 I keep thinking when I was a kid on the farm where I wanted to be as an artist and I think to have my painting then featuring Snoop Dogg's brand new track, that doesn't calculate for me because that's just so wild and we all know who he is, right? It's not like it's someone unknown, that's a huge blessing, you know, when the guys approached me about that I was like, oh yeah, no, we're doing this, right, but at the same time when I actually heard the track, I was like, I can't do this, right, and I had to make a decision to either just say no or find a way that I could actually work with it. This is Started to Store Front, the podcast where we inspire entrepreneurship through truth. Today's guest is James Peter Henry, the artist best known for painting the mural in our very own studio. Okay, maybe that's not his most famous piece of work, but it's certainly up there in our books. James grew up on a farm in rural Australia, about five hours outside of Melbourne. As he explored the property as a kid, he discovered a set of caves that were adorned with aboriginal paintings and drawings. These fascinated him and would go on to influence his work all throughout his life. The aboriginal artists were painting on the walls of the cave in order to pass down stories. Each of James's pieces today reflects this notion of art as a vessel for storytelling, but instead of being featured on the walls of caves, they've been projected onto the sales of the Sydney Opera House. So listen in, let's recover everything from why he almost talked himself out of his career, why he considers his paintings to be similar to real estate, and how his darkest moment came when he accidentally spilled five gallons of black paint on himself. Now back to the episode. All right, welcome to the podcast on today's show, the muralist, the artist, the man, the myth. And behind the wall, James Peter Henry. Thanks for joining. Hey guys, how are you? How did you first get into art, or I don't even know if you call it art, maybe expression is the better word. You know, I was about five or six, and there wasn't much to do on the farm. So I just started drawing and just kept drawing. And then when I realized that there was caves up in my parents farm full of Aboriginal art, well more storytelling actually, storytelling of the generations and all that, I started coming down from the mountains and writing what I saw and drawing and sort of like adding stuff to what I'd seen previously. So yeah, I think, you know, like six or seven, I don't know, I remember my auntie staying at my house for a couple of weeks, and she said, it's three o'clock in the morning. What are you doing? I'm like, I have to draw. I have to draw. And she's like, okay, it's always been a part of me, always. Did you have any influences from that early age, like anything you were trying to emulate? No, because I, you know, we didn't have internet, we didn't have any art books. My mom, she did a little bit, but, you know, it's probably like six or seven drawings. So I saw that and I thought that was amazing, a little bit of Cubism, but yeah, I had no idea. Did people try to sway you away from it? Were they like, oh, it's cute. He just says, hide this little thing he does until three a.m., but it'll go away. You know, I swayed myself away from it. Okay. Around like high school or like? Yeah, I was just like, you know, I don't want to be a poor artist. So I think that was why I turned away for it for a while. But I think when you're in purpose or when you know what your purpose is and you're trying to like fight it and trying not to do it because it's not exactly going with what your best friends are doing, you know what I mean? Whether they went to a law school or whatever and then like, and you want to be an artist, you know, it's kind of like, hey, this is not cool. Yeah, it sounds crazy. Yeah, I mean, completely crazy. And, you know, there's no ABC step to being an artist. You know, if you want to be a doctor, you know where you need to go, what you need to study. It's very linear. Right. And as an artist, it's like, OK, well, I've been painting this thing now for 20 hours. What purpose is that? Oh, people love it. Great. But then it's kind of like, but what did I do it for? So I think just three years of just finding my style and yeah, I mean, it just just happened. I think if like everyone, if they're in that purpose, it's going to happen regardless. Yeah, totally true. It's just how it is. You know, it's like when someone wants to be a singer, right? And they probably shouldn't sing, but they keep forcing it, right? And it doesn't really happen for them. Well, you've got those other ones that are so talented that whatever they do, they just keep, you know, going, going up, up, up and up. So, you know, yeah, I think it's just really about finding your purpose and not worrying about what your family or your friends are doing or whether it's about money. It's not about that at all. So at what point did you realize that you had a gift and that you were more than like these are more than just doodles? Like