 Hi, Roger Ooyama, third-generation Japanese-American born in Japan, raised in San Francisco. What else do you want to know? Well, let's get into what are your ties, describe your ties to the Western Edition community. Recently I've been involved with the community organizations, Japanese-American Citizens League, the Center, various Japanese cultural organizations that operate out of Japan Town through the festival. And you said you grew up in San Francisco, can you describe more of your experiences about that? Yeah, we immigrated back to the United States, my parents are Nisei, second generation. We immigrated back from Japan in 1958, and so I was just a little eight years old. And grew up in the Outer Richmond, so we weren't living in the Western Edition, but we would have regular visits to Japan Town, so being involved with church and judo class, that was my initial connection to the area. And what was it like growing up in the Outer Richmond? Yeah, I think moving to the United States from Japan was the first time I was confronted with discrimination, racial discrimination, from day one in school, you know, and the Outer Richmond district at that time was predominantly still a Caucasian neighborhood. And there were only very few Asian friends that I had, only two. But I was kind of hazed the first day of school, and they said, well, what are you doing here? And I said, well, I'm going to school here, you know, I just moved here from Japan. He says, well, you're supposed to be at another school. I said, no, I'm not. And a little confrontation ensued, and that was kind of my welcome to life in America. Welcome to America. Did you know English when you moved to the US when you were eight? I was fortunate enough to go to a bilingual school in Tokyo, Japan. So I grew up with both languages, but I didn't learn English until I was actually five. And Japanese was a predominant language in the home. So these trips to Japan Town, were they meaningful for you? Was it nice being able to connect to your Japanese heritage? That's an interesting question, because for me, having grown up in Japan and being in a so-called real Japanese environment, it was interesting to see this hybrid culture, you know, where there were a few Issei at that time, first generation people that were friends with family that still spoke Japanese. But then I realized that the kids here were very American. I kind of straddled both cultures, so I had a little bit of both in me. So interesting enough, I think they always looked at me as kind of an outsider, even in class. I was immersed in Japanese school as well, you know, and that was easy for me because I was way ahead of those other kids. But I found that Japan Town was kind of a closed community. I realized this more as I became older, but I realized that kids, you know, when I went to Judo class, that they all knew each other from the community, and I was the outsider. So consequently, you know, on the mat there was kind of a bigger kid that he would delight in beating me really badly on the mat. It was kind of a process to see if I could take it. But I never was really involved. I didn't join the Boy Scout troop here. You know, there was a Cub Scout troop and it was an integrated Cub Scout troop. It wasn't the Japanese troop. There were three in Japan Town, you know, from the Buddhist Church, or from the Koko Church, or from the Presbyterian Church. But my parents really felt that it was more important for me to have a more well-rounded circle of friends. So they didn't force me to become integrated into the Japanese community here. And did you eventually become integrated at school where you got beat up on your first day? Yeah, I think so. You know, I actually got a few fights for myself and my parents got called to school. But, you know, I was able to, I think, overcome the discrimination and establish friendships. You know, there's still always going to be people that are going to give you hard time. I mean, there was, through the years, all the way through high school, I encountered bullying, you know, from all different levels. But I managed to, you know, just kind of deal with it as it happened. Yeah, so I think I was happy that I had lots of different friends. And the more I grew, I became older and kind of looked in back here at Japan Town. I realized this was more of a sheltered community and I felt fortunate. I had friends from all over the world, you know, and that was really my parents and saying that it's more important for you to have a much broader perspective of society. So it's important you have all different kinds of friends. Just curious, were you able to take that big kid on the judo mat? No, he was a whole head taller than I was. I was about three years older than I was, and he was a much higher degree in his ranking. So he was kind of all the other kids, he kept all the other kids in life. And I think he felt that it was, he had taken upon himself to meet out discipline to those he felt who needed discipline, and particularly me. So what brought you back to the Japanese American community where you weren't, where you didn't feel particularly welcomed at first? Well, interesting, you know, it's been kind of a long journey. Most of my adult life and professional life, I worked outside of this community. I worked overseas, and I have friends in Latin America, I have friends in South Asia, friends in Europe. And I learned to speak, you know, several foreign languages. So the way to come back to Japantown was probably interesting. It was after the earthquake tsunami happened in 2011, was kind of a large impetus, because I jumped in to help the JCCC and C. And when they had their huge fund drive to accumulate funds, really funds to send to Japan, I got plugged back in. Because I volunteered and did phone work and we ran the phone banks. And so I went back to Japan after that. So this was 2011? This was 2011, right. And before prior to that, I got involved with a couple of cultural groups, sort of between Japanese, Japanese American groups. There's one group called the Chonai Kai, which in Japanese means sort of a meetup of a group for people to discuss various topics. It was an attempt to bridge Japanese residents living here in the United States and Japanese American community. So a couple of friends had started that. It's still going on. I think it's a really good forum for us to get together to kind of discuss our similarities and differences. Because we'll never be exactly like each other, and that's a given. And I think to be Nikkei, people, a person of Japanese ancestry, settling here in the United States, we are a unique hybrid culture. So I think we shouldn't try to