 All right. Well, welcome everyone. Thank you for joining us today. You're joining us for a discussion with Senator Patrick Leahy and his staff on supporting the economic future of Vermont. I want to welcome you all for joining today. I'm Charles Martin, the government affairs director at the Vermont Chamber of Commerce, our guest today is Senator Patrick Leahy. He's currently president, pro-temporary of the United States Senate, chairman of the Senate Appropriations Committee, and the senior most member of the Senate Judiciary Committee and Senate Agricultural Committee. As Vermonters, many of us had had the opportunity to vote for Senator Leahy and engage with him on issues. While he has always been a leader that Vermont can count on, he also ranks first in seniority in the Senate, which is extremely beneficial to Vermont. Today, he gives Vermont Chamber members and other businesses around the state an opportunity to engage directly with Senator Leahy. And of course, duty calls, the Senator's currently opening the Senate session as we speak, but we expect him to be with us shortly. Until then, we have two of his staff with us. Many of you probably know Chris Saunders. He's, he joined the Senator staff in 2002 and works out of the Senator's State Office on Economic Development, telecom and transportation issues. Chris, if you want to give a camera wave, I'll distinguish between you and Jeff. Jeff Van Hoot is also with us. He's the Senator's Washington lead on economic development, taxes, broadband, transportation, and other issues. He previously worked on healthcare and education policy in the Senator's D.C. office and is originally from Brattleboro, Vermont. Alright, well, in the meantime, the Senator should be joining us around 315. We're going to start things off with a discussion with Chris and Jeff, and kind of focus on the infrastructure plan that the Biden administration has proposed and many in the Senate are endorsing including Senator Leahy. Chris or Jeff, could you two help us frame the discussion in Congress around infrastructure plan, kind of where it is at this point and where you expect it to be over the next few months. Either or Chris, you can go or Jeff. Sure. I'll start in and then Jeff will fix all the details that that I've screwed up. So hi everybody. As Charles mentioned, I'm Chris work here on the on the state side of the Senator staff. We have been collecting from Vermonters over the past year, you know, billions of idea dollars of ideas and priorities for the state and helping the Senator think through those and and look at the opportunity that's in front of us with the with the President's American Jobs Plan and try to try to find a way to incorporate those ideas into the bill. The process really started with with the President announcing his proposals and Congress has has picked up the ball and started to hold hearings on those ideas. I know Senator Leahy will want to talk about his work and his role in that. Last week, his committee, the Senate Appropriations Committee had four of the cabinet secretaries in person to talk about those ideas. But the hope and the belief is that that Congress will take the ball and run with it, trying to pass a bill first through the House of Representatives. Later this summer, maybe by the 4th of July, and then the Senate picking it up and making some adjustments and sending it back over to the House either later in the summer early in the fall. The dynamic that folks are keenly aware of, you know, the Senate really being having the slimmest of majorities majorities for Democrats. Means that there's a pretty narrow framework for for which they can pass a bill and to the degree that anybody kind of follows the machinations of the Senate and the Senate rules. There are some procedures that allow the Senate to move forward and get a bill just with Democratic votes that will be kind of a key piece over the next couple of weeks and months. The President has made very clear his intention to reach out to folks on the other side of the aisle and bring them into the process. At the same time, acknowledge that that he's got a vision and feels that he wants to move forward with a bill that meets his goals and objectives. And if he has to go with a bill that the majority of the country support, but ultimately doesn't have bipartisan votes in the Senate, he will use that tool, if necessary. I think there's, there'll be a lot of action that the bill is still coming together and ideas are still being considered. I know the senator will talk about some of his priorities that include broadband and road and transportation infrastructure water wastewater those types of things as well as the more human infrastructure that that you've seen the Biden administration talking about so Jeff what what what did I miss or what what did I include. You touched on all the high level topics very did a very well job very good job with that and I mean just to go further on what you've already said is that there are more proposals to come. As we all know the president Biden has his first joint address in front of Congress to Marcus first 100 days in of the administration on Wednesday and the expectation is for the president to unveil the state before the more human infrastructure side of things for that prior to the joint address with the American families plan. And we're happy also to speak more about that. And as we are continuing to in the on the congressional side of things we are continuing to work with the administration and field ideas and hear proposals and legislative text is still in the works and as far as that I would also add that the on the other side the aisle the Senate Republicans as I'm sure