I know you said you talked yourself out of it in high school, but had you realized like that you were actually quite good at it by then or did it take a while after that? You know, it's kind of weird. It's like if you're focused on something, I believe you can do anything. Like really focused. I mean, you have to focus for a long time. It's got to take time. It does. It's like years of it does. I mean, and it's also it's about a confident level as well about being confident in what you're doing. I mean, as as a kid, being an artist, I mean, that's all fine. Your mum and dad say that you're great and your best friends say that you're great. Right? I mean, that that adds up to a certain amount. But then when you become, you know, like early early 20s, you have to then make a serious decision about, OK, is this going to actually put food in my fridge? Is this going to pay my rent? And then I realized that whatever I was doing was selling. I was like, that's strange. Like, I'm just doing from what's in here, like, you know, what I feel. So I put it on paper and then there was interest in galleries. There was interest in people, you know, purchasing and yeah, there was just an interest. So then I had to explore that interest to see if it was actually a valid interest as well, to see if it was actually going to take me to where I wanted to go, because I knew exactly where I wanted to go with it. Oh, where did you want to go? I mean, when I was a kid, I always dreamed that I had very vivid dreams, very dreams that are very I can see exactly what I'm doing. Like in 10, 20 years time. So this happened when I was a kid. So I knew that I was going to do really large scale paintings in Los Angeles. And this is me living on a farm five hours from Melbourne. I'm like, OK, I mean, that I don't know how that's going to happen. You know, first I need a green card and then I mean, it just nothing made sense. But when I was doing the Melrose mural, I started laughing at my friends. What are you laughing about? I said, well, A, you're meant to be holding onto the ladder and you're on Instagram, but don't worry about me. And B, I saw this already happening. So I see all those things. I'm not sure if that's a normal thing. But I mean, I definitely had a vision to keep going, even though sometimes it was extremely hard financially and just everything. I just made a decision to stick to it because it's actually the only thing that actually made sense to me. I was like, no, I can't do anything else. Did you ever have to become like an art historian at some point where you're doing research or maybe not research, but at least like drawing inspiration from different forms of art or just kind of exploring the full art world and then maybe thinking like, OK, this is interesting because everything at some point is just inspiration. Right? We've all been inspired, especially when you think about music and stuff like that. And so did you at some point become like a historian or just? Look, I because of my parents' farm with the Aboriginal art, I mean, that was my first taste of I didn't even call it art back then. It was storytelling. So I'm very inspired by ancient art. So African, Aboriginal, Egyptian, you know, people always say, you know, who's your favorite artist? And I actually don't have one. I'm more about, you know, ancient art. That's where I mean, that's where all art is from. It started just like that. Yeah, absolutely. That's where I draw from because I never want to draw from anything else. That's in Vogue or that's, you know, that's been around for a few years because I don't want a blueprint of someone else's art. So I'd rather draw from the source than from someone else. So, you know, yeah, so ancient art is is what I studied and what I grew up with as well. I have a cousin who he was an art. He was an engineer. He's like this engineer in Canada. And at some point he like became an artist and started making art. But he was still working as an engineer. But what was interesting is like he's this PhD engineer, but at the same time he's in this like art community in Canada all of a sudden because of his art. And what he's realizing is none of these people, like what holds them back is their inability to sell themselves effectively or their inability to have confidence in what to charge for their art. And so they become literally starving artists. And his view on it wasn't so much that they were not good at art. It was like they were so good at it that they were so bad at everything else. And it was this thing where he himself realized like he was all of a sudden becoming the most profitable artist in that group. Just because he would sell at high prices and those high prices would lend him into meeting the right people. He almost became not liked by that community because of his ascension. And he was just explaining to me like you have to charge enough to be able to eat to your point. But it's it's hard, right? I think it's hard for entrepreneurs. I think it's hard for everybody to like know your worth essentially. When it came for you to like