be completely Japanese. It's impossible just to be proud of who we are. So that whole sort of metamorphosis came about, I think, by amalgamation of all the things I've experienced in my life. And right now, I'm working on organizing a conference that will be happening in September. The first time it's been held in the United States since 2001, it's the Pan-American Nikkei Convention. So this will bring together people of our shared ancestry together for three days here in San Francisco. So we have a lot of people here who do not know that the majority of Japanese immigrants now reside in Latin America. There's two-thirds of them there. There's also a significantly large population in Canada. Obviously, you know about large population in Hawaii. So we are going to be showcasing our common North American legacy to share it with our Latino colleagues. Very cool. Yes, and we're happy that after much pursuit, we have Secretary Norman Minneta is going to be our keynote speaker. Wow, that's a huge undertaking. Yeah, yeah, so. Can you tell us more about your experiences abroad? Well, it started out actually, I was in San Francisco State. I'm an alumni of the time when San Francisco State. We all went on strike in 1968 to fight for the establishment of an ethnic studies department. And we won that victory and we just celebrated that 50-year anniversary this past year. The thing that happened was after that was closed, the university did not open for almost a year because there was a lot of logistical things that kept the closed. So I decided to, at that time, go on my own voyage of discovery. And so I bought a one-way ticket to London. And then I started my journey was to be able to hitchhike all the way from London all the way to Japan. And I allocated six months to do that. Unfortunately, I got as far as the Middle East and I got a letter from the General Delivery and Athens saying that I was being called up for the draft for Vietnam. So I had applied for a conscientious objector status because I had worked with the Quakers and I worked in the anti-war movement since high school. My mother was an activist. So my mom wrote in the letter she says, well, they find out that you're not in school. And so let me become first A1A category for the draft. So my journey was disrupted. How did they track you down? They sent a letter to my parents' house and my mom forwarded that letter to me by General Delivery. And so technically I looked at the date of the letter and I had to be home in 30 days to go to this what they call induction hearing. So prior to that I had filed for conscientious objector status and I had written probably my best academic paper as to the reason why I wanted to seek this status. So I had prepared that. So I went before the draft board to present this paper that I had written. And much to my disappointment there is four selective service. I was just sitting behind this counter, kind of like a jury. And only one looked up at me. And I said, well, I'm here to present my case for status, conscientious objector status. And I started to speak and started, I was like five minutes into my presentation, which would have been about a 20-minute presentation. And they told me that's enough. I said, excuse me, I'm not finished. He says, no, we're finished with you. I said, you're done. And I walked out a little disappointed. And after that they had rejected that status. So I became 1A again. 1A was the category for you're eligible for the draft. So finally I came only back and had to go for my induction physical. And it was the Army Induction Center in Oakland. And I said, OK, this is it. And I met one guy, he had just gone out and smoked a bunch of weed. And he says, look, if you just act crazy, you're going to be able to get a discharge for being out of your mind. I said, nah, I can't really do that. But so I went through the physical and they do the whole thing. And I had had really bad allergies when I was a kid. And so I had to divulge that during the examination. And it was a real fluke. I actually got out on a medical discharge. I was rejected because of the allergies. But I was so upset because I didn't get the deferment because of the political thing that I was fighting for. So then I left. And then I came back and I said, well, I wish I could have just stayed on my trip. So I went back to school and worked at City Light's bookstore for many years. And finally re-entered school, got my BFA through the San Francisco Art Institute. Because I was at my minor in cultural anthropology from San Francisco State, which I never finished. So I finished with the BFA. And then kind of fast forward. And I went back to Japan in the early 70s to try to see if I could live there. And so I did an independent study and worked and did a photo documentary project. And lived there for almost three years. Did you get your BFA in film? In photography. Yeah. But what happened was I realized I was too American. I mean, it was a great experience. I mean, great friends in that time in Japan. But I decided to come back home. So I came back home and was broke. So I said, well, what am I going to do now? So I ended up just getting some kind of menial sales job while I tried to decide what I was going to do with my life. And then in the process, I kind of stumbled into the travel industry. And within the travel industry, I started moving in with groups of people. But in starting tourism, but in the mid 80s, we're kind of going into that. I don't want to tell you all the details. But I was contacted by a Japanese company tour company that says, if you speak Japanese, we need you to accompany Japanese businessmen going to Latin America. Because at that time, I just started to learn how to speak Spanish. So this is pre-internet days. So communications were quite cumbersome. There was, I think it was telex and a long distance phone calls. And so I would meet Japanese businessmen in Los Angeles, pick them up, fly down to Mexico. And then we'd jump on land transport. And then this is just when Japan, the bubble was pretty up in its crescendo Japanese economy. So they started to invest in Mexico for starters. So there were automobile, petrochemical and electronics companies. So those were the people I would accompany into Latin America. So that developed my language skills, but also my organizational capabilities and working in that industry. And I really enjoyed it. So that kind of carried on. And then it went back into tourism and academic travel. And I was able to go to Europe. I was able to go to Asia, South America and work for companies that we were basically taking sort of graduates of Ivy League universities. So these are the kind of