a lot of people have seen have begun their processing negotiations and offered a counter proposal to the Biden initial white paper for the American jobs plan and we're happy to go more into that as well just let us know thank you. Yeah, that might actually be somewhat interesting for the company here without without getting to terribly political is there sort of a stark differences between the Republican plan and the and the Democratic plan at this point. I guess it might be easier to talk about where they overlap so we can kind of start framing around, you know what we might be able to expect Chris or Jeff. I think in terms of let's start with similarities in terms of similarities both have significant may do make significant investments in various sectors of our America's infrastructure and on the for the GOP proposal. I think they primarily focus on specific funding for to repair roads and bridges with by proposing 200, I believe 299 billion there out of all the proposals I believe that is the only one, no, and airport still that is one of the few where the levels are above initial proposals of the American jobs plan I think they also have with included within the account of GOP's count proposal is 61 billion for public transit when compared to the American jobs plan which is provides would provide 85 billion. And I feel as though they've dedication they don't the investment proposal for rail is not nearly significant enough to fix the issues that are at play right now. And I don't know if Chris would like to have a little senator. Well, Senator Lee. The session and there are a few delays on the floor. I don't want to raise that all senator we're just happy you're with us. I wonder I want to be with you buddy or every so often the job gets in the way. It's an important job and we are certainly understanding. Opening up the United States Senate is as good a reason as any to be a little bit tardy for one of these zoom panels. We already kind of introduced you and the introductory remarks and Chris and Jeff we're just starting to discuss the Biden infrastructure plan. The proposals that you're supportive of and kind of the proposals from the Republican side of things and where those overlap. I think folks on the call would be interested in kind of generally hearing about, you know your history of working with President Biden, and Vice President Biden and Senator Biden throughout his tenure as a public servant. And kind of what you're most excited about in terms of future collaboration with the administration, and what excites you about this infrastructure plan that's been proposed. All right, so, so I started here. Yeah, of course. Thank you. I know we have other chamber members on that I appreciate that. I'm glad we're doing it here. I'll be at her home in middle sex next week at this time is I know we're going to talk a little bit about broadband. It's not as easy to do these from there, even though we're halfway between my payer and water barrier. It's not totally a joke that you get a good signal you put one foot in the coffee table, leave one elbow against one door not point toward a particular window, and you might get it. Even though we pay for the top grade but I mentioned only because you have to think of it when you see so many people working, working from home, kids going to school my own grandchildren going to school remotely. And so I worked a lot with the with the governor and the others in the state about this. In fact, I had a long talk with with Governor Scott this morning we're talking about coven and what we can do with getting vaccines out you know they have a system where and from a whole pharmacy gives them but they have some leftover they have to send them back and the governor said, you know we got some rural areas. Don't send them back anywhere. We'll get them to people you know we have to have same boys and national guard or something drive them house to house will do will get them there. I'll get him off Kamala Harris's husband when he was in town days and just count the number of pharmacies between here and the airport and this is the largest the burn today and the largest concentration you see very very few. And so we have to do it differently in our state. And so I he and I are working on that I met with the White House this morning. And he's going to be on a conference call with the same people from the White House tomorrow morning along with other covers they hope they can do that. But we know the gaps we have. Because of COVID the nationwide 12 million women have lost their jobs left their loss their work from their workforce they buy park. And so we have to really hit. Look at our lodging and restaurants and you. These are your members and, and you're hearing the same stories from them that I'm hearing, or that I hear when I'm back home in Vermont. So I think we have to figure out where we go now our labor shortage. That's reemerging as a significant concern. So many companies have worked like mad to stay open they've had to innovate they've had to change. They stayed open and that that's helped us of course, I tried to make sure that we've had the money that might help I the first COVID package had what's called the small state minimum in it. That got us about a billion and a half dollars for Vermont. And I thought it was well worthwhile because it was spent on the right things paycheck protection program, direct assistance to Vermonters those are out of work but what you might do. I want to make sure our state fiscal situation didn't collapse. So they can work with businesses around the state and I made it very clear to the other members of the Appropriations Committee. I didn't particularly give