start charging for your art, you know, what was that? What was the first days of that? Like, do you remember the first piece that you sold? Wow, one million dollars. Yeah. Yeah, Bitcoin. No, I don't remember the first piece, but I always remember a statement or conversation. I can't really remember that. I was always going to keep my prices high. I never wanted to sell something for 10 bucks, 20 bucks. I mean, I always saw the longevity of my career. So if I'm doing an original piece, you know, OK, back then it was worth nothing, maybe five dollars, ten dollars. But I knew if I held on to that for five years, 10, 20, that, you know, it's a little bit like stock or it's it's like, or no, actually, you know, it's really like property. So, you know, you buy a house for 50,000, you know, in 10 years time, it's two hundred and fifty or whatever. So I always look at my paintings. Yeah, more like property, regardless of what size, you know, it could be just like six inches by six inches. But I've always been like that because I've always seen where I'm going to go. So I think a lot of artists are a little bit blurry about where they're going to go. You know, they might be amazing, but they can't see what is ahead for them. I always have. So I'm always like, OK, so this is the price this year. Next year, it's this the following year, it's this and this and this. I love that. So for you, it's not like a tactic. It's something that just happens because you know where your destination is. And this is something that I think people get lost on. They think it's like a tactic game or like let's go with the high price to influence the market. But in reality, it should just be pure. It's not a tactic. It's not a strategy. It's just something that, you know, you're going to be doing this forever. And so, frankly, you give a shit and you want that to you want to represent it in your price. Yeah, I mean, it's why you do up a house to get more, you know, when it goes to sale. I mean, you're always adding stuff to it, always, you know, improving it to add more value to the house. So that's what I'm always doing as well. You know, like whether it's murals or whether it's collaborations or paintings, I'm always adding to the pie to make sure that pie is growing in many directions and not just with, you know, maybe paintings in the studio, but it's paintings overseas. It's murals, it's collaborations, it's all that stuff. At what point did you move to LA? At what point was that dream realized? Yeah, was it as simple as hopping on a plane in Australia and getting off at LAX? No, it wasn't. It came after a divorce, actually. And I was just like, man, I don't want to be doing this anymore. You know, I was painting, but I was also in the music industry as well. And I was a producer, but I was always painting. I mean, that didn't stop. It was just a bit of a diversion. And I got a green card and I was like, OK, it's time. I just it's been time for a long time, but I just knew that everything had to be sold. And one suitcase was carry on bag, actually. And that's it. Nothing else. And I came to LA seven and a half years ago. So 2013, 2014. Yeah, just end of 2013. And then I painted basically nonstop for three years. Where are you in my house in down the road, Beverly Hills? And I was just just kept painting and painting and painting. Then I went to New York for a while and I had this big canvas, this six by five feet canvas, which I rolled up and would take to Central Park every single day. Just kept painting, kept painting. And then a mutual friend said, hey, you should meet this guy. He owns a gallery. He might like your stuff. I said, yeah, all right, let's let's work it out. He goes, oh, it's three o'clock tomorrow. I said, oh, what's his name? Oh, he's a Guggenheim. I said, what? And anyway, so I went I went to his place and he said, what's the canvas? I said, oh, just a painting. And he said, like, you're going to show me? I said, oh, yep. All right. So he bought it right there. And then and that sort of pivoted things to a different angle as well. So you sold your first painting in New York to a Guggenheim. Yes. So it was then was it sold to the Guggenheim? Or was that for his private collection? Private collection. OK. So I mean, and you know, things just kind of kept moving. So New York Fashion Week. But it wasn't a shock. It was almost like, oh, OK. Yeah. This is supposed to this is meant to happen. This is meant to happen. And it's been happening all my life through different things, through my art. But I mean, when you come to a new a new country, a new city, and I actually didn't know anyone at all. So I'm like, great. I feel like I'm 18. I've got to get a driver's license again. They had no credit. I mean, it was just a hole. Did you try to help you in other ways? Was he like, oh, let's do this, this, this, this? Or was it more of like, OK, this is interesting? Yeah, it did. But I mean, it didn't really pan off the way that that was meant to just due to him being so busy and myself as well. So then I came back to LA and, you know, I just wanted