tours that are people paying $10,000 to $12,000 to go on. So there were academic study tours. So I was the tour organizer. I was basically taking care of all the logistics. But I was afforded to, beyond the tour, take in the lectures. And it was amazing, you know, for me to be able to go on these things. So they really broadened my horizons further. And by that time, I became proficient also in speaking French. So that was another plus. So all these experiences and then traveling on my own on my own free time have really given me an amazing perspective of what the world is about and actually who I am and what my emotional index is. If you want to call it that, you know, in reacting to things and how I look at things through many different lenses as opposed to a singular lens. So I think that also people kind of sense that and that they kind of not sure how to categorize the how I think. But I said, well, why do you want to do that anyway? I mean, it's sunny. We're all unique individuals. And I think having a broader perspective is so important, especially in this time in life, you know. Have you always had a good sense of your identity? I have. I think I can't say that I'm singularly by, you know, anthropological definition. I'm Asian. I'm Japanese, you know, genetically based human being. But in terms of my values and my interests and my character, I'm probably an amalgamation of everywhere I've been in the world with everybody whom I've encountered in life. They've all left a little imprint inside of me, you know, in terms of things that I like, you know, the type of music that I like, the type of art, you know, type of books I read, everything. So I'm grateful to all those travels and all the people that I've met that have really made me who I am today. And what brought you back to San Francisco, of all places in the world? Well, I actually bought a house here 40 years ago, a little tiny house, you know, it's a post-earthquake. I found it, my house was built in 1908, way out, originally by Lincoln Park. And it was probably the most sensible financial decision I've made in my life, God forbid, I've made many bad ones. But I've always been a Bayesian. I always came back here and it was sort of my solace, you know, to have this little cottage that's off the street. Very quiet and have a view of the whole city. So I mean, where else would I want to live? I considered living other places, like I told you in Japan. I have friends in Hawaii, but I like Hawaii a lot, but I find it a little too limiting, you know, to my interests. I like to go visit. I always like to go visit, but it's too tough to live there. It's really expensive and there's just not work there, you know, to sustain myself. So, yeah, I'm back here. And I have a love-hate relationship with San Francisco because I remember what it used to be like when we first came, you know, I'm not too sure I really like it, how it's become. Yeah, I'm conflicted at times, you know. That's why it's good for me to get away from it. But then when I get away from it, I kind of appreciate it for what it is, you know. What was it like before? How would you describe it? I think I remember San Francisco being more civil, you know. I remember when people were nicer to each other and people weren't as aggressive, you know, and driving like maniacs. And I think probably the late, yeah, late 80s into the early 90s was kind of a pivotal point. I kind of noticed, you know, because socially, I kind of ran with a group of people that were from all over the world, you know. And there was just this nice flow between ethnicities. It's not as secular as it is now, you know. And I think that was such a great time for the city. Now, we were like the little United Nations, a group of 40 of us, you know, and we always socialized with each other and we shared each other things from each other's culture, we saw each other's holidays. And it was fantastic, you know, and that's kind of, it's still there, but I see lines of demarcation, you know, and socially in the city now. I mean, I go to Asian events, but then I say, you know, some of these Asians, you guys don't invite anybody else. You can just hang out with them all your own kind all the time. It's not good, you know. I mean, you have to have a little, you know, shared perspective in life, right. And, you know, I'm all for, you know, identity and pride and all this. I mean, of course it's important too, but I think there's a richness in crossing over and sharing and have different people of your life. It's just like, you know, if all your friends agreed with everything that you thought, it would be really boring. How would you have conversations if you didn't have disagreements about things, right? So, yeah, that's kind of, yeah, my love hate with this city, you know. And I think morphing into your, I guess your last question I'm talking about, where I like to see this city become as, I would like the city to somehow find its moral compass again, you know. And I think there's pressing issues where it overcrowded. I mean, the homeless issue, I don't have the solutions for that. But, you know, intolerance and, you know, having half-baked solutions and half-way houses is not really digging deep into why, you know, the people are in their plight, you know. So, hopefully they're going to dig deeper and find some meaningful solutions to this because it's only going to get bigger before it gets solved. And lastly, what are your hopes and dreams for yourself? Well, my hopes and dreams for myself is, I want to have more time to write and do creative pursuits instead of just working all the time. I'm still working in my age because I did not financially plan my life very well. But, you know, it is what it is. You bought a house. Luckily, like I said, I bought it, you know, back 40 years ago. And so that's my security right now. But I enjoy working. What kind of work do you do? I'm a builder, you know, a carpenter, yeah. And also, I also want to do more artistic type of endeavors in working with Wood and Bamboo, you know. It's going to be my winter thing. I do craft work every winter for Japanese miniatures. But I just, this is a really tough year right now because I've taken this project on to produce this event for September. And that's all I'm focusing right now because we're under the gun, you know, to create a workable budget and have funding to be able to execute. So that's going to be my focus until September for now. That's exciting. But after September, hopefully I'll have my life back. But it's going to be all worth it. Yes, yes, definitely. And hopefully I'll send you information so you'll be able to attend. Thank you so much. All right.