a darn with their Republicans or Democrats. So we're all in this together. If you get COVID, you're out of a job. The worst both. They don't ask what your political background is. They asked what's going to happen. So, in the American rescue plan marches even get another billion dollars to Vermont. But I know the government and the legislature worked harder than that. I want to get through the pandemic of course, but we got to make sure that this is an opportunity to build back a lot stronger. You know, we used to say infrastructure myself we got to fix that bridge of that road. It's a lot more than that. We have to put resources and transportation and affordable housing, water infrastructure. We talked a little bit about the internet and broadband. Well, there's so much that we have to do. The, I remember as a little child, my grandparents telling me from the lives in South Ryegate, Vermont. And they told me how when rural electrification came to their, to their community and my grandfathers they just walk over turn the light on turn the light off. You know, I grew up in Montpellier. I said, what's the big deal? Everybody's got electric lights. Well, they didn't. The large parts of Vermont didn't went out by the same token. I walk in my office in Burlington. I log on to the computer. I've got high speed internet. But if you're a kid has to go to school online Derby line or other small parts of the state. You may not have that. And we can't we can no longer say well someday we'll build it. It's going to be the same way. When you go to your home you can turn the light on the icon. They got to be able to turn on the internet. So, if we don't I don't know what we're going to do in creating jobs we have. You've done a lot working with some of these. job creation sites but we have to create a lot more. And we have to say that okay. We have to jump forward. Number of years after COVID. But I see Jeff and Newton Chris Sanders Sanders on my on the screen. They understand this far better than I do I'm really a constitutional impediment to the staff does all the work. They don't tell them I said that, but they can when I have to go back to the floor a little bit they, they can take over but you probably have a lot of questions you want to ask. Absolutely Senator I so appreciate your continued focus on and all of us at the chamber do on pandemic recovery because as you alluded to we have to get through that before we can kind of be more forward thinking. And the name of kind of being forward thinking folks are tremendously interested and kind of the ongoing discussion with the administration and you touched on a little bit of it on the infrastructure plan that the Biden administration's proposed. I know that you've worked pretty closely with President Biden when he was Vice President Biden and Senator Biden from Delaware. What, what excites you kind of most about the potential of this plan and what it could do for Vermont and northern border region states. We're going to have the, we're going to fund the northern regional commission of course extensively and I changed the law in that last about a year ago. So it's not just a northern part of our state. We're going to get all the way down to the, the bottom of the state and back. There were going to a couple ribbon cuttings before we had to start wearing masks down in southern Vermont, because of things through the northern border regional commission will continue that. We had a number of discussions with President Biden. And he says, look, I'm not thinking about what's, what do we do during this term of the Congress, how do we get through this. So I'm looking at my grandchildren, you better look at yours. What do we do for them. What's going to be the difference. How do we get young people coming out of school today. How do they have jobs decent jobs. They have businesses that are hard to stay open during COVID. How do we make sure they know we're with them and they can stay open and can start hiring again. He's very, very committed to it. Now we do. We have one thing we do joke a little bit about. He said to me the other day said, how's it feel to be third in line to the presidency, which, which is what I am as president pro tem and I said Joe, I always prayed for your health and safety before. I pray for twice as much now as I did that you kind of enjoyed that. He's a for a long when he's. He's done the right thing he's talked to Republicans and Democrats and what I've done with the with the appropriations committee. I've worked very closely with Dick Shelby, conservative Republican who's the senior Republican on the committee but we're also, he's one of my closest personal friends we traveled across the world together and we are trying very, very hard to bring Republicans and Democrats in and voted real things. But I made it very clear. I'm not looking at something to pass to take care of this year. You know yourself. If we just plan in Vermont just for this year. Who knows what hits next year. What if we have a natural disaster or something we got a plan for the future. And we definitely agree with you on that here at the chamber. And, you know, I guess I would ask sort of out of Chris mentioned Chris Sanders mentioned you had a meeting last week with some cabinet officials on this very topic. I'm curious as to what that discussion entailed, what those priorities were, and kind of who was present there and what you're what you're able to discuss. Of course, and you mentioned Chris Sanders and Jeff and you should always never hesitate to John Tracy, Paulie major either people in my office. They get to me call call them. They send me memos every single day, and it helps more here from home. The