to do a lot of murals because I thought that was a good way to express what I have inside to the general public. More so than people that go to galleries and go to museums. I wanted to explore the avenue of putting fine art on buildings as opposed to spraying. And I mean, I didn't want to be a graffiti artist. I wanted to be a fine artist that was painting on buildings instead. Now at this time, so Instagram isn't a thing yet. And so at this time, I don't know if this was a thought process three, but it's almost like an artist having a website is kind of tough because you got to keep sharing your website. Emails are probably there. But it's like, is a mural also just a way to showcase your art to a substantial amount of people in a really kind of like an Instagram way where it's like there's a lot. It's a platform with a lot of hard to ignore. Yeah, it is. And I think that's why, you know, I chose the places that my murals are, you know, I didn't want to put it in a place where people couldn't see it. And there's no point. But I we've offered places like that and turned them down. Yeah, like this one. I mean, I just, you know, I want to make sure that, you know, the one on Melrose, I mean, that was that was a massive one for me. Is that the input? No. That's table art. Yeah, I just want people to stand back and look. I want people to sit and understand the story, but also how it affects them as well. You know what I mean? That's that's what I want to do. I want to provoke people. I want them to, you know, it's this guy that was in the studio a couple of months ago and, you know, he is it like seven foot basketball and started crying. And it was because the painting was provoking, you know, all these emotions about what he'd been through and what the painting was about. And that's art to me. You know, I mean, that's if if we're moving someone and if they can walk away in a place where they haven't thought of before in a positive way, I mean, I'm all about that. It's like when you say to your partner, hey, babe, I love you. Right. And that thought is with her for the rest of the day. You know what I mean? I think if we can inspire people and and help them see what's more beautiful than the mess that surround us, you know what I mean? So I'm all about that. James, what was your favorite collaboration you've had to date? My favorite collaboration besides the mural behind me. Obviously, I was going to say that, but I mean, that was a great collaboration. What I loved about it was I would come here at the end of the day and I would see you at like six, seven o'clock. Yeah. And it was like your happy place. And then you were here until like two a.m. And for people listening, we had no light. Like we had no electricity here yet. We only had temporary electricity. And so he was basically painting in the dark to some extent, which was even cooler. And you think about it, like, at least for me, it was like this is it basically was like a Zen. There was a Zen to the room. Yeah. It was a meditation studio versus like a so peaceful studio with all this light everywhere. But, you know, I didn't actually need to see what I was doing either. We can tell. Oh, no. Nick thought you put six fingers on this woman, but it's just the bisecting line. Yeah. I mean, he was like, he put six fingers on her. I mean, I should have. Oh, my God. I mean, yeah, I mean, like. I'm a hater. Painting in this space was amazing, because it was quiet and away from the traffic. And yeah, it's just my space to paint. Whereas the studio can be very busy when you finish pieces. So like when I think about real estate development, like this project as an example, typically once they're open. So once the business is up and running and it's done, I'm out. Like I'm mentally like onto the next one. And I know that's a survivor component to my life, but there's another part of me that's almost like I really want to stay in the space of enjoying this. But I feel like once I'm done with it, it's not for me anymore. It's for the people, right? So like people come to the coffee shop, like it's for them. The brewery will open. It's like, I'm there to build it. And then once it's done, it's for them. And so it's almost like I'm giving it away. And because I give it away, I don't want it back. And I want to go somewhere else now. Do you ever deal with that when it comes to pieces? I mean, when people buy paintings from the studio, I'm just really so much inclined to say, look, pay me your money, but let's just keep it here. OK. And you can just come and visit it. It's like a kid. Yeah, it's like how much for my kid. Right. How much for the firstborn? I mean, like even looking at this mural, there's a journey that I've gone through. I mean, you know, I talked about this woman's journey that she's on. It's her journey, but it's a journey that I've experienced as well. You know, the journey of the artist going, holy crap, what am I going to do? Holy crap, you know, and it always happens. But it's it's that journey. It's that journey of, you know, working at the studio for like nine hours