you know? It's been too long. It's good though. I'm glad that you said that. Paul's been stewing at home in this whole COVID thing. That's a habit. But that was a good joint meeting and everybody now on the committee has a copy of the town plan and the zoning regs. So Rick Benson, bless his heart, has agreed to be the chair of the planning commission for one year. Oh, nice. Oh yeah, I talked him into it. So I was like... I was gonna say. You know, it was tough because there's all new members and he had a history. He was hoping to get somebody to take over the chair of the DRB, but that did not happen for him. So, but however, Brad, Andrews and Rick came to the planning commission meeting. So we've merged the two committees, you know, to work on the bylaws for now. And so hopefully at the end of the year, when, you know, once the year's up, somebody will step up and do it, but we still really need more planning commission members. But right now our focus is obviously redoing the, we're updating the town zoning regulations. But God bless him. He's agreed to do it, but the members so far, Gene Krause, he was great, Kyle and Zoey Cartwright were both there. They were great, Wayne. So, you know, so far the planning commission members, and Rita, I think Rita's gonna stick with it. We're, you know, really participating, but be sure to tell Joanne that we're still looking for planning commission members. So we'll, thank you. Will we get the solid waste budget review in our next one? I wasn't there, sorry. I printed hers earlier, Jen's earlier for the, I didn't see it anyways, but. It may not be. I had printed it for her, or for Moe, I guess, excuse me for their meeting prior. So I probably just forgot to make you guys a copy of it, but yeah, I'd given it to the BRTS board. And I didn't, I didn't really have any questions in regards to the budget. I think the only one I had there, I asked you earlier there, it hadn't shown any, any, hitting the sand, but yeah, so that that was. Yep. Process, so. So the town office is, Friday, usually the Thanksgiving people take a vacation day. So the office is closed. That's the case this time. I'm not sure if I'm not there, I may work from home part of the day. I don't really know right now. See what, how it goes. But anyways, so the office, no one will be there on Friday. All righty. Do we have anything else to come before the board this evening? I move we adjourn. I can. Okay. All in favor? Hi. All right. Well, thank you everybody. This evening. Thank you. On the 14th. All right. And I'll leave that. I'll put these resolution on the clipboard. So if you guys could walk in the background, sign it and I'll make you a better copy of the budget. I know the scan I guess could come out right. So sorry about that. Okay. So it's going to be doing payroll this week. It's already done. DTRI did it today. Okay. So it's gonna give me a call. I'll try and come in and look at it. Oh yeah. Yep. It's all, it's all done. So you can come whenever you want. Okay. So if you're making Dave a copy of the budget, could I grab one from you as well? It is hard to read. Yeah. I didn't realize that. So I was printing a copy for Chris. And then I was saw, I was like, I don't know why I did that, but I'll make a note. Yeah. I'll give you one. I might have been making up some numbers in there. Yeah. I wasn't good. So Lindley and Dave copy of the budget. I'll put that on there too. Thank you. Yeah. Absolutely. Have a good night. Yep. You too. Thank you. Bye guys.