cabinet members we met with were very clear they, they're not looking at this as a partisan political thing. They say we're here. We got handed this terrible problem as do other parts of the world. Let's get out of it, but let's let's come back a lot stronger than we were before. You know, I could not help but think on a much smaller scale when a hurricane Irene hit Vermont. And I remember flying over Vermont with a governor as a general helicopter, the day after hurricane and looking at a farmhouse that been on one side of the river is now on the other side of the river upside down. They look like toys. They just been twisted. And I was almost in tears seeing things I'd known from the days I was a child. But we said we'll come back stronger and Vermont did. And, but the whole country has to do that now. One of the things that encouraged me in talking with cabinet members they all come different backgrounds. They were all optimistic. They think we can do it. It's not going to be exactly the program I might write or you might write or, but it'll be one that we can all come to our state because of its size location has problems but then Oklahoma has different kinds of problems. And I think that's what's been exacerbated by drought. We have got to come together and I'm hoping that the partisan temperature we heard during the last election would just fade away and do as we have in Vermont where Republicans and Democrats have worked together. We're certainly hopeful that's the case as well because I think everyone's pretty excited about the potential of this infrastructure plan. I think it's a bit, in Vermont, as you know, we have quite a workforce shortage. We have sort of a demographics challenge of the state's population and such. I know Governor Scott recently sent a letter to the State Department that was indicating Vermont can continue to be a great home for new Americans. And at the Chamber, a lot of our members depend on new Americans to augment their workforces. So with that in mind, I'm just kind of curious as to what you envision for work on immigration reform and how that might help rural states like Vermont that really need people to live here and are welcoming of those people. Well, you know, the Senate a few years ago passed the comprehensive immigration bill. Unfortunately, the House refused Speaker Boehner would not bring it up. But I wish I think he wishes he had now because it wouldn't pass. But I, the Lays came to Vermont about 1850. Part of his economic refugees from Ireland. And then before 1900, my maternal grandparents immigrated from Italy to Vermont. They also come looking for a better, better way of life to my grandfathers were both my grandfather Patrick Lee, my grandfather Piazza Rosamble were stone carvers. But they helped build businesses and and made it better. We're, we're a nation of immigrants. My cells family immigrated from Canada she was born Newport Vermont they spoke French at home. Her uncle Tony promo just died at a study over 100 years old created big businesses, which his family carries on. The immigrants have been good for Vermont. I don't know what we would would do otherwise you know they thought after the Civil War, we lost so many for monitors we might disappear as a state. And so we had a lot of immigrants came into Vermont and made a difference and improve it. We have to do that. Our farm community. We have got to update our immigration. We've got to be able to give dairy farmers time to stay here for more than a matter of months you can't. You can't say okay come here for a few months to help it would just tell the cows. When you come back next year they can milk you again it doesn't work that way. And in the high tech area what we've seen in some of our high tech industry. The number of people are there. I tell the story of bill sessions that federal judge makes a point to do these naturalization ceremonies where it swears in new citizens you probably been to some I've been to them I find very emotional. George Bush was that one in New York class weekend. What. So, Bill had a sudden blood clot in his brain by years ago. They come to the hospital just in time had an emergency operation and he would have died. If he hadn't had it. He had an immigration ceremony told the story of that. He said the reason I'm telling it I looked at the doctor who saved my life operated my brain. And I remember when I gave him the oath of citizenship as an immigrant to Vermont. Now, you can tell hundreds of other stories like that. We have, we have got to improve immigration system we've got to make it better we've got to welcome people. We need it for all kinds of workforce is not just farming we have a high tech. The medicine. And I think the pandemic has probably brought this home to a lot of people that a lot of parts of this country. I would not have made it through, but the first generation or the, or even those seeking citizenship, who have worked on it. Well, Senator, I definitely appreciate that and we're, we're hopeful that we can have additional new Americans move to the state because we know that our businesses here certainly depend on them to be successful. Thank you for those questions in case you had to run back to the floor but getting a little more specific on the infrastructure plan this might be a question for Chris Saunders. Claudia LaValle from Lawson's finest liquids asks us to discuss the future of Amtrak service in Vermont, any additional service rail lines, and what reminders might be able to expect in that realm, and how it might relate to this infrastructure proposal so I don't know. I'll let Chris go on to that but first I was speaking on the floor again about how we're seeing