and coming here. And it's the the little things that I see driving here when I was doing the mural that I was like, Oh, I need to do that. I need to do that. It's those sleepless nights that I think that figuring out what's happening, the paranoia that happens, you know, whether someone's going to like it or whether someone's going to hate it. I mean, it's all this all these stories that I tell myself, right? How do you quiet that as far as judgment, I guess, or potential judgment? I just I just shut it off. I just like, I don't care about it anymore. Do you find that there's a certain like, you know, you painting here at the wee hours of the morning, do you find that there's a certain time of day where you're able to achieve that a little bit easier, the quieting of the mind? Like, do you work better at night, per se? No, it used to be like two or three o'clock in the morning. That was my sweet spot just to paint. But now it's like how an actor goes from being in a day to day life to switching straight into character. I mean, that stuff normally takes years to to get to that point and also to get out of character, right? I think for me, when I paint, I can switch. I know I know where the switch is now, whereas beforehand, I didn't know where that switch was. So now I can almost physically put my hand in my head and go, OK, turn that on or turn it off. So I know where it is. So, you know, before it used to be like, yeah, I need to make sure that that everything is clean in my house. Everything is clean in my studio. I need to do this, I need to do that, I need to do this. I mean, all these stupid things I used to do, right? I need to burn this in-sent and then this in-sent. So I just I just know where that switch is. So I switched straight into it. That's fascinating. Yeah. You learn how to silence it at the beginning and then at some point you just realized that there's just one switch. It's not so much about silencing the noise. Yeah, it's, you know, it's like a recipe once, you know, the first time you make that cake, you know, you go in through the recipe. It's like, OK, I'm trying to get this to happen. The oven's on. I mean, there's a whole thing, right? And you've been doing it for years, you know, exactly. You know, it's you just on autopilot. It's like, you're the oven's on. I've got this. I've got that. Great. You know, eat it. Everyone loves it. Hang on, hang on. If you're not subscribed, can you go ahead and do that right now before we get on with the video helps us out tremendously? That's all we ask, and we're back. Do you have any interest people wouldn't know that you have? Like, is there any hobbies? Just any hobbies that are so like, basically, it's almost like you're so immersed in your studio and then and then doing your work. Yeah. Is there something that is there's an escape for you? Is it meditation? Is it prayer? Is it? It's definitely prayer, but I mean, you know, go to the beach maybe three times a week, like really, really early in the morning. I mean, before the sun comes up, I'll just walk down the beach and pray. I'll sometimes dip a little bit into the cold water. That's my like you to now. Yeah, it's just really grounds me, takes me away from busy life and where I live, you know, it's busy. Just quietens everything, completely quietens everything. You know, I grew up on a farm for 18 years. Right. You know, with was it a sense of home to the quiet? Yeah, I need that. Yeah. I was doing a mural in downtown that was three o'clock in the morning and I moved the ladder. Which wasn't a good thing, because I just had a five gallon bucket of paint that I opened and put up on top of the ladder. And then it started to just come down and cover me completely with black paint. I mean, that was a shock because I couldn't hear anything, see anything. Imagine that on a marble staircase going down 13 floors black. God, probably looks cool after. Yeah, I mean, it was when I realized it was 3 o'clock when I couldn't see and I couldn't hear anything. And I just had all this paint. I was like, now you've got to try and clean this off. So I basically took off everything except for my underwear. I went downstairs and there's footprints all down the marble staircase. And I'm washing myself in the hand basin, probably three thirty in the morning. Were you happy that no one was around where you could just kind of like? I don't know if I would choose the word happy. I mean, it's better. All I wanted to do was see in here. I mean, that was I could feel the handrail going down. Right. And it was slipping with black paint. I mean, it was a five gallons of black paint. It's a lot. It's so nice to tell you and I that house in the Hollywood Hills, someone was coming to like see the house. We were selling it and we're just putting everything away. And I don't know why I decided to do this, but I decided to grab like one, too many paint cans. And it spilled. It like fell on the ground, just like the normal gallon. And it was everywhere. And these people were like or they were texting us, being like, oh, we're three minutes away. And this was like a really important showing because they were it was like, we had already sold it to some extent. They were just like coming back to like make sure everything was fine and do some sizing and then telling. I just go into like a panic of having to clean this up in three minutes. Oh, my God. It was black paint and there was like wood like this. It was like wood grain. And so it was getting into the grain. Would have loved being a fly on that wall. Yeah. It was a mess. Poor mess. And so we had to like, obviously paint thinner, the whole thing. Luckily, we had all this stuff. And then at the end, they laugh and they're like, oh, we noticed that it was like this area of wood was like a little darker. And we're like, oh, we'll just back in it. Oh, my. So like it was a lot of it's bad enough that you spilled the paint. But like you have a ticking clock as well. Yeah, it was not. It was not fun. I thought I forgot about that moment. But when you brought home, I was like, I've never heard that story before. Yeah. No, we buried that story. Well, it's alive now. It must have been a dark moment. It's not. I mean, you could imagine her. Yeah, she was not very kind. And it was my fault. I mean, I shouldn't have done that. I was dumb. Let's talk about your collapse. NFT, you're in the NFT game now, which is fascinating. NFTs come out to good in theory, help the artist help the artist protect their digital rights. You made a video with Snoop Dogg. What has that been like for you? I mean, I keep thinking when I was a kid on the farm. Where I wanted to be as an artist. And I think like to to have a my painting then featuring Snoop Dogg's brand new track. I mean, that that doesn't calculate for me because that's just so wild. And I mean, we all know who he is. Right. It's not like it's someone unknown. And it's like, and that's going to be forever with me, you know, which I think is amazing. I mean, that's that's a huge blessing. You know, when when the guys approached me about that, I was like, oh, yeah, no, no, no, we're doing this. Right. But at the same time, when I actually heard the track, I was like, I can't do this. I mean, it was full on, right? And I had to make a decision to either just say no or find a way that I could actually work with it. So so you pushed back a little bit. I did. Yeah, I mean, it wasn't exactly what I wanted. Were they shocked when you put were they like, do you know who you're pushing back to? Or do they not? Do they understand the the artistic community in that way? It was more my manager that I expressed the wow. And it was like, jogging cheese. It was like, I mean, how can this work? And then one of my friends suggested that my paintings are actually about what the song is about. It's just that, you know, like when I'm doing a collaboration, I mean, someone will have their point of view and it won't be aligned with what I'm thinking whatsoever. So it's a it's an automatic resistance. And then I have to step back and understand why that resistance is there and and then work with that. It's therapy. It is. I mean, it teaches me how to expand myself as an artist and how to to deliver something that not necessarily something that I would have thought of. So I mean, I actually like it. I beforehand, you know, five years ago, it'd be like, yeah, that's never going to happen. But when it comes to me now, it's like, OK, all right. So this has come for a reason. How do we turn this to create another space in my mind? That's a healthy approach and anything really. Yeah, I mean, we always have to grow, right? Yeah, it's like a relationship. It's like, you know, sometimes you just have to stand back, put ego aside. Yeah. And then your Kobe Bryant jacket, working with Mr. Hamilton. Yeah, Jeff. So you did the painting first, right? So I did the painting probably about 10 days after the accident. And I was approached by the city to do a big mural of Kobe. And I declined it because I wasn't really feeling it. I was I wanted to honor Kobe and I didn't have anything in my mind or I wasn't really resonating. All I knew was just a very sad story. And I didn't know how that would portray on a massive wall, like, I mean, massive wall. Yeah, I didn't do that project. And then I think about 10 days later, I started drawing Kobe's face. I didn't even realize that's what I was doing. And then I did Gigi as well. And I mean, it just kind of happened and it became a whole thing with the whole Kobe. It's a beautiful piece. Thank you for sure. And then now it's been animated as well. Right. Which is amazing. I hope we can put this in the tease because it's like, honestly, it's such a beautiful. It grabs you. There's no question about it. It really takes you to a place. Yeah. The animator that I use, Patrick, I mean, he just got it. You know, I've used other animation people before and they haven't got what I'm trying to to put forward. But this Patrick, I mean, he's he's brilliant. You know, when someone rips you up about him, you know, tries to put it on something else, I'm always like, what's this going to end up