railroads coming back to Vermont and working with Canada. When that border can open up so we can go straight. I remember as a law student taking the Montrealer back home to Vermont from Georgetown. There's a Montrealer because it went to Montreal to here and we're going to get back to that I know we've had grandkids here during the summer. We love to take the train. And we go from either Waterbury or Montpey or go down to White River goes to the Montshire Science Museum. And so we're working that but Chris you want to add to this. The two quick updates would be that the agency of transportation and conjunction with Amtrak is just kind of put the final pieces together to get the Ethan Allen service from Rutland to Burlington. So that should be able to start sometime in the coming months, either before the end of this year or next year I think there's some considerations about making sure it's successful right off the bat, but that is pretty much ready to go. And hopefully he's been working for a while on, as you mentioned, restoring the Montrealer. And the chief challenge there has been inspecting travelers on the train. And so what he's done is passed a couple of laws that allow Americans and any traveler to be screened by Customs and Border Protection at Central Station in Montreal before they board the train. The train can can, it wouldn't stop before then it comes down to St. Albans and so most of the roadblocks on the on the US side have been taken care of, and we've been working with former Vermont transfer station secretary Brian Searles and others to to work with our Canadian counterparts to get that proposal. Tempted to use a bad rail pun but to get that moving forward so those are the two most immediate. Conversations you know Amtrak released this big proposal about how they would spend some of the Biden infrastructure money. And some of that would lead to increased service along the Vermont route so they're definitely opportunities both as part of the infrastructure bill and some of the regular course of the work this senator's taking on. But Chris wanted to say but he bit his tongue you want to say getting it back on track but and of course we've probably certainly my lifetime that never had a president who likes railroads as much as President Biden used to after his first wife was killed he take the train back home to Delaware almost every day. Be with his be with his sons. And he talks about the trains all the time we come every time I would mention to my been in New York City for something he said well Pat did you take the train I said yes well it's a good. We'll get it back. I'm excited about that. Switching gears a little bit to sort of soft infrastructure and going into the chat we have a question from a few questions in the chat on investments in high quality childcare and how that can play into, you know generally just being beneficial to our state and also freeing up workforce to contribute to the businesses that need workforce. It's a general question either for you senator or your staff, but could you discuss a little about what this infrastructure can plan can mean for childcare and other investments that have been made in the childcare front, even prior to this infrastructure plan. I think everybody understands that childcare is real and it's a real cost. And as people start going back to work it's going to be even, even more so, I'm trying to keep as much flexibility in the money that goes to the state, I'm trying to make sure in the appropriations committee we don't do one size fits all and that's kind of a general thing but I have a lot of knowledge in our governor and our legislature take that money and make sure it's spent in a way that will do that, but there again, even in the childcare we also have to have the people available to do the childcare. Yeah. I don't know that Chris or Jeff want to add to that. I would, yes, I'd be happy to add to that senator. I mean, as what was brought up at the top of this in my past work in healthcare education and including childcare we the senator and then as chair of operations does understand the significant need for increased funding for childcare centers and how the economic impacts that will have on in Vermont and places across the country. We've heard from childcare providers throughout the pandemic and part of pandemic about this desperate need, especially in the state and we know we are just as concerned and upset as others when we hear the stories about working young parents having to travel 30 minutes to a childcare center one way then drive 45 minutes the other way to get to work. That's unacceptable and we're doing all that we can to bring the money to Vermont to ensure that we can fix problems like that. Thanks, Jeff. And the other thing is that and I sound like a broken record sometimes in the appropriations committee although if you're chairman they'll listen to the broken record the but I say that the scale in an urban area is so different than what we face in much our state, but then I'll point around the committee point of various Republicans various Democrats on say you have this rural area in your state you have that rural area in your state and it is amazing how again is bringing Republicans and Democrats together that they don't see this as a political issue. That's definitely welcoming to hear. So switching I apologize I'm kind of jumping around a bit but I'm trying to get through the 10d questions and do my due diligence on behalf of the business leaders who are here today. Claudia also asked the question about the feasibility of electric commuter buses running on the length of 89 so kind of, you know, outside of just Washington and Chittenden