like? But I mean, I said to him, I'd prefer your animation than the actual painting. You know, it's it's so beautiful. Did it require a conversation between you and the animator in order for him to, like you said, get your art and where it was coming from in order to highlight certain aspects of it? Or was it just like? I mean, a very, very quick conversation on a very windy street and with bad reception. And he said, look, I will send you something. And then you tell me what you think. Anyway, he sent it to me, because I haven't finished it. This is just a rough draft. And I said, this is perfect. Really? I mean, it's stunning. He grabs all of it, completely got me. And I was moving basketball, man, and stairs. And I was so surprised. But I mean, the basketball goes up to the stairway of heaven and then Kobe's reaching out. And then then Kobe in the backdrop is then slam dunking the ball. I mean, it's it's kind of like when you're creating something from scratch, like a project, like a building. And then you see it at its, you know, final stages. It's it's like, you know, like this place, you know, you see it when before it was gutted and you see it when it was gutted and you see it now. I mean, it's incredible journey for through everything that happened through, you know, getting electricity to everything. So once you have the piece and then does Jeff approach like, how does how does it become the point where let's put this on a jacket? Let's make a jacket out of the piece. Yeah, I mean, the jacket with Jeff Hamilton, we spoke about it last year about let's work on a on a jacket together. We did choose another piece of artwork and I wasn't feeling it. I'm like, you know, a lot of his, you know, his fans, his friends are very sports orientated. So I wanted to do something that was related to sport. And then, you know, the Kobe piece had already been done. So anyway, so Jeff did the Kobe painting. It's incredible. I mean, it just it's alive. There's something about that jacket that is just like, whoa. And then when you see it, the Chinese theater transferred into a hologram and it's spinning with Kobe's voice on the speakers at the Chinese theater with the painting of Kobe animated all over the Chinese theater. It's just like the silence feels very ground zero in that way. Yeah, it definitely takes you back. Yeah. And then all of a sudden you're doing this thing with the sales of the Sydney Opera House, oh, one of the most iconic places in the world. I have to say, out of all the things that I've I've seen of your work, that was just the most jaw dropping to be able to see that projection. And, you know, I wasn't there in person. You showed me like the print what you were doing, right? And I was like, oh, that's cool. Yeah. But then seeing it was like, holy shit. I mean, it was a moment of like that. It's one of the most iconic buildings in the world. And to see something like that projected onto the sales and come alive, especially at night, and it's it's so perfectly aligned. It was truly a spectacle to behold. And that was even over like my phone on Instagram. I can only imagine in person. Are you becoming a diva? Yes. Feel like your head is exploding. Yes. Absolutely. My name is Mariah Carey. Do you have handlers now? Yeah, I mean, the Sydney Opera House was, you know, something that was talked about six months ago. And I pushed it away, not pushed away, but I just thought, OK, I mean, my friends worked it out in Sydney and I didn't think anything of it. And then only weeks ago, they're like, oh, the Sydney Opera House thing is confirmed. I'm like, what actually are we doing? Right. They asked me to do something that was related to the Great Barrier Reef because it was for the UN World Ocean Day. So it was all about, you know, about the ocean, about the fish, about the coral reefs, all about that. So I had to do a painting related to that, which I said to them, you know, you know what I paint and it's not reefs, it's not fish. But then that comes back to what we're talking about before about, you know, with collaborations and then, you know, that resistance and then pushing through that. And then, you know, I had to do it on paper to use acrylics and graphite and a few things like that. That was quick drying because that very next day it had to be scanned and sent to Sydney. How do they scan it? What kind of scanner is it? Just like a regular computer scanner? Is it like a legit? Yeah, I take my stuff to to a place in Culver City and they do like all the high-res scanning for like the major OK, so it's like legit. It's like a big machine. Yeah, it's incredible. And that's how we do it has to be, right? Yeah, that's how we do the Kobe painting. I mean, to get the files to the automators so they could really cut it apart, you know, at a high-res, which is apparently so awesome to use. Yeah. And then so the Opera House, you know, I didn't think too much about it. And the night that it actually happened, I had my friends on boats in the Sydney Harbour on IG Live going, hey, James, wish you were here. I'm like, oh, my goodness, this is this is actually crazy. So, I mean, yeah, it was too bad you couldn't go. Yeah, I know, right? But, you know, friends, I had one friend, she was looking at her at her apartment and she saw it in Sydney. So I lived in Sydney for eight or nine years. So, I mean, was this a message to all your haters? Yes, my haters. Yeah, right. But I mean, yeah, to have that, I mean, that's definitely. That's definitely my bucket list of things that I wanted to do. I love that. And I think, you know, I tick that off now. It's kind of like, well, you know, there is there's talks of turning that experience into NFT when having the fish slightly move. That'd be cool. Yeah. How much money does it cost to make something in NFT? Like, what's the team you have to hire? I mean, it's a tremendous amount of editing, a lot of still photography. Yeah, there is. I mean, there's there's certain ways around it. I mean, you can do a deal off the back end. Like, what if we did make this an NFT? Let's just walk us through this process. So we wanted to make this an NFT. You need to find some of that. It's actually working with the platforms to start with for for individuals to get on to one of the websites. They normally come back saying, you know, we're overwhelmed and blah, blah, blah, blah and all this stuff, right? So you need to like a big name of some kind to you want to make money. Ultimately, yeah. So there's all these body brokers basically that get in there so you can get onto the so they will then find the best deal and what platform is right for whatever you're doing. So they will take a a chunk, a chunk for that. And then you own a piece, I would imagine, right? Yeah, as the artist. Yeah. OK. So you get a percentage. But then if you're collaborating, you know, with a famous singer or whatever, I mean, they'll take a chunk as well. Yeah. And then with the animators, you know, a lot of animators are payment up front or they want a percentage at the end instead. And a percentage at the end instead is actually quite an attractive package if it's done correctly. And if it goes for big money. Yeah, they'll make so much more than if they were to invoice for the for the job to start with. So I mean, there's many deals. I mean, animators are doing so much work nowadays because of NFT. So I mean, it doesn't need to be costly at all. You know, if you do back end deals. I just want to see this carousel moving. It'd be amazing. I think about that all the time. I'm like, how cool would that be? And then the handbrake too. You can kind of see that. Yeah, I'm talking. Yeah. The hand coming out. Yeah, it just it just lends itself so well. Maybe this is their next NFT drop. Right. What was the platform you dropped yours on? Makers Place. Makers Place. Yeah, there's so many platforms nowadays. But yeah, the Kobe NFT drop. When is that, you think? We're not ready as in we have to get a few things finished. At the Chinese Theatre before we want a drop date. But what we have in mind with the Chinese Theatre is is huge. So I mean, we're just going to shock platforms that are actually going to do us justice. Hopefully we work on a shoot together. Oh, we're in potential discussion to make you do something cool. Right. We're not allowed to mention any names, are we? But we can we can mention colors. We can allude. Yeah. So what should be amazing is just a cool shoe with your touch in these colors, black, yellow, white. Right. We love yellow, clearly. You know, there's a truck out the front that's yellow. Yeah, it's definitely a theme. It's a crazy mural that's yellow. I mean, when I was buying plants for the back patio, I really only had one color option. Right. And you've got yellow socks on. I do. Doesn't surprise me at all. Was that thoughtful of the plants? Did you know? Absolutely. Oh, nice. Yeah. What was the question? If you'd like thought about the yellow plants. Yeah, it's happened to me on accident. Like people go to my Instagram and they're like, Oh, it's really beautifully curated. Like it's all yellow. And I was like, that's all of that's an accident. Right. Literally, because the thing is, like I was just as we're doing this project, the trucks yellow and then it kind of took like member at some point. You were like, Oh, it'd be good to have the paint, the same color paint. And then that became a thing. So now anytime we take a picture of this, also yellow. And then it started, it started just having a thing. And now the shoe company also yellow. Right. And I love this shoe company. Cat footwear is amazing. I mean, right? It's just all kind of taking on a life of its own, which is amazing. I love the idea. That's nice. That's something special with that. Well, listen, tell everyone where they can find you. They can find me at my studio, which is at Lapeer Hotel in West Hollywood. Generally, they're eight days a week. Like I said that before. Instagram, which is all my first names, plus art at the end. That's the same with my website as well. Thanks for coming on the podcast. Yeah, thanks for thanks for joining us today and talking about the art of the chat.