County. And then we had an additional question from Kyle Clark from beta technologies on what is being done at the federal level to support EV charging infrastructure, especially dual use aircraft car truck charging systems. Yes, to kind of roll that all into one question. And this is Senator for you or your staff. As far as electric infrastructure and transportation whether it be air or ground. What, what are you hopeful about and what can Vermont potentially expect. Sometimes we have to look at the fact sometimes you have long distances to drive but this is not the, those of us who talked about electric cars and buses. Two years ago we were like, was this some kind of crunchy granola. Now when you see major car manufacturers say they'll make only electric cars or electric vehicles in the next decade to decade and a half. I look at a charging station by the red hand and little sex where I go for soup and sandwich often when I'm home. And there's always somebody plugged in there. But I think there's an, it's not a chicken egg thing. I mean you got to be doing this all together. I think that the pressure is going to be there with the manufacturers for and others, some of the Japanese manufacturers in going electric. The pressure is going to be there. We are going to be hurt badly. As a state. If we don't have fast and easy charging everywhere on our interstate on outside by our businesses. And there is going to be money that can be used by the states that they want to have. I don't know each step is going to be I think it's going to be an evolution, but I think it's going to be a much, much faster evolution that anybody thought of just a few years ago. I don't want to Chris or Jeff if you want to add anything to that. I would say that the, I think we're, we've been working closely with the state. And there's probably a time in the future where every new bus the state buys has the potential to be an electric bus. And we're not quite at that point but the senator's been making sure the resources are there through a program called the low or no program at USD OT to fund those buses and we have some as was noted by Claudia in Burlington and other places. So we're getting there. And then to Kyle's question about electric aviation I think I think that's been a piece that's been missing the administration I think is still working to understand what electric aviation is all about. And how to fit it into to their proposals and I think Senator you when you were talking with transportation secretary Buddha judge you mentioned beta the other day. So, I would hand it back to you because you're the one that's that's having those conversations. What they're doing in Burlington, and with the electric helicopters and how they're saying UPS contract. And I wish I could say more of it than that I can't because I made a plan to go there. Not this week. I mean it's coming week but the next time I'm home to get a full briefing. Also point out that they are hiring Charles I think they're hiring about as much percentage just by any company around people in building that. And what I'm finding more and more people to say not not electric they'll say oh, tell us more. How do we do it. And that's a good side. It's definitely exciting and beta is certainly a really forward thinking company that we're happy to have here in Vermont. Going to jump around yet again. Beth Kennett from Liberty Hill Farm, it asks, is there any upcoming support for agricultural infrastructure in Vermont either in this infrastructure plan or in other bills that are in the works. And one of the comments come through as we were talking about how cold weather batteries can lose so much of their power and that's obviously one of the things that we have to. We have to face because we for mothers know we do have cold weather. Now on this. I think the question of agriculture was that again. So Beth Kennett from Liberty Hill Farm Senator asks, if we can expect any upcoming supports for agricultural infrastructure either in the infrastructure bill or other moving pieces in the, in the Congress. Well, I think it's pretty clear we're not going to leave out agriculture. We also know the agriculture is evolving the way we do it in updating. We're on just second. Yeah. Tom will take me a couple of minutes, but I'll be there. Thank you. The floor is calling back but but yes we're going to have to. It's not the. It's not farming as I saw when I was a kid walking around farms and my pair over in South Friday with grandparents or anywhere else. It's much different. But again, I say this is if we're at all wise. If we use this money. Here, here's a check, here's a check, but actually target it. We can so dramatically improve for the next generation, just by any kind of business we have, or how we do our lodging is our tourism industry, every single aspect of that. I can stay for one more than I am going to have to leave or I apologize. Well, I'll give you another infrastructure related, I guess more focused on higher ed. Robin Gillian of Vermont technical college asks how higher education will be supported post pandemic. So many is referring to, from a congressional standpoint, what you see impacting higher education, especially in rural areas like Vermont where we kind of have unique challenges with higher ed. Well, I think I think that's a that's a two way street, I mean we get the money but higher ed is going to respond to it I mean we've had. I mean one example I helped Norwich University get money a few years ago for their cyber center, and they were aiming for that now. The only problem they have is that people are trying to hire the kids even before they graduate because of what they're learning. You're going to have to find those things that reflect the needs of today. Champlain College did the same with theirs. We're fortunate to have the University of Vermont is I think so. Superb. We have to. We have to give them the money they're going through some evolutions and I think the new president UVM has had to face. There are more challenges and in two years time the most would have in a, in a 20 year period there. And so we'll do it. We, but the, I don't pretend to be an expert but I've talked to governments knows it's not going to be education. As it's always been there are going to be changes in their direction and the nature of what they do. Otherwise it's not going to work. I understand that if we're not going to be doing education that will allow people who graduate to be effectively in the workforce and then to have the jobs there so they can. It does not work. But I am more optimistic than pessimistic. That's definitely nice to hear and completely agree it's an evolving landscape, higher education. We need to get to the floor we won't keep you any longer. We certainly appreciate your time and if you can hang out that's great. But I know that you indicated you only had time for one left so I am going to have to go but I'm glad you're doing this and Chris and Jeff thank you for your work on it. I think a whole lot of things done at once in the, in the Senate I juggled three different major committees in trying to do that. Fortunately, some good people working with me so thank you all very much and I may see some of you and Vermont next week I hope. I hope to see you senator. Thank you so much. Take care. I just wanted to add to what I made to add on to what the center said about with a little more specifics is that the higher education investments are expected to be included within the American family plan, which would be really the as I said is supposedly is going to be released this week. So we'll know more in the coming days. Well, that's exciting stuff. Thank you. Thanks Jeff and Chris this might be a question for you. I know we discussed immigration as it relates to workforce and childcare as it relates to workforce. But generally speaking, we've had a lot of folks that have left the workforce, and there are a lot of folks are still out of the workforce right now as a result of the pandemic, which is extremely challenging for our small businesses but it also presents an opportunity in some instances for those workers to be reskilled to re enter the workforce in other ways, maybe in a career change or something of that nature. What, what sort of programs can Berman expect to be able to access coming down from the federal level to kind of augment our workforce and improve our workforce, be it reskilling or otherwise. So that's a question Charles and a key point of the kind of the workforce issues that that I think the senator is thinking about. There, there's a subset of us DOL the employment and training administration that's a good partner for Vermont DOL and they have programs and resources that speak to exactly that topic. And I think we're expecting to see both through their normal course of work as well as some of what the administration is going to propose investments in ETA that would fund initiatives in Vermont, you know, a recent one. That that did come to the state the supporting working families program that that offered Vermonters supports for folks that are existing currently in the workforce but looking to enter the manufacturing field offered them support for their tuition as well as wrap around services for finding childcare for for their kids and some funding costs. I think we expect to see innovative programs like that. Coming from the administration. I think we were looking for programs that that come from the health side of things, looking that that would help those with substance abuse disorder, find pathways from from those afflictions and finding ways to enter the workforce so I think we expect a number of different initiatives, and then certainly the immigration piece that the senator is looking for a change you know we have many different types of immigration to the state through various visa programs. The one that's gotten the most attention recently is is the asylum program, and I think we expect that that the administration will keep its commitments to to bringing folks in through the asylum program. And for months programs really depend on those levels being where they have been historically so if 300 folks are going to come into the chinning County region through the refugee resettlement program. We need the historic levels, historic not exceeding but but kind of where they were prior prior to the previous administration for the supports to be there for for our Vermont programs to welcome those those new Americans so I think we see multiple multiple avenues to that to that question. It's definitely something we hear constantly at the chamber I'd say outside of coven 19 this is workforce, generally speaking and workforce shortages. It's kind of Vermont's economic crisis, you know if we weren't in a pandemic and I expected to continue to be coming out of the pandemic so we appreciate all the work on that and look forward to working with you on it. So this is more of a general question maybe one that's good to close with. In your opinion, Janet Lombra from Mobile Medical International Corporation asked this. What do you feel is a realistic timeline for Vermont's economic recovery. I'm considering the after effects the pandemic when I know this is one of those reading the tea leave questions and given how crazy the last year is that it's a difficult one to answer but when do you see economic normalcy occurring or kind of what indicators are you looking for to know that that's occurred. That's a big question. Because everybody everybody's answer to that is different and I think the senator alluded to that in some of his remarks of noting that we have different groups of Vermonters that have impacted this pandemic been impacted by the pandemic differently and so that might be true for somebody who's just looking to go back to the office and be able to go out to dinner and do the things of their normal life and be supporting their local economy in that way, maybe very different from the the one that has been forced to leave the workforce and, you know, their their child program, even with the state aid or other resources wasn't able to stay open and so they they are now having to find as you as you noted a new job or be trained for a new job. So, I think we feel like there's differing avenues for differing people, and it could be a while. You know, I think, I think we're share the optimism of the governor, and those that have been participating in the forward program and seeing the reopen of the economy and welcome tourists back to the state. But that that it's probably a longer a longer path for for Vermonters that have had a deeper impact and, you know, whether they've become homeless or whether they whatever that has challenged them during the pandemic. For those Vermonters, it's probably going to be a longer road. So I think that was a great answer and we definitely agree it varies wildly depending on what industry or what walk of life you're from. Certainly, but I think you you frame that well. Could I follow the senator's lead and just notice there have been a couple of good questions in the chat about broadband that while I think we we had hoped the senator was going to touch on more kind of glossed over Michael's and others have raised the question of how is money going to be distributed and I think, you know, this is the challenge of offering a briefing for you all at a time when when there isn't really a legislative text to accompany the proposal. There there's kind of big dollar figures and I think this goes across all the topics we've discussed today, whether they be electrification of transportation or childcare or housing and higher ed is that you know the details really aren't there for us to tell you this is how it's going to happen. But one of the proposals that's been out there that that I think the senator has some concerns about is the proposal from Mr. Clyburn in the house which which is kind of been the general bill that most House members if they're interested in broadband have added their name to, and it would be a small amount of the money to each state and then distribute the rest of it through a reverse auction where tell ISPs would say here is the subsidy we'd be willing to accept to provide service in this area and the math gets much easier in that dynamic if you perhaps provide internet via satellite, or if you're able to cover a large geographic area with a wireless signal, then if you're laying fiber and I think the senator sees that there are room for for multiple solutions to delivering high speed broadband to folks in Vermont but we have we've tried wireless internet and it hasn't been a resounding success for our state. And so I think he's particularly interested in making sure the playing field is open for the communications union districts to get resources, I think there's a lot of resources that are going to be available through the money that's already come to the state, but but in terms of this next plan, making a bit of a more level playing field is something that he's certainly focused on to ensure the CDs can compete with the star links and the others of the world that are in the space. Thank you for touching on that. I know that folks always want to hear about broadband and at the Chamber, we certainly support whatever gets reminders properly connected and connected quickly. So, it's kind of been our stance. Chris, and Jeff, do you have anything to add or to close with. The last piece that we would touch on is kind of the topic to sure. And I don't know if the Senate, Senator made the announcement already today Jeff or or not, but we with with his ascendancy to the chairman of appropriations the Senate made a decision to bring earmarks back to to Vermont, or well to the country and therefore Vermont. And so in the coming weeks, we're going to be working with organizations around the state we have no shortage of ideas that we've already received. He's going to be looking for ways to invest public dollars wisely in the state so that that we can, you know, as he said, build back stronger and really advance the economy of the state. And so we're looking for good community projects infrastructure projects, all sorts of things so likely in the coming days we'll have a forum on our website or Jeff and I put our contact information in the chat. If anybody's got a project that they are working on that they want to make sure it's on the senator's radar. We would love to hear about it and see if there's a way to to single out funding for that initiative. It tells me you're not going to have a shortage of people who take you up on ideas. That's really tremendously exciting. And we certainly look forward to hearing more about that. So that concludes today's event. I want to reiterate how thankful we are for the senator taking some time out of working on the floor to chat with us all and Jeff and Chris we so appreciate you joining us as well. Thank you Charles and thank you to the Chamber for hosting this great event. And thank you to all the attendees who are asking great questions today. Thanks guys.